Why are there autists on here who pretend this trilogy was anything other than awful?
>>342011157
XIII-2 was alright.
What kind of autist plays through a trilogy when they hate the first game?
It's PCucks.
>>342011726
I didn't, I beat the first game but I only played the demo of the sequels and looked up the plots online. I don't know why, the first game doesn't even make sense let alone the sequels.
>>342011157
Because you only played some of the first one or read about it.
13-2 is a great game, no joke.
Hank Hill
>>342012554
No I completed it to the end. The plot makes no sense. It's not even ridden with holes it just works on it's own logic which it never cares to explain to you. The only excuse I hear is 'well if you read the datalogs' but that shows how badly written it is that you have to read a codex to understand anything.
>>342012029
It doesn't make sense because you didn't play the full game.
>>342011157
but 13-3 ismy favouriteFF
>>342011450
>>342012554
This
13-2 is actually good
>>342011726
I did because I wanted to see if they learned from their mistakes and give them another chance
I'm kinda glad I did because despite really hating 13 I actually enjoyed 13-2
LR wasn't terrible but it wasn't great either
>>342011157
doea nybdoy else feel like this trilogy was "Press X the game" ?
i feel like you could beat this whole game by just pressing X because you could just push Auto and you and actuomatically win.
anyone else know what im talking about ?
>>342014572
>>i feel like you could beat this whole game by just pressing X because you could just push Auto and you and actuomatically win
This is because you didn't play any games in it and you are showing how retarded you are.
>>342011157
I actually started replaying it last night, and I'm having a lot of fun, so fuck you you neo /v/ piece of human garbage.
Fuck the vile peaks, though. It's definitely *that* part of the game. Being forced to play as Sazh and Vanille, neither of which having access to Commando, is a huge pain in the ass.
>>342014572
You cannot get past the first 2 hours let alone the entire game if you only auto battle and nothing else. Stop being a fucking retard.
>>342014843
>>This is because you didn't play any games in it and you are showing how retarded you are.
what do you mean ?
>>342013674
This. Lightning Returns is one of the best FFs to date in terms of combat and pure fun.
>>342015114
I'd say that *that* part of the game in 13 isthe whole game
>>342015413
I somehow feel I just can't discuss Final Fantasy with the rest of the community because I hateX, loveVIIIand thoughtXIII-3was a masterpiece.
>>342015554
kill yourself
>>342015554
Holy shit man. I hateIX and X, loveII, VI, VIII and XIIandX-2, Tactics and LRare my favorite FFs.
>inb4 contrarian
>>342015878The community has shit taste and hates the good games in the series while loving the turdsX-2 is fucking great as well and thief Rikku is second best girlBest girl being a tie between Selphie and Lebreau
>>342011157
what a fucking disappointing last boss in FFXIII, damn it. the game has such an amazing build up for the final battle but then throws it all away.
>>342015419
Lol sick burn bro, I made the same joke on Reddit earlier xD
>>342016194I like you.But yeah, the problem is that the fanbase is nearly 99% hate it or love it.All of the games have flaws but people just like to lash out at the ones that are unpopular for some reason. A real shame.
>>342016543
CHIBI SELPHIE IS CUTE
CUTEIrvine is a lucky son of a bitch
>>342016539
I'm glad you appreciated it, my fellow redditorxD
>>342011157
Because people often criticize it for the wrong reasons.
XIII is awful, but it has nothing to do with linearity or difficulty. It's just that those two things happen to be the current buzzwords to define "shitty" games, so that's what people gravitate toward when they can't properly articulate themselves. Also shitposters. Lots and lots of shitposters.
So some people who have a degree of self-awareness come in and are like well hey slow the fuck down, none of your criticisms make sense. But they lack enough critical thinking skill to actually find what the real issues are, so they come off as flaky and/or shills. Then there's this big needless flamewar and people get caught up bickering over nonissues while the real stuff gets ignored.This also applies to other, non game-related issues as well.
>>342016715A shame VIII doesn't have alternate endings. Squall got stuck with worst girl.
You will be surprised by the taste of people on the Internet, Anon.
That said, the biggest sin of the XIII line in my eyes was dragging itself through three entire games. The end of XIII itself left no questions that desperately needed answering. And while Lightning surprisingly is a greater monster than Marche could ever hope to be, just one game with her would still be tolerable.
>>342016843
What would you say was the biggest problem with the game then, if not the other things you mentioned?
>>342011157
I think the whole series was fun, but i finished the first one over the course of 5 years which might be fucking with my judgement.
>>342016843
Linearity is one of it's big issues
I don't mean that linear games are bad, there is linearity and then there is FF13 linearity where the game is literally a corridor with nothing else in it but monsters
>>342011157
why are there autist on here who still pretend the meme that this trilogy was bad is true?
>>342017641
Lack of worldbuilding, lack of immersive activities i.e. sidequests and minigames, lack of immersive scenarios(for a game based on the "fugitive" trope there are literally zero stealth or escape segments in the entire game), lack of character development, characters who are unlikable in the first place, inconsistent art direction, inappropriate use of music(I love Blinded by Light but it makes a terrible battle theme)
>>342015878
>loves II
>inb4 contrarian
no you're a special snowflake attention whore with shit taste.
any game that keeps you talking about it is a good game.
>>342018103
Why is it that in every thread where 13 is mentioned there is one dumbass that calls every criticism against the 13 games a meme?
>>342018256
Firion is literally the most competent MC in FF's mainlines. He wants shit done and now and will do it himself without pussing it out. That, alone, makes it better than most.
>>342018481
This is an unusually intelligent post on /v/.
>>342018481
Sonic 06 must be the greatest game of all time then
>>342018760
>implying the Sonic fanbase doesn't completely ignore that abomination
i want to fuck lightning
>>342018838
Then why are there constant threads about that game in /v/ and is a very popular game to talk about and do let's plays of? It's clearly the best game of all time
>>342018838
>>342019125
Bad Rats too, come to think of it.
There's even a sequel coming!
>>342011157
Because the entry barrier obviously relies on more mental strength than you can handle.
>>342013467
Its my favorite FF story
I'm not afraid of reading data logs though so...
>>342018207
Except
>greatest lore
>greatest theme
>most realistic character cast
>cast with the most depth
>>342019804
Don't act like this is Xenogears, Anon. The greatest feat of mental strength the game requires is figuring out how to pronounce fal'Cie and l'Cie correctly.
>>342020084
Really sounds like someone who can't read the nuances the game gives.
>>342018207
>Blinded By Light makes a terrible battle theme
>Bad world building
These two shit opinions discredit all the other correct things you said, sorry pham
>>342020007
Don't forget
>best story
>best gameplay
>best graphics
>best soundtrack
>best protagonist
Why do shitters here consider this game bad again? oh right, it's because no one of them ever finished the game and just shit on it because it is a meme to do so
>>342020195
Accusing someone of just "not getting it" in response to criticism of a game only takes you so far, Anon.
And it also requires some focus, especially considering I haven't pointed out any point of criticism in particular yet for you to respond with that. What, are you using that as a blanket response to every possible criticism regarding the game? Did I come into it expecting a First Person Shooter and was violently confused when a pink-haired lady jumped out of a train with a black man with a bird in his hair?
>>342020007
>greatest lore
Setting aside the fact that it's all in datalogs, all the lore in XIII is patterned after ancient myths and cultures. In other words it's all vague nonsensical bullshit and doesn't have any theming or symbolism behind it, plus it clashes with the overtly futuristic aesthetic.
>greatest theme
One song does not a great OST make. Also I made the distinction between bad music and improperly made music for a reason; most of the tracks are okay besides the cancer-inducing lyrical ones, but almost all of them are used improperly.
>most realistic character cast
If your definition of "realistic" is limited to "flawed," then yes. The thing is, the flaws are not entrypoints to character development or player catharsis, they're just...there. Like someone had a checklist that they robotically went through without actually trying to make it compelling or resonant. The token "development" they go through is never actually realized; we never see them substantively change their behavior, just claim that they have in a hamfisted one-off cutscene. This is culminated in the fact that the game ends with a L I T E R A L deus ex machina.
>>342015878
I feel like i'm one of the few FF fans who pretty much enjoy every game.
Apart from XII. Fuck XII.
>>342011157
Don't blame /v/
Blame this fuck
http://socksmakepeoplesexy.net/index.php?a=patff
"the tube"
fucker must be a space pirate
>>342020531
Exactly. The fact that you came in with no criticism shows that you didn't get it.
>>342020879
Actually the fal'cie fits perfectly with the futuristic look because they are machines. And the lore is wholly original in creating jealous gods instead of the usual ones who are clearly stronger than humans. Also, when I said the "theme," I was talking about the philisophical implications of free will versus absolute power, not a musical piece. And flaws are a great entry point into characters because it shows them as more than just cardboard cutouts. But it's not that that makes them human; it's the amount of depth in each of their characters.
>>342011157
XIII is great, XIII-2 is okay, LR is good
>>342020330
>has distinct phases
>takes a full minute to transition to the main phase when the objective of most battles is to finish as quickly as possible
>strong melody is wasted on what should be a background, largely-forgettable track
Also, what would you say is good about the world building? All I got was LOL SHEEPLE.
>>342021490
Exactly. The fact that you came in with no criticism shows that you didn't get it.
You didn't praise any points in particular either Anon, maybe you don't get it either.Don't make me post the entire thing.
>>342020879
Gonna try to be civil here. You better feel lucky about this.
>all the lore is patterned after ancient myths and cultures
I thought personally that on a creator's standpoint, it was pretentious. But on the other hand it's pretty unique in itself. Lindzei and Pulse representing Heaven and Earth, Bunzhivelve sleeping until the day he finds what he is looking for, Etro being the mother of humankind and the overseer of the Unseen World, etc
The only thing that feels immediately jammed into its ass is the whole Crystals theme. There is no good build up or mythologicfication of crystals to be found.
>>342021934
Summarize your shit, bruh. I ain't reading a wall of text, much less on an image.
>>342020879
>deus ex machina.
Different Anon here, surprisingly, I'm going to defend the ending, it shows the game didn't need any sequels.
I actually found it to be good writing when one of the characters responds to Vanille asking how they could still be alive with
>who knows, maybe it was all just another instance of fal'Cie smoke and mirrors
I actually really liked that, because the entire game was spent with you doubting the narrative that Barthandelus wanted to push on you, and how there was no choice and you HAD to do whatever he and Orphan wanted, period.
How the gods were gone, and destroying coccoon was the only way to bring them back, and you were screwed if you didn't opey.
And then comes that scene, an entirely unexplainable event happens that saves you all, and it entirely cracks open Barthandelus' armor by putting in question everything he has spent the entire game claiming was inescapable truth. Thus giving you the necessary second wind to defeat him and Orphan.
>>342022303
To chime in, he didn't even know if killing Coccoon would open the gate to the unseen realm. It was just a theory.
>>342022270
I don't intend you to read the entire thing Anon, I'm just saying that, if I wanted to post concrete criticism, I'd have more than enough for that, both for story and for gameplay.
Ultimately despite me admitting that I am quite verbose, analysis of this game is not something that can be done comfortably within a imageboard post format without taking over multiple posts, and I really don't feel it is warranted.
>>342022303
>I actually found it to be good writing when they basically said "lol i dunno" to justify the ending
Truly this is good writing
Bravo Toriyama
Lightning Returns has the best gameplay and customization of any Final Fantasy game except maybe X-2. Thus they are the best FF games.
You don't play games for the story do you?
>>342011157
it could have been decent if it wasn't a time travel cluster fuck
>>342015878
so much triggering
>>342022653
>implying you can't green text point by points
Okay
>>342022729
Considering explaining that one particular event and its significance took two additional games, you tell me wether or not you'd preferred my version, Anon.
That said, the entire franchise at various points relies on unexplainable events to get the party out of a bind.
How do the Warriors of Dawn come back to help in V? How does Aeris manipulates the Lifestream to nullify Meteor in VII? What the hell happens after Kuja shatters the Crystal in IX?
I'm just saying that, for XIII's particular brand of storytelling, with so much of the greater powers of the world being obscured or just plain irrelevant to the plot itself, which is a story with a comparatively small scope of a group of people being ushered on by an entity that desperately wants to paint itself as all-powerful and inescapable, sometimes just a little event that puts that all in doubt is all you need.
>>342011157
>you don't actually like these games. you're just pretending to make me, 1 Anonymous person, mad.
>>342011157
Well, you're actually the "autist" for making this thread like a bored lonely fuck for the thousandth time.
I liked all three, plain and simple. They were good, challenging, fun games.
>>342011157
anime fans have a degenerative brain disease. if they see a vanilla waifu with ice cream hair they will ignore anything else
>>342011157
I WANT TO MAKE LOVE WITH SERAH
>>342020442
>>342020007
I hope you're not talking of 13 here.
>>342011157
>Why are there autists on here who pretend this trilogy was anything other than awful?
Those kind of people doesn't exist. It's just Toriyama samefagging with proxies.
>>342023960
Oh, but I am.
>>342018207
This. Everything.
The lowest of lows is the story though, things go nowhere for 90% of the game until the end where the entire world is suddenly in danger for some reason.
All the characters do the entire game is "react" to things beyond their comprehension or actions all until the very end. There's no heroism, no thwarting enemie's plans, no epic turning backs to fight against all odds as most FF had. Disappointing as fuck.
>>342024160
Is this your first and only FF?
I can't imagine any other explanation. Even FFIV has a better story and characters than this garbage.
I actually enjoyed the gameplay of XIII, but the story was awful. XIII-II had worse gameplay and still awful writing. I got a couple hours into Lightning Returns before I just dropped it.
>>342020879
>Doesn't fit with with the overly futuristic aesthetic
>what is the entire Science-Fantasy genre
Also, what is vague and nonsensical about the lore? Some fal'Cie want to sacrifice a bunch of humans, so they build Cocoon to raise them like livestock, and the Pulse fal'Cie want to a put a stop to it. Pretty simple. I guess you could argue that the reason for wanting to sacrifice th e humans is an little vague, but I think that's done on purpose. The fal'Cie are meant to be Eldritch creatures, beyond human knowledge. And besides, the entire science fantasy genre is predicated on juxtaposing futuristic settings with supernatural shit like gods and magic, and FF13 does this the best I've ever seen.
>>342011157
Hated it the first time I played through
Playing it again now and I'm actually enjoying it and understanding the story better
Hope's Dad is the best character in the game
>>342024572
It's... it's... IT'S SLOWLY COMING THIS WAY!
>>342021490
>fits perfectly with the futuristic look because they are machines
But WHY are they machines? This is the problem with apologists, they always look at the literal justification rather than the meta-justification. I don't care what in-universe excuse they came up with, I want to know why the writers decided making a story with futuristic aesthetics but based on ancient myths was a good idea -- and not just because "it's cool" or "it's never been done before."
Almost all tropes surrounding machines are tied to logic, order, and the material plane. The idea of godlike, inscrutable AIs has been played with before, usually to represent the uneasy duality between the idea that we, as their creators, should understand machines yet often don't. To that end, it might've worked in XIII. But we never learn anything about the fal'Cie beyond what can be gleaned within the first few hours. They're intentionally left a mystery, akin to more traditional stories where gods are used as figures to try and bring us around to the idea that sometimes nature can be cruel or capricious. There's a distinct disconnect here and again it's not because they're doing something different, it's because there's no common threads between the symbol and the idea it's trying to convey.
>jealous gods instead of the usual ones who are clearly stronger than humans
>free will versus absolute power
This stuff only comes into play in the last hours of the game and it's not properly explored. Being branded l'Cie is consistently treated as much more of a curse than a blessing, and aside from MAYBE one cutscene there's no moment where you really feel as if they've attained any sort of godlike or even demi-godlike powers by the standards of the universe in which they reside.
Final fantasy 8 is still my favourite final fantasy. That feel when you walk into the school for the first time from the medical wing.
>>342023912
Better girl coming through
>>342021490
>>342024990
Continuation because fuck the character limit.
>flaws are a great entry point into characters because it shows them as more than just cardboard cutouts
You misunderstood me. What I meant was that in a normal/good story, flaws are entrypoints. In XIII, they weren't. All the character flaws in XIII are stereotypical and all the character backstories are absurdly-written. Most importantly, though, they never grow. Fang and Snow straight-up don't change at all, Lightning and Hope claim to change but it's extremely ham-fisted and poorly written(Lightning is particularly bad because a lot of her "flaws" are really just being forced into stupid situations that nobody could've handled "properly"), and Sazh doesn't really need to change per se because his problems are external. Vanille is funnily enough the only character that actually undergoes a bit of development, but we never get to see it because the plot never goes anywhere after her arc resolves.
>>342023451
>you tell me wether or not you'd preferred my version, Anon.
I like none because for one they just pulled a fast one out of their ass and the other one involves retcons
>How do the Warriors of Dawn come back to help in V?
It's just a thing in the FF5 world that is shown many times. I don't think it is good but FF5 doesn't really take itself as a grand or serious story so I don't mind it much
>How does Aeris manipulates the Lifestream to nullify Meteor in VII?
There are a couple of reasons
The lifestream is the planet's life and defense system, so naturally it fought off the threat that was meteor like a body would a sickness, the planet is a living thing in FF7 after all
Aeris also may have had something to do with it because the cetra were closer to the planet and could actually speak with it and feel the lifestream. she had a connection with the planet like the rest of the cetra
>What the hell happens after Kuja shatters the Crystal in IX?
Summons Necron who brings death because the crystal which brings life was destroyed.
I'll admit that one isn't well explained either but everyone agrees that Necron out of nowhere is an asspull anyway
>Oh no we've been branded
>let's escape the soldiers
>let's escape the soldiers
>let's search for a cure
>let's search for a cure while escaping the soldiers
>let's go to Pulse, maybe there's a cure there
>nope, nothing but deserted grass plains and monsters, welp
>whatever, let's attack the soldiers!
>what do you mean "why"?
>oh look, the time we decided to attack the soldiers just happens to coincide with the big bad's time of attack!
>let's attack the soldiers + big bad then
>big bad wants us to kill him, so we'll thwart his plans by killing him
>Big bad that wants us to kill him kills us, but we revive because-- whatever
>Big bad dead, we won! oh right all is lost
>or not! ---POWER OF LOVE KAMEHAAAAAAA
>COCOON IS SAVED
>fin
>>342024572
BUILT
FOR
SEX
>>342023732
Jesus fucking christ that head doesn't look like it matches with that body at all. She looks so skinny
>>342022303
>>342023451
This might've worked if the game was actually more in your face about the fate/control, being-besiedged-from-all-sides thing. As it is, you don't even know who Barthandelus is for half the game, and once he finally reveals himself all he does is talk a big game while acting all passive-aggressive towards you.
You don't even feel like fugitives for most of the game, it's just randomly fucking around in places that don't seem to fit into any sort of coherent world, then all of a sudden a bunch of poorly thought-out exposition at the end. FF has been accused of this kind of writing before, but never has it been so relevant as in XIII. It's like all the horrible things ignorant normies say about JRPGs suddenly came true in one game.
>>342024694
>Also, what is vague and nonsensical about the lore?
> I guess you could argue that the reason for wanting to sacrifice the humans is a little vague
That's the reason, exactly. I'm also talking about stuff that's only in the datalog/sequels. The nature of fal'Cie or Etro and Bhunivelze is deliberately left vague, as you said. This is an extremely common pattern in ancient epic myths, which were typically kept vague so that the person reciting the story could add flair or details that were relevant to the particular audience he was reciting it for. There are other parallels but I discussed it here >>342024990 already somewhat plus I've already wasted enough time on this shit. Basically the point is that XIII adopted a narrative style that is completely incongruous with the concrete, serial nature of modern storytelling, especially for a J/RPG and ESPECIALLY for a series where all previous entries had a very clear, distinct set of themes they were trying to convey.
>>342012554
Seconded
>>342026438
>You don't even feel like fugitives for most of the game, it's just randomly fucking around in places that don't seem to fit into any sort of coherent world
This. Who the hell thought that moving straight from a junkyard to a fucking amusement theme park was a good idea?
>>342026679
They travel through the Sunleth Waterscape, i.e. the wilderness before they catch a train to nautilus in a rural settlement, you fucking retard
I wanna marry Lightning!
