Is it possible that there could someday be a harem anime that is actually good, or do the inherent elements which define the genre make it incapable of producing anything that isn't terrible?
>>135126058
Already happened : no one watched it.
>>135126058
Blastoise best girl
>>135126115
It's the only way.
>>135126058
Harem is good. The people who are embarrassed to admit it just have a habit of deciding that even if they like a harem then it isn't really harem.
I think it's inherent. I don't mean it's impossible though, just fucking hard.
It's hard to make something good when most fans want a self insert with no personality, you have to give time to every girl stunting the growth and make her shallow.
>>135126058
DxD. The anime is okay-ish but the LN is where it's at.
But Trinity Seven already exists, anon.
>>135126058
The problem with harems is the restrictions placed on them by their publishers to appeal to the otaku like don't have them fuck the MC, they have to fit an archetype and the MC has to be relateable(basically be an asexual beta faggot) to the target audience. There's plenty of harems that are great but they're not popular because otaku's don't like when the MC's actually have sex with them and ruins potentual pure waifu's.
>>135126259
>DxD
>good
It's above average I'll give you that but what keeps it average and not truly great is the MC. The jokes are overplayed, the story arcs predictable and plot has slowed to a crawl.
>>135126386
Yeah I'm pretty tired with the jokes myself lately, probably just me growing out of it since I was 16 when I was first reading DxD. Although I like Issei compared to the other harem MC's that I know, since he's not the stereotypical dense MC that gets flustered when some girls throw themselves at him, and he actually works for all the things he's got now. If anything I'm just reading it for the lore now since it's gone so deep I can't drop it anymore
>>135126058
90% of Harem Anime is crap. But then, 90% of all Anime is crap.
>>135129362
90% of almost every form of media is crap.
![[HorribleSubs] Seraph of the End S2 - 03 [720p].mkv_snapshot_14.29_[2015.10.24_16.13.09].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/clNWEZo.jpg "[HorribleSubs] Seraph of the End S2 - 03 [720p].mkv_snapshot_14.29_[2015.10.24_16.13.09].jpg")
If the MC in a harem isn't top tier then there is literally no point of watching or reading a harem.
Not even cute girls can save that shit.
>>135126058
>no one in high school
>moderately intelligent MC
>never once pretended to not be going for a harem ending
>all the girls sleep in a bed with the MC every night
The harem /a/ needs.
There are good harem anime, especially when its comedy focused. Stuff like Noucome, Seitokai no Ichizon, and Korean Desk Car
>>135126058
>inherent elements which define the genre make it incapable of producing anything that isn't terrible?
Duh.
>>135130846
At first I thought Minato was a faggot.
But him being smart made me think he was just pretending to be retarded.
And I was right, this nigga impregnated a couple of lesbians by ignoring them.
He is the hero /a/ deserves.
>>135126099
I hope he makes a continuation on that story after his announcement on the sequel of Ryo-Ohki. Kenshi is a beast in that series and all of the girls in the academy want to get on his pants.
Post birds.
So did the manga end?
Blastoise best tittymon
>>135133024
>>135133084
Translation stalled when A-Team died. Someone else is doing it now.
>>135131807
>And I was right, this nigga impregnated a couple of lesbians by ignoring them.
>lesbians
Minato's dick transcends sexual preference. Thought we learned that with fire girl.
It's possible, Kyonai will prove it next season
>>135133135
>A-Team died
Good, fuck those whiny faggots.
>>135131807
>this nigga impregnated a couple of lesbians
Which ones were lesbians?
>>135133174
>Kyoani
>being anything than yuri/yaoi pandering faggots
This I got to see.
>>135133226
The ones he impregnated.
Seriously though they were the sick hosptial girl and the cloth using Sekirei.
>>135133269
What do you mean impregnated? I dont remember sex in this manga. But it's been a while since I read it.
>>135133269
didn't tangela die? did she get better?
>>135133891
Where from?
>>135133174
>Kyoani revives harem genre
>interest in harem skyrockets
>we get Sekirei season 3 as a result
TYBKA
>>135133947
I want to know too.
>>135131807
When is minato shown to be smart? Didn't he flunk his entrance exams twice?
He wins because the game is basically rigged in his favor
>dad runs the game
>mom helps run the game
>literally gifted 4 single numbered sekirei
>gets to live with the strongest sekirei everyone is scared shitless of
>musubi also happens to have another one the strongest sekirei inside her
>>135135239
It's just stated that he's very smart but he gets nervous during his entrance exams and can't make it.
>>135133947
>>135135090
Oh yea that'sBoku no google you fucking plebs.
>>135133752
Nope. Apparently the bitch was one of the survivors alot of them actually made it, though some did die just not as many. Can't wait for the authors next work apparently he's getting more helpers this time around since his next story has his editor excited.
>>135136245
>he
Sekirei was made and written by a gril
>>135136245
>he
Sekirei was made and written by a gril
>>135133947
>>135135090sekibokunopicorei
>>135136541
>by a gril
What I want from harem anime is...
>A protagonist with a developed personality
>Haremettes who have lives unrelated to the protagonist
>Haremettes who have a good dynamic with each other even when the protagonist isn't there
>>135126058
To make a good harem you need to break some basic conventions.
You need a main that isn't generic or a complete oblivious tool.
And you need enough plot that doesn't directly justify the harem mechanics.
It's not a lot, but it's amazing how most harems don't even try.
On the other hand it's also possible to do a good harem "by the book". But since the formula is so well known, nowadays it could use some degree of self-awareness to give it an edge.
Negima and Love Hina are good representatives.
Though Negima kinda went to shit as it dragged on, it had enough novelty to stand out. The number of girls was staggering and the main was a child. Incorporating battle manga elements also got the story going to not-so-stagnant places while still keeping it harem.
Love Hina embraced the "guy surrounded by girls who want him" formula. But the main was slightly less passive, having a concrete goal to drive him. The girls were all the usual cliches, but instead of just being played out for their cliches, they each brought different kinds of stories/genres. And there wasn't any competition between the girls, which is also nice.
>>135136859
You didnt know that, anon? Is it that shocking?
>>135137023
>Negima and Love Hina are good representatives.
Not really, seeing as how they arent even harems. There was no competition between the girls because the winner was already decided pretty early in love hina.
>>135137083
Which is another good thing if you ask me. But it's true. The true classic harem would be something like Tenchi. Which sucks. All of it.
I think harem anime has suffered a lot in the recent era of anime. I mean, particularly harems. I think battle shounen has actually gotten better with series like Boku no Hero Academia explore the genre, and a comedies like Nichijou actually do more than make puns and fourth wall jokes now, but I think harems have taken a nose dive.
Every harem seems to need to meet a character archetype quota, the protagonists have become formuliac where they can be grouped into useless, perverted or Gary Stu and no one actually gives a fuck about romantic arcs anymore. I don't actually want people to explore new shit, I just want things to become a little more focused. I actually consider Nisekoi one of the best harems in recent years unironically, because as much shit as it gets for the writing I can at least remember the characters.
Mostly, I blame light novel adaptations. This season really stood out as the season of shitty battle harem adaptations.
>>135137036
No. I forgot girls can also create delicious females as well.
You operate under the assumption all anime isn't terrible. You have predisposed ideals taken from probably a juvenile and oblivious clique. You will never find a harem anime that is actually good because of your own immature notions or need to impress someone else.
>>135126058
First step: Don't be a faggot or a fujo
Second step: enjoy the cute girls and hijinks
There, done.
>>135137379
Found the underaged poster.
>>135136998
Good thing Monogatari exists.
>>135137352
>shitty battle harem adaptations.
Battle harems are the absolute worst.
Regular harems at least have the chance to have some decent writing because they don't waste so much time on retarded fights.
>>135137728
Gahara is the girlfriend. There's no harem.
>>135133947
>>135135090
It's freaking Sekirei. We've been posting almost nothing else in this thread.
>>135137841
Oh you're retarded, I'll stop responding.
>>135137894
I know, I know. But as it was pointed above a harem should have an actual competition. There's no such thing in Monogatari.
>>135137931
You are just revealing your narrow veiwpoint
>>135131929
I think he's said he wants to write more, but don't quote me on that.
>>135126058
Most of the problems involving harems is that the girls revolve too much around the main character. It gets more entertaining when they either have a lot of interaction, or have some kind of violent conflict with each other. Maybe they are too attached to the mindset from LNs and games that the girls all have to be in unattached routes just focusing on them.
>>135137931
Even with an official girlfriend, Monogatari still plays out like a harem. They still compete for Araragi's attention, even if it isn't for a certain spot. It's a more interesting way of doing it, so I don't think it being compared to a harem should be a negative thing.
>>135137931
While I don't think Ore Monogatari counts as a harem, there was Suna's sister. She wasn't exactly a serious love interest though.
I don't think actual competition is a necessity. It's probably a fact that Senjougahara will win Monogatari or that Asuna has Sword Art on deadlock but they're both definitely harem series. What's important is establishing multiple girls as regular admirers of the protagonist. A series can have all the trappings of a harem without making room for the usual harem wars, and while I don't think the harems are actually necessary in the previous two series with the romance element being irrelevant in arcs other than Snakes and Cats and being complete window dressing in the latter, some series take advantage of the winner being obvious.
Saekano's the recent example. Megumi being the only serious contender is a major element that drives the other girls and breaks the status quo established in the backstory. It'd probably be a very different series if not for her position.
>>135133024
>>135138115
>plays out like a harem
This is certainly true and it's part of the appeal. You get a parade of very different girls that you can like for different reasons while the main doesn't lay a hand on most of them for his own reasons.
It's not a negative thing to compare it to a harem, but to include it as part of the harem "genre" sounds wrong.
>>135138200
the -gatari series. Ore Monogatari is a straight out love story where nothing goes wrong ever.And I love it.
But on harems with clear "winners", it just feels like cheating. Having a winner gives a harem story an end point, but making it clear who the winner is from the get go makes the whole harem thing pointless.
For example, the "deban" girls in SAO. They are the worst kind of cheerleaders, with nothing else to live for than the main character's dick. At least the Monogatari Series gives each girl some background and life beyond Araragi.
You could just have multiple female characters who DON'T want the MC's dick and have proper ties to the story. And, god forbid, some other male characters that aren't submissive non-threatening "bro" types.
The best potential a harem setup can exploit is the fact that any of the girls could "win". So people can pick their favorite and root for her. And even if they lose, the fans still win because the girl is "available" and the protagonist was a fool for not choosing her.Ukyo Kuonji, forever.
The problem is that playing out that formula without developing the girls a little tiny bit makes the whole thing feel weak. It's hard to like any of the girls when you can instantly recognize which stereotype they're playing.
Something like Infinite Stratos comes to mind. I picked it up due to some hype but I was instantly disappointed. Char got my hopes up because it was a chance for some actual story, the MC helping her keep her secret in a way that they'd develop a real relationship. But nope! Secret outed right away. Shit show.
>>135126386
>and not truly great is the MC
The MC is the one who put me off DxD.
Its good not to have a shy MC, but one whose main personality trait and goal is BOOBS is fairly terrible too.
At least thats all I remember of him after one anime season and 3 LN volumes.
>>135137023
>Negima and Love Hina are good representatives.
Negima isn't really a good example.
Many anons ship Negi with the various girls, but the romance aspect was almost entirely superfluous.
Negima isn't a harem manga; its a battleshounen with harem elements.
>a battleshounen with harem elements
like sekerei and most of the other shows mentioned here where the harem isn't the main focus.
>>135138603
An awful lot of harems have a clear winner right off the bat though.
There's a reason "main girl always wins" is such an accepted rule.
Like Nisekoi, Chitoge is going to win and she was always going to win. Anyone with half a brain called it years ago.
Love Hina
&
TWGOK
comes to mind
Harems need a strong MC to keep the story flowing well Trinity Sevens MC is a good example he's not a beta asexual loser and he knows what he wants. Now that's not to say a beta is completely out of the question Sekirei's MC was pretty good and had his moments as well all the whil being a willing sub to the girls. DxD's MC WAS good in the beginning but that motherfucker hasn't grown in 20 volumes and is still an immature idiot who contributes nothing to the narrative other than being a comedy relief. Another good MC is Shieldbro he grows as the story progresses and makes the girls' efforts actually matter.
>>135138812
>TWGOK
Oh yeah! That was another very self-aware harem that played around really well with all the conventions.And best girl won, too.
>>135138948
>DxD's MC WAS good
He was never good. Anyone that says Issei is a strong point in DxD isn't worth listening to because DxD is probably their first ecchi anime and they're 14 years old.
>>135126058
Average harem anime isn't any worse than average anime of any other genre and people who won't shut up over how much they hate harem anime are literally the worst people on /a/, worse than even that one faggot who tries to force a new meme like "Redditgahara" or "Asuka is a tranny" every other month.
>>135139054
I had I hopes for him in the beginning but after the Loki arc I just stopped caring, he went through all that shit people are placing their hopes on him and he doesn't grow as a character at all and the girls still lust after his dick because of his convenient "imma dragun" bullshit.
Boku Girl is good
>>135139054
The thing that bugged me about him was that rather than seeming like he was he seemed like he was just made to be the opposite of your typical cowardly main character, rather than a strong character on his own.
>>135139200
>and the girls still lust after his dick because of his convenient "imma dragun" bullshit.
I think that's my major problem with harems, there is hardly any actual justification for why all these 10/10 girls (who conveniently also happen to be kissless virgins that were never interested in any other guys their entire life for no reason) all fall in love with this completely average guy that usually has nothing going for him.
It's always either the flimsiest of justifications "He helped me buy some bread" or some "super special snowflake" reason that suddenly happens. And I understand that harems are mostly just self insert power fantasies, and that works great for porn, but when you actually expect me to get invested in or care about the story you're going to have to put some actual effort in the writing.
>>135139444
I blame Japan's obsession with purity.
I'd like a few experienced sluts in harems.
>>135139680
That wouldn't work because they'd seduce him instantly. It's the same reason why the MC has to be a borderline asexual virgin himself.
Them being virgins isn't a problem, 90% of the characters in these stories are japanese teenage highschoolers, it makes sense for them to be virgins. And there's plenty of sluts in other genres, the whole "purityfag" mentality is greatly over-exaggerated.
>>135139808
>That wouldn't work because they'd seduce him instantly.
And non experienced sluts can do that? It's not hard to seduce a male ages 15-35 if you're at least a 6.
>>135139680
>I'd like a few experienced sluts in harems.
But you already have reality for that.
>>135139444
You don't need a reason to love somebody.
But I agree the whole purity thing needs a serious downgrade.
>>135139862
Remember we're discussing your average harem MC, not your average teenage guy. You need some experience with guys to seduce him.
But actually now that I think about it, the real reason why a slut in a harem wouldn't work is because she wouldn't deal with his bullshit, she'd go find another guy. No woman with actual real world experience with men is going to sit around and get twat blocked by five other stupid bitches, especially for a guy that has little to offer.
![[HorribleSubs] Saekano - 09 [720p].mkv_snapshot_19.39_[2015.03.14_22.17.20].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/aX3j3tV.jpg "[HorribleSubs] Saekano - 09 [720p].mkv_snapshot_19.39_[2015.03.14_22.17.20].jpg")
Saekano is a good harem.
>>135139680
>>135139808
Even if they're 'pure,' a lot of harems have really seductive, aggressive women. They tend to be the hottest, and usually the best.
why do fags like to conveniently ignore hentai when talking about harems anime as a genre.
>>135140211
What is there to discuss? Hentai harems work exceedingly well. You have a bland self insert and a bunch of hot chicks that he fucks, it works perfectly.
>>135140123
And they almost always lose. Otaku don't seem to like aggressive women outside of porn.
BEST GIRL
Now that it's over, did Uzume end up in the harem? This is important.
>>135139054
>lust after his dick because of his convenient "imma dragun" bullshit.
Okay, so you clearly weren't paying attention.
>>135140577
That is not what I quoted.
I quoted >>135139200
Thanks 4chan
>>135140539
I'm guessing top left corner is uzume
Who is that below her? Sword girl? or is that top right corner?
Where are blastoises giant boobs?
>>135137352
Winter was worse, MUCH worse.
>>135137828
>Regular harems at least have the chance to have some decent writing because they don't waste so much time on retarded fights
This. I vastly prefer "normal" silly harems that only really care about having fun. Shomin from this season is a decent example, shame about the non-existent budget. At least with those I don't have to put up with a MC that's 90% likely to either be a complete Gary Stu (Rakudai) or an useless fuckwad (take your fucking pick from any harem from Winter that's not World Break).
>>135136998
Rozen Maiden
>>135126058
This is such a shit harem. Literally all cow tits except the shit loli with stubby arms.
>>135126058
Harem anime is dead
Manga on the otherhand has Negima and Sidonia
>>135137931
Monogatari has competition. Senjougahara is threatened by Araragi's crush on Hanekawa, and Shinobu is always in the background as one who will let Araragi outlive Senjougahara.
>>135140535
Even in a harem ending, best girl loses.
>>135126099
That show was real tasty, but the ending was weak. Make a god damn decision.
>horny elf is a best
>>135126058
watch more anime faggot
Post more Poketits.
>>135140621
What am I missing? His asspull power ups? His "m-muh power of o-o-oppai" power? Cookie cutter never give up attitude? What? Issei is an idiot and has had no character development even though it's 20 volumes in and all the bullshit he's done. Even though he has a shitload of other girls the red head gets all the attention who the fuck knows why they would stick around. DxD has been in decline quality wise since volume 16 and the newest season of the anime was so shit Ishibumi himself went on twitter to say how bad it was and IF there's another season they won't fuck it up.
>>135143474
>losing
Nigga you DO know she comes back and both her and her cancer girl are after that dick right?
>>135144182
I don't know much about Sekirei but I always thought of it more like Zatch Bell than Pokemon.
