So, now it's been about 5 years, can we admit this game was pretty fun?
>excellent motion controls
>great hubworld
>well designed combat
>dialogue options make link more enjoyable of a character
Sure it was a little linear and hand-holdy but the zones were beautiful and fun to explore.
What's the beef with it?
No beef here, I always really liked it. Motion controls worked great, cool bosses and dungeons.
>>337881652
It wasn't bad but it was one of the better Zelda games
I stopped after the first dungeon because it was all so by the numbers
Zelda needs a serious change in direction, on par with Majora's Mask. Hopefully Zelda NX is the change we need
>>337881652
No fuck you. I hate this game.
It was good, just really fucking handhold for more than half the game it drove me nuts
Really liked links design and personality this time though
excellent motion controls?
>>337881652
>excellent motion controls
lost me there
>>337881652
It's my 2nd favourite Zelda behind OoT.
>>337881652
No, SS and Fi are Qt's though.
Glad the groose meme died out.
>>337881652
I would but its like 50$ still and I refuse to spend that much on it, so i havent played it
>>337882030
if you had issues with the controls you were the problem
I was literally stood up getting full larp throwing my nunchuck up to shield and whatnot it was so engaging. Calibrate the wiimote and make room to play
>No overworld
>Empty sky
>Half the items are dungeon only gimmicks worthless outside
>Shitty sidequests
>>337882198
calibrate 30 times in a row?
I couldn't get into it because the damn helper never shuts the fuck up. Dropped Dream team for the same reason. Do I look like I just woke up from a goddamned coma, Nintendo?
>>337881652
The game doesn't tell you the specific triggers for the actions so when people can't figure them out, they say the controls are bad. The controls aren't bad, the explanation of them is. Or you could also say they aren't intuitive.
Take stabbing. It's really easy to do when you know how, and nearly everyone that complains about the controls brings it up. Or when you tell people that the game uses the sensor bar and that's a surprise to them, these same people will also complain about having to recalibrate even though the sensor bar often does it for you. Or people saying they have to recalibrate in the start menu all the time because they didn't listen to the sword tutorial that tells you how to soft-reset the sword swing directions.
If it had better dungeons, I'd rate it higher than TP. Some days I do rate it higher. Today is not one of those days.
TP>SS>WW
The land segments, combat, shield moves/health, item upgrading, sprinting, and items are all great.
Skyloft is just one city, but I prefer it over TP's shitty Kakariko and ironically dead Hyrule Castle Town.
Flying isn't as tedious as sailing.
I almost quit when I saw Wazowski's wife, everything else was from fine to great.
I even enjoyed fighting the imprisoned three times, also, SS Zelda is the best Zelda.
>>337882262
I actually did calibrate very frequently. It's worth it
>>337882298
maybe stop playing games for 10 year olds?
yeah, it felt very fisher price zelda. Moreso than even the kiddy Windwaker because at some point that leaves the whole ocean open for you to explore. SS splits the sky and ground apart and none of them have shit to do or allow you todo or see much.
Hubworld is ultimately just average. All of humanity living above the clous leaves the ground world empty and lifeless as it serves as nothing but an extension of dingeon puzzles.
Then Fi jumps in to fuck your ass on eventhe simplest puzzles.
Timestones were a great mechanic though. Even if they weren't used to full potential
>>337882030
Bet you're a dumbass.
>>337881652
>No mention of high tier waifus SS Zelda and Peatrice.
>No mention of top tier maximum comfy pumpkin and song waifu Kina.
Anyways yeah, it was a good game.
>>337882487
they didn't do this shit in older games
Replaying this right now, incidentally. It's not outright BAD, and there's a lot it does fantastically, but it has way more critical setbacks than the typical Zelda bout.
>stops you every 3 seconds to tell you where to go or repeat information you literally just heard
>the sky is barren as fuck and slow to traverse
>very few memorable bosses and dungeons
>THREE fucking areas on the surface, TOTAL
>riddled with obnoxious dowsing segments
>fi manages to actually be worse than navi
I am having fun, though. The controls work nicely (usually) if you're not a fucking wildly swinging baboon, and all the RPG elements are a perfect fit for the Zelda formula.
>>337883034
HEY LISTEN, WATCHOUT, HEY HEY
>>337881652
>tadtones
>the imprisoned
Naw, fuck this game. Those two things prevent me from ever replaying it. I'm sure there's a lot more tedious shit that I'm forgetting.
>>337881652
I had a lot of fun with it and I was genuinely enjoying the combat and bomb puzzles for the first time in a 3D zelda, but at the same time it felt kinda barebones, like they just got everything together as soon as the controls were somewhat functional and slapped them on everything.
I feel if this game had come out a bit earlier in the Wii's lifetime, and they had managed to streamline some ideas and work out a couple of kinks, they could've come up with the best 3D zelda yet as the Wii's swansong.
But there's probably only motion controls for the bow in Zelda U/NX, so I guess that's the legacy it got.
>>337883049
The three areas are huge though, so it's fine.
>Is X or Y awful game good now?
>Can we pass TPP now?
These two groups of people are equally annoying and the worst filth of the Earth.
>>337883319
Yeah, fuck you. It isn't fine. It doesn't take more than an hour or two to traverse them and get to their respective dungeons, and once you have, you get to do it again later. There is no excuse for the lack of variety in SS's locales. Compared to the array of scenery in TP before it, it's almost embarrassing.
>>337883209
not the same as an overly wordy explaination on how to breathe every five minutes
>excellent motion controls
Sure. They weren't bad, but instead of having dynamic enemy AI, we get Simon Says.
>great hubworld
Sure, but it doesn't make up for everything else shitty about the sky.
>well designed combat
Again, no. Sword controls were fine, but enemies were Simon Says and nothing else.
>dialogue options make link more enjoyable of a character
Barely.
>the zones were beautiful and fun to explore
Not when you have to fucking revisit them. I don't care if they added some sort of gimmick to make it different. It's the same areas.
Gonna add on to this:
Fuck Imprisoned.
Fuck the flying.
Fuck Fi.
Fuck the emphasis on story when the story is bland as fuck anyway.
I always hate being reminded that the Zelda cycle is real. I will hate this game for decades to come.
I will hate this game on my deathbed.
On my grave, it will says "RIP anon, he fucking hated skyward sword"
I will be studied in history books as the one guy that hated this game.
When world war 4 breaks out between China and Europe or whatever the fuck happens, there will be propaganda posters of me saying I hate the Chinese more than skyward sword
When the atomic bombs send mankind into anarchy their fiery mushroom explosions will remind the people of my hate for this game
Millenia after mankind has gone extinct aliens will find this post and say "trrrk klo ihgg reras" which is Alienese for "wow this guy really fucking hates skyward sword doesn't he"
You wanna know what my beef is? My beef is that it sucked ass.
I HATE skyward sword.
>>337881652
>it's been 5 years
kill me
>>337881652
>A LITTLE hand holdy
It's fucked, an a huge hindrance to enjoying the game. Why is it so hard to add a 'turn off help' button for fuck's sake
>>337882240
>No overworld
>Half the items are dungeon only gimmicks worthless outside
Show your work. We're not going to convince each other of anything, but I'm interested in why you had that experience.
>>337883209
Please, Navi was never annoying. Whatever webcomics you read that pushed that shit was never funny. Fi was a legitimate hindrance, Navi actually served a purpose from start to finish.
>>337883887
Got me to chuckle.
>>337884010
>the damn helper never shuts the fuck up
Annoying or not, no one mentioned that until you brought it to the topic.
>>337884001
Zelda games normally involve a large world to get to know and move around. The whole 'overworld' of Skyward Sword was made up of three 'levels', each of them linear in how you go through them each time you come back.
It's like the concept of an overworld was made into the sky, and the "overworld" was made into dungeon-ettes.
>It's been about 5 years
>>337881652
No. It had shit tier combat even by Zelda standards that was just as braindead as TP and WW but with none of the neat flashy shit like the helm splitter or WW parrying. Instead we just fight reskins of the same fucking enemy over and over and over again all through the game. At least TP and WW had you fighting different easy as fuck enemies in every dungeon.
Combine that with shitty motion controls being shoved in places that make no sense, awful repeating bossfights, and tons of pointless filler and you get the second worst Zelda game. Only Spirit Tracks and the CD-i games are worse.
To people like this retard >>337883887 that think the cycle exists:It exists because you Zeldafags are sheep.
To put it another way, the games become progressively worse as they release because Nintendo doesn't give a shit about putting love into their games anymore. The problem is that you fags cling to the series so hard that when the new one releases and it's, yet again, shit, you go
>"Well, the last one wasn't as bad as this (even though it was REALLY shit). I think I like the last one better because of this piece of shit new one."
>>337884001
The overworld isn't that stuff on the ground, it's the sky that links it all together. Which suffers from the same situation as Windwaker where there's mostly just alot of nothing. And yet Windwaker still had more islands and stuff out in the middle of nowhere that could pique your interest and get you to explore for a moment. The feeling of curiosity you get from randomly running across something was cool. Skyward Sword barely has that.
>>337882524
>the ground world empty and lifeless as it serves as nothing but an extension of dingeon puzzles.
Yeah, I preferred when the land between town and dungeon was blank.
All the way back to OoT, there were monsters or navigation puzzles. I mean I could bring up the 2D games and overworld puzzles but the design philosophy is different enough from the 3D overworlds that I think we can skip over them.
So your real complaint here has nothing to do with the land being simply "extension of dungeon puzzles" but you wanted more towns. And I'd understand that complaint, if it's the one you're making. Don't let me put words in your mouth.
After TP and having the 'bomb stand town' and the 'malo's other mart town' I was more than okay with a centralized location for all my shops. But what I do understand is wanting to see more villages made by these other weird creatures that inhabit the land. It helps make a world feel bigger and it's just always interesting to see different societies, how they get by. You never really see a Mogma city, the Gorons are homeless, there's just one robot house, and the forest things just sort of exist there. I guess those seahorses have an TP-tier Zora's Domain. SS's overworld is unsatisfying in that regard, but I liked those puzzles and areas we did get enough that it's not a huge loss for me.
>>337883702
>>337883049
Each of them opens up with a new area when you go back later. The dungeons vary in theme just as much as a typical 3D Zelda, so it's not like it's just 3 regional themes in the temples. Quality over quantity applies here. "Snowpeak" in TP was just a field, a wall, and a snowboarding section. The desert was one big 'field' and a base campish thing. Getting rid of those extra regional themes frees up more land resources to be used on more fleshed out regions.
>>337883234
>tadtones
What is it about them?
>the imprisoned
3rd fight isn't even a fight, it's a cutscene on how you should have been fighting the Imprisoned all along. Each fight takes maybe a minute, minute and a half when you replay it knowing what to do. I sure as fuck didn't know you could just jump on its head from the start.
>There are kids old enough to be nostalgic for SS now
>>337883882
>Simon Says.
drink
You're as bad as people that complain about the "waiting" in OoT's combat.
>Not when you have to fucking revisit them. I don't care if they added some sort of gimmick to make it different. It's the same areas.
This might be literal autism. I think it's important to note every 3D Zelda has you revisit areas. There's 4 Adult temples in OoT, going back to an area after you beat the boss in MM, and the entire Twilight Realm thing. WW's repeat of the Forsaken Fortress sucks ass but that's not just because you've been there before, it's because the Forsaken Fortress sucks ass.
The way you phrase it, returning to areas regardless of new content means those areas (even if enjoyed the first time) now suck. I assume that makes sense to you, so maybe is it because you're attaching meaning to repeated areas that I'm missing out on. Like you think it means 'lazy design' or 'cheaply budgeted.' What do the repeated visits mean to you?
>>337885586
>go back through the forest and the first dungeon
>there's a 20 minute lake segment now!
>go back through the volcano
>there's more volcano!
>and another fire dungeon with bomb puzzles and lava pits again!
The sand sea was, to its credit, actually pretty cool. The others can piss right off. You can try to justify it all you want, but all the resources they spent making us traverse the same places twice could have gone into brand new areas to explore.
My only gripes about this game is how fucking boring the sky is, how much the game holds your hand and how they went full tryhard on the story.
Also a really minor detail I always hated about the 3D Zelda series is how they poorly handle the rupee system. You're always overflowing with cash making the game easier by just buying blue potions constantly, that is if you're bad enough to lose a lot of hearts in combat (Thank god for Hero mode in the remasters).
Skyward Sword probably handles the currency system the best when you're given the options to upgrade your equipment and buy beedle's items at hefty prices. It's not perfect but it's better than how the other games handle it.
>>337881652
you just fucking said what is wrong with it. It's handholdy and linear. The antithesis of good game design.
Is there a more definitive argument against motion controls than Skyward Sword?
>Most labor-intensive Zelda game in terms of dev time to date
>Was the flagship title for an entire console that year
>Had an accessory developed specially for it for the sole purpose of making the motion controls more responsive
>Motion controlled swordfighting, the best implementation of the motion controls by far, basically boils down to simon says for most enemies.
>Devs still couldn't think of very many actions that couldn't have been done better just being bound to a stick or a button (hello swimming)
>You still have to periodically press the "fix controls" button on the controller or stop the game entirely so you can use the "really fix controls" option in the pause menu
>>337881652
The game interjected too much, breaking gameplay too frequently.
The fact that it would repeatedly pause to tell you about materials you picked up was inexcusable. Fi was also quite possibly the most frequently interrupting companion with the most blatantly obvious suggestions of a Zelda game.
>>337885836
>Where did all the time go...?
>>337881652
Just didn't like the controls. They played fine, but I would have preferred the option of regular controls.
>>337884394
>>337883209
Now sit down.
>>337887149
Is that a legit rugrats storyboard?
It was great, but the stamina meter sucked ass. I didnt like the first stealth section either
>>337884679
>The whole 'overworld' of Skyward Sword was made up of three 'levels', each of them linear in how you go through them each time you come back.
Think about OoT. Death Mountain is a linear path, there's a linear path through the desert, Zora's River, the Scred Meadow is linear.
The Sky is Hyrule field and Kakariko has been merged with Castle Town. That's most of the difference between OoT and SS's maps. The only other thing SS did different with its map is having some of those linear paths branch off from other linear paths instead of them all being linked to the field/sky directly. All 3D Zelda games are linear in map design. Key word being "map," I'm not talking about game design as in story progression. Once you get past the field/ocean/sky everything is a linear path with an occasional side room/cave/minigame.
The only thing "dungeon-ette" about SS's overworld is navigation puzzles and fighting monsters. You know, like in every 3D Zelda game. You jump gaps, cross rivers (sometimes of lava), kill things, find things, help out some asshole on the linear path, and end up at the dungeon. It's not like the overworld is full of floor switches and small keys. I mean shit, it's not like we've never seen Lanayru Desert's basketball bomb statues outside of a dungeon before, or never had to use the hookshot to get to new areas.
I'll take the sky over OoT and TP's Hyrule Field any day.
>>337884852
Anon said "No overworld" and immediately after "Empty sky" in a list as separate items. Anon and I were using it differently than you want to.
Are you saying that Hyrule Field is the "overworld" in OoT?
>>337881652
No it fucking sucked. Worst zelda game.
>>337881652
it was alright at its core.
probably needed a few more years in the development oven to be truly exceptional.
>>337887113
You're not wrong. The controls are bad, but the way you put it makes it sound like you didn't know how to use them.
>+memorable story, focuses on a few characters getting development instead of a large cast with shallow character development
>+solid dungeons overall. other than the sandship, few stand out as excellent but there are no dungeons i particularly disliked.
>+good variety between dungeons. even when a section doesn't work (escort mission and note collection), it's not too long until you've moved on to something else
>+all items are relevant and well utilized throughout the game
>+excellent music
>+unique, beautiful artstyle
>+welcome minor series gameplay changes. mostly bombs, being able to pick up bombs and add them to your bag, roll them, and trajectory markings are all helpful additions. i also didn't mind the stamina meter, being able to climb up vines faster was great & it made the spin attack a more valuable commodity.
>+item customization
>-focus on less characters takes away from the epic nature of link's quest
>-inconsistent character design. Main character designs are all good, Girahim in particular I like a lot, but there are some stinkers. The Imprisoned, Scaldera, and Tentalus are all awful. Tentalus looks like a fucking monsters inc. character, like what the fuck were they thinking with that design. it completely ruins the intense escape sequence when you exit the ship & see that stupid fucking thing
>-weak, boring hub world. i get it, it wouldn't make sense for the sky to be a densely populated area, but it could at least be a bit better than a bunch of rocks with flat grass tops scattered around. there should have been an unpopulated area of similar size to skyloft, like an optional mini-dungeon for collectables
>-poor side quests. not that all of the quests are bad, i just don't like how they're all centralized in skyloft and have the gratitude crystal currency system instead of specific rewards for specific quests
>>337888297
Yes. There was more but execs burned it all.
You think animators didn't do this? they all did, just for kek's.
>t. guy that lived and passed by klasky csupo studios before it closed down
>>337888717
cont.
>-motion controls. i personally had very few issues with them, but enough people had issues with them that it's worth mentioning. flying + the beedtle would be better served by the analog stick, but it's not the worst implementation of the controls i've ever seen (the flying sections in SMG2, with no motion+, were much worse. also, it took me until the very end of the game to be able to do the stab move consistently, but i was eventually able to do it, so that's on me for being dumb
>-puzzle-like design of enemies made it so you rarely faced more than 2 enemies at once (other than bokoblins obvs.)
>-Fi is the worst companion ever. navi was annoying, but she easy to tune her out after a while, whereas fi becomes more obnoxious as the game goes on & through repeat playthroughs
>-i fucking know what an amber relic is holy shit i have 50 of them in my inventory
i like skyward sword a lot. the controls weren't as big of a turn off for me as they were for a lot of other people, and outside of that most of the game's issues are relatively minor compared i'm able to overlook in comparison to the major things the game does well.
>>337886578
Okay so your issue is you didn't get enough themes in the land sections.
Don't treat that like a lack of content. You can't see though it looking the same to see the difference in content. The Fire Temple is much more than just "bomb puzzles and lava pits again." You brain is stopping at that surface level, but you're getting more and varied gameplay.
It's perfectly valid just to state plainly, "I would have liked more variation in the art of the land sections." When people, like who I was responding to, make it sound like there's a lack of gameplay content just because the visual theme is reused then that's just bullshit.
>>337888739
>lived and passed by
>lived
>and passedAre you a ghost?
>>337887995
>I don't know how to create an argument
I know.
>>337887113
>>Had an accessory developed specially for it for the sole purpose of making the motion controls more responsive
Wii motion plus came out 2 years before this game
>>337890231
Nigga what?
>>337881652
Easily the worst 3D Zelda.
Amongst all the other negatives listed in this thread, I think the biggest problem with the game is its focus and flow.
The entire game is just dungeons and dungeon-like overworlds. Like all Zelda games they're well designed, but the removal of a vibrant world filled with characters, locations and quests is a real detriment to the gameplay.
I missed figuring things out in the world. Playing Saria's song to Darunia, learning Song of Storms from yourself, bringing a red potion to the invisible guard, things like that. All of these require a knowledge of the world and how it works, then rewards you for figuring it out.
Skyward Sword's linearity loses this aspect. It keeps it too one note too often. Put your sword in here and match up all the symbols - woo!
All the challenges seems to be limited to physical or weapon/item based puzzles with the 'challenge' coming from the execution rather than the working out. Other 3D Zeldas had some linearity, but left it for the dungeons. Short bursts of tough physical challenges.
Outside its different. The puzzle solving changes from physical to worldly. These require a knowledge of characters, locations, and reward your exploration.
Without that, it's just one loooong dungeon. They tried to change the formula, but it just falls flat. They changed the wrong parts.
Bought it maybe 2 years ago. Finally got around to playing it. You can tell that the developers had playability for kids in mind when they made it, but boy, am I enjoying it.
>>337882369
>Flying isn't as tedious as sailing.
Yes, yes it is. You have to constantly waggle the Wiimote just to keep up speed and not plummet downwards and the speed boosts take ages to come back so you can't rely on those to keep up your speed. It takes like two minutes to just get across half the map with all the speed booster areas and having to go anywhere near the edge of the map is a chore which the game loves to do by sending you to the Thunderhead constantly. Not to mention they just loved throwing tornadoes at you that would come almost out of nowhere which you had to dodge in like half a second or it knocked you off, flipped you in the opposite direction, and reset the great flying music. It's insane they didn't make movement tied to the left stick and instead made you rock the Wiimote back and forth just to fly left or right.
The worst sailing ever did was the wind changing in the reefs, and how long it took to get places even if you were doing the speeedrun method of wind boosting. Thankfully they fixed both those problems with the Swift Sail in HD.
Seriously though, screw the Thunderhead, I hate the things that spawn right at the start every single time that seem to hit you at random and other times just float around you, I hate having to fly to the damn shrine every single time, and I hate how the only island worth a damn in it is the bug catching one.
>>337883049
The problem I had was with the areas that weren't the forest.
>Have to repeat the Eldin Volcano area several times, one is an escort mission, one is without any items, one is the Silent Realm, and one is your first time there without any bombs.
>The sand dune hills every single time.
>The Moblins scattered everywhere during the escort mission which the robot flies into and then shouts at you that you're not saving him.
>The Moblins that have steel shields on the narrow platforms so you end up twanging and have a high chance of just falling off due to the guy turning.
>Everything to do with the Mogma Mitts.
Then there's the Lanayru Desert which is just an utter chore to go through.
>Have to bomb dozens of statues to cross the desert which means watching the cutscene of it falling to make a platform every time.
>Constant Timeshift Stone cutscenes.
>Those shrimp things that see you a mile away(Though they're easily beaten just by parrying, I just hate seeing them and then having to wait)
>Everything to do with any sand, especially those segments where they want you to run across the shells and then wait for your stamina to regen every single platform.
>Having to essentially clean the entire dungeon once you get the Gust Bellows.
>Timeshift Ship segment is nice visually but terribly boring.
>Area only gets fun once you get the Clawshots since it lets you skip everything.
The worst the forest had was the swimming tutorial and the Tadtone section.
>>337881652
>Excellent motion controls
They had an error rate and had to be frequently calibrated. I'd hardly call them excellent.
They also ditched the only excellent part of the Wii motion controls to implement Gyro aiming.
>Great Hubworld
Sky sucked massively. Nothing to do and the controls were annoying. The subhubs were alright but for the most part they suffered when going through them multiple times.
>Well designed combat
It's less complex than if they had just made the game good for using items and had removed the sword motion controls in favor of more traditional responsive controls.
The error rate limited what enemies could really do in terms of speed and attacks. I hate to say Simon Says combat but really that's what it mostly was with few exceptions for mostly static enemies that you could use items on.
>Dialogue options
Arguably yes but unskippable cutscenes took up too much time and the story was still relatively lackluster.
I like the artstyle (Though not at the native resolution) and it definitely had its moments where it managed to make all the major issues the game had seem worth it but they were quite rare.
