lol enjoy your "freedom", freetards
http://mail.fsfeurope.org/pipermail/discussion/2016-April/010912.htmlIt has recently come to my attention that many in the free software
movement are unaware of a relatively new development on x86 platforms
that permanently removes the ability to use these platforms without also
continually executing signed, proprietary code at the highest possible
privilege level. All post-2013 (AMD) and virtually all post-2009
(Intel) systems contain this mandatory technology, and therefore, by
design, can never be converted to run using pure FOSS.
These signed, proprietary, binary-only firmware blobs must
execute on the service processor(s) before the main x86 CPU cores are
even released from reset (AMD), or will hard reset the entire system
after around 30 minutes of non-operation (Intel). These blobs continue
to operate on the service processor(s) as long as the system is powered
on, and in the case of the Intel ME they also continue to operate while
the system is powered off but still has access to power (e.g. plugged in
or charged battery attached). These services processors have full
access to system memory and all system peripherals, effectively giving
the binary blobs executing on them a higher privilege level than even
the operating system kernel. Due to the ability to access system
peripherals, these proprietary blobs could easily contain code to
exfiltrate encryption keys, remotely activate microphones and cameras,
plant unwanted data, or simply remotely disable the ability of the
machine to boot FOSS operating systems entirely. Finally, the Intel ME
firmware can be forcibly updated by a remote entity; it is unknown
whether the AMD PSP contains similar functionality at this time.
fuck, now what?
>in the case of the Intel ME they also continue to operate while the system is powered off but still has access to power
B O T N E T
O
T
N
E
T
>>53872387
Amlogic S905 is the future
>>53872387
1. Decompile blobs.
2. Reverse engineer firmware backdoors.
3. Setup FOSS firewall to block malicious packets.
>not just picking up an economical used SPARC workstation or PowerPC Mac for applications where running "pure FOSS" is actually critical
>>53872571
Wait, the PowerPC macs were FOSS hardware?
>>53872595
No hardware truly is, but they do use open firmware unlike x86 systems, and don't have any manufacturer-advertised backdoors like anti-theft or "management engines"
>>53872348
my pentium 4 seems to be working pretty well, op
>>53872387
VIA will rise again!
>not running linux on your FPGA
It's like you guys don't even enjoy freedom.
>>53872348
When was the i5 2500 released?
>>53872432
So Linux 3.11 for life? kek
>>53872348
>and in the case of the Intel ME they also continue to operate while
the system is powered off but still has access to power (e.g. plugged in
or charged battery attached)
that's some big-brother-shit.
>Anon, do your daily exercise now.
>>53874439
nevermind, found it
>>53874439
Intel's had the Management Engine stuff since like 2006. If you want a system without it you're looking at a Northwood P4 at best.
>>53874642
isn't it just in machines with vPro?
>>53872475
You can't flash anything because you don't have keys.
>>53873456
Not all of us practice voodoo magic, anon.
Stallman was always right.
>>53874743
no shit
he's literally like computer jesus
>>53874743
But muh commodity
Muh it jest werks
So does this mean all the freetards will stop using computers, hopefully?
>>53874841
nah they'll just switch to ARM until they realise how much more proprietary shit is embedded into every corner of your typical SoC. Just have a look at the license file for one of NXPs cortex based chips.
>>53874874
I meant stop using ALL computers, computing devices, and the Internet in general.
Damn, thought we had 'em there for a second.
>>53874642
Or, you know, AMD. They introduced their PSP just recently, so there's still bulldozer. I'm just happy, I got that Kabini soc, which is the last piece of the energy efficient lineup without that crap.
>>53874911
AMD has their own equivalent. They call it something different but it's the same thing. They've also had it for many years now, same as Intel.
>http://www.lowrisc.org/
RISC V
I
S
C
V
>>53874704
No, not modify the shit running on the service processor. Analyze it and find all the ways it can be contacted. Then configure the router or firewall you connect through to block all of those. They might control the service processor, but you can know the behavior of the firmware currently on it, and you control all roads in and out from it.
>>53872348
proprietary code isnt the only problem here
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lR0nh-TdpVg
>>53872348
So, does this mean buy AMD FX-8350 and use it for the rest of my life?
this has been a thing since 1993
V I A
I
A
This is supposed to be news? Anyone who finds it important to avoid these things are likely already running old machines with Libreboot by now.
I would also recommend reading the paper that proposes to build a "stateless laptop".
I'm assuming, when it comes to all this CPU-level botnet tech, that to actually be harmed by this you would have to be a specifically targeted by malicious parties? As opposed to Windows 10-style automatic mass data collection? If someone who has that level of authority is specificially targetting you, you're probably fucked even if you don't own a computer.
>>53876380
>fixed since sandybridge
welp nothing to see heree folks
>>53874965
Well shit, I'm excited now
>>53874965
>RISC/ARM
Oh boy I can't wait to have to go back to the command line because they're so slow and underpowered.
>>53873456
>Running anything on soft cores for production
You must like to suffer
>>53872348
Jesus fucking christ, that's disgusting.
>>53872348
This not anti-competitive behaviour how..? In my mind this is like the IE debacle with an added twist of "not allowed to install anyone else's browser lol" thrown in on top. Not allowed to execute anyone's code unless you execute this guys code? Fuck that noise.
Cyrix pls come save us.
>>53877539
Yes.
Also this stuff was all implemented to allow system administrators to deal with large numbers of computers remotely, without having to depend on the OS being functional.
>>53874965
That's incredible. I really hope they pull through.
>>53872348
If I've got a T420 that means it's already too late, right?
wait there are people that don't know this?
>>53874924
That's what I said with PSP, which is their platform secure processor that got introduced with excavator and puma+
>>53872387
If you're only running free software architecture shouldn't matter too much, pick up a non-x86 computer
So, the only way out is to use nontainted hardware,
FSF endorsed GNU+Linux-distro, without systemd. Although the messiah doesn't comdemn systemd either, it's a rotten concept.
>>53874965
I'm somewhat happy that progress in leading CPU design has stagnated, as it makes it more likely for stuff like this to catch up to a point where it can actually be useful.
>>53874743
>Of all the sentences this one hurts the most: "stallman was right again."
>>53872348
Welp. I guess I'll just embrace the botnet.
did anyone actually try to snoop packets from a turned-off computer to see if it in fact sends any traffic?
Is that even legal? Not even microsoft is allowed to disable linux, why the fuck are hardware vendors different? It's the fault of consoles again isn't it? They were probably the first ones to implement something like this.
>>53872348
>>53872387
P O W E R 8
O
W
E
R
8
Guess I'll be rockin' my Phenom II X6 forever now.
Raptor Engineering TALOS Workstation?
>>53879847
>tfw saving up for the Talos motherboard
> muh backdoored Intel chip
Asus C201 4Gb Chromebook
ARMv7 - rk3288 4-core cpu
Libreboot (readonly via hardware screw)
TP-LINK TL-WN722N (ATH9K_HTC)
linux-libre fully deblobbed kernel
debian8 jessie (armhf port) + xfce4
10+ hours shitpost time on battery
1. no intel botnet
2. no firmware binary blobs
3. write-protected bios compiled from source
>>53879930
Are they definitely going into production?
>>53872348
What now? Wait for ARM or RISC to catch up? Zen will have the same shit, so it's not worth it. I'm also running Fiery Bridge, so it's infected.
It just shows how freedom has always been an illusion.
>>53880021
How is the keyboard? I enjoy my X200 but would love something lighter.
>>53879802
Times have changed, buddy.
Just as a parallel, Apple is not allowing any browser other than Safari on iPhones either.
Freetards on suicide watch.
>>53872348
Why should I give a shit? I don't do anything illegal and basically use the internet for YouTube, Facebook, and /gif/
The only reason I don't use windows 10 is because I don't like the way it looks. I don't use Linux/Android because of muh freedums, I use them because I can customize them and still use the internet. That's it. Now tell me /g/... Why should I give a fuck?
>>53880811
>Why should I give a shit? I don't do anything illegal
>>53880854
>he does something illegal on his PC
retard detected
>>53872475
>Reverse engineering and replacing this blob is almost impossible, due to how complex it is. Even for the most skilled developer, it would take years to replace. Intel distributes this blob to firmware developers, without source.
>>53880811
"they" could disable your pc remotely, so that's a point.
And if "they" can do it, anyone can!
>>53872348
>implying x86 CPUs can spy on you
You're retarded if you really think this is possible.
>>53872348
good. hypocritical freetards need to gtfo.
go play on RISC V.
>>53880811
"Arguing that you don't care about the right to privacy because you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don't care about free speech because you have nothing to say. "
>>53880947
privacy has almost nothing to do with free speech.
>>53874743
He was just born too early
>>53880962
Well if you don't see a correlation, in a PC world, rm -rf you.autist
>almost
you are a joke.
>>53881065
and you can't even post anything valuable.
You have no point.
>>53880962
What good is free speech if you don't have a space to safely formulate your own ideas?
You really don't have anything to say if there is no privacy. Freedom of speech is meaningless without freedom to think what you want.
>>53881141
You are admitting that it has at least a thin correlation as your only point, so it is self contradictory.
And for me to elaborate in why privacy should be a respected right to every human being, you should first make a relevant point representing something broader than your individual circumstances, you should first abstract yourself from the "privacy" equation, if you want me to engage in such a deep topic.
And no, "why should I care?" is not a point, it is just revealing the confidence that your ignorance gives you.
>>53881365
free speech is not about having safe space. You take responsibility for everything you say.
>Freedom of speech is meaningless without freedom to think what you want.
Elaborate. As far as I know you can think whatever the fuck you want, including raping underaged loli sluts.
That doesn't mean you can go out and accuse other people of doing things they didn't do.
>>53880021
> c201 keyboard
Pretty good. Only has F1 thru F10 though. No designated delete key. And you need to set the power button to ignore when you get it up and running. Cursor keys are in the right spot.
>>53881444
You can't take responsibility for committing crimes when you're anonymous. That's why privacy should be limited.
What about coreboot?
>>53877742
I'd still like to know how to neuter it on my own hardware.
so x64 pcs are fine?
>>53880934
> muh head in the sand
You're just ignorant. All Intel chips from 2009 have an embedded processor (ARC) that runs its own Operating System. Programs (some written in Java) can be loaded into it. It runs all the time, when there is power to the supply, whether the machine is on or off. It reboots the machine after 30 minutes if it doesn't start up correctly. It also requires write access to the flash chip.
https://libreboot.org/faq/#intelme
>>53881622
So?
Without internet access it's not able to do anything even remotely useful.
Does anyone make processors that isn't AMD or Intel?
>>53881708
It has Internet access
>>53881731
VIA
>>53881773
via ethernet only
>>53881783
> no Internets
It has full DMA access to all your memory. All it needs to do is write into the kernel packet buffers of any outgoing packet. One bit flip at a time will get the data out, for example.
Keylogger is trivial with this setup.
If you understand how bad baseband is for security in the mobile world, this ME subterfuge is the same. You can't have a secure machine with this shit going on in the background.
>>53881783
>via ethernet only
Depends on the processor, some Intel CPUs have a 3G radio.
>>53881783
Via 3G even when the computer is not connected to your network
>>53872348
You freetards need to make your own CPU already so you can finally stop all your bitching
>inb4 I'll make the logo
>>53881731
For desktop and laptop computers, not significantly, no. The market has been dominated by Intel and AMD who jealously guard their chip architectures and production rights.
IBM, through their openPower initiative are pretty much giving away licences for their power architecture to anyone who asks as long as they agree to not break the standard. It's mainly targeted for large server stuff using nix based free software and there is no version of windows that will run on the chips. A small company in Rockford are gauging consumer interest in an ATX mainboard for power8, and actually posted a thread on g recently asking for input, here is their site:
https://raptorengineeringinc.com/TALOS/prerelease.php
Snother company(tyan) experimented with an ATX board for power8 although I don't think it's been marketed yet.
Basically this might break the stranglehold Intel and AMD have on the consumer chip market and we might get some say into what's written on the silicone we put in our machines.
>>53881588
Here's a reply for your underappreciated post.
>>53881904
>some Intel CPUs have a 3G radio.
>>53882106
Are you implying this isn't true?
>>53882150
it's not true you fucking retard.
>>53882167
Except it is you fucking imbecile.
>>53882198
You have no proof to stand any of this fucking bullshit up. You don't even understand how iAMT and AT works.
GTFO back to >>>/v/
>>53882036
Would there even be a market for open hardware CPUs?
I would buy one ofcourse, but are there enough privacy concerned freetards to make it economically viable?
>>53882167
>Doesn't know about vPro
>>53882233
>Intel shill in denial
>>53882246
I'd think China alone would make it viable, since Intel mainly uses this Big Brother stuff to prevent knockoffs, even though it could easily and instantly be used to do big brother stuff with a week's notice.
>>53882278
>>53882259
>buuhuuuu you don't know shit, here's my nonexistant proof loool
I bet you believe a small nigger sits in your CPU and rewrites your shitposts for the future use
>>53882299
>presented existent proof
>lol that doesn't count
Fuck off, mongoloid.
>>53882299
There's not enough room for anyone to sit in there, you're weird anon.
>>53880811
Why don't you give other people your bank credentials?
Why don't you give other people your door lock blueprints?
Are you really this retarded?
So using an fx8350 in fine? No blob backdoor?
>>53881549
coreboot have blob.
libreboot is coreboot downstream that remove the blob.
>freetards literally think their NEET life is of any interest to anyone
no one is spying on you, you autistic fat fucks
>>53882485
That's what they want you to think
>>53881518
I'm well versed in the ways of remapping keymaps, so stuff like that doesn't concern me much. I'm more interested in how it feels to type on.
>>53882348
>>53882339
You didn't provide any proof on your retarded theory.
You don't even know the difference between computrace (which uses WWAN module if desired) and iAMT. Just get the fuck out already.
>>53882496
>implying i'm not they
>>53882233
You're fucking retarded. Git good or kys
>>53882498
No issues with typing on it. It is nice and light, can easily hold it with one hand. No heat generated, screen uses a large hinge and can tilt to any needed angle. Has two USB ports on right-side. I allocate one port to the open-firmware TL-WN722N (which is attached to the back of the screen, out of the way). You can use the onboard wifi, if you want, but the driver is non-free and requires a blob, which would defeat the whole purpose of using the machine.
I'm considering picking up a second unit, since they are so cheap and I am really enjoying this one. Though the libreboot guys are looking at freeing some other ARM chromebooks too.
>>53882567
ok kid
>>53872387
AMD will save us all
i thought amd was the good guys, guess i was wrong
why is this happening?
I use MIPS. Overgrew the x86 meme a long time ago.
>>53882695
>why
secret courts and NOBUS.
Stay noided you autistic shitheads.
>not using low cost ARM boards with integrated SFP+ for your servers
Are you even trying?
>>53880811
>Why should I give a shit? I don't do anything illegal
nothing to hide, nothing to fear
good goyim
>>53880811
Because identity theft is a real thing, you mouthbreathing cocksucker!
>>53882784
You're retarded.
If you want to do illegal shit you just use a dedicated x200 with libreboot. Your everyday gaymur machine can be infested with fuckload of NSA/Windows keyloggers and backdoors. You don't have to care about that.
forgive my ignorance
When running linux on an arm machine im limited to software written for arm right?
>>53882695
>why
"Home Field Advantage"
>>53882880
>compiled for*
>>53880934
They can.
Dont know if anyone is the government is smart enough but grabbing encryption keys so they decrypt everything going across the wire is definitely possible.
And I wouldnt trust any corporation to protect the consumer at this time.
>>53882880
>>53882908
Yes, limited to binary compiled for ARM.
But, desu the only things that won't run on ARM is probably x86 specific like Wine x86 version..
>>53882908
thanks i understand now
According to google i could compile tons of stuff for arm, since source exist for most stuff i want. Im just playing with the idea of building an armputer
>>53882299
Top kek
You are still a retard, bud god that made me laugh
>>53872348
>All post-2013 (AMD)
>tfw Phenom II X6 1090T
>tfw master race
>>53872348
So that means AMD Zen is cucked? Only choice right now would be amd fx?
>>53883157
yes the x86 platform is tainted, please read the full email op just posted a small section
>>53872348
LISTEN TO ME PEOPLE , THIS IS IMPORTANT
It will be good if we can work together and make a list of all the remote access tracking shit embebed in every /g/ aproved laptop , and also make a list of in what laptops you can completly remove this shit and guides about how to do it.
per exemple:-Model:
Lemote/Obscure chink laptop
-Botnet shit it includes:
NONE
(....)
-Model:
ThinkpadXXX/PavilionXXX
-botnet shit it includes:
Intel ME 0.x
-Can be disabled:
YES/NO
-Guides for this model:
(...)
We can also make a list with all CPUs that respect your freedom.
Sorry about my broken english , I hope that at least you get the idea.
Lets do something productive for once /g/
>>53883033
it's not that simple you stupid retard.
I can only understand your arrogance because every single 16 year old on /g/ thinks he's a security expert. You kids lack even basic technological knowledge about intel embedded solutions, yet you talk so much about it and spread FUD.
Just please for the love of god shut your fucking trap and get back to books.
Even if this RISC V CPU is out, we still don't have blob free GPU.
Also, RISC V are not ARM, so no benchmarks or expected performance are available.
>>53883236
>virtually all post-2009
(Intel) systems contain this mandatory technology, and therefore, by
design, can never be converted to run using pure FOSS
Does this mean my precious 8320 is safe
>>53883100
going to need some sauce on that anon
>>53882680
I don't think you read OP
>>53883246
Not that anon you're replying but proof of concept already out there.
It's called LightEater.
It scanned for memory looking for PGP keys and works even the running OS is secure. (run Tail OS, specialized security oriented Linux)
>>53883291
>8320
should be since it was released 2012
>>53872348
just disable ME, AMT, AT and computrace you retarded negroids. If you own a decent PC your BIOS should allow that.
All ThinkPads can disable those
>features
>we shouldn't use x86, it's not secure
>recommends an architecture that is currently being maintained by the chinese
wat
>>53883333
>proof of concept
you do realize you can disable these shitty features, right?
Sorry desu familia but it's like having an insecured iLO interface enabled in your critical system and crying about how hackers can exploit your machine. Just disable the fucking thing.
Intel's embedded coprocessor is used to protect their technology, not to spy on you. Analysing the protected, hashed content of RAM by the CPU is something so fucking unreal that you should be ashamed of yourself.
>>53883269
Im still reading it but if I got it right:
-Every server and laptop post 2006 is bundled with intel ME
-The are hardware pre-2009 in which you can disable intel ME
-We can make a list of all the laptops free of any of this shit ( pre 2006 laptops , AMD , lemote , etc..)
-We can make a list of all the shit that comes bundled with newer laptops
-We can make a list of all the laptops with versions of Intel ME that can be disabled
-We can make a list of all the tutorials ( or even write our own) that explain how to get rid of this shit
-We can make a list of CPU that respect our freedom
-We can insiste and warn others actively about this in this board
If we can be autistic about GANOO+LOONIX and muh software freedoms we can also be more sensible about this
>>53882735
Where do I get one? I've been looking for quite a while
>>53883351
fucking retard you cant disable this, if the cpu doesnt get the blob it shuts off in 30min intervalls
fucking read the op before posting
>>53883360
>don't trust Intel. Trust us, the communists, fellow citizen!
>>53883429
So? It still needs to communicate with the OS or UEFI to do anything harmful.
>>53883360
What arch?
>>53883351
"Disabling" ME does not prevent it from functioning, it just disables your ability to access its user-oriented features. It's about as secure as politely asking a serial rapist murderer brony to stop browsing e621.
>>53883344
Cool
>>53883464
once agai you didnt read the op
These services processors have full
access to system memory and all system peripherals, effectively giving
the binary blobs executing on them a higher privilege level than even
the operating system kernel. Due to the ability to access system
peripherals, these proprietary blobs could easily contain code to
exfiltrate encryption keys, remotely activate microphones and cameras,
plant unwanted data, or simply remotely disable the ability of the
machine to boot FOSS operating systems entirely.
>>53883416
Yes, you can disable SMM but you can't totally disable IME as lot's of CPU supervisory function required it.
>>53883489
ME can't do anything harmful on it's own, unless supplied with harmful piece of code through the fucking interface you're supposed to disable.
And it's still too complicated to hijack cryptographic keys that way. You need much more computing power to analyze RAM content.
How is this news?
Shit, there was even a talk about failing to bypass it at 32C3.
>>53883464
It can rape your memory and talk directly to any hardware on the pci bus, including infected SATA drives running modified firmware (look up nls_933w.dll) and providing ample, protected storage, in addition to the space dedicated to it on the i2c flash.
>>53883236
>>53883417
>>53872348Before version 6.0 (that is, on systems from 2008/2009 and earlier), the ME can be disabled by setting a couple of values in the SPI flash memory. The ME firmware can then be removed entirely from the flash memory space.
There is still hope for dualCore laptops anons!
Lest get rid of this distopian shit from our beloved laptops.
>>53883534
> Intel shill from the minitrue dept.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ministry_of_Truth
>>53883549
>nls_933w.dll
oh no, haxxors can infect my computer and steal my data!
let's use less secure "free" systems more capable of infection with no protection of any kind. Fuck those read only proprietary embedded chips that are supposed to help us. Richard Stallman to the rescue!
>>53883606
So, you're telling me you purged SELinux from your GNU/Linoox already?
How nice! Enjoy your lack of capabilities.
>>53883583
Link:
https://leaksource.wordpress.com/2013/12/30/nsas-ant-division-catalog-of-exploits-for-nearly-every-major-software-hardware-firmware/
>>53883606
I always thiught the minitrue was terrible in the book. Like seriously the book goes way over the top with everything and the end sucked so bad...
>>53880811
>I don't do anything illegal
> and basically use the internet for YouTube, and /gif/
That's already two illegal things there chap. Piracy.
>>53883625
faggot, if you read about it, you would see it has code to infect *12* different hard drive vendors. everyone except Intel, funnily enough.
there was a story just a few weeks ago (apple/fbi fight timeframe) about how it is believed a secret court ordered the hard drive manufacturers to *hand over* source code for the drives, thereby making nls_933w.dll possible.
>>53882735
>thinking china doesn't spy on you
>>53872348
Who the fuck cares, bro? It's free like in free beer. I don't want to pay. That's all. Enjoy your money sucking OS, BIATCH!
>>53883437
Did you just try to insult communism?
>>53883738
Reading isn't your strong suit, is it?
>>53883699
>oh no, let's boycott intel for creating safe drives!
>>53883765
intel is the culprit behind the x86 taint you massive retard
>caring about privacy
>on your every day machines
>2016
>not having your very own isolated systems for secure purposes
Step up negroids. Just disconnect from the internet and enjoy your privacy and security.
so is x64 alright?
>>53883759
Sorry!
>>53883779
>being this aggressive
>being this buttblasted
contain yourself, nigger. This is /g/, not your designated negroidal street.
If you don't do anything illegal you have nothing to worry about.
>>53872348
>All post-2013 (AMD) and virtually all post-2009(Intel) systems contain this mandatory technology
So does the Motorola 68000 from 1979, there they call it "microcode".
This thread is FUD.
>>53883801
>so is x64 alright?
No.
Also, you might want to read up on what "x64" actually is.
>>53883811
>If you don't do anything illegal you have nothing to worry about.
This is retarded and you should feel bad for even writing it.
>>53872348
Pentium D master race over here mother bitches!
guess I'm not upgrading much farther than this.
>>53882233
http://libreboot.org/faq/#intelme
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xq-mHC9JYwY
https://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2008/10/designing_a_mal.html
>>53883811
You obviously havent read what this is about or have any interest in doing so.
Dont even reply.
>>53883820
> implying non-modifiable microcode is dangerous
did you get a degree in retardation or was it a natural skill?
>>53883871
If it has a non-modifiable backdoor on it, then yes, it is dangerous.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6bJ5b8Dgoc
Pretty good talk about how things like ME work and what could be done to get around it.
>>53872348
>the man with the 2010 era 1100T wins again
>>53882167
How the fuck do you think their anti-theft system that remotely disables the stolen computer's processor works retard?
>>53879847
When is it coming out? And where can I buy it?
>>53883865
I used to work there, you wouldn't believe the sleazy shit they sell and who their clients are.
>>53883865
>oh no! a feature that can be permanently disabled allows you to connect through remote desktop to my computer! shame on you intel, allah akbar! hail stalin!
seriously just gtfo already
>>53884022
it uses WWAN module that needs to be installed in the mPCIe slot, just like the SIM card, retard.
It's not even fucking close to having a 3g module inside the CPU, dumbass
>>53884157
> remote desktop
You are confusing AMT with ME. ME is on-die in all post 2009 chips. AMT is a software application that runs on top of the ME base, and is optional.
>>53884257
person I'm replying to just posted a video showing RDP function of the iAMT. It's obviously disabled by default and it can be disabled permanently.
>>53884306
> disable AMT
Which has no effect on the ME base, the ARC processor or the operating system that continues to run whether the machine is on or off.
>>53872348
What if I'm running Gentoo Linux with custom kernel and my Internet doesn't even go close to the Ethernet card (meaning shitty 4G modem plugged into USB, which might admittedly be more of an issue than Intel).
And the computer is laptop with Windows 8 preinstalled.
Does ME have any way to communicate with base like that? The 4G modem acts like an Ethernet card in itself, and I really doubt ME really has space to include any driver the user possibly could have installed, now or two years later.
>>53884370
Oh, and obviously there is no Internet connection for the laptop except for that 4G modem.
>>53884350
I'm not talking about ME. I'm talking about the scare of using RDP via iAMT. Learn to read, nigger.
>>53884395
wat? The OP post is about ME. AMT is just a demonstration of what can be done with it. Disabling AMT in the bios gets you nothing, and to suggest it does is spreading Intel protectionist FUD.
>>53877712
When the whole industry is doing it, it isn't anti-competitive.
>>53878786
Stallman also barely uses anything other than Emacs and even then only really uses his computer to store speech notes and check his email.
>>53884370
Its not very far fetched to have gigabytes of data somewhere on the motherboard. Still unlikely that you're at risk but hypothetically you are.
>>53884075
>When is it coming out?
The specs were released years ago. POWER8 hardware started shipping in 2014. There's even some openPOWER machines already on the market.
>>53884475
Yes, and these are stored in the invisible cloud.
If you really think you can't open up the chipset or CPU to see what's inside you're simply incompetent. Yes, it's very far from understanding and attempting to copy the CPU structure but it's enough to know what's inside.
So will anything actually come of this?
We're talking about millions and millions of devices right? Like the majority of systems?
>>53884475
Well, I was more asking, if you have a kernel it doesn't expect and an external Ethernet card, are you basically in the clear? Or is there more to it?
Say, you specifically buy an external modem whose driver in the Linux kernel didn't exist at the moment your processor was produced, to counteract the "gigabytes of drivers" thing.
>>53884523
yes, millions and millions on devices are hijacking cryptographic keys and sending them straight to the NSA just because this fat old cuckold richard understall said so.
>>53884549
Your CPU has at least 100GBs of local storage space for the purpose of keeping drivers. It's true because FSF site says so.
>>53884567
> shilling for a 151 billion dollar company
Why don't you just post your Intel ID badge and get it over with?
>>53880021
Accelerated 3d? Video decoding? Vsync?
>>53884608
My ID number is 148813372137.
I just got 4000 of Bingcoins transfered to my microsoft account.
Thanks, cucks.
>>53880021
>Asus C201
ok debian says no video decoding, no open GLES
https://wiki.debian.org/InstallingDebianOn/Asus/C201#Overall_Status
>>53884591
Yeah, it doesn't have that, obviously. But what about the kernel.
The most used families (of desktop) are Linux, Windows NT, whatever the hell Mac OS uses (but it's only recently that Hackintosh became official) and FreeBSD.
How much does it need to know about the kernel to directly inject the package it needs where it needs it? Does it need to only know the general structure, does it need to know the ABI or does it need a detailed description of kernel? This both affects how much information about the kernel they need to keep on the chip, how many kernels can they support and whether something like compiling custom kernel will hinder them or if not.
Hell, for that matter, can it inject its data into packets? I've only heard of the idea here. I'm not sure on the technical details. Kernel doesn't check for that at all, right?
>>53884643
XFCE4. mplayer plays everything I've thrown at it full screen just fine. vlc, not so much.
Is there anywhere I can pick up a Lemote mATX motherboard?
>>53883072
Virtually no proprietary software, outside mainframe software, even runs on anything but x86.
>>53883262
Nvidia can run blob-free, AMD can't. Paradoxically, AMD has 1st-party opensource support and only recently has nvidia stopped doing its best to fuck nouveau devs in the ass.
>>53872671
Kek, im on p4 right now.
>>53883072
>>53884801
Doesn't Wine work on ARM. There's a Wine for Android, I think.
>>53883489
I'm scared to look up e621... what will I see if I do?
>>53884856
Oh, wait, apparently it's for winelib-apps, not for anything actually programmed for Windows. My mistake.
>>53884856
QEMU runs fine on ARM.
>>53884875
It's an imageboard kinda like 4chan but that caters to more extreme fetishes.
>>53884901
Assuming there's a GPU passthrough going on, is there any chance to get reliable experience in there? I'm not sure if there is any slowdown when the target architecture is not the host architecture, or if it works the same either way.
>>53884946
> GPU passthru
I'm not up on that level of QEMU waifu. On the base system you can always use the Google provided GPU driver until Mali is done. I don't miss it myself and it is not required for a fully working desktop.
>>53872348
Is the ARM architecture affected by anything like this? I remember hearing an anon talk about the ARM TrustZone a while back that the entire Cortex A series and some ARM11 processors have saying it was similar.
>>53885045
check the link of the OP
Just imagine all the neckbeards who have been suffering using linux for years, telling themselves it was for security and privacy reasons
Freetards BTFO
>>53872348
does the FX-8350 have AMD PSP?
Imagine if it was a chip in your car.
Or an implant.
y/n?
>>53885190
It shows your CPU model number right there you fucking mong, look it up yourself. Intel lists information about the features of all of their processors online.
>>53885218
>Intel lists information about the features of all of their processors online.
I don't see a "built in spying features" in the table on the spec page
>>53881622
>ARC
For real? The same guys that made the Revelation virus??
>>53885230
ls -ld /dev/mei
Thanks, Linus!
>>53885230
Come on anon-kun, it tells you the year it was released at the top of the page too. If it's pre-2009 you're good.
>>53885316
Pre-2006, actually.
So if you're running a Thinkpad X60 you're golden. Anything newer? You're screwed.
>>53879847
You know, it would be kinda funny, if, as Mac finally gave up on PowerPC and migrated to x86, in the following years, LInux users will massively run away from x86 to POWER8.
It almost seems poetic, honestly.
>>53885343
linux users are proto hipsters
>>53885329
The 2006-2009 timeframe is when ME was implemented in the Northbridge chipset. Around 2009 Intel moved the infected Northbridge onto the CPU die and cucked everyone.
>>53885329
Pre-2006 you're good, 2006-2009 depends on the motherboard, post-2009 you had better keep some good lube and a condom handy.
>>53885428
> Northbridge
Or was it Southbridge. Can't recall really, but you get the idea. Someone can look it up and verify which bridge.
>>53879930
>Talos
>3700 USD
You know, it may be because I live in a third-world shithole, but that's just a little bit beyond my budget.
I guess it's expected that the first batch will be overpriced, but unless they really bring the cost down in the following years, I can't see them actually being viable, except for really high-level workstation. Well, I guess there probably are people in the world who actually need that much security, as in, right now.
>>53883236
I'll get to work on the logo.
>>53885756
POWER in general is really expensive, mainly because IBM's target market is gigantic corporations that will become repeat customers and not end users.
>>53880407
Nope, but it's not like I won't be able to repurpose a few grand if they confirm they're not going to make it
>>53872671
>pentium 4
>>53874965
>Google Code Projects
>port Doom on small one-core SOC we've only just developed
Someone has got his priorities straight.
Then again, it would be a really good test for the SOC.
>>53885959
>>port Doom on small one-core SOC we've only just developed
Nice catch
I guess I'm switching back to Windows.
>>53874965
How about a viable alternative for desktops that require moderate to high performance?
>>53886122
A cluster, perhaps?
>>53881622
>Intel ME
>Botnet
Well, now its obvious the only people stressing about it have never had a job.
Not only is this the only case where this technology is useful, but it is so fucking shit and gimmicky that there is no way the botnet could account for the infinite possibilities of configurations of the actual world.
>>53882735
In what world is x86 a meme?
>>53886215
if not the obvious money constriction this idea sounds extremely tempting
>>53886216
It's still irksome that it's even possible, and can't be turned off or pried off the chips and still function. Like being addicted to crack.
>still believing in FOSS bullshit
its almost like a terrorist organisation, theyre so scared of getting caught with some sort of data?
>>53886238
How cheap do these not Inel/AMD boards get anyway? Surely there's a way to repurpose oldish server boards that use them, right?
>>53886215
>a system that only works for very few, specific workloads, requires ridiculous amounts of energy to drive, and insane maintenance costs, perhaps?
>>53886268
I thought you could build them with old junker boxes and enterprise NICs these days.
>>53886240
>It's still irksome that it's even possible
It's irksome that my OS is susceptible to stuxnet.
Actually, that's a bad comparison. Stuxnet is actually a thing, while vPro is not designed to work on consumer devices, and ME is a heap of flaming shit.
>>53886297
Yes, that is also irksome. Both things are irksome.
>>53885232
Trust is a weakness.
>>53886328
Correct. I was pointing out that there are an infinite amount of hypotheticals which are irksome. Just because it is an irksome thought does not make it true.
>>53886353
You lost me.
>>53886259
Sure. Power bill would kill you though. Better off getting a load of raspberry pis.
>>53886388
You thinking it's possible does not make it so.
Do we understand now, or shall I draw with crayons?
>>53886294
There's a significant overhead for data transfer, result synchronization, communication, etc. which makes clusters useless for anything but repeating a very similar process across many instances with only slight modifications and collecting the results in some wa (more generally, any task where the collection and synchronization is trivial works great on clusters). General high-performance computation on GPUs is a more promising idea than trying to use clusters for general computing at high performance. I think there is even research into that going on, there should be a gpu OS somewhere around.
Additionally, the older the CPU, the more powerdraw it has, despite the decreased performance. You can build large beowulf clusters from scraps, that won't give you anything useful outside the setting outlined above.
Yep. Got 32 cores on my Libreboot machine (KGPE-D16, 2x AMD Opteron 6276). Can recommend.
>>53886419
Is $10 per node per year really worse than one machine at $700 per year, if you have the physical space? How many small-ball machines does it take to simulate an epic gayman machine? All it would have to do is run a virtual machine for a generic home windows install of some kind, at the very least. Are there mobos that use these nominally uncompromised CPUs, but can also interface with a pair of GTX 980Ti? Can this machine be built for less than $3,000 USD without any soldering?
>>53880811
how do you think shit gets on youtube and /gif/? somewhere someone is ripping or breaking handcuffs. just give it 10 or 20 years at this pace and these things will be gone. forever.
>FOSS
>>53888063
https://gnu.org/philosophy/malware-microsoft.html
>>53872387
Run XP, like I do, on elderly hardware
Can someone explain to a pleb what all this means?
I get the BOTNET stuff but the rest is over my head
>>53888797
It means Bill Gates is watching you masturbate.
>>53888797
-There is a part of modern CPUs that run autonomously, almost as if somebody had installed a seccond OS at the hardware level the code for which only the manufacturers can and has ever seen.
-If that part of your chip is disabled the computer stops working.
-This second "OS" has complete unprotected access to a bunch of peripherals including memory.
-This is supposedly to protect the chips from being copied illegally.
-This is a massive security risk because not only do we have to completely trust the manufacturers to not have latent malicious motives but also to write perfect, secure code without it having been audited.
-Joanna Rutkowska pointed out this was the perfect vector for rootkits and demonstrated this on a previous generation of the technology.
-A dangerous precedent has been set, and basically the security of any system running on these chips is assumed under the trust of the manufacturer.
-Single point of failure/concentrated trust yadayadayada always goes wrong. Basically this is unnecessary and could go horrifically wrong.
>>53889173
It should go horrifically wrong in the most spectacular way possible so that they backtrack
>>53889299
It wouldn't matter. People just shrug and shake their head when informed that the NSA is monitoring every single action they take on their computers, phones, tablets and whatever else they use. They don't care because it's far too difficult to care.
I mean really, what would you expect people to do in the event of some sort of impossible "attack" using Intel ME as a vector that actually gets people to care for a minute? Do you really expect everyone on the planet to throw out their computers and go buy used P4 boxes? Or do you really think Intel is going to recall every single one of the billions and billions of chips sold over the last decade?
>>53889299
I can't imagine a likely scenario that would end in appropriate public backlash against these 2 companies, much less popular demand for free firmware.
>>53889405
The arrest of several CEOs and government a subsidized swap program for affected hardware would go a long way towards solidifying public trust in whatever administration was in power, even among people who don't into computer.
>>53889460
>a "government subsidized" swap program for affected hardware
You're fucking hilarious, you know that? Come back when you're over the age of 18.
>>53889173
what is the alleged point/benefit of designing CPUs this way? why would the consumer want this?
>>53889649
>what is the alleged point/benefit of designing CPUs this way?
As stated earlier in the thread it's very useful for corporate environments. IT can reimage and restart a hundred desktops at the same time without having to get up out of their seat.
>why would the consumer want this?
It doesn't matter to the average consumer, which is why Intel doesn't bother to build entirely different chips with the features removed.
>>53889717
>IT can reimage and restart a hundred desktops at the same time without having to get up out of their seat.
They don't need hardware support for that. Windows provides that functionality.
>>53889717
>It doesn't matter to the average consumer,
They don't understand it, so they don't care about it, but it does matter to them.
POWER8/TALOS will be the future! ...so long as I can find $3k to fork over
>>53889745
>Windows allows you to boot to a network mounted ISO image regardless of the state of the installed OS
uh
>it does matter to them
It does not matter to them. John down the street does not have any secret data stored on his system that would ruin a multi-million dollar company and throw a large portion of its executives into jail if it gets exposed. The worst thing that John down the street has on his system is a bunch of lesbian ass licking porn downloaded from a shady site.
>>53872475
I can make meme lists too
>>53872348
Whelp, I have a Phenom II 965 lying around on a shitty 760GM motherboard that I haven't sold off. It's pretty crap but I guess if NSA doomsday comes and they decide to disable everyones computers worldwide I could still piddle along on it, Also have a truly dinosauric Apple II GS sitting in my den because I find it pretty to look at. Maybe some day it'll be worthwhile for computing again...
>>53885088
I hope you die irl.
>>53889805
Someone writes a worm that makes their property commit crimes using services paid for in their name, suddenly it matters to them.
>>53877437
Sounds like, keep an AMD chip, Ram, and a solid mobo in a closet somewhere in case the Dystopic future finally kicks in 100% and not just 20-30% as it is now.
>>53872387
Based SH4 is coming out of patent protection.
>>53872595
>>53872653
I have a dual CPU powermac g5 but the gpu drivers don't work and I cant use hardware acceleration.
I'm also afraid the shitty Delphi watercooling loop is going to burst
>>53890451
>dp PowerMac G5
Mah nigga, I'm using one as a server right now
>>53890523
What GPU does yours have? do you have hardware acceleration?
>>53885343
I think that would be pretty funny, actually.
Steam ported to POWER8 when?
>>53889405
More horrifically wrong than catching the NSA with their pants down or other political bulshit, which would be covered up and spun out anyway, would be some dipshit hacker releasing an exploit, computer security would evaporate overnight, the ensuing chaos would be pretty funny to watch if it weren't so serious desu sempai.
>>53889649
For the end consumer, nothing. But we have no say in the matter because there are only two big chip manufacturers who count at the moment and both can do what they want as long as neither significantly outperforms the other.
>>53889717
If the code running could be audited by third parties this might make sense. It can't. This is supposedly to prevent chip fraud, the whole thing is a mess and nobody cares because nothing has gone wrong yet.
>>53890615
>GPU
ATi Radeon 9600 Pro
>hardware acceleration
Well I'm running OS X at the moment, so yes
>>53882808
Calm down Pajit
Dodged a bullet there. Wew
>>53889460
>government lies about everything, coverups everywhere, wikileaks, panama papers, etc etc etc ad infinitum. literally 1984 tier rabbit hole but the twist is it's secret and no one person really knows how deep it goes
>not realizing humans in 2016 effectively live in The Matrix and people experience a vast web of lies based on controlled information, propaganda, mass data analysis giving the strong an edge over everyone, and so on forever
>"le government arrested somebody, I guess things are a-changing now!"
>meanwhile mr. goldstein rubs his hands since the commoners appeared to like his publicized arrest, so they should be sated until the next rabble-rousing
oh you precious little goyim. this is why people are so easy to control, they're retards who literally base their entire worldview on bullshit fed to them via twitter, TV, or whatever your poison of choice, fed to them by people with a vested interest in being deceitful. I guess some people just can't admit that it's literally impossible for a pleb to ever find out truth because it is not accessible to plebs, and that nothing you ever do really matters
>>53882064
Not >>53881731, but thanks for sharing this! This is more interesting than I thought.
>>53872348
whew, I'm ok
The Amish were right.
>>53883360
i trust china more than the united states
>>53891126
Well, they were never wrong about everything. People should think hard as a community how new technology will effect their lives, and adopt it in ways consistent with their values, in measured degrees that can be repealed if problems develop. People should distrust large secular organizations. All the god and itchy clothes stuff is silly, though.
>>53891187
Says the anonymous who has never lived in China outside of Hong Kong as a native Chinese person.
>>53891722
I believe in their commitment to hampering the evils of capitalism any time they can manage it would harming themselves. And my old roommate is marrying one and moving there, so fuck your butt, sirrah.
>>53891834
You know they censor internet traffic in china? I really don't think you want to live in china.
This is not capitalism, the problem here is the impairment of capitalism which works great when market demands are not artificially controlled. If there were more manufacturers, we as consumers would be able to choose those that best represented out interests and so manufacturers would be forced to at least attempt to pretend to represent them.
You using as an example something which isn't an example of the thing you are arguing against.
>>53891722
Not him, but it'd be different if I lived there. I trust China more because I'm not there. If I was, I'd trust the US more.
>>53892527
>when market demands are not artificially controlled.
It is an enormous competitive advantage to control them. They always will be if they can be.
>>53892578
I assure you the grass is dead everywhere.
>>53892614
which is why it is important to prevent bullshit legislation that gives power to larger corporations. The idea is to decentralise things as much as possible to avoid single points of failure because people will always be dicks and things that can go wrong will go wrong which is why communism is a terrible idea.
Anyway, threads reached bump cap and on page 9, cheers anons.
>>53892722
>I assure you the grass is dead everywhere.
Oh I'm well aware
and everyone made fun of me for going AMD
