Dol Amroth edition
>FAQs & General Info
http://pastebin.com/gZ1T9VCN
>Steam Groups
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/totalwargeneral
http://steamcommunity.com/groups/twgmp
>Total War Warhammer
Mods -- http://www.twcenter.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?2191-Total-War-WARHAMMER-Modifications
LAST THREAD
>>144404187
first for attila could beat chaos
Ahhh /twg/… the eternal general
>tfw taking advantage of Shield of Civilization to jew the entire Old World
MAKE THE KARAZ ANKOR GREAT AGAIN
SONS OF BISHAMONTEN
HARBERDU ASHIGARU GOZAIMAS
GREATSWORDU SAMURAI
ONNA BUSHI STEAM TANKU
>>144405506
>Some things are simplified like sanitation is gone
So are provinces simplified a lot then? I liked the Medieval/Rome system a lot better because of how simple it was, Empire & Shogun were ok because they were straightforward as hell but Rome 2 was just way too much for me and killed the fun. I want Warhammer but idk if i could make it past the city building shit
So what do you name your generals and heroes and units /twg/ ?
WE
>>144446932
WAZ
Haha memes, am I right?
TELL ME ABOUT THE JULIAN
WHY DOES HE WEAR THE WIG
>>144446653
How long until it goes on sale?
>>144445932
I took marauders as meat shields, man tww multiplayer is such a mixed bag, I had several fun battles and the next one after this is some guy with manfred on a dragon and a vampries who instantly dropped sigvald with spells before I could close in and caused mass rout
single target spells and abilities should have a massive debuff if used on one target more than once in a battle, its ok if a spell drops 1/3 of your health once, its not ok if it kills your lord in the first minute
whats the fun in winning if you cheese?
How come dorfs never developed spear technology? You'd think that a race with no cavalry would want anti-cab weapons.
>>144446653
rollan rollan rollan
>>144446932
WUZ
>>144446990
GOBBOZ
>>144447116
AND
>>144447212
ELECTOR
>>144447212
BLAK ORKZ >>144445271
>>144447019
Why does this make you upset?
>>144447327
AND
>>144447343
it doesn't
>>144447373
METAL BOXES
What brand of dental care does Karl 'Colgate' Franz favour the most to keep those pearly whites?
>>144447484
AND
We're playing now boys hitbox.tv/the4chancup
>>144447517
Cocks.
>>144447808
Sigmar forbids this
Goddamn, enemy lords with health potions are the worst
>>144448053
Godspeed skelly
>>144447517
>No artificial sugars
>Few naturally sweet dishes
>Lots of fibrous vegetables
Pre-Renaissance dentition is actually usually pretty good. You'd need good genetics to get that perfectly straight Hollywood smile but Karl Franz is obviously an ubermensch.
>>144447108
Weirdly the sand dlc is more expensive to buy than the slav one
>>144448053
Godspeed, spooky skelly
>>144446825
....
>shield of civilization
I'm fucking triggered.
>>144448053
sleep tight, spooky skelly
>>144448053
>courageous
What else would he be doing, skellies don't run, they're mindless puppets.
>>144447892
Sigmar was totally into buttstuff
>>144448192
Unironically using slayers
>>144448385
>Not wanting to help them fulfill their slay oaths.
w a i f u
>finally spend 25k to get black coaches
>they suck, worse than vargheists and certainly worse than terrorgheists
Undead unit selection feels so bland, every army is just a shitload of grave guards, a few good flying units and maybe some wraiths if you're feeling creative.
>>144448495
>>144448495
>not having pic related as your one true w a i f u
Can I still get the High king edition?
Whats the book of Grudges it brings like?
Can I write down my grudges in their?
>>144448650
Black coaches aren't for crashing into stuff idiot
They're buff machines
Wood elves when?
>>144448495
I want to cuddle with her in her dirty bloodsoaked clothes after she comes back from battle and tell he she is a stong and brave girl.
So what's the better early game infantry for fighting other infantry? I assumed swordsmen, but someone said spearmen were better?
>>144448872
elf and beastmen expansion
>>144448902
>not fighting alongside her
>>144449041
I don't think they'll do Beastmen, they'd need new animation rigs.
>>144448495
>Not removing her clown makeup
>>144449298
>implying the makeup isn't great
It's fucking great. Like she puts it on to make her feel beautiful again.
It's a great touch.
holy FUCK how does any play the empire, these french fucks wont leave me alone and keep declaring war on me while im fighting someone else
any PFM bloke here?
>>144449439
Get NAPs with every neighbour at start. If you're not using a mod that will keep them off you for a long time.
>>144449298
There's a point to it you dingus. They're cold, dead husks and they're trying to feel beautiful again so they overcompensate.
>>144447073
Autumn or christmas is my guess, anything else is too early for a game this expensive and popular.
Maybe other aaa releases is a good refernce, i.e. how long did it take for Fallout 4?
>>144449412
She is beautiful to me no matter what.
PROUD ROMANS
any modders here? I have a question and TWC is not being helpful.
>>144449369
The problem with this mod is that 80% of the good factions could never conceivably conquer more than a few territories for in-lore reasons relating to population.
>Vale of Dorwinion
>Rangers
>Dol Amroth
>Longbeards of Khazad-dum
>Dale
>Anduin
>Breeland and The Shire
>Dwarves of Erebor
>Blue Mountains
>Imladris
>Thranduil
>Lindon
>Galadhrim
>Khand
>Enedwaith
There's literally less than 300 rangers in all the North (basically two units)
>>144447517
Anon, why do you post a picture of the false Emperor?
>>144447073
Probably when the first major race DLC comes out. They said it will be around the end of the year.
>>144446758
>>144448364
skelephobe detected
>>144448053
Godspeed, Spooky Skelly
>>144448374
t. Nkari
How the fuck are a bunch of viking tribes able to raise more armies than the entire Empire?
>>144449749
>80% of the good factions could never conceivably conquer more than a few territories for in-lore reasons relating to population
You can,it just takes a bit longer
>>144449207
They said they want all 16 major factions in the game eventually.
hay /twg/
What're some good mods for AoC? I'd like to play as the Emirate of Cordoba. Sebidee seems bretty good, but I feel I need to be sure and therefore I come to you.
>>144448053
Godspeed, spooky skelly
FUCKING ANTIOCHUS
>recruit kholek
>split archaon's army so that marauders, demon dogs and other basic units as well as dragon ogres are in kholek's army
>kislev psychically knows archaon's army is weak now despite the fact that I'm up beyond the fog of war and sends their whole army to attack
Fun
>in Varg lands fucking shit up
>Skaelings running around nearby
>Skaelings ignore Varg forces to come over and attack my armies
Fun
>>144448053
Godspeed, spooky skelly.
>>144449207
Couldn't they just use various other animations for them? Warriors of chaos could work for a lot of units.
Goatmen are basically men, and giants are giants. The problem would be centigors and maybe epic monsters like the jabberslyte.
I'm dearly waiting for Wood Elves and would love to have Beastmen to encompany them
>>144450114
Sebidee is pretty baller
>>144449412
>beautiful again
>again
>implying she isn't beautiful now
>>144450059
iktf
>Chaos cucks all die at in 10 turns at averland
>next 30 turns the norsca tribes have launched 20 Doom stacks with max experience.
>>144448495
Threadly reminder that this tit dress gives her as much armor as a chaos warrior with inch thick plate and helmet
>Want to make more webms with higher bitrate but lazy af
Two Varghulf or two units of Crypt Horrors?
>>144449740
>>144449740
FORM TROPLUKS AKKIZ YA GROTS! GORK INVIKTA!!
>>144450301
>>144449656
But maybe she wants to attract men other than bald milkwhite bat autists, like this beauty right here
>>144449557
ya well they broke those and declared war, im just gonna start over and purge these frogs
>>144450076
Aren't they doing three games?
>>144450263
They could use Dragon Ogres for Centigors, maybe Terrorgheists or Dragons for Jabberslythes.
SUMMON
>>144450664
They said so, but you never know what might happen in the future.
Although, considering how well this game sold we can at least expect another
>>144450740
THE
>>144449629
>fallout 4
>aaa
Fucking lol made me spit coffee.
>>144450818
ELEKTOR
>500 longbeards can kill 3000+ zombies and skeletons
D W A R F E D
>>144450417
Is there a LOTR mod that takes place in Beleriand ere the fall of Morgoth?
If you do not win sieges using bats only, you are a shit VC and you should go back to playing within the warm embrace of dawi.
>>144450920
CUNTS
>>144450836
IT'S A FEATURE NOT A BUG
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
So i intend to wait for more DLC and discounts before i evaluate Warhammer
How good is it in current shape...its like like Attila?
Sad thing is, when you play as VC half the time you see any announcement there's a vampiress in the picture and they're always drop dead gorgeous, but then there's the ones that you can recruit and, well, they leave you pale.
Modders pls respond
Is there a mod out there that nerfs fucking Norsca?
A bunch of decentralized viking cunts should not be able to have the strongest fucking army in the game.
>>144448495
look at those booooooobs
>>144451192
Yesgit gud
>>144450961
Zombies has their uses though. During campaign today I sent a unit of zombros against a unit of Cairn Wraiths and they slapped those Cairn Wraiths around to the last ghost
>you will never have a stacked vampire gf
sweating
>>144451135
The campaign aspect is shallow in comparison to Attila, but the battles are way more nuanced
>>144451405
can't stump the stunt
>>144451405
You killed Gandalf and they crumbled?
Buff Bretonnia now.
>>144451665
I think they were harder to fight than the Empire in the campaign a lot of times.
What would you like to be buffed?
What they should do is give them their missing units
Build wise, as the dwarfs, am I supposed to make my barracks in the minor settlement and money building in my capitals? It seems like so many max out at level 4 in the economic building chains
>>144450441
>western empire
>illegitimate
This guy is absolutely terrible I regret picking him.
His first spell literally kills one goblin per cast and he dies in the blink of an eye in combat.
Anyone find themselves letting Chaos lords live to come back and fight another day to keep the campaign a bit interesting?
Feels like once I've beaten them off everything just goes stale. So once I've beaten their armies I don't chase the lord down, let them run away to keep fucking stuff up elsewhere.
>>144451580
no, he died pretty early on. they managed to get all my units but my leader routing with about 300 of them left and then fell apart when it looked like it was going to be a final stand to the death.
>overcast gaze of nagash
>over 2500 damage
Where the fuck can I look up actual spell stats? I had no idea this spell was so good.
>>144452019
Have you tried Fate of Bjuna? How do they compare? Casted it today from Mannfred and it literally deleted an entire unit of Wolf Riders at full health with just that.
>>144451910
Yes, only pick the combat focused heroes because they can take on units at a time. The mages can maybe damage units here and there, but melt as butter once they has to do something of significance
>>144449893
Did you say tendies?
>>144452345
What ifwe went over the Alps?
>manlets
>>144452153
They're very different. Fate of Bjuna is a good anti-unit spell, but Gaze of Nagash and Spirit Leash are great anti-hero spells. GoN is a missile spell, so you need a direct line of sight, and it can miss. But if you get Mannfred flying, and pretty close to the enemy, it completely fucks up single enemy targets.
>>144452537
Oh wait, for some reason I thought GoN was a unit spell as well. So it's basically an improved Soul Leech?
Flagellants when?
what dictates if i need siege equipment for a siege battle, do i have to wait 1 turn to take each capital or is there a need for a specific troop that can destroy gates?
Post best voice lines
>FOR THE EMPERAAAAAAAH!
>>144450363
That would be because they fucked this game up and made armor way too important to the point that its required on anything you want to live for more than two seconds in melee. Except then they put armor piercing in so that certain units can just shit on armor but still do the same amount of shitting to non-armored enemies. "Skilled" warriors with high melee stats are irrelevant in this game.
She should be able to be perfectly fine with just high melee attack and melee defense with like 15~ armor. Units like that should very rarely get hit instead of relying on armor to mitigate the damage.
This affects Chosen pretty bad too, but that's another topic.
>>144450205
The reverse is worse
>chaos raiders run away from the empire troops
>>144452996
Yeah, the Chaos campaign is pretty shitty to be honest.
>>144452831
If you have artillery you don't need to wait. If no artillery, you need to wait at least one turn to build a ram.
>>144452846
>WHERE IS KRELL?
>>144452743
It's more expensive and better at damage, but as I said it's a missile. Spirit Leech doesn't need line or sight.
>>144452846
SUMMON
1-5 Vamps
6-0 Attila
>>144453258
ctor
>>144447108
ROLLAN MEIJIN
>>144453142
i see, also is Manfred saying "nagash is weak" and "we will surpass nagash"?
>awaken aesling tribe
>one turn later aesling declares war on sarl
I guess it's horde infighting but it pisses me off
Are we still allowed to post about Napoleon?
>blackfire pass
>think this is going to be a defensive battle
>dwarven allies appear at my back
>countercharge orc army and shatter them
>Reiksguard, panzers, greatswords and dwarven helis charging up the hill together to remove orc for SIGMAR
fuck, this battle is awesome. Some of the other quest battles were forgettable, but this is a worthy setting right here.
>Turn 29
>Grimgor is already fuckhuge, has Gisnik and a waagh
>I need top tier units to progress with my first unique item quest
Bat-only is pretty fun, if FPS-draining.
>finish off middenland
>things are a little quiet
>stir up some unrest so my general can get some training
>this spawns
okay.
>>144452495
when will they learn?
>>144452915
there is severe armour inflation compared to say attila, its really weird, the units dont follow the common logic of - great weapon shock troops being glass cannons, for some reason they are just as heavily armoured, and in some cases even more armoured than their shielded frontline infantry, which makes anything that doesnt have armour pen redundant
though in the case of the vamp-tits I just assumed her armour value is that high since she is a vamp, maybe their bodies are just more resilient
>Tomb Kings still not announced
>>144447108
>>144453338
Rerolling because I just did Ungrim
>>144453475
When you awaken a tribe, you should immediately attack them again so that you can subjugate them. You could also just completely ignore the awakening stuff and head straight for Kislev.
>>144453481
>napoleon has better gameplay
>empire has bigger map
>no game inbetween
Shit sucks yo.
Man I suck at economy in the newer TW games I got pretty decent in Rome 2 at the end but still I'm playing vamp cunts, I've defeated chaos and yet I can barely afford 2 armies.
how do I into economy? and what about armies? should I spam low tier units?
>>144453603
>2 demigryphs
Spread your asscheeks anon
what do people here think of adding formations back into warhammer? would it be better or just add to tedious micromanagement? is the current system in place better(ie units will auto spear wall right before they get charged)? Pic related.
>>144453779
Build recruitment buildings in 2 provinces. Build economy buildings EVERYWHERE else. Global recruitment means you don't need to shuffle around.
>heresey detected! witch hunter dispatched!
>hes clumsy
>the order had your back! warrior priest dispatched!
>hes clumsy
Man, hammeres fucking suck. I get that they don'y have a shield, but for t4 elite infantry i kinda expect them to live longer than fucking warriors
>>144446758
>History Channel
No one here actually watches it right?
>>144451405
Why didn't you assign the runes?
>>144454015
I did when I was a kid.
>>144453921
There needs to be a bit more of a visual flair to the automatic ones, but I'd be fine with leaving them out.
>>144453970
shield doesn't do anything in melee
>>144453940
VC don't get global recruitment
>>144453737
>tfw Empire 2 is next historical tw
>tfw big Napoleon expansion a la Age of Charlegmane
>>144453970
Shields only give missile resistance, nothing else.
Hammerers are flankers, not straight frontline troops.
>>144452459
WILD SPECULATION
>>144453969
>recruit witch hunter
>one of them is blind
How do they even get their jobs?
>>144454015
I used to watch it when it was the Hitler & World War II channel.
ungrim or thorgrim?
>>144451254
Everything slaps Cairn Wraiths around.
>>144454165
>>144454165
I had my blind witch hunter BLAM Mannfred.
get cucked you fagget.
>>144453657
Or maybe she's that highly armored because this is a goddamn video game and she is a special melee hero unit who takes up an army slot by herself so it makes sense for her to have better armor than dime a dozen units, even if those look like walking fortresses.
>>144454015
My mother watches Ancient Aliens for shits and giggle because of how convinced they are in the show.
There are some good stuff left on the channel though.
>>144454165
Don't talk shit, faggot. Now, let me tell you about the Skaven I found under Nuln.
>>144454165
>one of them is blind
>blind isnt even a real debuff anymore
in Attila the general going blind made him completely useless in Warham its -3MD +3MA
what the fuck
>>144454145
they are supposed to be frontline troops though, they where the best armour and surround the lord and break the enemy lines as shock troops. The wholer point of dwarfs is that they don't flank, they just survive through the thickest combat and end up smashing the other army down.
>>144453779
VCs only get monies from their two big building in capitals. The necromancer one and the vampire one. You just have to spam them. Use vampire agents to spur growth and necromancer agents to reduce build costs. You probably using your armies inefficiently too. One big mistake noobs make to using one elite force to crush peasant armies. Ideally you should have just enough unit power to win each battle. I bet your two armies are pure grave guard.
>>144454323
>He has a candle on his hat
>>144454015
I haven't had cable for years, but if I'm dogsitting I have the guilty pleasure of watching commercials and stupid "documentaries". So, yes.
>>144454273
Thorgrim has better starting units, Ungrim is better in the battle himself.
>>144454121
They also don't need to worry about losing guys as much
>>144451254
zombies are the unit you send to die just so you can flank
they have huge unit size so they can pin 2 units for about a minute before they crumble
they're actually very useful
>>144454437
How else is he supposed to see in the dark?
Can YOU see in the dark without a candle you fucking sorcerous filth?
>>144454145
But dwarfs can't really afford flankers. They have their own flanks to protect.
they're forming back up, and they aren't gonna come at me single file this time.
what do /twg/? the first wave I cleared out with grapeshot but their line is too big this time, and my cav is too beat up
Does Mannfred use the lure of vamp waifus to advance his interests?
>>144446653
>medieval 2 has banners in units
>TWW doesn't
>>144454323
I sense chaos in this one, perhaps its time you were 'retired' in the temple archives...
>>144452846
SAY MY NAME
>>144454327
>he wants rng to ruin his best units
>>144454610
If his interests are vampire titjobs, then yes.
>>144454121
global recruitment is not very useful
I found myself using it only once to fill up a unit of halberdiers
raise dead is so much better
it actually allowed my Manfred Norsca Extermination Squad to stay in the north for very long
>>144454425
>>144454535
In lore they are the hardest motherfuckers around next to ironbreakers, yes, I know. Ingame they are fucked by any AP unit because of their low melee defense.
>>144454610
>someone had to texture that
>some faggot had to google "veiny tits" to get good references, or ask around the office
It's problably a buttcrack though they took via the copymachine.
>>144454610
>tfw a Lhamian will never smother you with her cold, clammy tiddies
SAVAGE ORCS OUT
>>144444444
>>144452846BY SIGMAR, NNNO!
>>144454789
>hey Dave, what are you gonna do today?
>...research
>>144454750
>raise dead is so much better
its a bit bugged though, very often the counter of the dead people does not go up even when you slaughter a million fresh stacks
>>144454661
Theskavensayswhat?
>>144455093
it's somewhat random, but sometimes it takes one turn for the marker to show up
What does metal magic do and why is Death so much better than Fire?
>>144452846
ARE YOU A GOD?
>>144454708
AHHH A FELLOW TRIBEget your daggers out boyz
>>144454281
>Or maybe she's that highly armored because this is a goddamn video game and
and they made a design error by making armor the only defensive stat that matters so they had to put a bunch of armor onto a clearly unarmored unit. Vampires should be hard to hit through stats alone, but whatever. Not that 60 armor matters anyway
>>144453538
>being the lord in the middle of that horde of bats
Euugh.
>Defeat Grimgor's two stacks in a hefty siege battles
>I only have shit units left
>Grimgor sends an extra full stack in there, just to remind me that there's no defeating the waagh
This campaign would be easy if greenskins didn't annex every orc tribe at extreme speed
>>144455126
>>144452846
>ARE YOU A GOD?
>>144452846
WHEN I GIT THERE I GONA STABZ
>>144455350
Bruce, is that you?
>>144450417
That looked like some weird type of uruk hai vs hobbits at first, then I saw the filename.
Turn 145, Very Hard
Really fun playthrough
F O R M A W A L L O F S T E E L
>>144455361
Yes they are like a fucking tractor wheel on fire rolling right towards you in the beginning
>>144455441
I refrained from calling my bat stacks "bat man" and went for "bat lord" instead. Maybe I should have gone for bat knight.
>>144455297
>armor the only defensive stat that matters
Melee defense is great.
>>144455416
THEY WON'T FEEL A THING... which is a pity
Fucking Parravon wiped out Brettonia on my Chaos playthrough, this happen to anyone else?
>>144455595
Phew. That was actually a bit tedious.
>>144455297
>Vampires should be hard to hit through stats alone
Armor is a stat. You can also get wards up to 75% and if you max out Thorgrim's defense he will only get hit once every 10 minutes. So that's 2 defensive stats that have the potential to vastly outperform armor. You might want to actually play the games you are talking about.
>>144455595
Why not Bat-talion?
>>144455784
wtf, did you go for that all flying achievement or is that Batman and Alfred?
>>144455963
>>144455597
This.
Armor is great against enemies with no armor piercing damage, but as soon as they're up against anything with great weapons the armor stat almost turns into semi-useless.
>>144454708
I get the feeling that's what he's shouting when he's pounding some ork qt.
This is certainly something I haven't seen before. Still don't know how I am supposed to afford all the good units as the VC, my economy is dogshit and nobody wants to trade.
The campaign is very slow aswell, there weren't any good early opportunities to expand really.
GOTREK & FELIX WHEN
>>144455980
>>144455595
Assault and Bat-tery?
>>144456328
>pounding some ork qt
but there aren't any female orcs
>>144456421
Sure there are.
>>144455697
marienburg killed bretonnia on mine
>>144450987
i like this meme
>>144455980
>>144456374
Could have worked, I suppose.
>>144455986
Didn't even know there was an achievement for that, not that I actually got it because those Lords aren't mounted on dragons. I just wanted to test the power if the "god-tier"fell bats that the tier-list fag keeps mentioning.
When amassed like this, they pretty much instantly morale-drop people, even Lords. It just takes a while to shatter them because the bats don't really do damage.
>>144455697
Actually it looks like it was mostly Empire. Empire's last city is at couronne. I guess paravon filled the gap and managed to wipe out mousillon
>Varied Zombies mod
>this mod is purely cosmetic, if you are looking for armoured cataphract zombies (artillery)
Which one of you fuckers made this mod?
>>144452846
KAZUKAN KAZAKIT-HA!
>>144455597
>>144456161
There are no high melee defense low armor units in this game. Including units that should have low armor. That's because they designed armor to mitigate almost all of the damage. There's a minimum hit chance so even shit like Zombies will actually do decent amounts of damage. Melee Defense is almost useless.
There's nothing Great Weapon Chosen for example will come up against that Normal Chosen would have been better against. There's nothing that hormal Grave Guard will come up against that Great Weapon Grave Guard wouldn't have been better against.
The way that it SHOULD be and the way that the game is currently balanced are two wildly different things.
>>144456681
not me, but i cheered him on in his quest
>>144456681
Dude that was making it actually posted about it while making it just yesterday.
>>144454432
>The necromancer one and the vampire one. You just have to spam them
alright I see. so spam them in every capital. I only have them in sylvania. thanks for the advice
>Deploy Necromancer in my own region, giving him the skill to improve building income
>Make LESS money
Uhm, hello CA. WHERE THE FUCK ARE THE PATCHES
>>144456421
>>144454585
Fix bayonet and charge mon ami
>>144456421
there is probably a vagina squig he can use
>deply banshee
>enemy income from buildings in the entire province drops by 45%
This means that a single ghost could spook Reikland so hard half the money made there is squandered. Fucking spook magic.
>>144456982
You should be going after the Border Princes, Tilea and Estalia too. They have ports and resource buildings, which both help with income.
Damn, I couldn't have chosen a better location for this battle myself. Though by getting Gelt so late, I think my units were a tad OP for this. It's obviously made to bait you into an ambush in the middle, but I pounded them with arty and lost only 86 men.
world conquest is kind of a bitch as undead, I lost like 5 or 6 armies to Thorgrim's stack just because they had lost 60-70% of their strength just from auto-resolve killing garrisons and attrition. Based Heinrich finally caught him in an underground intercept and dealt with him and his million organ guns.
>no mod that buffs garrisons and makes the ai build guard posts
No wonder Chaos keeps steamrolling everything.
>>144456681
Guy posts here, he's showed off his undead Bretonnian mod prior to uploading it too.
>>144457264
>handgunners
But why?
>>144457358
different guy afaik
>>144457345
picrel is the last turn
>>144457354
Chaos reks the AI but is completely trivial for a human to deal with.
