How's Lemire's Hawkguy?
Also, why is Kate so perfect?
Tfw when no rich sassmaster gf
The new series is not off to a good start
>>78102091
>How's Lemire's Hawkguy?
No one's ever discussing it here, I keep forgetting it exists.
>>78102091
>How's Lemire's Hawkguy?
>>78102992
She's not rich anymore.
>>78102091
>Kate
>not a complete cunt
DUDE MEN ARE SO STUPID LMAO
>>78103285
Somebody's insecure.
She's just a drawing, bro. She can't hurt you.
>>78102091
It's shit
Who should play her in the MCU?
>>78102091
If you mean she's the perfect cunt then yes.
>>78103285
are you a woman?
I never thought I would find a woman in 4chan, much less at /co/
>>78103392
A black female
Oh hey. It's another female character riding on the coat-tails of the original male character.
The new Hawkeye comic has been pretty boring so far. They spend every issue arguing about some science experiment children and the flash backs aren't good either
Is Kate gay yet?
>>78106602
I thought she was for America
>>78106629
Who isn't gay for America tho?
>>78106541
Agreed
>>78106423
>Oh hey. It's another female character riding on the coat-tails of the original male character.
Yep. The "Strength is Relative test" no doubt.
Then again, what are the chances Marvel ever publishes an original Bishop story that can stand on its own?
>>78106602
>>78106629
>they're actually going to follow through and make her a dyke based on one super aggro throwaway line
>>78106602
No and she won't be.
>>78103017
To be honest, there seems to be a general lack of actual comics discussion on /co/ this christmas season compared to last.
Not good. Clint is even more of a worthless loser idiot and Kate is even more of an "empowered stronk wymmyns" cuntbag.
>>78107709
>throwaway line
It's Gillen, there was nothing throwaway about it. I'm certain when he was given that book he went
>I'm gonna turn everyone gay
And editorial just OKed it
>>78109829
This. It's like Lemire skimmed through Fraction's Hawkeye and thought Clint was an actual emotionally stunted shithead rather than being an alright guy with some baggage and depression. And then he decided Kate should just shit on clint in both present times and in the 30-year flash-forward.
>>78102091
>>78103017
>>78103124
how about we read it!
>>78110080
>>78110080
All-New Hawkeye Storytime
There is a rec list for this character?
>>78110156
Thank you
>>78102091
I think it's better than Aja's hawkguy. The Kate wank can be kinda excessive but at least Clint is doing more than just being a depressed loser.
Also the story seems to be actually going somewhere.
>>78111115
Why would you want one.
Lemire got exposed hard, shame too, his GA and Animal Man were great.
>>78113088
I never read his Animal Man but his Green Arrow is really nothing special. Sorrentino carried that run.
>>78112786
Perfect
>>78113117
His Animal Man had a really mystic world building approach to The Red, lots of weird gore and a cute little anchor with the Baker family, a lot of it was structured like an horror road trip movie, which I found pretty fresh. Honestly I liked it even more than Sweet Tooth, and it's my favorite run since Grant.
I agree with you on Sorrentino carrying the run, though I still think it's one of the top runs and worthy of a mention on a superhero with a pretty good track record already, it solidified and offered fresh new characterizations to his rogue list, and while I'm not mad in love with the Arrow inspired hooded vigilante characterization, it's way better than the lame Hawkeye we were getting in New52.
Reading it issue by issue and comparing it to finished past runs, the current zeitgeist and the online discussion and reading it as a finished work is a completely different experience, and right now I have it side by side with Grell and the other top runs.
>>78113330
This
>>78113007
why not?
>>78102091
Because she's Kate. How else would she be?
>>78115457
Yup
>>78109829
It's honestly kind of uncomfortable.
Does anyone have that page of where she is craving pizza and is telling Ms America. It was in a recent issue of something.
>>78102091
In Issue 5, Hawkeye gives up innocent kids to Hydra instead of, say, SHIELD or anyone not nazis.
>>78116249
too skinny
why is she so perfect
>>78102091
If it hadn't been for Whor, she could have been a contenter for the Worst Marvel Character Award.
But she'd lose in the end to Laura Kinney. Finish second or third probably also beaten by Carol Danvers and/or Kamala Khan.
>>78119726
No idea
>>78119774
>doesn't mention SpiderGwen
YOU HAD ONE FUCKING JOB
>>78119950
Some things are so sick and vile that just should not be mentioned.
>>78102091
Read first four issues. I twas boring
Tried to continue the art from Fraction's run poorly and has annoying flashbacks with shit art for no reason.
>>78103010
>The new series is not off to a good start
It's off to a great one!
They're not quite doing the Dark Hawkguy Returns, but there's shades of it.
Lemire's Hawkeye reads like someone skimmed the first couple of paragraphs of Clint's Wikipedia page and Fraction's run. The Hawkeyes are practically caricatures of their Fraction characterizations.
Clint is supposed to be hotheaded, covering depression, not stupid and pathetic. Kate is supposed to be outwardly overconfident, covering insecurity, not arrogant and confrontational.
>>78121322
Pretty much
[spoilers]well shit[/spoilers]
>>78121322
>supposed to be
where are you getting this from? Lemire is simply presenting his own take on the characters. You were right if he was intentionally trying to mimic Fraction.
>>78121322
Funny thing is you could say the same thing about Fraction's run. He portrayed Clint as a insecure, idiot instead of the brash, hothead. Fraction did not do Clint Barton justice. Instead he made a bumbling loser that happens to have the Hawkeye name.
>>78123678
It seems to be the only way he can write. Danny and Clint are indistinguishable when Fraction writes them
>>78123786
Manchildren with no real depth and no regard for the past. I came to the realization a couple of months ago that Fraction's run on Hawkeye was garbage and flavor of the month for casuals.
>>78123678
I disagree. Don't get why anyone would think him an idiot or a loser. He's just a mess, but still puts up a good fight where it counts.
If writing an amazing, fan-favourite and acclaimed comic is not "doing justice" to a character, it makes me thing you see Clint as a real person that was treated badly by the writer and damn the fact he is a fictional character in a particular narrative. Which is actually the common sentiment on this board.
>>78102091
It's all about how Kate is perfect and amazing and the greatest character ever, and how Clint is a perennial fuckup.
I don't like the constant shitting on Clint. He's constantly the butt of every joke, and Kate poops dasies. Fraction's run was better.
>>78123786
>Danny and Clint are indistinguishable when Fraction writes them
I noticed this as well. Made Iron Fist hard to enjoy.
>>78123879
You had me at Kate poops.
>>78123833
The series was shit on Clint Barton and look at how great Kate Bishop is. Distilled character assassination. Amazing? Fan-favorite for who? Acclaimed, don't even get me started on what bullshit acclaimed means in the comic book industry? That is all opinion. I have been a Hawkeye fan for years and I didn't like this characterization at all. Clint Barton was the lancer, now he has been reduced to the court jester and the butt of the joke. Maybe we do see him as a real person because we are real fans. We have invested countless hours reading these stories. And then some hack writer comes in and does a hack job, what do you expect? For us to be happy?
>>78102091
Kate's the best and I would gladly hand over real, tangible cash-dollars for her own solo series.
>>78124003
Why is she the best?
>>78123833
>it makes me thing you see Clint as a real person that was treated badly by the writer
I like how this line of thinking is suddenly considered a bad thing when talking about narrative and characterizations. At least, when it comes to male characters. Female characters, it's a-okay to think of them as real people and try not to upset others by writing them "wrong".
>>78123952
>look at how great Kate Bishop is.
what? Kate is an overconfident teenager who annoys everyone, including Clint, and fucks up completely when alone. You have really shallow understanding on the characters.
And no, the book being fan-favourite and acclaimed is not an opinion. That is a fact. You can look at sales of the collected editions, awards and various Top Ten lists.
I expect you to be an adult being in for the craft, not a fanboy.
>>78123952
>how great Kate Bishop is
She is a sidekick. I cannot recall anything great she has done. Clint honeypots her once in a while, that's all.
>>78124027
Honestly it was just a hyperbole, but I enjoy the plucky nature of the character and the fact that (when written correctly), is just as self-destructive and headstrong as Clint is.
However, I'm a comics fan who is fine with writers and companies trying out different, progressive concepts (like Jane Thor, Amadeus Hulk, etc.) and seeing what sticks. I know most everything will go back to the status quo in at least a year, so if other people don't like how Kate is written and presented it will certainly go back to normal eventually.
>>78124049
You do a lot of baseless assumptions there.
>>78124118
How is fan-favorite not an opinion? Who are these fans? Aren't there different groups of fans? Awards are opinion. Top Ten lists are opinion. Sales I give you that, but that is all a part of the marketing and hype machine. Sales does not equate to good writing or storytelling, look at Avatar. Maybe you are naive to not realize how much Fraction was pushing Bishop and do a lot of that by making Clint desperately need her.
>>78124118
>Top Ten lists
>not opinion
>Awards
>not opinion
Those paid opinions.
>>78123786
Yeah, you're right. I got that impression when I read Immortal Iron Fist recently and saw Danny being a bumbling, awkward blonde dude covered in bandages when not in costume.
>tfe that Clint bullying comic is canon
CLINT IS USEFUL.
USEFUL
S
E
L.
>>78124215
Its not baseless. It constantly fucking happens. When something bad happens to a female character or they're written in a poor manner, it's considered an afront, not only to fans, but also to the character themselves. When it happens with a male character and someone bitches about it, they're met with "oh don't be such a nitpicky autist/neckbeard". It happens all the fucking time.
>>78124239
Are you daft?
Obviously awards themselves are based on opinion. But the fact X won the Award A is not an opinion.
those reviews on Amazon are opinions, but X having rating Y on Amazon is a fact, not an opinion.
And Clint does not desperately need her. Not more than Batman needs his Robin.
>>78124239
Avatar has great storytelling. Do not get your point.
>>78124374
Just because the book won an award doesn't help your argument. Ratings mean nothing. Awards mean nothing. Once again Avatar.
>And Clint does not desperately need her. Not more than Batman needs his Robin.
Expect one problem. Batman is capable. Fraction's Hawkeye was a loser and incompetent. Fraction set up that Clint desperately needed a crutch.
>>78124409
Really? Avatar is soulless and cliche. Highest grossing movie in the world, but it is not a good movie in the least bit.
>>78111115
Everything she's been a main character in (iirc):
Young Avengers v1 + Special by Heinberg & Cheung (first appearances)
Young Avengers Presents: Hawkeye (first meeting with Clint Barton; written by Fraction. Reprinted in the first Hawkeye trade)
Avengers: the Children's Crusade by Heinberg & Cheung
Young Avengers v2 by Gillen & McKelvie
Hawkeye by Fraction & Aja
All-New Hawkeye by Lemire
Before teaming up with Clint Barton she mostly appeared with the other Young Avengers, so you can look up the YA event minis for other appearances (Young Avengers & Runaways: Civil War, Young Avengers: Siege, Young Avengers: Dark Reign and Young Avengers & Runaways: Secret Invasion).
>>78124648
Basically Kate was tolerable when Clint died/or become Ronin.
>>78125009
Eh, she's not badly written usually, but between YA and Fraction's run her characterization varies quite a bit. Not in a bad way, it's just different.
I liked her more in YA and I felt like her characterization in Fraction's run was too different than what I like the most about her (especially in the LA part where she was too "kooky") but I still liked Hawkeye.
Up
>>78121322
Everybody has their own take on characters
>>78127156
In a nutshell
>>78124648
thanks for the rec, I'll hope to read them all
>>78127066
>>78127941
I think I saw you in the x-23 threads. anon.
>>78128357
Thank you.
>>78102091
Just read the storytime last night. I believe in Lemire. It's pretty dark, hopeless stuff and the main characters seem pretty tragic and broken, but that's just Lemire playing to his own strengths as a writer. I'm also really enjoying the split timelines, because they create a really effective atmosphere of futility and disfunction.
I can see why people don't like it, because it's definitely pretty unkind to Clint and one of the major story mechanics is framing Kate as someone who is his superior both as a hero and as a person. I'm willing to bet that this dynamic is soon to be subverted, though. It seems like the current timeline wherein Clint just sort of gives up and lapses into depression once Kate leaves is not set in stone, and something's going to happen to change it. I'll bet it ends in a really schmaltzy feel-good epilogue, and people will feel silly for jumping all over themselves to call it character assassination.
>>78123786
I love that he references that at least twice.
>>78124648
thanks for the rec!!
She seems like a pretty cool character
>>78124460
What?
My argument is that the book is acclaimed.
And winning an award does support that argument.
You're a dim-wit.
>>78124460
You have yet to explain how is he a loser and incompetent?
He is a mess and feels down, but he actually is not.
>>78124460
Basically, you consider your opinion to be of higher value than opinion of anybody else.
>>78129941
I'm hoping that it goes in this direction. Something to the tune of, future timeline is what happens if Clint gives up, but he manages to pull himself together either through gumption or with Kate's help, and that future is prevented.
>>78130971
She sure is.
I always thought she was asian
>>78128270
I wonder how many real teeth the average superhero has.
>>78136137
Same
>>78124460
>Fraction's Hawkeye was a loser and incompetent
No he was not, take of your anti-kate googles for a second and reread the book.
>>78110156
It's weird when they're quipping while simutaneously pumping non-superpowered hydra dudes full of arrows.
They're straight up killing people while making jokes.
>>78139165
I think that's what makes it funny
>>78140706
This
>>78106602
Well given that it was strongly implied that she has a thing for Clint in Fraction's run, she's at least bi if they pair her up with another woman.
>>78139165
Don't worry, they're just maiming them for life.
>>78139165
Yeah, especially since both characters have been firm supporters of the "Avengers don't kill" school of thought.
She seems cute
>>78149899
That outfit looks drafty
>>78149924
I'm sure it helps with arrow stuff.
>>78149899
Damn she's cute.
>>78150168
Poor Kate
>>78150489
Cheapest plot device.
>>78102091
>kate
>not janice
shame on you, beetle is mai waifu ever since superior foes
>>78150188
Yes she is.
>>78150168
follow up
>>78151400
She's talking with Jessica Jones, who was pregnant at the time
>>78151400
Atleast she recover.
If Clint is the loser Kate seems to think he is, she shouldn't be working with him in the future regardless of his level of culpability in regards to the situation at hand. Tens of thousands of lives are at stake. She has a whole team of competent operatives. Clint is just there so she can tell you how much of a fuck up he is.
It kind of sucks.
>>78151758
Kate looks up to Clint, but sometimes (in Fraction's run when she left for LA) she feels like he's giving up, he's not acting like Hawkeye should and he's relying too much on her, and she can't stand the pressure. It doesn't mean that she's right and Clint's a loser, though.
In Lemire's run Kate got fed up with Clint's attitude and left. In my opinion though the narrative is not telling you "she's 100% right, Clint is old and a fuckup!", it looks like she's still idealistic on and wants to save everyone, while Clint wants them both to be safe and knows when they can't win. Clint took a morally grey decision, while she wanted to save everybody (impossible in that case) and got burned. The let down is what made her distant to Clint.
>>78102091
Not very good.
>>78152652
Pretty decent.
>>78154074
Is there a larger version of this?
>>78154438
No sadly http://msz006zeta.deviantart.com/art/35-Hawkeye-Kate-Bishop-382497074
>>78154509
Shiitt
>>78102091
>How's Lemire's Hawkguy?
Without healthcare, dental coverage or enough money to buy a hearing aid not to mention making $85,000 a year less than a squirrel that's how.
>>78156878
Sad lemire and soule work went downhill.
>>78160277
Thank you
>>78161778
>>78162498
Post more Clint x Kate
>>78162696
Absolutely fantastic.
>>78149899
there's no way she's wearing underwear with that
>>78162855
I'm usually not one for these big difference in age ships but them Hawkeyes man, they just get to me.Is it because of the chemistry?
>>78162920
I think. http://i.imgur.com/0fNwNCih.jpg
>>78162696
A slight edit, emphasizing Kate's nudity.
>>78163571
Much better
>>78163571
Slight change.
>>78162498
How old are they?
>>78164000
Kate was 20 years old at the beginning Young Avengers Vol 2, so it can be inferred that she was 18 at the time of Young Avengers Vol 1. She is currently 21 according to the wikia.
How much shit would people give Clint if he hooked up with Kate?
>>78164141
An endless river.
>>78113330
His Animal Man, Swamp Thing, Demon Knights, OMAC, for all the new 52s problems, there was some great fresh new titles
>>78164281
I also loved his short superboy run.
>>78164376
the art bugged me, but it was a good story.
>>78164406
Sadly flashpoint kill the book.
>>78164052
Is kanda weird he was 18 in YA when the rest are 14-16 years old.
>>78164690
Agreed very weird
>>78164141
Make it happen marvel.
>>78162971
>Hawkeye's face
What the shit.
>>78167191
Those tits
Unf
>>78113330
>Arrow inspired hooded vigilante characterization,
Anon, that costume existed before Arrow.
>>78110156
Yikes, too much female righteousness in that piece of shit.
Kate's a failure for wanting to be a hero but not willing to be there for her own family, Goddamn.
>>78170530
The comic does seem to be very deluded and well up its own ass about Kate being 100% right and Clint being wrong to the point that now SHIELD are the bad guys...it's pretty bizarre.
Young avengers any good?
>>78171547
Its painfully average.
>>78169870
Rockie fan art
>>78172011
Wasted potential
>>78124118
>Kate is an overconfident teenager who annoys everyone
Kate Bishop is twenty one.
>>78169992
Perfect sizes.
>>78172296
Not bad.
>>78119388
good times with friends...
>>78124204
That dog has too many eyes!
Fraction run would be pretty mediocre (maybe even bad) if it wasn't for that excellent, excellent art.
Same thing on Elli's Moon Knight.
>>78174594
Too bad an issues worth of that art took seven months to draw.
>>78174492
Yup
>>78174647
Those delays killed the series hype.
>>78174594
Agreed the, artwork was excellent even wu as fill up artists.
>>78143877
Are you aware that Fraction actually said she has a thing going on for America when somebody asked him. And that the Clint/Kate relationship is more of a father/daughter type.
>>78175631
America I hate that Mary Sue.
>>78175747
Same.
>>78164000
Kate is 21. Clint is mid-30s.
Could she take Eva in a fight?
>>78176646
Maybe
>>78164052
I don't think she was 20 in the YA. She uses a uniform from a girls school. So i think she was 17-18, tops.
>>78176646
>>78177360
this is a fetish?
>>78177377
I think you mean "these are fetishes?". I don't think a centaur fetish goes with a catfight fetish.
Two girls wrestling with humiliation at stake really shouldn't be a fetish that surprises you. Catfights in the wide, wide world of fetishes are relatively mainstream.
The centaur thing though, yeah, that's a bit out there.
>>78177377
A little.
>>78176646
>Eva being overpowered hand to hand
>Being forced to say that her bow that she places so much pride in makes her a cheater
>And then gets called a keebler elf.
What did she ever do to you anon?A-am I the only one finding this arousing?
>>78178048
W-well, now that you've explained it to me...
>>78150168
I thought she almost got raped and not actually raped
>>78162696
Damn. Isn't he twice her age?
Did she get a new costume?
Or is she still using that 60's gogo getup
>>78178636
>Now that you've explained it to me...
What changed anon?
>>78178768
Almost
>>78178783
13 years.
>>78178805
I don't think she ever did. Her first costume was pretty good.
>>78178768
She got raped
>>78180939
Wait she did.
>>78177522
True
>>78182520
Thank you.
>>78124271
How much of this is sarcasm? Because I feel like this is pretty sarcastic.
>>78180851
Cute
>>78102091
She's super hot in that arc where that artist drew her. Literally the only good thing about Hawkeye issues that aren't drawn by Aja.
>>78186875
this picture is fine from a distance but when i look up close at it, it's all fucked up for a bunch of different reasons.
>>78186963
Atleast the costume looks good on her.
>>78186905
Wu issues were great.
>>78185634
>>78185990
I watch it.
>>78188164
Hell yeah
>>78184078
Cute
>>78185634
>Aubrey Plaza Kate
I kinda want this
>>78188802
I take it. Make it happen marvel.
>>78188644
Very
>>78193474
this was a great page
>>78193669
Favorite
>>78102091
I haven't read it but probably the best...
JEFF COME BACK!!!and bring Animal Man with you :'-(
>>78193455
Sassy Sidekick Kate>IMPERFECT Kate
>>78193933
they both work
>>78193896
Or green arrow
>>78194136
I think you skipped page seventeen, bro.
>>78194292
corrupted
>>78194309
Ah. Such is life.
>>78194344
I hate when that happens
>>78113330
I actually really don't care for Lemire at all, but his runs on both Animal Man and Swamp thing pretty much sold me on the New 52.
>>78194477
That was Snyder on Swamp Thing, they just crossed-over for Rotworld.
>>78194990
This art is baaad
>>78195037
If only Aja didn't take a eternity. kate looks so weird
>>78162829
Best part of the outfit. That knowledge.
>>78195528
that reminds me, i need to start christmas shopping soon
>>78195597
same. no idea what to buy
>>78196503
the bottom of this page would be a great /r9k/ image
>>78196569
Very true
>>78196322
I just read "Sorry, cunt"
>>78198850
No problem
>>78196494
>>78196521
These are my two favorite pages of this entire series. It peaked with this issue, sadly.
>>78201159
It was a fun series. Agreed it peaked with issue.
>>78201271
This
