>>681131649
Not losing friends as a result of talking about being a fucking vegan all the goddamn time.

Less effort. I can eat literally anything.

>>681131759
You dont have to be preachy. I dont talk about it to my friends at all unless they ask.

If we all started being vegan tomorrow we'd have to kill off essentially all farm animal life other than sheep and horses.

Oh and me being vegan wouldn't make a difference to anything.

>>681131782
Being vegan requires less cooking if you eat raw food, and is cheaper. If the majority of fast food places were vegan would you be vegan then?

>>681131929
The world wont go vegan tomorrow. You being vegan would cut out 50% of your greenhouse gas emissions, and also make you healthy as. Why is being vegan pointless for one person?

>>681132123

>but it wouldn't go

No let's just say it did, you vegans we, we're all suddenly vegan how do you deal with the guilt knowing you just murdered trillions of animals?

and no it still wouldn't make a difference, the animals would still be dead

>>681131967
No, I can't stand fast food.

But overall, I'm not a picky eater. I'll grill up some chicken, cook a pot of rice, make a light sauce. That'll last me like 3-4 days easy. I suppose you're right in that I would do less cooking if everything was raw, but that sounds like it would get old pretty quickly.

>>681132241
>triilions of animals
50 billion land animals die every year due to the meat industry
whats the point of hypotheticals that wont happen? Thats not an argument against veganism in the real world. Everyone would go vegan gradually, and less animals would be bred due to lower demand, eventually cutting them out while the last are killed for meat consumption.

>>681132469

I mean let's face it we'd only need horses and sheep since you can't use pigs, cows, goats or chickens besides the ones that would be kept in zoos for people to look at.

Is that what you really want?

>>681131649
Well people wouldn't think you're a faggot for one and since you felt the need to tell us you're vegan you care what people think about you. Also check em

>>681132395
It actually doesnt man, on a high carb low fat vegan diet you can eat fuckloads of sweet fruit, and there are plenty of fake meats on the market that taste awesome if you dont want to go raw. Ive been vegan for ages and the food i eat tastes awesome.

>>681132610

>plenty of fake meats

Why even bother?

I don't consume any animal products, but I don't call myself a vegan either.

>>681132584
Yep. Farm cows and pigs are not supposed to exist. we should let them die off.

>>681132689

So you want animals to die? Some vegan you are

>>681132593
People talk about all sorts of shit on here, why cant I talk about veganism? Does it strike a nerve with you?

>>681132752
No i want them to die naturally shit head, without us killing them.

>>681132752
Read his statement again.

>>681132669
To help people make the switch to veganism, i dont see a problem with fake meat if tastes good and doesnt harm an animal.

>>681132833

What about in countries where there aren't any big predators? How are they going to die off?

>>681132689
>Farm cows and pigs are not supposed to exist

Neither are vegan homo sapiens

>we should let them die off.

>>681132922

>don't eat meat
>here's some fake meat

It's almost like you want to eat meat

>>681132974

kek'd

>but humans have the choice to eat me
>but you're not allowed to have that choice!

>>681131649
>35 year old vegen at college
>masters in art
>hasn't eaten meat in 7 years
>suddenly has a massive seizure
>call 911
>barely misses hitting her head on table
>told she had too many hystamines or something
>caused by veganism
>doctor tells her to eat meat

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>>681131649
THOSE POOR VEGETABLES!!!!!! YOU MURDERER!111111!!!!1!!!!!!!!11111111111

>>681132936
Duh, you desex them, which vegans are in favor of

>>681133075

So you desex them so they have to live out their lives forcing them to not breed? That's not very nice.

>>681133065
You kill more plants by eating meat retard, due to the amount of plants that cows, chickens and pigs eat.

>>681132936
they're not. and i don't think that vegan poster knows about wild boars either. those things are fucking vicious and only came about because we let pigs roam into the wild and forgot about them and instead of dying they fucking thrived and became angry and dangerous.

>>681133160
Lol and killing and torturing them isnt?

>>681133075
i think we should desex vegans so they can't breed.

1: because I'm comfortable with my diet
2: because we use cows chickens and pigs for more than meat so as a hunter of old 'it's wrong to kill and not make use of the entire animal"
3vegans are massive pussies that think they deserve special attention for what they put in their mouth

>>681132974
Humans are naturally herbivorous retard,

>>681131649

Dairy farmer here.

Yes. If you stopped buying my milk and eating my cows - i wouldn't be able to make any sweet, sweet cash.

Also humans evolved to persue an omnivorous diet and you should not be a faggot about it.

>>681131858
>You dont have to be preachy.
It's a requirement, like being one of those door to door jesus salesmen you have to actively preach and annoy others.
You aren't doing it properly, not a real vegan.

>>681133267

Death is death, you'd rather they suffer for years on end?

>>681133309
Nice argument, really disproved veganism right there.

>>681133372

Dunno which biology book you picked up.

>>681133196
Boats aren't that bad, I've bicycled through a herd of them completely surrounded, kids and all. They get defensive with kids but only if you go out of your way to annoy them

And they hate HATE dogs

9/10 if you see a wild boar and it sees you it's going to turn away and go dig up roots

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>>681133384
You are wrong my friend

>>681133372

Are you stupid? Canine teeth? Superfluous appendix? Desire for flesh?

If i wasn't so sure this was b8 i would quote david attenborough.

>>681133499

A blurry mess? Very convincing.

>>681133532
Desire for flesh? When you see a dog do think about eating it? Canine teeth? go attack a cow and try and bite into and see what happens

>>681133372
>Humans are naturally herbivorous retard,

kek

>>681133384
>Also humans evolved to persue an omnivorous diet and you should not be a faggot about it.

/thread

Humans have omnivore teeth and an omnivore gut. We are designed to eat whatever we can get our hands on, fruit, roots, fish, meat.

The one thing we do NOT have is a herbivore gut - see the vestigal appendix = meaning we cannot naturally subsist on vegetation high in cellulose.

It is impossible to live naturally on a true vegan diet, and you will stunt your growth and lose out on essential micronutrients if you try.

>>681133499
>posts a potato pic as proof
>>681133372

Humans dont have forward facing eyes like a predator, the teeth of an omnivore and the highest stamina on the planet to chase down strawberries

Whether you like it or not, humans definitely are omnivores

>>681133634
Sorry, follow this link to see a clearer image: http://static1.squarespace.com/static/531ef4b9e4b069e27c30957e/t/5324b2bbe4b03d5774a67306/1394913979729/

>>681133731
http://static1.squarespace.com/static/531ef4b9e4b069e27c30957e/t/5324b2bbe4b03d5774a67306/1394913979729/

>>681131649
>a good reason for not being vegan
"Why not" is not a reason. You'll be short on protein (or eat 5 lbs. of broccoli a day), vitamins, minerals and other such necessities

>>681131649
It was recently proven that a diet with no meat/fish in it is very bad for Humans. Studies have found that over generations, this diet causes the body to struggle to break down certain acids found naturally in food leading to much higher cancer rates along with other big problems.

Even with this study people still think its better to be vegan/vegetarian. It's ok if you want to fuck with your body for 1 life time, but just hope your kids and their kids dont do it. Or your family tree wont last very long.

>>681133499
Was looking for that kind of chart for ages. Thanks.

>>681133929
>short on protein
Uhhhh, you sure about that?
>vitamins and minerals
Ever heard of fruit and leafy vegetables?

>>681132123
Humans need meat. Its a literal scientific fact that a diet with no meat/fish over generations is bad for Humans. Proved quiet recently.

We have evolved so much because we learned to cook meat, so we could eat it and break it down easily allowing us to use more energy on other things.

>>681133981
The china study does not agree with you.

>>681133831

So chimpanzees should also be herbivores?
You better go tell them.

>>681134143
Source on your proof m8? Look up the china study. Vegans on average live 5 years longer, have lower rate of diabetes, heart disease and cancer.

>>681132469
Please man.
>50 billion land animals die every year due to the meat industry

They are only alive to be eaten. Don't act like its some kind of genocide.Humans need meat its a fact of life, we evolved this way.

>>681134246
Many herbivores can eat meat, but that does not make it their optimal diet. Same goes for chimps and humans.

>>681131649
protein

>>681134255
Yeh, ill look for the link now. You could just google what i said but whatever give me a min.

The only reason vegans "live longer" like you say, is because most vegans are also healthy people in general. So they stats are so fucking useless to even look at.

Yes, look at your teeth. What do you think the sharp ones are for? Self-defense?

>>681134334
Lel, http://malnourishedvegans.com/ Do you think these guys have protein deficiencies?

>>681133731
>impossible

You're so stupid. I'm 6'0 and quite substantial, no stunted growth here and I've been vegan since I was 14, shortly after puberty so all the way through my growth period. I could tell an argument with you would be one sided so I shouldn't have even engaged. It's amazing how some people create their own facts out of thin air just to support their own ridiculous beliefs and win an argument. Goodbye idiot.

>>681134255

This is true. They have a 100 percent chance of being beta cucks tho...

Is it worth the trade off?

>>681134379
Compare your "sharp" teeth with a dogs sharp teeth. Are they the same? Our canines are flattened, while every omnivore has canines 3x longer than the rest of their teeth. Find me an omnivore that can move its jaw sideways like us and herbivores.

>>681134255
here you go

telegraph co uk /news/2016/03/29/long-term-vegetarian-diet-changes-human-dna-raising-risk-of-canc/

>>681134432
ty, good to have another vegan here

>>681134387
They get plenty of protein from their boyfriends.

>>681133895

Sorry, but that chart is obviously bullshit, and has been very selective in how they classify "omnivores".

>omnivores have sharp claws
>chimpanzees, rats, pigs are not omnivores

>>681134432
see >>681134542


IT IS BAD FOR HUMANS TO NOT EAT MEAT. It might be ok for you in one generation but if we all did it the whole fucking world would suffer. Your retarded thinking your saving animals and shit. Your just follow a trend its that simple. We are animals who need meat. I dont agree with inhumane conditions and if i could i would hunt/kill all my own food. But we need meat. Fact of life.

>>681131649
So the whole process of eating is basically killing living things and digesting them. Is the capability of animals to feel pain the only qualifier that vegans have for being anti-meat? They're still "killing" living plants on a daily basis to eat, so some kind of moral argument for the general sanctity of life is obviously not the case.

I can understand being against corporate factoryfarm animals who live and die uncomfortable lives in boxes, but what about people who raise their own free range animals and the like?

>>681134333
No. Many herbivores can't because their digestive systems can't handle it

Go feed a cow nothing but meat for a while and see how it feels

You guys are so far inside your own asses you don't even realize that a human can go on meat and pasta without any major concern for a long period of time, they might need supplements if they keep it up, but they can

Source I've had a childhood friend that hated vegetables and fruit and only ate boar/cow/pig/chicken/fish/deer from the time he was 5 and 20 years later he's still fine

Go feed a cow meat for 20 years

>>681134542
>telegraph co uk /news/2016/03/29/long-term-vegetarian-diet-changes-human-dna-raising-risk-of-canc/

That study actually concluded that people who have a long family history of vegetarians have a higher chance of cancer than other vegetarians if they eat shitty vegan food like oreos or other processed shit. It also found that they were better at digesting plant food.

>>681133499
10/10 chart would read again

>>681133499
fallacious bait for ants

>>681134333

Nice trips. Your argument is validated - many herbivores will consume their own placenta after birth.

Chimps hunt and kill regularly, however.

Humans when starved will consume fauna over flora.

>>681134659
Doesnt disprove the rest of the chart. A herbivore has a 95% plant based diet, like how chimps do.

>>681134432
>vegan since 14
>most of your growing already done

had you been a vegan all your life instead of eating a healthy omnivorous diet during your crucial formative years you'd probably be 5'6 tops. there's a very obvious reason all those asians and hispanics in piss poor countries with little to no access to meat are so short on average.

>>681134662
We cant sustain 7 billion meat eaters on free range farming.

>>681134542
Read this article and go to the study and then keep being a vegan. Your all fucking idiots here.

Ofcourse its possible to not eat meat and be healthy. Allot of the time this requires supplements but it is possible without.

But is fucking bad for you. If you lived in a cult and did it for generations you would start to get cancer and shit as the study shows.

We need meat in our siet. Simple as that. Its the reason we evolved so quickly after we found fire. Because it rapidly decreased the energy it took us to digest the meat.

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>>681134899

>>681134432

Holy ad hominem batman.

>veganism can't stunt growth because I'm 6'0.

Anecdotal evidence is meaningless, and since we don't know what you're potential height may have been, we can't know if you are stunted or not.

> because humans have a lot of herbivore characteristics they can't be omnivores

I have nothing against vegans, eat what you want, but don't spout utter nonsense

>>681134896
>681134896
THIS

It is actually being proved as we speak. The average size is growing in many parts of Asia as eating meat becomes more popular compared to the mainly vegetarian and occasional fish diet.

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>>681132989
he just wants be egdy irl

>>681134758
>>681134810
Apologies, the image should be clearer, if you trust me enough here is a link to a better version of ithttp://static1.squarespace.com/static/531ef4b9e4b069e27c30957e/t/5324b2bbe4b03d5774a67306/1394913979729/

>>681131649
Enjoy running out of proteins and other nutrients you need from other food richfag.

>>681135013
Lel, the comment he was replying to posted no evidence at all showing that veganism stunted growth. Anecdotes trump no evidence at all.

>>681135088
Vegan food is cheaper for any nutrient dumbass, Do you think fruit and veg is more expensive than steak?

>>681135252

No, anecdotes ARE no evidence at all.

Abraham Lincoln told me that this morning.

>>681135252
i eat meat and i am 6'1 so meat wins?

>>681135390
Actually your genetics win. Great job.

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>>681133758
>highest stamina on earth to chase down strawberries

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>>681135424

>>681135424

I am made of meat and eat meat and i am 6'2.
Genetics and meat wins...

Ok boys, since OP is a retard Vegan. I'll have to take over, since I'm a "smart" vegan.

Yes, it is true our brains grew with cooking meat, but it was not necessarily the meat, it was the cooking that did more.

As for meat being necessary, no, it isn't really.

Yes meat can cause cancer and heart disease, but frankly, a poor vegan diet can also lead to death.

We should be more concerned about treating animals equally, and not abusing them. I have no problems with people wanting to eat meat, you don't have to be vegan, but truthfully it is better if you atleast give it a try.

>>681135543
At least all the food in there is vegan (op here)

>>681135543
At least the food in there is vegan(OP here)

>>681135566
I am a Human and understand that we have evolved for generations eating meat, for this reason i also eat meat and am 6'4

>>681131649
Not being a little pussy.

>>681135604
Why am i retarded bro? Cooked starches were responsible for brain growth btw

>>681134387
i just looked up the heights of some of the men on that site. almost all of them range from 5'3 (kek) to 5'7 at the upper end.

not to mention literally every example they give is a bodybuilder on steroids, which will get you jacked regardless of what you eat.

>>681135528

Lol. Thanks for pointing that out.

Top kek

>>681135604
If you want to follow the trned go ahead, but just dont say its "healthy" to not eat meat. Because factually speaking it isn't all the mortality rates are worthless when you consider most vegans are also living healthy life styles anyway.

But i do agree that making sure animals are treated well before we consume them is important. However i have been in the position where i could only afford battery chickens etc. So really its a bigger issue than just, supply and demand.

>>681135677
Why is that the countries with highest meat intake have the highest rate of heart disease? Doesnt sound like we are very suited for meat eating.

>>681134528
Dogs are carnivores, you fucking dunce.

>>681134899
it sounds to me like the answer is to make less humans. or are we not capable of making a choice to not do that?

You're failing to realise your dealing with a bunch of "Btards" who use appeal to nature fallacies and anecdotes.

>>681135856
THOSE STATS ARE SO FUCKING SUTPID.

Did you know when more increams are sold more people get shot to death, so i guess it must be ice cream making people shoot each other.

Your retarded, most meat eating nations are also richer ifsofacto they indulge more. You need to learn how to look at stats seriously. I learned this shit when i was 12

>>681131759
I literally never talk about being vegan

>>681135747
check out Roman Halík. Hes 216cm and vegan. There is no evidence that veganism stunts growth

>>681135864
Dogs are omnivores actually

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fuck off new fag

If you want to be vegan go for it, but don't be self-righteous and a fucking asshole about it and don't think it's helping anything or anybody.
>THA POOR ANIMALS
Go watch a nature documentary sometime. Animals are hunted and brutally killed all the time.
>BUT WERE BETTER THAN THAT
No we're not. We're animals. We're not special. Get over yourselves.

But eat your vegetables if you want, I don't give a fuck. Just shut your goddamn self-righteous mouth about it.

>>681136008
Except that we are actually able to show why eating meat causes heart disease.

>>681135864
my pug does not eat plants, so no theyr'e not. they omnivors

These dubs are reason enough

>>681136024
LOL yeh, no evidence at all. Its just random that most of Asia has had little to no meat in their deit for generations are have been small the whole time. Oh also its just random than now they are becoming more modernised the average size is growing especially in cities where more people are eating meat as it is seen to be western. Yeh all these years and generations of clear fact must just be not true.

Fuck me you people are retarded.

>>681135900
tru tru Dubs the logical fallacies are running rampant in this thread.

>>681136103
Well thats arguable, i agree you can show that with processed meat but even red meat some people say its bullshit. I think we can agree too much of anything is bad for you. But it doesnt mean we dont need meat.

Seriously, do what you want with your life but dont pretend we are meant to not eat meat. Because its just not true.

>>681131649
I've been vegetarian for 25 years, but not because I object to eating of meat. I just don't want to support the meat industry. If meat was obtained from small-scale sustainable hunting, I would eat meat. Likewise, if I go fishing, I eat what I catch.

I think veganism is part of the *problem*. It implies that humans are separate from nature, that we need not live as part of the cycle of life and death which drives our ecosphere. I believe that veganism breeds contempt for the self-stabilizing stochastic systems of life.

>>681131649
>>681131967
I need to always count nutrients to ensure I get enough of everything I need, whereas if I eat different kind of meats and fish and combine that with vegetables, it's a lot easier.

Remember, vegetarians don't eat ANYTHING that has any animal traces in it. Not cheese, not eggs, not fish, not gelatin, nothing.

>>681135856
Why is it that a rise in cheese consumption correlates with a higher rate of people dying by becoming entangled in their bedsheets? Correlation is not causation, folks.

>>681136080
Nice use of appeal to nature fallacy bro. The animals in those documentaries need meat to survive, we dont. In fact, we would be able to sustain up to 12 billion people with the plants and fruit that we grow right now/

>>681135604

Sup faggot. Serious question...

Did your stamina increase or decrease upon adopting a vegan diet?
I love meat but i could potentially go without it for more energy.
Im not a gym freak or anything but i am active.

>>681133727
>no facts but its my opinion so its obviously right
>hurr im a edgy 14 year old.

>>681136165
Lel, the okinawan people in japan have a 95% plant based diet and have the highest average life span on earth, where as the inuit people eat an all meat diet and have an extremely high rate of heart disease and diabetes and a very low lifespan

put a rabbit and a apply next to a 1 year old child and tell me which one it eats and which one it plays with.

>>681136337
You can actually show why meat causes heart disease tho...

>>681135604
If only I gave a flying fuck about animal rights.

>>681136641
apple*

>>681136653
If you went to a slaughter house i bet you would feel pretty bad.

High carbs can only take you so far, what about protein? Where do you get that from, its arguably just as or more important that eating only potatoes and such.

>>681136641
TY

>>681136550
All meat is bad. Ofcourse it is bad. Also you again are using stupid stats. Look at the lifestyle in Japan compared to other nations, How many fat people do you see in japan in general. Stop being so fucking retarded.

>>681136744
Not really. I've been in a couple.

It's a fact that vegans are faggots

>>681136771
You can get all the amino acids from nuts, beans and leafy greens my friend. We actually only need 60g per day unless you are on gear. We've just been duped by the dairies whey protein campaign.

India - largest vegetarian/vegan population in the world (40%), 4th shortest country by average height.

Netherlands, tallest country in the world on average - 4% vegetarian.

Norway, third tallest country on average, 2% vegetarian.

https://www.google.com/fusiontables/DataSource?docid=120DzHmKJOgO9k5lTlIBh0WALCz-MpXOuoXwznyM#rows:id=1

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarianism_by_country

The "smart" vegan here. Instead of using statistics, here's a study regarding the carcinogens in meat.

Here are some studies on heme iron, found in meat.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4035012/

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23708150

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24243555

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23046549

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22121108

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4135519/

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11743810

Here you go OP, saved your thread.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4135519/

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11743810

>>681136641
LOL PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY TAKING THIS AS EVIDENCE.

Holy fuck. Humans are born stupid, they are not smart enough to kill, skin and cook the rabbit ready to eat. The apple on the other hand smells nice and is ready to eat, put a rabbit steak next to a 1 year old and an apple then you have again another useless act. Because 1 year olds dont give a shit what they eat.

Put a chocolate bar and an apple next to a 1 year old and see which 1 it eats and which 1 it plays with, so therefore we should stop eating apples and only throw them and live only on chocolate? Your fucking retarded.

>>681134896
>>681135020
Idiot. Their growth isn't stunted because they're not eating meat. It's because they're poor and they're not eating anything at all. So fucking dumb, im out

>>681136550
>highly advanced medical care in 1st world nation

>picks the longest lived tribal nation to compare them to

wew

>>681136550

Which would suggest people in the middle range would be just fine.

Non-genius confirmed.

Energy has improved massively, I was constipated for quite a while aswell. When I wake up, I'm never really that tired. I get about 8 hours of sleep.

>>681136791
What? Stupid stats? Im a little confused as to why they are stupid. You cant dismiss every statistic like that.

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>>681136771
"One farmer says to me, 'You cannot live on vegetable food solely, for it furnishes nothing to make bones with;' and so he religiously devotes a part of his day to supplying his system with the raw material of bones; walking all the while he talks behind his oxen, which, with vegetable-made bones, jerk him and his lumbering plow along in spite of every obstacle." -- Henry David Thoreau

>>681137023
LOL WOW YOUR AMAZING.

I GUESS THATS WHY AFRICANS ARE SO TALL, BECAUSE THEY ARE SO WELL KNOWN FOR THEIR HIGH CALORIFIC DIET.

Your actually so stupid you should be put down. Like your thought process is so bad. Think years of evolution and your the fucking result.

>>681137104
see >>681137074


Why do you always need everything explaining in so much detail before you realise your wrong. Just think a little bit.

>>681131649
No. If tofu and lentils tasted like steak and bacon I'd go vegan.

>>681137001
Netherlands and Norway are extremely wealthy nations compared to india. Many people in india are not able to buy enough food for themselves. Not a good example

>>681137007
There is no smart vegans you pretentious faggot piece of shit go fuck a carrot

>>681131649
Because after about 20 years, your body will only be able to process certain types of protien and certain amounts.

>>681137176
So everybody in Africa is tall? You're a fucking moron. Shut the fuck up before you ruin my morning you fucking cunt

>>681137316
Africans dont eat allot, what they do eat is mostly meat and any fruit/veg they can get/grow. Please, just spend 5 mins thinking about what your saying before you say it. Its getting silly now.

>>681131649

Hi, OP. I notice you completely ignored my comment here: >>681136295

I'm assuming it's because it's a legitimately good reason to not be vegan, and that you'd rather argue with low-IQ /b/tards than justify yourself to someone who know what he's talking about.

>>681137107

You know, some scientists are now theorizing that people and oxen are actually different.

>>681137423
He has a valid point OP.


- The "smart" vegan.

>>681137100

Thanks. How do you cope when someone is cooking meat and you smell it? Thats what i think i would have trouble with.

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The amount of protein required in my diet to make sufficient gains is not realistic without eating meat.

>>681137360
I thought we were using averages? Seriously just stop doing what your fucking doing.

I guarantee your an atheist. I guarantee you also hate talking to those religious people who deny any kind of evolution and say the world is 3000 years old.

Thats is exactly what your doing, you say something stupid, i give you evidence to show you how your wrong. Rather than accepting the facts and moving on, you stick your head in the sand and ignore all logic. You are the very thing you hate. I see so many fucking people like this in the world. Fuck you to be honest. You are retarded and unless your mentally ill you should be put down. Because clearly no amount of reasonable logic will help you.

Vegans are faggots

>>681137279
There are vegan bacon substitutes that taste awesome, you should try them even if you're not vegan.

>>681136046
Yeah, after humans began feeding them that stupid shit. Canines are naturally carnivorous.

>>681137771
Lets not lie here, they dont taste awesome at all, maybe if you no longer eat bacon they remind you of it, but as a meat eater who has also eaten allot of that stuff. It is not even close to being the same.

>>681137240
But australia has great healthcare, and is the worlds fattest country, and has an extreme high rate of heart disease and diabetes, and eats the most meat per person out of any country.

I have impaired smell, so I don't really care. It's the sight that makes me uncomfortable, I just try to look away.

>>681137904
Again, stupid stat because of the large indigenous population who eat "meat" but its highly processed and very bad for you.

Can you actually give me a good reason for not eating shit, apart from taste?

>>681137871
But have you tried them?? Or are you just guessing that they do...

>>681138033
Yes, tried lots of them including expensive and cheap ones. My step mum is vegatarian so when i ;lived at home they were always in the fridge, only once did i eat something that was non meat that i didnt realise, after years of her trying to "trick" me

>>681137988
Lol im from australia, and see first hand what meat eating is doing to the country. Aborigines dont even account for 10% of the population. It doesnt matter what kind of meat it is. It will still give you heart disease.

>>681138215
So go raw vegan. You get to eat lots of sweet fruits and veges and shit. Its awesome

>>681138031
It will make you extremely sick

>>681138251
Its the processed meat that is the problem, not meat. And Australia consumes and exports very large amounts of the stuff. More than pretty much any other country.

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>>681131649
because its gay, and why the fuck would anyone want to be deprived of the sweetness of meat?!

>>681138320
I am an animal that has evolved to require meat in my diet, why would i deny myself of that.

>>681138429
Large amounts of minerals, not really sure what it has to do with this. Live exports are actually a debate in Australia atm

>>681138447
Because fruit is sweeter.

>>681138539
I said large amounts of processed meat...

The sole reason Tongans are all fat as fuck and dead before 30 is because Australia exports all the shit that they cant sell in Australia over there. PLEASE DO SOME RESEARCH. Why do i always have to be the guy who knows the actual information

>>681137423
>>681137551
Still no response, OP. I'll take that as a silent admission of surrender on your part.

>>681137423
I couldn't agree more with you. I'm not a vegetarian, but I do source and hunt my meat carefully. It doesn't have to be an unethical process, and besides, hunting for sustenance can feel quite noble.

>>681138688
Still not sure how you showed that non processed meat is healthy.

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>>681138569
Gonna eat my FULL OF MEAT lunch now.

>>681138738
Oh sorry. The problem with that option is that the earth can not support 7 billion people hunting wild animals, over fishing is already a huge problem, can you imagine if every person in the US went out and killed wild animals for food instead of factory farmed food? Animals would die out very quickly. Free range farming is also not an option, feeding every meat eater in the US with free range meat would require a pasture land larger in area than the US itself.

>>681138745
>>681139006

>>681138957
Good one, never heard that before. Thanks for contributing nothing to the conversation, please leave now.

>>681138746
Well it is required more than healthy... eating only meat is obviously bad for you, eating meat in your diet is smart.

I dont know how many studies i could link or explain to you before you accepted it. If you choose to not eat meat because you think the animal conditions are bad i respect that, if your doing it because you think we dont need meat well again, arguably with supplements your right. Although i still would say that if you live well and keep fit, having meat in your diet would be better than not having it. Comparing all vegans to all meat eaters is so fuckign stupid. Because so many of the vegans or vegetarians also care about their life style. And so many people eaters also eat processed meat, if you compared 2 identical people both eating essentially the same and keeping fit but one had meat and the other didnt, i would say the meat eater would be healthier. And studies have shown that if you did this over generations. It would not take long before the meat eating family would easily pass the non meat eaters, due to the side affects of long term generational vegan-ism/vegetarianism. Increasing risk of cancer and other things. Because the DNA changes so your body can get more out of the fruit and veg you put into it.

>>681138745
If i could i would also hunt and kill my own meat. I agree that is the best way. Not an option for everyone though.

>>681131858
>>681136016
People notice when you order a vegan dish. Just that act is being preachy, whether you want it to be or not.
If you want to be a likeable person, stay in the closet. Order meat just to fit in. Do whatever you want at home, but don't let us know.

I don't mind faggots, as long as they have a wife and kids, and I have no way of knowing about their degenerate fetish.

>>681131649
Dietitian here, you're fine to eat meat just not the amount we tend to in Murica'. Ethics or a digestive disorder are the only reasons to not eat meat.

>>681139132
You dont need any supplements on a vegan diet. Every meat eater turned vegan ive ever met has been healthier without changing anything other than their diet. Meat eating has been shown to increase cancer risk, as vegan blood is 8x better at fighting cancer cells. Could you link me some studies showing the side affects of veganism? Not being a dick actually asking

>>681139354
Can i get your opinion on a ketogenic diet, thinking of switching to it as i have some clear issues with my digestive system.

>>681139006
You apparently missed the "sustainable" part. No, people couldn't eat cow with every meal sustainably with 7 billion people on the planet. But it's entirely possible for people to eat mealworm, ants, locusts, snails, and plenty of other animal-based protein sources on a regular basis while having the occasional piece of sustainably-hunted venison.

Like I said, you're part of the problem. We live unsustainably because we think of ourselves as somehow apart from the system of checks and balances which keeps our ecosystem healthy.

>>681139403
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/03/29/long-term-vegetarian-diet-changes-human-dna-raising-risk-of-canc/

>>681139354
What about the fact that vegan blood kills cancer cells 8x quicker than non vegan blood?

>>681139006
True. I would agree that we should eat less meat and use the majority of agricultural land to cultivate things like soy and what have you, but it doesn't invalidate the hunting and ethical sourcing. Sometimes I feel like vegans think everyone's eating 16oz steaks for every meal and nothing else.

>>681139354
Dietetics is literally a religion. Don't kid yourself.

>>681139403
Everything can be shown to increase cancer risk pretty much. Processed meat is bad for you we know this, just eating meat is not increasing your risk of cancer. Aslong as you dont do it in excess. It is required in our diet, if we all stopped eating meat tomorrow within a few generqations would would devloped >>681139488
because our bodies need meat. or atleast fish.

>>681139439
What? You do realise that we already grow enough plant based food to easily sustain 10 billion people? Can you explain the second part of your statement a little further please?

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>>681131649
Because I'm a fucking lion. I don't eat veggies

>>681139551
I have never seen the study saying this but i feel safe saying its most likely bullshit. Small sample size, stupid samples etc etc etc. Ice cream sales also increase with shootings. So i guess we should just ban ice cream to save lives?

>>681139735
I think he means we waste far too much, we could easily feed the whole world true. But actually doing that is a very very long way off.

And by waste i mean more than just wasting food. We are lazy and stupid with nearly everything we have.

>>681139682
>it is required in our diet,
Every major health organisation disagrees with you on that. Including the USDH, the aus department of health and the world health organization.

>>681139746
Thats fine, lions dont get heart disease from eating meat

ITT: a balanced diet is inconceivable

>>681139954
Not true at all. Any diet chart given out by any fucking W.H.O pretty much always shows meat/fish as a requirement for a healthy balanced diet.

>>681139827
Found the study in two seconds:
http://ornishspectrum.com/wp-content/uploads/Intensive_Lifestyle_Changes_and_Prostate_Cancer.pdf

>>681140021
They probably would get it all more if they ate as much processed meat as we do. But to vegans meat is meat, be it a fresh cut veal steak or a hotdog made from god knows what.

>>681139735
The entire reason our ecosphere is collapsing around us is because we live unsustainably. And we live unsustainably because we think of ourselves as apart from nature. When people stopped having to kill their own animals and raise their own crops and chop down their own wood and construct their own dams and trap their own furs and so forth, they no longer witnessed the repercussions of their actions. When you walk into a store and put money down on the counter for a cellphone, you don't see the mile after mile of landscape transformed into the surface of the Moon in China in order to get at the rare earth metals which were used to make it. People would be much less likely to toss an old cellphone in the trash every year and buy a new one if they were forced to walk past the blasted Moonscape caused by the extraction of those metals.

By preaching veganism, you are making things *worse*. You're encouraging people to think of themselves as a special case separate from the natural world of eat-and-be-eaten.

Cost. Health. Those are my big two

>>681140066
"Households should select predominantly plant-based diets rich in a variety of vegetables and fruits, pulses or legumes, and minimally processed starchy staple foods."
Says who?
Say experts from the World Health Organization and the Food & Agriculture Organization of the United Nations, in a landmark report.

>>681139954

"Major health organisations" are talk bollocks and push for corporate lobbies.

Example: Until relatively recently sunflower oil was used to lubricate machinery, but then it was replaced with crude oil. This left huge crops of sunflowers with nothing for them to be used for - the solution? Flora and other sunflower products that are "healthier" than butter because they attack "bad cholesterol".

Total bullshit, but what everyone was selling up until very recently.

>>681140135
> A total of 93 volunteers

Thats when i stopped reading. Not even close to being a big enough sample to make those claims people made in this thread. Also we have no idea what kind of meat the people eating meat were eating, was it good fresh meat, or was it processed shit from mcdonalds. This is what i mean buy stupid stats.

>>681140332
I didnt say you should eat mostly meat did i? No i didnt. And they didnt say you dont need meat. Its just a part of your diet. Im not going to explain why meat is good for you when it has been explained 1000 times above. If you want to be retarded thats on you.

>>681140222
lol okay whats your idea of sustainable then?

>>681140306
Fruit and vegetables are the cheapest food items in the supermarket dude.

>>681140489
They didnt mention meat retard. That generally means dont select it.

>>681140617
Yeh they are also perishable. And you are retarded. Anyone who thinks it would be cheaper to not eat meat is stupid. The cheapest diet is processed food. Frozen shit. Which is bad for you. Then the vegans jump on and say "SEE SEE LOOK AT ALL THOSE FAT DEAD PEOPLE, MEAT KILLS" When the real issue is that poor people cant afford good food, eat processed shit and its bad for you.

>>681140771
They didnt mention anything but fruit and veg. Do you seriously think that all we need is fruit and veg, nothing else??? Your seriously retarded. Im wasting my time with you people. Your are religious fanatics just with a different bullshit to follow.

>>681140361
The meat industry is the most heavily government subsidized industry out there. Why? because its profitable to exploit animals. The world has been fooled by the most successful advertising campaign industry into thinking meat is healthy and necessary

>>681140987
HAHAHAHAHAHA HOLY FUCKING SHIT. How do you live your life being so fucking stupid.

Thousands of years humans have been eating meat, but yeh. It was just an advertising campaign? And i love how you said exploit animals. fucking wow. I heard people like you exsisted but i didnt think it was true.

Those animals would never have been born if we were not eating thm. Please fucking do the gene pool a favour and castrate yourself.

>>681140789
Have you ever been to a farmers market? You can get good whole foods for cheap as.

>>681137423
Okay, I'll bite. Not a vegan but I do see why your reasoning is not good enough. I don't understand why everyone in this thread can't get why a vegan might see the killing of an animal as not worth it for the taste of meat.

You can kill an animal as nicely as you want but you are still denying it of all the pleasure it could have felt later on in its life.

I see no inherent difference in the death of an animal and the death of a human beyond our biological connection to other humans that is instilled from birth but I don't see that as relevant from an ethical perspective.

As for your stuff about contempt for the ecosystem and our separation from nature - the point is that there is no survival need for us to eat meat. That is not the case for animals so they should be allowed to kill each other.

I really enjoy the suffering I cause when I eat meat. It seems the more the animal suffers the better it tastes. Veal is fucking incredible.

Nah m8 I can't, go your own way

>>681140987
Also just a side note the main reason its so heavily susidized is because we have laws in our countries meaning we have to atleast keep animals in "slightly humane" conditions. So to keep up wuth the low cost of meat being sold from countires without such laws. The government must subsidise it. It has nothing to do with your fucking stupid conspiracy theory. Again this is another thing you could have found out on your own without me telling you. But again you did 0 research and just talk absolute shit.

Seriously my opinion of the whole human population is being diminished recently. You really are so fucking retarded.

>>681141117
You honestly think 1000 years ago everyone ate meat? It was actually only wealthy people who ate it, and was seen as a luxury. Never have we ate it on the scale we have now. And what was their life expectancy? 40-50?

>>681131649
>Humans are natural omnivores
>Eating complete proteins are healthier for you
>It is almost impossible to get some important nutrients with a vegan diet
>90% of vegans are douchebags

>>681133496
I sure learned alot of new things about boats there

>>681141233
Yes, i have access to that kind of thing. Not everyone does. I also grow allot of my own fruit and veg because i think its important to do that. If i had space i would have some more animals to eat, i only have chickens for eggs at the moment.

Because humans are meant to and designed to eat some meat. It's in our biology. From our nutritional requirements, to our functionless appendix, our teeth, our eyes, etc. We are natural omni's.

>>681141375
lel at the more complete protein. You know thats bullshit? The amount of protein it says on packaging for any food is talking about complete protein. You can get the complete amino acid profile easily on a vegan diet. What nutrients are you talking about btw

>>681141369
I think everyone wanted to eat meat as and when they could. It was never the main part of a diet, but it was always and always will be part of the diet.

The life expectancy wasn't from the diet really, it was from the terrible medical care and just lack of hygiene causing allot more diseases to spread.

>>681141543
this.

>>681141543
http://static1.squarespace.com/static/531ef4b9e4b069e27c30957e/t/5324b2bbe4b03d5774a67306/1394913979729/


nope nope nope

>>681141678
This
>>681141696

>>681141696
Im not even looking at another retarded link. Learn how to look at stats. We need meat its a fucking fact we have evolved this way, if you want to follow the trend go ahead. But dont pretend its for any other reason than you want to follow the trend.

>>681141367
still confused on how thats an argument against veganism. How am i stupid?

The majority of the posters here will just spout bullshit and nonsense which has been debunked millions of times already.

Take >>681141117
for example, by their logic child slavery would be okay.

>>681141822
What stats m8. What proof. Of course you're going to avoid my evidence.

>>681141909
yup

>>681141558
i can't name them all of the top of my head, but 2 seconds off google can show you pretty easily.
from what i can remember: Vitamins B12 and D3, Creatine, Carnosine

And no, complete proteins are a real thing. You can find certain plant combinations that can get you all 21 amino acids, but it's much, much easier and more natural to just eat fucking meat.

>>681131649
Meat

>>681141808
Oh lol its that, i looked at it.

Ok again i have to explain why your retarded. We are not a typical animal anymore, due to our advanced evolution we no longer need any of the usual things.

Our teeth are the way they are because of how we eat not what we eat. There is a commonly accepted theory that we will lose our canines because we use knives when we eat. So we dont even need to be able to tear food anymore.

Honestly i dont know why im still here. You are just like i said above, religious fanatics who spout bullshit and even given facts deny the truth.

Like our nails for example, if you actually use that as a reason to not eat meat your literally retarded. Our hands are the way they are so we can make things like tools for hunting and make shelter etc. Nothing to do with eating or not eating meat. We are if anything the perfect predator. So if you want to go based on what a human as an animal can do to other animals. We should just eat everything, meat, veg etc. As we do. Because we have one thing few other animals actually have. Intelligence. Why do you need claws when you can build a bow and shoot you prey? Why do you need a large open in your mouth when you can easily kill and then carve your meat, unlike say a bear which will eat an animal alive. Or a lion say, which will also on occasional eat an animal alive. So it needs to be able to rip away meat. We dont need this so we dont have it.

It is also commonly believed we will lose our 5th toe, because we now wear shoes pretty much all over the world it isnt used anymore and most peoples little toe is turned in or at some strange angle as it was never used and pretty much just grew into the space of your shoe.

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>>681131858

>>681141901
Your stupid if you think the meat industry is subsidised because of some conspiracy to make money and make is all eat this thing that is bad for us. Its just not true at all.

>>681141909
lol by my logic child slavery would be ok? So a child is worth the same as a chicken? I have a child. And she is worth much more than a chickens life. Because she is intelligent, the same reason you dont cry when you see a chicken eating grass, because the chicken is higher up the chain of intelligence than the plant, both living things.

>>681141696

>no omnivores chew
>all omnivores have sharp claws

What the fuck is this shit? That is just no true.

>>681142225
B12 you can get from soy. We naturally got it from water until we started chlorinated it.

D3 you get from the sun and from mushrooms

Creatine and carnitine are all produced by your body. Every soy product, legume and collard green have the complete set of amino acids.

>>681131649
I'm extremely active and I don't have the time to constantly be thinking about my next meal. You lazy Fuck.

>>681142443
Our hands are designed for grabbing fruits and branches like any other primate.

>>681142664
What that is, is an example of a religious fanatic, just instead of choosing religion he choose vegan-ism. Same end result of a stupid cunt who spouts utter nonsense and even when given facts to show he is wrong will not change his beliefs.

>>681142760
Kek, 99% of vegans are very active people.

>>681142849
Our hands are designed for much much much much much more than grabbing fucking fruit. Your a dumb cunt.