Previous thread: >>3220676
This thread is for the spirited discussion of CRT displays - Televisions, monitors and projectors used for the playing of retro games!
>Try to keep it /vr/-related: Nothing past 5th gen(+Dreamcast). Slight OT might be okay if related to CRTs (E.G. 16:9 compatible models, flatscreens, etc.) Systems with backwards compatibility are also pretty safe territory, assuming you're focusing on the older games. PC CRTs are also a-ok.
>Produce OC! Get out your real cameras and take beautiful pictures of your CRTs displaying recognizable characters with the kind of beautiful accuracy that brings tears to the eyes of young and old alike! If you take 100 photos, at least one of them will turn out alright! (maybe)
>Try to be as detailed as possible when asking info on a specific model. As always, google is your friend, and we are your friends with benefits. Older archived threads aren't a bad place to look either.
>Share appreciation for others choice of technology and personal philosophy of gaming. As always show courtesy in your discussion and moderate yourselves first.
Discussion of video processing and scaling devices is okay, but try to keep the focus on CRTs and CRT accessories
CRT Pastebin (WIP): http://pastebin.com/1Ri5TS3x
An Anon's Guide to CRT Hunting: http://pastebin.com/H9H9L2LQ
S-Video Pasta: http://pastebin.com/rH2h6C7W
Thread Survey: https://docs.google.com/forms/d/1PhdXJYwA8xModrTV1Yt-i1tvNgwiagpeBx0m_xNIVtc/viewform?edit_requested=true&fbzx=9009823977812318933
I have an older PVM with what I think might be an HV problem. When the set is cold it'll power up, but only for about 5 minutes. The picture flickers noticeably on a 240p signal. Then after a few minutes the tube powers down and goes quiet, as though turned off at the power including the sound. Everything else about the set still works as normal when this happens, the input buttons work, the sound, etc. Just the tube won't com back on.
Turning the set off for a moment and on again will see the tube power up again, but only for a few seconds before tube tube goes dead. Normally not enough time for it to warm up and show a picture.
Sometimes when the tube drops out there's a clicking noise from the board that has the HV regulator pot on it. At least, i think that might be it.
Any ideas about where to start with this one? Not after specific test point numbers yet, but areas to start looking. Might it be the snubber, of the x-ray cutoff?
how does this make you fell /vr/ ?
should I sneak in there at night and go thru them ??, its protected inside a fence .
Alright here we go, after waiting to pick it up for a month. Everything seems to be fine except for the obvious reason. Why would it do that?
>>3237425
Alright so I figured it out, it's the red bleeding over and it goes away if you turn the red down until it looks pink. Is there anything that'll fix it?
Post N64 pics
Preferably OoT
>>3237268
>PC monitors
I feel nothing.
>>3237425
>why?
Demonic possession probably.
>>3237024
Fuck, that's a delicious screen.
>>3237829
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXkN3nJyWEA
But there are some tvs in there, I can even see what looks like 2 scart inputs on one.
>>3237627
Not exactly conventional (n64 240p composite to 480i YPbPr via a VCR/DVD Recorder) but I have some Neon Genesis Evangelion for it.
>>3237627
>>3238189
>>3238193
>>3238198
Also, does anyone have any direct comparison shots between an RGB source coming in through a sync-stripped sync-over-composite input (LM1811, I believe) vs a Csync or Sync on Luma configuration?
I've seen a post mentioning there is still potential for noise/checkerboarding on large areas of solid color from a user on Shmups but I was under the impression that the Sync cleaner for Sync on composite would remove any artifact-causing noise from the video lines.
Any thoughts?
>>3238210
Better example is an old shot I have here of Popful Mail on a M2 Sega Genesis/ M2 Sega CD outputting RGBS with Sync coming through the aforementioned Sync on Composite pin (through the sync cleaner, etc.).
>>3238210
You have to put the stripper inside the console or very early on the cable, else the composite signal still travels along the whole length of the cable and polutes the RGB lines.
There's also the option of using Luma as sync as it doesn't polute the signals. That's what I did on SNES and PS2.
>>3238327
I now have a mental image of a tiny stripper pole and a tiny stripper inside a games console.
>>3238460
Waiting on a de-blur feature to be added to the N64 RGB before I invest in that. As for the 240p to 480i, that's simply how my Toshiba VCR/DVD Recorder handles passing that signal through it's YPbPr out. That and I don't have that damn NTSC decoder card for either BVM.
Essentially, it's temporary.
>>3238467
>de-blur feature
Link me some examples/ screenshots of the problem? Never heard of that before.
Are you referring to the built-in anisotropic texture filtering?
>>3238210
for some reason, it's a lot more visible on the 1410 than on the 1750
>>3238210
>>3238475
>>3238467
Couple BKM-21D modules on ebay for $80 right now, if you can live with just NTSC composite.
Didn't see any BKM-24D (NTSC and S-Video)
>>3238474
I am indeed addressing the hardware horizontal AA-filter that smears the hell out of the image.
I don't know the full hardware details of it but if I understand the explanation correctly, it would cut out every 2nd horizontal pixel which would normally be a blurred state merging the properties of the 1st and the 3rd pixels adjacent to it. As far as I'm aware, this doesn't discard any critical video information and still maintains the 320x240p output (de-blur doesn't apply on native 640x480i since those cases don't apply the hardware AA anyways)
>>3238484
Its 24N not D just for clarificaton. And the 27T would also work for NTSC. I manged to grab 24N for $60 plus shipping about a month ago. It was nice considering the only other listing us that one guy teying to $125 + shipping for one. I still dont think he's sold it.
>>3238061
It's clearly e-waste. Talk to the guys at the site or who run the site. Why would they object to you going through that stuff and helping yourself? The only issue is liability. Just sweet talk them, tell them the tech is obsolete but not replaceable, and someone finding a use for it is better than it (or parts of it) ending up as landfill. You probably won't even have to break in.
>>3237425
I can't get the colors to be quite right (I don't have the 240p test suite so this is the next best thing i could think of), and different colors make the geometry different at certain points, also quick flashes of screen filling white cause it to desync? Is this monitor just fucked?
>>3238658
Also I'm testing this over S-video because I don't have any RGB cables yet, could that be a reason?
I have been using a PVM for about a week, and while it's sharp as fuck, the blacks seem kinds of washed out. My apartment is pretty bright. Obviously it looks better at night. Is there something I can do to help the washer out look, or is my screen just getting old, or am I just being a taint?
>>3238672
I don't really know what you mean by washed out, but the older PVMs have a less dark coating.
Just avoid shining light directly on it imo.
>>3238658
Is that supposed to be all blue?
Reminds me of that defect XM29 I had a few months back before some part on whatever was generating the image raster blew. Would've tried repairing it instead of recycling/parting it out but it was probably shadow-mask damaged anyways.
*sigh*, good times.
>>3238672
post a pic
I'm the guy who was complaining about the ViewSonic G810 not going up to 180hz.
Turns out if your purchase includes a physical manual, you should trust it over the internet.
This thing only goes up to 160hz, not 180.
120hz was great news to me though, so I'm not complaining.
>>3238736
How did you unlock luigi
uguuuuuu
>>3238984
>consumer trinitron
>>3238994
It's not that bad. My stepbrother has a fuckhuge SD Trinitron Wega that looks quite decent over component (minus flat-tube geometry issues).
>>3239084
Take a closer look. Theirs is a Mitsubishi CRT. My post was of a different XM29 monitor I used to own that was indeed severely fucked. Theirs, I'm not 100% certain of (they may have just chosen different colors for the FFVII menu background, though that would be an odd example for addressing a question of color uniformity)
I'm going to make the drive to pick up a couple of 19" PVMs I won in an auction for $70 tomorrow morning.
I'll report back later with pictures.
>>3238886
Not a great shot, but...
I know this background is supposed to be a dark blue, but it still looks washed out, to me. This was when the room was pretty dark, and it still seemed noticeable. I find myself in a lot of areas in this game (Super Mario RPG) having to turn up the brightness or losing details in dark textures.
MegaMan Legends 2 on an 8044Q over RGB.
I have the vaguest of feelings that I've been connecting stuff to the wrong set of inputs on my Megaview.
I've always assumed it was the top 5 that was meant for input, but I'm currently feeding the bottom set from my laptop, and it seems to be giving me less problems; At least for this use, that is.
>>3238994
Better than an 8" PVMEME that requires custom cables.
So I have a strange issue: the faceplate of my Sony Trinitron WEGA is coming off. On the top and sides, it's perfectly fine, but the other day I noticed the bottom part of the silver frame around the actual screen is protruding in the center, coming away from the set. This hasn't affected my ability to use the buttons, but is this something I should be worried about?
>>3239367
What set? You might be able to turn the brightness down and the individual gain up. With some sets though, you have a bias for two and a gain for two, like R-Bias & G-Bias, B-Gain & G-Gain. Those are enough to work with for a set in good condition. But as sets age and fade, you may need to fiddle, say, turning up R-Bias and the two Gain adjusts. That way you get a nice bright picture, but have a red tint at low light. It beats not being able to see shit though.
>>3238189
>>3238193
>>3238198
>>3238210
here's a rgb shot of eva on my d20.
not the best photo.
>>3238546
>I manged to grab 24N for $60
i nabbed my 24n a few months ago for 75 shippedi'm pretty sure we've talked about it actually
i offered the expensive guy 100 bucks and he declined before i found the cheaper one
(haven't posted dancing bman in a while)
An old, on the shitty side RCA. SNES with S-Video. Looks brey good.
>>3238736
No the colors are supposed to be those colors, you can change the ff7 menu to 4 different colors. They're just not right, reds are more pink than they should be.
>>3237024
CRT noob here, what's out there in terms of portable CRTs that also have S-video or particularly component hookups? Something that can easily be carried around. Is it going to cost me an arm and a leg?
>>3240017
8/9 pvms/bvms
15/17 jvcs
consumer tv often lack proper handles.
>>3239834
Yeah i remember. Haha i was thinking about buying it and you made a decision before I did. The one I ended up buying actually wasnt coming up if you searched bkm-24N via ebay.
I was google searching and happened upon it that way and didnt hesitate to purchase it fearing someone else would. It works and everything was clean on it so Im happy with it.
Was missing the copper shielding piece but i have enough space to have blanks between my cards.
>>3239842
>checkerboard
get/make a better cable plz.
>>3238958
Rad dude. I guess the digital manual PDF was a lying stack of shit. Glad you're happy with 120hz. VSync probably looks great if you use it for PC gaming and your card is capable of 120fps.
>>3239326
Glad you won em. Open them up and post pics. Probably dusty af.
>>3239481
Probably not something worth worrying about. Post photos if nervous.
>>3238658
Well looks like I might have to recap it, I can't get yellows to properly display, everything is too red.
>>3239798
Here is another shot in full daylight in my place. I'm kind of guessing my room is too bright. I'm on a PVM14M4U. I don't know if it has bias adjustment, or not.
The black in games looks very similar to when the screen is off. I don't know if the black of 'off' is the theoretical darkest a CRT can get. I'd kind of imagine so.
>>3240430
Another
>>3240423
I opened it up and there doesn't seem to be any caps that are bulging, I'm not an expert though. How about those black things you can turn? Do those mess with the colors or it is just for convergence?
What's the smallest consumer CRT with s-video or component inputs?
>>3240530
some 14" flat sonys have component
>>3240496
The black rings? Convergence/focus adjustment. Avoid touching those unless you've literally run out of options. They're adjusted at the factory and the white line is painted to keep them in place. Only worth playing with if nothing else does the trick.
>>3240368
not bad for a $10 cable. For fuck sakes they want 80$+ for a "good" one. I've even seen some for double. Im happy with it. It's better than composite, and my OCD level isn't as high as yours. Thx for the feedback doe.
>>3240610
See if you can find the service manual for your monitor or a very similar one. It should have a section on purity and convergence adjustments. Typically it is a pain in the ass to perform and you need a way to feed the monitor solid colors and crosshatch patterns and depending on your monitor, some other equipment.
>>3240635
I could only find the service manual on those website where you have to buy it, but they look pretty sketchy so I dunno about actually buying them.
>>3239462
RCA -> BNC adapters are literally $0.75 on ebay
Is there a way to remove the 15.625kHz squeal from CRTs? Are there models which do not make this noise?
Also, this may seem like a retard question but do monitors make this noise, or just TVs? Because when I was a kid I remember my TV squealing but not my monitor, even though it would be logical for them to all squeal.
>>3240017
How small are you willing to go?
PVM-8045Q have higher resolution than most consumer sets (450 TVL), a convenient handle on top, and can take RGB/RGBs/Component/S-video/Composite.
You'll need some $0.75 RCA->BNC adapters ($2.50 at kikeshack) if you want to run RCA cables for composite/component/RGB, but that's not a big deal.
Only downsides are that it's only an 8" screen and over a foot deep. PVMs have a way bigger screen/depth ratio than consumer stuff does.
Available all over ebay for ~$100.
>>3240660
People can hear from around 20 Hz to 20 kHz.
TVs have a horizontal frequency of 15 kHz while most computer monitors have a frequency of at least 31 kHz.
>>3240660
480i is at 15khz, within human range.
VGA 480p is at 25 khz and Component 480p is at 31.5 khz, both out of human hearing range.
Some monitors are worse than others, but basically you're stuck with the squeal. On the plus side it goes away as your hearing gets worse. My hearing currently rolls off real fast above 15.9 khz, so if I keep working in this factory it'll be gone before long.
>>3240676
I like your outlook on life man
>>3240539
Any smaller sets? I found a small balck and white 5 inch CRT at a Value Village and I'm curious if there's any other tvs that size with s-video or component.
>>3240840
Sony made 5" PVMs, dunno really why you'd want a consumer set specifically. With consumer dot pitches & bleed you're not even going to have enough resolution to even make out NES games.
I've seen plenty of 5" B&W kitchen tvs, but never any consumer color sets at that size.
PVM-5041Q has RGB/RGBs/YPbPr/NTSC ins (no Y/C sadly), and 250 tv lines which is pretty good considering the size.
Sony KV-9PT40, AFAIK can be modded for S-video
I have a Sony PVM and as most of you will know, the tiny mono speaker is terrible. Before I got my Extron crosspoint switch I used to manually hook up my systems via scart to a bnc/RCA adapter that went to my PVM and stereo receiver. The switch really does make things easier but the audio connections on it are all Phoenix style and would require me to remove the RCA adapters on all of my cables and manually splice the wires into the switch. I'm looking at getting a dedicated audio switch with L R rca jacks for input and output but I haven't had much luck. How do you guys do it, especially with multiple systems hooked up at once?
>>3240872
A goodwill stereo receiver with about 8 inputs.
>>3240857
They're just easier to come by in my experiences, plus shipping prices to Canada is a pain.
>>3240872
Not actually making use of much of this at the moment, but:
3 Input SCART Switch -> 3 Input Audio switch
3/4 Input Component/S-Video/Composite Switch -> Audio Switch
LCD Analog Audio Out -> Audio Switch
Audio Switch runs to my Receiver.
Attic setup requires much more cable switching, mainly due to running audio from the Genesis/SCD and Saturn separately from their SCART cables. If I could figure out why I was just getting straight static from the modded AV port of the Genesis, I'd probably just use that; Model 2 connector would mean it'd still be stereo too.
>>3240872
I just use a dual female RCA -> stereo 3.5mm adapter and plug them into a 2.1 set I had laying around.
I use dual-sided mounting tape to attach the speakers to the side of monitor, put the sub under the desk. I use double-sided mounting tape to attach the satellites to the sides of the monitor. The speakers seem to be magnetically shielded (they were made back when CRTs were still common) so they don't fuck up the screen, unlike several of my modern sets.
I don't really switch systems every five minutes, so just unplugging the old scart and plugging in the new one doesn't bother me.
>>3240872
If your PVM has audio out, then run the audio out to a receiver. I do that with my consumer trinitron, but I'm not sure if PVMs do that.
>>3240872
You can buy phoenix to RCA adapters really cheap. If you want to use the extron switch for audio. I bought a pack of 50 for around $20
>>3240914
PVMs have audio out, but it's only mono (blechh)
>>3240923
Where did you pick them up? I can only seem to find long cables that are $20 a piece
The difference between 14M4Us and 14M2Us is just the number of lines? Does this make much of a difference for old games? In the manuals, the 2s look darker, but that could just be photography.
>>3240940
Pretty sure either one is overkill for retro (320/256 source TVL).
I think the difference is only really relevant for 480i stuff and up.
Would be interested if anyone's got one of each and could do some comparison shots.
>>3240937
Ebay. Search "RCA to screw terminal adapters"
>>3240937
Unless of course your extron switcher didnt come with the phoenix connector to screw terminals already then you might be SOL. But you could just buy the phoenix connectors as well. I was lucky the INLINE switch i bought had all the phoenix connectors with it.
Does anyone know of good S-video switcher that wont degrade signal? I have 3 svideo systems but only 1 input on my TV and its a hassle to reach behind the tv to switch it out
Are there any RGB cables for retro systems that end in BNC instead of scart? I'd like to use a extron switcher, but to do that, you'd have to buy a breakout cable for each one.
>>3241012
I was actually wondering the same thing. If I can't find anything im just going to add a VGA din port to all of my consoles and use a VGA to BNC cable.
What kind of bnc breakout cables do I get for this monitor? Just the regular PVM ones? This is my first monitor.
>>3241063
Unless you plan to run a SyncStrike or something of the sort inbetween, you'll want a SCART to BNC with a sync stripper (lm1881) built in. The Megaviews need composite sync for RGBS sources.
I run this between the sync line of my breakout cable and monitor.
>>3241012
>>3241026
That's what I plan to do eventually. The Multi Out to BNC would be the obviously cleaner and plug-n-play solution, but VGA would be simpler.
I posted this before but I thought I'd check again with people to see if anyone has any ideas.
Picked up a PVM-20L4 recently that was listed as broken. Turns on and displays 480i/60 but does nothing after that. Line B is selected but trying to put multiple consoles into it via BNC doesn't work, last thing I need to try is a PS2.
None of the menu buttons do anything and I can't seem to get it to change source at all. Anyone ran into anything like this before?
>>3241080
Not that guy but have a general question, once vertical sync is stripped using that chip, is the output just a clean hsync that needs nothing else done to it?
Meaning my sync 'S' from RGBS goes into Pin 2 on the lm1881, then H output will be on Pin 1 and V will be on Pin 3?
>>3241080
So this is all I'd need?
>>3241012
Make your own.
>>3240857
you could if you were right in front of it.
pic related 2.3" tv
>>3240430
The 14M4U has a good menu. Go into it and adjust things. Bias is the low light setting - a black screen should be black, and adjusted with the main brightness control as well. Equal levels at low light do not equal a black screen, they filaments and components may have drifted. Same goes for setting things to zero. The bias and brightness should be set so that none of the pixels are actually lighting up when you get close.
Gain is the contrast, again divided by colour - a bright white screen should be just that.
>>3241134
Composite Video/Luma goes to Pin 2
Composite Sync comes out Pin 1
I'm not entirely sure on everything required, but using an lm1881 to get H and V sync is more involved than that.
>>3241135
That should do the trick.
>>3241130
You're feeding composite, correct? Line 2 is the dedicated composite input on the L4.
It's entirely possible that whatever damaged/caused the buttons to malfunction is also affected something in the video circuitry.
>>3241283
Is there a chip/simple circuit out there that I can get RGBHV from RGBS?
>>3241283
EuroSCART to BNC was what I was trying.
>It's entirely possible that whatever damaged/caused the buttons to malfunction is also affected something in the video circuitry.
Is it possible to switch sources any other way, like switches on the board itself or is it just fucked? I checked for some user manuals but didn't see anything.
>>3241287
I'm sure there are ones that are simple enough out there, but nothing that I am aware of off the top of my head.
>>3241296
If your breakout cable does NOT have a sync stripper in it, and you're using any console with composite video for sync, connect the sync cable to the dedicated composite input on the back of the PVM. That should pass just the basic composite video signal to the proper circuitry and at least tell whether the monitor will display anything at all.
>Is it possible to switch sources any other way, like switches on the board itself or is it just fucked?
I -believe- it would be doable via the remote connection on the back panel of the monitor, but you'd need a BKM-10R or a way to use the deciphered protocol that was linked last thread (http://pastebin.com/aTUWf33J)
Which, now that I think about it, tossing that in the OP might have been a good idea too.
>>3237024
why are the scanlines so pronounced on that tv? is it like 7 inches or something?
>>3241335
It was an NES & Megadrive and I'm 99% sure the breakout doesn't have a sync stripper (it's just a breakout from retrogamingcables)
I was thinking I'd need a BKM which is next to impossible to get where I am unless I'm willing to pay a fuck ton of money to get one shipped.
I'll try what you've said to see if I can at least get a picture on screen. Thanks.
>>3241134
No, it only strips the video information. If you feed C-Sync in, rather than C-Vid, Pin 1 is still outputting C-Sync. But. Most systems have no problem accepting C-Sync as H-Sync. They'll just ignore the vertical pulse.
>>3241363
And pin 3 does output V-Sync, so it should work, AFAIK
>>3241352
>an NES
RGB modded, I hope. Otherwise, the only thing the breakout cable will get are sync(composite video) and one of the audio lines. I, amusingly, have a NES SCART cable laying around that doesn't get used since 2 simple RCA cables works just as well and doesn't take up a spot on my tiny switcher.
If you have a PS1/2 SCART cable, it would in all likelihood be using either CVid or Luma as sync unless it has a built in sync stripper, so that may be your best bet to try and get a picture to display.
>>3241336
1- Smaller monitors/TVs have less pronounced if not non-existent scanlines in most cases. The larger, the more pronounced they'll be. That's a photo of a THIRTY seven inch screen.
2- Not over exposed, so there isn't a lot of blooming between lines.
Frustratingly, the brightness/exposure of some video I took at the same time is far too high and just makes everything look like shit.
>>3241197
post an external shot, I'm sufficiently curious
>>3241287
http://www.epanorama.net/documents/vga2rgb/vgamonitor.html
scroll down a bit
So, here's my haul from the online auction some anon here mentioned before. I drove to Burbank to pick it up this morning.
The left one is a PVM-20M4U while the right is a PVM-20L2. Got both for a total of $70. No power cord though.
>>3241197
text is barely readable desu
at 2.3" you're literally better off going with TN
>>3241408
I have some questions though.
Would it be possible to play emulators on these or just consoles? Or did I need S-Video for that? Could I get any ol' power cord that fits the socket?
>>3241413
Never considered an M4.
>Could I get any ol' power cord that fits the socket?
It's a standard IEC connector; Like what's used for PCs and such. Any cable will work.
>Would it be possible to play emulators on these or just consoles?
Wii would work extremely easily for emulators via Component video. Emulation from PC would be a bit more involved in getting proper 15khz RGB output.
Consoles would work for any of them.
>>3241420
Possibly just some missing anti-glare coating(I hope).
>>3241420
They're just residue. They scratch off.
Output to 15khz RGB huh? Hmm. Gotta figure out how.
>>3241428
can be a bit complicated, even more with laptops.
the upside is that VGA to BNC cables are easy to find
>>3241413
power cord: Those are super standard power cords, the one from your PC monitor or printer is probably the exact same type and will work
emulators: only if you have a specific model of old AMD video card, or are running linux with intel graphics and have the correct cables. You can use composite out from a raspberry pi, but composite 480i kinda defeats the point of a pvm.
You will need simple, $0.75 RCA -> BNC adapters for plugging in Composite or Component cables. It's probably worth sucking it up and paying happy merchant prices (~$2.50 a piece) from an in-person or US ebay seller if you want it sooner than 6 weeks.
Simplest hookup is your console's standard composite AV cable -> RCA to BNC adapter -> "video in" . Make a trip to radio shack/ frys / etc and you can probably test them out with this this afternoon.
In the long run you're going to want SCART cables for each console -> a SCART to BNC adapter like the one posted above in the thread. 99% chance you want the "EURO" pinout unless you're a mega-weeb
>>3241279
Here's a shot of the screen with no input. Is it possible for me to get the "gray" lines as dark as the "black"? In other words, can I adjust something to make the whole screen a uniform blackness? Sorry I'm so GODAMNED STUPID.
>>3241403
Just remembered I got some EL1883 chips a few weeks back, and it has both h and v sync out.
I'm going to buy some RCA jacks that will mount to a board and start working on a circuit for my supergun
>>3241456
>EL1883
Where'd you get em from? How much?
>>3241460
You can get free samples directly from intersil. I believe you need a corporate/university e-mail address to qualify. Most companies that sell chips/ICs like texas instruments, analog devices etc offer this service too, and not all of them require a corp/university email.
The great thing is that they almost always send the samples out via fedex or other courier, I got mine in 1-2 days delivered to my door internationally.
I got 2x 1881 and 1883's from intersil and also got some 1881's from TI. I also got some video encoder chips from analog devices for the supergun I'm working on, and I got some PIC chips from microchip for a custom USB HID joystick setup I'm working on too.
>>3241478
Also if you don't want to/can't go the free samples route, most of these chips are like $2-5 and you can either buy them directly from the manufacturer or from sites like mouser or digikey.
>thinking about building a scart switcher
>find info about the CBT3244A
>trying to think about how I would manage switching with push buttons and shit
>suddently remember that rotary switches are a thing.
I gotta plan on making one.
>>3241472
SCART is like VGA for consoles. It carries the Red, Green, and Blue signals all separately. Your console "thinks" in RGB, and your TV's guns work on RGB, so this avoids additional processing steps.
SCART was common for Yuropoors, as black-and-white tv was much less common and thus they were able to 'start fresh' so to speak when designing standards for color tv. Americans got cucked by backwards compatibility, hence why only top-of-the-line or late-model consumer sets had component inputs (almost as good) or S-video (okay).
"Component" carries three signals too, but they are "Luma" (black and white (greyscale) picture) = Y , "Red Chrominance" (redness) = Pr , and "Blue Chrominance" (blueness) = Pb.
Mathematically YPbPr should be equivalent to RGB, but in the real world the two extra conversion steps will add *some* distortion.
>>3241428
>>3241431
Linux is easiest to get 15kHz out of, but linux isn't easy to use by itself. Or i don't find it so.
For windows 7, laptops are fine so long as they have a Radeon HD Mobility 3000 to 7000 series. For a desktop, a Radeon HD 2000 to 7000 series card is fine. This is to use crt_emudriver, by calamity. The eiusdemmodi site has the downloads, and a few guides you can follow, one for $000 series or lower cards, one for 5000 and above.
http://geedorah.com/eiusdemmodi/forum/
Then you need VGA to BNC cables, and a way to combine the sync lines. I'd recommend a 100R resistor in each, combined into a 200uF cap (+ toward PC), then another 100R resistor.
>>3241472
You get an RGB SCART cable for your console. This is a replacement for the shit one that usually ships with it that only comes with Yellow, White, and Red RCA cables.
One end goes in your console. The other end has a male SCART plug on it.
The male SCART plug goes in the female SCART socket on this >>3241135 cable. http://www.ebay.com/itm/Female-RGB-Euro-SCART-to-4-BNC-Audio-Cable-BUILT-IN-SYNC-STRIPPER-XM29-PVM-etc-/191876458442
Yes, it's $55. It has the best quality. There's a whole rabbit hole you can fall down regarding composite vs luma sync vs csync vs separate h/vsync etc. This cable will solve all your problems for you and also suck your dick at the same time.
There's also a $35 version from the same seller without the sync stripper. It's also possible to build your own cables if you're cheap or /diy/. You can even put in your own sync stripper with $3 in parts and some dead-bug soldering magic.
I probably wouldn't shell out for $$$ worth of cables until you've confirmed that your units can actually display a working image in the first place and don't have horrible burn-in, failing hsync, or tube malfunctions in the first place.
Mine is an unpopular opinion, but composite is basically fine for 240p at a reasonable sitting distance. The main reason to fall down the RGB rabbit hole is for those e-peen closeups or if you want to run non-retro 480i and above, where it makes a huge difference.
Just buy an RCA -> BNC adapter and post some pics you dumb faglord
>>3241454
No, it's not possible. When the screen is under power and warmed up, the scanlines will light up a little bit. I'm not sure, but I think the screen grid needs to be primed for the beam to scan across.
>>3241670
>SCART was common for Yuropoors, as black-and-white tv was much less common and thus they were able to 'start fresh' so to speak when designing standards for color tv.
That's an odd way of putting it. I'd prefer to say SECAM/PAL transitioning gave the need for a single colour standard so companies could sell AV equipment across the continent? Peritel just chose the system the TV's and monitors actually run on, that microcomputers were already using, and fed it through a plug. No idea if the plug was pre-existing or not.
So I'm going to start fucking around with making my own cables/circuits for connecting my old arcade boards and other stuff. Seems like I will possibly be messing around with both straight analog and ttl rgb so I'm assembling a list of the passive parts I will need to order:
Resistors:
470 Ω
75 Ω
330 Ω ?
100 Ω ?
Caps:
0.1 µF
220 µF
Is there anything I'm missing?
Anyone know the specific power/voltage ratings I'm looking for for the resistors/caps?
What pots are ideal for RGB? From reading people say anything from 250ohm up to 10k
>>3241720
>is for those e-peen closeup
>>3240660
Just turn those speakers high and hope you drown out the squeeling
>ttl
5v max, so just grab like 10v and up rated stuff so you'll have a good margin of safety
resistors, shit just get one of those ~$20 packs that has a shit ton of values in 1/4W packages. If you need anything high-power order it separately, signal currents are low as fuck
Pick up a few LN1881's, EL1883's, THS7314, maybe some fancy-ass video amps if you're trying to do 480 stuff.
Honestly I find the hardest part of projects to be designing the enclosure and packaging well, so take some time to think about how you're going to pack it before you start soldering shit together.
shh....
mods are asleep....
post non-retro shots
>>3241887Ey bby, watchu need?
>>3241296
Have you tried making a custom control and plugging it into the MiniDIN port on the front? In the one mode it should just be one pin, being bound to one function/button. It's a bit more tricky if it's set to the serial mode though.
>>3241926
Kill yourself, faggot.
>>3241787
you probably want 75ohms and 220µF by the boatload.
for the rest just get some E24 serie lot for resistors and capacitors.
>>3241408
Nice dude! I'm glad you won em.
I fucking hate Parcelforce. I bought a BVM-14G5E and the seller sent it by their 48 hour delivery service.
That was 6 days ago.
>>3241926
best looking shot itt. nice.
>>3242637
Was that on ebay?
I was looking at making my own BNC-BNC, BNC-HD15 and BNC-SCART interconnects and came across this multicore coax cable:
http://www.van-damme.com/29.html
I think I'll be okay with BNC termination - using RG179 spec connectors of course but what about the SCART and HD-15 side of things? Will this stuff be an absolute ball-ache to work with?
>>3242826
It was
>>3242856
Not enough cores.
>>3242871
£150 right? Hope it turns up soon...and intact.
I saw a couple go recently for a lot less but couldn't really justify any more CRTs at the moment what with my two BVM-20G1s and IBM P260 for high-def stuff.
>>3242874
2, 4, 5 or 20. I think I'll manage tyvm.
Seriously though, what's the best way to use coax with SCART? Specifically dealing with linked grounds off the shielding.
>>3242875
That was the one. Luckily the seller accepted a lower offer of £100.
>>3242884
>Seriously though, what's the best way to use coax with SCART? Specifically dealing with linked grounds off the shielding.
You have to decide what level of shit you want.
5 cores isn't enough. SCART needs 7-9 wires.
>>3242897
SCART-SCART would, yeah. What with all the blanking and switching malarkey.
If I'm making a pure RGBs lead though, outputting to BNC, I need 4 signal wires connected plus grounds so this should work just fine.
>>3240676
>VGA 480p is at 25 khz
Not at 60hz, this could be somewhat feasible with around 48hz.
Certain arcade games are 24khz but real VGA was and is still always 31khz and above.
>>3242884
>what's the best way to use coax with SCART?
Use the correct ground pin.
In case of audio there is one ground pin for both channels, so solder the shielding of both to the same pin.
>>3242897
6 would be the barest minimum: stereo audio+video/sync+RGB
Maybe use 4 core wire for video and then 2 core for audio.
8 is good if one want's to use these switching voltages like RGB blanking (switch between RGB/composite) and AV channel switch/16:9 mode.
>>3242910
>If I'm making a pure RGBs lead though, outputting to BNC, I need 4 signal wires connected plus grounds so this should work just fine.
Why use scart at all then?
>>3242914
Because that's what my consoles output to and I don't fancy drilling holes in them like some people round here advocate.
>>3242912
Thanks
>>3242917
What console has a scart output?
>>3242919
None directly, they're all proprietary at source.
However, I already possess SCART cables for them so I'm just looking to interface between these - or a switch - and my BVM.
Audio is not a concern as I already have this broken out separately and anyhow the BVM has no audio capability whatsoever.
>>3242928
Why not use the proprietary multi-out directly to BNC? Your plan now sounds like multi-out -> SCART -> BNC. If you're gonna make your own cables why have SCART+convertors as middlemen?
Also, someone here would know: if I use a SCART to BNC with a built in sync stripper, if I have a console like SNES with natural CSYNC, is the CSYNC just passed through without any fuckers?
>>3242928
a switch would be best then you only need the 1 scart to bnc.
>>3242984
>>3242997
I need to switch between sources and BNCs are a fucking pain to swap out on a regular basis. I could source an Extron or equivalent BNC switching solution but those are a little on the humungous side. As I'm in euroland and SCART is widely used and cheap here I already have a decent switch hence only wanting to use BNC where there is no other option - such as the inputs on the BVM. I'm perfectly happy to stick with 21 pin as an intermediate step.
I saw pic related on Amazon which might be a way of avoiding making the SCART-BNC variant. Assuming it's not a crosstalking hunk of shit of course...
>Console Multi-AV to SCART --» Switch --» Pic related --» 4xRCA to 4xBNC --» BVM
Whaddya think?
I'm looking at making a Saturn RGB cable, using this diagram. I'll need R, G, B, Composite (to give me C-Sync), and L and R Audio, for a total of six outputs. Is this right? Do I need to worry about the +5v? I want to terminate in either BNC or RCA connectors.
Are some trinitrons better than others? Are the 2000s silver series okay or do I have to stick with the 90s black ones
Bought a minty fresh Tandy 1000SX a week ago and it came with a CM-11 monitor. Should arrive tomorrow. Will post pics, but it'll take a lite time to make a cable if the connector is what I think it is.
>>3243072
you might want to use Luma as sync, it'll avoid checkerboard from composite bleeding.
You don't need +5v if you use a pvm, but don't forget an additional wire for ground. Ideally you also want audio wires to be shielded (or in a different cable altogether) as there can be audio buzzing on bright screens.
>>3243098
All of this according to: http://members.optusnet.com.au/eviltim/gamescart/gamescart.htm
This says that Pin 1 is actually composite sync. Saturn natively outputs C-SYNC, I believe. I was under the impression that C-SYNC > Sync on LUMA > Sync on Composite. Is this right? If that's the case, would I just do the two audio, three color, and a dedicated line for C-SYNC?
>>3243083
Literally cut my fingers bringing one of these home. After like 2 months, the screen was dead and I had to return it and cut my fingers one more time. It's unreliable piece of shit and it's heavy even for two people.
>>3243112
pin 1 is composite sync on NTSC consoles, but it's +9v on PAL consoles. I don't know want console you have but using luma as sync ensures the cable is universal while still avoiding composite video bleeding.
Also, I don't know if Saturn C-Sync is standard or open collector like on the MD.
>>3243083
They're *okay*. At least near me, most of the ones still available (that people actually hung onto until now) are the 30" and up fuckhueg monsters.
I'm not a fan of the dot pitch, and you kind of have to make a sophie's choice: no lag and nice 240p scanlines but composite-only, or component/480p ins with the downside that everything gets scaled to 1080i with corresponding scaler lag and no scanlines.
If you can find one in the 20-24" range I'd pick one up - those can actually be lifted just by one person and make a decent "starter" CRT. I wouldn't pay more than $50 though.
>>3243168
some flat sonys have component in while still being 480i only
>>3243168
>>3243171
There's a few in my area ranging from Free to $20. Im trying to find one with a remote because to buy it alone is expensive on ebay.
Im considering replacing my 27" Philips TV with a Triniton. Should I bother? The philips has 3 inputs: svideo/av , component. audio out, and av on the front. I've had it since 2004 with no issues, but if a trinitron with component is better, then i'll switch out.
>>3242856
hack up vga cable dude, they are very nicely shielded and cheap if you can find them locally
>>3243204
I don't think it would be a big improvement if at all. I'd just use the service menu or it might even be in the standard menu and fix the rotation on yours. It looks to have good geometry and picture.
>>3243083
Every one I have had has a 240p horizontal bow that can't be fixed in the service menu.
>>3243123
On the sides by the screen there is a smooth recess you can use as a handle, It wasn't too much of a struggle to move my old 32" with a woman helping. And I carried my 27" upstairs by myself, you must be tiny.
bad pic but you can see the almighty trinitron is still a bit wonky after adjustment, I was able to fix the trapezoid later but the bend remains
>14L5 came today
Holy shit, 6th gen is actually playable
>>3243305
doesn't it bother you how the colors are so wildly different between the two sets?
The big one is blue as fuck, small one actually looks good
>>3243274
do all tvs have service menus? or do i have to mess with the pots on the board?
>>3243416
I probably had the color set to cool and forgot to change it. I only use the smaller one when my kid is being annoying and standing in front of the tv. The consoles are y/c to the trinitron and the sanyo is composite from the monitor out jack so the picture and colors are usually different. it's only for the kiddo so good enough. I have the 35" mitsu to play on now.
>>3243430
most newer ones do, yours is silver so I'm guessing it does, look up the service manual for your model number. write the base setting for anything you adjust before messing with it.
rotation is all you need on that tv, you may want to play around with h,v pos and size to get the picture centered and the overscan correct. but it looks fine from here.
>>3243451
I was able to find a push button code to get it working. one last question, should i display a calibration grid? or just load up super mario and adjust it by eyesight? I've never calibrated a crt before
Threadly reminder not to fall for the SCART meme.
>>3243507
I'm a regular here and I genuinely have no idea what you're blathering about. What are you calling "the SCART meme"?
>>3243519
>What are you calling "the SCART meme"?
Using shitty SCART cables and shitty SCART connectors even if you live outside of Eurabia.
>>3243468
I take that back, apparently even with the service mode, I dont have access to half the the adjustments. I can only get Horz pos, but not scaling. I cant get rotation or bowing. But for some reason I have almost full access to Vert settings.
>>3243507
SCART RGB is no meme. Go insert a RCA composite connector in your urethra.
>>3243561
>Go insert a RCA composite connector in your urethra.
Nah, I'll keep using high quality 75 Ohm coaxial cable with BNC termination, just like God intended man to feed video signal.
You enjoy your interference and impedance mismatch.
>>3243305
>On the sides by the screen there is a smooth recess you can use as a handle
Yes, it's smooth and also like 2 cm deep. Great if you want it to slip from your hands, break your floor and/or destroy your legs.It's also very tight to get a finger in there, so your hands must be tiny. I'm not going to carry this abomination with my pinkie.
>>3243565
>BNC
Oh. Carry on then.
>just like God intended
Err. Why do you Yanks have to keep bringing up imaginary magical beings into these threads?
>>3242919
Pretty much all of them from the SG1000 onwards except for a bunch of weird-ass Nintendo systems (eg, NES and N64).
>>3243529
If you have the hardware...
I have a PVM that only takes RGB through a SCART plug. Or that shape connector, anyway.
>>3243362
Interestingly, 480i actually looks worse than on my consumer set. Low persistence phosphors? Also seems like the even and odd fields aren't quite aligned horizontally. Maybe the it's just the set's age, maybe sony (rightly) just doesn't give a fuck about interlace. Looks like a pile of steaming dog crap, but hey, that's interlace for you.
480p looks fukkn awesome though, obviously. Now I'm just going to have to figure out how to hack my PS2 to get all those titles that had lazy devs running properly.
</non-retro>
240p SNES looks pretty sweet even over composite, still waiting on my shielded S-Video and SCART connectors though.
The strongest thing I've noticed about my PVM vs my consumer sets is how much better the greens are. I'm a filthy pleb so I jacked up the chroma a few notches just to soak it all in.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Anyone got some good, in-depth resources for the differences between P-22 and SMTPE C phosphors?
>>3243565
Do you custom make each cable yourself, then?
pics of ur setup
>>3243650
P22 is a slightly brighter phosphor used in consumer sets but it doesn't follow the revised (SMPTE-C) color curve exactly.
To get precise details you'd have to find the SMPTE specification (I've been trying for ages) and find a very in-depth datasheet for a P-22 picture tube.
I believe the P22 specification is also commonly used as an indicator for a color tube in the CRT's part number.
>>3243652
If he wants to avoid impedance mismatch he won't use the multi-AV connectors either - he'd have to drill holes in the back of the case and mount 75 ohm BNC connectors on the panel.
I have a slight impedance mismatch since I used RCA jacks instead, but it's still closer to 75 ohms than the multi AV (I measured 34 ohms on the multi port and 56 on my RCA jacks).
>>3243576
>your hands must be tiny
My hands are big, I have big presidential hands. You'll be very satisfied with my hands.
You only gotta get it to the first knuckle^^.My 32" would break your fucking back though, I never tried doing stairs alone and carrying it any distance was a feat. The 35"console tv requires another decent sized guy you can trust with your life and or a stair crawling hand truck to move up or down stairs.
I do have small feminine hands.
>>3243834
Could you not use a 75ohm resistors between the pcb and the a/v out?
>>3243652
diy cables? made 2 of these out of some cheap a/v cables and an old high end svhs cable we had.
Can the BNCs on the back of the monitor i have be used, or do I still need to convert the signal
>>3243892
looks like you could use rgbs but it will need a line doubler, 8220 or framememester to do 15hz
I just got this lil crappy thing called Samsung CXJ 1331 and cant for life of me figure out how to use the composite in at the back. Tried channel, 3, pressing the input button gives me a black screen I suppose for the VCR that is built in. Anyone have any ideas?
>>3243945
First plug in the cables to a known good tv to make sure it's not just your console/cart shitting out. Once it's on and displaying a picture on your known good tv you should unplug the RCA cable and put it in the new one (without turning off the system).
Also maybe you got assfucked and you're going to need the remote to switch inputs?
If it's got an R/F in you could just go full grunge and rock the shittiest picture you can get. I used to use R/F for my genesis back in the day. Post pics
>>3243083
I have a nice 27inch from the 2000's that I got for $20 and i'm enjoying it very much so. Want to trade up to a 36inch eventually. It's nice to have composite/component/Svideo all on one set.
>>3243650
>Low persistence phosphors?
That's a good thing since the lower the persistence the better the motion quality
>>3243834
>(I measured 34 ohms on the multi port and 56 on my RCA jacks)
How are you measuring that impedance, exactly?
>>3243881
>Could you not use a 75ohm resistors between the pcb and the a/v out?
It's entirely possible I'm missing something here. Are you proposing to add the resistor from signal to ground, as a termination? It reads like you want them in the signal line...
>>3244003
thanks for trying but I think its just ded : ( rip
>>3243892
It's just standard RGBHV, i.e VGA minus the data lines. Not going to get any sort of support for resolutions that wouldn't work via the DE-15 connector.
>>3243561
Bnc > rca > vga/hd15 > * > scart
>went to a video editing place that was selling CRTs a few years ago
>only had enough money to buy 2 monitors (and a tiny mechanical keyboard) at the time
>left so many odd monitors behind
I wish I could go back. Especially for the wide-screen hitachi PC CRT.
>>3244321
Theyve been dumped anon.
Anyone here own the Gamecube component cables?
Lookin for some shots of Metroid: Zero Mission on GBA Player to decide if it's worth it. Also I'm not 100% with Nintendont on Wii U - It seems to assume 480p means I'm using a 16:9 ratio screen and I have to mess with the H/V size to get it to display normally, still feels like it adds a bit of blur.
( I really wish we could have our own board or at least a thread for /almost retro/ )
>>3244854
I own the component cables. The Gameboy Player software is poorly designed, and I get input lag when playing on a HDTV in 480p. This same TV has no noticeable input lag when playing the Famicom , which is 240p upscaled to 480i (since HDTVs can't output 240p).
So the Gameboy Player is only worth it if you have a CRT that you can use it with.
>>3244862
>The gameboy player is only worth it if you have a CRT you can use it with
do you know where you are, friend?
This is the e-peen general, I have a cathode ray jepsen capable of doing 480p with no lag., you're tv a shit. 480i is not comfy at ALL though for gameboy games.
thanks for the response.
>>3238994
Let's settle down, that looks like a very nice set he has. I think I have the same one. I just really hope he has a switcher.
>>3243204
late reply, but at some point I went from a phillips flat 29" to a trini flat 29" and it was totally worth it for me. Both were 480i only, no processing gimmicks.
Who's got a good soft 15khz guide for me?
Anyone got some photos or success stories?
I have a bunch of old-ish laptops with linux+intel graphics laying around.
Morning, /crt/
I need some help here. It isn't directly CRT related, but I figure it's within this generals expertise.
I don't currently have the space to house a CRT, so I'd like to hook my N64 andoriginal Xboxinto my LCD monitor at my desk. The monitor supports HDMI, DV-i and VGA input. I was going to spring for a component to HDMI converter, but I've heard there is a severe loss of quality in doing so, atleast with an affordable converter.
So, what's my best option with the inputs available? I'd also prefer not to hard-mod either of the consoles, but I don't toally object to it if that's the ideal way.
>>3244981
the N64 has extremely limited output options in stock form, and the forced full screen blur also doesn't help. Even the best scaler will produce crap.
The xbox supports 480p, 720p, 1080i via component. There's also a 3rd party VGA adapter. But the game has to support it and the video options are disabled on PAL consoles (needs soft mod or chip).
>>3244981
All the affordable composite 240p -> HDMI scalers look like fried dogshit. For Xbox, the affordable component -> HDMI scalers actually look alright, particularly if you make sure to use a progressive video mode.
Any type of analog -> HDMI converter will induce a few frames of lag, (on top of the lag from your monitor) so if you care about that you basically have to buy a CRT.
For N64, your best option is an 8" or 14" PVM. 8" is a cozy size but basically only works as a single-player desk tv, easy to handle and stash in a closet in between sessions if you don't want to make permanent room for it. S-Video is the best picture you can get out of a stock system.
If you can make space for a 14" you can get a PVM-14L5 which will also support component 480p/720p/1080i over component with no lag, making it basically perfect for 6th gen. These things (and the 20" big brother) are basically the holy grail of Melee players.
The "GBS-8220" has a decent reputation as a YPbPr -> VGA converter, and startech makes a ~$100 version that some leddit fag claims only adds 0.1ms delay.
>>3245035
Neato, thanks
I'll probably pickup one of these guys
http://www.amazon.com/Portta-PETRHP-Component-Converter-%C2%A0Windows%C2%A010/dp/B003VJ9RP6/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1464281729&sr=8-2&keywords=component+to+hdmi
Looks like the only reason it has less than perfect stars is because people mistook confused component for composite.
I could probably make room for one of those 8" Sonys. Do they by chance hit 480p or is that only the 14" and up?
http://users.rowan.edu/~winkler/equipindex/manuals/Sony%20PVM5041QSeriesBrochure.pdf
According to the specs listed here, these all come in at 14 inches deep. I'd like a 8045Q to live in a 14.2 inch deep shelf; can anyone confirm if the front-facing handles are included in those measurements? Can they be easily detached?
>>3245141
Busted out the tape measure just for you bb
The chassis of my 8045Q measures 13.75 inches deep. That 14.2 inches measurement seems to include the handles on the front. You also have to add in another ~ .375 inches for the BNC connectors on the back.
Conservative total depth is somewhere around 14.75 inches (I'm shit at measuring), factoring in the handles and the BNC connectors at the rear.
I don't see an easy way to remove the handles from the front, but they seem like the kind of handles you could remove if you dissassembled the chassis. Try looking up the "service manual", not sure if the 8045Q has one floating around on the net.
btw I can totally shill this cable here:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/The-best-S-video-cable-for-Nintendo-SNES-N64-Game-Cube-Svideo-SVHS-1-8m-6ft-/131782319627
Great quality picture, no dumb composite artifacts on the white-on-black text in Yoshi's Island. (Still waiting for my SCART cable).
I almost like Y/C and YPbPr even better than RGB since I get to play with the chroma and jack up the saturation like the filthy pleb I am.
>>3245281
Thanks familia
I know it's not CRT. But What's the name of that new framemeister clone/alternative that's supposed to be coming out called?
All I remember is that it is an acronym that is similar to a euro country name
>>3245861
OSSC
Okay, have had this thing for 24 hours and this thing kicks fucking ass. Here's my blog for you:
3rd gen: Don't own any yet. Might pick up an NES at some point.
4th gen:
Model 2 Genesis looks fucking awesome over RGBs. I hooked it up the way I used to display it as a kid (RF into consumer set) for some A/B laffs, and impressed even some non-technical friends. The most noticeable thing is how the red doesn't bleed all over the damn place any more. I think I'm going to have to buy a flash cart now.
SNES: Looked pretty good over composite, but had a bit of a "vaseline smear" effect. I'd never really noticed the flaws in composite 240p (on crts) before because my set was always the limiting factor. Got my S-Video cable today and this shit fucking rocks now, black and white text is *actually* black and white, no shitty composite purple and yellow jizz. It doesn't look quite as sharp as my Genesis yet, but hopefully the SCART cable I've got coming will fix that.
>>3245913
5th gen:
N64 - S-video right now (waiting on SCART+ RGB amp in the mail). Picture quality is actually kind of a mixed bag, subjectively. I fucking love the vibrant colors, especially the greens and vivid blues when I'm out in hyrule field. Started a new file, talking to Talon right now and his red sleeves are popping really well against his blue overalls. The kind of surprising downside is that I don't really like the strong scanline effect. I played a ton of N64 growing up, and our tv had such huge bloom (and aggressive, bright phosphors) that I don't really have any memory of N64 scanlines. White text on the half-opaque dialog boxes in OoT is still readable but doesn't pop and glow the same way I remember it. It's probably an acquired taste I can get used to, but in an ideal world 'scanline depth' would be a knob I could turn from 0 all the way up to 100 and back. Might try to get 480p working from my laptop for exactly that at some point for some OoT romhacks.
Playstation - In contrast, I really, really like the way the strong scanlines look on ps1 games. Darker games look the best - the green glowing themes of MGS look just right, and SotN is crisp and clear. It makes for amazing nighttime playing. I would maybe prefer a bit more shitty glow and less scanline depth on brighter/"daytime" games like Crash, Spyro, THPS, but the effect is not nearly as jarring to me. When playing on my PSP with component out, I can actually change between "480i" (240p mode) with scanlines and 480p mode (line doubled), which is kind of fun to play around with.
>>3240660
no, get over it.
>>3241130
if you just want RGB and you can get it to sync at least, run RGB to the OSD RGB input pins on the jungle IC inside.
>>3245962
>NOT RETRO!!!!
>NOT RETRO!!!!
>NOT RETRO!!!!
Now, the real reason I went with the L5 instead of one of the cheaper models: 6th gen.
6th gen is fucking amazing.
Gamecube: I've mostly been playing Super Mario Sunshine and Pikmin 2 and basically just been continuously jizzing myself. I probably don't need to tell anyone here about how shitty the options for playing 6th gen are in 2016. This set is sucking my dick right now and fondling my balls at the same time.
Currently I'm using a hacked Wii U with Nintendont, but I've got a backwards-compatible Wii on the way. I can't tell if the GC->USB converter is adding any lag, but since I'm pretty close I might as well ascend fully up the "no lag" e-peen pyramid.
PS2: PS2 devs should be fucking ashamed of themselves. The fucking framebuffer is progressive and I don't think it takes any/much extra resources resources to read it out, yet those lazy motherfuckers shafted us with 480i-only for most of the games worth playing on the console.
I played a bit of GT4 in 480p and 1080i just to verify that it works, but that particular game is not a huge draw for me anymore. There's some hacking shit you can do to try to force progressive, but apparently it's super fucking touchy, there's like 3 different ways to do it, each way works only with certain games, gotta set up an SMB server, buy an IDE hard drive, network adapter, only fat PS2 blah blah blah... I still might do that for shits and giggles but I ordered a backwards compatible PS3. Mostly looking to play the Katamari, GTA, and THPS games in proper 480p.
These 6th gen games are actually playable again and everything is right with the universe.
>>3242884
>coax with SCART?
the scart end will remove most of the reason for using coax in the first place: crosstalk removal (unless you have very very long cables).
>>3243645
I want a picture of this supposed PVM.
>>3243881
That's assuming the connector itself has ZERO impedance which is false.
>>3244021
http://www.learnabout-electronics.org/ac_theory/impedance73.php
>>3246035
>>>XXXTREME NOT RETRO
>>>XXXTREME NOT RETRO
>>>XXXTREME NOT RETRO
7th gen: Hooked up my 360 for shits and giggles.
480p: Skate 3 looks fucking awesome at 480p, since mostly the graphics just need strong colors and good contrast to look good and don't really need resolution.
Skyrim is very playable and looks great, color-wise. It's kind of funny to see it at 480p though, kind of feels like Morrowind 2.0 . Text is shitty.
Fallout: New Vegas is playable, but I'm definitely resolution-limited. I end up making heavy use of the binoculars/sniper rifle to figure out just wtf that thing moving is in the distance. Underground/Cavern sections are very nice though because of the good colors/contrast balance.
Overall it's actually pretty workable for a lot of more casual, non-shooting games, and still 100x better than consumer 480i stuff.
720p:
I really wish there was a standard that would let you keep 4:3 at 720p. At 720p I'm draw-distance limited instead of resolution-limited, but the useful, center-of-screen area becomes so small that I have to lean forward to like 10" in front of the screen to play comfortably. Perhaps it's big-brother 20L5 will be better when it arrives. 480p is definitely where it's at, for this screen at least.
8th gen: I don't own any 8th gen consoles. I wouldn't be surprised if they completely or effectively drop 480 support (CURRENT YEAR), so I don't really expect this to work well for it.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`
6th gen and up stuff basically requires you to pull your chair right up to the screen though, so don't plan on doing too much comfy reclining with those gens. With 240p stuff I can pull back the chair enough to kick up the leg rest and max out relax though.
Overall, A+ purchase, would buy again.
>>3246058
2730QM does at the very least.
>>3243625
>england
>blaming Christianity on anyone
>>3246078
question
Can I use a PC CRT for 6th and 7th gen stuff no problem?
IE, 480p 4:3?
>>3246158
Most PC monitors will ONLY support 480p = ~31.5 Khz scan rate. 240p and 480i have the same scan rate of 15.6 something (i.e. half of 480).
Additionally, you have to keep track of the sync stuff - For 480p, Most consoles output Component, which has combined H and V sync on the luma channel. SCART typically has sync separate from R, G, and B, but you still need to split the H and V syncs off.
Your VGA monitor will not accept sync on luma/sync on green.
Basically, for Xbox 360 you can buy an official VGA cable and that's it. The 6th gen stuff is a pain in the ass and most stuff will have *some* lag. Apparently there is a $100 StarTech converter that will turn YPbPr into VGA and only adds 0.1ms of lag.
It looks like it is NOT a scaler though: if your monitor won't accept 15khz sync rates then you're still out of luck. What I was complaining about PS2 is that there are a whole bunch of good games that only output in 480i (at least without tedious hacking).
They make some convertes that WILL work (scale 480i to 480p), but most of them will induce some lag I'm pretty sure. ~2 frames is not a big deal at all for grand theft auto etc, but it is if you want to play Melee at a high level etc.
fuckin 6th gen display options suck fuckin dick
>>3246078
>anything past 6th gen on a CRT
I do this regularly and can't read shit ever. Very uncool.
>>3246192
What's the resolution on your set?
Some day I want to pick up one of those 20" 2048x1536 sets and see how well they do with 1080p
>>3246208
I dunno lol it's a big fucking TV I didn't know they came in resolution
>>3246176
>>3246078
God, you're worse than me about the L5 - a lot of people here will resent you for it if you don't tone it down. Congrats btw, I'm sure it's nice.
Also, you're wrong, some VGA monitors do accept sync on green (only tried on sonys and a panasonic monitor though).
Also just so everyone knows I had no idea what the 20L5 was when I got mine, just that it was a 20 inch PVM and it was free. Its multiscan capability was a nice suprise, but I rarely use it for anything but 240p/480i content. After all, I have PC monitors...
And I am a pretty casual melee-er.
>>3246176
>most stuff will have some lag
wait what?
You mean this adds lag?
http://www.amazon.com/Wii-PS3-VGA-HDTV-Cable-Nintendo/dp/B0015MISAG?ie=UTF8&keywords=wii%20vga%20cable&qid=1464312093&ref_=sr_1_1&sr=8-1
Wii VGA Cable
>>3246176
My monitor says it does "sync on green" or something
>>3246223
>http://www.amazon.com/Wii-PS3-VGA-HDTV-Cable-Nintendo/dp/B0015MISAG?ie=UTF8&keywords=wii%20vga%20cable&qid=1464312093&ref_=sr_1_1&sr=8-1
Nah that looks completely analog, so you're fine.
All 7th gen stuff supports 480p and up, so it's real easy to play on CRTs and PC monitors.
It's 6th gen that's a pain in the ass, particularly if you want to play on original hardware.
I'm not entirely sure how the backwards compatibility works though, if playing 480i-only GC games on a Wii will come through as 480i or 480p. If you hack it though (piss easy) I'm pretty sure Nintendont can force progressive scan. I mean I know for sure it has that option but I don't know if it actually works or not on games that didn't originally support it.
Most of the stuff worth playing on GC had the option for progressive scan anyways, it's just the ridiculous prices for the component cables (literally $200+ nowadays) that are the gotcha.
PS2 is the real pain in the ass, as basically all the good stuff has no progressive option. There's some hacks and shit you can try on original hardware, I also just ordered a backwards-compatible PS3 because I'm *pretty* sure that should just auto-force progressive.
I think Xbox also has pretty good progressive coverage on its games, but I don't own one.
That cord looks good and not too expensive, so try it.
PVM supports external sync. Can I also just use sync on luma, like for a PSX, or do I have to use a stripper and do CSYNC?
>>3246220
nah, I'm taking the name off now, now nobody can tell how meme I am most of the time when I post in the future.
I mean yes, it is very cool - however the tradeoff is that I did have to pay quite a premium for it (~$250 shipped), an anon who didn't need >>>NON-RETRO could have either gotten similar image quality at 20" and not have their knees right up against the desk like I do or a 13" + a legit krikkz flash cart.
a fool and his money, and all that
>>3246220
>a lot of people here will resent you for it if you don't tone it down.
Thats not why people resent you tripfuck
>>3246078
did you try 1080i?
>>3246264
what system are you trying to hook up?
>>3246276
Yeah. 1080i works, but the picture is functionally identical to 720p at this screen size. Horizontally both 1280x720 and 1920x1080 are way above my TVL of 800, so there's no gain there, and drawing 720 vs 540x2 lines doesn't really make a difference because it's all crammed into a ~10" window and they blend together.
Interestingly, I didn't notice any flickering at 1080i (again gives credence to the fact that the lines were overlapping). I notice it real fucking hard on 480i on this thing, 480i actually looks far worse on here than on my consumer set.
720p is actually more demanding than 1080i, as 720p has to draw (720 lines) x (60 fields per second), whereas 1080i only needs to draw (540 lines) x (60 frames per second).
I find 720p and 1080i pretty useless on this monitor though, it's already pretty small at 14" (13 actual viewable?) and then letterboxing it throws away a bunch of more screen area + turns a bunch of the sides into effectively useless peripheral vision.
