I have never seen the VR meme get so utterly destroyed.
quora.com/How-big-an-issue-is-the-nausea-problem-for-Virtual-Reality-products/answer/Steve-Baker-9
Who the fuck would believe this was ever a good idea?
>>338582609
The VR runs at 30fps doesn't it.
That'll give you nausea.
It needs to be up around 800 fps before it becomes unnoticeable, though most people can tank 200fps for brief periods.
>>338582609
VR will always be a novelty
>>338582609
Let the technology get mature and cheap then buy it.
>>338583306
It won't even be that. They haven't solved the problems from Virtual Boy.
>>338582760
No it fucking doesn't. 90fps is the absolute minimum, even for Playstation VR.
If it's lower than that, then you need to upgrade your PC.
>>338583827
Like what?
>>338582609
>talks about how VR causes nausea and everyone who says it doesn't ignores the evidence
>thousands of Rift and Vive owners never had any problems despite using it for hours at a time everyday
He's full of shit.
>>338582609
>quora.com/How-big-an-issue-is-the-nausea-problem-for-Virtual-Reality-products/answer/Steve-Baker-9
>muh eye muscles
I can spend the entire day in VR looking at boobies close to my face and don't feel any sickness whatsoever
Same goes for the guys over at giantbomb
That guy is a literal attention whore
>>338582609
That is a pretty good read, and i hope he is right so everyone that uses these things die in a car crash.
>>338584000
>90fps is the absolute minimum
given that the screens are 90hz, 90fps is the absolute maximum
>>338584654
lol yeah, all those 60hz monitors that can't display 61fps, huh?
>>338584756
>>338584830
Sorry, I forgot the human eye can't see past 90fps anyway!
>claims he's an expert
>doesn't even know about light field displays that completely fix the convergence issue
Yeah, stopped reading when he said there's no know technological means to fix it which isn't even a big deal in the first place.
Don't trust anyone that has to say "I am an expert"
>>338584756
Well yes, they can't display 61fps. Your hardware can compute 61 frames per second, but one of them will be dropped on the monitor.
>>338584756
You won't bait me this time, fish!
Humans can't even see more than 720p
>>338582609
>quora.com
Is this site the new Yahoo answers?
>>338585019
From my understanding, the Oculus doesn't use a light field display, at least not yet.
>>338585019
I am an expert on shitposting and this guy is correct.
>>338585019
>source: your ass
>talks down authorities in the next sentence
sasuga /v/
>>338583637
This is what i'm doing. I'm waiting a few years before I bite the bullet.
It sounds great, i'm onboard but they still have to get the headsets just right, figure the controls out and make some indepth games that aren't just tech demos before I spend money on it.
>>338585032
There is a big difference between 60fps and 120fps on a 60hz monitor.
>>338585303
>oculus
Vive is the new hotness now.
>>338585340
>can't even use google
>"authorities"
That guy is a literally who.
>>338585347
Controls can feel more responsive, true. But visually, any difference you might have seen was placebo.
>>338585346
There are already a few games available that aren't just tech demos, like Job Simulator and that one post-apocalyptic online car shooter.
I don't really mind tech demos, though.
>>338585303
It doesn't but that doesn't mean there's no known technological fix. I've tried the prototypes by Nvidia and you can focus like in real life. But honestly, this guy is full of shit, not a problem like this guy is claiming it to be. It's more of a loss of immersion in situations than anything.
>>338585340
Literally just google Light Field Displays
>>338585438
Burden of proof is on you, m8.
>That guy is a literally who.
Assuming so, he links a funded government study backing his claims.
Where's yours?
>>338582609
I played with the DK2 for 2 hours without removing the headgear back in 2014.
I played with the Vive for 1 and a half hour before the game crashed.
VR nausea is something you get if you're a wuzz.
>>338584058
Being red and black, needing a stand and only having 8bit sprite graphics.
>>338582609
Feels like VR is a tech that came to vidya too early.
I'd wait for 5 to 10 years more.
>>338585557
>Where's yours?
Tens of thousands of Vive and even Oculus owners reporting no issues whatsoever.
The only problem people ever had with the headsets was that they don't fit their heads, which is easily fixable on Vive anyway.
>>338585527
Yeah but they're a bit too casual for me. I'm not one of those /v/irgins who throws that word around casually (heh) but I need a game with meat.
I'm basically waiting for a good, detailed, indepth high fantasy setting game or something.
>>338585628
>works fine4me
Not a source.
Next memer.
And no, linking an nvidia research proposal meant to sell an eventual product, ISN'T a viable source
>>338585685
Oh, I see. I personally have no problems with tech demos and some even seem very interesting, like that gun simulator. In your case though, you'll just have to wait a few years before any serious announcements.
That PSVR mech game has potential.
>>338585628
It's easily fixable on the Rift too.
>>338585704
Pretty sure that actual tests by actual consumers mean much more than old tests by people unaccustomed to computer screens working with old hardware and software.
>YOU CAN'T USE VR FOR MORE THAN 10 MINUTES
>AN HOUR TOPS
Meanwhile, my longest session is 4 hours and no problem.
However, I will say that certain rendering settings in vorpx WILL cause nausia almost immediately (or after a minute). This has to do with matching the IPD in the virtual world to your real-world eyes.
So I'm not sure what the article's purpose is other than to say, "We've been using a simulation that makes us sick for years, but this new device is totally worse!" when they're wrong.
>>338585528
Let's assume he just doesn't know about them, or he knows about them but also knows they aren't remotely suitable for consumer hardware due to the cost.
That only removes one of the two MASSIVE flaws, and it doesn't even touch upon the other one which is a million times more damaging to the concept.
>>338585340
>authorities
>>338585801
See, that gun simulator is a good example. It looks amazing for something so new in concept but it's just a gun range.
Now give me an fps vr GTA implementing those fancy gun mechanics and we'll talk.
>>338585880
Let's pretend you even read the article, and remind you that he doesn't say you can't use VR for more than 10 minutes. He says for a sizeable percentage of the population, VR actively induces nausea as quickly as minutes after putting it on.
Let me tell you what happens to products that make people sick. Either, they don't even remotely take off due to being retarded gimmicks (hint, this is the one VR is destined for in its current format), or they explode in popularity and are recalled in a month when the company shuts down due to being sued a million times for making people throw up and crash their cars.
>>338586159
No fancy gun mechanics because >GTA, but...
https://u.pomf.is/cwtlcg.mp4
>>338585923
Ok I read on just for you anon
>But this problem simply cannot be fixed by any means.
People have solved this by using teleport techniques which makes no one sick but you lose immersion obviously. Also with room scale you don't have this issue because the movement is 1:1
Cockpit sims don't have this issue, some games narrow your vision or put a box around you when in movement. There's a bunch of designs and people are coming up with new and different ways around it.
Then you have people that are just completely unphased by it can can just move around at 50mph with no issues.
This is all about design and is completely fixable. This guy really is clueless. He didn't mention anything about these techniques and just says whelp can't be fixed.
>>338584243
It varies based on the person, I had the rift beta. My PC wasnt great for some demos, but basically anything with WASD movement would give me some motion sickness. Couldnt really handle it at length because it feels like having your body involuntarily pulled around. Meanwhile girlfriend was zipping around in tf2 as the scout testing it and had no problems at all.
Yeah no wonder I've used my Vive for hours at a time without ever feeling remotely sick.
This thread and that article are clickbait bullshit. Why is /v/ full of so many angry poor people?
>>338586206
Show me one person that got nausea after 10 minutes in COMMERCIAL VR. I'll wait.
>>338586159
what kind of mudrace has shit enough genetics to get sick from VR?
>>338584938
Actually they did a study with fighter pilots, though they couldnt see a visual that flashed by at a high speed, they could still detect its presence
>>338586298
>>People have solved this by using teleport techniques
This isn't a solution. This is a workaround to deliver incredibly dull experiences. Nobody in their right mind saw the OR demos a few years back and thought, "man, I can't wait to sit perfectly still and blink all over the place!".
What he's saying is that anything close to classical game development isn't possible in the boring new environment. What this means is that you're going to have either VR games, which will be bland tech demos priced at 60 dollars, or normal games, which can't be played in VR due to all the issues. It's amazing how VR fans have gone from "it's a revolution, I can play all my old and new games in VR with a patch!" to "I'm so glad we can only play games designed for VR in VR." I guess when you invest that much into it, any delusion is possible.
If you can't move in it without making you sick, it's fucking dead
I bet tons of people who are interested in this have no idea about that.
>>338582609
Nausea hasn't been a problem at all for me. My biggest complain is how heavy and hot I feel while wearing the Vive.
>>338584243
He is a monitor producent. Or shill ir.
They both will lose big bux to vr.
Its a god like combination of both.
>>338585491
lower input delay = better feeling of control. maybe the OP wasn't talking about refresh rate, but rather delay between movements?
>>338585880
Dont forget when occulus loses connection with the camera boundary and sends your vision careening sideways.
but seriously, why is the vr meme being shilled SO hard? everyone's pushing this idea that it's going to be normal within a few years that everyone is going to be strapped into a vr headset while they play vidya.
bull fucking shit. it's NICHE. that's all it will ever be. take your "immersive experiences wow..." and fuck off out of my video games.
I'm not going to sit around and let these imbeciles shit all over video games any more. I've had it. I'm tired.
VR, FUCK OFF. no one wants you
>>338586584
> This is a workaround to deliver incredibly dull experiences.
I've had a blast playing Budget Cuts and various demos in The Lab and so have the 20 or so people I've demo'd it to. Not one person would describe it as incredibly dull and you can find plenty of evidence of that just searching for reactions.
>What he's saying is that anything close to classical game development isn't possible in the boring new environment.
No he isn't. He's literally saying it cannot be fixed by any means. Read into it how you see fit but it doesn't change that exact quote which isn't out of context either. He doesn't mention any of these techniques at all. He's fucking clueless.
>>338586689
$600 makes people say some dumb things out of buyers remorse
>>338586332
Because poor people are literally niggers
>>338585704
Best provs.
The cust has spoken.
You have writen shit.
He has smiles and lougther on thousends of yewtube videos.
You got out proved.
>>338586919
Speak english or die
>>338586334
I have a kickstarter v1 Oculus and I really can't use it because of the nausea.
>>338582609
vr will ONLY take off once vestibular stimulation gets integrated with the headsets:
http://www.vmocion.com/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Li_1xQV_Hs
>>338586206
Let's look at some quotes from the article
>About half of people feel sick after a few minutes
My mother, someone who is on their phone all day, says she cannot watch 3D movies because they make her sick. She says that it only takes about 5 minutes of watching a 3D movie and simply feels nauseus. She told me once that while looking at a buffering icon (a spinning picture), she felt woozy, she is probably one of the few people in the world who tripped and fell while walking through a stationary platform in a spinning tunnel at a carnival/fair we went to.
I let her try my Vive, and she spent half an hour without any complaints what-so-ever. However, see the last quote to see how small of a margin this can affect people.
>When you’ve spent an hour in one of these contraptions - it can get very bad indeed.
He then proceeds to explain how his veteran team of scientists only uses VR in short 30-second bursts while LITERALLY just TESTING things.
>part of the aviation population that experiences delayed problems beyond the simulator exposure and for periods that exceed 6 to 8 hours for approximately 8 percent of the population and l-to-2 days for an even smaller population.
EIGHT percent, so let's round up to ONE TENTH. That's a fairly small number if you ask me, and they say it can be even worse for a smaller fraction. That seems like such a small factor that I doubt people who play video games all day are going to be a part of it.
I will admit, on my own accounts, that after I left VR during my first uses, my focus felt... Off. If anything, it felt that my focus had strengthened, or maybe it just means that my focus had strained. Either way, my vision seemed clearer in a way, but also a bit overwhelming. I can see how this could affect driving, but I don't think it's harmful.
>>338586206
>For a certain percentage
Genetic inferior plebs. There genes have to be removed from the pool before they polute it and doom the gamer race.
Or in short. The future is not braking for leftovers.
>>338586584
>"it's a revolution, I can play all my old and new games in VR with a patch!" to "I'm so glad we can only play games designed for VR in VR." I guess when you invest that much into it, any delusion is possible.
Only uninformed idiots thought that. I've been following it since the Kickstarter and it has been clear nearly since the very start that games would need to be developed with VR in mind. Talk to anyone that knows anything and they'd tell you that. So no, VR fans haven't changed any standpoint on that.
>>338586829
>he's crying
>>338586829
>He's literally saying it cannot be fixed by any means
And it can't, you clueless retard.
Inventing entirely new methods of playing games isn't fixing the underlying issue. It's a workaround, not a fix, a fix would be some fucking magic headphones that apply pressure to your inner ear so you don't have the disconnect between VR and reality. But those don't exist, and it's unlikely they ever will.
>>338587010
What you really need is force feedback if you want games more than waggle shit.
>>338586206
>He says for a sizeable percentage of the population
aka normies
normies don't belong here
>>338586827
Anon, I'm sorry for shilling VR.
It's really neat, I want people to try it. It's not better than traditionaly gaming, it's just a new way to experience it, like 4k monitors or 120fps.
>>338586827
I have a Vive, I really like it, but it won't ever replace the current way of playing video games. That said, I do hope it will continue to be supported decently enough as there are some great experiences and potential games with it.
>>338587036
>That's a fairly small number if you ask me
Being completely unusable for a tenth of the population is an absolute joke, dude. Your assumption that video game players would somehow be less susceptible to sim sickness must come from either a complete misunderstanding of statistics, or the mistaken believe that hand-eye coordination has anything to do with nausea.
>>338587113
Oh boy now we can get into semantics of "workaround" vs "fixed". Call it what you want. I don't care. It's still obvious this guy is clueless.
>And it can't, you clueless retard.
Oh and it can too. There's places like The Void that keep 1:1 movement or you have a treadmill so there are means in that regard as well.
Keep holding on to this guy's word though because he's an "expert"
Marketers: You'll be able to do anything! ANYTHING!
Expert: It's going to be limited because of these problems and these problems are not easily fixed.
Morons: LOL, whatever "expert!" I believe the marketing!
I'm enjoying my roomscale porn on the vive just fine.
Tfw i can choose to fap in any position i want to.
>>338587298
Why the fuck you care for 1/10 th if 9/10 are ok with it?
Fuck the 1/10.
Evolution nigger.
If VR is speeding up the procces even better.
>>338587354
>>Oh and it can too. There's places like The Void that keep 1:1 movement or you have a treadmill so there are means in that regard as well.
These are not FIXES. I don't understand how words are so hard for you.
The issue is that you can't move around in VR space without physically moving. Saying "oh, but I can run around an abandoned warehouse to play a single game" is not a solution to this problem. It's a workaround to devise a method of moving in VR because the classical method that's been used for the last 40 years DOESN'T WORK for such a significant majority of people that no early game dev has even attempted to create a game where you move using a controller or a keyboard or whatever.
So what will we call actual VR when it eventually comes out?
>>338587298
>Your assumption that video game players would somehow be less susceptible to sim sickness must come from either a complete misunderstanding of statistics, or the mistaken believe that hand-eye coordination has anything to do with nausea.
Neither, it has to do with the fact that some people can't handle LOCOMOTION in VR very well.
That's the only thing I haven't tried with my mother, because even my first uses of VR with a motion were janky. I think VR works well in roomscale, but trying to use a thumbstick to move around everywhere might prove to be sickening to a lot of people.
Blink-teleporting seems to be the answer to this "problem". And you might say that I'm still not grasping the issue at hand, but when I tell you I know what he's talking about because I've experienced the bad things he's mentioned, I can also say that a lot of games have found ways to fix this.
>>338587554
>no early game dev has even attempted to create a game where you move using a controller or a keyboard or whatever.
You mean like Lucky's Tale a launch title you get with the Rift? Keep posting. It just keeps getting funnier how clueless VR haters are. You guys are a desperate bunch.
>>338582609
I heard boats cause nausea. I mean there is literally proof out there. I swear, the boat technology will never catch on because of that. Its going to only stay a novelty item.
This guy is literally retarded.
>>338587583
>"problem"
You think something as basic as fucking movement in a video game is so minor that you can air-quote it?
No wonder you're so into VR, you don't even fucking like video games.
Enjoy your SO REAL FMV interactive experiences, they were a real hit in the 90s and I'm sure they're due a comeback.
i've been using my vive for a few weeks now, and have never experienced any nausea at all. What I have had are a handful of momentarily-terrifying but retrospectively-AWESOME moments where I truly felt like the world/room was moving under my feet and that I was about to fall.
This guy sounds like a moron.
>Sadly, the $80,000 googles we made for the US military had less latency, higher resolution displays, and more accurate head tracking than any of the current round of civilian VR goggles…and they definitely made people sick - so this seems unlikely.
>the goggles we made had less latency, higher resolution, and more accurate tracking
latency yes, resolution and tracking no. flight HMDs have either had laughably tiny resolutions (like under 200x200), or have used some kind of vector display (which could be argued to be 'higher resolution', but certainly not fidelity).
this is all based on us military research. the purpose of such research, more often than not, is to rationalize stasis. it's as worthless as everything else associated with the us military.
>>338587476
Experienced users: Hey, the Morons are morons, but they can still be right. The Experts don't seem to be right about this one aspect, and hey, the Developers seemed to think it was ok to proceed with all of this, so I'm pretty sure the Experts aren't accounting for something important in this discussion.
I'm fine. So are thousands of others. Time will tell who knew best.
>>338587659
Pirates are doomed
>>338587689
>I'm fine. So are thousands of others
So long as the game doesn't let you move around, lol
>>338587684
oh, and fuck, i just actually opened the PDF he's sourcing - guess the decade!almost THIRTY YEARS OLD
>>338587689
>Experts aren't accounting for something important in this discussion.
Yeah, like the idea of how these companies LOVE to make money in the short term shitting on everything and everyone.
>>338587715
I dunno, a life of booze rape and stealing seems pretty appealing. The small price of a boat and a bit of nausea seems pretty appealing.
>>338587658
Sorry I wasn't pedantic enough for you, I figured it'd be obvious that I meant first person games with responsive player acceleration.
Honestly, you could have at least picked that shitty game where you ride around in a car shooting people riding around in other cars for your argument. Oh, wait, you move around in that by moving your arm around.
>>338587659
Yeah, and people spend literal months on those things, that can't be healthy!
>>338587750
It's not even bad. I've now gotten my "VR" legs and can glide across rooms with little to no effect of feeling off-balance.
I dunno, I think I trust John "Down to Chinatown" Carmack more than this guy.
>>338587773
Fucking tip toppety kekety. 30 years old research quoted on a rapidly developing field?
Yea, no way all his info is going to be hillariously outdated.
>>338587490
Yeah, but I doubt it will be used for anything other than porn.
Not that it's a bad thing.
>>338587926
Could have said the same thing about VHS.
>>338587874
>It's not even bad. I've now gotten my "VR" legs and can glide across rooms with little to no effect of feeling off-balance.
Yeah the trouble with these accounts is that you guys have dropped like $600 and are desperate to justify your investment
I'll take the word of researchers over people desperately trying to justify their purchase.
>>338587847
Oh but I thought you said we had to invent entirely new methods and all traditional games couldn't be played by any means. My bad.
Oh and I guess I should mention I played through half of Alien Isolation just fine on the Rift with no issues.
>>338587971
>I'll take the word of researchers over people desperately trying to justify their purchase.
The word of researchers from 30 years ago?
>>338587905
>Fucking tip toppety kekety. 30 years old research quoted on a rapidly developing field?
>Yea, no way all his info is going to be hillariously outdated.
Do you dorks know the history of VR?
There's no way you're old enough to have seen VR in the 90's.
>>338587874
>I've now gotten my "VR" legs and can glide across rooms
Actually, this is all you need to do to lessen nausea. Give players an explanation in how you move without walking. Be it gliding on something, or having powered skates. Something that makes the brain acknowledge that you do not need to physically walk, but move with a push of a button or in a similar way these "hoverboards" move you.
>>338588015
Yes, I would - little has changed on the nausea front. The research is still valid.
Hey VR buyers, if you're trying to convince people to buy a VR set you should do it with reason and arguments instead of "VR IS ABSOLUTELY PERFECT EVERYONE WHO DOESN'T HAS AN OCULUS IS A FUCKING POORFAG SUCK DICK YOU FAGGOTS"
You people are really turning me off from buying a VR, and it's all your fault
>>338587960
What?
VR isn't some kind of new media format, dipshit.
Sure, VHS probably won over Betamax because of porn support but that was a format battle, not some new tech
Here's one of these $80,000 HMDs this guy is probably talking about. Yeah the res is high but it has no low persistence, which means headaches. It tracks like shit. And the ergonomics are terrible. It's no wonder people felt sick.
The stuff we get provides a better experience in every way.
>>338587689
Even Occulus say that less than half of the games are uncomfortable and it's everything that isn't from a static perspective.
>>338582609
are people buying VR for anything other than watching movies and porn?
I thought it was just a /v/ meme that anyone would actually game with it.
>>338582609
its heavily marketed trash, what did you expect lmao
>>338588118
>The stuff we get provides a better experience in every way.
Yeah and he said those still have the same problems.
>>338587971
>$600 and are desperate to justify your investment
as would anyone
$600+ is a lot of money to justify, and this technology isn't going to take off if people are afraid of one scientist's claim over 60,000+ users who aren't experiencing unmanageable symptoms.
I'm telling you as a consumer, not a shill or scientists or moron or faggot, but as someone who has used a product for several hours and wants to see the product succeed and grow, that VR sickness is akin to boat-sickness when it comes to fighting against locomotion instead of working with it.
>>338588267
With the "workarounds" there's no problem but you just like ignoring the facts. I've let people that get sea sick and car sick try my Vive with no issues.
>>338588296
>that VR sickness is akin to boat-sickness when it comes to fighting against locomotion instead of working with it.
That isn't exactly a great endorsement, you know?
>>338588021
I'm old enough trust me on that one. And the tech back then compared to today is lightyears apart. I mean just the raw processing power we have now compared to then is different.
Different frame speeds affect nausea, same with tracking/fidelity of screens.
Also you could probably get different results in how nausea inducing it is if you ran different media/games on it.
>>338588083
The fuck you on about? Literally anyone tech related i have checked out warns users that they should not buy it because of hype, and that they should wait for a better newer consumer version, and that at this moment it is more of an early adopter item, for people with too much money.
>>338588118
>4200x2400
4K VR IS HERE BOYS
>>338588146
VR porn is the meme, my friend. Porn directors are shit to begin with. This new tech will take decades to work properly without feeling like you're just a camera jammed into somebody else's skull.
>>338588234
Nothing was ever any good when it was first introduced. Remember the horseless cartridge? It was a fucking marketing feature that a later model could ascend any sort of incline at all.
Personally, consoles have given me more motion sickness than my ghetto as fuck Samsung Galaxy S3 jammed into a google cardboard with hacked drivers to make it work with the Oculus shit and Vive's nonsense.
>>338588267
And he doesn't know jack shit. I've never once gotten sick in my Vive and I've played for 8 hours straight.
>>338588349
It is when you realize people can get over it if they do it long enough.
I won't push any harder. You're trying to protect yourself from long-term damage, and I respect that. I just don't think that's going to happen to me any more than it happens to a sailor.
>>338582609
This guy is so full of shit it's embarassing. You can tell it's someone that's only ever either worked with low quality HMDs or has never actually understood how the fuck they work.
Convergence is an easy issue to relieve with proper optic design, and we're not too far away from proper eye tracking to further reduce issues. The focusing issues up close rarely become a problem.
And he's so fucking stupid as to miss the easy way to solve acceleration / deceleration issues: Adding a constant frame of reference (ie a cockpit) solves the problem. Cockpits will be common, but it completely removes the nausea.
>>338588357
>The fuck you on about
In every VR thread, there's always people calling people who haven't bought a VR set a bunch of faggots, rather than trying to convince why it's a good product
Like this one
>>338588083
I've literally seen no one try to advertise it that way.
>>338588015
>>338582609
the fuckin studies he quoted were 30 years old, they were literally using VR with CRT monitors
>>338588417
I fucking get nauseous whenever I play for more than 10 minutes, fuck your anecdotal bullshit.
The vive is really cool when it works, but the second something goes wrong or there's a framerate dip it's goddamn nausea central.
>>338588496
>not too far away from proper eye tracking to further reduce issues.
Its called foviated rendering, if I remember correctly.
http://www.getfove.com/
>>338588505
Fanboys aren't just restricted to consoles senpai, and they will fight tirelessly to make sure their investment is the best one and that everyone else is wrong.
>>338588296
Let's pretend you did a great job and all the fucking losers on 4chan went and spent their neetbux on something that has no games and no potential.
That doesn't change the minds of the important crowd, which is normies. And normies are never going to fucking buy something that may cause motion sickness willingly.
If VR took off (which it didn't), within 2 weeks this guy, and men like him would have been on a morning news show completely destroying VR in front of the world.
You could act like this is the most revolutionary thing ever, but it's a gimmick with no purchase in the market. Google cardboard completely destroyed and chance the OR had of succeeding, because any normie who wants to try VR can try it for 20 bucks. You can act like that experience isn't "legitimate" or whatever, but it is in the minds of the people who have used it.
>>338588083
I think you're focusing on the bad because they're big and loud and not reading the posts that are level-headed
>>338588417
>I've never once gotten sick in my Vive and I've played for 8 hours straight.
You were probably playing Defense Grid 2 or something with a static view.
>>338588349
Not that anon, but why isn't that great endorsement? Did boat sickness ever make a boat market crash, or prevent boats from being a thing? Its just a fair warning that you might want to try it out in a store before purchasing it, if you are a consumer who reads up on things before throwing cash around.
>>338588410
Actually, VR porn is new, and the porn business is already trying to adapt to it. I know i have seen some youtube video about it, how they actually are testing out the VR filming methods, and how different it is making VR porn compared to old school. They already have proper 360 sphere camera setups and even know where they need the chicks to move to cause the least issues or fuckups.
>>338588536
>second something goes wrong or there's a framerate dip it's goddamn nausea central.
Stop playing on a toaster maybe? Of course when something is broken it's going to make you sick dumbshit
Also I have a hard time believing you. I guess my 60 year old mother has a stronger stomach than yo.
>>338588058
30 years ago we simply did not have the technology to make VR passable. Military or not, it literally did not exist.
>>338588658
Did you even read the PDF?
>VR will make women obsolete!
>Not if we kill VR before that!
Those SJWs got you guys really good this time.
>>338588647
>Stop playing on a toaster maybe?
Sorry, is a fucking 4 gig card not enough?
>Also I have a hard time believing you.
DOESN'T CHANGE THE FACTS FAGGOT.
>>338588267
Yeah, this one guy is claiming that people are completely unable to use these devices for more than 30 seconds at a time when tons of game developers, journalists, random people at conventions, and now consumers have used it all for varying lengths of time and were fine. The guys at Giant Bomb who intentionally go out of their way to find shitty VR games have been fine. There was even a video of some normalfag guy who spent 25 hours in that fucking paint game, essentially in a black void, unable to take his hands off the controllers or take the headset off or even switch the game, eating pizza fed to him and pissing into a bucket, in order to set a world record, and yeah, he threw up. After 17 hours. In one of the most intentionally extreme case scenarios of VR ever. And I'm pretty sure he didn't fucking crash his car afterwards! But whatever, I guess all these people are just shill cucks paid off by Facejew and Valve, and this one guy working for the US military who's having his livelihood threatened by the onset of consumer-grade HMDs is completely trustworthy!
>>338588634
>Defense Grid 2
Isn't that Oculus only? And no, I've mostly been playing Space Pirate Trainer running around my room like a mad man.
>>338588641
>Did boat sickness ever make a boat market crash, or prevent boats from being a thing?
Because Boats actually have utility. saying you only get kinda sick from playing VR kind of shows how it's inferior to standard gameplay on a screen.
>No really fun, immersive, games can keep you more than 3 meters from every objects
bull-fucking-shit
ace combat is going to be GOAT
>>338588647
>3DPD VR porn
There's your problem
>>338588505
>there's always people calling people who haven't bought a VR set a bunch of faggots
So? There will always be faggots drinking bleach as well. Does not mean that its descriptive of the general population.
VR at this point is an ok product, not something everyone should have and with a lot of flaws, but on the other hand, everyone can at least get a taste of it with shit like google cardboard. I mean that shit costs 2 dollars, and i bet a majority of people have smartphones.
>>338588724
VRAM has little to do with it.
The fact that something not performing as it should can give you a headache? Yeah ok.
>>338588698
of course he didn't, time is money, and he's $800 bucks in the hole.
>>338588619
Yeah, because graphics cards totally don't sell because normies don't buy them.
Or 4k monitors, or projectors, or memory-foam mattresses.
Because they're just so fucking expensive that no one buys them.
Stop.
>>338588536
why didn't he just take off his helmet???
>>338588536
Have you tried not having a terrible computer, or playing a actually optimized experience? I'm making one of those new fangled vidjeo games myself, and there's a lot of pitfalls for FPS that most new devs seem to ignore.
A lot of them don't seem to understand you can lock the mouse to the screen with ONE FUCKING LINE OF CODE IN THE CHARACTER CONTROLLER JESUS FUCK.
Its not out of the question to assume that the games you've played are garbage.
>>338588641
>even know where they need the chicks to move
I just realized that this would be a fantastic way to serve the voyeur kink, by just placing one of those 360 cams in the middle of the room and making no attempt to make it seem like you're participating.
>>338588658
We did, it was shit. We had the capability to make video games 40 years ago. They too, were shit.
>>338588724
Nope. 8 ish gig minimum. The new 1080 or 1070 is perfect, since it costs exactly the same as the old cards.
>>338588698
No. But it's easy to infer.
Because a modern-day Helicopter simulator will make few people sick because it has a constant frame of reference, no acceleration/deceleration of the player character plus no focal issues. The technology they used at the time in order to simulate helicopter piloting was shit. Military super computers could not properly render scenes at the correct refresh rate and I can guaran-fucking-tee that these systems were not designed with what we now know causes simulation sickness.
>>338588831
Oh great, I already spent 800 fucking dollars, let's just spend another 600!
Christ, I can't believe I moved my couch out of my living room for this. Maybe I can sell it.
>>338588732
better have a source fampai
>>338588923
I'll buy it for the price you bought it, provided its a vive. The only thing that genuinely makes me angry about the VR meme is the nintendo-like inability to fucking make enough product.
I'm getting my Rift that I preordered within the first hour tomorrow.
How easy it to sell over Craigslist?
>>338588985
Right here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mZau6PiLoJc
>>338588914
Headaches from poor refresh rate, etc I could believe of such old hardware
But there's no getting around the fact that simulating movement in these headsets while you're stationary, makes people feel sick.
No upgrade in hardware, lenses, algorithms, etc can get around that fact.
>>338588793
PROMOTIONS
>>338585563
I still use a DK2, and depends of the engine in question, some let me do a complete 2 hour race with no issues, but some wont let me keep playing even for seconds, did alot of shit about the framerate, and its not that, its how the camera of the game presents you the scene as you move.
>>338588810
All three of those things are cheaper than VR...
>>338589050
It makes a small subset of people sick, yes. But it does go away.
>>338588998
pretty easy on ebay, you can sell it at a profit even after opening/using it.
Be quick though, people are realizing that the Vive is ultimately the better experience, and I'm sure Rift owners will find fewer and fewer opportunities to sell.
>>338588998
I'll buy it for 20.
>>338588805
No anon, you don't understand, VR is like, the FUTURE! you don't even BEGIN to comprehend how REVOLUTIONARY and GAME CHANGING this technology is!
It's nothing like the Wii or 3D before it! This is BRAND NEW!! If you have doubts, just know you can't even BEGIN to experience it unless you get to TRY it. If you don't have one, YOU DON'T KNOW.
This is every fucking thread.
>>338588998
Pretty easy. Too bad prices tanked like $300 in less than a week.
>>338589129
they all have a starting cost around $400 for entry-level shit, what are you talking about?
they can cost upwards of $2000
![2350909-novint_falcon_limited_edition[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/FIZrbIk.jpg "2350909-novint_falcon_limited_edition[1].jpg")
>>338588742
You only get sick when what you see does not conform to what your brain/inner ear compute. So you get nauseous. And as people just now started developing things for now, at least on a broader, consumer scale. It will take a bit of time to get the hang of DOs and DON'Ts.
I mean fuck, right now people still don't know what to do with fonts in VR. Then you have people who don't know how important it is to set the proper FOV in such things, as already on computer screens wrong FOV settings can make people nauseous.
There is a huge lack of knowledge on both the consumer side and the side producing content. So yea, the nausea thing is likely going to be less of a problem in the future than now, but most likely it will always be a problem to a certain degree.
>>338589129
Where the fuck do you live? In Canadia land, it cost about 1200 monopoly rupees.
>>338589162
No anon, you don't understand, Islam is like, the FUTURE! you don't even BEGIN to comprehend how REVOLUTIONARY and GAME CHANGING this religion is!
An interesting read.
>>338589226
4k is also not worth it, just like VR.
Just wait for tech to improve and get cheaper.
>>338589320
>busted open the battery
holy shit, is this guy retarded?
>ITT: people with no experience and shit genes have motion sickness
We have been through this so many times.
>>338589359
Have you tried it? Its kind of amazing, but I agree that its not worth 2000 of your human dollars.
>>338589372
Funny thing is, I think thats the Samsung Galaxy S2, and it was posted when it was brand new.
>>338582609
>These aren't as good as military ones
>THEY SHOULD BE BANNED
What a nice kneejerk reaction.
Surprised to read all that from someone who was working with pilots - they have almost no frame of visual reference in the sky and are therefore subject to heavy cases of motion sickness, loss of orientation and related detrimental neurological effects after exposure to flights with high speed turns. They get used to it after a while and it stops.
People also get motion sick from video games until they get accustomed and then accept them as normal. It's particularly bad for fast paced games without FoV adjustment, regardless of platform. I haven't seen "a large amount of the population" reject 3D games for that either.
Regardless of all that there's still the fact that the industry can try what it wants - if it works for enough people to sustain a business on it'll be a thing but if it's shit it will die. It's not like anyone needs to talk someone out of using a VR headset - try it out and then hate or love it, voting with your wallet.
>3D cinemas give a significant portion of the population headaches
>Motion sickness is a common problem even in real life
Why do VR shills just ignore human physiology?Is it because they are actually Facebook AI bots?
>>338589359
Just because something is expensive, doesn't mean that it isn't worth the price.
Buying a VR headset right now isn't worth it. It's an early-bird special for people who have been waiting since 2012. If you can't afford it, don't buy it of-fucking-course. But don't tell people it's shit and doesn't work.
It works. And it's great. But the problem isn't VR itself. The problem is lack of content.
This article is balls.
>>338589462
>video games are violent, interactive mediums
>video games need to be BANNED
>think of muh childrens ))))
>>338584617
>That is a pretty good read
Considering his section about depth perception is filled with false information regarding the function of eye muscles that even passively interested layman who like to read about medicine can point out, I would call into doubt this person is who he says he is, or really call into doubt the judgment of his employers who hired him.
>>338589567
>ban non-content
>consoles get banned
>kotaku, games journalism in general gets banned
>4chan gets banned
weew
>>338589462
The guy who made the article probably sells $80,000 headsets and thinks that his business is now doomed.
>>338589671
The guy is a political tool to put this in the scope of everyone, so they dont jump into it, because its not for everyone yet.
>>338589226
VR requires the peripheral plus a VR ready rig. Normies might blow money on $350+ beer coolers but that's a far cry from something like the OR.
>>338582609
>IMHO - these devices should be banned
>Goes on to list things that are only pretty much inconveniences that only affect some people and the fact that $50,000 pilot headsets are obviously better
Wow yeah what a good reason, ban away Stalin, for the public good.
>>338584243
>>thousands of Rift and Vive owners never had any problems despite using it for hours at a time everyday
Sorry to break your bubble but I won't speak about my nausea if I'd paid hundreds of dollars for it.
I may have fallen for the VR meme, but I'm not an idiot to admit I couldn't play it. It is fun for the first few minutes.
>>338588536
>counters anecdotal evidence with anecdotal evidence
Think before you fucking speak.
Ok, memes and gags aside, VR is pretty fucking cool. That said, I think its applications in gaming is not great so far. Like Giant Bomb's VR roundup showed, you need a lot of money and space to properly do it. Cool, whatever, but at this point we can't consider it an "evolution" or whatever since just defined by cost, it's a niche thing.
For example, I heard somewhere that around 100k Rifts have been shipped. Neat. Compare this to the Wii, which is largely considered a massive success. Let's assume out of the 105 million consoles, 60 million were sold in the states. Since the US has a population of 300 million, that's about 1 in every 5 people owning a Wii, or 20%. That's crazy.
Conversely, let's assume 250k PC VR headsets have been sold. That means 1 in every 240,000 people have a VR headset or 0.08%. That's not exactly mainstream.
>>338587554
You realize the Vive's main gimmick is the room scale VR, right?
I get that most of /v/ can't walk without getting winded but c'mon man.
>>338589760
even if normies don't buy vr, if his business is selling overpriced headsets, then his business is over if a $1000 product can do the same thing at a lower resolution for cheaper.
I mean jesus fuck, the displays are higher than standardized 4K. Current consumer HMDs are barely over 1080p
>>338589137
How easy is it to get scammed over Ebay? I don't know how that system works, and I don't want to send someone my Rift only for them to claim I never sent it and get their money back.
>>338589567
>Just because something is expensive, doesn't mean that it isn't worth the price.
In this case, it most definitely does. Most PC's aren't ready for VR at the recommended specs, and just a graphics card update costs MINIMUM, 340 bucks. So going with the cheaper of the VR headsets, that's almost $1000 untaxed. Throwing around 1000 is not at all a small purchase for a huge percentage of gamers.
>>338589671
>Steve Baker, Worked for Rediffusion Simulation, Hughes Aircraft, L3 Simulation over 25 years.
>Thales Training & Simulation Ltd. (Formerly Rediffusion Simulation) is a multinational company which manufactures simulators, including full flight simulators and military simulators, and provides related training and support services.
>Link Simulation & Training is a systems integrator that provides military aircrew training systems, flight simulators, simulator modifications, maintenance trainers, part task trainers, tactical operational flight trainers, deployable readiness trainers, ...
And look at pic related. All these companies he listed, including Hughes, are directly connected to each other. This guy is a Shill with a capital fucking S.
>>338589816
stop using math to prove points, you'll scare shitposters.
>>338589802
It's almost like anecdotal experience doesn't account for shit!
>Skyward Sword isn't bad, you just can't handle the controls!
>>338589913
>send money to guy, receive damaged or improper product
>write a negative critique on his profile
Like Kickstarter but with slightly more shit talking.
>>338584617
They might crash into innocent civilians senpai. They didn't use the VR and don't deserve that.
>>338586919
>>338589948
>don't buy consumer VR so maybe people will...join the army and attend flight school to use a cockpit sized simulator?
were you kicked in the head as a child?
>>338582609
From what I've heard, the nasuia goes away the more you use it.
Not that it wont flop for other reasons.
>>338589948
>I have no idea about the difference between military and commercial grade flight sims and consumer grade VR.
I haven't bought a headset yet and i'm holding off as there's nothing I want to experience with it yet
That's pretty much all it is, lack of content
What i'm really excited about is the commercial applications, like laser tag with your friends in a big warehouse, rented out to you
But the biggest hurdle that VR has at the moment is the DRM
I'm sure you've all heard about Facebook trying to restrict their software to their platform only, and if other companies also pick up on this approach it's going to stunt the growth of VR in a huge way
We can only sit back and hope this doesn't happen
>Aren't you just mad some fat amateur kid became a billionnaire by trying to design a "shitty consumer VR headset" while you worked your ass off for 25 years and have nothing but bitter tears of jealousy to show for it?
>>338589971
It's just weird how fucking defensive VR users are. Like this is consolefag levels of delusion and defensiveness.
>>338590061
more like why should NASA or the military spend thousands on a HMD when consumer VR does it better?
>>338590106
the article specifically mentions headsets, not cockpit sims
>Steve Baker, Worked for Rediffusion Simulation, Hughes Aircraft, L3 Simulation over 25 years.
>IMHO - these devices should be banned
Hmmmm
>Man who spent $25 years working in an industry that relies on jewing the government and military with $80,000 headsets claims that commercial VR, something that would drastically increase competition and reduce costs/pricing are bad and should be straight up BANNED FROM PUBLIC USE
Wow I am so fucking shocked, what a level headed, unbiased claim.
>>338590061
He works in an industry that has its existence directly threatened by comparably cheap HMDs like the Vive or the Oculus. Notice his wording in the original post.
>Everyone thinks these things are new and revolutionary...but they really aren't. All that's happened is that they dropped in price from $80,000 to $500...and many corners have been cut along the way.
>Sadly, the $80,000 googles we made for the US military had less latency, higher resolution displays, and more accurate head tracking than any of the current round of civilian VR goggles…
>IMHO - these devices should be banned
He's scared. He knows VR is gonna put him out of a job.
>>338590084
Reddit cant get gud, or cant reach solid 90fps thats all.
>>338582609
I used to get motion sickness until the cause of it was explained to me, then even my subconcious knew the cause and could tell itself I hadnt eaten poison mushrooms.
Id take the article with a pinch of salt, just one mans opinion, no matter how much of an expert he is.
And i played skyrim for hours running at sub 30fps with cardboard and my htc m8 and at no point did i feell nausious, nor did i notice any side effects.
>>338590084
Just depends on the game. Generally games where your character moves give you headaches. Games where you are in a vehicle are a bit better, but will still make you sick after a while.
The only games that currently work in VR are games where your character remains stationary.
>>338590120
>But the biggest hurdle that VR has at the moment is the DRM
Actually the biggest hurdle is that giant fucking cord. That seriously limits potential of themeparks and stuff.
>>338584938
>>338586523
Science has proved time and time again,
The human eye can not see more than 8 fps.
>>338590120
someone's already hax'd the vive to play a couple of oculus exclusive games, and I know a guy who, if he gets a headset, is going to devote himself to doing that same kind of thing because fuck proprietary hardware
>>338589913
Its relatively hard to get scammed if you watch out for reputation of sellers and comments. I bought a few things over ebay, and so far no problems. But you do need to watch out if there are negative comments.
I did not ever buy from new accounts tough. Or accounts with little to no sales. I always managed to find a proper account with what i needed.
>>338590202
>yes goy, just spend more shekels. You want your waifu, don't you?
>>338590161
What he said isn't wrong so there's nothing to really defend there. VR is niche atm but it probably won't be in 5 or 10 years.
What gets me is when people post the usual bullshit memes when they haven't even tried it. /v/ is a terrible place to talk about VR because of it and that sucks. I hate having to resort to leddit.
>>338590106
>they are going to make supercheap HMD and break my business
>if i tell arab kids could master fighter jets in the middle of nowere to kill americans... YES.
THIS IS DANGEROUS, IT SHOULD BE BANNED
Its a fucking shill.
>>338590218
nor any resolution higher than 640X480
>>338590267
I already ride my carfus on the weekends, so i dont need to worry.
>>338590268psst, check /vg/, I'm trying out a vr general
>>338590268
I'm gonna try a rift this week, but even if I love it I'm not fucking shelling out cash for one. I've got more things to worry about.
When I have the time and extra cash to shell out $1200 for graphics upgrades and a VR headset and not worry about rent or school payments, I'll gladly fucking get one.
>>338590386
>to play other games outside the library you need paid 3rd party drivers
>library games are facebook tier shit
Try this in like 6 months.
>>338590213
I'll have to disagree with you because of the ways that people who have purpose built their rooms for VR can deal with them
Think about how bumper cars work, or the old radio telephones
It's not viable for consumers to do this to their bedroom or office, but if you're making a business out of selling VR experiences it's going to likely be a smaller obstacle than programming and advertising your experiences
Maybe i'm just hopelessly optimistic but I already can't wait to see what the future holds
A new age of arcade gaming perhaps? I can only hope
>>338589913
It's actually hard to be scammed out of your money entirely. eBay is a pretty much 0 questions asked buyer is always right system. You tell eBay you were scammed, you're getting your money back 100%
People actually exploit this, they get their product then lie that it wasn't received because eBay constantly sides with the buyer.
>>338590459
I really hope VR brings a resurgence in arcades like The Void. It's kinda pricey but I don't want them to hold back the tech to lower the price either. With arcades you could satisfy a lot of people that don't want to pay the full price or don't have the space for the best experiences.
>>338590546
Virieo Perception is the free alternative.
Since it's free, progress is slow. Supposedly, vive support is being worked on next.
>>338590562
It sounds real great, but as of right now it's just too problematic to realistically invest in.
First thing they need to do is get that goddamn streaming tech the Wii U has, because that shit is basically lagless. I don't know what kind of battery a VR headset would take, but surely it's better than a giant cord.
>>338590285
>>338590168
So how does he become a shill, if it's not threatening his market - and talks bad about his own 80k products - ?
"Sadly, the $80,000 googles we made for the US military had less latency, higher resolution displays, and more accurate head tracking than any of the current round of civilian VR goggles…and they definitely made people sick"
He goes on :
The problem is that the people who make those claims are either ignorant (or are deliberately ignoring) the evidence collected over 20 years of flight simulation experience with VR goggles (only we called them “Helmet Mounted Displays” - HMD’s - and what we did was called “simulation” and not “virtual reality”).
Yeah, burn my bread maker, I want those consumer grade VR's to burn, or US Airforce may just opt to but them!
Idiots.
>>338590631
It works only with a few games even on the rift, very slow i say.
>>338590679
But anon, obviously we know more. We go to a nip cartoon forum about video games. I think we know what we're talking about.
>>338590679
>if it's not threatening his market
It is. He's selling incredibly expensive VR displays, and he needs to make the new ones look bad and get banned so he can keep jewing the people he sells them to.
>>338590679
The HMD's he's referring to didn't have less latency, higher resolution, or more accurate head tracking though.
He is LYING, to try to make a point.
>>338582609
Nothing he said was based in much of anything. Notice he hung it all on "caveman brain think hallucinate, sense not agree! Vomit!" Do you truly agree with that hypothesis?
Nah, that's nonsense. As someone with visual snow and periods of Alice in Wonderland syndrome, I can say quite bluntly false sensations of motion, scale change, distance, etc don't produce nausea. Nausea and vertigo are multifaceted and have many causes.
The brain is a machine. Although I don't care much about VR, I highly doubt he could produce any solid research substantiating the overall pathways he's claiming so inherently exist. People say the same shit every single time something new starts to come along. With his attitude we would have abandoned nuclear reactors after the xenon problem and all the active failsafes for dealing with high pressures became apparent.
>>338590679
because he doesn't have to worry if he says his product is shit.
If consumer VR fails, then he still has his market.
If it succeeds, then he loses bank hardcore.
>>338589816
>That said, I think its applications in gaming is not great so far.
I do 3D modelling work as a hobby. I got to borrow a Vive for a week to try out, I was alright with the games, but my first discovery I loved was the Virtual Desktop. Making monitors and resizing however I wanted for my individual programs, the immersion with watching videos, it was amazing.
But then, I experienced my favourite thing so far. I found that UE4 has a VR template, so I loaded it up and imported one of my work in progress 3D models and just scaled it up in the world and then I got to actually go walk around it and inspect it and it is just indescribable how incredible it was, it was like my work was tangible and real.
This is where I think the hololens (if it gets way better than its current situation, with low FOV) will be my love. I don't understand how people would use that thing for any serious gaming, it just doesn't work in the way games play. But for that situation with my 3D model? Just being able to drop it on my desk as I work and get a new perspective on it and see it differently than just in my Max viewport? Sign me the fuck up.
So year, AR/VR I just see as being best as tools for many things that aren't games.
>>338590679
>that fucking cesna dosent have jet engines and canrad computer controlled surfaces
>IT SHOULD BE BANNED
>that fucking roadcar dosent have a rolling cage in case of an accident and also it wont turn as a racecar
>IT SHOULD BE BANNED
That retard is on that train.
But his business or his "expertise" is on it.
If this cheap HMD take off, it will push the development for cheaper solutions to make it better, and with less latency, in the long shot, they are DED, and he knows it.
Simple...
The product, its not perfect, its on the early stages of this "new era" of VR (new because we are using phone screens now), so it will have flaws, some worse than the others, but how do you think this shit is solved, by selling it anyways and upgrading the next one, not just banning it for ever and ever because my business is in danger, no one goes that far into an opinion, they little cuck should said, its not as good, i dont recomend it to anyone.
>>338582609
I don't understand this. I admittedly don't have an HMD but I do have TrackIR. The first few hours of using it invoked a feeling of vertigo but now it is non existent. I would imagine that with HMDs it is similar, you just need to get used to it.
>>338590918
"..people’s brains say “This is an impossibility - we must be hallucinating”…and if you’re hallucinating, and you’re a caveman, then you’ve probably eaten something poisonous - a “magic mushroom” maybe? And when that happens, your brain goes into panic mode and tries to empty this substance from your stomach…and you feel very, very nauseous.
And THAT problem can’t be fixed by any known technological means….we need entirely new research into optical systems that can dynamically refocus light on a pixel-by-pixel basis and which costs about $20 per eye."
What does he mean by this?
if it can't be fixed by current technological means, and needs new research in order to fix, why would it only cost $40 to fix? and it is only $40 to fix, why hasn't the issue been fixed yet?
I'm pretty sure he has no idea what he's talking about.
>>338590852
>As someone with visual snow and periods of Alice in Wonderland syndrome
I know these feels.
>getting nausea from VR
Let me guess you get motion sickness when you are sitting back in a car? Fucking weaklings, I bet you faggots got concived with a defective sperm.
>>338591140
He's saying the fix needs to be less than 20 bucks an eye to be realistically implementable.
>>338591140
>What does he mean by this?
Ban consumer VR and keep his employers contract with the air force for $80,000 headsets active.
>>338582609
Could be, but I haven't used vr goggles yet so can't tell.
I got to fuck around with PSVR at PSX last year and while it wasn't the best thing ever, it didn't cause any sort of nausea. Any time I see someone complain about nausea in games, it makes me think they're the same people who get seasick. That is to say, they're pansies.
RIGS was much less comfortable than the tightrope building to building walk though. It wasn't even fast paced, there was just lots of shit going on and you were still slow. Headtracking needed some work, is what i'm saying.
Don't know about vive or OR but i'd reckon they're probably in similar predicaments. The tech just isn't there yet. Maybe in 5 years, if it lasts.
>>338590194
Probably he is scared what will happen if the next gen is actually as good as the military grade things. Then people will start prying into why the military grade actually costs so much and will find out that they are being scammed.
Trust me when i say that. There is so much fucking artificial price inflation going on in the tech buisness. I had several occasions where a custom machined part of better quality was leagues cheaper than the official part. Same goes on in the military tech.
Oh yea, these fucking screws cost 900$ each! Totally not possible to have them machined by hand for 100$ a piece.
Same thing will start going on with the VR tech, and a few people are scared. Because if it really catches on, in some cases companies will switch over to the way cheaper versions.
>>338591062
This, kind of. It's a little more intense with VR since you feel the motion more, but it's basically the same thing. It's like when TVs first started becoming mainstream and a lot of people go motion sick from it at first, but it's fucking nothing now because we've gotten used to it. The same will happen here. Way overblown issue. I don't see how this thread is even being kept alive, having just come into the thread. I'm just going to blame it on the newfags.
>>338591062
What he's saying can basically be reduced to two points, artificial locomotion and vergence/accomodation conflict.
Artificial locomotion is clearly the main cause of people experiencing sim sickness in mainstream VR headsets. It apparently varies from person to person, and it seems to be possible to get used to it to some degree or mitigate it with cockpits or peripheral stuff, but the most effective way of getting rid of it is simply not to use any artificial locomotion. Which is exactly what Valve did.
Vergence/accomodation conflict is exactly as unsolvable as he says, the question is whether it's anything near as big a deal as he claims.
And I'd say the reports from pretty much every Vive user, ever, are a strong indicator that it's not. My guess is that all the simulators he ever worked with used artificial locomotion, because what would be the point if they didn't, and he attributed the effects of that to VAC instead,
>>338586740
He did mention "on a 60hz monitor" so he was talking about the difference on the monitor.
>>338591208
$20 per eye to fix (in his opinion) the ONLY issue with VR sounds worth it to me, and it doesn't need new tech. to make it cheaper.
he's saying it isn't possible, yet it only cost $20 per eye.
>>338591140
>"..people’s brains say “This is an impossibility - we must be hallucinating”…and if you’re hallucinating, and you’re a caveman, then you’ve probably eaten something poisonous - a “magic mushroom” maybe? And when that happens, your brain goes into panic mode and tries to empty this substance from your stomach…and you feel very, very nauseous.
So am I so caveman that even my caveman instincts are failing, or am I some ascneded uber being that has shed all "caveman insticts" because this supposed human response to motion doesn't happen to me. I can play with a Vive for 8 fucking hours straight no problem (other than heat, my face gets warm very quickly)
>>338588083
Not one of the people who posted in this thread before, but I actively enjoy making people who make decisions using such shitty rubrics make bad choices in life.
If you don't buy VR you're a poor faggot with shit taste, and that's literally the only reason.
>>338591409
you are no longer a caveman.
I don't think there are many left,
I guess some terrorists might live in caves?
other than that though, these issues shouldn't effect most people.
>>338591409
>not using a cheap chink fan to blow your face
>>338591140
Your eyes do two things when you look at an object. They swivel to both point at it, and the lenses inside them deform to focus on it. The swiveling is called vergence, the focusing is called accomodation.
In VR, the screen is always at the same (optical) distance, because the lenses of the VR headset don't change. This means that if you look at an object in VR, your eyes do the swiveling but not the focusing. That's not natural behavior.
The question, though, is how sensitive people are to that. I think he's overestimating that sensitivity, a lot.
>nausea
lol
me and a friend were playing Windlands, where you fling around everywhere with bungee cord grappling hooks and neither of us had any issues with nausea or disorientation
for him it was also his first vr experience
you must have a very weak stomach to get nausea from vr, but even if you do I can't imagine it not subsiding over time
>>338590679
HMDs are not what VR is now. HMDs are more like google glass stuff. Which is most likely already blowing that guys shit out of the water, or at least on the way of doing so.
All this new VR tech is literally shitting on his market of super expensive "simulation" tech. Its what happens when you throw tech out to the masses. Way more competent people get their hands on it and start polishing things that were usually hard to get their hands on.
>>338591573
HMD just means head-mounted display. Current consumer VR is all displays mounted on your head. Rift, Vive, PSVR, GearVR and what have you are all HMDs.
Not that something like a CAVE solves the thing he's talking about, mind.
>>338591563
I'm on this boat
and speaking of boats, most people's first experiences on the sea involve nausea to some extent, what i'm now wondering is, do people who live their life at sea get used to it, or does the nausea just scare everybody else away?
