With Turkey siding with ISIS I see more and more people showing ressentiment towards Turks in Austria. This goes over the casual, "sick turks", towards "why the fuck are they still here".
Do you have that in your countries fellow europeans?
What turks?
why did the butthurt jani delete the Turkey thread
I was just eloquently replying to one of his fellow countrymen. :(
How can one show ressentiment for non-humans?
>>51414494
like this
>>51414341
you should be literal retard to think usa let turkey do that. usa and turkey are arming fsa against assad, "moderate" rebels. fsa is also self-claimed enemy of isis.
>>51414447
same
>>51414608
>"moderate" rebels
this ain't 2014, even pentagon declared in august that "moderate rebels" do not exist and that all their military support was seen handed over to ISIS.
also it is more than obvious that for the last year turkey is bombing anti-ISIS troops just because they are Kurds. ISIS alone stated that the most military and man power comes from turkey.
you are not the good guys, even your MP's are saying openly that west should consider recognising ISIS as a real state.
>>51414341
We have around one thousand Turks in Croatia. Coincidentally, these are all Bosniaks who were too autistic to say they're Bosniaks so they adopted the identity they felt closer to
No one asks why they're here. No one asks why our Muslim population (not fresh Syrians) is here. We had around 200 mosques since Ottoman occupation onwards, which was reduced to today's 2-3 I believe? They even asked a local imam on the city radio where I live (he has around 300 followers - Sunnis) whether he'd like a mosque here and he said: "There's no need for a mosque here. Our group is small and we don't want to disturb the Croatian people. Despite the fact I feel Croatian myself, I think we still need to take the majority into consideration here and preserve the city from tension". They pay the city to use one of their buildings every Friday
>>51414898
Turks here in Cologne sometimes used to pray in Christian churches. They said its the same God.
>>51414759
Who are they gonna arm now than? / Apparently the US has new batch of money and support for the Syrian opposition?
>>51414898
>We had around 200 mosques since Ottoman occupation onwards, which was reduced to today's 2-3 I
you are bragging about demolishing historical buildings. thats isis-tier. fucking westerners and their hypocrisy.
>>51415089
Mehmet don't you know the difference? If muslims destroy things it's considered vandalism.
If westerners do it, it's called progress.
>>51415007
They also like to go and begg among gypsies infront of the dome and hang around with the support palestina guy who has been there over spring and early summer.
>>51415007
muslims believe jesus is actually a prophet, although his religion is corrupted.
>>51415089
why would they want to be reminded of their countries occupation by a foreign army?
>>51415194
I have to admit I prefer a corrupted religion that preaches pacifism as an ideal to one that was from its inception war-like.
Sorry.
>>51415194
Matter of fact, Jesus is mentioned 25 times in the Quran while Mohammed is mentioned only 4 times.
>>51415167
80% of the time you cant even identify a Turk as one. The 20% you get lucky they have a half asian appearance.
>>51415264
>I have to admit I prefer a corrupted religion that preaches pacifism
crusades?
>>51415313
This means literally nothing.
>what are hadiths
>>51415338
Pacifism in this case implies not hurting human beings
>>51415338
The ideal in the books.
Still you can argue that the muslims started conquering christian terretories before.
In any case, I admit that crusaders were christians even though most muslims seem to have a problem accepting that ISIS is muslim and try to run logic loops around it.
>>51415321
jesus christ, did they behead all the good architects?
Is it a mosque?
>>51414341
shh no tears. tell putin to send us another jet. we need more barbecue
>>51414341
I never liked them, but now with Erdogan siding with ISIS over those oil deals and shit, I reckon people will start openly hating them pretty soon.
>>51415484
crusades were like 300 years, the Ottomans harrasing people and taking clay lasted for centuries
>>51415212
Aboriginal uprising when?
>>51415321
you cant. you just think they arent turkish when they dont fit stereotype in your mind. turkey is multiethnic country. we used to rule over 3 continents and actually mixed with people there, not just made them slaves like you assholes did.
>>51415495
kek
its built next to the tv tower and germans have harsh regulations demanding a standartized appearance
>>51415089
It's statistics, M*rad, not bragging. Do you see me writing "ahaha VICTORY!!! THOSE PESKY MUDSLIMESSSSS"
?
And if we're going to play the moral high ground here. Question how your ancestors destroyed almost all of the churches built by our kings and desecrated their graves. Our native kings. My village was a city, 10,000 people, until Turks razed it, razed the fort, stole the king's bones, demolished the local church and took exactly 6,300 people back to Anatolia. Now, this once city is not even a village. There are still ruined foundations around it, and 300 people live there. Now multiply this example by 200. Every more notable city in my region's history has a story of Ottoman plunder and orgy on the Christian monuments. Not to mention the culling you did on the people that a region of 200,000 people was under constant siege and skirmishes for 300 years. Coincidentally, this region was the most industrially prosperous one
Go be a M*hmet somewhere else, you get no sympathy from me
>>51415631
>we used to rule over 3 continents
Now thats a bit of an overstatement isnt it.
>not just made them slaves like you assholes did.
No you raped their women and forced your ways upon them good jahb
>>51415657
this
2/3rds of Balkans perished during Muslim rule
>>51415484
you should read about crusades. during first 2 crusades they thought europeans were just barbaric invaders looking for loot. when they realized it was actually a religious war, they did the same, embraced jihadist ideas. spain invasion was for clay, money, not religion. they didnt even try to convert locals.
>>51414341
this will hopefully bring them to emmigrate back to turkey.
>>51414759
>implying
>>51415839
>Crusade memes
Crusades came after centuries of Muslim conquests, and Crusaders weren't nearly as brutal as modern Muslims claim
in fact, no Muslim even cared about Crusades until late 20th century, when they started using it to show how Muslims were supposedly victimized
>>51415690
>Now thats a bit of an overstatement isnt it.
no, especially not when treating turk, as a singular entity
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Turkic_dynasties_and_countries
which makes sense since it shaped every contemporary turk people and we get the butthurt all of them caused
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Turkism
>>51415927
>no Muslim even cared about Crusades
Because we won pretty much every one of them. U mad?
>>51415881
1. go to wikipedia
2. type ''Syrian Civil War''
3. see combatants under ''Opposition''
4. realize that except FSA, they are all openly Islamist (and even FSA is)
5. cry because you're a fag
>>51415963
yeah exactly
also, besides a massacre in Jerusalem (which is heavily exaggerated), Crusaders were more lenient than Muslims in Middle East
in fact, Muslim peasantry liked Christian rule more, cause they were more respected and paid less taxes
so much for ebul Crusaders
>>51414759
http://www.iraqinews.com/arab-world-news/isis-opens-diplomatic-consulate-istanbul-turkeys-president-denies/
ISIS has a fucking embassy in Turkey.
>>51415007
That is like Christians going to a synagogue saying: meh, same God
>>51415619
Penciled in for next Tuesday now you mention it
>>51415948
Anti-Turkism is like Anti-Semitism.
People hate you for good reasons, but no, they're just jelly that you're rapists and murderers and you're god's chosen kind and that bullshit.
>>51415963
no, because crusades were just a few incursions across anatolia and egipt into palestina, whereas mongol invasions at the same time covered all of the middle east and brouth them all back into the stone age
>>51415495
Looks better than most of the other buildings in that pic.
>>51416101
And then Mongols became Muslims. U mad?
>>51416101
that's another meme
while Baghdad and Abassids were destroyed, center of Islamic culture already moved to Cairo
it's not Mongols, Islam is simply degenerated religion and it degenerated further into it's present-day condition
>>51416148
And then Mongols became Vajrayana Buddhists
I would like to see that Kurds establish Kurdish state in T*rkey.
>>51416200
Now they might be irrelevant Buddhist shits, but 3/4 khanates (Golden Horde, Chagatai, Ilkhanate) eventually became Islamic. U mad?
>>51415988
Is the syrian civil war now officially the civil war with the highest number of participants?
>>51416148
why would i be mad tho?
>>51416239
if Islam is so great, why are you living in a Christian state?
>>51416252
probably not
Russian Civil War also had shitload of participants
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_Civil_War
>>51416253
It's in your Slavshit blood
>>51416263
Just doing my part :^) Also
>Netherlands
>Christian state
lel
" I never disliked a Chinaman as I do these degraded Turks and Arabs, and when Russia is ready to war with them again, I hope England and France will not find it good breeding or good judgment to interfere. "
—Mark Twain, 1869
>>51416291
>>51415988
You seem like nice Montenegrin fellow.
>>51415839
Oh yes the crusades. Yeah, the Muslims were just hanging out peacefully when these horribly racist Christians appeared out of nowhere trying to take their land away from them. But how did muslims get there in the first place? Wasn't it always muslim land? No! Palestine was part of the Christian Byzantine empire until a bunch of durkas showed up who murdered thousands of people and forced Christians out of the region. They let some stay as long as they paid a tax and lived as second class citizens. How kind.
>>51416293
Netherlands is a Christian state, in terms of cultural heritage at least
>doing my part
what part?
>>51415484
How exactly is DAESH muslim?
Name one of those restrictions that they actually follow
>>51416359
t-thanks
>>51416069
>That is like Christians going to a synagogue saying: meh, same God
Turks are Tengriist in core.
Tengri literally means God and Tengriism is similar to deism.
Turks on a wide range havent been religiously educated in the same manner as peoples subject to standardizing entities such as a pope.
Common responces of Turkish people confronted with a dogma are:
God gave you a brain, use it.
Belief is a personal matter.
All monotheistic religions obey to the same god.
Just like a tengriist.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tengrism#Principles_of_Tengriism
There exists one supreme God, Tengri. He is the unknowable One who knows everything, which is why Turks and Mongols say 'Only Tengri knows'
There is no 'one true religion'. Humanity has not reached full enlightenment. Nonetheless Tengri will not leave the guilty unpunished and the virtuous unrewarded. Those upright in spirit and righteous in thought are acceptable to Tengri, even if they followed different religions.
>>51416408
The Netherlands is not a Christian state
>cultural heritage
Sod off lad, this is the prostitution and drugs capital of the world, "Christian heritage" my ass. This is a thoroughly atheist country, with some Christian parts (all of which are irrelevant farmlands).
>>51416138
It looks like an Arabian Nights themed nuclear power plant
>>51416408
Hoping people will actually switch over to his Salafi crap, top kek. In fact, all those 2nd/3rd genners are "degenerate" AF
>>51416430
Nice taqqiya
>>51416430
"Don't enforce Islam"
The Qu'ran literally says to force infidels to convert or kill them
>>51416430
Opkankeren
>>51414608
sure thing Mehmet
>>51416430
>don't kill those who surrender
Mohammad did that
>don't kill a child
Tatars regularly did that when they captured slaves; they would cut the throats of children and old, and herd others on a long march
>don't kill a monk or a priest
regularly done by Muslims
>don't destroy a church or temple
true, they get converted to mosques, and Christians are banned from building new ones or even repairing old ones
>don't enforce Islam
at least not directly, but your choice is: live in agony, or accept Islam
>>51416543
not actually
t not even muslim anymre
>>51416514
Taqqiya is a shia practice. ISIS consider themselves Salafi-Jihadist of the Sunni branch. Furthermore, these points are directly translated from Hadith Al-Bukhari, Muslim etc.
If you cannot come up with arguments and/or emperical evidence, you should stop now.
>>51416580
>>don't kill a child
Mohammeds favourite wife was the 9 year old Aisha. I think its pretty safe to say she wouldve been better off dead.
>>51416495
even if I accept your idea that Netherlands is not of Christian cultural heritage, it's clear it's not Muslim either
so what are you doing there?
what are you seeking in ''den of prostitutes and drugs''
why don't you move to Saudi Arabia?
>>51416580
>Mohammad did that
Source? '
If you prove your point I will get baptized and convert to Christianity today,
>>51416495
read something about the value system of our western culture and you will see that even though we Dutch might be atheist in majority, that does not mean christianity does not run trough our veins. Same goes for all the other European countries. Just google shame versus guilt culture and you will see what makes us different from the rest of the world. And after you are done doing that please think to yourself where all of this came from.
>protip: it's christianity
>>51416621
And you should fuck off to your own country m8
>>51414341
>"why the fuck are they still here".
good question
>>51416621
haddiths are also full of other vile shit, far more than Quran
do you want me to post it?
>>51416649
What am I doing here? Living here with a Muslim family, within a timespan of five years I'll marry a Muslim woman, have 5+ Muslim kids, all of whom will also have multiple Muslims kids, etc.
>>51416680
Nee.
>>51416710
FUCK OFF
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
>>51416710
goats cannot get pregnant with sandniggers
>>51416707
Don't hold back. Google hard.
>>51416710
But if Islam is such a great religion and you defend it so fiercely, why are you living in a land filled to the brim with infidels (and the worst kind of infidel,atheists)
>>51416664
slaughter of Qurayza Jews, after the battle men and boys were slaughtered, and women enslaved
>>51416752
>>51416680
The same Dutch people who always post things like that are immigrant keks IRL desu. and only have an opinion when they are 100% anonymous.
this is a nice thread
>>51415839
Every muslim war of conquest against non believers was djihad and holy war due to state and religion being one.
>>51416343
>Pass by
>See this
>Think it's a joke
>mfw
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anti-Turkism#Quotes_and_sayings.5Boriginal_research.3F.5D
>>51416779
They love mudslimes and shitslam so much they rather live in a country that isn't run by mudslimes and shitslam.
>>51416780
>missing source
>>51416666
Why read some stupid article about "muh Dutch cultural values" when I can take a stroll through the capital and see hundreds of whores selling themselves even though Christianity discourages prostitution. Promiscuity everywhere, even though that's forbidden. Hell, I have a Christian friend who is actually one of the few people I know who goes to the church every Sunday, and he is also promiscuous.
The Netherlands is not Christian, at all.
>>51416761
>>51416752
I'm doing nothing illegal.
>>51416814
Wilders is the biggest in the polls by far. How does that make you feel?
Dont you notice public opinion is changing? Maybe people dont say it to your face but even at my left leaning university there are enough people who hate muslims with a passion.
>>51416680
this
>>51416710
thats not a good plan you know
europeans have these things called crematoriums
>>51416666
this guy is right >>51416495
Christianity formed Western civilisation. All our modern notions about human rights etc. comes directly from Christianity, that's why there's such a huge divide between the East and West.
>>51415007
That's some 40k shit right there, I like it
>>51416779
Islam is indeed a wonderful religion, that's why I want to see it everywhere :) By being here, I'm spreading Islam by peaceful and legal means.
>>51416766
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divisions_of_the_world_in_Islam
division of world, from haddiths
>Bukhari (8:387) - Allah's Apostle said, "I have been ordered to fight the people till they say: 'None has the right to be worshipped but Allah'. And if they say so, pray like our prayers, face our Qibla and slaughter as we slaughter, then their blood and property will be sacred to us and we will not interfere with them except legally."
>Bukhari (11:626) - [Muhammad said:] "I decided to order a man to lead the prayer and then take a flame to burn all those, who had not left their houses for the prayer, burning them alive inside their homes."
>Muslim (1:30) - "The Messenger of Allah said: I have been commanded to fight against people so long as they do not declare that there is no god but Allah."
>Muslim (20:4696) - "the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) said: 'One who died but did not fight in the way of Allah nor did he express any desire (or determination) for Jihad died the death of a hypocrite.'"
>Muslim (19:4321-4323) - Three separate hadith in which Muhammad shrugs over the news that innocent children were killed in a raid by his men against unbelievers. His response: "They are of them (meaning the enemy)."
>Muslim (31:5918) - "I will fight them until they are like us." Ali's reply to Muhammad, after receiving clarification that the pretext for attack Khaibar was to convert the people (see above verse).
>Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 484: - “Allah said, ‘A prophet must slaughter before collecting captives. A slaughtered enemy is driven from the land. Muhammad, you craved the desires of this world, its goods and the ransom captives would bring. But Allah desires killing them to manifest the religion.’”
>Ibn Ishaq/Hisham 992: - "Fight everyone in the way of Allah and kill those who disbelieve in Allah." Muhammad's instructions to his men prior to a military raid.
>>51416430
Inshallah my brother. This is true, Daesh have nothing to do with Islam, it is just terrorists who need an excuse to kill.Yet the westerners still blame all Muslims for something that non-Muslim possibly jewish terrorists do. *Shaking my head*
The koran is written in a very bloomy language allowing various interpretations and translations.
Its really about what you make of it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NJXcrM3B4zI
No one has to accept your interpretation senpai.
>>51416430
Exactly, i can also swing words around and say crusaders or Inquisitors weren't christian.
That is exactly what I mean, it does not count what you think about them but what they say they are and that they use islamic tradition.
>>51416962
I meant that the other way around
>51416666 this guy is right
>>51417013
My reply to him:
>>51416911
>>51416969
hail tengri desu
>>51416911
Ask an university professor about it, please.
What you think christianity is doesn't count.
>>51416962
>>51416998
This. It's one giant poem and depending on which language it is translated into and who reads it, anyone can make anything of it.
>>51416909
>The Qur'an briefly refers to the incident in Surah 33:26[16] and Muslim jurists have looked upon Surah 8:55-58 as a justification of the treatment of the Banu Qurayza, arguing that the Qurayza broke their pact with Muhammad, and thus Muhammad was justified in repudiating his side of the pact and killing the Qurayza en masse.[48]
>In the 8th and early 9th century many Muslim jurists, such as Ash-Shafii, based their judgments and decrees supporting collective punishment for treachery on the accounts of the demise of the Qurayza, with which they were well acquainted.[70]
>Aiming at placing the events in their historical context, Watt points to the "harsh political circumstances of that era"[8] and argues that the treatment of Qurayza was regular Arab practice.[79] Similar statements are made by Stillman,[28] Paret,[76] Lewis[80] and Rodinson.[64]
>>51416917
That's good for them m8, I honestly don't care. I am almost finished with my studies and will probably pursue an international carreer. Thanks for all the years of aid and facilities man, it really made life easier.
>>51416911
You are doing the God's work my brother :)
Islam will peacefully spread to all corners of the earth mashallah
>>51417085
>>51416998
And yet 80% of Muslims worldwide say there is only one valid interpetation of the Quran.
>>51417081
>Ask an university professor about it, please.
>an university professor
>an
So basically, you have no reply and that's why you're making an appeal to authority. On top of that you don't even know who you're making an appeal to. Pathetic.
>>51416909
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banu_Qurayza#Arrival_of_Muhammad
>>51417142
What a fantastic statistic. I'm sure this came from a very reputable piece of research.
>>51417142
don't forget, they also accept haddiths which are a far clearer
>>51416992
>>51417130
>What am I doing here? Living here with a Muslim family, within a timespan of five years I'll marry a Muslim woman, have 5+ Muslim kids, all of whom will also have multiple Muslims kids, etc.
>That's good for them m8, I honestly don't care. I am almost finished with my studies and will probably pursue an international carreer. Thanks for all the years of aid and facilities man, it really made life easier.
Even on an anonymous Bengalese homemade applepie forum you lie whenever it suits you. Not suprised because in the end youre still a fucking muslim.
>>51417138
Inshallah, brother. Great to see Muslims in Norway.
>>51416779
Because of the government hand outs we get enough money without working and there is nothing you fags can do about it.
>>51416911
our christian heritage goes deeper than that which you see in the streets. It goes to the core of how we see things different than others. How we feel about personal responsibility and individual liberty versus the communitarian (do not mix this up with communism) ideas of the east and the middle east etc.
the world of knowledge is bigger than that what you see in the streets of Amsterdam. Please educate yoruself
>>51417148
...and I gave you haddiths earlier, why are you not responding to me?
because you can't, obviously
or you'll say ''it's misinterpreted''
or, ''you have to know Arabic''
or, ''you can't discuss Islam if you aren't a Muslim scholar''
you people are so full of shit
>>51417225
Those are two different posters. I am the guy who posted the family thing, I am intending to stay here for the rest of my life.
Not surprised to see a Westerner making stupid, rash claims though.
>>51416909
Are you the guy that made an ask a muslim anything thread in August and just called everyone ignorant when they proved you wrong with sources?
>>51417269
I can't believe this guy is actually arguing with you. Does he think that all of our normen en waarden just came from nowhere?
>>51417148
Christianity led to the age of enlightenment, whose bigget proponents for deconstruction of feudal society and old believe systems were founded in their religious believes.
Protestant icconoclasts, the 30 year war, finally the french revolution were driven by the ideals these forethinkers developed to what we now have with human rights and a law applying to everyone and the need to not punish but to rehabilitate in european prisons as well as the refusal of the death penalty.
I could go on, I am studying political science in my 3rd semester now and I feel shitty enough for pissing away my time on 4chan and I don't need to waste even mroe on people that don't even want to learn and see my point but only make their points in anger.
This is so tiring.
>>51417235
I am planning on moving to the Netherlands or Germany actually, the weather is too cold and the sun does not exist here. Men were not meant to live in this godforsaken place. Also norwegians people are racist
>>51417275
Read this: >>51417285.
You are responding to a different poster. I am not the one who you replied to with the hadiths, I have no idea what that conversation is about. Doesn't surprise me though that a Slav is very weak mentally.
>>51417269
Another poster who says a lot without actually saying anything. No examples of what that supposed Christian heritage is. Let me guess, your stinginess comes from Calvinism? Lmao. Try again.
>>51417285
Yeah and the claims are only gonna get more rash and bold as long as you fucks refuse to abandon your medieval ways.
Better start thinking about a plan B, cause who knows what the future brings. :^)
>>51417350
>want sun
>go to the netherlands
great impression of someone who doesn't know anything about the netherlands
hope I don't miss anything, I'm going out to buy some popcorn and beer
>>51417350
Fuck off, we dont want you. Move to Britain, i heared they are nice.
>>51414341
>Do you have that in your countries fellow europeans?
You mean resentment towards turkey/turks ?
Nah man what would make you think that
>>51417254
>>51417285
Why don't just go then?
i seriously believe we would be better of without Islam.
Without islam no homegrown muslim terrorists.
I have enough friedns that are muslim, but they are not as insufferable and try to integrate.
>>51417370
I apologize then
but the other guy said he'll convert to Christianity immediately if I show him violent haddiths and when Mohamed slaughtered prisoners
>>51417393
I don't think you understand. The sun is not behind the clouds here, it simply is not at all. I have heard from my friends in the Netherlands that while it is cloudy, the sun is still there. I think this is a sign from God that people were not meant to settle here
>>51417414
the english are too strict for me too enter
>live in western country
>still be muslim
how retarded
t. bosnian atheist
>>51416408
>doing my part
>what part?
In the war.
>>51417120
>Lo! the worst of beasts in Allah's sight are the ungrateful who will not believe
>Those of them with whom thou madest a treaty, and then at every opportunity they break their treaty, and they keep not duty (to Allah).
>If thou comest on them in the war, deal with them so as to strike fear in those who are behind them, that haply they may remember.
>And if thou fearest treachery from any folk, then throw back to them (their treaty) fairly. Lo! Allah loveth not the treacherous.
I am missing the part about slaughtering children
Also the hadiths you posted have hilarious translations.
But, I did not expect differently from someone who's not proficient in Arabic.
Thanks for your time man.
>>51417493
>live in Austria
>still be Bosnian
how retarded
t. former Slav
>>51417493
I am sorry my brother :( that you have lost faith in God... you must find your way back to him :)
>>51417142
Namely their personal one.
Belief is a personal matter.
The only unifying entity can be the belief in tengri directly, since every fraction of tengri can deliver truth only partially.
Thats where the differences start, the limited perception.
>>51417174
>Wikipedia
>really academic
>>51417553
... :(
..........
...........
............... :)
;) ......
>>51417564
I never understand people who shit on wikipedia like it can never be correct.
Why don't you check the sources?
>>51417370
the same prostitutes you see in the streets of Amsterdam are a product of western individual liberty and responsibility.
this notion came from christiantiy (or more broadly judeo-christian culture)
https://allenmendenhall.liberty.me/sanctifying-the-individual-does-the-west-owe-its-individualism-to-christianity/
also you might be interested in the case of a non-traditional christian country that has much of it's freedom to thank to christianity.
http://biblicalstudies.org.uk/pdf/ijt/33-4_001.pdf
btw I am not even talking about the Netherlands in particular. But western civilization in a broad term.
>>51417622
???
>>51416911
It's not about believing in god or strictly following a religion, many of us have moved past believing in a god. The societal attitudes Westerners have come directly from Christianity theology. It is ingrained into us and forms the ideas we have about what is wrong and right.
Not to mention all the literature, art and music that is central to our culture. The Renaissance? Man read a history book or something.
>>51417547
True
>>51417553
I never had faith to begin with
>>51417629
wikipedia is a shithole desu
not defending muslims or anything
>>51417669
I think he was inviting you to come to Chili, so please dont come here. Chili is nice and sunny and they dont speak English at all.
>>51417346
>political science
Waste of a major, but I digress. Thanks for the history lesson, totally useless though.
>the refusal of the death penalty
Yes, because that is very Christian right? A question to you. Have you ever read Leviticus? It's part of the Old Testament, that one book Jesus called divinely inspired, and of which he said that "the scripture cannot be broken" or something similar.
Fun exercise - See how many times you encounter the death penalty in Leviticus. It might surprise ya.
>>51417350
>Norwegian people are racist
You should stay in that case. If they don't want you there, stay. It's your right to be a Muslim. See it as your own jihad, your struggle against the Norwegian people.
>>51417372
>who knows what the future brings
Allah does :)
>>51417417
Explained that already.
>>51417525
Why does anyone care? I never listen to people's words. I look at what they do.
>>51417679
Are you one of those who does everything haram, except for some reason eating pork?
mfw this entire thread
>>51417629
I am not saying it cannot be correct, but submitting an academic paper with Wikipedia as its source, is a disturbing joke.
And it's true, it kind of is disturbing. It means that you absolutely put no effort in what you are trying to find out/prove.
>>51417525
ah yes, the famous ''hilarious translation'' argument
didn't expect any better
but it seems to me, groups like ISIS mostly base their actions on ''hilarious translations'', which is weird since their founders are often quite fluent in Arabic, and often studied Islam
>>51417346
Thought so, I will be gone at 17:00.
I hope people wake up and realise that importing people that are mostly poor, uneducated and tie their self worth to the believe that their religion and ideology is superior will be bad for european society.
My fathers sister married an iranian whose family fled with the fall of the Shah, he became a doctor, plays the violine andwrites poetry.
He is a great guy and one of the proofs muslims are ok.
The risk is not worth the reward when we can't process the hordes correctly.
But politics are led by muh feelings.
>>51417564
You're just going to say that for any source I give you. On what evidence is the assertion that Islam is a religion of peace based?
>>51417728
meh i dont really eat it, only ham and sausages.
>>51417693
No, it's a shithole. We have earthquakes every day
>>51417738
I'm actually not the guy you argued with earlier, I was just curious what was wrong with the source you received after requesting a source.
>but submitting an academic paper with Wikipedia as its source
Wikipedia is not a source in itself. I did not think this was part of the initial argument.
>>51416430
Sure thing Ahmed.
>>51416543
Have you read the Qu'ran?
>>51417689
YEAH, FUCK WIKIPEDIA!
FUCK WIDELY AVAILABLE KNOWLEDGE!
>>51417693
>>51417706
Why do you not want me to come to the netherlands? It is not illegal. And it is my right as a human being to be able to live where I want to my self :) Also i do not believe that me or any one else should live in norway, God would not have wanted us to live in a land of darkness
>>51417664
Fuggen this. It's not a giant conspiracy that all western countries are Christian countries.
>>51417747
Please, let me tell you again as a 100% devout muslim. Every ISIS militant will burn in hell. Their magic 'Allahu Akbar' will not save them from the depths of the abyss that will encircle their bodies while the flames burn them endlessly.
Such is the thing you get for being a retard.
And it's true. I have all hadith collections in Arabic and have read most them.
Let me tell you something about the hadith, hadith are not 100% correct. There are instances where hadith contradict the Quran and in that case a hadith will be deemed untrustworthy.
>>51417830
God does not exist, if you believe otherwise The Netherlands is not the place for you.
>>51417787
This isn't an academic paper though, universities don't accept wikipedia as a source because you need to learn how to carry out research yourself. The claims in that article are sourced, you are more than welcome to look into them yourself.
>>51417706
But the individuality we have.
>>51417664
is what divides us from mainstream islam who won't let people alone that do and believe different stuff.
My god is mercifull, because we realised that killing each other for 30 years did not change anything about the nature of god and so we just need to let each other live in peace and believe what he wants as long as it doesn't damage society.
Enforced morality, especially in a religious sense, has no worth.
Strict laws don't make people better persons, but prevent bad things from happening.
Faith and Law have a reason to be mostly divided and I am thankfull for it.
>>51417770
Islam is not a religion of piece, there is no religion of peace. Mankind is retarded and rotten. If there was a religion of piece, mankind would have corrupted it already into something vile.
Do you get my point? Religion does not promote peace or violence, it's just a way to live life.
>>51417830
You should simply stay in Norway because you sound like a little bitch 2bh.
>Norwegians are racist
So what? You're a Muslim, not a tumblr-tier crybaby. Our ancestors fought to the death for this religion and you want to leave Norway because some people don't want you there? Pathetic senpai.
>>51417728
Turks despised eating pork before islam desu.
Fucking mudslimes.
The problem Europeans have with Islam isn't because we just want everyone to be Christian, but because YOU want everyone to be Muslim.
Western civilization is based around liberty and individual choice, things that Islam despises in it's quest to conquer the world.
Islam is not a religion.
It is a totalitarian political ideology aiming for Arab global domination masquerading as a religion.
>>51417917
Peace, the word you are looking for is peace.
>>51417863
But i have heard from my friends in the Netherlands who are muslims, that it is a good place to live and without racist people. My friends are muslims so they would not lie :)
>>51417918
My main complaint with norway is the darkness and the cold
>>51417843
True.
>>51417851
They still are muslim, like crusaders were christian.
They are financed and supported by muslims world wide and act on their faith world wide.
I know and understand that your believe is not theirs and I am thankfull for it.
But they are muslim
>>51414341
We don't have Turks.
Which is funny since we, along with the Croats, Hungarians and the other balkanites were literally a buffer state for Austria.
Turns out there is Justice in this world after all hehehe
>>51417901
I think both of you are misunderstanding me.
On 4chan, it's acceptable to cite a quick wiki link as a source.
Nobody should be retarded enough to write any sort of academic paper with literally wikipedia as references (wikipedia is a collection of sources, not a source in itself).
I was wondering what was wrong with the sources cited in that wikipedia paragraph early on. I didn't ask 'why is sourcing wikipedia in academic papers wrong?'
>>51417851
but why do plenty of Islamic scholars accept those haddiths?
why did they historically act upon them?
what was the rationale of early Muslim conquests?
how did Romans and Persians attack Muslims?
how did Vandals attack Muslims?
how did Indians attack Muslims?
actions speak more than words
first four Caliphs were rightly guided, I believe
>>51417940
It is botth, there is no divide between the state and the ummah in an ideal muslim state.
It is one.
>>51417789
Everyone can pull this off by citing 2 sentence paragraphs from the Quran and claim it's evil or even on the contrary 'a religion peace' which is also not true. I suggest you stop this retardation, clear your mind, take the book and just read for times sake and then form your opinion.
If you have actually read the book and can review it in an honest way, negative or positive, I'll actually respect you for your honesty.
In any case, I'm out this thread, not even one person was able to put forward a decent argument.
>The Netherlands is Christian because it promotes homosexuality, promiscuity and prostitution
Kek, never change, retarded Westerners, never change. How about you read the fucking Bible. Embarrassing to be schooled in your own religion by a Muslim.
>>51417950
Sorry
t. macbook autocorrect
>>51418034
No, I literally don't give a shit, I want all of you mudshits to get the fuck out.
>>51417995
The turks all came in the 20th century, we needed cheap work force
>>51418061
>not even one person was able to put forward a decent argument.
You got BTFO in the beginning with the guy explaining how our Dutch values actually stem from Christianity.
You're probably not even trolling, which is the most embarrassing part.
>>51418061
And that you are posting from the netherlands is the proof that muslims are not able to build something for themselves that is worth living.
They are even disrespectfull of the country that gives them all the opportunities.
>>51417851
>Let me tell you something about the hadith, hadith are not 100% correct. There are instances where hadith contradict the Quran and in that case a hadith will be deemed untrustworthy.
If one hadith should be treated as a source of teaching then they all should. This is just an excuse to cherry- pick which pieces of Islam to follow if and when it suits you.
>>51418061
it's okay I am used to muslims discarding sound arguments as not decent enough.
I learned that after having my first discussion with a muslim about him not having the right not to be offended at a cartoon.
>>51418061
westerners always claim to be good christians, but they are actually atheist and have no morals. They live only for short-term pleasure without laws
>>51417851
>believing in hell
Theres only 1 reality.
Death means losing form.
Heaven and hell are concepts conducted from observation of this realm and situated in the same.
>>51418102
It was the wrong decision.
The Italians brought the Mafia, but islam is worse.
Honestly turks are traditionally pretty ok as immigrants compared to algerians or moroccans...but still.
>in heated muslim debate on 4chan
>captcha keeps failing
CHINESE MOOT WHAT THE FUCK IS THIS
>>51418142
and you must respect their right to do so, since you're newcomer to society they created
>>51418061
and why are you still there?
>>51418027
If no one else, then at least Germany should ban Islam ffs, don't you have that constitution protection police? Who shut down organizations aiming to topple the constitutional state?
I'd say Islam definately qualifies
>>51418142
Our laws and societies work, yours don't.
>>51418061
>read the fucking Bible
We've progressed past the point of having to believe in fairy tales to make it through the day. However we did take the overall message of it to build our societies. Just like your countries did with your book and they're still living in the fucking stone age.
If you hate the west so much fuck off.
>>51418165
What still?
Youre in no position to judge.
>>51418017
I'll quickly answer your first question, I need to go to the gym and I am not trying to push anything over. I mean wouldn't care less if you liked muslims or not. I just care about the overall image.
>but why do plenty of Islamic scholars accept those haddiths?
The islamic scholar system is a huge con of islam and I mean a huge setback. This means that aside from a few intellectual skeptics, the rest of the islamic population is depending on the opinion of a few scholars that can twist reality into something for their personal gain.
In saudi-arabia, they accept hadith that openly permit violence and oppression against women. Those hadith are da`if (weak) and have no solid base to be accurate or even legitimate at all.
>>51418180
I feel that it is my duty to help them accept real morals
>>51418224
Ours do, it is just you westerners that invaded us and destroyed our countries because you knew that our culture and morals is superior :)
>>51418061
>Dodge and ignore arguments
>"SEE NO ONE CAN MAKE AN ARGUMENT BECAUSE ISLAM IS PERFECT"
>>51414341
Daily reminder
>>51418201
Sadly we are ebil nazis and still like rleigious freedom.
Our security apparatus IS cracking down on radical islamists, that is why we don't have any major terrorist attacks.
But the problem is the pool the radicals recruit from is generated by ordinary muslims who breed rather fast.
This is hard to deal with.
>>51418258
>>51418269
>>51418269
We are letting you flee here, you should be thankfull.
If we really were that evil we would let you starve and die or lynch you.
Just look at pre WW1 times, if you prefer to be treated like this. Just say it.
>>51418142
>without laws
yeah, what are civil rights, equality before the law, procedural justice and democracy even
>>51418269
Most muslim countries were only conquered by other muslims 2bh, the ones that were conquered by Europeans were only held for a very short period.
>>51418338
Morgen Rotterdam Centraal? 9:00uur, kebabzaak? wel komen he
groetjes achmed
>>51417525
>Move of goalposts
Kankermongool
HAHAHAHA FUCKING DUTCH MUSLIMS EVERYTIME WHAT A BUNCH OF CÚCKS
Europe is doomed
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xKF45TvUVw
Why is every dutch porster a muslim holy shit europe get it together
>>51418258
point is: that's the state of Islam right now
your ideal Islam doesn't exist, and it probably never did
religion isn't just idea, believers make religion real
>>51418269
what morals?
I don't even like modern Western culture, but it's their choice, not mine to make
am I immoral simply because I'm agnostic? you don't even know me
>>51418382
p.s. onze relatie is taqiyyah toch? senpai?
ik hou niet van je.. i-i....ik vind het gewoon leuk om je te zien.
baka
>>51418297
fuck off chinkfag
>>51418061
the Bible is shit, all the religions are shit. My Europe is atheistic. Liberté, Égalité, Fraternité and so on
*tips fedora ironically*
>>51418458
Please save us, and bring some bunda.
>>51418338
:(
>>51418360
I am very thankful, and i am repaying you by teaching you about real morality, so that you need not go to hell :) that is a fair repayment in my opinion
>>51418374
Man made "laws" are immoral and against God. I am saddened to see how brainwashed you are by the jews :(
>>51418379
And yet you spread your decadence to our countries because you want the oil
>>51418463
Choice is a man made illusion made to distance people from God. And yes I do not know you, but in my experience very few atheists in the west follow Islamic law
>>51418510
Just come home white man
Europe is Islamic now
>>51418061
>all those muslims with european flags
>>51418515
but if Islamic law is so good, why are Islamic societies den of corruption, suffering and backwardness?
>>51418497
saatana perkele
it seems we did not hit your suomensuko pagans hard enough with the bible
>>51418463
It did and there are a lot of ideal muslims.
The most ideal muslims were, Ibn Khaldun, ibn Musa al-Khwarizmi etc.
The average muslim nowadays is insecure and fears science, because they believe science leads to blasphemy. If they follow the perfect religion, they shouldn't be afraid of science nor of progress.
>>51418557
Lmao ever been to /mena/? its literally all German, canadian, french and Dutch flags
>>51418515
>I am very thankful, and i am repaying you by teaching you about real morality, so that you need not go to hell :) that is a fair repayment in my opinion
You are fucking beyond help. Noone wants to have anything to do with mudslimes and your illconcieved sense of superiority. Let alone be taught about how you think goatfucking is the epitome of life.
>>51418497
No transcendental value no justice.
The biological human is merely a machine, not a juridical entity.
Unknowledgable times are dark days.
>>51418515
While muslims swarm into Europe like locusts because they want our prosperity and human rights.
Also I don't remember muslims complaining when the West intervened to stop the Bosnian genocide.
>>51418604
Why are muslims so full of themselves desu, when a country dont want or like you, you should just keep your head down a behave or get the fuck out, not pretend you are a god
>>51418601
seeking perfect society simply leads to disaster
see: communism
>>51414341
Turks are ISIS supporting scum
>>51414341
turkey sides with isis meme
falling for isis meme
ISHYGDDT
>>51418679
Totalitarian Communism works good during a war though.
>>51418558
Because of western influence
>>51418604
And yet there is nothing you can do to stop it :) just give up my friend, the western decadent immoral way of life is outdated, Islam is the future inshallah
>>51418640
You did not intervene to stop the Bosnian genocide... You intervened because you think orthodox christians are a bigger threat than muslims
>>51418731
during times of chaos, totalitarianism works
during other times, it degenerates into oppression
>>51418753
So you will turn our countries into the same kind of place you fled fromß
Oh wow, good idea.
>>51416970
You cannot convert Dutch atheists. We don't care about religion. We'll build you a time machine in the near future so you can gently fuck off to the past.
>>51418753
>Because of western influence
how come?
as far as I know (and I'm quite knowledgeable about history), things were only worse in past
>>51418731
I hate communism even more than islam.
At least islam has "some kind of" morals towards god (though I admit you need to look really hard)
Communism has none it is just the total submission of the self to a faceless state that can and will do with you whatever it damn well pleases.
>>51418753
>And yet there is nothing you can do to stop it :) just give up my friend, the western decadent immoral way of life is outdated, Islam is the future inshallah
This shit right here is why i think the only possible outcome is civil war in western Europe. Is this what Muslims like you want? Full blown conflict in Europe? Because let me tell, that has only one possible outcome and thats picrelated.
>>51418771
Totalitarianism in the 20th and 21tst century only happened because foreign powers shifted all the resources into the hands of one or a select few.
In that case, ultimately, every regime on earth is totalitarian, because in the end, the one with access to most of the resources can influence politics and indirectly make decisions. In dictatorial regimes however, this is more transparent.
>>51418753
>You did not intervene to stop the Bosnian genocide... You intervened because you think orthodox christians are a bigger threat than muslims
Are you fucking kidding me? We intervened because of political pressure to prevent another holocaust. How could Orthodox Christians be a threat to the West compared to Muslims?
>>51418850
godwin time!
ou see, it's been our misfortune to have the wrong religion. Why didn't we have the religion of the Japanese, who regard sacrifice for the Fatherland as the highest good? The Mohammedan religion [Islam] too would have been more compatible to us than Christianity. Why did it have to be Christianity with its meekness and flabbiness?[4]
Had Charles Martel not been victorious at Poitiers -already, you see, the world had already fallen into the hands of the Jews, so gutless a thing Christianity! -then we should in all probability have been converted to Mohammedanism [Islam], that cult which glorifies the heroism and which opens up the seventh Heaven to the bold warrior alone. Then the Germanic races would have conquered the world. Christianity alone prevented them from doing so.[6]
>>51418753
Wow I went from defending muslims to absolutely fucking hating Muslims in a year.
>>51418807
No, they will be moral societies because when you are powerless, you will not be able to influence people with alcohol and promiscous women
>>51418816
In the past, Muslims lived a simple bedouin lifestyle mostly. A good lifestyle, but of course it could not last forever
>>51418850
No one has to die. I have faith that you will accept God eventually :) No Muslims want war or violence, the Paris terrorists were not Muslim
>>51418951
Like you didn't want the holocaust to begin with... You hated jews more than we did back then, then you sent them to us for them to become our problem. And as for orthodox christians being a threat, I do not know what westerners think, but the Crimean war happened because you thought orthodox christian Russia was a bigger threat than the Turks
>>51419001
Just a phase my friend :) hate is juvenile, acceptance and tolerance is mature
>>51419001
>Actually feeding and believing that troll.
>>51419080
>No Muslims want war or violence,
Better tone it down then m8
>>51419001
it is fun, isn't it?
I was like you too.
But coming into contact with them and seeing how the worst behave (and there are not that few) makes one reconsider.
>>51419093
It is ok, at least he helps radicalise people.
>>51418993
guess the one that was being quoted just thar
>>51414341
Wir haben fast keine Ausländer, vor drei Monaten war ich in Berlin, um non-white Leute zu sehen.
>>51419120
Daesh is not Muslim. Paris terrorists were not Muslims. Educate yourself
>>51419190
Je moeder?
Better praise Tengri or you go http://mp3pm.info/song/45731944/Gore_Elohim_-_Federal_Emergency_Management_Agency_2013/
