Why do westerners believe that democracy is good? No, seriously. Overwhelming majority of people are total retards. Some recent examples: retarded Brits voted to exit Europe and fully fucked their country up, Americans have elected George Bush as a president and may elect Trump now etc.
I think you should at least limit voters with educational and age census.
1) Only people with at least bachelor degree should vote. Seriously, do you expect people breeded on memes and TV to make sane decisions?
2) You don't let children vote but you let old people vote despite old people just doesn't understand modern world. If you are older than 70 you should not vote because you are likely to be retarded.
No one should be able to vote in your country then
You are all retards
You see, and those examples are only picked by me from first world because most of people here are westerners and they are acquainted with those examples the best. 2nd/3rd world examples are way more funny.
In Russia people continually votes for United Russia and Putin. Of course elections are always rigged and if even they weren't Putin won't go out of office, but the fact is that people votes for retarded party full of criminals, famous for bribery scandals etc.
In Egypt people after revolution made mostly by local progressive forces voted for retarded Islamist party. Yes, Egyptians seem to have learned the lesson because the was revolution and coup next year after elections, but they still did retarded shit at first step.
In Ukraine people unironically elected guy who started his career with stealing hats in public toilets as a president.
In Venezuela people elected Maduro who is obvious retard and mentally ill person who states he likes talking to Ugo Chavez spirit.
In Zimbabwe people vote for Mugabe despite him being obvious idiot who fucked their economy up, but they still vote for him because of his cheap nationalist rhetoric.
List can go on.
>>61540985
Good point. Majority doesn't always the right side.
>>61541006
Putin support base are mostly uneducated religious people from villages and small towns of 45+ age. Educated people from big cities and youth tend to be progressive and anti-Putin. Educational census in Russia could be good thing too; with such a census it would be able at least to elect opposition party to parliament (well, we now have problem that authorities don't let them to participate in elections but still they would have more chances with census).
Communism is the only way.
>>61540985
College is a meme
>me
>reading
>all that shit
>>61541119
In 2nd/3rd world people are often uneducated and brainwashed with state owned TV, media, religion, traditions etc. In Russia people would support any cannibal if he is anti-western because people here hate the West a lot. Despite I am pretty skeptical about our relationships with Europe myself it's irrational feeling based on emotions which allows to manipulate the people a lot. You may just be very hostile to the West, talk about muh culture, muh traditions, damned west, lustful western influence, gay threat etc and be popular even if you don't have any actual proposals making sense.
>>61540985
So someone with a bachelors in womens studies should be able to vote but an self-employed entrepreneur shouldn't?
Absurdly idiotic suggestion.
>>61541219
It's not a meme. Even if you studied bad or you have irrelevant profession (artist for example) you still have the common course taught which gives you some basic knowledge. Idk, maybe it's different in the West but here people learn higher math even if they study at manager program and philosophy even if you study at engineering. Also colleges here are places where people are taught trades, it's not higher education here. Higher education here is provided only by universities.
Except government can only gain its legitimacy from the consent of the governed, but how can the people consent unless they have official power to give governments power or take it away as they see fit? And it doesn't matter if people are stupid or not, the state's decisions have an impact on them so they deserve a say.
>>61540985
The EU on a whole operates more as a technocracy with some democratic components. What is your opinion on their operations?
Personally I think, despite their best efforts at establishing this technocratic system, they still failed to form a cohesive mechanism for implementing uniform change. They have to persuade member nations to agree on things, like accepting refugees.
You have good points. We are TOTALLY dominated by glamorized issues while completely ignoring others. We're so obsessed with putting up a thousand mile slab of concrete that we forget whites are dying en masse from drugs and blacks from gang violence. It's heartbreaking. That being said, democracies are an imperfect mess, and I prefer to keep them that way.
>>61541322
tbf someone with a bachelors in women's studies would at least know how to use a search engine.
>>61540985
I think that the only people that should vote are:
>Economists
>Political scientists
We need a technocratic world
>>61540985
>yfw if you add a basic math captcha, akp would literally drop to 5%
OP is right
only people who graduated from universities and gets +120 IQ points must be able to vote
>>61541322
1) Bachelor in woman studies obviously had the common course and is more educated than average person. Also as far as I know woman studies is just a politology/history course with an emphasis on feminism history and woman rights history so people studying this course should in theory understand politics pretty good.
2) >self-employed entrepreneur
doesn't mean he is an educated person able to make politically significant decision. You may be total idiot and own some business, these things don't contradict each other.
I will post my naked butt if someone describes a better ideology than democracy.
Also, what the fuck is happening to /int/? Pic related
>>61541405
And what stops those people from fucking over everybody else? The only way to avoid the abuse of power is to have it as evenly distributed as possible.
>>61541396
See my post here
>>61541375
The problem with technocratics is that they sometimes ignore the social ramifications of their decisions. The world to them is statistics and results. To the technocratic EU, accepting an extreme number of migrants is good for the economy. European populations are aging, so it is only 'logical' to take all these people in to keep up economic productivity and not fall behind on debts. However, they don't care to notice the ideologies and social movements these new people bring with them
>>61540985
Democracy is a mess, but it's still better than a system that concentrates power into the hands of just one or a few people.
>>61540985
Al Gore won the popular vote in 2000 and GWB won because of the electoral college. The GWB argument is actually in favor of direct democracy. It's almost as if people argue against democracy only when their side loses.
>>61541396
Except technocrats can become massively out of touch with the populations needs and desires. People could be furious about something but GDP rose so who really cares? That's technocratic thinking.
>>61541435
Thats because they suck at being technocrats, not because technocracy ia bad per se. They just failed at everything.
>>61541427
technocracy. Ruled by a benevolent super AI smarter and more rational than any human :^)
>>61541469
Any government that doesn't accept the input of the people will be out of touch with their needs. There's also the issue of whether or not you think prosperity is worth sacrificing the freedom to have a say in your own government.
>>61541469
This. Technocracy is not inherently autistic.
>>61541474
Humans are only partially rational. Like it or not, how people feel, even if it's at odds with facts, is something that has to be taken into consideration when making decisions, otherwise the results can be catastrophic.
>>61541469
I see the wisdom in technocracies, but this argument that they're just "bad technocrats" can be applied to any ideology. It's like saying Pol Pot was just a "bad Communist" and does not represent some of the potential shortcomings of that school of thought.
Yes, in an ideal world technocrats mix logic with socio-cultural trends that the nation approves of. As it stands though, they frequently fall out of touch
>>61541412
>You may be total idiot and own some business,
not for long enough to vote
>>61541467
So you want a government that controls your heart? Thats even more dangerous than the alternative. Government is supposed to be boring.
>>61541474
A computer that doesn't understand human irrationality and emotion would never be able to look after many essential human needs such as mental wellbeing or our desire for art and culture.
>>61541347
I see no problem in dictatorship. It may be extremely effective. Sometimes it's even necessary to have a dictatorship, for example if you have to modernize your country quickly. Singapore would be retarded shithole without Li Quan I, Turkey would be 3rd world without Ataturk, Russia would be agrarian colony of the West without Stalin, China would be shithole without Dan Siaopin. And what I am talking about is not even a dictatorship, just a rule of sane people.
>>61541405
Yes, Turkey is a twin state to Russia so I think you really got my point. Westerners often don't realize that shitty and retarded governments outside the 1st world are often not muh bloody dictatorships ruling people with violence, they are supported by majority of population due to the lack of education and excessive brainwashing.
>>61541430
democracy doesnt work trudeau. when you give power to stupid people who believes to everything what their tv channel says, they fucking up everything.
i mean look at us, 15 years ago, our cunt was worth to live (except economy). but now, as a nationalist i literally planning to move out
>>61541469
Your """"argument"""" could be applied to communism too
>>61541523
That's not what I said. I said that technocrats can often have their priorities be completely out of touch with the realities and concerns of the people. They are busy congratulating themselves on improving crop yields while the people are rioting about police brutality or something completely unrelated. Not to mention that any technocratic regime could easily abuse it's power.
>>61541519
I commounism is a different kind of iddolgy from techncracy. Its like comparing democracy and mercantilzm. They are things that opperate at a differnt level
>>61541536
how did turkey get so stupid anyhow? seems like ataturk set you guys up pretty well by trying to remove durka from all public life and influence but now idiots want to be more like the fucking iraqis or egyptians or something
>>61541555
Those problems are inherent to any form of government.
http://www.newyorker.com/books/double-take/e-b-white-on-the-meaning-of-democracy
>Democracy is the recurrent suspicion that more than half of the people are right more than half of the time
Also:
>it has been said that democracy is the worst form of Government except all those other forms that have been tried from time to time.
-Winston Churchill
>>61541536
If democracy doesn't work then why are most of the most powerful and successful countries democracies? The problem of uneducated voters can simply be solved by educating them. Make quality education easily available and you have yourself a population that actually understands the issues. Less educated people tend to vote less anyway.
>>61541582
Not as much, since democratic rulers rely on being re-elected periodically they have a vested interest in making sure that the people's interests are met. In countries like the U.S. where the political elite is increasingly out of touch with the people the issue is that democracy as effectively ceased to exist, what they need is to become more democratic.
>>61541569
They don't want to be Saudi Arabia, it's just people being nationalist and traditionalist due to lack of education and urged to be like that by TV who support retarded right wing conservative regime. Same we have here in Russia. Putin forces traditionalism severely, forces religion, builds fuckin churches everywhere and people accept it because they are stupid and uneducated and favor everything related to nationalism.
>>61541253
Because the corrupt politician was chosen, people ask them to resign, they're still in power. Democracy as the name, but total autocratic in execution. Manipulator are not outsider, but rather the insider. Kind of jealous with Japan and Koreans.
>>61541632
Having elections every 2 years results in politicians focusing in short term goals. Btw, Im not honestly proposing to change the system, it is just a thought exercise
>>61541632
>If democracy doesn't work then why are most of the most powerful and successful countries democracies
Because those are the western countries. West was lucky to invent capitalism first in the world because rest of the world was affected with harsh Mongol invasion and held back so you invented capitalism and have historical handicap due to it.
>>61540985
Democracy worked the best when only people who earn above certain income (or other qualification) were able to vote.
One example was when Europe was at its height with industrial revolution and colonialism and Japan with Meiji restoration and (to some extent) ancient Rome and Greece
>>61540985
Tsarist autocracy sure made Russia a developed and prosperous nation lol. That said, none of western countries are actually democratic so you're criticising something that doesn't exist.
>>61541708
It's shit by the set of reasons:
1) Many rich people earned their capitals through crime.
2) Many rich people have just inherited their capitals and may be totally retarded themselves.
3) We have ton of examples of countries ruled by ultrarich people actually including Russia and Ukraine but it's total shit. Rich people only care about themselves and tend to favor laws and policies that favor them over poorer people.
Oligarchy is always bad.
>>61541700
Actually, the big event that laid the groundworks for development was the Black Death, which totally fucked up Europe along with most of the world. The value of the average worker skyrocketed, and new technologies had to be invented to make up for the horrific loss of manpower.
>>61541748
And soviet authoracy (well, it's not correct to call USSR authocracy because it was ruled by politebureau i.e. collective rule) made us superpower, and I mentioned countries like Singapore above.
>>61540985
I think the same way desu.
Like people with at least a complete high school should vote.
WE MUST DEVELOP A BENEVOLENT AI TYRANT
THIS IS LITERALLY A FLAWLESS GOVERNMENTAL SYSTEM, ALL FLAWS PREVIOUS SYSTEMS HAVE, THIS ONE DOES NOT
>>61541427
There was another Australian shitposting spree with the lame as fuck 'Easter?' meme so the jannies had to come and delete half the threads on the board. It's being repopulated right now.
Australia rangeban when?
People like Trump because he is the older age strong executive power. Obama literally went on a global apology tour in the first two years of his presidency. Are we regarded any differently? Do we not still bomb the fuck out of any middle eastern country we want to? Obama and Hillary seem so upset with America, but Trump is unapologetically, uncompromisingly pro-America. Tell me you wouldn't vote for someone with that mentality in your own country
>>61541829
>what is The Terminator and Psycho Pass for 600
Western democracy is hidden oligarchy OP. Even Marx wrote about it. Capitalism concentrates capital in a hands of a very close group of very rich people and concentration of capital brings concentration of power. Their parliaments are just cover for underground games of millionaires. In USA few hundred people owns 70% of total USA wealth, in our country 62 Putin friends own 80% of all the capital of the country. Only direct council democracy may be effective if it is not dominated by one party as it was in USSR.
>>61541878
Yeah, communism worked out so well for you.
Suck my dick faggot
>>61540985
Democracy isn't good. It's just better than anything else we've tried.
>>61541870
a fictional movie and a weebshit loser cartoon
>>61541878
>Even Marx
stopped reading
>>61541569
laicism.
check france they have the same cancer.
>banning even head-scarfs
>people: " the states religion is literally atheist / anti-religious"
>then they support anyone pro-islamic
>>61541853
No, I wouldn't because I have solid mechanical engineer education. I am nit a person who would vote with my fuckin emotions, I prefer to employ brain sometimes. He may be 10 times nice person making poltards panties get wet but his proposals are absolutely retarded, he is total idiot from idea of building the wall with Mexico and banning Muslims (the latter is special kek because he would have to change first amendment then) to destruction of trade agreements and putting the biggest economy of the world and world mist influential country to isolation.
>>61540985
I've been thinking this for years.
The one thing I need to add is that for this system, university education (and education in general) need to be fully funded.
If getting a bachelor's degree requires 50k, as it does at many universities in the US, you're going to have a stratified society with no social mobility. Else it would be subject to the regular faults of aristocracy.
>>61542047
I basically mean that moving between the non-voters and voters group should not be decided by money.
>>61541964
Yes. In USSR we had oppression on religion and without USSR we had giant religious revival in 90s when it was literally trendy to be religious which caused Putin to start forcing religion hardly. This in turn makes people hate religion and I think Russian youth is the most radical fedora youth in the world, next generation we will be Sweden tier. Are there anything like that in Turkey? I've heard your youth are becoming total fedoras too. I think it's always like that, some ideas are becoming popular and when they have become popular they turn to be shit due to retardness of people and this causes reaction. In Europe we see rise of rightists by the same reasons.
Democracy and infinite growth on finite materials is the religion of death an despair eventually.
>>61542047
Yes, you're right. It's just here in Russia education is free so I wrote it out of my experience.
>>61542162
one of my friend literally left islam after seeing how akp-tier muslims acts.
im seeing in the last 15 years atheists number increased.
and the fucked up way is how akp sparated the people like:
before 2005-2010, greetings was like "selamün-aleyküm" in turkey no matter if youre secular or religious (even the atheists used it i think. but there is nothing wrong with it anyway since it means "peace be upon you in arabic)
but after 2010 even this become like, "if he says merhaba instead of selamün-aleyküm, then he is secular / indidel"
so because of like this example, some people hated this shit and became distant to whole religion.
tl;dr: yes
>>61541964
>stopped reading
Meanwhile present day economists do actually read Marx because he wrote about economic theory and the structure and mechanics of capitalism and supported the free market.
>>61540985
The only thing would be good for democracy because the citizens can decide more things and without Member of Parliament. But it includes a number of values that are not good. For example, the native population have less value than immigrants.
>>61540985
We don't trust a political process that we have no say in.
>>61540985
/pol/
>>61542359
This.
The favoring of Mexicans by liberals is why Donald Trump happened. Democracy quickly becomes insanity when the demographic stability of a nation is thrown off balance.
>>61542367
So you would also not trust a heart surgeon to fix your heart or an engineer to build you a bridge because you have no say in it?
>>61540985
>Only people with at least bachelor degree should vote
Wouldn't change much here. Universities usually have the biggest cucks.
>>61542339
>supported free market
what did he mean by this
>>61542414
Politics is a bargaining process. Surgery and civil engineering are not.
>>61542421
>REEE KEKS
Back to pol. There is a reason why educated people tend to be left wing.
>>61542423
Free market urges the development of capitalism and the more capitalism is developed the closer it is to socialism. Actually that's why antiglobalist left wingers are idiots who have not even read Manifesto.
>>61542423
The planned economy was a Soviet invention.
if you want cringe any turk just post these links
>democracy gives power to these people
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbF4rCZQNRU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=epAgMNykjCc
>>61542464
And where is your proof of this claim??
There's a colossal task that needs to be done, can turn up deadly, are very easy to fuck up, and is virtually impossible to do unless you have highly skilled, highly educated, highly experienced narrow specialists to do it.
Why the fuck is bridge building a "not bargaining process" and politics are a "bargaining process"?
People are retarded and there are tons of every day proofs and examples of this.
>>61542488
>There is a reason why educated people tend to be left wing
Yes, because if they would be openly right wing, they would lose their career.
it's very simple how to fix democracy
one person can vote only once in their life, so they don't waste their vote mindlessly and if they do, next time they won't have the possibility
at the same time, representatives shouldn't be just random people who got enough supporters, they should be exclusively senior state officials + specialist committees
for democracy to work, you just need to keep the rabble from wasting their votes on populism
I'm not a fan of the system myself, though
>>61542531
>>61542488
Also, school systems brainwash people to be left wing, so of course, people who went to university tend to be left.
>>61542414
if the heart surgeon does not fix your heart properly he can be sued and/or lose his license for malpractice.
if the bridge-builders fuck up the bridge they will have a massive fucking lawsuit and likely be massively discredited, to the point where they may not be contracted anymore (depending on how bad it was)
therefore it makes sense that the leader of your country will also lose his job if he fucks up too badly; accountability.
>le educated people are left wing meme
Left wing brainwash != education. Think of the left wing college educated people. Think of their diplomas.
Produces nothing. Builds nothing. Solves nothing. Fixes nothing. Does fucking nothing. Their work is subjective, useless, not applied, impractical, economically unviable, just a pretentious useless drivel.
The scale of citizenry, if such thing was invented, should rightly put all these quasi-intellectuals on the bottom, together with criminals, traitors, corrupted people, parasites, etc.
THIS MEME NEEDS TO STOP
>>61542531
Oh wow, so all the right wingers in the West are hobos? Don't be retarded, all that rightist bullshit about "muh oppression on rights" is bullshit. There are tons of alt.right parties and Europe with significant support base. Yes, if you implement my proposals they would lose many supporters because those are mostly uneducated and stupid people who fall for pol memes and vote for right wingers.
>>61542608
I'm not sure how it is in your third world country, but in Germany being right wing is practically illegal, since allieds occupied this country and created the EU. Nationalism is completely gone in Western Europe, which is also why it is dying out.
>>61542606
>>61542600
Lol, it's not brainwashing, educated people all over the world tend to be left wing, in all the education systems in all the countries. Education just gives you more knowledge and more wide view of the world so educated people are naturally inclined to be progressive.
>>61542667
This has nothing to do with being educated. They just follow what people tell them without thinking for themselves. Just because you go to universities, doesn't mean you have to be smart. You just have to work hard and memorize the shit people want you to learn. many people who are "educated" are dumb as fuck actually.
>>61542663
Lol. So you understand nazis under right wing, lol. Of course it's illegal because we all have seen where such an ideas lead, it's like banning suicide sect.
>Nationalism is completely gone in Western Europe,
Because it is the most prosperous and successful region of the world where people are the most educated.
>dying out
Lol, problems you have are nothing compared to problems of Russia or Brazil. And it's extremely stupid to hear it from German whose economy is thriving and tons of Russians move to Germany every year. Germany is do successful and comfy because you have abandoned retarded nationalism and freed yourself as all the Europe which has caused mass economy boom and cultural domination of the West.
>>61542667
educated postmodernist artists and literature critics, doctors of women studies, certified zimbabwean feminist hip hop experts and so on
literally everyone in financing is right wing, most of the people in hard sciences and medicine are mixed/apolitical, they simply dont care since they will get payed either way, no matter what politics win they are getting the big bucks
not everyone with a college degree is educated or useful in any way, shape or form
i'd rather crash on a desert island with a fucking electrician and carpenter and car mechanic than a fucking educated language major or postmodern philosopher
pic related, "the education", fuck off quasi intellectual, useless shit
>Why do westerners believe that democracy is good? No, seriously. Overwhelming majority of people are total retards. Some recent examples: retarded Brits voted to exit Europe and fully fucked their country up, Americans have elected George Bush as a president and may elect Trump now etc.
>I think you should at least limit voters with educational and age census.
>1) Only people with at least bachelor degree should vote. Seriously, do you expect people breeded on memes and TV to make sane decisions?
>2) You don't let children vote but you let old people vote despite old people just doesn't understand modern world. If you are older than 70 you should not vote because you are likely to be retarded.
>>61542764
>Because it is the most prosperous and successful region of the world where people are the most educated.
Japanese people are usually much smarter than Europeans (have a higher IQ) and also still have nationalism. The reason there is not nationalism in Western Europe is because it got completely cucked by the allies and their beloved Jew overloards.
But whatever... Makes obviously no sense talking with you brainwashed third worldler with the IQ of a peanut.
>>61542733
People who know more facts than average person have more examples to compare, have more food for their brains. And you can't study in uni and be stupid, all your memorizing wouldn't help you. The amount of information you got in modern education system is impossible to memorize. Lol, looks like you are just justifying yourself for not going to uni.
>>61541971
>I prefer to employ brain sometimes.
when are you going to start?
>>61542606
I know poeple with IT and other useful degrees who are raging leftists.
>>61542775
All the STEMfags are statistically left wing, learn more about it.
>>61542845
>Japanese people are usually much smarter than Europeans (have a higher IQ) and also still have nationalism
Japanese nationalism is almost dead now, what are you talking about. They had it in the past, ~20 years ago but now majority of Japanese are progressive. Japanese nationalists are mostly meme now connected to criminals. You would see no nationalist prosperous countries. Nationalism is pure 2nd/3rd world thing.
>>61540985
>Overwhelming majority of people are total retards
I just can't be on this board anymore.
The people are too dense, too dumb, yet they still shit out their opinions each time.
I'm well educated, normie, I'm too good for this.
>>61543017
See you tomorrow.
>>61542974
Are you gonna dispute it? Give me the arguments most of people are clever.
>>61540985
>westerners believe that democracy is good
today i learn
russian aren't westerner.
>>61542946
I am in stem and most people are apolitical, where is your proof that stems are leftists????
>>61543087
>apolitical
That's not actually a virtue which is why I trust engineers to build shit that works but not to run society.
>I just can't be on this board anymore.
>The people are too dense, too dumb, yet they still shit out their opinions each time.
>I'm well educated, normie, I'm too good for this.
>>61540985
Russians just suck at democracy
>>61543087
I am stemfag too and most of people from my uni are communists or liberal (engineers tend to be more left wing, IT tends to be liberal).
Also our education system is mostly liberal while we just don't have any woman studies tier educational course. Our education is limited with STEM, doctors, lawyers and managers. We have literally 1-2 unis where historicianz and politilogists are educated.
>>61543052
Welcome to geography.
Monarchy is the most stable and natural and that's an undeniable fact
we havent fucked our country up at all, i love how people shit themselves over a little drop in the pound. its already back up to pre brexit levels
>>61540985
The best way forward is to make owning property and serving in the military a prerequisite to the right to vote.
This will have the benefit of reducing the voice of women, and the manly layer of women who do enlist are skimmed off from the general population of feminine women who just don't want to enlist
This also solves feminism, promotes a sense of national unity, and is the only sensible solution
Prove me wrong faggots.
Protip: you can't.
>>61543390
yeah that's why it survived feudalism :^)
brute force-ism it the only true governing system, all authority comes from violence
troughout ages man ruled man because he was more fed than him and because he had access to better weapons (feudalism)
today, man rules man trough technology, most successful people, the richest businesses, the most influential and powerful, all can be tied to technology
>>61543617
>serving the military
What's the point in it? Here in Russia we have enlisting but only bydlos and peasants serve eventually because others give bribes or make up diseases. Serving in military makes you stupid and obedient, what's the point in connecting it to the right of vote?
Also being rich doesn't make you clever and educated at all, what is the point in it too? Majority of richfags built their capitals on crime or inherited it, number of self made businessmen is small.
>>61543790
Well if it was mandatory and you could remove the bribery aspect:
1. Helps build national character and comradeship
2. Prepares for times of war
3. Management benefits; eg Israelis
4. Women don't like it and are less likely to enlist, it thins out the female vote. Ills of Western civilization can be tied with women getting the vote & sexual liberation
5. Masculinizes the culture
I don't think serving in the military alone will make you dumb... that's a matter of military culture and discipline
It's not about being clever, it's about people who have a personal stake in the country making the choices. I think that is my weaker point, but regardless it too would reduce the female vote I believe.
>>61543729
That's too simplistic but it's almost true, anyways those with real power amongst the people in society will be aristocrats or monarchs
>>61544022
Enlisting is mandatory in Russia and:
>Helps build national character and comradeship
Not at all, army just breaks your mental health and instead of comradeship it's a festival of humiliation. Until recently we had great troubles with violence in army where people who served second year intimidated and beated those who serve less. It was only fixed with mandatory check of bruises all over the army.
>Prepares for times of war
Only professionals are preparing really, enlisted usually just build some shit or transport military merchandises.
>Management benefits; eg Israelis
Idk what are you talking about
>Ills of Western civilization can be tied with women getting the vote & sexual liberation
It's highly disputable, lol. Women are liberated throughout the world now, westerners just did it earlier but the countries of the world are all different and have different problems. If the reason of problems were woman countries would have similar sets of problems.
>Masculinizes the culture
Lolno. It actually makes the opposite because after army many males become sexual perverts and so. Army is built up on obedience and dominance so the whole society is becoming filled with BDSM. For example, bydlo discusses almost all political and social relationships in terms of "x fucked y in the ass, z sucks y cock".
Mandatory enlistment army is just a softer kind of prison and I don't see any way prisons may make society better.
