Hypnosis and telepathy:
a short summary
> Hypnosis is the bypassing of the critical faculty of the
> conscious mind and the establishing of acceptable
> selective thinking.
~Dave Elman (paraphrased)
Our brains, in order to process all the information and
data into our conscious perception (thus creating the
abstract idea of "self") are constantly operating on a very
high level of both abstraction, and tension.
Now, what is consciousness?
As far as I can tell, it's recursive self-abstraction.
What is, then, the subconscious?
It's the sum total of all automatic processes and
information that happens within an organism.
Now, since we know for a fact (which I ain't sourcing right
now, perhaps later) that quantum entanglement happens
between individuals (even without any trance at all), and
we know for a fact that we can influence not only moods,
but also gene expression using hypnosis (Cf. Ernest Rossi),
as well as their immune system, and others, directly and
indirectly.
The bigger changes we want to induce, the more profound we
require that bypass of the critical faculty to be.
For example, we generally divide trance into many layers of
"depth", which is no more, no less, but a metaphorical way
of referring to the "extent of the spectrum a hypnotic
subject can realize suggestions".
For a list of how this looks like, more or less:
hypnox.pl/what-is-hypnosis/hypnotic-states-and-depth-of-
trance/
C.D.
Now, we know (from G.P. Hansen) that telepathy and other
weird fuckery happens when people are in liminal states.
What is, then, liminality?
The critical faculty that Elman speaks of is the part of
the mind which judges and evaluates whether things are true
or not.
Interestingly, this is functionally equivalent to what
Chaotes call "suspension of disbelief" or "gnosis", and
what Victor Turner named "liminality", being the state
"in-between", where neither social role is true.
That this is true can be easily demonstrated by giving any
double-bind to a person. As a demonstration, you might want
to follow these instructions:
> Place your better hand down somewhere.
> Relax it to the point where it won't want to, cannot move.
> While keeping that quality of relaxation as it is, try to
move your hand.
This essentially creates a situation where you're trying to
move your hand while at the same time keeping it entirely
relaxed, as moving it would necessitate that you get rid of
that quality of relaxation in the first place.
Continuing, it is well-known that religious beliefs have
a profound impact on the human psyche, and it is asserted
here that they are a direct way to the subconscious, as
they necessarily create a state of double-think on the most
basic existential level.
This might very well be an evolutionary trait, since
hypnosis, in all forms, allows us to adopt and be more
elastic about ourselves and our behaviors.
Given the extent of this hypnosis, on an existential level,
I think it is very possible that it allows a person to
communicate on an entirely different level, perhaps solely
with symbols, with intelligences from "beyond the Mauve
zone".
Of course, I am making no assertions as to what that might
be; it could be just people, a perhaps species-wide
telepathic link, or it could be something else entirely.
My working theory for explaining telepathy without
telepathy is that it's simply an insanely high-level of
analogue communication (body language, tone of voice,
rhythm of ones breathing, ones balance, etc. etc.). Keeping
in mind the "six degrees of separation", there is quite
some likelihood that this is actually how it works.
But then again, I don't know.
>>17524147
Links, since I forgot in my sleepiness.
>Temple of Solomon the King (occultism, esotericism, anthropology and religion resources):
https://mega.nz/#F!AE5yjIqB!y7Vdxdb5pbNsi2O3zyq9KQ
>Mesmer's Lair (hypnosis, hypnotherapy, some neuropsych, brainwashing resources):
https://drive.google.com/open?id=0BwLJ8mj-ZuoGc0NKUEtoLTBmQXc
>History 2D: Science, Magic, and Religion, UCLA
[YouTube] History 2D: Science, Magic, and Religion, Lecture 1, UCLA (embed)
Further thoughts upon reading my own drivel:
>Continuing, it is well-known that religious beliefs have
>a profound impact on the human psyche, and it is asserted
>here that they are a direct way to the subconscious, as
>they necessarily create a state of double-think on the
>most basic existential level.
Interestingly, this could be correlated with the increased
amount of craziness in the world in general. The stronger
our science gets, the stronger the double-think people have
to maintain, and the more intense the hypnosis (bypass of
the critical faculty).
Fascinating.
Also re: sources,
>Beyond Telepathy - Puharich
>Dream Telepathy - Ulman and Kripper
>The Trickster and the Paranormal - G.P. Hansen
>Hypnotherapy - Dave Elman
This is off the top of my head. Not really willing to dig through my pile of bookmarks now. Maybe later.
Almost all of the magic that I've seen posted here has been placebo magic - the kind of that tells you to do something for a vague future thing to happen (wealth, help with studying, etc.)
Is there any reliable magic that creates an immediate effect that's able to be observed? I'm okay with things that require extensive knowledge or focus; so long as they can make something I can interpret with a sense.
>>17524225
>Is there any reliable magic that creates an immediate effect that's able to be observed?
What would be sufficient for you to witness in order to consider it "magic"?
>>17524231
Something that's able to be seen, felt, heard, etc. conclusively - i.e. something that isn't excessively vague or minor to a point where the placebo effect could create it. "A slight sense of being watched" isn't a major thing. We imagine people watching us when we're in a dark hallway, or walking at night.
>>17524243
Okay. So would being unable to move your body as you wish be empirical evidence sufficient enough for you to accept "magic" as real?
>>17524147
Very, very interesting. Theoretically It could be done between two meditating persons, then?
>Now, since we know for a fact (which I ain't sourcing right now, perhaps later) that quantum entanglement happens between individuals (even without any trance at all)
I'll be waiting for your source! If I don't find it before
>>17524151
>the part of the mind which judges and evaluates whether things are true or not.
kek
>Interestingly, this is functionally equivalent to what Chaotes call "suspension of disbelief" or "gnosis", and what Victor Turner named "liminality", being the state "in-between", where neither social role is true.
kek
>This essentially creates a situation where you're trying to move your hand while at the same time keeping it entirely relaxed, as moving it would necessitate that you get rid of that quality of relaxation in the first place.
kek
> the rest of this post especially double-think
Kek
>>17524154
Have you had any experience with telepathy? If so, could you recount the experience to me? Don't try and understand or put it in those kinds of words.
>>17524247
Sure. Hit me
>>17524253
Depends on how you define it, and what margin for error we accept. My experiences for the most part revolve around things which are actually explainable by aforementioned analogue communication; answering questions before they're asked, being able to tell what a person is going through in their lives, occasionally reading memories, however that only happened a few times.
>>17524254
>Hit me
I have no clue what you're expecting, but consider this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhaR9656LOg
NOTHING save for physical results external to the operator is sufficient evidence for magic.
And I've yet to witness anything I couldn't explain otherwise, save for ONE incident.
>>17524273
None of that matters. Could I get a phenomenological description of the experience ?
Also, I repeat, if the experience is a relatively new thing, don't try and analyze it just yet
>>17524273
>save for ONE incident.
You can't say that and not tell, anon
>>17524273
>NOTHING save for physical results external to the operator is sufficient evidence for magic.
Is this a response to their request, or do you actually think this?
>>17524281
>phenomenological description
Talking to a person, suddenly make an association between something I am saying and an idea that "randomly" popped up in my head. Then I keep on talking and it turns out to connect directly to a problem or issue the person has.
In retrospect, it's just analogue communication. But it might feel paranormal to some, that's for sure.
>>17524286
Nothing too big. Did ritual, went to kitchen, frying pan flew out the window.
>>17524299
I'm the guy arguing against the supernatural here, giving evidence-based explanations for things which might appear ambiguous to some people.
>>17524273
>save for ONE incident
WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
>>17524312
>>17524312
>frying pan flew out the window.
FLEW? flew how, like levitated it's way out? Man this is enough to prove a hundred magicks!
>>17524329
Basically yeah. I'm still skeptical as hell, however, since I haven't had anything of this magnitude happen since. Also next day when I checked it was entirely fine, despite seemingly falling 4 floors onto concrete.
So for all I know, I could just have hallucinated. False memories are a thing, sadly.
>>17524312
Which ritual did you do? What materials did you use? Did you try to replicate this?
>>17524339
Just the daily CC, XXV, V combo. And yes, I did try to replicate, nothing happened.
>>17524337
Well, did you have to go down and fetch the pan back? then you didn't hallucinate man.
Did you see the pan floating? or was more like being propelled? maybe the wind or an involuntary bodyslam?
I do this because from all the namefags on the OMG threads you're the only one I respect and you have earned some credit.
>>17524312
>Talking to a person, suddenly make an association between something I am saying and an idea that "randomly" popped up in my head.
How developed is it? Just a clear simple idea?
>In retrospect, it's just analogue communication.But it might feel paranormal to some, that's for sure.
Both sides of the aisle refer to it occasionally in terms of analogue communication.
>I'm the guy arguing against the supernatural here, giving evidence-based explanations for things which might appear ambiguous to some people.
Word to the wise, you're going to cause problems for yourself thinking like this. There are plenty of other types of evidence.
Also, "Supernatural" = metaphysical = not your enemy.
>>17524377
>Well, did you have to go down and fetch the pan back? then you didn't hallucinate man.
That's the thing. I remember doing that, but how can I be certain?
>Did you see the pan floating? or was more like being propelled? maybe the wind or an involuntary bodyslam?
More like it was "carried" by something from underneath.
>>17524383
>How developed is it? Just a clear simple idea?
Basically. Sometimes in the form of a word, like "rape", "abandonment", "numb", sometimes in the form of a feeling or image.
>Word to the wise, you're going to cause problems for yourself thinking like this. There are plenty of other types of evidence.
Oh, absolutely. I'm just not going to discuss it in public due to it's nature and how connected that is with my own personal systems of reference.
What I am presenting here is mostly the framework I approach things from, which still leaves a vast amount of space for metaphysical considerations.
>not your enemy
That's arguable. First and foremost, I need to make 100% certain that I'm not my own enemy, by achieving full personal integration in all aspects. Then I can worry about metaphysics in a more direct manner, once that's done.
>>17524344
Kind of newbie, what's this CC XXV V combo stuff?
>>17524413
Liber Resh,
Liber XXV (Star Ruby)
Liber V vel Reguli
A set of three inter-connected rituals in the A.'.A.'..
hermetic.com/crowley/libers/lib200.html
hermetic.com/crowley/libers/lib25.html
hermetic.com/crowley/libers/lib5.html
>>17524404
>That's the thing. I remember doing that, but how can I be certain?
Well, cant you just, you know, hypnotize yourself to check your memories, or make someone hypnotize you to go back to that moment?
>I'm just not going to discuss it in public due to it's nature and how connected that is with my own personal systems of reference.
Noob here (not >>17524413). Why is it so bad to reveal your own systems/paradigms? Is not like anyone cares.
>>17524452
>Well, cant you just, you know, hypnotize yourself to check your memories, or make someone hypnotize you to go back to that moment?
Nope. Hypnotic regression does two things:
A) Strengthens the memories that are already in place.
B) Runs the risk of changing memories (via imagination or suggestions), and those false memories override the actual ones.
That's why hypnotic hypermnesia is used in forensics, but not in a court of law.
>Why is it so bad to reveal your own systems/paradigms?
It's less about it being "bad" and more about it being a symbolic profaning of my mental temple.
Once everything is nice and tidy, then I'll start writing more.
>>17524464
well, if you're so inclined to think you've hallucinated, is very probable that is true, but fuck, i could not be sceptic after that.
I have also ruled a "false memory" an incident it happened once in my life. I think that the more that you actually review the story or tell them to anyone, you are in fact changing the story in your mind and re-shaping it.
>>17524404
>Basically. Sometimes in the form of a word, like "rape", "abandonment", "numb", sometimes in the form of a feeling or image.
This is really interesting. So it is voice not vision? Come about as part of your self-integration?
>That's arguable
Yes, yes it is.
>First and foremost, I need to make 100% certain that I'm not my own enemy, by achieving full personal integration in all aspects.
No argument from me.
>>17524498
>So it is voice not vision?
I wouldn't call it a voice. I think in words.
>Come about as part of your self-integration?
Possibly. I'm not certain. My guess is, the more in-tune I am with myself, the less noise I generate, and the clearer the signal is that I can get.
ITT: autism
>>17524147
Magic isn't real.
>>17524545
I understand the sanity behind the distinction, but have you ever seen words?
>Possibly. I'm not certain. My guess is, the more in-tune I am with myself, the less noise I generate, and the clearer the signal is that I can get.
Yup.
>hypnosis
>conscious
>selective
>>17524147
I need a spell or something for health.
Got an exam tomorrow and also the worst cold of my life. Nowhere else to turn.
>>17524994
If it's just a head cold, I'd suggest moderate exercise in an environment with fresh air, then a nutritionally-dense meal covering a wide range of vitamins and minerals, green tea, and proper rest.
Probably a better investment of your time than trying to learn some occult method under the stress of an exam and your physical condition.
How do I meditate without my eyes hurting? Not my third eye, just eyes 1 and 2.
>>17525702
What works for me is to make sure the lighting in the room is not too bright, keeping eyes about halfway open, relaxing the eyelids and facial muscles, and focusing the gaze about 45 degrees down from eye level on a spot on a blank wall 1-2 meters away from you.
>>17524147
Hypnosis is not occult or magic. Stop shit posting
>>17524951
Every term I used was defined. If you have a problem with the nomenclature, I'm more than glad to argue about it.
>>17524994
Hypnosis stems directly from occult teachings (Order of the Gold and Rosy Cross), which then were studied and turned into a science.
You know, like one of the few things in the occult which actually turned into a science.
>>17526104
>You know, like one of the few things in the occult which actually turned into a science.
Only the faggy stuff turned into science. If you needed a metaphysical approach to maintain the foundation of your occult beliefs, did not really have any other choice.
>>17526303
Good argument there brah.
1/10, made me reply.
>>17524147
There's literally no connectivity between the points in your argument. Just thought you should know.
>>17526307
I love me some Alchemy, so I poking fun at myself. The rest is pretty accurate.
Also, Thelema never even got succession down, not even good enough to be faggy.
Why do you subject yourself to trolls? I always look forward to these threads but I feel like if you feed them enough they just shit up any actual discussion
Do you think that the occult could explain poltergeist/paranormal happenings? Even if the persons involved had no connection to the occult whatsoever? Just trying to find some explanations
>>17526617
Explain? Yes.
Explain in a way which doesn't leave much doubt as to what's happening? No.
>>17526618
What if there are paranormal episodes non related to the occult? I mean; spirits that just do things on it's own, as opposed as evoked by someone.
>>17526352
To be fair, I troll these threads every couple days, and I'm still spreading good information. People just dont know.
>>17526627
>What if there are paranormal episodes non related to the occult?
That's, by definition, related to the occult. The hell are you talking about?
>>17526640
Maybe i got it wrong.
Im my mind, the occult = people doing magic
paranormal = random creepy shit happening itself
>>17526646
Well, yes, either way could be conceivably possible.
>>17526650
>>17526646
I want to decide if spirits of the dead are real or not. So I want to rule out any possibility of mental projection into this.
I sorta guessed that you magic users treated spirits as mind projections that can only exist by reflection on the viewer.
I mean: i Know that all reality is just what we perceive of it. But persons do things when you're not looking at them; the tree makes noise on the fall even if there is no-one to hear it. What is bugging me is: Do spirits act when no-one knows about them?
IDK if i'm explaining well enough
>>17524147
Got anything quick and dirty to make someone quit a job?
>>17526689
also, i think that floating objects like your frying pan are probably a good proof of that. I happened to witness a very similar thing.
The only thing that keeps me guessing is that MAYBE the humans can produce telekinesis or random poltergeists around on mind-altered situations; such as terror or the uneasyness that the supernatural produces on us.
Why do you think that eastern esoterism urges you to be honest, compassive, giving, etc?
It clashes with my conception of many people on this thread; this is normally full of dicks
>>17526689
>>17526698
More reflections on this:
If spirits are REAL and not just a mental projection of the subconscious, It implies some moral assumptions:
Why are we summoning/using them? Should we not better help them/leave them do whatever they need to do? They are sentient beings after all
Why do we make up traditions and shit that we believe that the spirits like? Should we not learn about their current state and about their real needs?
Also I hate that people claiming that they've written a song possessed by the spirit of Kurt Cobain/morrison/bowie, etc. Is just like Yeah, I'm dead, but of course I'm totally up for writting a song, have you got a pen? Just like they were not people before icons. IDK man, just things i think about that, but i'm not sure this thread is for this kind of things.
What is the epistemology for a naturalist to into the occult?
>>17526352
Disagreeing with baseless comments ain't trolling, honey bun.
http://www.spelwerx.com/symbols.html
You know what? I don't feel like the necessity of making magic or anything. I really don't know what could I do with it. But I see that symbols and is like I'd love to draw them everywhere, to bring good luck or even just to make everything more "mystic".
It's a pity because I don't want to unleash any power unwillingly or anything.
>>17526731
>If spirits are REAL and not just a mental projection of the subconscious, It implies some moral assumptions:
Not really. There is a millennia-long history of spirits of various sorts messing with us. If it's 'real', it's been at least partly mutual.
>>17524147
Is there a simple self-hypnosis technique that I can do right now to get into a trance in a few minutes?
>>17527880
>I don't want to unleash any power unwillingly or anything
Then good news, magic isn't real.
>>17528074
Thats like saying "If some muslim killed our people, why don't we kill some muslims?" Thats hate speech anon
is any of you involved in that? >>17524493
>>17528657
Yes, I is involved with that. Meme magic, AM I RIGHT!??!?! (kill me)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nf1TXOF2Ul8
>>17528689
Groovy. Y'know his wife was a confirmed Thelemafag?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4pfWxjoc6w
>>17528657
Not I, said the blind man.
>>17528934
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wdnTEugFVes
>>17528298
Yeah. There's the Betty Erickson Induction, there's the arm relaxation, there's a few different things.
>>17528504
Except I said nothing of harming anything. At all.
>>17524147
In my experience, telepathy is a thing. I've encountered a couple of mind readers. Usually, I find them annoying. Some form of telepathy is about all I need to explain magic.
I actually agree with a lot of this. I'm pretty sure belief is unnecessary, though. I didn't believe and it worked, anyway.
>>17530834
>In my experience, telepathy is a thing.
That's not in question. It absolutely is a thing, and research supports that. The problem is that we can't be certain that it's telepathy or just analogue communication, especially when meeting a reader in person.
In fact, I would argue that analogue communication can go significantly further than "telepathy" can, if only because it uses a significantly higher amount of channels for what it does.
>Some form of telepathy is about all I need to explain magic.
Which is fair, but then the question is, how do you know it's telepathy and not something else?
>I'm pretty sure belief is unnecessary, though. I didn't believe and it worked, anyway.
My argument is that belief (faith, whatever you want to call it) acts as a catalyst for the process. Much like nitrous oxide for an engine. It can still work, but on average, it'll work better with something supernatural, unexplainable, unknown involved, if only because it gives the subconscious (or whatever you want to call it) more space to act.
>>17530848
>In fact, I would argue that analogue communication can go significantly further than "telepathy" can, if only because it uses a significantly higher amount of channels for what it does.
How many km? I had a telepath in California mail me a drawing of a project I was doing in Virginia.
>Which is fair, but then the question is, how do you know it's telepathy and not something else?
Occam's Razor.
>It can still work, but on average, it'll work better with something supernatural, unexplainable, unknown involved, if only because it gives the subconscious (or whatever you want to call it) more space to act.
Experience suggests it may be something else. Like, why does yoga kick the magic into overdrive? and it does.
>>17530881
>How many km?
In-person. Over distance, I do concede that telepathy is the more likely explanation.
>why does yoga kick the magic into overdrive?
Same reason. Yoga naturally stimulates the autonomic nervous system and gives more space towards the subconscious to act by quieting down conscious interference.
>>17530884
another point of view why yoga makes magic more efficient;
all magic is manipulation of a polarized living energy, called electric and magnetic fluid in hermetix, prana shakti and manas shakti in tantra respectively. so the hermetic axiom "as above, so below" implies that the more one is able to control energies internal, the more one has authority over external forces. certain schools of yoga rely entirely or for a very large part on an individual's ability to manipulate internal energies - pranayama doesn't translate to breathing exercises or control of breath, it is in fact control of prana, control of the polarized living energy. whereas modern western ritual magic uses complicated mental structures like kabala to direct and manipulate force, eastern initiates (i generalize but whatevs) tend to rely more on direct interaction with internal and external energies through sensitizing oneself to currents of force. it's a pretty cool subject one could say more of. combine and profit, bros!
TO WHOEVER PUT THAT STUPID CURSE ON ME!
Please stop. I was wrong. I can't take it anymore.
>>17531008
sorry, you can go now.
paranormal is fuckin alive bro.
Has anyone here ever gotten in trouble for doing occult things/spells?
>>17531110
Yeah, people get killed for that in Saudi Arabia.
>>17531118
How about in the western world? What about if one of your spells works... are there consequences? Do you get in trouble?
>>17530998z
It's why I recommend both hatha and raja. For magic, you need to be able to move the prana around and project it.
I should never, ever say "polarizing" or "electric" or "magnetic" in this context. I'm a fucking engineer. Fucking words have fucking meanings. Deal with it.
>>17531122
No, because magic isn't real.
That's why there's no laws against it.
I was reading the other thread about child sex rings (you know, those pedophiles, satanic elite); and I thought on asking your views on the subject.
Do you think that there are real magical powers involved beyond pure psychopathy there?
Do you think that magic could be done to prevent this from happening?
>>17531282
i suspect there is a "rush" that comes naturally from, say, murder, and i would conjecture that it is even more so with the innocent victems such as children.
>>17531309
you mean like an adrenaline rush? what does that to do with magic?
>>17531320
yea like an adrenaline rush. i heard about it watching documentaries on serial killers on youtube, guys like the zodiac killer for example. what does it have to do with magic? i suppose the rush can be interpreted as magical in a sense that it grants the murderer a feeling of some kind of personal superiority or godlikeness maybe given the performance of the forbidden act of murder, especially on somebody young and innocent. my take on it anyways.
>>17531229
Thanks for that response. Anyone else have an opinion?
>>17531122
you mean legal consequences? no, sorcery and witchcraft have been legal for a while now, though i dimly recall that in the UK there is a line saying sorcery is OK as long as you don't use it to harm others or something - maybe what they meant is that you can't sacrifice little kids. Not sure though, but anyways; rest assured, no serious prosecutor these days will accuse anyone of black magic. but there are karmic consequences (better accept it's real if you think magic is real) so you'll get yours, if not from the cops and judge
>>17531174
certainly words have meanings, but unlike numbers they are highly relative. engineering is a different context than magic. In linguistics, the word "paradigm" means one thing, in philosophy another. best not get too stuck up in words but aim to convey the ideas behind the words accurately - and i find that in context of hermetic magic electric and magnetic fluid describes pretty well the forces you interact with
>>17531720
>engineering is a different context than magic
Not at all. Applied science is applied science. I think that's one key to my success.
"Electric" and "magnetic" are warning signs. Someone really hasn't thought this through.
>>17531832
In astrophysics, any atom with more than two protons is a metal. Words have different meanings in other fields of study.
>my success
"My success" is a warning sign. Obvious troll is obvious.
>>17531832
they're different contexts. the laws under which prana operates are different than those under which physical forces operate, applied science or not. but i'm not seeking to argue, just saying, words aren't absolute things. maybe we can stick to hindu terminology then and call it prana shakti and manas shakti, but we could call it "that cohesive reflective emotional really fine kinda alive stuff" and "that dynamic impulsive intentional alive stuff", you know, and still kinda get what is being talked of. you use the words that suit you, i'll stick with standard hermetix
what do you mean by succcess? i'm honestly curious
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYHjQaBvV1M
>>17524147
Is there any way to turn back time?
>>17524147
magic ain't real
Once you get into this shit, Is it normal to get paranoid seeing symbols and meanings everywhere and feeling like reality is gonna break apart every moment?
>>17533854
Maybe, if you're losing your shit.
>>17533871
Did anyone else go through this stage? BECAUSE IT IS A STAGE, RIGHT?
>>17531855
>you use the words that suit you, i'll stick with standard hermetix
At least you're entertaining.
>what do you mean by succcess? i'm honestly curious
I got what I wanted. What other kind of success is there?
>>17533558
Yes and no. Takes a.lot of 'power', though.
>>17533854
Fairly normal, yeah. It can be a result and a sign of trouble. It's useful to cultivate a sense of.detached indifference, not get too excited about such.things.
Ah, April Fools! The favorite holiday of 12-year-olds of every age.
>>17533916
>Yes and no. Takes a.lot of 'power', though.
Care to expand on that?
You know what it scares me most about magic? The fact that, if it works, it means that the elites have access to it. Is like no matter how good at it I am, they will always be more time and resources and in the end they'll use that power for who knows what evil things
Not trying to blog, but will tell my story for context before my enquiry. I started reading up on chaos about eight weeks ago. Didn't jump straight into magical work (not done any banishings or other rituals,) but designed my own system for constructing sigils (I'm a visual artists, so was automatically drawn to the idea,) and sketched a few of them down in my little book. Wrote down some intentions/affirmations.
Anyway, during the first weeks of researching magic, I realised how I've been sort of doing magical work for years, but never realised that it was magic (think The Law of Attraction, vision boards etc,) and never had any real system for it.
I work part time in a dead-end job, and been sick of going to work for months now. In February I was waiting to receive some money from my insurance company, and was preparing to ask my boss for a three-six week long vacation (length depending on the amount of money.) Was very focused on not going to work, no matter what, this was on my mind constantly. And then, first week of March I fractured my ankle. I'll be in crutches until second week of June.
Would anyone else here blame yourselves for not specifying what kind of circumstance should lead to not having to go to work? I know I didn't exactly draw any sigils for leaving work, and I certainly didn't fire any of them, but my overall daily thinking at the time was really only focused in two things: magic and not having to go to work.
What are your thoughts, /omg/?
>>17531711
http://www.dirgemag.com/mississippis-new-religious-equality-bill-paves-way-human-sacrifice/
>>17533910
thanks, dat attitude tho... i dunno mayne, i guess there are heaps of reasons why people choose to start occult studies. egoistic pursuit of getting what you want is one. obtaining K&C of HGA is one. learning your true will is one. changing and sublimating flaws of personality is one. so i was just wondering what counts as success with you. as a sidenote, the reason i got in with this stuff was something of an existential crisis - i wanted to know what i'm here for. what is it that you want? again, just curious, it's kewl to hear how other people take to this stuff
>>17533920
It's largely beyond the scope of this board. Enough to say that the physical reversal of time is impossible.
>>17533921
Fortunately, it doesn't work that way.
>>17533923
>Law of Attraction
Shitty meme seized upon by shitty people to sell shit to weak people to get them focused on wanting shit and feelies rather than changing anything.
~t. occultist of 15 years
>>17533921
this is only partly true. sure the elite use magic, but it's a different kinda ballgame altogether. black vs. white and left vs. right are really quite outdated ways to express what i'm trying to say, but bear with me; to choose to work for the good of others at your own cost gives you the support of everything. to choose to abuse others for your own gain puts you equally at odds against everything. so the so-called black brothers vampirize their power and attempt to violently force nature. a so-called white bro will co-operate with the natural process of unfolding and is aided by nature all the way. egoistic pursuits are always limited to the personal power one can muster, and many say this will prove fatal in the end when the black bro can no longer resists the overwhelming forces of nature and is doomed to face a rather bitter disintegration, whereas a white bro is not limited to use only personal power but is in fact aided and guided by all of nature. but again, the strict division of black vs. white is really outdated
>>17533936
>Fortunately, it doesn't work that way.
would you care to explain? I would make me feel a lot better
>>17533923
>Would anyone else here blame yourselves for not specifying what kind of circumstance should lead to not having to go to work?
Probably. My petitons read like legalese.
>>17533934
I wanted to attain. I wanted to know whether there was anything to magic. I wanted to play in the big leagues. I wanted to be a Master of the Temple. I wanted enlightenment.
I didn't know it at the time, but what I really wanted was to be whole.
>>17533947
The more powerful systems have their own guardians, with their own agendas.
>>17533946
This is pretty good.
>>17533923
I think it helps to be specific. The better you get at focusing your intention the more careful you have to be with your thoughts. Nowadays I always make a note to include health and safety when expressing intent. Also consistent gratitude is a pretty safe state to try and exude because for the most part, one wouldn't be grateful for pain and discomfort. Keeping that feeling of gratitude present as much as possible helps attract situations which one would feel genuinely grateful for.
In short, keeping focused on not having work was the right way to go as far as brute force. To protect yourself in the future - sorry about the ankle by the way - probably the safest and simplest way to ensure that one stays safe and healthy without mishaps is to cushion that singular intent with the thought of, "I'm so thankful that things worked out to where I don't have to work, and I am pleased to enjoy my time doing something more pleasurable."
I experienced something similar. I worked at a job which I was miserable at, and like you, after just getting into chaos systems, I solely focused on the "not having to work" part. I developed an allergy to something we used to clean, it made me break out in hives like mad and I had to quit. Haha.
Sigils are really helpful, especially for complex and long term project, but words and thoughts are spells in their own right. Sometimes people are inclined to take their effects for granted because thoughts come so freely. You sound like you have a good deal of power and potential focus built up - I know you can turn around your situation anon!
>>17533923
it's important to define clearly what you wish for to happen - nature seems to work along the path of least resistance, and you breaking your ankle was probably the easiest way to get you outta work. then again you must leave sufficient room for nature to do her thing (rather will to 'make a lot of money at work next week' than 'make 3,169$ at 2:30pm on tuesday'). lovely how it's both an art and science, yeah?
brotip; work on introspection and character refinement until you have a clear grasp of your subconscious nasty tendencies, otherwise these might come and haunt you later on and prove to be a bitch to set straight. i know it's cool stuff and everyone wants to be a ritual hero, but... it can get a bit tricky if you build on sketchy foundation
t. dude who kinda went batshit crazy cause i didn't listen when i should've
>>17533937
I don't disagree with it being a meme, but you'd get to understand more if you weren't to presumptuous.
I've used it mostly for letting go of emotional stuff and controlling how well I adapt to change. Also, I'm very rarely sick, and been conscious of my thoughts in relation to health, and have been for the past twelve years. Very rarely do I get sick, even if a lot of people around me are. Not been focusing on material goods at all, and I haven't spent more than £10 for one DVD, and that was in 2007.
Would you say that the only way occult work works is with rituals and spells, and not your everyday thinking outside of temple?
>>17533956
>I've used it mostly for letting go of emotional stuff and controlling how well I adapt to change.
That doesn't sound like the laws of sympathetic magic as described by Frazier, that sounds like self-help styled yoga.
>Would you say that the only way occult work works is with rituals and spells, and not your everyday thinking outside of temple?
My point is this; when a tribal member enacts a sympathetic ritual to ensure the hunt, he doesn't stop there and wait wishing an animal would just stumble onto their spear -
>>17533959
They'd go out and hunt, if I would have not hit enter.
How much of this 'law of attraction' for health was simply going "huh I need to be healthy" and doing it?
That's not occult, that's minimum basic self-awareness.
Yes, practice subsumes everything, but spending your time wishing you were healthy and then acting in kind does not sound like it's leading anyone to the HGA or Boddhicita or dissolving self into the flame-bearing Eye of Shiva.
>>17533959
Sure, I agree. The reason I came to magic was actually a cry for help on /adv/. I've been depressed in recent years, and it actually began by disowning my prior faith in affirmative thinking and getting ridden with death anxiety. The letting go-thing is something I rediscovered in early 2015, and taught by a guy named Hale Dwoskin who teaches The Sedona Method. He's featured in The Secret, but he's sort of the least interesting speaker in the movie/book. He actually turns out to be the one with the most sound system for allowing change to happen in life.
Fast forward, I stopped being depressed, but I fell into apathy. This was the reason I asked about magic: I wanted to program my subconscious to make decicions that would get me back on track.
>>17533950
>>17533953
As I expected. Cheers both of yous.
>>17533969
>Hale Dwoskin who teaches The Sedona Method. He's featured in The Secret, but he's sort of the least interesting speaker in the movie/book. He actually turns out to be the one with the most sound system for allowing change to happen in life.
>The Sedona Method is just a few simple questions, apparently requiring $400 of CDs to fully comprehend:
>Step 1: Focus on an issue you would like to feel better about.
>Step 2: Ask yourself one of the following questions: Could I let this feeling go? Could I allow this feeling to be here? Could I welcome these feelings?
>Step 3: Ask yourself the basic question: Would I? Am I willing to let go?
>Step 4: Ask yourself this simpler question: When?
Ayo bruh the library's free and actually has shit written by mystic logicians, poets, and contemplatives.
>>17533975
I haven't spent a dime. Just saw this video, and it's all quite easy to follow, and it helped me loads last year, with immediate effect.
http://youtu.be/psBuPo1ez0M
>I welcome the issue
>I welcome any need to do anything
>I welcome the notion that it's personal
Before
>Can I, Will I, When
>>17530998
Interesting.
>>17533918
The name's very appropriate.
>>17530304
Thanks, tried the Betty Erickson method last night and it was stronger and better than everything I had ever tried before, but I still couldn't get into a trance. Maybe I just suck.
>>17533874
What do you mean? Literally everything is a stage. Memento Mori.
>>17534365
>stronger and better than everything I had ever tried before,
What results did you get?
>but I still couldn't get into a trance
Perhaps you're expecting something which isn't hypnosis, or hypnotic trance? (the two are different)
Here's my explanation of what it is:
http://hypnox.pl/what-is-hypnosis/
>>17533950
>he better you get at focusing your intention the more careful you have to be with your thoughts.
1000x this.
Also reminded me of this guy, don't let the Jesus thing put you off the message is great:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKS_QIPet-k
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNloJT8-pfw
>>17534369
Well I'm not sure of what a true trance would be like, but I have experienced self-induced deep trances before, usually with psy music. I had flashes of my early childhood, stuff from a time I was barely walking on my own feet, and came out of it drowned in tears. It's not the same as other experiences, that's for sure.
I can meditate and clear my mind in seconds in normal daily life, but I hate sitting in the dark to "meditate". My notion of trance is that state I achieve (sometimes) after an hour of meditation, but that state is easily dispelled by losing focus. I believe a true hypno-trance would be a lot more stable and noticeable but I might be wrong.
I'm going to try it again on a more serious setting, but the only result I got so far was relaxation.
>>17534397
>I'm not sure of what a true trance would be like
It's not like anything. When a person is in a hypnotic trance, they feel what they are suggested to feel.
>I believe a true hypno-trance would be a lot more stable and noticeable but I might be wrong.
There was an experiment a friend of mine did, where they hypnotized people, then basically went like:
- Do you think you're hypnotized?
- Yes.
- How do you know?
- By the tingling in my hands.
- I'm going to snap my fingers, and the tingling disappears. (hypnotist snaps fingers) Do you think you're hypnotized?
This went on to the point where the person would either say "no" or "I don't know". It is absolutely repeatable.
It really goes back to the definition of hypnosis as the bypassing of the critical faculty of the conscious mind. A hypnotized person by definition accepts all the things they're told on their face value, provided they're not emotionally jarring.
>>17533949
You mean metaphysical guardians? gods?
Anyhow, chaos magic for example doesn't have any kind of guardian. What prevents a group of psychos to use it without moral boundaries?
>>17534377
>>17533950
>The better you get at focusing your intention the more careful you have to be with your thoughts
Start doing this and you won't be able to think freely in your whole life.
>>17534484
I felt an itch on my face, and I suggested to myself: "you feel nothing, your face is completely numb". I could feel myself a bit more relaxed, but the itch got worse. Same for other discomforts along my body. I didn't feel like the suggestions were working.
>>17534563
>suggesting to yourself
Shit-tier excuse. Get a friend to hypnotize you. Everything you need is on my website.
The reason why self-hypnosis is so fucking hard is because it prevents you from reaching deeper states of hypnosis because you still have to THINK in order to give yourself suggestions.
>>17534559
Well I think that is exactly the opposite.
If your thoughts manifest your reality (and they do, even if you only acknowledge "psychological" effects) than thinking that you are a worthless piece of shit all day everyday will make it so. There is no freedom when you are poor and hated.
Thinking freely is not a good thing if all you choose to think is shit, IMO.
Also freedom is not the same as doing what you want, I think freedom is doing what you would wish for if you had true freedom, which you do not. A monkey is not free just because it wishes to live in his cage for ever.
>>17534567
Fair enough, but if the only way to use hypnosis is to have someone else with me every time, then it is useless for me.
>>17534581
>Fair enough, but if the only way to use hypnosis is to have someone else with me every time, then it is useless for me.
Once you have your deep trance triggers, what you can do is, give yourself a pre-hypnotic suggestion, then trigger yourself (kek), go into deep trance for a few seconds for the effect to stabilize, and then move out of trance, and the effect sticks.
It's a matter of practice after that point. The first thing, however, is to get the ability to go into really altered states of mind at will, with precision and speed.
>>17534532
>Anyhow, chaos magic for example doesn't have any kind of guardian
You are did mistake, the Chaos Dragon is in my mind, and he also is in mine of others.
Surely, Chaos magic is contain a lot of freedom, and because this the Chaos magic get a lot of freedom fighters on their side.
>>17534596
...are in mind of others...
fix my-selves.
Is there any example of Occultism or Magick being fairly accurate in videogames?
Even if it leads to some dude with a big hat shooting fireballs, stuff like symbolism or philosophy.
>>17534605
I hear it's quite accurate in El Shaddai, however I can't really confirm or deny because the gameplay was utter shit and I dropped it.
It's surprisingly accurate in Bayonetta, though.
>>17534605
Well, in game "Blood" using a magic doll was pretty nice, except lack of words of spell and matter link in body of doll to enemies. Even maybe some kind of software should work well as magic spell, why devilish not, computers is part of this word of matter is.
>>17534616
>word of matter is.
...world...
>>17534623
...world of matters and spirits is...
>>17534638
thank
>>17534589
Thanks, that was my thought too. I'm gonna find a way to get hypnotized and program some triggers.
>>17534605
The Witcher 3 has an awesome story, and it is based on real folk lore. There are hundreds of examples of games that try to be edgy and occulty but mostly they just paint a pentagram somewhere and make o effort to provide context.
Occultism is much more about context and story than it is about using a talisman to summon an elemental or something like that.
>>17534641
>I'm gonna find a way to get hypnotized and program some triggers.
There's quite a few people online who do this kind of stuff for free; most work in text, which is very much sub-optimal, but it's entirely possible you'll find someone who will be up to help out, if your buddies aren't very big on hypnosis.
>>17534605
The Elder Scrolls, especially Morrowind.
>The 36 lessons of Vivec have a huge inspiration from occultism. I think it was Crowley, idk.
>Mages worship the sun, Magnus. Magnus built the layout of reality and is literally The Great Architect of the Universe.
>Willpower is is a stat that effects magic.
>Mysticism is a school of magic. It has books detailing how it works.
>The line between theology and magic is non existent, with priests practicing magic and mages having better perspective of cosmology.
>Magicka is essentially Chi.
>The lore was written in part by a whacked out theology major with a hard on for Mysticism.
>Metaphysics include things like the universe being the dream of a god that everything is an aspect of, like Brahman. Kalpas are also a thing, even if not exactly the same.
How do I into Tarot?
>>17534660
Just buy explanation book with a Tarot desk.
>>17534664
I need a special desk to do it on?
>>17534650
I'm gonna find a hypnotherapist, and I also talked to my wife and she is going to assist me. I have a few books on me like Dave Elman's Hypnotherapy, and I have derived a step-by-step instruction for us to experiment.
Using skype would be a lot better than text IMO. Still pretty awkward to try such an intimate experiment with anons, I think.
>>17534664
Is there a free one online?
>>17534668
Yes, special, suitable for an your soul.
>>17534685
Well, you have my name and credentials on the website for what it's worth. I'd still have to get Skype on this computer, but if you want, I'm up to help, provided I have time.
>>17534692
Can't afford 20 bucks for something you wish to learn about? Are you 12? From magic you only get from it what you put in it.
Go to the Tarot folder here:
https://mega.nz/#F!AE5yjIqB!y7Vdxdb5pbNsi2O3zyq9KQ!pNIG3a5Z
>>17534704
you mean http://hypnox.pl ? It's down for me.
>>17534692
Software algorithm is different from paper desk. Also a paper desk will have contact with aura of palm.
>>17534706
Nah, I just got a deck, and wanted to start right now, instead of waiting a few days to for it to ship on amazon.
Thanks man.
>>17534712
HUH.
Well, whatever the case might be.
https://archive.is/zV0Ji
Poland strong
>>17534731
>stronk
fix'd
>>17534581
>The better you get at focusing your intention the more careful you have to be with your thoughts
You're speaking about something more akin to illumination, maybe. But that's not the power to focus your attention. Just some wisodm to know what you really want. But illumination is never permanent, at some point you're gonna get enraged, drunk or just distracted and have unwanted thoughts. Will them also be propelled into reality? that's why you should not play with this things
← Is it illegal?
>>17534785
The mind and imagination are the most powerful tools at your disposal. They are neutral and do what you will. I can get rich and spend all of it on blow and hookers, die of overdose alone etc. That doesn't mean I won't "play with" money. Nothing is safe.
>>17534397
>Well I'm not sure of what a true trance would be like
There are different trance straights.
>>17534721
In that case you can use this gif: http://imgur.com/45WVLm9.
Disable the loop, then click show controls. Enable the loop and play. When you feel the urge to pause it, press pause and note the card, then move on.
You can also use a random number generator to pull some numbers for you between 1 and 72 and then use those jpgs. The order is: Major arcana by number, wands, swords, cups, disks. Ace, 2, 3.... 10, princess, prince, queen, knight.
As someone else pointed out, use this for practice. For serious divination you need the physical objects most of the time.
>>17534532
>You mean metaphysical guardians? gods?
Sure.
Chaos magic has serious limitations.
>>17534884
you're thinking ALL THE TIME. At any time you're gonna make unwanted associations. Hell, you know what an OCD is? just like that, but with magical effects
>>17535101
That's why we have discipline. That's why the east invented meditation. That's why people join orders and societies. That's why Liber Jugorum exists.
In the real world you can't just download the stuff you want, you need to suffer and work.
Do see the connection here?
>>17535113
>Liber Jugorum
Googled it. Looks more a book on how to go mad in 3 easy steps than on how to keep a straight mind
>>17534947
>Chaos magic has serious limitations.
Care to enlighten us? I'm very interested on the "firewalls" of magic; I mean, the failsafes it has to prevent its abuse.
>>17534596
>the Chaos Dragon is in my mind
nigga what is that dragon you talk about
>>17533949
I always thought that people kinda made their own gods and systems.
>>17535162
>Care to enlighten us?
I'm not worried about anything that doesn't have robust command and control structures.
>>17535146
You're weak.
>>17535177
I've seen that claim. Why reinvent the wheel?
>>17535210
>>17535210
>I've seen that claim. Why reinvent the wheel?
maybe to NOT have a guardian in my magic system. Just make up a belief system with no guardians whatsoever and you have it.
>>17524147
can you recommend any hypnosis lectures on youtube or podcasts I can listen while doing other stuff?
I got a bunch of silver and gold bullion coins and bars. Anything occult / magic that I can do with it?
I'm not sure if this is the right thread, but I would like to get some thoughts on >>17535820. Thanks :)
>>17533950
10/10 name holy shit
also, *bump*
>>17535978
Can't tell if trips are working but someone tell Thoth to check his email and accept that invite before we're both effectively cucked
>>17535215
If you refuse to accept the wisdom of others because you don't want to believe in a guardian or something similar, then you will never progress beyond the level of a novice. Even shamans, true chaotes if you ask me, pass down ancestral knowledge.
>>17535162
>Chaos Dragon
Tiamat yo.
>>17533946
most people are grey
>>17534532
>chaos magic for example doesn't have any kind of guardian
It has the fully awakened octo-mind.
>>17535375
Not really. I'm more of a reader than anything else. For what it's worth, the how2hypnotise channel on youtube is an excellent intro to practical applications.
Let there be no more names and get back to normal.
>>17537406
No.
>>17524273
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VhaR9656LOg
Dan Dennett. Ants, terrorism, and the awesome power of memes. TED 2002.
https://archive.org/details/www.ted.com-DanDennett_2002__video_TEDTalks_Ants_terrorism_andtheawesomepowerofmem
Weaponizing Cultural Viruses - Memetics - Hacking - 26C3-3570.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Utw7CgwYAvY
>>17533921
<
Human Resources: Social Engineering in the 20th Century.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rnJEdDNDsI
MK Ultra Documentary by ABC News.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ND2CmD_k4XI
>>17537553
>memes
Shreq?
Also I don't see a relationship between what I'm saying about magic and memes.
>>17537563
Is more like a relationship of something said in a dew threads back I think. That if one can only influence minds, how can someone influence reality.
Also, the MK Ultra thing, sounds like modern voodoo zombies.
>>17537597
*few
damn keyboard
>>17524273
>And I've yet to witness anything I couldn't explain otherwise, save for ONE incident.
what about the wounds healing?
To all Thelemites lurking: what are your thoughts on this:
http://www.astronargon.us/Holy%20Conundrum.doc
>>17537935
>pjr
Probably trash.
>>17537935
Rovelli, exceptionally, isn't wrong in this one.
>>17538075
What's the deal? I don't wanna give his site any views.
>>17538079
IIRC it's the date of the Holy Days.
Also
>giving sites views is srs bsns now
Please. Just admit you don't care enough.
>>17538075
>>17538079
So why the date change? Did A.C change it or did the OTO revise it later?
>>17538113
Crowley, most likely. That's what their tickets suggest.
>>17538138
Are you talking about Liber Al? It was April 1st, apparently.
>>17538151
Yes.
>>17538153
Jones dug pretty deep into this. They'd left Egypt before the 8th.
>>17538160
That's basically what Rovelli says in that file.
The one thing I don't get is... why fool people into believing it was the 8th?
>>17538164
Good question. After the opus in North Africa, he seems to have realized that he could make something of 220. It was apparently a vehicle for his message. He knew he could roll his own religion and.ppl would fall.for it.
>>17538172
so by changing it he could hide that it is basically an Aprils Fools joke?
thelema is for tryhards
>>17531110
well russians have openly had some metaphysical government departments, i'm assuming america and other countries do too, so i guess if your spells are too powerful or you try to impact something that undermines the gov they can try and shut you down but not openly and it won't be along legal means anymore...
>>17533950
>The better you get at focusing your intention the more careful you have to be with your thoughts. Nowadays I always make a note to include health and safety when expressing intent. Also consistent gratitude is a pretty safe state to try and exude
So it is common practice to perform magick in environments made pure/harmonious/aligned through ritual so as to better focus one's 'signal' and achieve results, right? And likewise is done internally.
But magick itself, outside of performed behavior/ritual, is fueled and more importantly guided predominantly by the subconscious, right? We communicate/interact with the forces of reality subconsciously.
So, shouldn't we trust ourselves? Shouldn't we trust that we instinctually do not wish to bring harm to ourselves and that we inherently express this intention?
I think this intent would be more likely to be inherently expressed subconsciously than the expression of gratitude. I understand focusing on the specific expression of gratitude as that is more of a conscious thought of a self-aware being. It seems to me personal well being would be programmed in at a fundamental level due to evolutionary biology (natural divinity), even when dealing with magick and the 'spiritual realm.'
Making note to include health and safety when expressing intent can't hurt, but I think there is concern when you let your intrusive thoughts gain power. And I think that is done when they are feared. The best way to deal with them may be to confront them head on and address the source of the anxiety causing such thoughts through meditative introspection.
If one is internally aligned, they should be able to trust their own subconscious strength and desire/ability to protect one's self. If they have 'contacted their guardian angel/higher self,' then they should feel at ease. Faith is key to magick, right? So shouldn't one have faith in self?
How about a pol folder?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UiqTNCnFv8
>>17540538
I really liked your post
Elites have cults where they make evil
Sadhus are powerful, but are detached from the world and only care about inner trascendence
Why there is not a justice league equivalent? I mean, a club of people that uses magic for the sake of the world? Why aren't you a superhero?
What do you recommend for someone to get into the occult? I've been reading some stuff about those english magicks and organized cults and they aren't very impressive. I've read a some parts of some medieval grimoires but no usefull knowledge was made (mostly catholic stuff, read it just out of curiosity). The mega file is too large.I'm interested in
>sigils
>amulets, talismans
>familiars
>>17541727
Start with a study of neuropsych and hypnosis.
Then move into the more narrative-driven anthropology of ritual, and only later move into concrete systems. From the general, to the particular. The other way is significantly more difficult.
>>17541734
Are they in the mega? Do you have any recomendations? Most the british organized cults are more political and gibber jabber than anything else it seems.
>>17541744
Mesmer's Lair, here:
>>17524154
Basically start with Elman's "Hypnotherapy", as it goes into some science, and then read whatever you can find on Neuropsych, and then move into Ledochowski, as he uses A TON of neuropsych principles in order to influence.
>>17541647
thanks, pal
>>17541750
Why you suggesting that crap for him? That's new age self-help level of shit.
Can anyone recommand a starting point, book or video, about egyptian magic? I heard pretty much everywhere that Budge's book was nice to read but a bit "dated".
>>17541912
>That's new age self-help level of shit.
More like applicable neuropsych with higher effectiveness than CBT.
I'm a huge beginner, I'm looking for a path, what are the kind of magic that are closest to nature? (besides shamanism I suppose)
On the opposite side, what are some kind of post-magic using what we have at hand nowadays?
From liber null:
>There are three parts to the operation of a sigil. The sigil is
constructed, the sigil is lost to the mind, the sigil is charged.
>To successfully lose the sigil, both the sigil form and the associated desire must be banished from normal waking consciousness. The magician strives against any manifestation
of either by a forceful turning of his attention to other matters. Sometimes the sigil may be burnt, buried, or cast into an ocean.
>The sigil is charged at moments when the mind has achieved quiescence through magical trance, or when high emotionality paralyzes
its normal functioning. At these times the sigil is concentrated upon, either as a mental image, or mantra, or as a drawn form.
If the sigil is physically destroyed and gone from my mind, how am I supposed to concentrate on it at such moments?
>>17524225
Yes, Palo Monte has some pretty observable spells. I hear that Haitian Voodoo is pretty strong too.
>>17542249
Read it and see.
>>17542295
>I'm looking for a path, what are the kind of magic that are closest to nature?
Wicca's a possibility, as is Neo-Paganism, generally.
Don't know about "post-magic". Explain?
>>17542332
>If the sigil is physically destroyed and gone from my mind, how am I supposed to concentrate on it at such moments?
Presumably, you did so before you.destroyed it.
>>17542638
>Don't know about "post-magic". Explain?
Just made up the term. I meant, recent kind of magic, possibly interacting with technology or something, as opposed to traditional, natural magic. Not sure if clear. Not sure if it even exists.
>>17542666
Some chaos magic might fit the bill.
Magic survives as a living tradition. It's roots reach deep into the past and engage the present.
>>17542666
Make something up. I'm a beginner as well, and I went straight for chaos magic - which, to the best of my knowledge, isn't a system in and of itself, but rather allows for any part of any other system to be utilized. What the other anon quoted; you can burn, bury or cast at sea your sigil... but why not lose it in cyberspace? Create your own system, post it on 4chan and let it get lost in the archives, use you imagination. I just came up with that, and I'm sure a lot of experienced occultists will probably disagree, but as stated
>nothing is true
>everything is permitted
What helped me get into this shit was this PDF:
http://www.philhine.org.uk/writings/pdfs/orchaos.pdf
Remember, fellow beginner, you can charge sigils for summoning the magical system that works best for you.
A white person doing haitian magic/voodoo. Why does that feel weird? Should it?
>>17542644
I just cut out the middle man and don't make sigils in the first place.
There's no way I can remember what I haven't made, therefore they're by nature the most powerful.
It's not like any of you will believe me but i successfully summoned a succubus through meditation of the third eye. We talk telepathically and she physically manifests to touch me and shit. It's been pretty cool but it's not what i expected, i just wanted a demon friend to hug cuddle and kiss but i can't talk her into doing that. Anyone here have an experience with succubi?
>>17542881
>he only has one succubus
get a load of this cuck.
>>17542896
actually there are like 3 other succubi that come to visit me every once in awhile but my main girl is always with me.
>>17542881
How do you third eye?
>>17542914
>"""girl"""
>not futa
neophyte detected
>>17542989
Take a pen or a pencil (something sharp) and put the pointy end right above you nose and between your eyes but not touching the skin. You will feel pins and needles and it's uncomfortable but that's your third eye and what you need to meditate on.
>>17543078
They're succubi bro they are into kinky shit. i'm not new to this we've done futa, loli, traps you name it. The only thing iv'e made clear we shouldn't do is scat and even then i have to deal with that bullshit time form time.
>>17542881
>self-hypnosis
Anyone want to get a succubus, with full visual and sensory hallucinations? You get to pick how it looks, how it behaves, and how nasty it is.
Only $300 per!
>tfw I could run this as a business
So, Austin Osman Spare
Should I into The Book of Pleasure and The Focus of Life
>why?
>why not?
filip ty tryhardzie
>>17544458
Huehuehuahue.
Co tam?
>>17544405
sure, i like spare's writings but i'd be careful in trying to adapt his system as such - he himself seemed to think everybody should make their own symbols. if you are crafting the so-called alphabet of desire, your own set of subjective magical glyphs, he's well worth reading - also it's pretty deep philosophically somehow though many things i don't really get what he's trying to say
Can I ask for your views on a subject that is bugging me?
Some occultists regard satan as a real guy
Wicca doesn't believe in satan, but in the Horned God that is totally not evil
Buddhism doesn't believe in gods.
If all that systems work, doesn't that mean that all this beliefs (which contradict each other) are just in one's mind?
that would surely proof that
a) entities are not real, and just are projections of our minds
b) entities are interpretations of a real spiritual force. What we know as gods are just mental constructs that we use to visualize the different aspects of this force.
c) entities are created by the viewer and have a life of their own. This can imply that somehow entities can manage to outlive their creators.
>>17544667
a is kinda true with some entities
b is true
c is kinda true with some entities
not an expert, but the way i see it is that there are many "hierarchies" of entities in the cycle on manifestation that is a two way current between mind of god and material world, of descending spirit and ascending matter, involution and evolution, and some of these high entities are fully self-conscious and can express themselves to human perception in many ways. then again there are natural forces that lack self consciousness and free will, and these in turn are interpreted by the human mind so they tend to be personified and seen in forms resembling humans (anthoposofistified, can't spell the fancy word). i think subjectivity plays a very prominent part in post-modern occult, age of aquarius and all
>>17544667
>If all that systems work, doesn't that mean that all this beliefs (which contradict each other) are just in one's mind?
First off, ignore this shitposter:
>>17544699
Second off, the terminology is vague. Occuckists love vague terminology, but I don't consider myself an Occuckist. For the sake of the conversation, "entity" will be "a conscious intelligence without physical form, verifiably separate from whom or what its interacting with". Anything else along those lines, that isn't that, is "imaginary friend".
Given that, unless you can somehow show that entities actually do anything whatsoever, beyond what you pretend they do while rolepalying a wizard inside your mind... this rules out C.
As far as B goes, in reality, no, for the same reason it rules out C. If we're talking pure superstitious belief and the evolution of religions, then sure, multiple """gods""" have been called by different names, their attributes shift slightly depending on culture and time, etc.
A is the most logical answer, until someone can summon a demon that tells me what color my underwear is. Then it might actually be worth looking into.
>>17544743
>without physical form, verifiably separate from whom or what its interacting with
Then it's impossibru because "no physical form" means "outside of nature" which is by definition making it impossible to interact with something physical.
>>17544667
A B and C don't follow at all from any of that.
>>17544667
>Buddhism doesn't believe in gods.
Not true, really.
>>17544699
Not a bad answer.
Some of the constructs are quite old. Some aren't. Those with agency are bound by the same karma as ourselves.
Hey /omg/,
How can I find a deities name, or nature?
Here's a bit of backstory:
A few months ago I found from my grandfather on my fathers side that I will "inherit" a deity.
Apparently, this deity has been revered in my family for generations, until the last 2 generations, starting with my grandfather, when he decided to adopt the faith of Pentecostalism during his late 20s.
The family before that was registered as Orthodox, but never followed the christian faith.
A month ago, I went to visit my grandfather for the passing/transfer ritual. The ritual was pretty simple, no blood stuff or sacrifices, the carving of a seal on a big stone, next to all the others. This stone is near the house where the first head
Now, my grandfather said that if I want to worship the deity, he won't stop me, he's kinda glad he got to pass it down to the next in line, since my father didn't want to have anything to do with it.
Didn't think this will be this long.
continued in next post
>>17544823
Where is your grandfather?
>>17544823
which kind of deity it is? I mean, which function does it handle?
Also which ethnicity is your family?
>>17544823
Also part of the ritual is the story of how the deity came into our family:
While looking for a place to settle, my ancestors came across a opening in the forest, and decided to settle there. While they were settling, 2 deities where fighting over the portion of the land my family decided to settle on. So each of the deities came to the head of the family to seek for help in fighting the other one.
They both promised to help the family, one said it will help and care for a 100 generations and the other upped it to 1000 generations, so my greedy ancestor went for the biggest bidder.
And that's how it came into our family.
>>17544835
>>17544852
I'm from Romania, but we are not really ethnically romanians, we are part of the Ukrainian minority, living in the northern part of Romania.
We are actually Hutsuls, a subgroup of Ukrainians living in Romania.
The people from my grandfathers village call us molfars.
I think that means wizard in their language.
>>17524147
some people can naturally talk via telepathy
I've had someone attempt to use hypnosis on me... it usually involves drugging someone and talking to them via telepathy in order to get them to do stupid shit
I was drugged at an Emergency Room so avoid these kinds of places if you aren't surrounded by good people,
the zombies working inside them can take advantage of you, send you to the crazy house, etc.
