Are women allowed to serve in combat roles in your cunt's military? Should they be allowed to?
IIRC I remember seeing pics of Israeli and Kurdish qts serving as infantry so I guess it's not that rare?
Yes, but only as whores.
Has feminism gone too far?
>>51612709
Yes
but most don't go for such roles
Finland
Technically yes but they aren't generally put in high intensity jobs. I don't recall one woman from my time in the army who served anywhere else than artillery, logistics&service or comms. What's kind of funny is that most of them end up as soldier cooks :--DDD
>>51612892
There is nothing they won't try to ruin
>>51612709
>defence secretary
>>51612892
No. It has evolved to the point where they can be shot. This is progress.
True gender equality when females are included in conscription desu.
I wish they weren't. Women in the army will cause conflict between guys, such as hostility, depression and jealousy. They're breaking up the ranks and splits the unit up simply by being there, no matter how good they are at their job. Incidentally, same reason i don't want gays in the army for the same reason.
>>51613302
>not about being the biggest
>is literally the biggest
What were they trying to say here?
>>51614414
Norway did that to celebrate the 100 year anniversary of suffragette
Literally a non-issue unless you're some kind of a butthurt faggot to romanticises the military and wants to keep it free of icky girls because that would ruin his perfect little fantasy world.
>>51615761
The Marine corp said girls need lots of handicaps and simply did not measure up to a male soldier.
Your military is irrelevant and is only there to postpone your defeat for a few days, that is why it doesn't matter to you. But to the US, it is different.
>>51612709
this is so fucking retarded
not even we open all combat roles for women, only a single mixed brigade that never sees any actual combat, they just patrol the southern borders.
how is a woman supposed to ruck march through mud with 40 kilos of gear and equipment? and be able to fight afterwards? carry casualties? carry ATMs?
>>51615761
http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-marines-women-20150912-story.html
>>51612709
What combat arms MOS do people think they could get into without lowered standards?
I don't think they could even make it as a grunt or a scout.
>>51616161
>jew
>>51616135
>The Marine corp said girls need lots of handicaps
Source would be pretty good bro. From what I read they will be using the same standards for females as they are for men right now when it comes to active combat positions if the initiative passes congress and isn't blocked by republicans.
And if they will be using the same standards as they do for men what exactly is the problem?
>But to the US, it is different.
Literally mad that your little fantasy military is being invaded by icky girls. Or maybe you've convinced yourself that the marines are so hard and terrifying that you couldn't possibly pass as one so a few women potentially doing it would completely emasculate you?
>>51616412
Does your country have conscription?
Because almost every Israeli you'll see has served 3 years in the army.
The chnaces are high he knows what he is talking about.
>>51616478
THis isn't the marine corp, but similar argument.
http://www.people.com/article/female-ranger-school-graduation-planned-advance
i took the first link I got. I don't read people.
>>51612709
No. Women aren't allowed in many roles here.
>>51612709
did they lower the requirements to get into some forces or just allow women to take the same tests as men?
If they're measured up to the same standards then i don't see a problem, actually about time women fought for their country instead of sending the men to die.
Say goodbye to camaraderie. No more brothers in arms. I doubt that many women will want to be in it though.
>>51616161
For one a woman is not necessarily a woman. As in, physically a woman could be a man.
>>51616478
>>51616203
Lowering Standards?
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2015/apr/19/marine-corps-weighs-lower-standards-for-women-afte/?page=all
Men performed better.
http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/09/10/439190586/marine-corps-study-finds-all-male-combat-units-faster-than-mixed-units
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/marine-corps-study-women-in-combat-at-disadvantage-men-perform-significantly-better/
>>51616203
No surprises here, your average woman is going to perform on average worse than a man, just like manlets, which is why the standards will be held the same as they are for men so that the ones who can actually perform won't get shut out just because they have a vagina.
>>51614537
Biggest as in biggest self-esteem, biggest as in greatest etc
>>51612709
there is literally nothing wrong with this as long as the requirements are not lowered
>get a girl in your squad
>tfw you're the only one in your squad that hasn't fucked her
we have, but there are very few because most of them fail the physical exams.
>>51616615
I can't imagine how different it would have been if we had women in my platoon, all the pc bullshit, having to watch your language, and other stupid shit.
Can't imagine taking orders from a women, also I don't think my platoon Sergeant would have been able to have a 8 x 10 pic of a vagina framed on his desk.
>>51616615
>he doesn't want to see Band of Sisters in a few years
>>51616735
Well, sounds good. But is not what is going to happen.
There will be handicaps given to women, to complete non-written quotas that will make the military look good by "succeeding" in getting lots of women in combat positions.
The two women who managed to become rangers, had a numbers of advantages and special training not given to the men. The articles talk about generals pressuring the trainers into helping and looking the other way, when it came to women.
It would be nice, if things went the way you say. But they wont.
Also, this tests only measure the physical ability of women. We will not get good results of their actual physical and mental performance in real combat.
>>51616827
I don't know a single case of women having the same fitness standards as men for combat roles.
>>51616827
They already have, kind of.
But believe me, they will be lowered.
They won't announce it publicly but it will happen gradually.
>>51616876
>not liking to take orders from a strong woman wearing military uniform
im a faggot but you are fucking homo
>>51616735
its NEVER going to be the same standards
they are going to have their own shit tier standards just like its always been and even if they fail those standards they will be let in because there is going to be a vagina quota
i'd be shocked if they ever treat people equally and fairly
>>51612709
not in infantry but I there are a few helicopter and ground attack fempilots
I think they might technically be able to, but really, so what? Women can also work as tradespeople and labourers, but they generally don't because the work is difficult and labour intensive. Combat roles in the military are no different, really.
can you army take down Motoko ?
>>51616729
The only interesting article that you brickwalled at me was the washington post article that discusses the implementation of what they call the "dempsey" law which basically means that the diferent service branches have to justify any high standards that women have problems clearing, which is perfectly normal. And like the ex-marine says they marine corps shouldn't have any kind of problem justifying the standards since they have decades worth of experience about the subject. They're not going to lower the standards no matter how you cry obama.
>>51616915
It would be a bunch of "muh empowered womyn" bullshit. Jokes about periods, the BBC bull drill sergeant and how they're trying to fuck him, and bossing men around.
Why can't they realize that this is a tremendously bad idea? Unless they organize them into female only units I can only imagine this having a disastrous effect on overall cohesion.
>>51617015
Have you ever tried it?
I heard many stories about women in the military, very few were good.
I went to a medical training class lead by the women LT's, they were such cunts my LT cut the course short and told us to leave.
In the Netherlands they aren't allowed in combat roles (due to lower male performance) and not allowed in the marines and submarines for privacy reasons. Marines have a buddy system where you basically have to wipe each others butt and that doesn't work with men and women.
>>51617099
No wait, nevermind. I just checked and women can't serve in combat roles here. But I still stand by the rest of what I said in regard to countries where it can happen. Especially in developed countries.
>>51617019
Nah, when it comes to professional soldiering the standards will be the same with everyone, just like they are with firemen.
>>51617384
but thats not how it works - ever
the standards have been lowered and will continue to do so
>>51616729
> "unnecessary distraction or any dilution of the combat effectiveness puts the mission and lives in jeopardy. Risking the lives of a military unit in combat to provide career opportunities or accommodate the personal desires or interests of an individual, or group of individuals, is more than bad military judgment. It is morally wrong."
Based.
I'd be interesting joining the military but i'd want to wear skirts. Pants are for plebs.
>>51617496
I guess you hate your knees.
>>51617287
>>51617015
Aren't military women like police women with overcompensating?
>>51617384
But it has already happened in both the military and fire fighting that they lowered the standards, trash got in and fucked shit up.
>>51617518
Stockings exist, Dutchman.
>>51617518
if you want to join the military you already automaticaly hate your knees
lol no women in the military is a meme
>>51616920
I wouldn't be surprised if the first women really got some special attention just because of the media circus around them, but this isn't about individual cases but opening combat positions to people with also a vagina. There's literally nothing concrete that would show that the standards at the marine corps are going to be any different for women combat roles. Just a lot of ifs and buts.
>>51617544
Yeah, it gets real bad in the military.
They know everybody thinks they are a joke, and think they need to prove something.
My unit had 0 women, so we weren't used to being around them, we must have called them "Sir" 20 times, they were getting pissed. Then later when my LT saw how they were talking to us he said "You guys don't need to take this shit" and got us out of there.
>>51617306
>Marines have a buddy system where you basically have to wipe each others butt
for what purpose
>>51617544
you have that +
>combat ineffectiveness due to ruining cohesion, being weaker, being girls
>literally costing male lives because they have to be saved by men constantly
>etc
even the most basic thing like morale is fucked up because you introduce a whole host of new problems into the system
>>51617756
>Then later when my LT saw how they were talking to us he said "You guys don't need to take this shit" and got us out of there.
H-how were they talking to you?
Most Kurdish soldiers aren't women, and those that are aren't usually fighting on the frontline. It's more out of necessity due to lack of manpower, an issue which has been by now resolved.
As for Israelis, most of their women don't serve in combat roles; it's usually combat-support at most (field intelligence, artillery etc). Even those that are aren't in the ORBAT for wartime.
>>51617424
You keep saying this but I don't think you're right.
>>51617570
The standards for firefighting are literally the same as they have always been and they are the same for both men and women, at least in finland, while conscripts are not soldiers. The people who do it for a living are under completely different kind of scrutiny, which is why there is only a single colonel in the finnish army who is a woman, and she's in the navy to boot.
>>51617827
They were demeaning because we were enlisted and they were officers. They were already angry from being called sir all day, we also showed up hung over and stinking like beer, and guys letting out loud farts in a closed room.
They just were not able to handle a room full of troops.
>>51617688
I think it would be best to give women their own divisions desu. Then you won't harm the male morals, while at the same time you can give women suitable equipment, missions and provide in their hygienic needs.
There are no downsides.
>>51612709
men in US must be ashamed of themselves.
only faggots who are afraid of being called sexists, let women be in the battle field.
>>51617973
The only downside is that you spend money on women instead of men, but that's it.
>>51617982
>let women be in the battle field
Do you want to rely on a women to carry you if you get wounded, to bring you ammo thru a firefight, do you want to listen to a woman when you are getting shot at?
My ruck was over 90 pounds at times, and on my back for weeks, don't think they could handle it.
>>51618088
Which is probably why they aren't planning on letting women who can't carry that kind of weight in in the first place.
>>51612709
They're allowed iirc. I don't care if they can be on par with men, some women have good genetics for it. Not a problem since only specifical types of them go to the army, boxing, etc.
>>51618173
Good.
My main issue is that I don't believe they can handle all the stress.
>>51617896
>artillery
I don't think there are any women in Artillery, unless you mean mortars.
>>51618088
He's literally agreeing with you you grunt.
How the fuck would this work in the cav? No way in fuck that I would want a woman in that situation, and I seriously doubt a woman would want to be there either
>>51617982
>men in US must be ashamed of themselves.
>>51618307
what is cav?
>>51618274
The M270 MLRS unit accepts women
They sit on their asses and work out coordinates. They don't have the physique to deal with loading shells on an M109.
>>51618307
heh, the comma fucked me up
I was in the cavalry, we humped it with rucks too, most cavalry units are in name only, they are really set up like infantry units
>>51618343
that is great tho
you are problaby a subhuman normie
>>51618343
does she really pilot that?
Is it true that when women go through training they don't even have to do a single pull up instead they just hang there with their arms flexed?
>>51616161
This is true, but lets not take anything away from Caracal, they do important work in the field on the border and go through do 07 basic training.
Women definitely have a lot of roles they can do in the army, including lots that are directly related to combat, but it's true you need to be able to carry at least 50% of your body weight in equipment as a male to be in a proper combat unit, which isn't realistic for almost all women, who would need to carry like 70% on their body weight.
>>51618479
>>51618434
Cav ==> cavalry = armoured divison
Granted, the endless cleaning would be something they're used to, and they could man the bivvie
>>51618791
thnks
>>51618791
IDF tried to make "Girls und Panzer", it failed horribly.
>>51618879
Why?
>>51618791
We didn't clean that much, we cleaned up our weapons and gear after returning from the filed, but our barracks rooms were never inspected, and civilians were paid to clean everything else.
All this cleaning stuff comes from training bases, after training you can be a slob.
>>51618902
The women couldn't coexist comfortably with the men in close quarters (if you are in combat and you have your period, too bad, you're stuck rubbing shoulders with men while you get your tampon on because you can't exit the vehicle without dying).
Moreover, they lacked the strength to assist in the basic maintenance of the Merkava every tank crew needs proficiency in.
>>51618902
To put it shorly, a lot of girls were unable to withstand what was required of them. A lot did, but can't make an effiecent force when there's too many dropouts, so the idea was dropped all along.
>>51619076
>>51619203
Makes sense.
Sadly our minister of defense also tried to make shit more woman friendly.
Luckily our military is so underfunded that they mostly care about the more important stuff.
Sucks for our soldiers, but hey thats what you get for denazification sincet he cold war stopped.
Here they can join the military, but not the front lines. And they're not subjected to conscription/reserves - they're more public servants with military uniforms than soldiers.
>>51619350
SEXISM
i dislike the whole call for equality even though it is men that do the really dirty physical work jobs most of the time.
>>51616827
>as long as the standards won't be lowered
>>51616827
all the female fitness tests are lower than the male requirements though.
Even young women get like 15+ minutes to run a mile and a half. Young men get 10. They are literally 2/3rd's as efficient as a male recruit, lol.
Its fine because everyone knows they are just going to suck a few high rank dicks to get cushy office jobs anyway, but in the field nobody wants that shit.
It's irrelevant because no one who isn't mildly retarded joins the military anyway.
I think it depends on the service. My Air Force and Navy friends don't give a shit, male or female. My Army and Marines friends, all male, do not want it all. They all say women cause nothing but more drama, and its mentally shitty. They don't think they'd be a detriment in an actual combat situation, but the other 99% of the time they said would end up making them despise each other.
As a former grunt. I can tell you that this is going to fail miserably.
>>51620917
why do you say that
>>51621345
Well, at least with the Infantry. Its a tight brotherhood. A very strong bond between a group of men can do almost anything. Always trying to show off whos more masculine between lifting weights, getting pussy, or just doing stupid shit can be motivating. So when you finally deploy. You have this special level of trust that you can only get from other dudes. That you 100% know what each member of your team is capable of and you know that you can trust them no matter what.
Men can not get this same type of bond with females. Especially in a combat scenario where you and that female are living out in isolation for months at a time. Just because of human nature, feelings will develop. And guys will turn on each other for said female. Even if she looks like a troll. Human instinct will tell you that you must mate with her. So her presence alone will create tension and stress amongst the group.
thats just the scientific aspect of it. Not mentioning how women are full of fucking drama and pull "oh i'm a woman and you are a man, you should help me with this" entitilement pullshit just because they got a hole between their legs.
>>51620604
My father and mother are airforce.
My mother is a feminist in many ways (steady job, high rank, well educated, can stand up to my father) yet she has repeatedly said that women just aren't naturally suited for combat roles.
Her words. "In the military we face reality. In politics you face ideology. Let's not make the military have to face both."
>>51622354
Your mum sounds like a sensible woman.
>>51614364
And then you have to cover their sorry ass.
>>51622354
More feminists should be like your mom.
>>51612709
It's actually illegal for anyone here to serve in the military, as there is no military here and the formation of one would be unconstitutional
>>51622596
sounds like bullshit
>>51612793
Only laundry and sexual relief of refugees.
>>51622596
I thought Icelanders could join the Norwegian Military. Also, what use are you to NATO without a military or letting troops be stationed there.
>ShekelLivesMatter
>>51622742
there is an airbase there
>>51612709
Can we open all combat roles to only women?
Have the men here to defend the actual country and let the bitches get killed in oil magnates' mercenary wars.
>>51622742
They can join.
>>51618274
Artillery needs more than just cannon crew. They need a staff, logistics and so on. Those jobs aren't terribly physical.
On paper there should be no reason to deny women in combat roles. If a person, be them male or female, are able to meet the physical requirements and can handle the equipment properly then why not?
The problem is that if a squad of soldiers are in a firefight and a women is in trouble, no doubt will male instinct kick in and result in some men making dumb, unnecessary, dangerous decisions in attempts to protect them. Another reason is the demoralization that a female PoW brings. A lot of people still see male soldiers as cannon fodder, a male prisoner doesn't provoke that much emotion. As soon as you swap the Y chromosome for an X, everyone goes mad. The mere thought of a woman soldier being beaten, tortured, raped, turned into a sex slave etc can lead to rash rescue missions that result in several other soldiers being killed to save the one.
I remember seeing a wall of text made by a female in the military who is against women in combat roles somewhere on the internet, don't feel like searching for it.
Jim Webb, former director of the Navy and presidential candidate, has some interesting things to say about women in the military. He wrote this a little after serving in the Vietnam War. Interesting read.
http://www.washingtonian.com/articles/people/jim-webb-women-cant-fight/
>>51616735
>mfw only manlets are allowed to be pilots
>>51615761
Are you retarded? Even if you would ignore the psychological differences the physical ones would still be a huge issue, ie. the average man is stringer than 99.9% of women.
>>51629222
*stronger
Yeah.
>>51625114
The American understood what I meant, smartass. There are woman all IDF corps, but they're mostly filling the generic roles.
>>51626128
Generally speaking, women arent as psychologically suited to combat as men are.
>>51612709
>Are women allowed to serve in combat roles in your cunt's military? Should they be allowed to?
Yes, as non-combat.
Yes, as non-combat.
Medics, radio operators and whatnot are fine, I'd never wish a woman in the squad of my worst enemy.
Yes but very few because we hold them to the same standards as men
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2004/jun/15/20040615-115647-8125r/
>>51615761
more like i don't want individuals at high risk of lower back and knee injuries from heavy lifting doing a risky job where other people's lives depend on them
