GERMAN STEEL
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You are currently reading a thread in /v/ - Video Games
GERMAN STEEL
ENGAGING ENEMY ARMOR
WITH OUR RIFLES
ARE YOU FUCKING HIGH
>>345122437
>Game has multiple factions
>Nazi Germany is the strongest
>there are only a few vehicles that can beat them
I'm not history savvy; somebody explain this shit to me.
LEFT FOOT RIGHT FOOT YOU IDIOT
>tfw coh 2 will never be balanced
>tfw USF is still crippled post patch
>tfw UKF still has zero early game dislodging tools that isnt a 90 muni 1hp wasp
>tfw soviets gets rolled by OKW now
>tfw okw gets free wins for playing retarded and zero punishment
>tfw ostheer is gay as fuck with crutch bullshit commanders like mech assault, elite troops, osttruppen, and mobile defense
fuck you relic
>>345123057
Because German vehicles were beaten with numbers
>inb4 le 5 shermans a tiger meme
more like 20 slavs
>>345123057
Everyone likes Nazi Germany
>>345123057
game does not consider technical shit like tiger's engine breaking all the time (talking about multiplayer)
>>345123057
It's a wehraboo meme. Russian vehicles were better.
>>345123308
>no cock
>getting slaves who hate your guts to make your tanks
Well done, krauts
>>345122437
How's coh2 now? haven't played in a year
>We are Jagdpanther dammit... and we hate you.
>>345122437
PRIDE OF THE FAHZERLAND
>>345123335
>tiger's engine breaking all the time
Just like Sherman's and T34's technical problems too
>>345123402
>MUH COMMIEBOOS
>MUH NAZIBOOS
>MUH MUH MUH
this is how this discussion will go, kill yourself.
>>345123234
Lol wehraboos
>>345123562
NO, NO PUPPER!
GERMAN SCIENCE IS THE BEST IN THE WORLD
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xyxOXjZHl9U
>>345123402
>Russian vehicles were better
And why they were losing so many of them then?
CONRAD TIE YOUR FUCKING LACES
>>345123308
>tfw i was an autisitic child and told my parents i love the nazis because they were cool looking
>>345123562
NO, NO PUPPER!
>>345123693
Then you grew up and realized that you love them because Hitler was right
>>345123057
Americans = infantry spam
British = tea party artillery spam
This = early game domination into snowball and overwhelm. BUT
Wehrmacht = better techs and GERMAN STIEL
Panzer Elite = Support and raids
Late game and Fuel seizing is the way to go at late game domination. This is the core gameplay of CoH.
Also why? because allied tanks sucked ass. Also german engineering isn't just a meme.
>>345123454
its still alive
>>345123562
Nein, nein Welpe!
>>345123562
HALT! NEIN, WELPE!
>>345123895
Is it balanced yet or are Relic still being incompetent as always?
>>345124181
there was a major recent balance patch that removed shreks from volks
but then they gave it to sturmpioneers and volks got stgs as well as more brit nerfs
one step forward, 10 steps back
>>345123672
It's "Jesus Conrad, tie your fuckin' laces"
Also this reminds me how much I fucking hated how tanks would drill your ear shrieking about being under attack when at low HP and you focused on them and they were just being shot at by some faggot with a rifle who wasn't even moving their health bar.
>>345123057
>Vehicles beating the Prides of the Väterlange
kek nope
History wise, and the short lived but very interesting tank warfare that was waged on Europe, the Panther was an engineering prowess. Tank hunters were a German thing and the Sherman for example, was an iron coffin compared to the German response to them, having their armor penetrated side by side by 88 german cannons and exploding behind, pulverizing people inside.
as game balance goes, build AT as americans. Seriously do it. Do them. they are cost efficient and precise. The riflemen can defend themselves very well against almost any attack. As a Wehrmacht player the only thing you have against that is artillery. Sweet german artillery.
>>345123402
Better designed and more sensible, sure. But they were manufactured incompetently.
Plus Germany's retarded allocation of resources to over-engineeed over-specialized impractical tanks makes for great video game material.
Man I remember getting home from school and downloading commentary for coh replays and watching that shit while I ate dinner. Those were the days.
>>345123402
>Vehicles that were notorious for catching fire due to turret ring lubricant catching fire from poorly wired electrical instruments
>Better than over-engineered as fuck vehicles
You make papa Stalin proud with your conviction!
>>345123130
tfw you could just play coh1 instead
>>345123402
Why did they need so many if they were better?
>>345124615
delet this amerikanski cyka blyet
Honk Honk!
>>345124795
Because the Russian and Brit retards we were lend leasing them to kept getting them blown up.
>>345124615
I love how WW1 and WW2 had both sides desperately throwing science at the wall to see what sticks. I wonder what could get invented today if we had a war to motivate us.
>>345123548
>Sherman
>Technical problems
That's a nice MG team you got there, shame if anything were to happen to it.
>>345124795
Because they listened to Guderian better than Germany did.
>>345124795
>splitting T-34 and T-34/85 production
C'mon son.
>>345124958
>tfw no armies will ever just bolt shit on to tanks anymore
>YOU WANT TO FUCK WITH A T-34?!
I'm getting the urge again /v/
>>345124995
For 'technical problems' read 'kept lighting on fire and killing everyone at the most inconvenient times'.
>>345124891
Morning!
>>345124995
Any WW2 tech would tell you what a fucking pain Shermans were.
They broke down alot, set on fire like paper.
They really weren't a good tank.
They were designed to be infantry tanks and yet they were slow and heavy.
>>345125165
They do, it's just usually more subtle than rocket racks.
>>345125210
>>345125320
Hey guise I read Death Traps tooo!
>>345125320
This is nonsense. There are actually a ton of Sherman tanks still in great working order being used by reenactors and super nerds. They're pretty easy to maintain and keep running.
You're pulling nonsense out of your ass.
>>345123057
german armored devisons were equiped with supperior communication technology which allowed their combat vhicles to cordinate with each other and their infantry more effectivly. german tank crews were also 4-5 man instead of the 3 man crew russian tanks usually utilized. this higher crew count allowed for a smaller work load on the idivudals in the turret. soviet armor was actually very formidable duriong the opening stages of barborossa, stories abound of KV-1s and t-34s taking on multiple direct hits before going down, however, due to superior tactical capabilities of the german tank companies these obsticals could be delt with. the panther was created as a response the the t-34. reed Battle of Raseiniai.
>>345124736
coh 1 1v1 ranked is utterly dead, coh 2 fills this empty spot
there are some things that are really gay in coh 1 though that make me glad that it got killed off in coh 2
wehrs global vet system: really unfair that you can shit out vet 3 knights and panthers while americans have to actually get vet from combat
blobbing: coh 2 has it bad, but coh 1 if you are playing PE or brits you're FORCED to blob because thats literally how your vet auras work, it's cancerous design
global upgrades: dumb as fuck, im glad this shits gone
snipers: coh 2 has it perfect, only camo in cover, or else they become unstoppable monsters with anyone with decent micro
the brit faction: this is easily the worst faction in the game to play, in 1v1s they're utterly worthless, they have barely any tools to deal with most situations and their slow, blob gameplay is just ass
little minor things like vaulting, the new point capping system, reversing on vehicles, true line of sight, all of these things make coh 2 slightly better to play and more thought out than coh 1
>In WW2 the allies spammed tanks to be able to overrun german tanks
>In CoH2 They have almost the same price and thus giving a huge advantage to germans
I'd really like it if my T34 could actually kill a fucking Pv4, instead of needing 2-3.
>Tfw no good tank games
>>345125512
>instead of the 3 man crew russian tanks usually utilized
T-34/76 had a four man crew, T-34/85 had a five man crew, KV-1 had a five man crew, KV-85, IS-1, and IS-2 all had four man crews.
>>345123057
Relic has abandoned the game. In reality Americans dominated the Air as the sight of P-51 Mustangs sent even Whitman scrambling to the woods, Brits destroyed everything with artillery, and Germans and Russians were pretty at odds with Russians dominating armor but Germany dominating the ground.
Once the T-34 was made in the early stages of the war, it kicked off a competition between the two that led to Armor Doctrine the way it is now. Before that, they fought their wars similar to how the Americans and Brits did when entering the war. Tanks were used to support infantry, and were taken out by specific anti-tank weaponry. Tanks were never supposed to go up against other tanks. But sometime in 1941, Russian engineers got massively hammered to the point that they decided to put a 76mm gun on the tank chasis because why the fuck not? And while they were at it, they decided sloped armor looked sexy. So was born the T-34 and KV1 which steamrolled over Germanys shit. It was very common to see a lone T-34 just roll on through German lines because the gun destroyed all their shit and the sloped armor caused shit to just bounce off. Germanys answer was to create anti-tank weaponry such as the Pak guns as well as upgrade to match with the Panzer 4s.
And from then on it just devolved into "who's dick is bigger?". Russia would counter with a bigger gun on a bigger chasis, Germany would counter with a bigger gun on a bigger chasis and so forth and so forth.
So when America and UK entered in, they were at pretty bad odds with the new way Armor was utilized. Granted we had superior weaponry for our infantry and our tactics proved to be superior. But Germany Armor was leagues ahead. We eventually were able to catch up with Fireflys and whatnot, but had Germany been able to make quality parts for their armor they could've kept the war going for a while longer.
>>345124402
The Panther was a terrible tank, way overengineered along with terrible reliability. So unreliable that in 1946 a Panther used by the French to for testing was unable to complete the trials.
Along with the fact that if your panther was on any sort of incline you couldn't turn the turret.
The Tiger was expensive and Trash in 1944, the only saving grace was the Gun.
>>345123057
German tanks are shit when it comes to reliability.
>>345125210
Not any more than any other tank, especially after introducing wet stowage.
>>345125320
Is this bait? Infantry tanks were slow and heavy. They're called infantry tanks because they support infantry and were intended to match the pace of infantry.
The Sherman had issues, but it was a very well liked tank and very reliable and easy to fix. Spare parts were everywhere, and the Russians liked them especially for their ergonomics and ease of driving because you didn't need a mallet to change gears.
I HAVE ARRIVED
>>345125504
OOOOH REENACTORS HAVE WORKING SHERMANS THAT'S A TRUE FIELD COMBAT TESTING OOOOHHH
>>345125808
>play USF
>m4 sherman can solo a p4 easily
>play UKF
>cromwell can solo a p4 easily
>play soviets
>t34/76 can solo a p4 about 1% of the time
why the fuck everyone here calls coh2 unbalanced? us mortar is literally the only OP shit in this game, and there is very little UP things left. l2play fucking scrubs
>>345125504
You mean like the engines that would foul their spark pugs if they were idled for too long?
>>345123308
God I hate Shadman, like I fap to some of his shit but whenever I see his buttugly style without a hard-on I just get irrationally angry.
>>345126316
>usf mortars
>op
literally a clone of the ostheer mortar, you l2p you fucking germaboo
>>345125526
Most of those complains are just "I don't like thing"
CoH2 is meh. I still rpefer CoH1. I don't know why but can't force myself into CoH2.
>>345124832
Ja Finski!
Shoo before i blow up your tank with my heat seeking baby killing assault log!
>>345125808
sorry, i did not clearify which tanks utilized 3mans, you are correct the t-34 and kv-1s had more than 3, i should have clarifieid that i was speaking about the smaller qtp2t tanks.
>>345126026
Russians also liked Shermans because they didn't get cooked alive inside if the ammunition went off like with the T34
>>345125526
I agree that Brits are fucking garbage shit for retards and snipers are broken, but I don't really agree with the PE blobbing or Wehr vet complaints.
Blobbing PzGrens is a recipe for disaster vs any competent player, and I have no complaint about the Wehr veterancy system, since they're kind of designed around having to sink fuel into it in the first place. Grens really aren't cost effective until Vet2, MG42s not cost effective without Vet1, StuGs have no ability to combat infantry without veterancy, etc.
The real complaint about Wehrmacht is Medic bunkers, and that's certainly not an issue with the current sniper meta.
CoH2's mortar meta is almost as bad, honestly. General Mud can fuck right off.
>>345123562
NIET, SUKA BLYAT!
>>345126148
You're a fucking moron. It's easier to keep a Sherman tank running 60 years after the fact than it was to keep a Panther running off the goddamn assembly line.
>>345125903
>the only saving grace was the Gun.
By 1944 it wasn't even that great. Soviet 85mm and American 76mm guns were just as good in the anti-armor role. The 75 L/70 that Henschel originally wanted would have made it a much more useful tank.
>>345126179
In real life, during the German offensives, T-34 crews were shit (the entire soviet army was pretty shit thanks to the purges coming pretty nonstop since 1936), combined with awful ergonomics meant that even the early model Pz.III and Pz.IV's used in the invasion were able to destroy massive numbers of soviet armor despite being outclassed in armor and armament. That's combined with the large numbers of inter-war tanks the soviets fielded, which were little more than speed bumps to the German armor, meant that the Soviets endured crushing casualties despite driving, on paper, vastly superior tanks.
>>345126507
>light tanks
The combined number of light tanks produced and converted into SPGs by the Soviets during the war is less than the number of T-34's produced.
>>345127214
I get it was a nice armored car. But as a tank, it was shit.
Shit.
>>345123562
No, no, perrito!
>>345127234
Can't forget that although the T-34 was a revolutionary design with its sloped armor, appalling production quality meant horrible spalling so it didn't have to be penetrated to be destroyed.
>>345127485
Why are the slavs so ugly?
>>345128040
All the handsome ones were purged to boost Stalins confidence
>>345127738
You lost the war, Hans.
Start shit, get hit.
>>345122437
>german steel
DEUTSCHER STAHL!
>>345127234
but how many t-34s were avalibale during the summer of 1941, and which tanks made up the majority of the armored forces of the soviet union during that time period? I'm only speaking on the early stages of barborossa, not the entire war.
>>345122437
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mwJaQCf6to
Some of these are too much
>>345123402
Only in terms of productability. One T-34 was no match for a Tiger, but when there's four T-34s for each Tiger, it's a different story.
>>345123057
Over-engineering. Kind of like how in Metal Gear, the first REX was a monster of a machine, and still superior to more advanced Metal Gears several years after.
>>345123562
NEE, NEE PUP
>>345128632
Why would you compare T-34s to Tigers? They didn't serve the same purpose. It makes much more sense to compare a Tiger to an IS-2 or another heavy tank.
>>345125903
Panther reliability problems were solved in the G variant among other problems. G was also the most produced variant.
>>345127234
The Soviet 85mm was still years behind the Tiger 88mm which fired larger shells at greater velocity and better penetration, in addition to having actually reliable detonators.
>>345129047
It would make more sense to compare it to a KV-1S, but that would be even worse a comparison. I picked the T-34 because it was the tank it usually faced. The IS2 is better compared to the other late war heavy, the Tiger II.
>>345123057
Install the Eastern Front mod, Russians get vehicles which are mostly on par with the German ones
>>345123057
The Germans did make some quality stuff, particularly tanks and self-propelled guns, but so did everyone else. The main difference was in how the armor was used.
Ton-for-ton the French actually made some pretty solid tanks that could give the German armor a run for its money. The problem is that the French tried to use the tanks as infantry support platforms like in WW1, and deployed them all over the place. This meant that they were easily plowed over by concentrated Panzer divisions during the blitzkrieg. By the time the French learned their lesson, they were already out of the war.
The British made some decent tanks, but again, they used them incorrectly like the French did. They learned their lesson and used them properly later in the war, but at first the lesson was learned too late.
The American Sherman was actually a decent tank, especially when its cannon was upgraded later on. The Sherman was designed with a good balance of firepower, armor, and mobility in mind. However, in the open fields lined by concealing hedgerows in western Europe, it was easy for the Germans to force the Shermans into head-on engagements, which heavily favored the German tanks due to their bigger guns and heavier armor. On the other hand, the Sherman did really well in the Pacific, where its smaller size and greater mobility allowed it to move with the infantry in the dense jungles better than any German tank ever could.
The Russian T-34 was similar to the Sherman in that it went for a balanced design, however, the Russians leaned the design a bit more toward the bigger guns and better armor end of the spectrum while maintaining decent speed and mobility. It also had solid frontal armor, allowing it to soak a hit or two from the German guns whilst trading fire. Overall, the T-34 was superior to earlier German tanks, and could be produced in much larger numbers. While later and more advanced German tanks were better, they were two few in number to stop the Red Tide.
>>345123402
>T-34s having an engine life of only 100 hours
>no such thing as repair parts in the Red Army
>poor optics
>no radios
>no commander's cupolas on T-34s until 1944
>had to close to suicidal ranges to take on German tanks
Decent bait, try again though.
Ha ha ha, they're scratching our paint!
>>345129672
>>no such thing as repair parts in the German Army
ftfy
Fact.
>>345130063
depends on how you define medium. Other nations thought of the panther as a heavy
>>345127738
Ironic shitposting is still shitposting.
>>345127920
That's was actually a deliberate production choice rather than a flaw. The soviets used ~400 brinell hardness face hardened steel in the T-34, which is fairly similar to the steel the Germans were using, and found that it tended to crack and shatter (just like on German tanks) leading them to dropping the hardness down to about 250 brinell, about on par with the western armor, by 1942.
>>345128426
I should really bookmark the sources so I don't need to keep looking them up.
In late '41 the Soviets had ~1/3 of their armored force as 'modern' vehicles (T-34's and KV-1's) with the other two third split between interwar light tanks and T-28's. By late 1942 light tanks made up only ~40% of the Soviet armored force.
>>345129356
The D-5 85mm gun fired BR-365 APHE at 792m/s and could penetrate 111mm at 500m.
The 88mm Kwk 36 fired Pzgr 39 APCBC at 773m/s and could penetrate 130mm of armor at 500mm.
Both guns were good enough to kill the other tank at up to a kilometer with regular armor piercing and further with HVAP/APCR.
>>345130063
>medium tank
>heavier than IS-2
Suuuure
>>345129356
>85 mm air defense gun M1939
>Year of design: 1939
>Used on SU-85 and T-34-85
>8.8 cm Flak cannon
>Year of design: 1933
>used on the tiger
The 85mm was actually a more modern weapon design
>>345130345
It was small time considering the germans planned the Ratte as something viable
>cannon so fucking big it could crush through panther's frontal armour plates (to be fair late war german tank armor was shit due to losing mines that supplied important alloys, but still)
>can't reliably penetrate a puma
Sasuga Reric!
>>345130736
If by that you mean that speer called it retarded and cancelled it in 1943 with only some preliminary drawing done, then yes it was considered viable.
Being Speer must have been suffering dealing with all of Hitler's retarded ideas.
Make way for M10. Best tank destroyer.
WHO'S AFRAID OF THE BOOGYMAN?
>>345131000
>muzzle brake
Jesus christ put some fucking effort into it you lazy german fucks.
Also, this is quite possibly my favorite tank picture of the war.
>>345128632
>Muh Tiger
A good comparison would be to the Pz. IV which the T-34 shat all over. In all honesty once the Pz. IV, Pz. III, and their anti-tank guns got upgraded to calibers that could actually penetrate the T-34 hull at ranges other than point blank it was whoever got the first shot off. Read a book niggers.
>CoH 2 Comes out
>1 Ratings everywhere from asshurt Russians
Probably the funniest thing ever with that game
>>345130052
http://chris-intel-corner.blogspot.fi/2012/07/wwii-myths-t-34-best-tank-of-war.html
Get over it, the T-34 was utter crap.
Not saying that the German army was perfect, but armor units, especially Heavy Tank Battalions had a much better time getting their tanks repaired when they could. Only a handful of heavy tank units had near 100% ready status. The Werkstatt Kompanien attached to them did what they could to keep Tigers and other vehicles in action.
>>345131154
Thats american TD you stupid faggot
>>345131162
>it was whoever got the first shot off. Read a book niggers.
Seriously, all the arrmor in the world won't help you when your tiger II is being pounded with enough HE to concuss you and make the crew sick.
>>345131275
>>345131404
>stars painted all over
obviously soviet artillery
>>345131404
I certainly hope that is sarcasm.
The turret is wrong, the glacis is too far sloped, the road wheels are obviously not VVSS, etc.
I hope you are smarter than what you just posted.
>>345131154
What are you talking about anon?
>>345123357
>L2P
>>345131404
>>345131492
>3in gun M7
>muzzle brake
You avin a giggle mate?
Seriously though, all the ersatz m10's had their muzzle brakes removed because it's a huge fucking giveaway. and modeler leaving them on pisses me off.
>>345131492
Nothing here but American gear.
>>345131492
this kinda looks like a stug...
>>345131626
What are you on about.
>>345131456
God I love it
>>345125026
Fuck the gay shock doctrine.
Jesus even his face you can tell he his a fag.
>>345123057
Late war german armor was nigh unbeatable one-on-one pretty much. It was incredibly rare for any of the allied tanks to win that matchup. It mostly happened due to luck (like the tiger motor blowing up because it was pretty much jury rigged together). They mostly relied on higher numbers.
A common soviet strategy was send a t-34 to ram a german tank at high speed so it would lock it in place, while other t-34 would swarm the tiger and take shots from behind, where the armor was weaker.
Only the soviet IS tank had any chances of winning a tank face off against a tiger or even a panther
>>345123308
>smoking
ruined
also, why does it look like she's pregnant?
>>345132098
This bait is too easy
>>345131283
T-34 is a medium tank, not a heavy tank. Panzer IV was worse and couldn't be upgraded with anything larger than the long 75mm gun
>>345132098
>It was incredibly rare for any of the allied tanks to win that matchup
Sup.
SU-100 also called, she called you a wehraboo.
Shermans were worse vs tanks because they were never designed to fight other tanks. The Americans used the Tank Destroyer doctrine which meant that specialist tank hunters were held in reserve and deployed when enemy tanks were spotted. The Sherman was a great anti-infantry tank.
Also >>345124795
StuG really needs to be on that list, it was the most manufactured German AFV.
>>345132098
hue
>>345132342
I understand that the T-34 was a medium tank.
The Panzer IV was fine for what it was. The /85 gave the Panzer IV problems, but whatever that Panzer IV couldn't handle, there were Panthers around or Paks to take care of it.
>>345132098
The side armor of the panther could be penetrated by fucking anti-tank rifles...
>>345132581
They should have just concentrated on building only stugs and jagdpanzers late war, since they were excellent for use on the defensive
>>345132405
the kubinka is barely a tank, it's just a cannon on wheels
But yeah, I was talking mostly about normal tanks, not tank destroyers. If we are talking about those, even the hellcats, fireflies and the m36 were pretty good at it.
>>345132770
Weakest* then
>>345132405
those things were used as a mobile artillery, real world wasn't world of tanks you retarded mongoloid
>>345123806
Allied tanks were good compared to their German counterparts. Tigers and Panthers were deployed in insignificant numbers, the majority of German tank forces were Panzer IVs and Panzer IIIs. Which are crap compared to Sherman and T-34. Specially late war T-34s.
So "german engineering" is a meme. Specially when you take into account how bad the Panther actually was due to poor materials and manufacturing. It was so bad that Soviets wouldn't even repair captured examples, unlike Panzer IVs which they put into service very happily and even converted into tank destroyers with the 76mm ZiS-5/F-34 gun.
>>345132878
Agreed. Anything but keep making bigger and bigger tanks, see Jagdtiger.
>>345132965
>people actively discussing 1x1 tank duels
>somehow only my post triggers you
They weren't called "zveroboy" for nothing m8.
8.8 Flak was an anti-air cannon too, that didn't stop germans from wrecking tanks with it.
>>345133036
Sure, sherman could go against early models of the IVs but they couldn't reliable beat the late models IVs.
>>345132581
>Shermans were worse vs tanks because they were never designed to fight other tanks.
Shermans were designed and expected to fight other tanks. At the time of its design in 1940 the Sherman's M3 75mm gun was one of the best tank mounted guns in the world and one of the first dual-purpose guns put into service (on the stopgap M3 medium). When it entered service in 1942 the 75mm gun armed Sherman was on par with the German 75 L/40 on Pz.Iv Ausf.F2's and Soviet 76mm gun on the T-34.
In September of 1941 there were plans to upgun the sherman with the 3in antitank gun but mounting it in the Sherman's turret proved less than ideal and it wasn't until the T20 program produced the turret that would eventually be mounted on the E8 shermans that they would be upgunned in american service, and they were available before D-Day but weren't used by American forces for logistics reasons.
>>345133036
some of those captured panzer IV's and stugs were even re-armed with 122mm guns
I'm so tired of reading the same bullshit about soviet tanks and the "they mass produced t34 " meme.
T-34 is the reason they won the war and not only this but this tank was made to destroy the soon obsolete panzer IV, so stop saying shit like it couldn't destroy it in reality blahblahblab (as if coh 2 was realistic to begin with).
No, a Panzer 4 cannot in normal conditions match-up against a T34/76.
And we're talking about first gen t34.
Panther was an answer to Russian modern tanks.
Which was a failure anyway up until the Tiger got out.
So yes not only P4 is no match against it but they also crushed panzer 5.
Its only in late war that they started mass them T34 in elastic defense to cut out panzer army by half.
>>345133418
Plus, they were reluctant at first to mount 3inch or 76mm guns on a sherman because it meant a less effective high-explosive round, and the 76mm guns didnt have smoke rounds like the 75mm did
>>345133036
>It was so bad that Soviets couldn't even repair captured examples
Fixed that.
I mean really, whats with those people thinking you can just take a vehicle from someone else and expect it to run just fine without knowing its problem and technical data properly.
US tanks = utter shit.
Thank god russians did all the job.
>>345122437
Es ist Deutsch Stahl! Du kannst mich nicht töten!
Sum up this thread pretty well.
Is it so hard to accept that all tanks have pros and cons?
>>345133372
>but they couldn't reliable beat the late models IVs.
Yes they could, even late model Pz.IV's only had 80mm of armor, with 30mm of that being a bolt on plate of dubious quality. At the engagement ranges they fought at on the western front both the Pz.IV and Sherman could easily knock each other out and it came down to, unsurprisingly, who saw whom first.
>>345133598
They didn't mount them because the Americans were concerned with ergonomics, the same reason they didn't adopt the 17pdr and instead waited for an improved turret and their own 76mm gun.
Armored force didn't reject the initial attempts to install the 76mm gun M1 because of worse HE, but because
>“[g]un mount and the turret arrangement is unsatisfactory principally for the reason that the gun mount employed in the quick fix turret does not provide adequate space for the installation of sighting telescopes of suitable size and power to develop the full potential capabilities of the 76mrn gun.”
The dislike of the 76mm gun's HE was more of a field concern, considering the tanks fired mostly HE in infantry support (but so did the tank destroyers) and so many commanders preferred the 75mm gun. That however had no effect on what the tank was designed for or how much of a boner ordinance had for mounting a hole puncher in the Sherman.
>>345133536
of course panthers could deal with t-34, are you retarded? The t-34 had to aim for the turrent or the mantlet to penetrate panther armor, but the panther could penetrate any part of the t-34 glacis.
we doing webms now?
>Sherman Tank
The reason the Sherman is amazing isn't because of its capabilities to go up tank v. tank, but because of its operational versatility, field maintenance and general reliability. The turret could be taken off in the field and replace with anything, from mortars to flamers. While the Russians and Germans had variants, none would be as swiss-army knife tier as the Sherman's. Axis armour and Russian armour had the luxury of being able to return to their manufacturer should they encounter something that requires a rework, be it fucked bearings or a wrong bolt. The Shermans had an ocean between them and home, so factory-based maintenance was not a possibility. This meant ensuring that enough tanks were supplied to justify supplying the subsequently large amounts of spare Sherman parts to preform maintenance without the help of a factory. As for its reliability, T-34's tended to have cracks between the armour because of rushed construction. German tanks suffered from large amounts of over-engineered to the point of total failure due to the maintenance required. There was also the issues of German logistics but we'll keep that at a distance. Now regarding the Shermans actual combat capabilities, as an infantry support weapon, it excelled beyond all expectations. As an force multiplier, again it excelled beyond all expectations. As an anti-armour device?
>>345134212
I love this fucking video
Haven't played since the brits though, is the Pershing commander in? Any other new commanders?
>>345133372
Yes they could. The late models of Panzer IV had much weaker armour than the Sherman and the Sherman gun had no problem dealing with them at respectable distances. Specially if it was a long 76 or firefly variant.
The Panzer IV had a good gun from F-2 variant onwards but their armour was bad. Specially the turret armour. Only 50mm on the turret face. The Sherman had a comparable gun to F-2 and inferiour to late G, H and J variants.
>>345134040
>Yes they could, even late model Pz.IV's only had 80mm of armor, with 30mm of that being a bolt on plate of dubious quality.
H model onwards it was single piece 80mm plate.
>>345134363
Not only it's in but is also on top of meta (including even fresher Calliope doctrine).
I still use Infantry though for them quick WP rounds.
Also a big rebalance patch hit removing shreckblobs from OKW.
>>345134420
>H model onwards it was single piece 80mm plate.
Which the 75mm gun M3 could penetrate at 1500m with M61 APCBC.
>>345134269
While the early war Sherman was prone to losing engagements against enemy armour, by the late war the upgrades it received made it bar none the finest tank. And of course lets not forget kill reports by Germans and Russians were made in methods that would heavily favour that side inflating their actual performance statistics.
>>345134420
>>345134040
I'm talking about the sherman with the 75mm cannon, not the 76, which was still the majority by Overlord.
>>345134747
75mm gun M3 could penetrate approx. 82mm of RHA at 1500m and 30° obliquity with M61 APCBC. More than enough to punch through the front of a Pz.IV H or
>>345134747
So? The 75mm could penetrate it too. The Panzer IV wasn't an impenetrable fortress. It was a slow and difficult to produce metal box with a gun attached to it.
>>345134696
>>H model onwards it was single piece 80mm plate.
>Which the 75mm gun M3 could penetrate at 1500m with M61 APCBC.
Bullshit, zaloga claim the penetration figure of the at best 60mm at 1,000m with the APCBC. It's not going to penetrate 80mm at 1,500m
>>345134212
I wish I was good at this video editing skills.
>>345134965
No it couldn't, are you fucking high?
Ameriboos are as bad as wehraboos.
>>345135149
Fucking desants hiding in wells and throwing bombs at good honest german soldiers!
>>345134747
Oh and just to put things into perspective. USA produced more 76mm Shermans in 1944 than Germany produced Panzer IVs of all variants from 1943 to 1945.
>>345134965
That number is hilariously wrong, you need to re check your sources.
Hunnicut claims 75mm with APCBC could penetrate, AT BEST, 76mm at 457m, with 30º angle.
It would NEVER reach that penetration at 1500m. If it did, it would be enough to wreck most tiger side armor
>>345135658
I know, but we are mostly talking about individual tank capabilities. If we are to talk which was better, the german panzer division or the US+UK armored division, I think the numbers speak for themselves. The panzer division was pretty much wiped out in the western front before 1945 even got around
>>345134269
>The reason the Sherman is amazing isn't because of its capabilities to go up tank v. tank, but because of its operational versatility, field maintenance and general reliability.
What most people often forget is that the US had to ship tanks across the Atlantic, so Germany had the homefield advantage of being able to manufacture medium and heavy tanks without worrying too much about about shit like transporting them across a fucking ocean. Logistically, the M4 and T-34 were unparalleled, and while tactics wins battles, logistics wins wars.
>>345123562
Sleep tight, pupper
>>345125717
>world of tanks was the final nail in the coffin for a good tank game.
That game is literal cancer.
>>345136080
>>345136103
>retards forgetting how much allied CAS destroyed german tanks
Fuck off normies
>>345136103
God band of brothers is good.
>>345123562
you made your bed now lie in it pupper
>>345123562
OI' YA DAFT PUPPER. STOP THAT NOW.
>>345135125
>>345136080
>tfw you cite sources with numbers instead of pulling them out of your ass and everyone else suddenly fuck off
>>345136254
I didn't say anything about Allied tanks winning the war by themselves you presuming sack of shit.
I was replying to someone talking about tanks, not about tanks > planes, so instead of butting into adult conversations like a fucking autistic child on a cocaine sugar rush, why dont you leave the adults alone and go eat sand in the playground.
>>345136080
Sure but why are you comparing the 75mm Sherman to the Panzer IV H/J? It is comparable and more than adequate to fight it effectively, but USA had 76mm Shermans and even field modified 76mm Jumbo Shermans available during the campaign. Production was almost entirely shifted from the 75mm to 76mm Sherman after Overlord.
It's true that this type of Sherman was a minority, but I think that has more to do with the mind bending number of 75mm Shermans that USA had at its disposal than it did with the inability of USA to deliver this vehicle.
I don't even consider the 75mm variant inferior to the Panzer IV. It has better armor and better mobility. The only thing it really loses on is the gun performance against other armoured vehicles.
In der heimat wohnt ein blondes magdelein...
>>345136617
Looks like an average balance mod
>>345136764
Just for the sakes of argument, really. We all know who won the war in the end, and what the numbers were. It's much more fun to argue what tank would win in a battlle between 50 shermans and 10 panzer IVs, because that happened so much we already know what would end up happening.
>>345136679
go back to rebbit kiddo
>>345137010
It's much more fun to argue what tank would win in a one to one battle than in a 50 sherman vs 10 panzer IVs,*
>>345136254
At that point you might as well not argue anything about tanks, soldier weaponry or planes, since it was artillery that inflicted the most causalities in ww2
>>345137118
sorry i'm too busy actually contributing to a thread.
you sound like the kind of faggot that plays 4v4, plays like shit, blames everyone else on the team for losing and then disconnects like a shitter.
so why don't you just skip to part where you pull out the ethernet cord.
>>345137010
That makes it specially confusing for me, because if production doesn't matter - why not compare the best variant of each tank? When it comes to Sherman, the Firefly variant could even take on a Panther on even ground. Let alone a Panzer IV H.
Soviet Union had small numbers of the short lived T-34 successor, T-44 available. You could be comparing that to the likes of Panther and Pz IV.
I think it's a pointless exercise, given that 99% of a war is logistics and one of the most important aspects to that is reliability and production efficiency. Which is something Germans failed bad at.
You have to look at German vehicles with very loving eyes in a complete vacuum to crown them superiour to anything the allies or Soviets fielded.
>>345137538
I dont even play the garbage that is COH2 faggot. Play a real fucking ww2 game with real ballistics and penetration and all that good non arcade stuff. COH2 is a failed SC2 themepark rts
>>345137790
>shitting up the thread of a game you don't even play
literally the cancer killing this chinese comic forum
>>345137660
Because we are discussing tank specs in a anonymous board on the internet filled with memes and shitposting. We might as well have some fun while doing so.
Again, I'm not saying germany should've won the war and the superior german steel made of ten thousand french souls was clearly superior to american made of spit and gum or whatever.
We know which side had objectively the best logistics; they won after all. So what left is discussing technicalities.
>>345128594
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3azxIAWJdh0
5/5
>>345138098
But that's the thing, if you want to discuss which tank is the best you have to take into account aspects like reliability, crew comfort, build quality and production efficiency. Tanks like Tiger I were extremely good when you look at specs, but when you consider how hard it was to produce one those specs start looking increasingly hollow.
I think German tank design was overall very poor. They were far behind other contemporary nations which they were fighting, including France funnily enough. France just didn't have the industry or operational doctrine to effectively use their armoured force.
>>345137790
>>345138835
I love "Men of War"
>>345138082
>COH2 is the only ww2 game and the only thing discussed here.
Cancer kid
>>345138835
>rocket bounces off
>get out of t-34
>burn to death anyway
even when ruski soldiers win, they still lose
>>345137790
Ah the token MoWfag
Now thread feels like home
>>345139072
It didn't bounce off nigger that's the sparks from the penetration
>>345139214
it's great innit?
it takes you back to simpler times
>>345138685
Let's be honest, it's much more flashy and impressive to compare two tanks blowing up each other than how easy they were to maintain or deliver to the fighting front or how likely they were to kill the crew due to noxious fumes.
That's why most people ignore that the tiger II motor fucked up more often than not when under heavy stress when they claim they were the king of the tanks in WW2 and that they could beat them all.
We know that t-34 pretty much revolutionized the tank design and industry and that it was nigh unbeatable when first introduced sure. But even between those who are educated in the matter, they will remember fondly of the absurdly ridiculous heavy tank that the king tiger is, comparatively.
It's idiosyncratic, really.
>>345137790
.
>>345138835
>>345139393
is this game worth trying?
>>345131490
>>345131626
Nothing but genuine made in Detroit US armor here
woof
>>345125717
warthunder ground battles are alright, World of tanks is a faggot-tier moba game.
>>345139064
>OP image is CoH1
>OP is a quote from a CoH1 game
>70% of replies are about CoH
>other 29% is about WW2
>1% is you talking about MoW
I would probably take up MoW if the players weren't so obnoxious about shitting up CoH threads. I fear to see what actual MoW community is actually like. At least CoH is self-aware and can joke around.
>>345139334
I think the Tiger tank is at least 100x more sexy than the Tiger II tank.
>>345139623
its alright, but somewhat unhistorical (self propelled B4 howitzers, T34's with roof machine-guns...)
>>345139623
Only if you like good games
>>345136103
>>345136365
>You will never be so baller that you distract the enemy during an attempt to force your guys to get the fuck up
>>345137538
>tfw he actually hit the machine gunner on the head, and managed to fucking time it right; blowing upon hitting the gunner
>>345123057
Late-war German tanks were superior one-on-one but were far too heavy and unreliable. There weren't enough of them to hold the line, and they broke down so often their tactical mobility was hampered. Even a Tiger II will die if it gets shot from an angle it wasn't expecting.
>>345139623
a lot better than CoH imo
>>345123693
they were good cooks though
>>345123057
German military is by far the strongest in the world and their tech is far superior compared to anyone else
>>345141016
MoW is dildoes.
>>345141459
>Germany
>Military
Lmao
>Good tech
I'll give you that
>>345141459
>is
Was, right now Germany can't even afford guns and ammo to their soldiers. Even Poland could defeat Germany in 2016
>>345139861
The first ones are good for SP.
MoW is really clunky with its MP because interface was clearly designed to control as few units as possible.
>>345122437
"OUR PRETTY TIGER, SHE SAVES US!"
>>345142354
>this hunk of steel is something magical, i swear
>>345123643
Soviet Doctrine
Superior numbers and battles of attrition.
They literally Zerged the Germans.
>>345124958
There can be no progress without sacrifice.
9/11 advanced genetic testing decades because they needed it to identify the bodies.
>>345125526
What about the random blizzards and freezing temperatures that could kill your troops?
They bragged about that shit for months but took it out because it added more strategy to the game and the kiddies didn't like that.
>>345143475
random blizzards and subzero were only appropriate for campaign imo, they slowed MP down too much.
>>345142274
that german guy at the end looks like gwyneth paltrow, would suck his feminine penis
fuck you owl
>>345131275
>"UAAAAH this game show russia in wrong light, russia no kill own soldiers russia is best"
they're delusional as fuck.
