Discuss 2D scrolling shooter games here.
For bullet hell/Touhou, try this thread on /vg/:
>>>/vg/shmupg
(Mods, please prune genre war shitposts)
Tell us your…
>favorite shmups
>recent acquisitions
>latest accomplishments
Previous thread:
>>2855807
Current events: several shmups on sale on Steam. Triangle Service, Qute, MOSS and more!
New to the genre of shmups? Check out this page:
http://www.racketboy.com/retro/shooters/shmups-101-a-beginners-guide-to-2d-shooters
Shmup Collection containing over 9000 MAME romsets:
https://www.mediafire.com/?48812jiax8m1c#nz0227tzb9zor
Decide the greatest shmup developer of all time here:
http://strawpoll.me/4496713
For a realtime chatroom, head over to our #shmups channel:
https://kiwiirc.com/client/irc.rizon.net/?nick=Anon?&theme=cli#shmups
List of the hardest clears, ranked in order of difficulty:
http://www.wikihouse.com/stg/index.php?STG%A5%E9%A5%F3%A5%AF%B0%EC%CD%F7
Video resources that explain superplay recordings:
https://www.youtube.com/user/STGWeekly
Highscore tables for several shmups (can track your own):
http://www.restartsyndrome.com/boardlist.php
Lets start this thread off right.
>>2872731
Would be nice if Takumi ports the DC version to Steam, with the counterstop fix and extras included.
Any retro shmups worth getting in the steam sale?
>>2872779
Raiden Fighters Legacy
>>2872804
>supporting dotemu
>supporting a worse port than the piece of shit on GoG
You monster
Is it okay to talk about RefleX and ALLTYNEX Second here?
What do you think of Recca?
http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/recca/recca.htm
>>2873591
Technically impressive, but utterly dull to play. This is just another "hidden gem" that people go and get autistic about because it's different. In retrospect, it just sucks.
One of the reasons I got into shoot-'em-ups in the first place was for the atmospheric quality of series like Gradius. It was really aesthetic flying through extraterrestrial caverns, colossal alien lifeforms and fortress ships. Recca doesn't have that quality to me. It's just wave after wave of enemies on generic backdrops. I don't even recall there being any environmental obstacles in the game.
>>2873606
I like the music most of all
>>2872731
>bullet hell garbage
Nah.
>>2873580
I don't think anyone will mind.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w025kQRMZwA
>>2873621
Mars Matrix is bullet hell done the right way.
>no bullshit chaining like Ikaruga or Doodoopoopy
>screen is 4:3 instead of 3:4 for more freedom
>>2873715
>screen is 4:3 instead of 3:4 for more freedom
That gives you the exact same freedom. Maximum freedom would be 1:1 aspect.
>>2873718
Are you stupid? You get 4:3 or 1.3 screen estate while with 3:4 you get 0.75 screen estate. 1.3 > 0.75
>>2873728
wat
>>2873728
And by covering the screen with electrical tape except a very thin horizontal line, you can get 100:1 for even more freedom. 100 > 1.3
>>2873738
Too bad no game is designed that way, huh.
>>2873731
you can actually skip the initial levels by accessing the hidden service mode menu, look it up (it's technically cheating though)
>>2873731
you access service mode by pressing and holding A, B, C, and then start at the title screen.
>>2873715
>>no bullshit chaining like Ikaruga
Chaining feels pretty awesome in this game. You probably just suck at it and thus dislike it. However, you also can play without chaining.
>screen is 4:3 instead of 3:4 for more freedom
The screen in games like Mars Matrix is pretty dumb for verticals. You can't see what is going on in front of you.
>>2874056
Even if that anon sucked at Ikaruga chaining, what's that got to do with anything? If a system isn't enjoyable why would you play it? Leave color-matching stuff to puzzle games, not shmups.
>>2874070
People constantly critize the game simply because it is too hard for them and involves too much memorization.
If you like strategic and puzzle-like elements in shmups, then Ikaruga is perfect for you, though.
Just like you probably also will like R-Type if you are more into methodical shmups.
Not everyone likes these simple twitch based games for plebs, where you just can turn off your brain and shoot along.
batrider is cool
Gee, Ikaruga shitposting, how original.
>>2874080
>wahhh chains make no sense in shmups, where are my gold stars to collect???
Treasure Internet Defense Force is starting to surpass Cave and Touhou fans in terms of general shittiness.
>>2874092
ikaruga is bad because the scoring is unintuitive. chaining is fine in games like dodonpachi or raiden fighters though.
>>2874101
Ikaruga's chaining fits pretty well to the game world, enemy placement and the weapons you have.
It just actually takes some skills and a lot of precision, while Dodonpachis chaining merely reuires you to hold rapidfire and using big buildings on the site to stall the chain.
>>2874120
>while Dodonpachis chaining merely reuires you to hold rapidfire and using big buildings on the site to stall the chain.
Quit talking about games you've never played before. If all you do is hold autofire in DDP your chain count is going to be utter shit.
>>2874131
If you don't hit anything for more than a second your chain is lost in this game. This basically means it requires you to use rapidfire you fucking Cavedrone.
Doodoopeepees chaining is just more "intuitive" because it's simple as fuck. Ikaruga's chaining actually adds something to the game.
>>2874159
>If you don't hit anything for more than a second your chain is lost in this game.
Right and there are moments where it's actually better to wait than shoot if you knew anything about the game. Shut up already.
>>2874172
If you don't want to lose the chain you can not wait, you fucktard.
So what are you playing to celebrate this Christmas /vr/? I'm trying to get that clear on the Phantasm Stage in PCB.
>>2874190
I'm playing R-Type Final. Very underappreciated game.
Already got fucking 75 ships and unlocking them is fun as fuck.
>>2874159
It took people 20 years to figure out how to counterstop Donpatch. Cave shmups are infinitely more complex than your pleb Treasure shit, kiddo.
>>2874179
Have you even watched a superplay of DDP before? If you hold autofire the whole run you kill the wave too early before the next enemy wave arrives and your chain gets broken. God damn you are one stupid piece of shit, with horrible taste in garbage shmups like Ikaruga and R-Type to boot.
>>2873606
>I play shmups for the aesthetics
Just kill yourself you casual shitter.
What are some good shmups that use a health bar with one life rather than ships?
I remember playing one in a system11 tournament a few years back, but I forget what it was.
I know it's functionally the same thing, but I find it less frustrating somehow
>>2874284
RefleX has something similar where instead of lifes your ship can only take around 7 hits before blowing up for good.
>>2873632
>5 minutes in
>Ross puts STG cult on blast
>>2874284
Lords of Thunder
>>2874284
Guwange? 1944?
>>2874097
>If you defend any stg I dislike you are a shitposter now
Not really surprising to me. These "shooting game threads" here are nothing but Cave and hipster threads anyway.
>>2874316
how about instead of bitching at everyone who voices dissent at your favourite shmups you just ignore them? ever considered that, asshat?
>>2874321
>you are not allowed to defend any game you like, only I can do this
No wonder the genre is fucking dead, when you take a look at all the retarded man-children here
>>2874354
Have fun anon. RefleX is one of my favorites, hope you enjoy it.
>>2874316
>ANYONE THAT DOESN'T LIKE MY FAVORITE GAME IS A CAVE SHILL!
Ikarugatard please.
>>2874426
That's because they're the only ones who actually play the games. Why aren't you discussing your precious R-Type?
>>2874298
Point at the Reco plushie where danmaku touched you, anon.
>>2874429
>Reco plushie
Are those actually a thing.
>>2874430
Probably. There are Cave-produced figuresthat apparently are nopan.
Reminder to report trolls and complete idiots.
>>2874435
Do mods actually deliver?
>>2874437
>>2874439
Only one way to find out.
Now when you play Ikaruga you can either play for shootin' game, chain, or you can play dot eater.
So basically you can hold on to the fire button, you can hold on to the fire button in the exact order Treasure wants you to, or you can not hold on to the fire button.
Here's hoping Treasure announces Radiant Silvergun for Steam with netplay and a boss rush mode tomorrow at Cave's thing.
>>2874428
They play the games as much as Touhou fans play the games. They may be numerous, but in the end they just ruin the genre with their shittaste.
Most Cave fans are just weebs who never cleared anything but Touhou games anyway.
>>2874461
[citation needed]
>>2874468
Zun and Cave pander to the same exact people. They pander to weebs and otakus. The whole genre is just full of these freaks thanks to them.
No wonder noone posts here about Gradius or R-type. It's almost like posting in a Touhou thread. Who the hell wants to do this?
>R-Type Tactics
Huh, so that exists.
Is it any good?
>>2874482
>No wonder noone posts here about Gradius or R-type
Because when they do it goes nowhere. Because most people don't play the games. Say what you will about Touhou but at least there's plenty of strategy sharing and discussion among the waifu shitposting. The only thing coming from Gradius and R-Type fans is the most surface level shit imaginable.
>>2874485
That's no true at all. Gradius and R-Type are just dead series, which is also probably a good thing regarding this community.
STGs just turned into a genre of generic waifu shooters, which is also why there are so many Cave and Touhou fans.
>>2874495
>which is also probably a good thing regarding this community
This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. You don't want good games to be made because people you don't like would play them; people that you don't like because they like something you don't.
>>2874497
You sound retarded as fuck. I just don't want to see companies milking otakus with Gradius IV: Waifu Edition, that's why it's better that these games are dead. Otomedius was already more than enough. Good shooters obviously have no real place in this industry full GTAs and Witcher games anymore, which is sad, but I can't change it.
>>2874495
Dodonpachi Daioujou and Touhou 6 are both older than R-Type Final and Gradius V yet get far more worthwhile discussion. All you have is excuses.
>>2874284
Area 88 from Capcom is very good, based off the manga of the same name. Try it and its sequel, Carrier Air Wing.
>>2874512
They also still have communities, since they pander to otaku weebs, you fucking retard. Why do you think Konami released Otomedius instead of Gradius VI? Because producing cheap otaku pandering rehashes is only way to still make some money with these games.
>>2874542
Oh yeah, and look how well loved that is lmao. Daioujou is practically identical to Donpachi and Dodonpachi when it comes to its style, but ok. All you're doing is projecting your obsession with aesthetics to other people, because you are only able to appreciate games on that surface level.
>>2874557
Otomedius was extremely cheaply produced, but many otakus still have it in their library right next to Mushihimsama or whatever.
And yes, Daioujou or however it is called is practically identical to Donpachi, which is also why it's just another otaku pandering rehash, and Cave are pretty good at producing cheap otaku pandering rehashes.
>>2874563
Not like you can 2-ALL either game, even though they're just a "otaku pandering rehash".
>that moment when you realize you're a shittier player than waifufags
>>2874563
What is Donpachi a rehash of?
>>2874567
>look guys how hardcore I am
Cave games are not any more difficult than most other STGs.
>>2874571
Prove it. Let's see those 1ccs and scores.
>>2874572
You are the one acting like these games are so hardcore. Why dont you prove that these games would be so much harder than other games?
>>2874578
He wasn't saying that the games are hardcore, he was mocking you for being a total casual who is below the average waifufag. Then you said the games aren't any harder than other shooters.
>>2874580
Acting like I am bad at STGs for not playing through Cave shit implies that he thinks the games must be harder than the game that I play.
I do not play Caveshit, I play other shooters, but what I've played of it wasn't much different difficulty-wise compared to other shooters.
>>2874583
That's not a problem. Post those scores and 1cc's you did of other "superior" shooters, then.
>>2874585
Why should I, you fucking retard? Again, I'm not the one acting like Caveshit would be so hardcore here. I have nothing to prove here.
>>2874586
No one's acting like Cave games are hardcore. You are the one acting like Cave games aren't any harder than the shit you play, even though you admit to not playing Cave games. Or are you yet another casual chucklefuck who's talking about things he has 0 experience with?
>>2874587
Of course you are acting like these games would be oh-so hardcore, otherwise you wouldn't call me a casual for not having 1cced them. You inane Cavedrones are just full of shit and it obviously makes no sense talking to you.
>>2874591
It doesn't matter what I think the difficulty of the game is. In fact, you'd be less of a casual if I believed that they were truly hardcore. Think for a second before you make a post, you dip. If you don't like CAVE games, post some 1ccs and scores from games you do like.
>>2874598
Again, you are the one here who acts like Caveshit would be hardcore as fuck like no other STG, and any STG fan who hasnt 1cced them is a casual. I don't have anything to prove here fucktard.
>>2874607
>1cced them
kill yourself my man
>>2874616
Go back to /v/ or /vg/ you meme spouting retard.
>>2874618
Only after casual scum like you are purged from this thread
>>2874620
>look how hardcore i am on the internet
I'm beginning to think this is one guy at this point.
>>2874626
>Implying you're not that guy
>>2874569
Batsugun you rube.
>>2874626
Probably.
Merry Christmas, everybody! We get to watch somebody have a meltdown on the internet.
>>2873632
>i suck at games: the video
i actually like tyrian, don't get me wrong, but holy shit
Hurry up and put Trizeal on Steam, M-KAI you lazy fuck.
why do you hate animu grulls so much, /vr/? im starting to think you have a weird repressed homosexuality thing
>>2875012
I miss the time when these games came out during comiket instead of steam
>shitposts smearing ZUN and Cave
>muh spaceships
Jesus christ /vr/
>>2875056
We could create another /vr/ SHMUP thread that allows all genres, just saying. (I'm aware of the /vg/ thread but it's shit for similar reasons why this one's shit).
>>2875061
We could just stop playing this shitty genre altogether.
What shmups give you multiple paths a-la platformers like Castlevania?
>>2875083
Darius.
I recommend Gaiden or G-Darius.
>>2875027
Fuck off back to China then faggot.
>>2875083
Blast Wind
>>2875056
Well ZUN isn't retro (unless you're a PC98fag) and Cave only goes up to PGM, so a bullet hell thread on /vr/ seems kind of silly.
>>2875083
Tyrian
>>2875114
Whether the thread is silly or not isn't my issue. It's the shitty posters /vr/ has been drowning in.
>>2875061
>I'm aware of the /vg/ thread but it's shit for similar reasons why this one's shit
1-2 dedicated derailing shitposters and crossboard shitflinging from another 1-2 shitposters?
>>2875263
I still think separating bullet hell from regular shmups hurts more than helps. And it's not like the Ikaruga shitposter wouldn't show up still in both threads to flaunt his One True Opinion.
>>2875276
>Ikaruga shitposter
More like waifu drooling Cavedrones and hipsters.
>>2872727
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wg-ZhnQKx8
IDZ HABBEDING
>>2875540
Enjoy your Deathsmiles, baka gaijins.
>>2875540
>Deathsmiles
God dammit. Wasn't that already region free? How about something I can't already get, fucking gooks.
>>2875585
No SDOJ for you.
No counterstopless Futari for you.
No YGW games for you.
>>2875540
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6wg-ZhnQKx8&t=8m5s
On a serious note, this is like the 5th time happening, do nips know how microphones work?
Yay for more rehashed rehashes full of kitchy waifu stuff \o/
>>2875672
The mystery game was going to be a previously released game ported to Steam, so why wouldn't it be a rehash?
>>2875707
It also was a game by Cave, so of course it was a rehash.
>>2875714
>le all cave games are the same meme
Jesus, you just never give up, do ya?
>>2875761
>implying it's not true
>>2875764
I might agree with you if all Cave games were by Ikeda.
But you have games designed by different directors, like Dangun, Guwange, Ketsui, Ibara, Pink Sweets, Muchi Muchi Pork, Progear, Akai Katana, etc.
It's really only the pachis that look same-y.
>>2875776
No, they all look and play samey. But it's nothing special for this genre. Konami also rehashed like a motherfucker.
>>2875801
At least there isn't a shmup developer that rehashes as bad as Nintendo and Capcom.
>>2875801
dangun plays like ibara?
tell me more
>>2875776
Those games he mentioned are drastically different from each other. Yeah like, even ibara and pink sweets which are direct sequels don't play remotely the same
>can't even do no-polarity-switching runs in Ikaruga
What a shittily designed shmup.
>>2876050
I assume the lazers fuck you up
>>2876050
Did your dad beat you up with a copy of Ikaruga when you were a kid or something?
>>2875801
>they all look and play samey.
Yeah cus controlling uo poko in dangun is identical to controlling dyne in ibara........
>there will never be an R-Type game made by Treasure
Why even live?
>>2876335
>Why even live?
Because you have peace of mind that treasure won't get to over casualise and water down the excellent formula of a classic franchise.
Postang best shmup.
Everything else is a close second.
You know this to be true.Only reason I got a CMVS is to be able to play this daily.
How can people even enjoy Cave games? They are just quarter munchers at its finest, plus the presentation is pretty generic.
>>2876398
You sound like the guy that unironically likes Gradius IV because it stockholm syndromed you.
>>2876479
>quarter munchers
git gud
Cave games are so fair that you could theoretically 1CC them the first time you played if you were good enough. Pretty much all the patterns start with an easy version so you can learn it before they step up the bullet density. If you want an unfair shmup, check out anything by Psikyo. Those routinely feature surprise attacks that are impossible to dodge if you don't know they're coming.
>>2876532
>you could theoretically 1CC them the first time you played
You know yourself that neither you, myself, nor anyone else ever did this. I like challenging games, but the difficulty in Cave games is just complete bullshit. At least in games like Gradius you still can make progress with memorization, which is why they never get annoying.
>>2876540
>in games like Gradius you still can make progress with memorization
The flip side of that is unlike Cave games, you cannot make progress without memorization. And memorization is boring.
>>2876598
I like memorization. It makes fun memorizing things which interest you and making progress through them. And at least these games give a chance to learn from your mistakes and to change your methods.
In Cave games you also need memorization, no question about that. Many patterns in later levels are too dangerous to get through without enough memorization. However, when you die in these games, then it's not because you used a wrong method, but mostly simply just because you dodged a milimetre too far to the left, or overlooked that tiny bullet somewhere out of the million other bullets.
I mean even real pros in games like Ketsui, people who dodge the bullets almost supernaturally, even they can hardly 2- ALL these games. It's just complete bullshit.
And don't act like this wouldn't be quarter munching. Cave rehash and pander to otakus like a motherfucker, and they also quarter munch in the same way.
>>2876640
>In Cave games you also need memorization, no question about that
It's a different kind of memorization, because the patterns are designed as cues to the next pattern. It makes the memorization as easy as possible. Ketsui is a great example. Look at any of the boss fights, and notice how each pattern is split up into sub-patterns, the first sub-pattern being easy, and each successive sub-pattern being a more difficult version of the previous. You're never severely punished for forgetting something like you are in Psikyo games.
>>2876664
I find the memorization in Cave games much more difficult than in games like R-Type or Gradius. I'm not sure about Psikyo games, since I haven't played them enough yet, but in Gradius you always can orientate yourself more easily and find solutions more easily.
Like for example putting your options above you, or in front of you, or finding the savespot in the left upper corner or underneath the enemy or whatever. While in Cave games the memorization just comes down to positioning yourself in the right place. And it's much more difficult to find these save spots there, since you only have the background and the screen to orientate yourself.
In R-type for example it's more like, "ok, there will come a deadly laser out of this thing in the wall, so I have to stay around the corner", or something like that, but in Ketsui it's more like, "ok, now comes death spiral #125, so I have to stay in one of these certain pixels of the screen".
>>2876479
>How can people even enjoy Cave games?
Because they like different things than you.
>They are just quarter munchers at its finest,
gitgud, or are fighting games just quarter munchers, too?
>plus the presentation is pretty generic.
I'll give you that one in some cases, but I don't see many other disco-themed shmups or games about giant bugs.
>>2876753
What does this have to do with fighting games? Fighting games are casual as fuck.
>>2876640
>I mean even real pros in games like Ketsui, people who dodge the bullets almost supernaturally, even they can hardly 2- ALL these games. It's just complete bullshit.
Is that why SPS 2-ALLed Ketsui live in front of hundreds of viewers on his 2nd attempt? Is that why SOF-WTN 2-ALLed DPP in front of hundreds of people? Even DOJWL got 2-ALLed at a live event by fufufu. Just because you're shit at the games doesn't mean you get to pull good players down to your level.
Besides, memo is just a tiny part of getting good. It's literally the very first step you take when you start putting effort in. If you think the games are pure memo, that just shows how bad you really are because you've never even gotten past that first step.
>>2876758
I've seen casuals cry about how they're quarter munchers, too. Any game put into an arcade was made to get quarters put into the machine, anon.
>>2876761
No shit there are some people who can play through these games after hundrets of hours, however, this doesn't change that they are still nothing but quarter munchers, which throw one cheap death after another at you.
I also never said anywhere that they would be purely memorization based. Can you retard even read?
>>2876764
You also can make a game difficult but still keep it fair, you know.
Arcade games are not just difficult to munch quarters, they are also difficult to be interesting.
>>2876770
>cheap death
I can't think of a single cheap death in any Cave game. "Cheap" does not mean "too difficult for whiny scrubs". The truly cheap games tend to be forgotten because nobody plays them.
>>2874692
which is just a typical Toaplan game just with more bullets, which i liked.
>>2876770
>I also never said anywhere that they would be purely memorization based. Can you retard even read?
I would believe that if it wasn't the only thing you keep mentioning.
>however, this doesn't change that they are still nothing but quarter munchers, which throw one cheap death after another at you.
Except that they're completely learnable and doable. Get good instead of whining about how shit you are. And Cave games almost never kill you out of nowhere, when it happens it's because of your own incompetence.
Also
>Quarter munchers
How the fuck is this a viable argument? When nearly every Cave game has a console release that allows you to practice for however long you please? Aren't you just making excuses to continue being shit?
>>2876778
Cave games are full of cheap deaths, where you often do not even have a chance to notice what actually killed you there.
>>2876774
>they are also difficult to be interesting
But that's just it, at least on the first loop I do find Cave games to be fair and interesting. I find the traditional games to be much harder and much more punishing of failure, but it's all personal taste.
>>2876785
>blablabla git gud
As if you would be any better just because you have the autism to practice these cheap boring generic quarter munchers for thousands of hours.
>>2876787
Are you blind? Cave games have clear and bright colored bullets, you can always see them easily. It's not like it's Battle Garegga with its "realistic" camoflage bullets.
>>2876802
>Taking pride in being shitty
I bet you have 0 talents or skills, even outside shmups.
>>2876816
>As if you never overlooked a bullet in these games...
Overlooking a bullet and a bullet being impossible to notice are two entirely different things.
>>2876817
When the screen is just full of bullets the whole time, it is just normal that you overlook a bullet sometimes.
>>2876824
Of course, normal players are expected to fail. That's the whole point of shmups. If you want to win without any effort go play a JRPG.
>>2876837
Don't act like you could tell me anythign about this genre. I already have 1cced enough of them. However, I won't close my eyes when a game is just quarter munching the shit out of you in the cheapest way possible, just to act as if I was the shit.
>Cave
>quarter-munching
R-Type Boy is going full retard mode now. Not much longer until he turns into a rabid lunatic and we have to send him off to the insane asylum.
What do you guys think of the sword mechanics in ALLTYNEX Second? Do you think it made the game too easy since you can just swat bullets with it?
>>2872727
Controller, arcade stick, or keyboard?
>>2876761
>Is that why SPS 2-ALLed Ketsui live in front of hundreds of viewers on his 2nd attempt?
Not just that he came back on day 2 and did the exact same again.
Mushihimesama is so boring. 95% of the patterns are aimed and the scoring system might as well not exist.
>/stg/
>>2876926
git gud faget im so good at shooting games and ur not
u put quarters in because ur not gud but i'm gud so i don't hav to put quarters in
the games u like are bad and the games I like are good that means im cool and u have autism
>>2876973
What kind of asspain is this?
I've been trying out Sōkyū Gurentai, Sengoku Blade, and battle garegga. Raizing shooters are all pretty well done
>>2876926
I think it's pretty cool. I like the gimmicks in the Siter Skain games, but I can't wrap my head around the shield in RefleX
>>2876968
average Maniac survival clear <100 million
Maniac world record 2.6 billion
>>2877063
>Raizing shooters are all pretty well done
except Brave Blade
>>2877016
seems like pretty typical /stg/ to me
>>2874542
So you're not an otaku weeb but you're on 4chan?
get the fuck out.
>>2876919
>says the person who enjoys IWTG-tier games
>>2877228
>except Brave Blade
it might not be the prettiest thing but it plays super well and has a great system.
>>2877471
i didn't realize every shmup was legacy of lunatic kingdom now
>>2876926
I think it's the hardest of the trilogy because it's hard to anticipate attacks when you're right in front of the enemy and because you get fewer lives than in the other games.
>>2877105
>but I can't wrap my head around the shield in RefleX
you activate the shield, you move closer to maximize the reflecting damage, you retreat, you stop shooting to recharge.
Rinse and repeat.
>>2878096
>you activate the shield, you move closer to maximize the reflecting damage, you retreat, you stop shooting to recharge.
It's easy on paper, but in practice the different way it interacts with colors trips me up and I screw the pooch.
Video games are hard, especially when one is a god damned imbecile.
>>2878112
you mean bullet colors?
Purple = cancelled by shots
blue = is reflected
red = cancelled by shield
missiles = cancelled by shots
while shielded you are invincible to all except rockets and impact with ships
Did CAVE announce the next steam game besides Deathsmiles yet?
What's a good babbys first shmup?
>>2879404
Life Force.
>>2879408
Arcade?
>>2879409
I only have experience with the NES version, personally. It's somewhat hard, but it introduces you to mechanics that are common in these kind of games like memorization and timing.
>>2879404
Espgaluda, with the exception of the big difficulty spike for the final boss. Don't rely on autobombing, manual bombing is much more efficient.
>>2879404
mushihimesama novice mode
Are there any good Star Wars shmups?
>intentional slowdown
>"focus" movement
>tiny hitboxes
why are these a thing
>>2879735
>>"focus" movement
>>tiny hitboxes
What's wrong with these?
>>2879415
The NES one is good for beginners, along with the NES Gradius.
>>2879735
>intentional slowdown
Shitty hardware.
>"focus" movement
I don't know what your problem is with this one, but it usually changes your shot and it's to let you have better controlled movement.
>tiny hitboxes
Again I don't see the problem, but it's to make crazier bullet patterns possible and fair to humans.
>>2879748
I rather there be just one speed. Also, hitbox should be realistic to the ship's size, not a 1x1 dot.
>>2876926
Reminds me of Radiant Silvergun or Chaos Field. It's pretty cool.
>>2879912
All hitboxes are unrealistic. If you want realism you need pixel/polygon-perfect collision detection, and that sucks because it means you need damage modeling too (otherwise your ship will explode when a bullet just barely catches some minor protruding part of your ship), and then you have accidentally become a shitty Euroshmup.
Small hitboxes are better because they allow more interesting patterns, and you've sacrificed realism either way.
>>2880370
Using your logic characters in fighting games also should only have hitboxes on their head or whatever. Every game without realistic hit detection would have small hitboxes then. This would be dumb as fuck.
>>2880404
If it's one of those Touhou fighting games then yes, that would be a good idea. But in normal fighting games the characters only throw a few projectiles at once, and only have two hands and two feet, so small hitboxes would make matches last too long.
>>2880483
But it would allow for more "interesting" attack patterns.
>>2880492
Fighting games are multiplayer so they have plenty of tactical depth with simple patterns. Shmups need more complex patterns to compensate for them being single player.
>>2880494
Oh so only single player games need small hitboxes now? Aha... What about games like Contra or Metal Slug? Should they also only have small hitboxes?
Anyway, I think you can create very complex "patterns" no matter if the hitbox is small or not. Instead of making the hitbox smaller, you could for example also just make the bullets smaller.
>>2880502
>What about games like Contra or Metal Slug? Should they also only have small hitboxes?
Yes.
>you could for example also just make the bullets smaller
Not by much, because they are already small.
>>2880524
Go back to your danmaku crap, Cave babby. You have no idea about games.
>>2880502
>you could for example also just make the bullets smaller.
You would sacrifice visibility, making it harder for the player to track bullets with peripheral vision. The genre's full of visual clutter as is, so making bullets more noticable is something that should be a top priority. The small player hitbox helps this as well by allowing a bigger sprite which is easier to follow while giving more room for error at the same time.
>>2880502
>you could for example also just make the bullets smaller
Already done in Battle Garegga, and it becomes a nightmare to see what's happening.
>>2880404
>Using your logic characters in fighting games also should only have hitboxes on their head or whatever
That's a really dumb analogy; fighting games and shmups have entirely different playstyles and designs.
>>2874461
I'm a casual who hasn't touched a CAVE game because I'm still trying to 1cc all the Touhou games and know I don't stand a chance at CAVE if I can't git gud at Touhou; form my experience it seems Touhou fans and CAVE fans loathe each other, I wouldn't call them the same thing.
>>2881223
I've 1CCed both Touhou (lunatic) and CAVE games. The big problem I have with Touhou, especially earlier Touhou, is the slow pacing, but it's not so bad in more recent games.
>>2881223
>and know I don't stand a chance at CAVE
They're not that much harder dude (until you start doing second loops and TLBs), and you'll definitely not get gud at them if you're not playing them.
>playing Touhou first is necessary in order to play other bullet hells
Where did this epic meme come from?
>>2881017
The problem with Gareggas bullets are not the size but the colors.
>>2881186
Danmaku and normal STGs also have entirely different playstyles and designs. Not everyone needs oh-so cool spirals of doom patterns in the game.
Small hitboxes make sense for danmaku, but for games like darius for example, it's totally uneccessary.
>>2881242
There are /vr/ Touhou games, and I can't stand /vg/.
>>2881235
It's not that I think it's necessary, but I hear Touhou is relatively easy. I'm a person who requires weeks to months of practice to 1cc the few games I have (I have all the /vr/ games 1cc'd except Mystic Square, and I plan on going back to it later), and even then that's just on Normal. I feel if I stay at a level that challenges me harshly but doesn't blow me out completely within seconds, I'll improve that way.
>>2872727
>http://www.racketboy.com/retro/shooters/shmups-101-a-beginners-guide-to-2d-shooters
This link is dead
>Shmup Collection containing over 9000 MAME romsets:
>https://www.mediafire.com/?48812jiax8m1c#nz0227tzb9zor
Where do I start?
Why are game with save bombs always so shit?
>hurr instead of making the game balanced we will just give the player some bombs
>>2881912
Yeah! Fuck Darius Gaiden, and Raiden II!
>>2881926
Not so sure about those games, but I was just playing Lightning Fighters, and that game is ridiculously hard without bombs. When you use the bombs though you can just kill everything on screen easily.
![maxresdefault[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/P5T2Dfs.jpg "maxresdefault[1].jpg")
Is it even possible to recover in that section?
>>2881980
i did it once
it boils down to luck since crystal movement seems random
>>2881980
Who cares? That you basically have to no miss Gradius games is one of the things I like about them, since the difficulty is still fair enough.
>>2879404
Thunder Force III is pretty good for that. Not the prettiest looking thing, but still fun.
>>2881284
This shit, a dark gray camouflage bullet coming from the trees. God damn it, it isn't a war simulator, it is a video game. I want to see what I am suppose to dodge.
COMPILE shooters are my favourite with Konami close 2nd.
i appreciate others, but the music/gameplay/visual style combo of these two is just great.
>>2881912
If you complain about bombs you might as well complain about games having lives as well, cos that's pretty much all they are, reflex-based lives.
>>2881980
It's less than 6 mins into the game and the first loop of gradius 2 even on hardest dips is a fucking cake walk so just reset and go again. You really shouldn't be dying anywhere with type 4 in the first loop though if you have a basic plan of what to do as it works every time.
>>2882057
>But you know, it's fun dying and not having to restart the whole game. And recovering is also fun to do.
This is why Gradius iv is my fav because it's basically gradius 2 remake with non baby difficulty but also completely re-balanced with all checkpoints being recoverable as the rank drops (i consistently use a suicide on stage 6 to get past the stretchy arm things in the cell stage) and a brilliantly balanced 2nd loop with a sensible difficulty increase over the first.
>>2882042
>I want to see what I am suppose to dodge.
Then try opening your fucking eyes you worthless spakker, unless you have grandad vision you can learn to see everything in Garegga with no problems.
>>2882154
You can adapt to even the shittiest mechanics or design choices, what's your point?
>>2882042
Here you go anon, have some visible bullets:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgxJB5HXlr8
What's your favorite Irem shooting game that isn't R-Type?
Armed Police Unit Gallop is a great horizontal game with racing elements. The further you are towards the right of the screen, the faster the scrolling, and you get a bonus for fast times. The level design is solid as well.
>>2882057
>it's fun dying and not having to restart the whole game
Then just don't die. I dislike games which basically expect from you to die in order to play through them. It's retarded.
>>2882269
Probably X-Multiply.
>>2882152
>This is why Gradius iv is my fav
it's literally only a single autist on /vr/ that actually likes this rehashed turd.
>>2882136
Having lives is dumb too I agree. That's also why checkpoints with severe punishment are good, so the game difficulty is designed around no missing it.
>>2876926
Unlike RefleX or Kamui, the sword swing can't completely cover your ship in destroying bullets , the buster rifle has a bit of delay before firing and a recoil and finally, you only have one shield to protect you before blowing up so, ALLTYNEX Second is probably the hardest of the three.And it becomes harder if you use the red ship, which reverses the laser and buster rifle, disables lock on and disables auto fire in sword swing.
>>2882380
Fuck off you pleb cunt we get it you never got past stage 1 so have to keep ranting over the dodgy 3d models which fyi look fine on actual arcade hardware unlike that ghastly picture thats from a fucking ps2 emulator you utterly dumb cunt. Gradius gaiden is great but its to fucking easy I can 1 life the first loop on hardest every try ffs just waiting for any actual challenge to start in loop 2. Come back when you actually learn ANY skill in these games and we can talk until then you're a fucking stupid cunt that can't play for shit so aesthetics become your focus. "HURRR I RLY LYK DIS SPRITE ARTWURK GUISE THIS GAME IS INSTANTLY BEST".
>>2882521
It's a rehashed sequel that has no new ideas of its own and somehow has significantly uglier visuals than the game that preceded it. It's a lazy Gradius sequel and a disappointing game in general. No surprise why people consider it the black sheep of the series.
>>2882382
You realize how stupid that sounds, right? If a game has no lives checkpoints are as meaningless as not having them at all. Checkpoints are just an annoyance- they make bosses harder than they should be for survival because you have to restart the whole boss if you die once (most checkpoint shooters don't have complex bosses for this reason), and they make scoring too protracted because of checkpoint milking. Games where you don't have a health bar shouldn't use checkpoints, like Contra and Thunderforce, because games that fuck you over until you've learned to no-miss them have shit tier quarter-munching design, hoping you can recover from a bad spot after dying by inserting more change over and over till you decide to give up. You know it's true since shmups in general have dropped checkpoints, and don't say something like "oh it's because the genre's been casualized", all Cave games despite not having checkpoints (well, besides Progear's 2nd loop) are hundreds of times harder than your beloved Gradius and R-Type unless you credit feed through Donpatch like an IGN reviewer. Also checkpoints are bad for practicing tricky sections because the game balance will be thrown off if you die for instance on stage 5 where you would be more fully powered up and ready for a harder end-game. Using saves for practice is much better since your ship power will stay consistent to the game's difficulty incline.
>>2881912
What's funny about them to me is that it's exactly the same as the lifebar in a Euroshmup in that sense but those are universally shit upon.
>>2883246
I'll take Euroshmups over 2hu faggotry and the plethora of its doujin clones, which are more about dodging than shooting.
>>2872727
Damn no one likes this gem .
>>2883267
Word.
>>2883271
Who is this qtpa2t?
>>2883280
Filename.
>>2883292
>capeshit everywhere
Thanks.
>>2872727
That first link for newcomers to shmups is dead apparently.I'm one of 'em.
>>2883505
Racketboy is temp down I guess. Here's a cached version:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:Kx8Uwkk76VkJ:www.racketboy.com/retro/shooters/shmups-101-a-beginners-guide-to-2d-shooters&hl=en&gl=us&strip=1&vwsrc=0
I also recommend reading Full Extent of the Jam.
>>2883543
Thanks.
>>2882945
>that wall of text
Cavedones in full defense mode again
>>2883659
I don't much care for CAVE, but it's true that their games are harder than pretty much any checkpoint shooter.
>>2883691
Of course they are when the developers throw any kind of balance management out of the window. Doesn't that they are better though.
>>2883716
*mean
>Cavefans would give this game a better rating than Gradius because oh-so hard and challenging XD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0fBss1AxJYE
>>2883691
If you're counting anything past first loop then no, not really.
