What would the NX need to be, for it to be considered a success? Some people think it's a waste of a console to just copy the PS4/Xbone, but others think that another bullshit gimmick will make Nintendo fail again.
I can't think of a scenario where Nintendo comes out of this on top.
It would need good games and multiplats that don't suck
saged
>>337857340
God I wish that really was the real, primary controller for it.
But instead we'll get a buttplug that you control with your ass muscles, or something similarly gay.
>>337857340
How the fuck am i supposed to get my fingers around the controller to use the snes buttons.?
>>337857340
I don't understand why Nintendo can't just suck it up and play the same game everyone else in the industry is playing.
Right now Sony and MS are competing purely on the basis of advertising and exclusives. ALL Nintendo has to do is make a decent multiplat machine, and people will pick their product for its first/third party exclusives.
But no, we HAVE to have a gimmick to try and replicate the Wii. Ignoring, of course, the fact that even casuals got bored of Wii Sports within a month, and that aside from maybe one or two titles nobody liked the Wii's unique features.
>>337857340
All the mystery about the NX is starting to piss me off.
>>337858857
It's a reskinned Wii u pro controller.
>>337857340
No matter how good NX will be the PS4 still has a 40 million momentum
>>337858654
we're sorry you're too stretched out to use it already, anon
>>337857340
>Some people think it's a waste of a console to just copy the PS4/Xbone
it depends
the argument is that it would be a waste of time to try and compete with that market because both Sony and Microsoft are firmly entrenched so not only would it be extremely difficult to break through because of their dominance, in the event that you're 'successful' you're basically cannibalising your own console and game sales because you will always be splitting things three ways with Sony and Microsoft
the alternate argument is that if you can create a console that is equivalent in power and third party support as whatever Sony or Microsoft have on the market, PLUS provide access to Zelda, Mario, Donkey Kong, Pokemon etc... then you would think success would be assured
>others think that another bullshit gimmick will make Nintendo fail again
if the 'gimmick' is what i driving the console it needs to be something far greater than the Wii U's, and it is extremely difficult to predict what the general public will latch onto
>What would the NX need to be, for it to be considered a success
Nintendo will (probably) not try to compete with Sony and Microsoft (more out of pride than business sense)
so what will be needed to be a success is a VERY strong library of first-party games, one that far exceeds the Wii U
despite what people think, this will be difficult to achieve since the Wii U had a surprising amount of solid first party releases:
>Mario: 3D World, NSMBU, Maker, Kart
>Splatoon
>DK Tropical Freeze
>Hyrule Warriors
>Bayonetta 2
>Wind Waker HD
>Pikmin 3
>Star Fox Zero
>Wonderful 101
>Xenoblade X
>Yoshi's Woolly World
>Captain Toad
>>337857340
>others think that another bullshit gimmick will make Nintendo fail again.
Most developers ignore the gimmicks, so I doubt stuff like the Gamepad is why the Wii U didn't sell
>>337859865
>All the mystery about the NX is starting to piss me off.
Same here. It's just gone on for easy to long. Starting to lose hype.
>>337859643
>aside from maybe one or two titles nobody liked the Wii's unique features
yeah, nah:
SMG
SMG 2
Mario Kart
Metroid Prime 3
Twilight Princess
Wario Land
Zack & Wiki
Kirby Rainbow Yarn
DK Returns
RE4 (for the controls)
NSMB Wii
Boy and His Blob
Deadly Creatures
Endless Ocean
Red Steel 2
>>337859865
>>337861230
it was literally only just announced and it's still 10 months away from release
they will likely reveal more about it in September
>"Check out our awesome dual screen gimmick!"
>Few games actually use it
>"Check out our awesome waggle gimmick!"
>Few games actually use it
>"Check out OUR awesome waggle gimmick!"
>Few games actually use it
>"Check out our awesome Kinect sensor gimmick!"
>Few games actually use it
>"Check out our awesome 3D gimmick!"
>Few games actually use it
>"Check out our awesome rear touchpad gimmick!"
>Few games actually use it
>"Check out our awesome tablet controller gimmick!"
>Few games actually use it
>"Check out our awesome controller touchpad gimmick!"
>Few games actually use it
>"Check out our awesome IMPROVED Kinect sensor gimmick!"
>Few games actually use it
>"Check out our awesome VR headset gimmick!"
>Few games actually use it
When the fuck will hardware makers learn? The last "gimmick" to bring anything worthwhile to the table was fucking Ethernet in the early 2000s.
Just fucking make good, exclusive games that play on a normal controller. No third party is going to develop anything good for your shitty revolutionary biometric VR dildo touch controller.
>>337861230
At first it was a bit intriguing but now it is getting ridiculous. Stop telling me how awesome it is and show me.
>>337861458
>>"Check out our awesome dual screen gimmick!"
But the DS actually had good games with this
>>337857340
They are no longer making home consoles, so they will try to make a ugly hybrid between a console and a handheld with shit graphics, expensive cartdriges, games and the same limited online experience we know. Not to mention gimmicks, Miis, Amiibos, and DLC.
So yes, it's prettry much already dead.
>>337861275
Okay, now how many of those games would lose anything from being adapted to a Xbox/PS layout
>>337859643
>I don't understand why Nintendo can't just suck it up and play the same game everyone else in the industry is playing.
Because if the Nintendo system is just the same thing you could get from Microsoft or Sony what's the point of releasing a system at all? Plus Nintendo has to sell their system for a profit because they can't tax the sale of every PC or Blu-Ray player sold that means that in a apples to apples competition Nintendo's system would always be less powerful/more expensive.
The NX should just be the next generation of their handheld hardware, it should be good enough to at least handle 720p graphics with the Vulkan API and it should have the capability to broadcast an image to a HDMI connected dongle. Games should be on 4-8 GB cards and they should continue to improve their online experience. Do all that and make it compatible with DS, 3DS, and New 3DS games and you'd have a pretty damn attractive system.
>>337861791
red steel 2 (which sucks unless you're a super wii apologist)
wario ware (which is fun as fuck and would be a shame to lose)
thats literally it
>>337861791
Red Steel, because then it'll be casual trash
>>337858654
Literally the worst right analog placement in gaming history. Right hand claw is basically necessity in every game.
Apple should buy Nintendo. Nintendo's games + Apple's hardware and marketing = a huge surge in their market share.
>>337860303
they both have the same number of games out, though
>>337860719
>it would be a waste of time to try and compete with that market
>create a console that is equivalent in power and third party support
Pick one
>>337862096
That sounds terrible. You really want to pay $2000 for a Apple console, or see Nintendo games saddled with an even worse controller than the Wiimote like the Apple TV games are?
>>337861668
I'd argue that the DS and Wii were actually somewhat successful. But every gimmick after that was a colossal failure.
Also worth mentioning that the DS was cheap to develop for. If you were a third-party studio, would you spend your budget making games for all 3 platforms? Or would you risk it on a single platform's gimmick?
Hell, the only reason third party exclusivity even exists nowadays is because of money changing hands. Nobody gives a shit about console exclusive features.
>>337862096
Why would Apple buy Nintendo when Nintendo's already going to make games for smartphone?
>>337862179
I'm literally presenting both sides of the argument though
>>337861443
>just announced
Where have you been?
>>337862720
Both are the same thing.
>>337862739
when was the official announcement, anon?
We've known they were working on a successor to the WiiU since before the WiiU came out, so we've technically known about the NX for like 5 years
>>337862267
No. The Mac Mini is $500. All they'd need to do is update it with like higher end Iris Pro graphics and create a media center/gaming mode for use with a controller and it'd already be competitive with current gen consoles. Especially if they don't do paid online.
>>337861861
I get what you're saying, Nintendo has all its eggs in one basket so it can't be the console powerhouse it once was.
But the LEAST they can do is make their console roughly as powerful as the competition. That way, if people buy the console for Mario, great. And if people want Far Cry 5 AND Mario, they can get that too.
All they're doing with their "we're weaker but we have this neat controller!" bullshit is scaring off third parties. EA, for example, will never release a Battlefield game on the Wii U because it would look like ass compared to the other versions, so nobody would buy it. And they'll never make a Wii U exclusive, because why do that when they can spend the same resources targeting 2 consoles instead of one?
>>337863039
Even if they do that the Iris is weaker than the graphics hardware you'd get currently in the WiiU and even if it wasn't on OS X you get OpenGL 4.1 which is worse than you even even with open source drivers on Linux and Metal an API that doen't even come close to Vulkan in terms of its feature support.
>>337863039
>it'd already be competitive with current gen consoles
Oh yeah, I forgot we needed another PS4.
>>337863178
People already have a console for Far Cry 5.
>>337862034
Very good point
>>337863178
I think if Nintendo wanted to create a new pillar for the company they'd be better off going cheaper. Build a better 'New' 2DS as a companion system for a new higher end handheld. Target the sub $100 market.
>>337863358
>implying console consumers care about that
Anyways, they could put like a mobile Nvidia chip in it with an i3 and sell it for $600 and normies would still lap that shit up because it's Apple. OS X already has a fair amount of games so if their controller was like the Steam controller and the OS was just OS X without any major modifications besides the optional "big picture mode" interface, it would have a huge advantage over current gen consoles. Combine that with how well known and popular Nintendo games are with normies and how desirable Apple's ecosystem is for a lot of people, Apple could sell a lot of units if they did that.
what has ACTUALLY been confirmed about the NX other than it being released in March 2017, and Zelda being a launch title?
the rumour about cartridges seems to have slightly more legitimacy than other rumours since it came from something Macronix actually said
>>337862374
>>337862096
>>337862267
From a business standpoint a partnership makes a lot of sense.
>Apple has nice hardware with healthy market share,
>But has always failed at gaming ventures
>Nintendo has some of the most valuable game IPs in the world
>But finds themselves in a position where they have to compete against two tech giants
Apple provides the hardware and rock-solid advertising, and Nintendo provides the games. Now Apple TV and Apple's Metal API are actually desirable, and Nintendo no longer has to worry about being shat on by the sheer resources of the Sony and Microsoft corporations.
I don't want it to happen either, but you've gotta admit it sounds good from a boardroom perspective.
>>337863536
It'd be much more functional than a PS4. It could still be regular OS X with a "big picture mode" so existing Mac users already have access to it. And developers could use iPads/iPhones like the PS Vita/PS4 connectivity, and since iDevices have a much larger install base than the Vita, it could be implemented way more successfully.
>>337864075
>>But has always failed at gaming ventures
Yeah, and then iOS happened
>>337863750
Then, they could just put then on steam for cheap like SEGA did
>>337864075
If nobody bought a Wii U just to play Nintendo games, nobody will buy an proprietary Apple console just to play Nintendo games. They gotta be on iPhones.
>>337864075
>Apple has failed at gaming ventures
have you heard of the App Store?
>>337863819
If they had Nintendo though they would have some of the same problems that Nintendo has now. Scaring off third party developers with a extremely strong first party line up. APIs too different from other platforms. Honestly if Apple was going to do that they'd have better luck not buying Nintendo and using ARM hardware except they already did that with the Apple TV and it hasn't really gone anywhere.
Apple is the cool kid company, and video games that you need buttons to play are like baby toys.
>>337864386
an Apple Console would be more than just for playing Nintendo games though
it would possibly be the high-end version of the Apple TV
>>337864512
Yeah put a competent CPU and GPU on Apple TVs and you get a proprietary console just to play Nintendo games. Especially when all the other consoles also focuses on TV content. No you're an idiot.
>>337864512
They already have a "high-end" Apple TV
>>337864512
Why is Apple going to sell a $400-$500 device that would compete with the iPhone and the iPad for software?
>>337863750
For what purpose?
People were more than willing to pay $399 for the other consoles. Why would they want to pay less? They can already get tablets for that price.
>>337864386
The beauty of it is that if they decided to keep it OS X based and not make the console separate from their PCs, they would already have a huge install base if it worked on Macs as long as they meet the hardware requirements. Their console would be like the windows based Steamboxes. So you could hook up your macbook pro/iMac/Mac pro to your TV + get Apple's controller, or buy the console. It makes sense because consoles are trying to become "smarter" and more internet connected, to the point where they're basically just media center PCs that can play games now. So a dedicated box that can also be used as a PC and has iTunes and all the iOS device integration you could possibly want built in would sell like hotcakes.
>>337865159
>Their console would be like the windows based Steamboxes
why would anyone buy that
do you think people bought an iPod or iPhone because Apple made it and not because everything else was garbage
>>337865159
I can understand if Nintendo games are going to be on MacOS and iOS, but Apple would not make a proprietary console to run Nintendo games. That goes against the idea of capitalizing the Apple install base. Good luck selling a $60 game on the App Store to an almost separate fanbase though.
>>337857340
The future of consoles is probably a console + handheld that can play the same games at smaller resolution
If this happens Microsoft will probably get pushed out or have to develop a handheld while Sony already has Vita and can make a buffed up version if needed
>>337857340
>hardware on par with PS4/Xbone if not better than those
>online to rival xbox live and PSN (doesn't need to cost money but it probably should given market direction although I doubt they could convince people to pay for it now)
>X86 arc to convince third parties to release games on it
>a controller that isn't a stupid fucking gimmick making it impossible to port other games to it
>a steady stream of games both first and third party that make it worth owning despite being half way into the current generation and this thing killing off the wiiU despite what they want to claim
Daily reminder that the DS line "is not meant to replace the GBA line. They're differnt"
-t. Nintendo before butt fucking people that just got an SP and weren't looking to upgrade.
Also see the DSI to the DS or new 3DS to the 3DS. Nintendo would never lie about upgrades. Not even once.
>>337857340
They have one angle they can take and as I see it only one path to get there. They need incredible 3rd party support. INCREDIBLE. Theonly way I see that happening is digging deep into all that cash they're wasting by having it just sit there and buy exclusives. Big ones. GTA6 an NX exclusive. Buy SE loyalty back. It will cost hundreds of millions each but it's the only move.
Even then they become hated by people wanting those games but not another console. And would Nintendo drop $150-$200 milion for one game? GTA would cost at least that, probably double.
>>337865054
Because a $399 Nintendo system would be less powerful than a Sony or Microsoft system for the same price. Sub $100 devices are impulse buys, get one for a kid and if they destroy it its not that big of a deal.
Perhaps it shouldn't even be a 2DS. Imagine for a moment a $49 system that's basically a modern take of a system about as powerful as the original DS hardware with a number of classic games pre-installed and an updated online store for more. Release it at the holiday season and market it like the other cheap holiday systems you'll get an instant install base of millions. Consoles should be cheap toys.
>>337864512
Ha. One word. Pippin.
>>337865609
The future of consoles is consoles. Why would everybody else stop because Nintendo is having troubles?
>>337861861
Given a typical game system with nintendo branding you've got the power of those other machines and the selling power of nintendo first party. Are you fucking dense? They could have their first party fans and the CoD drones all on one console.
>>337865785
>The future of consoles is consoles.
Is it though? Doesn't seem like anyone is really making a killing this time around.
>>337857340
i have this controller, it sucks
the analog stick doesn't have an "off" position even when you're not touching it so it's always going in one direction and the dpad doesn't have a middle and it registers as a wii classic controller and the battery life is shit and drains even when it's off
>>337865387
Yes. Tons of people bought iPhones because it's Apple.
>>337865517
Because it's so cheap to implement. It'd literally just be Mac mini refresh with an updated/overhauled version of Apple's game center (that's not exclusive to the Mac mini) for use when it's hooked up to a TV. Plenty of people would still buy the Mac mini for regular use and not as a console. The only thing Apple would have to change is marketing and software, and they know how to do that already.
>>337857340
Nintendo is going into mobile and 3rd party devs are not going to be hopeful for the NX after the Wii U didn't do well.
NX will fail unless it is a handheld/console hybrid.
>No 3ds replacement announced despite it being released before the Wii U
>Would merge their 3ds devs and console devs resulting in more games for the NX.
"Wii U tablet you can take with you" Sounds like the only viable gimmick left.
>>337865159
>>337865159
>Their console would be like the windows based Steamboxes.
Just two problems with that. First off the Steam Machines don't run Windows, they run SteamOS, and secondly they'd have the same problem Nintendo has today which is the hardware would be worse for the same price.
Why would I buy a game system locked to OpenGL 4.1 and 'Metal' a next-gen API that doesn't even support tessellation when I can get a Alienware Steam Machine cheaper that has OpenGL 4.5 and Vulkan support? Not to mention a larger game library since the Apple system wouldn't be able to run games from Steam and would almost certainly be locked against running anything from third-party sources.
>>337865901
>Is it though? Doesn't seem like anyone is really making a killing this time around.
Is this what they call NintenDELUSION?
>>337865725
my lord no
>>337865901
Please stop posting. I beg of you.
>>337862993
>when was the official announcement, anon?
Reggie literally named dropped the damn thing on E3 2015, saying they would say more about it in 2016
We are in 2016 and now they are saying they will say more about this year, just not at E3 and that the thing is being released in March 2017.
>>337864075
I think Nintendo became weary after their previous partnerships with Sony and Philips.
>>337866036
Nintendo seems too scared to talk about it, like they're not confident in it. Why not show it at E3?
>>337857340
either
>its actually powerful enough to compete with next gen games
599 us dollars 2.0, too early for third party support, basically no established userbase, fucking awful online infrastructure, etc
or
>its a $200 cell phone you can hook up to your tv or something equally stupid
shitty games, no way to compete with next gen, an almost guaranteed failure as a gaming console attempting to skate by on some kind of crossplay/mobile market gimmick
in no plausible situation does it turn out well
as a stepping stone to the gen after it could be something positive but only if it takes a step backward from the wii which they have shown no willingness to do
basically theyre too far behind to compete with the other consoles on an equal level and the wii was sheer luck mixed with borderline illegal market manipulation with a marketbase they will never even capture a portion of again
on top of that the quality of their first party development is spiraling out of control, passion for gaming has seemingly evaporated from the company
>>337865958
Alienware released a Windows version of their Steambox, I'm just using that as an example of what I mean. And if people bought consoles for their processing power, they wouldn't buy consoles. People buy consoles because they're convenient and can integrate into the product ecosystem of whatever company makes them. And it wouldn't be that much more expensive than an Xbone or PS4 in the long run anyways if Apple doesn't charge for online.
I doubt Nintendo will come up with anything interesting after they shat the bed with the Wii U.
Seems like there's not really any consoles worth it this gen. Maybe the PS4 if you can find one used at a decent price, but all the games are still years away.
>>337861051
>so I doubt stuff like the Gamepad is why the Wii U didn't sell
How much R&D and processing power go to making the game pad a thing? How much of the system cost is in the game pad itself? I'm willing to bet a wiiU without the gamepad would have been at least $150 cheaper. That's $150 of more powerful tech that could have been put into the system to match the xbone and ps4 and get third party support. If nintendo wants gimmick shit they should just sell it secondary. No reason the pro controller shouldn't have been the default controller. Especially with the number of games that ignore the gamepad or just use it for map display.
>>337866096
But >>337864386 's point is that nobody would buy an Apple console for Nintendo games. My point is that people wouldn't be buying this for the console aspect, or even buying this at all. They'd be buying it because it's a full fledged Mac computer with Nintendo's games and convenient media center mode. A lot of people wouldn't even have to buy anything besides the games because they already have Macs.
>>337866284
>borderline illegal market manipulation
Explain
>>337864820
you have no idea what people use Apple TVs for
>>337864867
this would be an upgrade and become the high-end Apple TV, just like how the current "high end" Apple TV was an upgrade frome the previous one
do you understand?
>>337864908
when you say software, are you talking about the App Store?
>>337861458
Really the only gimmick I like is the motion controls in the playstation controllers. I can completely forget they exist 99% of the time until I get a prompt to shake my controller to bring back the flashlight in that cave section of UC4.
have you liked and retweeted yet, /v/?
>>337866169
because it's Nintendo, they don't 'play by the rules'
they've said in the past that major announcements will mainly take place during Directs (even though it seems like they're going to reveal the NX at the Tokyo Games Show)
>>337866638
Everything they do is illegal. It was illegal for Nintendo to be the market leader in America, so congress took action to limit their sphere of influence in the market. You can't have bad goys getting uppity.
>>337866512
Nintendo doesn't have third party support because of gimmicks. It's a problem if demographics. Wii U owners only want to play Nintendo games so why would any publisher bother?
>>337866551
But you want Apple to make a console just for Nintendo games, but at the same time opposed to Nintendo games being on Mac OS and existing Mac computers?
I wouldn't even care if the new console still had a dumb screen on the controller, if it at least was high quality, and or / multi touch
All I want is a fucking console that isn't underpowered garbage, with Metroid on it, for less than 400$.
Is that too much to ask, Nintendo? Why are they so fucking ass backwards and stupid. Holy fuck. The only games I play on my Wii U are games I could be emulating anyway, like Earthbound and Super Metroid and the Metroid Prime Trilogy. None of the Wii U games interested me except the Zelda game they have delayed until the NX. You better believe I regret buying the Wii U.
>>337866794
I have as a space cowboy dandy man.
>>337866868
But Nintendo really did a lot of shit back then that's illegal by modern laws, like refusing to restock retailers if they accepted competitors' products.
>>337866506
Eh, even cheap, a PS4 is useless. I've tried Bloodborne, and it's not good. MGSV is also on PS3, and FFXV looks like it's going to be trash.
The key problem for Nintendo is that the wider market doesn't really want to play their games anymore. If people wanted to play their games, they would buy their consoles because that's where to get them and third party support would follow.
The base of consumers that will buy Nintendo consoles for only Nintendo games is pretty well defined on the Wii U.
I can't really see what they could bring to the table with NX, regardless of the form factor it takes. If it's a handheld of some kind and there is no home console coming, I suppose it could absorb both the Wii U and 3DS install bases and possibly some portion of the Vita's.
Assuming not much further attrition to mobile, that would be a pretty healthy install base approaching GBA numbers.
>>337866970
No, I never said I'd be opposed to the second part of your comment. That's pretty much what I'm proposing actually. The point of Apple changing how they market the Mac mini is that it would be an easy point of entry into Apple's ecosystem for people that want to play Nintendo games but don't already own a Mac or iDevice.
>>337867063
That's why im saying the games are years away. Maybe something good comes up, fuck if I know. Kingdom Hearts 3 looks fun.
>>337866862
Nintendo Directs are only watched by fanboys and modern TGS is basically Sony Central at this point, Nintendo hasn't bothered to show up in years.
Half of Nintendo's profits are coming from the US so it's odd to skip the US centric industry show.
>>337866871
You're thinking of it wrong.
>Nintendo makes a system with a stupid gimmick and gimped hardware to compensate
>third parties don't want to bother developing for a console that's using powerPC when literally every other platform that matters in on x86 now
>gamers that like those third party games completely ignore the wiiU because it won't have their favorite games despite liking titles like mario smash and zelda. Can't justify the system cost for 2 or 3 games when the competition has literally every other title you'd want
>wiiU ends up only getting die hard nintendo fans that will play those games regardless of the negatives
If they had made the wiiU on par with the Xbone and PS4 you can bet your ass they'd be giving sony a run for their money right now. Xbone would still have shat the bed with the always online thing but Nintendo would be direct competition for third party games that run just as well if not better than the ps4 PLUS nintendo first party games that everybody loves.
>>337866293
That's not a Steambox then its just a normal Windows PC. And I'm not talking about consumers as much as I'm talking about developers. Nobody is going to want to develop titles for a system that let them translate their skills easily from other platforms. Nintendo knows this and that's why their handhelds have traditionally been similar to systems from a generation or two ago and why with the NX they're supposedly jumping right in with a Vulkan style API since it will be similar to the APIs that devs have been working with on the PS4 and Xbone for a few years. Metal has a completely different design and its less capable. It works on iOS devices because Apple is more dominant in that market, but its not going to attract devs to a new platform.
Apple isn't going to do this because they are not interested in this market. Their interest level is so low their drivers have been passed by stuff written by college students in their spare time. Everyone here things Steam Machines are aimed at Windows and they are to an extent, but they're really aimed at making Apple the #3 platform for PC gaming because they're really bad stewards of anything other than phone platforms today.
>>337867187
Macs are not known for gaming though. They essentially have to build back a userbase. Good luck again selling $60 games to an almost alien userbase. If you just want pure userbase numbers then Windows would be a better choice.
>>337867158
Nobody want's to play their games because they don't even know who is their core audience anymore. Nintendo still try to get kids with kiddy shit while kids play things like CoD, and because their games get more easier and look shittier to appeal the wider audience they lost their old fanbase as the time goes.
>>337864294
>>337864398
iOS is a success in its own right but it's not the only place they want to be successful.
Currently Apple has a strong presence in mobile, desktop, tablet, and even wearable. Now the living room is the missing piece of that puzzle. They want people to get Apple TVs for the same reason Microsoft wants people to get Xboxes: to push streaming media and gather advertising/marketing data.
Apple TV is in an okay place, but is hampered by the fact that it's basically just a streaming player that does nothing special. An exclusivity contract with Nintendo could change that, giving them an edge over other streaming players and the ability to go toe-to-toe with player+consoles like the Xbox and PS.
>>337867272
Third party publishers don't care about underpowered machines or gimmicks as long as there's money for them. The Wii didn't have a problem with third party titles early on because there was people buying them.
If the Wii U sold well and its owners willing to buy third party games publishers would suck it up and make games for it.
>>337867040
I just don't understand the process with which we define anti-competitive practices. It's okay to do things like bribe or strongarm third parties into not releasing games on other platforms for example.
There's some pretty slimy shit that goes on in the background still.
>>337867218
I agree with everything you're saying - I didn't say it was smart for them to "not play by the rules'
>>337867542
>because they don't even know who is their core audience anymore
Which is a problem that goes back to the time period in between N64 and Gamecube. All the evidence was right there in front of them with all of the popular shooters on N64. They sperged out over Saturn eating their lunch back in Nippon, did everything they could to muzzle NoA, and acted totally dumbfounded when Microsoft dropped Halo and basically came right in and displaced them in the US.
>>337867515
With Windows you're now adding the cost of a license and surrendering a lot of control of your platform. Not to mention the person who is selling you the OS for your console killer happens to sell a console that they want people to buy instead of your system. Not sure if you paid attention in school but Microsoft doesn't have a very good history of playing well with others.
>>337867656
Very family friendly third party games though. The kinds that sell before the existence of smartphone gaming.
>>337857340
>What would the NX need to be, for it to be considered a success?
a videogame console.
thats literally it.
But Nintendo is incapable of making consoles without stupid gimmicks anymore, so it will fail.
>>337867554
mobile and tablet ARE the living room now
The concept is handheld console merge
While being a traditional console
It'll work
Also people seem to misunderstand what Kimishima says
When he says "it won't be the Wii U's successor"
He means it won't be the successor in name terms, like Wii to Wii U and DS to 3DS
>>337862034
what are you talking about? it's the same position as the left analog stick. why would it be any different/worse for your right hand than your left?
>>337867305
Normal Windows PCs don't come in that form factor and aren't marketed like that. My point was that some PC manufacturers already do what I'm proposing, but with Windows instead of Apple and OS X. And severa games are in the top paid section of the Mac app store (Rollercoaster tycoon, the Sims, SUPERHOT, Civ 5, and COD 4 is even sitting one spot above Angry Birds), if Apple can make people interested enough in gaming on Macs, the developers would come. The games might not run as well as on Windows PCs, but they'll still run and that's all that matters.
>>337867515
Macs are not primarily intended for gaming and I don't think they ever will be. But games are fairly popular in the Mac app store, the potential is there for Apple to build off of.
>>337867554
>An exclusivity contract with Nintendo could change that
Apple has extensive experience designing their own licensed CPU cores, designing their own licensed GPUs [they even own 10% of Imagination], and putting powerful hardware in small form factors that are visually appealing.
They have their own digital distribution platform from which they collect royalties. They don't need Nintendo.
>>337867784
>It's okay to do things like bribe or strongarm third parties into not releasing games on other platforms for example
Nobody does that anymore. Whenever a third party game is exclusive it either means that the console maker worked up a contract or the publisher knows that they won't find their target audience on another console.
>>337868164
Yeah well, I'm sure Nintendo "worked up a contract" with retailers too. I'm sure they signed an agreement saying that they can have Nintendo games, but only Nintendo games; and that if they break the contract then there will be no more Nintendo games.
>>337868089
Apple has had years to show interest in PC gaming on their platform and they haven't. They already have the casual market with iOS and they're never going to get the enthusiast market who want more control of their platform. Consoles served a purpose in the past and they just don't anymore they're getting squeezed between the ever increasing capabilities of lower-end hardware, and the ever decreasing price of higher end hardware.
The future of the mainstream is mobile devices and everyone knows it.
>>337867656
>The Wii didn't have a problem with third party titles early on because there was people buying them.
Because the wii had a gimmick that luckily was strongly received by casual consumers. You can't base a business on luck that your gimmick will catch. They're trying to catch lightning in a bottle. Third parties only ignore hardware when consumers ignore hardware and consumers only ignore hardware when you get lucky as fuck. In most cases and especially now that all systems are x86 meaning devs can save big by porting across pc and console, you need a system that can at least run those games at decent settings. Otherwise they won't bother. Nintendo's thinking is stuck in the past when it was possible to pull off a weak console but still sell because ports were expensive anyway so they would try.
>>337868164
>Nobody does that anymore.
Ever tried to buy a PC at retail without Windows that wasn't a Mac? Strong arm tactics remain a part of market dominance even today. That's why Microsoft, Apple and Sony all push their own single-platform solutions that won't work anywhere else because they want to pay off a developer for one game and then once they have them on their platform they'll have a hard time moving to anything else.
>>337857340
> perfect face layou
I wish Sony woul use this layout.
>>337868474
Nintendo strong armed retailers back then because 60% of Toys R Us sales came from Nintendo back in the NES days. No console maker hold this kind of bargaining power anymore.
>>337862034
the wii u pro controller is actually very easy to claw grip, you just have to alter your grip slightly
works even better for claw grip + rstick combo for those games where you need to control the camera at the same time too
it's quite nice
>>337869026
I was specifically talking about the situation between third parties and console makers.
>>337869138
Sony's layout is perfect for clawing. Only people that can't use the analog and face buttons at the same time would prefer that.
>>337857340
If it was a Linux box more powerful than ps4 I'd be happy.
>>337869415
Yes and we still see it with third party devs. Witness the devs who announce their game for platforms other than Windows who then surprisingly wind up releasing the game for the Xbox first even though they hadn't previously announced it for that platform. Hell Microsoft has gone so far as to purchase developers in the past who made games popular with users of other platforms. Anyone else old enough to remember that Bungie was the big Mac game company in the 90s?
>>337869725
Picture pls
>>337869725
>people that can't use the analog and face buttons at the same time
Thankfully, Microsoft solved this problem on the Elite controller. Hopefully it gets implemented in the future as standard so we don't have to listen to you clawfags anymore.
>>337868683
Well that's even better for Apple because they already do well in that space. They could do something like an Apple TV with a gaming controller instead of a Mac mini and make a fortune from selling future Mario titles on iDevices (including Apple TV obviously) and macbooks. Laptops are already approaching console quality graphics (and Polaris even aims to make more power efficient, console level mobile chips), so with gaming becoming more of an option on low end hardware, $1300 macbook pros could actually eat into the console market because someone looking to buy an $800 laptop and a console would be tempted to just buy a macbook and no console instead. Apple wouldn't even need to buy Nintendo, just pay them for an exclusivity deal and work with Nintendo on first party gaming accessories (like a gamepad attachment for the iPhone and a controller for OS X). This would be a huge advantage for Apple because people who want to play Mario and Pokemon would start buying iPhones or iPads instead of Android devices. And Apple could sell virtual console titles in the app store as well. Honestly, this makes a ton of business sense IMO.
>>337865725
pippin was a product without a market
it was a bottom-end Mac that was locked down as fuck and sold as a console that could go on the internet, and Apple didn't market it at all (that was Bandai's job, and they royally fucked it)
the 3DO already proved that no one wanted a $600 console
and then it didn't do anything to compete with the PS1 or N64, you didn't have any accelerated video, you just used plain ol' Color QuickDraw like on a Mac and the PPC CPU and did whatever 3D rendering in software on the 66MHz PPC
in fact, the whole thing reminds me horribly of the CD-i in execution -- underpowered, overpriced, didn't really target a market segment
An Apple TV that played games at least has some value. Pippin sure as fuck didn't.
>>337869920
This. It may not be as overt as Nintendo's was in the 90s, but to call these practices "competitive" is a joke.
>>337869920
Microsoft paid Bungie to develop Halo. It was a contract, nobody was forced to do anything. It's a very different situation from the days Nintendo forbid publishers to make games if they also made games for other platforms.
No console maker can afford to do this kind of shit anymore.
>>337869920
>Anyone else old enough to remember that Bungie was the big Mac game company in the 90s?
>tfw if the Pippin was more competitive, Marathon could have been to the Pippin what Halo was to the Xbox
>>337869963
For Apple maybe if they were interested which they probably aren't. How would it make sense for Nintendo though? They would lose all of their autonomy to promote someone elses platforms. Seems like in that scenario going fully third-party like Sega would be a better move.
>>337870320
Halo was already developed. Microsoft bought the company killed development of everything that wasn't Bungie and locked them into their platform for years.
>No console maker can afford to do this kind of shit anymore.
You forget that Microsoft isn't just a console maker, they tax the sale of every PC sold by making OEMs either pay for a Windows license, or protection money to prevent a lawsuit from Microsoft that somehow costs even more per unit sold. That combined with their new revenue stream from data mining and direct advertising to the Windows 10 install base gives them a nice warchest that they can still use for shenanigans like buying out popular studios and turning them into Windows 10/Xbox only developers.
>>337870320
Nobody forced third party devs to sign a contract with Nintendo. They could have just released their games on other platforms, or stick to arcades and Pachinko machines. Nobody is ever forced to do anything, they don't have a gun put to their head when they sign these contracts.
>>337862034
Claw is for faggots with no finger dexterity.
You are irrelevant
>>337870490
>Seems like in that scenario going fully third-party like Sega
I don't think Nintendo needs to follow in Sega's footsteps, not in the position they're in
>>337870883
Anything that wasn't Halo obviously. Seriously Fuck Microsoft for killing my favorite development studio and forcing them to shit out sequel after sequel while letting their other properties rot.
On a scale of 1 to quintessential British, how badly is the NX gonna bomb?
>>337871264
no way of knowing since we really don't know what it is yet, nor what the launch and year 1 games will be, nor exactly what the Neo is, nor what Microsoft's plans over the next 18 months are
>>337871264
If its a console it will fail faster than Top Gear without Clarkson.
If its a handheld it might just have a chance.
>>337870883
Again, I'm talking about the relationship between third parties publishers and console makers. Bungie is a studio not a publisher, they develop games for whoever pays them, I don't know how any of this can be considered anti competitive.
The situation is different because unlike the NES/SNES days, console makers need third party publishers more than third party publishers need them. Can you imagine what Activision would do if Sony tried to force COD into exclusivity on the grounds of denying the PS4 licensing? Activision already knows through NPD that COD has sold more PS4s than any other game even the exclusives so it's no skin off their back.
I just can't see a reason why anybody beside Nintendo fans would buy the NX unless it manages offer something that appeals to both Nintendo fans and casuals while simultaneously offering something the PS4/Xbox doesn't have. That's quite a tall order if you ask me.
I do think they can do it by delivering a hybrid console handheld device however it also needs software to back it up which needs to include third party support at bare minimum and a truly gangbuster line of first party titles.
They really have a lot to targets to hit this time around. I personally think the gamepad was a great idea and if they can take this console model and improve on it they will have a chance. A fully portable multimedia gamepad/console attachment would be the way to go, it could essentially be the gamepad on steroids with greatly improve ergonomics, battery life, screen resolution and utility, to me that alone would drive a lot of consumer interest but then you still need the software to back it up.
I am very curious to see what Nintendo will do, they do design pretty really neat console/handhelds and they all have a very distinct Nintendo-style, they've always been good in that regard, we just have to hope the actual performance is satisfactory this time around and the materials used are top notch instead of toyish feeling.
>>337862993
>when was the official announcement, anon?
March 17, 2015
>>337870490
>which they probably aren't
Games are all over the featured page of the mac app store. Apple may not be the most serious about gaming, but they definitely realize having the ability to do it on their hardware is an attractive value add for potential mac buyers. Macs already have League of Legends and Counterstrike and a ton of indie games, which is all a ton of PC gamers play anyways. I think it *could* make sense for Nintendo because Apple could pay them a lot for exclusivity, and Nintendo cares a lot about their image and wouldn't want to become just another dime a dozen third party developer making their IPs for Android/iOS and consoles. iPhones are pretty popular in Japan, so presenting themselves as a "premium" game developer for Apple's ecosystem wouldn't hurt their image too much in the case that Nintendo does actually fail so hard with the NX that they have to give up hardware and move to just making games.
>>337871632
>Again, I'm talking about the relationship between third parties publishers and console makers. Bungie is a studio not a publisher, they develop games for whoever pays them, I don't know how any of this can be considered anti competitive.
Microsoft purchased Bungie a company best known for making interesting and unique games for their competitors platforms and turned them into a studio that just cranked out a single series of fairly generic fps games for their system until all the talent left at which point they threw them away.
If you want a more recent example Microsoft purchased Mojang a company best known for the extremely multi-platform game Minecraft and has made future versions of the game Windows 10 only and disregarded the open source pledge the developers originally made.
>>337871749
Also the NX is coming out this year, I highly doubt they will miss such a golden window to reveal it during E3. My bet is they're going for a total blind/surprise reveal but then again the news about a reggie hosted treehouse event with a zelda-only presentation really dose seem like Nintendo might actually be leaving this launch window alone.
>>337870901
Back in those days Nintendo was the only viable platform for third party publishers, so they had to meet on Nintendo's terms. No publisher was forced to sign a contract with Nintendo in the same way that no slave is forced to work for their owner since there are worse options available. It's no wonder that they debanded as soon as Sony entered he field.
>>337871783
that was when they announced that they were developing it
the actual words were:
"Nintendo is currently developing a dedicated games platform with a brand new concept under the development codename NX. It is too early to elaborate on the details of this project but we hope to share more information with you next year"
>>337872104
Purchasing a game studio is not the same as forcing them to develop for you. I don't know why you have a problem with this concept.
>>337871929
Putting icons up on a store page costs them nothing. Spending billions of dollars to buy Nintendo, or hundreds of millions for some kind of exclusivity deal would be a lot of money. Like I said Apple won't invest the money in their platform to even equal the feature support or performance of drivers on Linux that are often literally worked on by kids on second hand machines they don't care about gaming enough to spend that kind of money on it.
>>337872106
>the NX is coming out this year
Nintendo has officially stated the NX isn't getting released until Spring 2017.
>>337872106
I highly doubt they will reveal it at E3, Nintendo seem to stick to their word about things like that
it does rais the question as to what the Zelda event is going to look like though - it must purely be the Wii U version
if Zelda is the ONLY thing they're displaying publicly, wouldn't it make sense to show the absolute best version of the game, as in the NX version? or is the NX version no better than the Wii U version?
>>337872471
>Nintendo has officially stated the NX isn't getting released until Spring 2017.
Yeah that could mean two things, they actually mean what they say or they are going to a surprise reveal.
>>337872510
Good point
>>337872541
>surprise reveal
Worked for Saturn, right?
>>337872471
they've been more specific - it's March 2017
what we're waiting for now is the official reveal of what it actually is
>>337872471
>>337872702
Right so thats the launch date but reveal could come at E3 still, that's what I believe anyways
They did the same kinda thing with the wiiU
>>337872691
As long as Nintendo's only keeping the public in the dark and not the retailers like Sega did, it's going to be fine.
>>337872323
Except that's what it is in literally the most forceful way. Another example would be Microsoft's hostile takeover of Rare. If you won't play ball with Microsoft's exclusivity deals they take a hostile takeover bid to your shareholders and then the studio goes Microsoft-only and starts to focus on what the new management wants.
>>337872142
Maybe not in 1983, but by 85 the Master System was made, and had a generous amount of games on it. I would hardly say it wasn't a viable system. They just wanted to make shitton of money, so many of them opted with Nintendo. Also, there's a big big big difference between a slave and corporations making billions of dollars, a canyon of difference. A slave would literally be shot dead if they ran way from their owner, a corporation finds other ventures to make money from.
And many could. Capcom was releasing games on arcades, Konami did the same, and had Pachinko. Others probably had many options made available to them. To compare them to slaves is a bit laughable, and to pity them even more so. Especially when they were content to release shitty clones for eternity on Atari.
>>337872541
do you mean they're going to reveal it in 2016, or are actually going to commercially release it for purchase to the general public in 2016?
because it's almost guaranteed to be revealed this year
>>337872463
Performance is not the biggest deal. Nintendo managed to sell boatloads of Wiis and DS's despite not being very powerful compared to the competition. Macs and iDevices are at the point where they're good enough to handle the level of graphical detail that Nintendo uses on their games. I don't think this is a very realistic situation either, but this is just a hypothetical discussion. And Apple has a ton of money, they definitely have the resources to get Nintendo to start making Mariokart for iPads and stuff IF the NX is a huge flop and Nintendo is forced to leave the console market.
>>337872931
The CEO said they were going with 2017 to make sure the software is ready. I'll take him at his word when he's speaking directly to investors.
>>337872953
I honestly didn't take that into account, I falsely assumed a launch and reveal would on the same day. xD
>>337873224
>xD
here's your (You)
>>337872946
It's a fact that third party publishers did not like working with Nintendo. This shit is well documented.
Third party publishers weren't huge corporations with billions of dollars back then. Konami had 20 employees during the NES era. The entire Capcom could fit into a single office. To think that they could meet with Nintendo on equal terms back then is what's laughable.
>>337872849
>They did the same kinda thing with the wiiU
not really
they announced a few months before E3 2011 that playable versions of the Wii successor would be at the show
they then said that the final specs and most launch software would be shown at E3 2012...which is what happened
>>337872932
No it isn't. I'm literally baffled at you not being able to understand this. Buying a studio means offering compensation for making exclusive games. It's not bribing or forcing anyone.
>>337857340
>Sony shitposting squad at it again with their ten thousand years old pasta
Can you at least put SOME effort into your shitposts? Having the catalog filled with your copy pasted anti Nintendo propaganda is getting really fucking tiring. Well, at least you changed the image this time, +1 point to you for that.
Downvoted.
>>337857340
They need to stop treating kids like retards. Kids can handle complex shit. There's no need to dumb down the experiences.
I've already committed to not buying it, Nintendo has spat in my face too many times. I bet it'll even have Splatoon, thus making the WiiU completely worthless.
>>337873121
I don't know how this conversation started but Apple has nothing to gain by buying Nintendo. Nintendo is already developing iOS games.
>>337873380
Yeah, I know they didn't like working with Nintendo, I'm not denying that. I'm just saying I don't feel sorry for them.
Capcom may have not been as big as Nintendo, but it had an international arcade hit in the form of 1942 at the time. Not to mention having arcade games like Ghosts and Goblins already made.
With Konami you've got a point, they were pretty shitty at first. Capcom though, they had some very good titles already created. I'm sure they could have easily ported Ghosts and Goblins over to the Master System, and it's not like they would care about quality, given the shitty ports to the NES.
>>337874194
>Apple has nothing to gain by buying Nintendo.
Except that high quality exclusives would lure tons of people into buying iDevices over Android.
>>337874532
I don't think you understand how unconcerned Apple is about any kind of app not being exclusive to iOS.
Seriously, so Mario helped Nintendo sell 50 million 3ds in five years? Nigga that's cute but 50 million is how many iPhones Apple sells in a BAD quarter. Without Mario or Pokemon. They couldn't care less.
>>337874507
This is not about feeling sorry, this is about Nintendo pulling shit to undermine competition back then, stuff that nobody can pull anymore. There are people here that are somehow equating the purchase of game studios or entering exclusive agreements to forcing exclusivity by denying licensing which is what Nintendo did back then. It's nowhere near the same situation.
>>337863536
man, the xbone controller looks super comfy, the sticks should be placed like that in all the controllers
>>337861458
dual screen wasn't a gimmick
it was an elegant solution to displaying information without cramming the primary screen
>>337861458
Wii actually had a lot of unique games that bothered with the wiimote. The best part about its library is the railgun shooters that don't require you to buy an expensive guncon.
>>337876719
The stylus was the actual gimmick. The second screen is great for quick menuing or maps or basically anything secondary. When they forced its use is when the problems arose.
