there is no ban on guns at the moment and 50 people died. Why didn't anyone shoot the guy who killed 50 people? Why didn't 50 people who had the right to carry guns protect themselves?

>>689523702
That bomb is good for one use and will be effective over a fairly small range. And if you think you can kill nearly as many people with a bow as you can a gun in the same period, you've never shot either.

>>689523702
Fuck banning guns.

The cartoon that you posted actually hits the nail on the head.
It is not about availability, it is about demand.

Banning them will do nothing if people still want them. If they are wanted, they will be acquired.


The problem is that so many people want a gun.
Stop people from wanting to shoot each other and you will solve gun crime.


Same thing in our country, too. If you want one, you can get one. But through decades of education and having a rather reasonable populous in general, the demand for tools to kill with will never be present.

So, sort your shit out, United States. You can keep the guns, just do something about all the fucking idiots.

>>689523702
>shot a gun
Nope, never shot a gun, fired a couple tho.
166 mass shootings from 2000 to 2014, 133 of them in the USA. The problem is a combination of people having access to really high powered weapons everywhere and the culture of vengefulness and anger.
There's no solution, the USA has been degrading into a place where this is normal for years now.
I remember the dismay when it was reported a 2 year old got shot in the head in crossfire during a gun fight in LA. That was in 1992, it was all over before most of you were born.

>>689524667
You seriously think Aussies just 'don't want guns'?

>>689524963
Nope. Not an access issue. You could give guns away in some countries and have no change in gun related deaths.

The problem is not guns, it is your society.
Sort that out.

Those 50 people didn't have guns, because they were in a club. You are not allowed to conceal carry in a club.

>>689524129
It was a gun free zone dipshit

>>689525028
What the hell do Aussies have to do with it?
However, some might, but only a small (and often vocal) proportion. The population in general does not or there would be loads of illegally armed Aussies roaming the outback with shitty zipguns or other easily available illegal firearms.

>>689525414
Now imagine if whole USA was a "Gun free zone"

The current problem the US has with guns is the sheer amount of them and how easily a mentally unstable person can get their hands on one.
A ban would not be a good solution anymore. It would only spark massive black markets.

Imagine if there never were guns in the US, the situation would be quite different.

>>689525486
Do you not get that tgevpeople buying guns for $200-$1000 wouldn't be able to afford their inflated black market pricing? Okay fine, the extremely wealthy and certain organized crime syndicates sure. But the average dipshit shooter won't be shooting up anything if the gun he needs costs $35,000 or higher and black market involvement.

>>689524963
Weird that prior to 2000 we only had one or two mass shootings per year

Weird that mass shootings and media coverage of them seem to align with politician agenda

Weird that Hitler had trouble rising to power but by burning down the capital building he was able to scare the masses into thinking that a totalitarian state was the "safest" option

>>689525924
I can build a gun out of pipes, a $20 drill and some ammo, take away my machined ammo and I can still build a blunderbuss. I would, too.
Making them more expensive just makes them more dangerous in general.

>>689526195
Finally, a niggah with some fucking sense. My thoughts exactly.

>>689525493
People would be getting wounded much more often. The rate of gun crime goes down and other crime rises to compensate.

>>689525924
No, I could build a fairly effective weapon for far less than that.
But I don't need a gun, so I don't.


Just saying that it is an option that is pretty much ignored by most people, because they don't want or need one.


The point is that it is a mindset thing. America needs to sort out its society to stop the killings, not just ban guns.

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>>689526195
>prior to 2000 we only had one or two mass shootings per year
Except that's not even remotely true

Policy should be evidence based. In Australia following a mass shooting of 35 people, tough gun control laws were brought in. You can still have firearms if you are a member of a sporting shooters association, or a farmer. But you can't have automatic or semi-automatic weapons.

Another side to it is that greater equality of societies correlates with lower rates of violent crime. Australia is a more equal society with universal healthcare, free education and a robust social security safety net. Care for the mentally ill is important.

Less marginalisation of minorities is a factor. Australia has a partially government funded broadcasting network called the Special Broadcasting Service which broadcasts TV and radio programs in many different languages. It's really only in small, backward communities where racism is commonplace.

>>689523702
How about simply because it works very well for the rest of the developed world that has done it. And no, I am not interested in your really badly manipulated statistics on your infographic made by the NRA. Guns make it a whole lot easier to kill people, accidentally on purpose, whatever. They are machines of death. That is literally what they are for. Killing.

>>689527252
Yeah. They're made for killing. They're made for killing people who want to take away your rights. Such as criminals, and politicians. And anti-gun advocates.
Our constitution isn't like the rest of the world. It doesn't grant rights, it recognizes the rights we grant ourselves, using our guns. Rights don't come from ink on paper, they come from blood and bullets.
You can't take our guns, because you can't take our rights, because we say you can't, with our guns.

>>689527694
jesus christ you are a moron

>>689526828
Not an automatic one. You aint building that.

>>689527694
I'm all for guns in a well regulated militia so that we can protect ourselves from our government. Thats all the consitution protects fyi

>>689527694
I didn't realise all those primary school kids at Sandy Hook, or the High School kids at Colombine were trying to take your rights away....

>>689528057
You also didn't realize that the top of someone else's car was a bad driver's intended destination.

>>689523702
People who think banning the guns won't help the shooting problem going down are litereally retarded.

I think the 2nd amendment is moot. Even if American gun owners did organise themselves into militia, they could not withstand the force of their own military which is under the control of the government.

The "we need our guns to protect ourselves from despotic government" argument doesn't hold water.

If the American people aren't yet convinced that their government is despotic, they do not deserve guns or any other "rights" beyond the rights of the child.

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>>689527859
*cough* Bottle Opener *cough*

>>689528192
You are literally spewing shit out of your mouth

Or keyboard as it were.

>>689527859
Actually for someone with machining experience it wouldn't be hard. There are many simple designs that would be easy to copy. The Sten series look like trade school plumbing projects and were effective sub machine guns. The MAC 10 and 11 are also simple designs.

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>amerifats defending MUH RITES MUH GUNS
>implying you need an assault rifle for defence
>mfw america is a melting pot of liberal pussies and autistic weaboo internet republicans who can't agree to set reasonable concealed carry laws for defence and ban sale of automatic rifles.

>being this fat

>>689528445
Look at Detroit, Chicago, Baltimore, DC, CA. All liberal controlled for decades with strict gun laws and absolutely no decreases in gun violence because criminals don't follow laws, remember?

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>>689528785
>being this mad

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>>689528945

>>689528785
>assault rifle
define
>sale of automatic rifles banned
It's actually not banned, but okay. Just the production of new machine guns is banned, even then not really.

>>689528836
>black people don't follow laws
FTFY

>Guns everywhere
>Literally in your face 24/7
>You have one, your dad has one, your 12-year old nephew has one and shoots it out back
>People in unsafe areas always carry a gun, because the other guys also have them
>a fight starts, someone gets pissed beyond control
>MY OH GEE I WONDER WHAT WILL HAPPEN

>11 000 murders later
>GUNS ARE FOR OUR SAFETY

>>689529118
Do you not know what an assault rifle is, no?

>>sale of automatic rifles banned. It's actually not banned, but okay.

Nigger where are you going with this.

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>>689526698
Got a source on that statistic? Besides a bull's asshole?

>>689529270
>tfw a country of 320 million people with 280 million guns only has 11,000 deaths

There is no problem here, learn math you nigger.

>>689523702
How about you don't fucking ban guns, but you at least restrict them to a certain degree?
Why is it legal for a nine-year old to shoot fucking automatic weapons?
Why do people need military-grade weapons?
Go have a handgun for self defense, go have a shotgun for home defense, go have a bolt action hunting rifle.
But isn't that more than enough?

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>>689523702
>Look how well everyone except criminals not having guns worked for the Florida NightClub in Orlando!
Faggots literally defending this.

>>689523702
In germany we had some right-wing terrorist group called "NSU" the last years, the reason why they werent able to do more harm than killing a couple of sandniggers was, because its not easy to get a gun in germany, whats so complicated to understand? They actually killed a policeofficer with his own gun in order to steal it, for that sole reason.
What i am trying to say here is :no guns or restricted distribution----> little possibility of acquiring one.
Whoever thinks you go to the dealer at the corner and get a gun watched too many action movies.
I see why people think illogically about things that became part of the identity, for example in germany we have no speedlimit on some highways, which is literally impossible to justify.
Its the same on a smaller scale, lower speed=less deaths in traffic, less guns available=less deaths by guns.
People tend to defend their culture, but its no real use arguing about these things if someone isnt even willing to accept simple logic or look at some stats.
The fact that someone thinks, theres nothing wrong with being able to acquire assaultrifles or semiautomatics easily, baffles me.
If you have a bad day in another 1st world country you maybe stab someone or beat someone up, in the US you can literally get an assoult rifle and do a massshooting

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>>689527997
Lrn2grammar. The 2nd amendment protects the people's rights, not the militia's.

>>689529727
Stop it, buddy.
You are making way too much sense for people to listen.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rR9IaXH1M0

>it's simply too late
>we been giving anonset guns hand over fist 200 years
>cain't go back now.

>>689529727
Agreed. 0 point in someone being able to own a weapon that can hose an entire room of people down in seconds.

>shotguns+pistols = home defence
>pistols = concealed carry


Get your shit together yanks.

>>689529953
Matze, hör auf.

>>689529727
You clearly have no understanding of how the black market works. According to your logic, what happened in Paris was impossible since it's a gun free country.

>>689528057
>Sandy Hook
Fake.
>Columbine
They were taking away the kids basic human rights so it was a give in they would retaliate

>>689529445
Assault rifle is just a scary name that the liberals and media gives rifles to make them sound big and scary so they can push their anti-gun agenda.

>>689530181
Neither of your unproven points refutes mine though.

Seriously, all that ever happens is people refute points with evidence and you people go off on another misdirection

>>689530178
That completely depends on the buyers agenda, connections and the amount of capital he has.

>>689525281

That depends on the state, we can in MN just not if you are drinking. I doubt anyone in there had a concealed carry permit, most gays I know are firmly on the liberal no gun side.

>>689530331
Were you born this retarded or did something happen in your early life?

>>689530178
>impossible = unlikely
That's not what he said.
It's about statistics, not whether it's completely infeasible.
This is why there's some mass shooting every other weekend in America and something like Charlie Hebdo is a thing that happens once every 20 years.

>>689523702
I am ex army, in the UK, so I have shot a fair few weapons. The statistics are clear - fewer guns, fewer shootings. In the Uk we have very strict gun control, and no cases of toddlers killing themselves or their friends or parents. very few suicides, very few domestic murders, very few murders at all. very few killings during robberies or other crimes. no road rage shootings (althought he odd beating up) no mass shootings, thankfully, for decades. We might have one in the future, sure. a determined terrorist may do it. But that is always the case. We used to have bombings - IRA that sort of thing, but they were also rare. Determined bad guys will kill people - but you do not have to make it easy. You have flooded your country with army grade weapons - I do not know how you will ever get it clean again - it was a short sighted money grabbing opportunity combned with a short sighted Republican political move - promote fear adn distrust of the government. bad can of worms to open. but a gun ban is the only way you will ever get a civilised country back . American now is third world in terms of civil society, civil rights and health care - you guys need to do something.

>>689529270
word.

>>689523702
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rR9IaXH1M0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a9UFyNy-rw4

>>689529566
I would normally say UK violent crime, but the common response is that they judge violent crime differently.
Australia had a similar increase in home invasions following their gun control laws.
I could find charts, but i'm lazy. It's not even really a question of how much crime, it's a matter of the quality of crime that your nation deals with. I'd just rather have more dead from guns and a government that lays off my dick, than beat up people and an overly oppressive government. Guns don't kill people, people kill people.

>>689530178
i understand the difference between "impossible" and "more difficult to accomplish" is completely negligable when you are trying to make your point.
Is it possible for terrorists backed by a terrorist organisation in the middle of a war to bring assaultrifles to europe? - obviously
Is it possible for a right wing terroristgroup with strong connections to the underworld to acquire a handgun in europe? - obviously, but only after killing a german policeofficer, which clearly was not their targeted group of victims.
Is it possible for any random angry cunt to kill 50 people? only with excessive planning and months of organisation,bombbuilding etc

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>>689529727
i agree

americans have the weird ideology that they automatically become rambo if they have a gun, and that it would have gone differently if they had a gun

the reality is no one needs an assault rifle >>but it's ma constitutional right to bear arms

this is were america has gone wrong for years

if you weren't a warmongering nation that made guns, assault rifles and other deadly shit you wouldn't be such a bad bunch of lads

but of-cause you need to make and sell weapons to make a living, so you'll never have peace, even if you turned on religion

>>689523702
so, you mean, completely ignoring the overwhelming amount of evidence that in countries with gun restriction the amount of deaths, violent crimes and shootings are negligible in comparison to US? Well, if we're going to throw facts out of the window to be able to spout our opinions as truth, the reason why banning guns is a good idea is definitely because you are an illiterate moron.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCTrZJrLbsoN171bMFQKN5Xw

I love watching this guys vids because it reminds me how lucky I am to not have to live in the same country as these dumbass Americans.

>>689530178
Countries laws are only as strong as their weakest link. the EU with its open borders and US with each state having different laws allow people to get shit through the border. When the entire continent has banned weapons of war not just hunting/defence you just don't get massacres on anywhere near the same scale if at all. The last terrorist we had in Australia only had a shotgun and simply couldn't have ever killed 50 people.

I understand you guys want to keep your toys but you keep crying and praying for victims every time this shit happens then do absolutely nothing to fix it. Usually the smoke hasn't cleared the gun barrel before 'muricans are defending their guns.

>>689529614
your face when a country of 70 million people has two gun deaths a year. so multiply that up - if you have the maths skills - and get just about nine people per 320 million. That is the typical death rate for 320 million people in a civilised country. Your 11,000 deaths a year is a staggering figure, an uncivilised figure, a tragic and terrible figure. Your attitude to it is inhuman, and morally bankrupt. please shoot yourself with one of your stupid guns.

>>689529693
Florida has 2nd amendment rights, and concealed carry - that worked out well didn't it?

>>689530491
According to some ex-army cuck. OK, we third world now.

Don't leave the EU, faggot. Your country is a joke among the rest of the free world, Bin that Opinion.

>>689532411
Can't legally carry in a bar. Learn the local law before you make yourself look like a fool online.

>>689523702
Honestly I don't know anyone who wants an outright ban on guns. Even my most liberal friends just want them to be regulated more. I mean, you have to admit, it's pretty fucked up that a suspected terrorist was able to get those guns so easily.

>>689530181
Sandy hook was not a fake - you are either a troll or a conspiracy nut - either way, please kill yourself, preferably with your gun. Sandyhook was a real shooting - kids died. to make fun of it or deny it is less than human. it is base, it is unworthy, it is wrong. you are scum, and should be ashamed.

>>689524667
Severely punishing crimes committed with guns would do a lot. Courts are way, way too lenient on violent criminals. They need to be locked up and kept there. Add an additional 10 year sentence in addition to normal sentence for using a gun in commission of a felony. Problem solved. Just clear out all the non-violent weed inmates to make room. We're locking up the wrong ones!

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>>689525028
>

>>689525414
If it's a fun free zone how did he get one in? Was it a magic gun?

>>689532694
In NC you can legally carry in a bar out that serves alcohol, but you cannot be drinking. Learn to law faggot.

>>689532802
>regulated more
gee sounds a lot like infringement

>>689523702
no one ever talks about banning guns except people who don't want gun legislation when they're talking in opposition to gun legislation. We have toooooo many guns for anyone to reasonably take. Everyone feels it should be possible to own a gun.

>>689523702
Only extremists want to ban guns. Common sense gun laws are what Clinton is proposing. Bans on army rifles. Waiting periods for all purchases and background checks. No sales to felons, people flagged as risks.

IF THEY SAY "BAN GUNS," THEY ARE OUTSIDE THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY MAINNSTREAM!

Precisely zero politicians have mentioned banning guns in America. Not happening. It is largely a right wing myth, aided by a few far left extremists. The same people who want to outlaw being a white male. It's a joke.

Common sense gun laws is what we are actually trying to discuss.

>>689533257
Or more like common sense. A fucking suspected terrorist was able to purchase firearms. Legally. With no problem. Common fucking sense dude.

>>689525493
same thing with any gun free zone, guns get in and more people die

>>689532596
Cuck? you calling me a cuck? Faggot? Our country could still nuke yours intothe stone age, but we are better civilised than that. Our country is the fifth largest economy int he world, with a fifth of your population and a twentieth of your land mass and natural resources. Our country is still in the forefront of human rights, science and technology, while your country is despised across the world as a human rights abuser, a warmonger, a theocratic imperialist insane asylum. I served in Afghanistan and saw your countrymen - some fine soldiers, but many so fucked up with jingism and with so little culture, so little appreciation that American does not mean right. Don't leave the USA, child, your country is a bad joke, a disgrace, in the rest of the world. Your country trades in war and death and disruption - it is no wonder that it is hated by most and despaired of by the rest.

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>>689533317
Clinton is a nigger!!!!!

>>689532694
ok, so what you are saying is that we should be allowed to carry in bars, so we can have everyone there to shoot bad guys incase it happens again? Great idea - guns and alcohol, and paranoia.

>>689524129
club was "gun free"

>>689533417
tell me then, what is the solution to this, and one that doesn't infringe on the rights of citizens.

>>689524667
They can't fix stupid. That's a far bigger problem than their guns. As hard as disarming the US might seem it would be much easier than fixing their huge class, health, aggression and education problems. Just a couple days ago a guy escaped from a mental hospital here and was in a shopping mall threatening people with a knife. Cops rocked up and shot him. GG. In the US he probably could have got a gun and killed some people.

>>689523702
irst of all its fucking difficult to make a functioning bomb. there's a reason why terrorist groups use experts for this and not just anyone.

and maybe look at Australia, they banned guns because shooting. things are pretty solid now.

Gun control is too control people not violence. Mao Adolf and uncle Joe all took guns before mass genocide

>>689525814
>Imagine if there never were guns in the US
then we would still be the UK dumbass

>>689527142
sauce?

>>689533417
someone suspected by the fbi of being a criminal is running for president. can't make this up man

>>689528763
> Fucking American education system/culture and "literally"
Opinion discarded.

>>689533749
>>689525414
>>689525281

I'll take "what is a soft target for $500".

When you can have assault rifles legally right outside a "gun free zone" it's only going to keep out the law abiding citizens.

People won't attack gun conventions and trump rallies because theres 100 rambo's just waiting for the excuse. They attack schools, churches, clubs anywhere they can do the most damage.

The US's horrible health system and wage disparity means theres so many people out there broke or mentally Ill with nothing to lose then they get a facebook message from an Isis recruiter and get a reason to live.

>>689534162
http://nymag.com/scienceofus/2014/06/mass-shootings-arent-on-the-rise.html

>>689534639
Congratules

>>689534118
And things would probably be much better for you. Canada and Australia are still "UK" and have vastly better quality of life and happiness ratings.

>>689529184
Liberals are the real racists.

>>689529742
You can prove anything by shitty analogy, you mong

>>689529566
look up the Australian transitions stats in "type of crime" over time.

>>689534802
Sauce confirmed. I would have preferred the straight up stats, but something at least linking to them is decent.

>>689534492
>"Fucking American education"

No man Nicky M and Kardashians are teaching the leaders of tomorrow!

>>689523702
Just look at the fucking stats

>>689535002
The worst shit we have here now are one punch killings where douche bags get drunk and king hit someone from behind. I'll take that over 50 murders by one person any day.

>>689530181
> believing anyone could orchestrate such an enormous & intricate faux-shooting event & keep it secret across every news channel & the literal hundreds of people who would know about it when the most powerful nation on earth had their most secretive & powerful domestic & foreign spying program run by the most secretive & powerful spy agency blown wide open by a single guy with a usb stick

Kek. KYS, conspiratard. Paint your ceiling with the brains you obviously turn off every time anyone mentions "gun." Leave a note to Alex Jones.

>>689528467
>If the American people aren't yet convinced that their government is despotic...

Well here's the thing: The government is the the people. That's what democracy is all about. So the only logical conclusion must be that the americans think themselves of despots and possibly totalitarian. And completely nuts. And I agree with that.

You can't ban guns in america anymore. It's too late. They've been going into the wrong direction for 40 years or so now. Their society and culture is beyond fucked up in that regard and it will take a lot of work to bring it back, if it's even possible at all.

It's a society thing. America is a tough and unforgiving place to live if the chips don't fall your way. Like if you're born black, or poor. And you have a government that is so compromised by interest groups who squeeze the working and middle classes to the brink so that they cannot survive without taking second or third jobs. People are stressed. They get angry and desperate and are pushed to the limit and react. Guns are available and single shootings are common. We all give Canadians shit because they're considered too nice. But maybe there's something in that. Although gun ownership is high per capita (the US has 90 guns per 100 people. Canada has 31 guns per 100) the rate of gun homicides is proportionately high in the US. In 2011 11,000 in the US compared with 158 in Canada. How out of whack is that? But also consider this: nearly all of the MASS shootings in the last 30 years have been caused by angry or disturbed white males. Only one has been by a woman. Solution: either chill the fuck out and smoke more weed, move to just about any other country in the western world, or use your vote to oust your current, corrupted leaders. Americans are understanding that last choice. This is why Sanders and Trump have done so well.

>>689533417
So we should be able to deny certain people rights based on arbitrary lists that the government makes. Yeah that sounds like a grand idea. >>689534013

>>689534013
>it's fucking difficult to make a functioning bomb

It's really.. Not.

>>689523702
>no one have guns.
>no one Will shoot you.
>no need to own one.

Kick ass with a baseball bat instead. Hurts more. Injury lasts longer.

>>689536548
If that list is of people who are likely to murder people .... fuck yes deny the shit out of them. What is the point of the FBI if it can't investigate dangerous people and say "hey maybe we should stop this psycho guy fucking everyone over"

You faggots will never learn. Your world is black and white when it comes to politics. You will never move on as a society unless you take the middle way.

You are just like your 200 something years old document that's worth shit in modern society. Once you're done being pretentious cunts and twelve year olds we can gather here again. Until then call each other faggot based on who they are voting for instead of listening to facts.

>>689526195
>hitler
You can't compare that with gun laws.

>>689536917
>Not stating any facts
Nice job remaining neutral with that bait to try and cause people to flame each other.

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>>689523702
Americans!!! Dont let them take your guns from you.

They logic is crippled.
When somebody says its a muslim problem LIBTURDs say: NO... He was an extremist muslim... not all muslims are like this. Its gun law related issue.

It makes me sooo mad. Not all of the gun owners are willing to do such a thing.

I believe percentage of radical muslims in whole ISLAM world is higher than percentage of psychokillers in american gun owners pool.

>>689526655
>>689527142

>>689533179
50 people didn't die in NC faggot

>>689533726
>>689533179
this is fine

>>689533522
Ageee.

>>689532596
says the country that killed more native american indians

you fuckers should feel the shame of all those poor cunts who died so that you can sell your killing weapons arond the world faggot

>>689523702
Comparing guns to alcohol, youre fucking retarded. That is an awful analogy. Did a twelve year old draw this?

>>689538865
they died so we can shit on their land
the sale of guns is incidental

>>689523702
No one's asking for bans on all firearms, you stupid shit. Pay attention to talking points.

>>689538168
If this was true, the amount of shootings in all Muslim countries would be higher than shootings in America... which is not the case. Check and mate.

>>689534639
I thought you were making sense until the Isis recruiter bit...

>>689524129
shoot him back with what? Their dicks?

I love it, when Americans try to defend their "god given right" to own a firearm/gun/whatever.

Its always a good laugh.

>>689539272
Are you retarded? Extremists are not killing eachother. THat would ve been pointless.

>>689523702
>outright ban

It's a straw man. It's not what gun control advocates really want. Background checks, registration and licensing are the 3 policies that have been shown to significantly reduce gun violence.

50 people died in one day. Wow. More than that die due to manufactures of vehicles in a day around the world. Let's look at the REAL deadly weapons. Assault vehicles! Ban them now!

>>689528785
>automatic rifles
anything automatic is pretty hard to find and you need a shit ton of permits and illegally modifying a gun for automatic can land you in jail for years

>>689538989

It's a valid comparison, oh yee of little brain.

why doesn't the government come up with a compromise and maybe outlaw any firearms above a semi auto 9mm pistol. leave anything higher to police or military. it wont stop shootings all together but it might decrease the casualties. you all know that taking them away would just cause problems because amerifags are just a bunch of fucking babies so instead of making it harder to get a gun why not just limit what they can get?

>>689539720
>god given right to own a killing device
>thou shalt not kill

>>689523702
>Without the bullshit

Nobody except the most regressive liberals believe in an outright ban on guns. Nobody. Not Hillary. Not Obama. Everybody with any common sense has given up on the notion that we will ever outright ban guns.

What most democrats want to do is to expand background checks, have a way to prevent certain individuals (such as in this case) to not be able to purchase guns. Additionally they want to ban certain types of guns (AR being the most widely brought up) and close certain loopholes such as in the case of gun shows.

Honestly, I support 3 of the 4, the only reason I don't fully support AR ban is because they are really not any more deadly then similar guns and the wording is very poor. Many non-AR guns can be easily modified.

Now with that being said, this conversation took place less then two weeks before what happened in Orlando.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlgMOmoGI-A

To sum it up for those that don't want to watch a 1min30sec video....A gunstore owners asks why we can't have common sense gun laws. He says we can't because everytime any type of common sense law comes up for discussion the NRA incites everyone to think its a law to ban guns. Even if its not. Additionally he mentions that there are people on terrorist watch lists he can not prevent from buying guns - he can prevent them from getting on a plane but not buying a gun. We already know that the person in Orlando was being investigated and is likely a person that could have on a ban list for buying guns - again I said COULD, I don't have any dream that he could not have got them in another fashion but babysteps...

>>689541412
Open to interpretation. God commanded Moses to wage war and kill. King David was a warrior. There's a lot of killing in the Bible.

>>689542112
>>689541283

People, don't be dumb. This "ban the guns!" that gun-nuts outcry liberals for saying never came from liberals. It came from the slightly smarter gun-nuts to discredit regulation by making it sound like a totalitarian, extreme and unpractical measure.

>>689530331
>>
The term assault rifle is generally attributed to Adolf Hitler, who for propaganda purposes used the German word "Sturmgewehr" (which translates to "assault rifle"), as the new name for the MP43, subsequently known as the Sturmgewehr 44 or StG 44.[8][12][13][14][15][16] Other sources dispute that Hitler had much to do with coining the new name besides signing the production order.[17] The StG 44 is generally considered the first selective fire military rifle to popularize the assault rifle concept. Today, the term assault rifle is used to define firearms sharing the same basic characteristics as the StG 44.[citation needed]

In a strict definition, a firearm must have at least the following characteristics to be considered an assault rifle:[2][3][4]

It must be an individual weapon
It must be capable of selective fire
It must have an intermediate-power cartridge: more power than a pistol but less than a standard rifle or battle rifle
Its ammunition must be supplied from a detachable box magazine[5]
And it should have an effective range of at least 300 metres (330 yards)

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>>689542112
Nothing anyone has proposed is common sense. Trying to lower round counts and force us to cannibalize our AR's is NOT common sense. It's all based on misplaced blame and fear.

Same with trying to make private sales harder, I live in Idaho, where I could sell a SCAR at a yardsale for $15 if I wanted. Look at that state, third highest gun ownership rate in the u.s., and yet is still in the top 10 for lowest violent crime.

Truth is, the states with looser gun laws are the ones with less crime, we don't need any of the "common sense" bullshit that's designed to slowly chip away at our rights.

>>689538865
It's just Native Americans btw

The bar was a gun free zone, obviously the fact that it was a gun free zone didn't stop the murder

>>689544085
Man, if according to that comic, buying with ease, owning and carrying several fire arms, including some of greater military use are the crumbs left out of a satisfying cake... what was the cake at the beginning? Were you allowed, nay, required to carry several bazookas and machineguns at the same time?

Nevertheless, for the sake of the argument, let's say that guns are not the problem. Then what is? Why does America have a violent shooting like every other week? Note that the eye-rollingly cliche answer of "immigrants!1!!!!1111!" will get you laughed out of the argument as US is not the only nation with a high number of immigrants legal or otherwise.

>>689543577

This is exactly the point the other poster was trying to make.

>It must be capable of selective fire

This means multiple shots with a single pull of the trigger. The majority of civilan owned firearms are semiautomatic meaning a single round is fired for every pull of the trigger.

>>689534990
So can you.

>>689544983
Terrorists.

And crazy people.

>>689544983
Actually yes, in the beginning there were virtually no restrictions.

As for what's the problem, our absolutely shit mental health system, and society stigmatizing the idea of people with mental problems seeking help. Have depression or thoughts of killing? Better not tell anyone or your life is fucking ruined. So people with problems get shunned until they feel like they don't even want or could get help so they take it out on whoever pisses them off the most, that's what.

Shootings are just the flavor of the country, everywhere else they use knives or explosives or clubs, or anything else.

Their media doesn't sensationalize it for an agenda, it's like how people think there's more degeneracy and stupid people now when there's not, you just notice them more now because the internet gives them a voice. Same concept with guns.

Not only that but people go after the guns used the least out of all, more people are killed yearly by hands and feet than rifles.

>>689530181
In Columbine those kids were assholes before they got the guns. They weren't being bullied. They were simply bloodthirsty.

>>689545627
No pretty sure the poster was just being a fag

>>689546361
Meant to say: Their media doesn't sensationalize it for an agenda, it's like how people think there's more degeneracy and stupid people now when there's not, you just notice them more now because the internet gives them a voice. Same concept with shootings

>>689545627
Also this
A selective-fire firearm has at least two firearm modes, which are activated by means of a selector which varies depending on the weapon's design. Some selective-fire weapons have burst fire mechanisms to limit the maximum number of shots fired automatically in this mode. The most common limits are two or three rounds per trigger pull. Fully automatic fire refers to the ability for a weapon to fire continuously until the feeding mechanism is either emptied or the trigger is released. Semi-automatic refers to the ability to fire one round per trigger pull.

The presence of selective-fire modes on firearms permits more efficient use of rounds to be fired for specific needs, versus having a single mode of operation, such as fully automatic, thereby conserving ammunition while maximizing on-target accuracy and effectiveness. This capability is most commonly found on assault rifles and military weapons of the 20th and 21st centuries.

>>689523702
People will always kill people no matter what. But in the US crazy people with no connections can by a high power assult rifle with no issues. In places like Japan where guns are banned you have to know an illegal gun trader to get your hands on them. Also the arguement about people woth knives can kill people to is invalid because adam lanza was 6' tall 112lbs that nigger would have passed out from exaustion after stabbing 2 kids to death

If you don't know jack Fuck about how guns work or what their limitations are, you shouldn't be telling me what I'm allowed to have.
Overexaggerations and flat out false information spreading is why people think a fucking AR is a WMD.
Educate yourself before acting like you are a fountain of information on a topic you don't understand.

Lets go to the roots of the problem. THOSE FUCKING ILLEGALS

>>689547332
illegals are more than just the mexicans right? because media seems to try to drill it into our heads that illegal immigrants are mexicans

>>689547526
probably 95% or more are mexicans

>>689528445
Shootings go down, and violent crime rate goes up.

Look at assuieland and the UK. Gun crime went down, but assaults went up.

It's easy to be a bully when you know the skinny guy your mugging can't shoot you.

>>689544085
What do you consider common sense then? Are you fine with continuing to allow people who are unstable the right to buy guns?

The problem I have with your Idaho argument is simple. Gun's don't cause violence. Conflict causes violence. So pointing to a state that is not very population dense to make the case I don't feel makes any case. That state would have a low crime rate with or without guns just as a state like California or NY would have a high crime rate with or without guns. But the guns violence magnifies the problem that exists.

I am all for getting to the root of those problems and trying to fix the violence at its source. But that doesn't mean I still would not agree that we can regulate certain items better.

On that note, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama have some of the highest gun related crime rates. The three states with the least restrictive gun laws are Louisiana, Mississippi, & Arizona. So for every Idaho there is also two Louisiana and Mississippi's.

>>689529270
Such a dumb arguement.

I guess we shouldn't have nukes either, since when a government gets mad they'll use them.

Self preservation is a far more pressing matter to individuals when guns are everywhere.

>>689547974
what about arizona? alabama?

>>689532298
What country?
And what's their murder rate? :)

Don't hide those statistics you cuck.

>>689546361
>Shootings are just the flavor of the country, everywhere else they use knives or explosives or clubs, or anything else.
See, that's the /actual/ problem with unregulated guns. Sure, every country has their own violence issues, but when you can only get a knife or a club, you cannot mow down 50 people before being taken down unless you are fucking batman. And the fact that you know that you cannot take that much people with you is in and out of itself a good demotivator for all the bitter or mentally-ill people that in America would end as shooters. There's almost no point.

>>689530491
Shootings went down, what about stabbings?

How long till you ban knives completely and everyone if forced to eat baby food?

>>689531875
Assualy rifles are just hunting rifles with black plastic instead of wood.

You faggots can't even buy M rated videogames.

>>689533726
Bartender is required to carry and be trained in use of pistol.

That's 40 less faggots that would have died.

>>689548225
Arizona is 11 in terms of murder rate (only counting firearms). About 40% higher then national average.

Alabama's restrictive in gun laws are average, ranked 17, but 14-22 are all pretty much interchangeable, as the laws are nearly identical in all cases.

>>689547974
Common sense is running campaigns on how to ask your kids if they're having problems in life, and promoting mental help centers instead of labeling anyone with something worse than ADHD as a risk to society and a crazy.

Start labeling mental help shaming in the same light we put bullying or gay bashing. Making sure people in general just ask how someone's doing more often, whether family, or a stranger noticing someone having a bad day. The solution to this is to work towards actually being decent fucking human beings.

To get rid of accidents reinstate optional firearms courses in high schools, encourage parents to take their kids shooting when they roll over to their early teens and to teach them proper handling and safety. Remove the fear of guns early by showing them that guns are like any other potentially dangerous object. You wouldn't mishandle a chainsaw would you? So don't mishandle a gun.

Beyond that you really only have gangs which would be taken care of in the original bit about running campaigns about talking to your kids, if they feel loved and cared about at home they wont feel the need for the "family" a gang provides.

>>689548544
Look up "Kunming" knife attack

>>689549536
I would support all of those, but I would also state that it still doesn't fix all of the issues. Too many people are shitty people. While it helps some there are still too many shitty people out there.

I would also state that in two of the most recent cases we are talking about an ideology that would ignore all of that. They simply want to destroy us. So all the good those things you suggested will do, it wouldn't eliminate those forces we cant influence. Shouldn't we then do our best to keep guns out of the hands of those individuals?

I would also state that one huge correlation among violence crime states is poverty rates. This is your average everyday "Chicago Weekend" violence that we are basically immune to at this point. While your points would help reduce some of these "mass" shootings it doesn't address the everyday violence. And that is really the problem we have. These mass shootings are tragic because its a sucker punch to the gut. But the real problem is the constant beating that is the real issue.

>>689523702
People argue that a larger number of mass murders happen because of how easy it is. So the arguement goes x amount of people want to make a massacre, but some of x are only willing to put in a medicore amount of work to enact a massacre. What you do when you outlaw guns and assault rifles in particular is you set the bar a little higher. Now if everyone were willing and trained to shoot a pistol this wouldn´t be a problem since there would be much more good guys with pistols than there would be bad guys with assault rifles.

>>689533009
This is why the yakuza mostly kill people with grenades and blades. Japan adds extra penalties to murder if you use a gun so people just murder without guns.

>>689524593
Hitler was living proof of how shittly bombs do their job.

>>689550435
True. That's also why Japan very rarely has incidents in which 50 people or so are mowed down. Murder will always exist, yes. Not a reason to facilitate it.

>>689540306
It is what a lot of people want though, which would make your arguement a no true scotsman.

>>689550845
That is what your average everyday facebooker wants because they are all regressive leftest. Nobody with half a brain or in a position of power argues for that though.

>>689540306
But that doesn´t eliminate the ability of a government to take away it´s people´s guns and then go Soviet on their ass.

>>689529270
You missed the part about shootings happening in gun free zones.

But your right about guns in my face, personaly, 24/7. I have 3 within 20' of me and im not even home. Ive also never been shot, or had to shoot anybody.

Be surrounded by guns, never be a victim.

>>689533417
The issue is he was taken off the watch list specifcally because he was Muslim, if they monitor him too long its racist.

If you want to stay on the watch list you need to be white and support peaceful armed protest occupations like in Oregon.

If you really want to keep guns away from terrorist then don't let Muslims own guns, or even enter the country while you are at it.

>>689551240
>peaceful
>armed

pick one.

The threat of violence is not peaceful. "Occupying" something while carrying guns is a threat of violence.

>>689551566
>niggers loot and burn a city while taking potshots at police to protest [insert dead dindu] who attacked [insert law abiding citizen]
>""""""""peaceful protesters""""""""
>some white people stand around on federal land with guns to protest some farmers getting thrown in jail for a fire that got out of control
>get called terrorists, shot by FBI and thrown in jail

>>689550719
They are also one of the most xenophobic nations on the planet and they tend to deal with thier problems through suicide rather than anger. They havery plenty of ways to kill 50+ people at once, but it doesn't happen over there because culturally everyone is on the same page and very few people have a shitload of anger to project onto large masses of people that belong to a different cultural faction than themselves.

Tldr: it's not a lack of guns that helps Japan it's a lack of Muslims and niggers.

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>>689533749
>club was "gun free"

>>689523702
the problem is neither guns nor muslims. Its a systemic problem with the feebleness of our society. This guy walks in and starts shooting, no regard for life, got it. The victims huddle in the corners and call family to tell them they are about to die....if they knew they were going to die anyway, why didnt they try to fight back? Likely because they have been conditioned since birth to be powerless.

>>689539272
Protip: Refugees aren't fleeing North Africa because of the smell

>>689552017
> see in Japan people realize they're in this shit together, so they don't take it out on each other
> niggers and mudslimes are the problem
Close enough

>>689523702
Alright dipshits, here's your solution to the gun deaths in the US: outlaw handguns.

WOOAAHH controversial idea, I know, but the VAST majority (orders of magnitude larger) of gun deaths and injuries in the US each year are due to handguns, not high powered rifles (or rifles of any kind for that matter). This is due in large part to the fact that they're very concealable. You essentially have no idea when talking to a person, or walking past them on the street, whether or not they're carrying a handgun on them.

Yes, we will still have mass shootings like the ones in Orlando, Sandy Hook, VT etc. but that's the price we'll have to pay for freedums and pertecting urselves frum the gervunment. The reality is, that with outlawing the production of handguns and instituting a buyback program for the ones already out there, we could drastically reduce the number of gun related incidents in this country.

All the legit hunters and the fucking tinfoils could still own their assault rifles, they could even walk around the streets with them if they wanted, but you'd fucking know if a person was carrying a gun and I'll bet you'd act a lot differently toward them. There would be no escalation of a situation without your not knowing that the other party was packing heat.

Win-win-win

End of discussion.

>>689551983
Thanks for saying all those things that I was totally going to say but forgot to. Fuck off.

Not a single one of those fucking riots was peacerful or anything but an excuse for people to loot. They didn't give a shit about the criminal the cop killed, only themselves. So fuck off.

>>689550206
Everyday violence will always happen, the mass shootings are the only problem we have that people are so up in arms about. Doesn't matter if it's with guns or not, there will always be the distressed co-worker, or the abusive husband, or Jamal who cant afford his liquor. These crimes happen in every other country at about the same rate, the only difference here is everyone makes a big deal because it's with guns. Most of which are pistols not rifles of any kind like the AR-15 people so badly want to ban. There's not a whole lot you can do about those besides look for warnings and have well trained law abiding citizens to hopefully resolve it.

Which by the way many MANY more situations where a gun comes out wind up resolved without it being used. Just having them is almost always enough to stop petty crimes, no one wants to die over $200 in a cash register.

I'm honestly all for peaceful resolutions, I never ever want to have to use a gun on anyone else and this feeling is almost universal I'd imagine but I'd like to have the option of a level playing field if someone else doesn't feel the same towards me or anyone else. Guns are purely a hobby first for me honestly, it's like cars, both are dangerous when in the hands of someone with bad intentions or idiocy.

Sorry for being a slowfag, had a phonecall.

>>689552352
How the fuck does that deal with mass murderers who carry it in their car?

>>689523702
Just saying, if I were to go on a mass shooting, I'd go to a gun free zone knowing that I won't be stopped.

>>689548782
(cough cough)
The term assault rifle is generally attributed to Adolf Hitler, who for propaganda purposes used the German word "Sturmgewehr" (which translates to "assault rifle"), as the new name for the MP43, subsequently known as the Sturmgewehr 44 or StG 44.[8][12][13][14][15][16] Other sources dispute that Hitler had much to do with coining the new name besides signing the production order.[17] The StG 44 is generally considered the first selective fire military rifle to popularize the assault rifle concept. Today, the term assault rifle is used to define firearms sharing the same basic characteristics as the StG 44.[citation needed]

In a strict definition, a firearm must have at least the following characteristics to be considered an assault rifle:[2][3][4]

It must be an individual weapon
It must be capable of selective fire
It must have an intermediate-power cartridge: more power than a pistol but less than a standard rifle or battle rifle
Its ammunition must be supplied from a detachable box magazine[5]
And it should have an effective range of at least 300 metres (330 yards)

>>689552621
I said in the post that it doesn't, dipshit. We'll still have mass murders, but the actual number of gun deaths in the country will plummet. If everyone's so concerned about people (generally) dying from guns, that's your solution. If they're just upset about a bunch of people dying from guns at one time in a mass killing and it flooding their fucking news feeds, idk what to tell you.

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>>689552703

What we need to do is convince insane mass murders to obey the law. - lol

>>689523702
>why they believe an outright ban on guns would be a good idea?
Just to point out, very few nutcases want an outright ban on guns. But if you're crazy, you probably shouldn't be able to get a gun.

And the gunshow loophole is bullshit.

>>689523702
In an uncivilized country like Murica it probably wouldn't be a good idea to ban guns.

>>689552955
The popular new idea is to blame it on mental health, which at least in part is probably correct.

>>689553204
Sure but my point is these mass shootings account for like less than 1% of actual gun deaths in the US. So, either people need to get their priorities straight and address the real problem, or stop bitching.

>>689552841
It actually translates to storming rifle

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>>689553093
>But if you're crazy, you probably shouldn't be able to get a gun.

Guess which two idiots in this picture are not allowed to carry firearms.