Revolver can fire across the map, but shotgun is a melee weapon.
Doom 1 got this right but somehow every other game since hasn't.
>play STALKER
>get this babe
>load in Slug or Dart ammo
>proceed to blow the shit out of bandits 100 meters away
only Slavs can into good gunplay.
>>339817759
A shotgun IRL doesn't lend itself to "game balance." It does a huge amount of damage to anything both near and relatively far.
>1 revolver round headshot instakills
>20 SMG bullets to do the same
It's the same lazy ass ratio design to supposedly reward skill, or balance, or whatever, and it's never going to get better.
>>339818143
>Play E5
>Get any long shotgun
>Load normal ammo
>Proceed to blow the stamina and morale out of bandits 100 meters away, leaving them unconscious and bleeding to death
slav game too btw
>>339818190
That problem is that you're facing human enemies. It can never be different besides, "slightly armored dude" and then "even more armored dude" or possibly "shotgun dude that charges in".
That's why games like Doom are perfect.
Max Payne 3 shotguns were pretty good
>>339817759
>AA-12
>nerfed into oblivion in almost every game because otherwise it would be absolute rapegun
>>339818143
Slavs know how to make a good vidya shotgun
>>339818461
What is E5?
Shotguns are not "meele" weapons, in real life, infact they have decent range but videogames double down on the spread for gameplay variety reasons
Also doom shotgun had a good range aswell.
>>339817759
I think Soldier of Fortune 2 had beastly shotguns (dat USAS12) but they still suffered from point-blank range syndrome.
>>339817759
You did not play Bad company 2. You could countersnipe with this shit.
>>339817759
>COD shotguns
>shots vanish after 5 meters
>>339819273
Brigade E5, least shitty ja2 successor.
>>339819029
See also: Metro 2033
>>339817759
you can hit people from the other side of the map easily with TF2 shotguns, the damage drop off just makes it useless
Well school shooters never use shotguns
Must be for a reason right
>>339820119
Slow to reload
>>339820119
Each Columbine shooter was armed with a 12 gauge shotgun and a 9mm carbine.
The kill/wound ratios of people shot with each weapon were exactly what you'd expect.
>>339820119
they also manage to kill laughably small number of people given the situation
BLOOD had one of the best, if not THE best shotgun in gaming history.
>>339818190
>A shotgun IRL doesn't lend itself to "game balance." It does a huge amount of damage to anything both near and relatively far.
Are you implying a shotgun with real life logic applied would be overpowered when compared to a rifle with real life logic applied?
>>339820634
not him, but mixing IRL reach and spread patterns to generic game logic would indeed make shotguns OP as fuck
Partly this is because laziness, partly because devs don't even want to 1:1 replicate reality. If they did, they'd have to take into account things like all the ballistic stats of used ammo, calculate armor penetration probabilities of the shots and how well different materials would work as armor, etc.
STALKER does many of these things, but in a much more exaggerated, you could almost say "cartoony" way, just so that there's enough strategic thinking involved in choosing your gear for tasks, while also having actual variety, clear strengths and weaknesses, between different weapons and suits (and thus enemies too).
>>339820634
not him, but yes
pretty much every arcade shooter (i.e. not Arma) are what would be considered close range and shotguns would be equal or better than rifles
there's a reason why Germans wanted to ban shotguns during WW1
>>339817759
We need more triple barreled shotgun
>>339819697
yeah but it was crap. i was draining fools with sniperskaya VSS half way across the map, you wouldn't even be able to see me before you got swiss cheesed.
>>339820904
>>339821076
I still don't see a reason to pick a shotgun over a far more versatile rifle.
>>339819697
Fucking Neostead
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4CmpFFdCVQ
>>339821124
More like this, pal.
At a certain distance shot simply spreads, which is intentional.
>>339821076
Shotguns are great for midrange but at long range proper rifles are still king.
A game isn't real life and shotguns have to be balanced against other weapons.
>>339821512
Stopping power.
A round close range from a rifle is going to hurt, but likely be a through-and-through, with the opponent able to react.
The kinetic energy transfer from a 12-gauge round is enough to basically stun an opponent.
It's like getting bitten by a snake vs being kicked by a horse.
Both deadly, but one is more likely to prevent you from doing anything immediately afterwards.
modern game balance just appeals to the lowest common denominator
see SF4 for this
the most obvious example being how they made vega worthless because he was so good in Super Turbo and people hated him because of that
the shotgun in FPS games is vega, used to be great, got nerfed into nothing
again look to SF4. even though O.Sagat was the other best character, he ended up being the strongest in SF4
Sagat is also the other best weapon in DOOM(note I'm referring to singleplayer, the chaingun kind of sucks in multi due to the ease of acquiring the fancy weapons), Sagat is the chaingun, or rather the automatic weapon, in FPS, great from the start and everything else was nerfed to the point where it's the only gun that matters
>>339821138
RE5 and Bulletstorm
>>339822042
>A round close range from a rifle is going to hurt, but likely be a through-and-through, with the opponent able to react.
That's why you never fire only one round with a rifle when semi-auto exists.
By the time the guy would be reacting, I can guarantee you he'd have enough holes in him to be dead.
>>339821512
you're more likely to hit target, you have much better stopping power at close range and you can load up lots of different shells, shotgun is basically both close and medium range weapon
>>339821687
that's true, but as I said, most videogames are medium range most, so shotguns would be too OP
>>339822341
With a rifle you don't need lots of different kinds of bullets.
Already explained why close range stopping power doesn't make a difference unless you both jump around a corner simultaneously and react at the exact same time.
I'll give you that you're more likely to hit your target if you don't have time to aim.
>>339822189
It's easy to imagine that to be the case, but even 2-3 through and throughs are not always enough to end a confrontation.
A 12-gauge shot is like landing 5 .223 rounds at once in a 2-inch circle.
Also, there's less risk of collateral, both to ricochet on people and punch-through on property.
>>339822864
Are we even talking about video games anymore?
>even 2-3 through and throughs are not always enough to end a confrontation
>Also, there's less risk of collateral, both to ricochet on people and punch-through on property.
>>339823102
No, we are referring to real life.
Follow the conversation.
>>339823197
>>>/k/
>>339823425
>a discussion about realistic guns in videogames
>hurf durf go to /k/
>>339823585
>realistic guns in real life = realistic guns in video games
All Revolvers in games should be incredibly OP yet at the same time the hardest weapon in the game to be good with, separating the men from the boys.
>>339823646
>realistic guns in real life
Oh ok, you're retarded.
>>339823837
>even 2-3 through and throughs are not always enough to end a confrontation
>Also, there's less risk of collateral, both to ricochet on people and punch-through on property.
>>339823646
>>339823585
>>339823425
>>339823197
>>339823102
its about misconceptions ingrained into vidya thats far beyond the time to let them go.
mostly its the shotguns are melee rage and wide spread meme
>>339818992
It was pretty awesome inmoddedFO3.
>>339824246
>its about misconceptions ingrained into vidya
The misconceptions don't fucking matter in videogames, because nothing you do WITHIN videogames happens because you press buttons, do you understand?
You do not walk by pressing a stick or an arrow key forward. You do not look by moving your arm or moving a stick. You do not receive experience points or have access to a pause or save function.
It's all there to make the game more enjoyable to play. And if the only gun that matters is a fucking shotgun, then that makes the game less enjoyable to play than if there were a bunch of weapons all with a variety of uses.
>>339824457
the problem is that before it was shotgun vs assault rifle and that would lead to shotguns being OP. now with military shooters, games have 10+ assault rifles with varying degrees of range and accuracy. shotguns should be moved back to mid range. single shot vs rapid smg. especially that smgs still compete with assault rifles in many cases. just as ars high range and acc vs lmg high dam and spread. melee needs an complete overhaul. too much of it stands on tradition when all the the other gunplay modeling has moved on.
>>339823768
Nagant revolver in RO2 takes like 2-3 hits regularly to kill, excluding heart, head and nutshots.
Also the silencer for it is pretty dope.
>mfw doom 3 shotgun
literally hits anything but the target
