Be honest, did these 2 age well?
>>345384819
>>345384953
Well make up your goddamned minds already.
They have one of the worst combat systems in any game. There's next to no real strategy involved and if you don't have superior firepower and stats the only thing you can do is save scum until you get enough lucky rolls.
>>345385717
>There's next to no real strategy involved and if you don't have superior firepower and stats the only thing you can do is save scum until you get enough lucky rolls.
You're bad and you should feel bad.
>If you don't have the good stat you're fucked
Duh, you don't say. It's an RPG, fucktard, just havez a bit of common sense and look at your character's sheet. If you're awefully inept with energy guns, don't shoot thing with laser, stupid. If you're physically weak and frail 'cause you did play a diplomatic mastermind, don't run in melee with a steel pipe.
Combat system is fine. It's not the best because it lacks tactical option (like in JA2, for instance) but it does the job.
"Aged badly" is just an excuse to not a play a game that you are too fucking retard to understand.
>>345386121
I've played tons of RPGs with far more efficient combat systems. It's clunky as fuck and you have next to no control over companions. The environment can rarely ever be taken advantage of, and half the time your character is randomly shoved directly in the centre of an enemy mob and exposed on all sides.
>>345384770
Yes.
The best looking crpgstoday, all the others are too clunky. Only I have to add that F2 is better playability-wise because of the improved interface.
Play them every year or two
>>345386685
That's just completely retarded to say in it of itself. Old games are notorious for having crappy or outdated mechanics, shitty camera or controls, and several other things that most nostalgiafags are oblivious to.
>>345384770
yea
>>345386685
This
Considering that they were made before 2000 i'd say yes.
The first time I played them it was when FO3 released and I got them for a dollar. Granted it took me a few tries to actually get into them but they are amazing games.
>>345388842
Doesn't mean they've "aged". Some controls just take time getting used to. Just because they don't play like CoD doesn't mean they're aged youngin
It's a bit easier for me to notice some of 2's flaws now.
>Pop culture refs everywhere
>"Vault's are social experiments" crap that makes no sense
>A fucking ghost
>New Reno
>Hubologists
>Talking Deathclaws
>Chess-playing radscorpion
Still better than anything in the series since, though.
PC games rarely age well
They take time getting used to, and I'm not sure if it was like that when they were realised or if it's because it's a bit different to modern games. There's been modern games with worse graphics (Minecraft, Fallout 4 lmao), and games with similar gameplay (Wasteland 2).
Once you get used to it it's fantastic and completely enjoyable to this day, so I guess you could say it hasn't.
>>345388842
It's not that.
Those who played the game in their time enjoy the game itself for content and not delivery, simply because back then we didn't know any better, so crappy mechanics were a norm. That's why when we go back to those titles knowing how fucking brilliant everything is there, we just yet again ignore the technical flaws.
That being said I honestly know a guy who can't ever start playing Arcanum because THERE IS NO HOTKEY FOR MAP and Fallout because THERE IS NO TAKE ALL BUTTON.
Feel bad for poor sod desu senpai
>>345384770
Only the second one
>>345389838
>"Vault's are social experiments" crap that makes no sense
They were organised by Enclave in order to research human behaviour in different situations, almost all of which included being stuck in confined spaces for long periods of time with different circumstances (with the exception of the Necropolis vault). This was so when they attempt to colonise new planets, they can make the trip.
>>345389838
Fallout 2 has almost as much dumb shit in it as Fallout 3.
I love the game to bits because it's Fallout 1 with a shitload more content but it had some really terrible shit in it.
Fallout 1 = NV > Fallout 2 > Fallout 3 > Fallout 4.
>>345390775
That's the best rating of FO games I ever saw
>>345384770
NO
NO
First one aged bad because there was nothing much to do, its existence was created because original devs wanted to make Wasteland sequel after the abortion Fountain Of Life.
Second one aged pretty bad, not as bad as the first due to more updated interface, speed, options, skill options, quests, and locations. Still it aged badly because it was pretty date with its graphics at its time (yes, i played it back in 1998 to 2000).
Fallout Tactics took my highest expectation and threw it into the thrash by giving unlimited amount of dx8.1 issues and buggy engine albeit an extremely improved UI and combat which allows litterally what Bethesda been doing since their own Fo3 had for VATS. Still it wasn't really good because it wasn't open ended despite having multiple endings that changes the commentator and images(NV fags take note).
Fallout Brotherhood Of Steel, now this is mixed for me. Being a big fan of fallout, i bought this game and it was one of the most anticipated games i played along MGS2 and some other games. Verdict ? good clean co-op fun, you can even play it as a single player game. Abortion ? hardly, it was never meant to be RPG for starters, its a top down hack n slash that plays like baldur's gate which release before it.
The power fist is fun, the super turbo sledge is fun, the dual wielding bitch is fun, but i never played the ghoul and the extra unlocks. Still it gave me dozen couch co-op replays.
These are the classics, they don't perform well but they just werks. Beth been doing what interplay been doing since beginning of FO franchise.
>>345389838
The vaults being revealed as experiments in Fallout 2 was supposed to be set up for Van Buren, which was going to reveal that Vault-Tec was preparing Man for Space Colonization and so needed to test things like long-term isolation or radiation exposure.
>>345390772
Except that doesn't really work when the only way they'd get used was in the event of nuclear apocalypse, at which point space colonization would no longer be a concern. Even from the standpoint of not knowing the war would happen, it makes no sense.
>>345391630
The point of going to space was because the Earth was going to become uninhabitable. The war was inevitable.
>>345386685
>excuse to not a play a game
I've-a got to agree-a
>>345390775
NV is an overrated shooter on one of the worst engines of all time with tacked on RPG elements. New Reno does casino nightlive better than all of New Vegas.
>>345389838
Don't forget Arroyo. It's fucking hilarious to me how the fanbase bitched and moaned about every little inconsistency in the Bethesda games but apparently nothing's wrong with the Vault Dweller and Vault 13 going full retard and becoming a bunch of spear-chucking tribals.
>>345392013
So the government actually believed they'd have control and authority over the tattered remains of a nuclear holocaust? If so, that's really fucking dumb.
>>345392537
Actually Arroyo had no other Dwellers aside from our OG VD. Basically after the end of Fallout he just staked a piece of land and said, "if anyone wants to join a tribe led by a badass, you're welcome."
>>345384770
mods exist so yes
>>345392537
Oh fuck, I completely forgot that. Yes, Arroyo is retarded.
The Elder is the Vault Dweller's daughter, and even she worships Vault 13 and believes in sky spirits. What the hell?
>>345393147
>Actually Arroyo had no other Dwellers aside from our OG VD
Incorrect. Check the Fallout 2 manual.
>>345393147
>>345393345
And here's the proof:.
http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Vault_Dweller's_memoirs
>I wandered the desert, but never moved far from the mountains that shielded the Vault from the rest of the world. Perhaps I wanted to return, and force my way in, or plead for them to take me back. Fortunately, it did not come to that. I found a few wretched souls, a small group of Vault dwellers, who upon hearing of what happened to me, had decided to leave the Vault and join my side. They knew little of the outside world, and would have died if it were not for my assistance.
>Together, our little group moved north, away from the Vault, and away from that old life. Slowly, I taught them what experience had taught me. And together we learned to thrive.
>>345393147
Yes it did. The Vault 13 residents rebelled and executed the overseer after he exiled the VD. Some of them followed VD and helped him build Arroyo.
>>345393345
>>345393536
>>345393635
>double check the wiki
>you're all right
Well I'll be damned. I DID NOT remember that shit.
>>345384770
The first one aged better than the second one
even though the second had arguably better "game" content, its story aged like milk, especially with all of its fucking pop culture references
>>345393345
Not to mention just how immersion breaking the Chosen One's character is. Unless they have low intelligence they talk like any regular wastelander and seem like total foreigners when put next to the villagers they'd spent their entire life around.
Just finished Fallout 1 for the first time about 10 minutes ago. It was a very good base for an RPG, mechanics have depth but it's still a lot easier to pick up and understand than most similar games of that period.
Dialogue is great, atmosphere is GOAT with special mention to the soundtrack, and I had a lot of fun experimenting with different weapons.
My biggest problem with 1 is that it seemed really, really short. The main quest and a good variety of side quests took me under 20 hours and that's with a lot of game overs too. It's like they give you a shit load of options and not nearly enough situations to utilize them in, some skills seemed borderline useless.
I'm looking forward to playing 2 since Im sure less dev time was spent on the engine and more on just sheer volume of content. As it stands, I still liked Arcanum more than F1.
>>345394064
>>345393898
That's the problem. Fallout 2 has a shitload more content and you can more time into it as a fun sandbox, but the actual quality of the story content is worse.
So more content of lower quality or slim content that's consistently great quality?
>>345393070
How else are they going to prepare for it?
They know its going to happen, so they make these experiments so they understand human behaviour in isolation for long periods of time, so they can colonise a new planet since Earth has been destroyed. It's really not the worst of ideas.
Also they dont want to have control over who's left. They don't care, they wanted to purge them all with the modified FEV in Fallout 2, and send their biologically pure Enclave friends to space.
>>345389838
The intelligent, talking deathclaws are not scrutinized often enough.
If that weren't in 2, and Bethesda so much as joked about adding such a thing, this board would never have seen the end of it.
>>345394934
Whats so wrong with intelligent talking deathclaws?
>>345394213
When it comes to this particular brand of game, I don't have a problem sacrificing a bit of quality for volume. As long as none of it is actually flat out bad, and the majority of it is close to the quality of the first game. I felt like I was cockblocked at the end of F1, like I was craving so much more but it hit the end screen and I thought "Is it over already?" F1 was a memorable experience and I enjoyed it but I definitely don't see myself replaying it any time soon and that's only because of the deficit of content.
The flip side would be Fallout 4, which had a huge volume of content but was dreadfully uninteresting. I think you can hit a sweet spot if you've got a group of capable writers and designers.
>>345394368
All that to say, I'm the guy who hasn't played 2 yet so I'll take your word for it. Is it generally considered true that's it's a case of quantity over quality? I felt New Vegas one upped 3 on both.
>>345395318
Meant to reply to the post above this one.
>>345386121
>put 9 points into luck and even my dog could beat the game
nice system
>>345395075
Nothing by itself, necessarily. I'm pointing out the board's (largely justified, let there be no doubt) bias against the Bethesda titles.
If talking deathclaws had not appeared in the series up to, say, Fallout 4, and the very same reasoning behind them was given in that game, it would have been a disaster.
>>345394934
IIRC they were killed off in the end screens, so they were clearly intended as a one-off joke
>>345395579
meant for
>>345394934
>>345395579
>a one-off joke
A one-off joke would probably be something like an encounter in the desert with a deathclaw sage, rather than a populated deathclaw settlement encountered during the main quest, from whence a deathclaw companion can be recruited and whose leader interacts with the final boss.
>>345395579
I think there's endings where they live that got cut, but can be added back via mods.
So they just figured out talking deathclaws were dumb AFTER making them, but before releasing the game.
>>345395579
No that was due to a bug or cut content that prevented the player from receiving the good ending slide where the talking deathclaws lived.
>>345396207
I meant one-off as in segregated to just Fallout 2, but I can see why my wording didn't properly convey that.
>>345396394
>>345396447
I thought them dying was backed up by the Fallout Bible?
>>345395509
The difference is that Fallout 2 is a good game, so the dumb things can be forgiven more easily. Bethesda's Fallouts don't have enough redeeming qualities to make up for their dumb shit so everything gets nitpicked. It's not necessarily fair, but it's just how people think.
>>345395509
What's even odder is that Fallout 3's Enclave just put mind control helmets on Deathclaws, which was a way better plan than making them intelligent.
Bethesda has these brief moments of competence... that vanish almost immediately after. I can think of other examples.
>>345398157
>Bethesda has these brief moments of competence... that vanish almost immediately after
This is honestly the worst part. The Fallout franchise being in the hands of a writer as incompetent as Emil would be one thing, but seeing that he can do better yet routinely doesn't is far worse. This man wrote the main plots of fallout 3 and 4, clearly making him an incompetent writer for the fallout games, yet he also wrote some of the best sidequests like Blood Ties, The Silver Shroud, and Kid in a Fridge.
>>345399159
>Those quests
>Best
>>345399580
>>345394934
Because Bethesda takes their games seriously as all fuck. I think it's fucking stupid, but Fo2 was an incredibly ironic, jokey game in a way that Fo3 and Fo4 were not.
