How do we fix poise?
why fix something that ain't broken?
we dont, there are several ways to hyperarmor and iron flesh exists
also the people complaining are mad that they get staggered on the windup of their attack animations, niggers dont even get into the full animation and they wonder why they dont get their hyperarmor, its so stupid, fuck anyone who complains about poise, thinking you know more than the fuckers who made the damn game
Change the 0 to a 1
>>336920186
>why fix something that ain't broken?
>>336920209
>we dont, there are several ways to hyperarmor and iron flesh exists
>It's literally turned off in the files.
>"No it works fine"
Poise isn't hyper armour, you fucking retard.
Who needs poise with hyper armor up the ass
>>336920019
Hyper armor is better than poise, it's weapon specific and requires some timing.
What should be fixed is how some equipment and weapons are balanced around giving poise. That's just fucking lazy From.
>>336920019
poiseEnabled=1;
Why use heavy armor if poise doesn't exist?
>>336920450
Damage reduction for when you use hyper armor.
>>336920450
Damage absorbtion
>>336920019
by fixing hyperarmor
>Being stunlocked by an estoc is fine guys, just use an easily parryable great weapon for those hyperarmor frames
How fucking stupid can you retards be?
>>336920019
>How do we fix poise?
They already fixed it by removing it from the game.
Stay mad you chaos zwei wielding giantdad faggot.
>>336920315
yes it is you dumb motherfucker hyperarmor works through poise now thats the whole fucking point of poise now and all these dumb cunts wondering where it went holy shit you are retarded just kill yourself
>>336920450
"Fashion."
>>336920539
>>336920546
Try dodging.
>>336920562
you can't parry heavy weapons when 2 handed
>>336920562
What's preventing you from using a fast weapon or parrying yourself?
>>336920539
>20% with leather
>33% with Havel's
Why use heavy armour?
>>336920585
Uh no, swapping poise for hyper armor targets people with heavy armor and a fast spammy weapon. That's why it's a good change.
>>336920602
No it isn't you fucking autistic retard.
Poise is LITERALLY turned off in the fucking game files.
FUCKING
KILL
YOURSELF
>>336920682
Some people don't want to use the same godamn weapon every time. Maybe running around with heavy armour and a giant-ass club would befun
Add negative poise to weapons, which increases in magnitude with the speed of the weapon, ie.
>Dark Sword gets -20 pose
>FUGS gets -0 poise
>>336920638
You realize I was just answering his question right?
Why does anyone care about poise when you can just dodge
>>336920664
You can't parry some, not all. For example a UGS's two handed vertical swings can be parried.
>>336920682
Maybe he'd like some weapon variety in pvp.
This is such a retard's argument.
>>336920019
There was nothing wrong with poise in dark souls 1. The real culprit was Havel ring + dwgr turning giantdad into a speed demon.
>>336920782
>some people want to gimp themselves
That's your choice.
>>336920684
Because 33% is more than 20%
When you are trading, that makes a difference
We don't, no poise means easy parries during invasions.
>>336920964
You don't think that a lack of viable weapon variety affects replayability?
Honestly if you fags think poise being turned on will make 1v3 easier you are out of your mind.
>>336920525
>>336920539
You're better off rolling in most situations, the use of damage reduction in trading is very much a niche and is hardly worth it
Drop hyperarmor entirely.
Make poise equipment have a strength requirement.
Bam, fixed all issues.
>>336920602
lolwut
Hyperarmor =/= poise.
>>336920729
If they're using the same engine, or course they are going to turn the old poise system off.
>>336921190
pls someone needs to email this to miyazaki and fast pls
>>336920964
The point is to make other weapons viable. Having only one or two good weapons makes the game lose its appeal very quickly. If From did it right, you could use any type of weapon and still do well with the right skills and build.
>>336921002
>trading
PVP shitters are cancer
>>336920905
>>336921065
There's always going to be weapons and spells that are better than others.
In DaS we had ninja flipping giantdads wielding chaos zweihanders thanks to poise stacking.
There's more variety in PvP nowdays without poise.
The Estoc isn't even the most OP thing in PvP. How about fixing Fire Surge spam first?
>>336921161
>You're better off rolling in most situations, the use of damage reduction in trading is very much a niche and is hardly worth it
Not really, the time it takes to roll and swing your big ass weapon gives them plenty of time to recover and dodge your attack. Using hyper armor is the way to use heavy weapons.
>>336921253
>If they're using the same engine, or course they are going to turn the old poise system off.
Then why all the references to poise on new equipment? It makes no difference to the hyper armor system.
Ditch the poise system entirely. Stagger should only be linked to weapons, not armor.
Light weapons should require 3-4 hits to stagger, heavy ones should only need 1.
>>336921358
>There's always going to be weapons and spells that are better than others.
They spent some time patching and rebalancing stuff in Das2 and the build variety is significantly better as a result.
>>336920602
>hyperarmor works through poise now
You don't know what you're talking about, do you? You're right in saying that hyper armor and poise are related, but the point at which hyper armor for all weapons that can get hyper armor is enabled is at 0.2 poise.
ZERO POINT TWO
ZERO POINT TWO
ZERO POINT TWO POISE
Meaning as long as you're wearing literally anything you get hyper armor.
Wolf Ring literally does not do anything. Yhorm's Greatshield's 45 poise passive is useless. The only described "poise" that actually works in the game is in fact hyper armor, that you get while performing certain weapon arts like stomp or unfaltering prayer, or some weapons having hyper armor by default.
Even if the devs at some point decided to make a poiseless game like DeS again, it doesn't change the fact that there's clearly leftover items and character menu parts that increase a visible poise stat, which is described to increase knockback resistance, but does nothing. The game files literally have a switch that says poise is disabled.
>>336921358
More variety? Don't make me fucking laugh. Literally every single invader I've seen has been using either a straight sword or the estoc. At least in DaS1 and 2 people had different weapons. I'd rather fight a few flipping havels mixed in with other builds than 10,000 estoc users in a row.
>>336920209
>HURF DURF, HYPER ARMOR EXISTS, GIT GUD FAGGOT
I could see the defense of Hyper Armor if this was a fighting game like Street Fighter, and actually had good net code
The problem is that this isn't a fighting game and the netcode is fucking garbage, so Hyper Armor is fucking retarded.
>>336920562
You do realize that many weapons in the game have unparryable moves, right? Like, specifically talking in reference to great weapons, there are many moves on many weapons that cannot be parried: https://www.reddit.com/r/darksouls3/comments/4hrzmy/guide_to_parryable_and_unparryable_weapons/
This doesn't even cover the fact that there are many ways of mixing up your timing, spacing/movement, and use of even parryable attacks to throw off parry spammers.
So, not only are you wrong that the great weapons are "easily parryable," but you need to understand great weapons have far better hitboxes than most straight swords and thrusting swords even in spite of their "phantom range" (defined as hitboxes not matching up with the weapons model). In trading situations with Hyperarmor this makes great weapons completely viable. You're just not very good at the game.
>>336920684
Whats the difference between 500 damage and 300 damage? A few extra hits.
>>336921663
>Literally every single invader I've seen has been using either a straight sword or the estoc.
Every BAD invader uses a straight sword or estoc, heavy weapons shit all over them by consistently getting better trades through hyper armor.
>>336921796
>A few extra hits.
Which is a big deal if your weapon is designed around trading hits.
>>336921796
>>336922065
Wait, you were saying it's a good thing, misread that my bad.
>>336921796
Not good for long term survivability. I'm talking about a PVE scenario. If I keep taking hits from every enemy through hyper armour, but still taking 67% damage, I'm gonna burn all my estus before I get halfway to the boss, so I may as well go light armour and roll everything, still getting over 20% reductions.
But I want heavy armour to be viable.
>>336922336
The thing is kind of have to know the enemy to know which hits to trade. It makes a blind first time run with a heavy shit, but if it's your second it's a lot of fun.
>>336920186
ehehehehehehehehehehehehehehh
>>336921802
nah, your swings are so ass slow I can just roll through it and backstab you every single time
>>336922529
Why ever trade in the first place? just fucking roll like jesus christ stop trading hits and just attack when they aren't!
>>336920019
>reddit Cries for poise
>4chan cries for poise
You know that poise WON'T help hammers / great swords right
it will instead make people wear Havel + Estoc and guess what in the time you hit him once with your greatsword he already hit you 3-4 times. because he won't flinch in his full havel
>>336923208
>put in the poise system
>poise in the game literally does nothing
>people don't actually know this so they're doing hyper poise builds that literally do nothing
>HURR THEY KNOW BETTER SHUT UP
>>336920019 (OP)
You don't.
You accept that you're a fucking consumer, not a professional gamedev and accept that they actually fucking know better than you.
Eat shit poisetards. Poise fucking wrecked DaS1. If you wanna poisetank shit like a brainless retard, go play that.
>>336923286
People are astoundingly narrow minded, entitled and stupid anon. Forget how the current hyper armor meta actually allows for effective punishing of light weapon R1 mashing.
>>336922880
Oh you're going to roll while you're in mid-swing? I don't think you quite understand how trading with hyper armor works.
>>336923503
I'm rolling when you make an attempt to swing because your animation is so fucking low and my fast roll puts me right behind you I can get a back stab off your slow as autism swings because you magically think you're getting more damage when you aren't
>>336923396
>Put in the poise system
>Realize it's insanely imbalanced
>Disable it and focus on a hyperarmor system
Yes. This is what Fromsoft did. It was a smart choice.
>people don't actually know
Ignorant retards who try to stack poise despite it being demonstrably disabled deserve to have their time wasted. Takes two seconds playing as a Knight to realize that poise doesn't work. Or a google search.
>>336923423
>You accept that you're a fucking consumer, not a professional gamedev and accept that they actually fucking know better than you.
I can tell from the way you talk that you have no idea how game development works. Game devs aren't some kind of jack of all trades who are masters at the craft at making games. The people who make design decisions usually aren't even artists or programmers, they're just directors who have played a shitload of games and are familiar with the process.
Game devs aren't infallible, either. They are real human beans capable of making decisions that are less than the best.
>>336923639
>>Realize it's insanely imbalanced
it actually doesn't work at all, the stat is there and it literally does nothing.
The only things that have poise are NPC's
>ignorant retards
FROM hasn't made a statement about how Poise is literally unusuable, there are people who haven't looked online to see the one reddit thread about how Poise physically does nothing at all and its a place holder. So unless they looked and found the Datamined thread, they'll never know.
Its not their ignorance, From put in a stat that doesn't work and everything would be fine if they removed the stat entirely so people couldn't see that their huge Vit stats don't give them extra poise
>>336923716
>I can tell from the way you talk that you have no idea how game development works.
I can tell from the first chunk of your post that you're incredibly dumb and wrong.
>The people who make design decisions usually aren't even artists or programmers, they're just directors who have played a shitload of games and are familiar with the process.
They're professionals. Not whiny consumers.
>Game devs aren't infallible, either.
Much less fallible than random assholes whining on the internet.
>>336923423
>nuh-uh you're not allowed to criticize game devs' decisions because it hurts my fanboy feelings
Let me give you a hint; leaving descriptions of poise, visible poise stat in the character and armor screens, items like Wolf Ring and Yhorm's Greatshield's passive effect in the game when poise doesn't actually exist isn't something your perfect professional game dev would do.
Either poise is accidentally disabled due to From's incompetence, or they knowingly disabled it, but didn't change or remove poise stat and items that literally only exist to increase poise stat from the game, which messages another type of incompetence.
>>336923626
Damn anon, you need to start a youtube channel. You'll get mad views because no one else can do that against players that know what they're doing with heavy weapons.
>>336923873
>Much less fallible than random assholes whining on the internet.
oh because them having a stat that simply does nothing, its pretty much a placebo at this point is totally infallible right?
If they removed the stat from view and from the game then no one would know or have ever found out, but because Poise is advertised as a stat when leveling up, people don't know it does jack shit.
>>336923870
>it actually doesn't work at all, the stat is there and it literally does nothing.
Because they realized it was imbalanced and disabled it. Moron.
>FROM hasn't made a statement about how Poise is literally unusuable, there are people who haven't looked online to see the one reddit thread about how Poise physically does nothing at all and its a place holder
If you're dumb enough to find a stat that doesn't quite work right and then not do any research on it, you deserve what comes to you.
>>336923930
Nobody is defending them leaving all those poise items in the game. Only their removal of poise as a game balance choice.
>>336924052
>Because they realized it was imbalanced and disabled it. Moron.
They didn't remove it from the stat sheet or level up stat table. Which means people see the little blue indicator that "this stat gets better" and they think they're benefiting when they aren't and never have been.
if From was competent they would have removed it from view so that people didn't get confused. Not just arbitrarily disabled it and told no one about it.
There isn't anything wrong with "useless" stats or deliberately poor balance. Finding out what's good and what isn't is an integral part of any game.
>>336921585
>>Poise has to be unintentional, because the Wolf Ring/Yhorm's shield make no sense otherwise.
>He's talking about a Souls game. A franchise literally chock-full with reused assets that don't care about making sense.
>Painted - test level - world, Andre - mouth-animations - the blacksmith, literally the entire re-written story of Dark Souls 2>Poise has to be unintentional, because the Wolf.
Poise is exactly what the wanted it to be. Just accept it already. They didn't give a shit about armor this time around, as evident by the lack of upgrades for it.
>>336923873
>They're professionals. Not whiny consumers.
Professional = you get paid for doing it. Professionals can still be incompetent, and mistakes can still be made when you're dealing with a large team of people.
>>336924052
>If you're dumb enough to find a stat that doesn't quite work right and then not do any research on it, you deserve what comes to you.
>its the user's fault that From made a stat do nothing and its your fault for not just researching a stat before using it
thats completely out of the water.
You wouldn't know poise didn't work unless you googled it
>>336920019
Leave it out because it's garbage and would ruin the game by benefitting fast weapons even more
>>336924228
By that logic they clearly did not give a shit about anything but straight sword users in light armor and we should defend this and embrace it, and be happy that From is only giving us one viable way to play.
>m-muh no poise
i bet you guys who want poise are all estoc / dark sword R1 spammers who want to wear full fucking havel or smough so you can tank 1 hit from ugs and meanwhile plant five hits on your opponent
for PVE poise would be fine but for PVP it would make it even more shit than it already is this is probably what the devs realized and that's why they turned it off
>>336920682
My strength build you autist
>>336924228
>poise has to be unintentional
Literally nobody said this.
>>336921585
So does this mean that literally the only use for the wolf ring is to get hyper armor while nude / full dragon?
>>336924572
Wolf ring does nothing
It's a placebo false advertised by a Stat that doesn't work
>>336924508
>by that logic
>makes up some complete bullshit that has nothing to do with the applied logic
>wat?
Noone said you should defend it, idiot. The point is that they're not going to fix it, and that makes it moot to whine about this shit.
>>336924228
> They didn't give a shit about armor this time around, as evident by the lack of upgrades for it.
Bu this doesn't make sense, if you disable poise at least make me upgrade my fucking armor so that stacking high weight equipment is not completely worthless.
>>336920019
It's not about fixing poise, it's about fixing rolling. If you can make it so that no matter what you do or how many rings you have you cannot fast roll and flip around in plate mail, then you can make it so heavy armour has all the poise in the world because the trade off is movement.
As is though most people minmax is their armor so they can still roll quickly while having high defenses, that's why havels are such a joke because even though you have slabs of fucking stone strapped to you you're ninja flipping with the best of them, and have all the defense too.
>>336924731
Well, it was said that armor is bad because From "didn't give a shit about it". But magic, most heavy weapons, almost all dex weapons, every split damage weapon, etc are all terrible, so what DID From even give a shit about?
>>336924052
>If you're dumb enough to find a stat that doesn't quite work right and then not do any research on it, you deserve what comes to you.
>Nobody is defending them leaving all those poise items in the game. Only their removal of poise as a game balance choice.
I don't follow. If you are trying to blame the users for thinking a stat may do something is that not in effect a defense of From's removal of it?
>>336924195
>They didn't remove it from the stat sheet or level up stat table. Which means people see the little blue indicator that "this stat gets better" and they think they're benefiting when they aren't and never have been.
The effects of poise should be immediately visible in practice. Just because the numbers on the stat screen exist does not justify being an ignorant shitter. If you stack poise but you can't posietank hits, poise isn't working.
>>336924241
>Professional = you get paid for doing it.
That's correct.
>Professionals can still be incompetent, and mistakes can still be made when you're dealing with a large team of people.
They're still 100% more reliable than random whiny shitters on the internet anon. They make games every day, for a living. People here are just whiny entitled shiteaters.
>>336924283
> researching a stat before using it
You don't have to research it before using it and it doesn't even take a stat investment. You're a moron and I get the impression you're speaking in defense of poor choices you made.
When you first try to stack poise and get no results, that should be your warning sign. Everything after that is your fault.
>>336924515
Estoc / Dark sword spam wouldn't even be so big of a problem if there was poise, since they wouldn't stun lock the shit out of you. Also fist weapons are pretty much useless without poise because of their short range and so are slow hyperarmorless weapons, such as scythes and whips.
>>336920209
>About to attack
>forget I am barefoot and step on a pebble
>jump in pain for 5 years before I can attack again
>Enemies turns into the Hulk
>fair
>>336924817
But wouldn't highly upgraded havels vs highly upgraded robes have the same ratio as the un-upgraded versions?
Genuine question, never put a lot of thought into upgrading armor, it was just something you did.
>>336924869
It means armor is largely worthless now because the armor has no resistance to stagger. Anything and everything staggers you, daggers stagger the heaviest armor in the game. This is purely and only because Poise is broken atm
It means attempting to use greatswords is heavily nerfed because you don't have the poise and you can't deliver the poise damage. This is why R1 straight sword spammers exist because they do way more DPS than a greatsword.
It means light armor with straight swords are always superior to greatswords with heavy armor.
>>336924228
What the fuck are you even trying to argue here? The excuse that because the previous games were not perfect either and had their share of shortcomings doesn't magically absolve From Software of the mistakes they made with their newest game.
Even if we assume that From Software knowingly disabled poise (which could very well be the case), it doesn't change the fact that in their incompetence or outright laziness they left items that increase a visible stat with descriptions of its effect, but that literally does not do anything. What exactly are you trying to defend here?
>>336924995
>They're still 100% more reliable than random whiny shitters on the internet anon. They make games every day, for a living. People here are just whiny entitled shiteaters.
Yes, of course. That's why professional game developers never make balance changes or other fixes after releasing their games, often based on user feedback. You're completely right about that. It's not like both Dark Souls 1 or 2, or even 3 has received post-release patches.
>>336924896
>a defense of From's removal of it
*Rather, defending them leaving the visible stat in
>>336925067
Good question, maybe higher the weight, higher the gain per level?
>>336924896
>If you are trying to blame the users for thinking a stat may do something
I'm not blaming them for thinking it might do something. I'm blaming them for not realizing that it doesn't do anything once they've tried to use it.
> is that not in effect a defense of From's removal of it?
No it's not, but I absolutely am a defender of the current state of affairs. Poise has ALWAYS been a huge load of bullshit that encourage clownsuits and minmax shitter builds. People want poise back in DaS3 because they think it would change the problems we have with the metagame. It would not. It would only further emphasize them.
Anyone got an idea why as a Darkmoon Blade, I helped someone kill 3 invaders and got zero concord kept. Actually quite annoyed by that.
>game has 4 stats
>game has 1 build
>game has 2 viable strategies, parry fishing and R1 hit confirm into a 100-0 combo
Worst Souls game yet
>>336924995
>The effects of poise should be immediately visible in practice.
They're going to default to "jeez maybe my poise isn't high enough" then proceed to dump a lot of souls and time into buffing out their vit and end to get their poise higher and higher and its not going to work. They'll make a bad character and they're going to be sadly disappointed.
You're literally defending a stat that doesn't work as advertised.
You're a fucking shill.
>You don't have to research it, you'll just know
>but you're ignorant for not knowing it didn't work at all
you're a fucking shill and this confirms it.
>>336925016
Yeah estoc does 90% of your damage while you do 20% with 1 great sword swing
nice balance
>>336925016
>Estoc / Dark sword spam wouldn't even be so big of a problem if there was poise
It would be worse because they could stunlock you while stacking their own poise.
Stop being an ignorant shitter and learn timing, spacing and hyperarmor. I dumptruck Darksword shitters all day with my shitty little Executioner GS.
>invest 30 points into faith or int to get a weapon buff
>apply it
>do 30 bonus damage per hit
>less than a fucking resin
WHAT'S THE POINT
>>336925285
Whats also funny is your Estoc staggers as often as the greatsword every time
>>336925067
>>336925184
Well as you upgrade your weapons the armor is going to be less effective.
>>336924995
>entitled
honestly i wish everyone that even THOUGHT about saying the word unironically got a death sentence
its such a lame fucking thing to say
oh, whats that? you have legitimate criticism about this product that you gave your hard earned money for? well you're just entitled :^)))))))
fucking kill yourself retard
>>336924817
It's not completely worthless. You still get higher damage absorption and resistances.
>b-b-but, anon, i can't stand there like tanking hits like idgaf anymore
Who's to say that they cared to let you do that?
>>336925129
>It's not like both Dark Souls 1 or 2, or even 3 has received post-release patches.
You're not even making a rational argument anon. Just because devs can make mistakes doesn't mean legions of vocal morons on the internet are in the right.
>>336925303
>It would be worse because they could stunlock you while stacking their own poise.
No it'd be the opposite, every time a dark sword swings it staggers because there is no poise.
With poise actually working, a dark sword doesn't have the poise damage to break your poise and you can get your super high alpha swings out.
>>336925342
Armor has % absorbtion now though.
>>336925231
pretty sure you only get concord kept if you kill all the invaders in host's world. there might've been a new invader just as you died, if you did die.
>>336925382
>You still get higher damage absorption and resistances.
which is associated with DEFENSE, which has jack fucking shit to do with poise
>>b-b-but, anon, i can't stand there like tanking hits like idgaf anymore
thats the entire point of poise, its what makes builds revolving around heavy, slow weapons viable and its the literal only benefit of wearing heavy armor in DaS3 because defense is also retarded in this game
>>336925435
>With poise actually working, a dark sword doesn't have the poise damage to break your poise and you can get your super high alpha swings out.
YOU CAN ALREADY DO THIS. ALL YOU ARE ASKING FOR IS DARK SWORDS WHO HAVE POISE. HYPER ARMOR IS YOURT ANSWER YOU IGNORANT SHITTER.
>>336925243
>proceed to dump a lot of souls and time into buffing out their vit and end to get their poise higher and higher and its not going to work
Oh so the added defensive properties of their armor of choice don't work? It's not going to provide a damage reduction? That damage reduction isn't going to work in concert with skillful use of hyperarmor to make you come out on top when trading blows?
>>336925524
That would explain it then. The host died to an enemy literally seconds after a new invader. Thanks.
I have a real question. I've heard people say to punish r1 spammers with a parry, and sometimes I do. Like I use to run up and parry their asses like crazy, that was using a target shield.
I switched to the ceastus because people told me its a 100% guaranteed parry on their 3rd hit where you're able to move again after the second hit
Ive tried it multiple times and it never works. Its gotten me so fucked up to the point I'm scared of parrying ever now.
Is this due to connection or something or was i just lied to
>>336920220
/thread
>>336925189
>I'm not blaming them for thinking it might do something. I'm blaming them for not realizing that it doesn't do anything once they've tried to use it.
Ah, then are you arguing that, to a degree, neither party is blameless? I suppose that's fair enough, normally people would notice when a build doesn't do anything and since poise is armor based rather than stat based (for the most part) you don't have to "build into it". In that way a player isn't particularly at a loss for attempting to use poise since they can switch out of it freely
>>336920019
Enable it and have poise breaking be dependent on the weapon you're using in addition to the armor your opponent is wearing. If you're using something like an Estoc or a straight sword and wearing Havels, you'll do little/no poise damage to your opponent and anyone with a heavy weapon will still smash you and interrupt your faggy R1 spam.
>>336922982
Because you can never count on not getting phantom hit in pvp. Hitboxes are very random due to netcode.
>>336925425
If you didn't yet notice, your own argument is literally
>you're not a game developer, therefore all your criticism concerning the game is invalid ;^)
You aren't even trying to argue back against people bringing valid reasons why poise in Dark Souls 3 doesn't work as intended, or works as intended, but the game has tons of leftover data strongly implying otherwise. If you played DaS1 on its release I bet you you were the first people to defend unnerfed Fog and Ninja rings. Because player's are just uneducated masses, right?
>>336925129
What on earth makes you think I'm defending anything here?
DS3 is such an obvious amagmation of fanservice, it actually blows my mind how you would assume that the addition of a useless Wolf Ring, for one, is anything but.
>doesn't magically absolve From Software
Lol, like they give a shit.
>>336926026
>If you didn't yet notice, your own argument is
I know what my argument is. My argument is that a bunch of ignorant little shitters who can't think the situation through are whining and moaning from a place of ignorance. They're too stupid to even understand the poise situation, but they don't care. They just want their stupid braindead gamebreaking mechanic back.
>>336925665
>YOU CAN ALREADY DO THIS. ALL YOU ARE ASKING FOR IS DARK SWORDS WHO HAVE POISE. HYPER ARMOR IS YOURT ANSWER YOU IGNORANT SHITTER.
You're an idiot
Without poise, R1 sword spammers get the same benefit of a greatsword because there is no poise. This means darkswords do way more damage than any greatsword ever will and greatswords are literally inferior because they don't have poise damage.
People with heavy armor should not fucking stagger to a dagger, people with light armor should ALWAYS stagger to a great sword. None of this happens because light or heavy armor gets staggered by both daggers and great hammers equally.
>Oh so the added defensive properties of their armor of choice don't work? It's not going to provide a damage reduction? That damage reduction isn't going to work in concert with skillful use of hyperarmor to make you come out on top when trading blows?
None of this shit has to do with poise. People used to make huge poise builds so that their attacks would never get interrupted so they could swing without getting just smacked and negated
>>336925787
>Ah, then are you arguing that, to a degree, neither party is blameless?
Sure. I'm not gonna sit here and say that it's okay that they removed a stats but left items that govern that stat in the game. Though, I do feel this is evidence that the poise removal was likely a very last minute thing. I bet it happened in March or February and they couldn't cut the content or edit the item descriptions.
> In that way a player isn't particularly at a loss for attempting to use poise since they can switch out of it freely
That's been my mindset. Sucks if you stacked a bunch of VIT though. But it's not like Rosaria can't help with that.
>>336925665
>No! they should just know that putting stats in and if something doesn't work then they should know it automatically doesn't work and stop doing that
>they should just know!
>its not froms fault for making a stat not work but not removing it from view so people don't get confused
>>336926361
>I don't know what hyper armor is
>I'm going to keep complaining anyways without understanding what's being said
Just stop. You're making an ass of yourself
Poise and the rest of the shit in this game can be fixed once FROM actually learns from their past missteps.
Why were so fucking many of the quality-of-life changes that DSII made completely ignored? When you break down the PvP, it's way less balanced and varied than DSII. That game had its broken metas and OP builds, yes, but most of the other weapons in the game were still very much viable. You could win with almost anything you wanted against decent players so long as you were skilled enough. This is extremely hard to do in DSIII with the fucking Bloodborne-level rolling and i-frames that trivialize 80% of the game's spells and weapons in PvP.
In the end, it just pisses me off that they ignored so fucking much from DSII. The only improvement DSIII has over II is the level design, which I understand and agree is a huge plus. Still, it's frustrating to think about what we could have had if FROM just actually assessed and applied more of what they did well with DSII (and there were a LOT of things).
For everything DSIII does well, it makes just as many, if not more, baffling steps backwards from the things they got right in DSII. I think it's just Miyazaki valuing his own creative direction over a careful analysis of how the game's mechanics would actually clash with one another. I don't know how anyone in charge of balancing player vs player interaction could look at some of the fucking movesets in this game and say that they're viable for hitting other players with how insane the rolling is.
So UGS can't be parried when 2 handed, but what about GS? I used the Claymore for a while and it felt really underwhelming in this game.
>>336926627
>it doesn't matter how broken a stat is because hyper armor exists!
>>336925635
I'd even go as far as to say that's part of the reason why they abandoned the Souls series. There's no gameplay in a metal blob tanking hits like they're standing in a magically impenetrable bubble. It's missed by some fans of the franchise, sure, but that doesn't mean it's how From wants people to play their game.
>>336926837
>So UGS can't be parried when 2 handed
Some UGS attacks can't be parried while 2-handed, not all.
>>336926095
>Lol, like they give a shit.
They certainly do seem to give a shit (at least to some extent), as evidenced by post-release patching of their previous games. There was shittons of unbalanced and outright broken shit in DeS, DaS1 and DaS2 releases, which got addressed after people voiced their opinions enough.
>>336926231
>They're too stupid to even understand the poise situation, but they don't care.
Do YOU understand the poise situation? You still haven't addressed why there's leftover data in the game itself outright telling how poise works and which items increase it, items that exist for the sole purpose of increasing poise, but poise doesn't actually exist in the game. How is that type of shit is even remotely acceptable? All you've done so far is dallying around the core argument of your opposition and saying
>na-na-na can't hear you, you're not a game developer therefore you can't criticize ;^)
>developers admitting balance issues and fixing them in their previous games after people complaining about them enough doesn't count either btw :D, the developers are right because I like them
Are you by chance underage?
>because poise is broken and falsely advertised in game a dagger will stagger you the same as an ultra greatsword regardless of what armor you're wearing
>people will defend this vehemently
>>336925382
>You still get higher damage absorption and resistances.
Which, as you can clearly see by the meta, it is completely worthless compared to light armors' defenses.
So if you want poise to be turned off at least give me some fucking reasons to go full havel without being disadvantaged 99% of the times.
>>336927448
This
There wouldn't be an issue if they disabled poise, removed the stat from view and removed the rings that give better poise. Then give heavy armor a serious reason to be used.
>>336927086
>They certainly do seem to give a shit (at least to some extent)
We're talking about adding proper poise values to every single piece of armor in the game, and to, at least decently, test them to make for a fair, balanced experience without having people run around who are literally unfazed by anything you throw at them while one-shotting everything in their path. Yea, anon, I don't think they care to that extent.
The diminishing returns for absorbtion kick in too quickly. Especially when it comes to PvE, 30% isn't good enough to bother trading with during long sections of mobs or bosses. Which leaves poking and rolling the best way to use heavy weapons in most circumstances, which is just tedious when you're fighting a boss with shorter recoveries than your attack speed. It means you're dodging for a while waiting for that one combo ender that you can safely punish.
And don't bother saying it's fine because rolling requires more skill, the i-frames for rolling are ridiculously forgiving.
>>336920019
Just make it like DaS2, just a little buffed, enough to survive rapiers and straight swords, not enough to survive a claymore hit. Boom, fixed.
>You wouldn't know poise didn't work unless you googled it
Nigga what, probably the first thing people noticed
>Start as a knight, cool 20 poise or something
>Noticed that everything fucking stuns and staggers me
You don't need google for that and to be honest the poise system was the first thing I tested in the game when I got it.
>>336927990
>mfw fatrolled throught the game with my tarkus built just fine
the frames are so good, so fucking good.
Also UGS weapons are baller in this one, the nameless bitch died in less than 2 minutes thanks to based staggering, riposte and hornet ring.
Is everyone just a shitter at this game? I'm using big weapons only and I'll only get stunlocked when I fuck up and get ganked by two guys at once.
Not even a real fighting game m8s
>>336920539
It was like this in Demon's Souls, there was literally no reason to use heavy armour.
>>336928947
>Is everyone just a shitter at this game? I'm using big weapons only and I'll only get stunlocked when I fuck up and get ganked by two guys at once.
No, the conversation was about the laziness of removing poise but leaving in equipment that are designed around it. Like Yhorm's shield and the wolf ring.
By turning it on
>>336920186
lel
>>336920019
by changing how poise works completely.
if you make it work like it used to. it would only make the light vs heavy situation even worse and a person with a light weapon stacked with pose would still come out on top.
it also pretty much rewards sloppy play and attack spamming over proper spacing and timed attacks. And also make it super easy to just take a hit and force yourself into a backstab
Now, i'm not going to say that this will 100% be the correct answer but WHAT IF instead poise was a value that reduces damage taken while in attack animations? but then there's a question of counter damage from thrust weapons and the leo ring and if that would hurt that.
>>336921190
>Half the weapons in the game are garbage again.
No thanks "ideaa guy."
>>336920019
Remove it from the info sheet and revise Wolf Ring to do something else.
>>336921190
>STR requirement
Stupid. This might work if it were VIT, though.
>>336926892
Disabled isn't the same as broken you dumbshit.
>>336927086
>Do YOU understand the poise situation?
It was in the game. They decided it was imbalanced, so they disabled it. This decision must have come too late to cut all that content.
>How is that type of shit is even remotely acceptable?
Poise was cancer in DaS1 and it took them a year to balance it for DaS2. I don't mind it being gone because hyperarmor works better in more than one way.
>Are you by chance underage?
Are you? You're failing at basic self awareness and common sense.
>>336930249
Something to this effect, poise can no longer effect flinch.
At the end of the day the idea was to make you choose between fast roll and poise, but it just turned into stack poise as high as possible with fastest roll.
>>336923943
it's easy to spot become no one with a clue uses heavy weapons
shitters gonna shit
>>336930650
>This decision must have come too late to cut all that content.
That's the complaint retard
>guys, poise was a completely broken mechanic anyways, it's not like From Software could actually try to make the effort in order to improve it, no, don't mind the items that exist for the sole purpose of increasing poise or character stats detailing its use, leaving them in the game was completely intentional
Do you retards not realize that this isn't a black and white issue?
People wanting poise back, especially since the game itself says it exists when it doesn't, does not necessarily mean we want it in the same broken form it was in Dark Souls 1. What we are proposing, is that the developers actually put in the effort of balancing and improving the system in question instead of cheaply pretending it exists when it's actually disabled.
If I may be presumptuous, I actually think Dark Souls 2 was better than either DaS1 or DaS3 in its handling of poise, clearly even detailing how much poise damage different weapons inflicted, and there being specialist weapons like small maces and hammers that were better at breaking enemy poise, or the ring that did the same. It added a layer of gameplay and build depth. Removing poise altogether is just lazily removing a game mechanic which could be improved. It's like Bethesda completely removing spell creation in Skyrim because it was overpowered in Oblivion, rather than fixing it.
>>336920019
Fix the value to turn it on or remove it completely from the game. There's no point having a stat or items that have zero effect on the game because they're not turned on.
>>336930650
>Disabled isn't the same as broken you dumbshit.
its the same shit, Poise is in the game but it doesn't work it physically does nothing and its falsely advertising what it does
>>336931146
>"... even detailing how much poise damage different weapons inflicted, and there being specialist weapons like small maces and hammers that were better at breaking enemy poise, or the ring that did the same. It added a layer of gameplay and build depth."
You lack information on how much poise your enemy has, it's regeneration, etc.
Maces and hammers were seldom used as a poise sideboard because it wasn't strong enough to begin with and basically didn't make a difference because of how it worked anyways.
The only reason poise wasn't a big deal in DaS2 was because of how practically nonexistent it was after a couple patches.
There was no depth in that, no builds reliant on it really, because it was such a nonfactor.
>>336931724
>There was no depth in that, no builds reliant on it really, because it was such a nonfactor.
There were some fast weapons that clearly benefited from poise damage increasing ring, not to mention you're completely forgetting poise as a mechanic in PvE as well. Whether we have poise or not isn't just a PvP issue as some people in the thread already mentioned. Even if it was just a PvP issue and like you argue "almost nonexistent", removing even the tiniest tidbits of build variety caused by poise is an objective downgrade in game mechanic depth.
Right now as the game is there is no real reason to level up VIT in order to use heavier armor due to diminishing armor returns coupled with the non-existence of poise. It's almost a dump stat and for defensive purposes leveling up VGR is always better. Rolling is always the optimal choice, and unlike many people seem to think not actually harder to perform due to very forgiving i-frames. Not only this, but the game stats screen and items falsely state that poise does exist when it doesn't.
>>336932695
>"Poise adds depth and builds."
>No it doesn't.
>"Well, there's like one dagger that benefits from the poise damage ring!"
>That's not a build, and it's not really deep.
>"Don't forget PvE!"
You just solved it the equastion. Poise can work in PvE just like it did back in the day while being disabled in PvP.
>>336930969
It's a pretty petty complaint.
Just get over it. All you're doing is enabling shitters who think poise would stop Estoc/Dark Sword shenanigans.
>>336933243
>its petty
it would be petty if the stat was removed from the game and every ring and spell that increased your poise specifically also wasn't there either
but they are there which is completely erroneous and misleading
>>336933135
That would be at least some sort of improvement, but it's not actually the case with how the game is right now as far as I'm aware. And I was never defending DaS2's poise system as a bastion of perfection, I was just trying to convey that it handled poise *better* than the other games in the series; not too overpowered but not completely non-existent and broken either. If I may knowingly veer away from the poise argument for a moment, Dark Souls 2's heavy armor also had more noticeable effects, especially when coming to elemental resistances. Leveling up VIT in DaS2 actually made a noticeable difference.
Instead of lazily dumping poise altogether while pretending they didn't, From Software could have actually tried to improve the system further. My personal argument is that the system could be improved, while I think most people pissed off about DaS3's lack of poise are (reasonably) angry about how the devs' were not honest with how they implemented stats and poise items in the game, or somehow otherwise fucked up causing player confusion about poise.
>>336934219
Which sucks. But it's not a big deal. It'll just be like Resistance from DaS1. Everybody will remind newbies that it's a placebo and that'll be the end of it.
>>336934539
>It'll just be like Resistance from DaS1
Resistance actually did something stupid
>>336934562
The difference between 99 Res and default Res was almost nothing. It was horribly balanced and should have been cut.
>>336920019
You turn it on and balance as needed afterwards.
>>336925189
>I'm blaming them for not realizing that it doesn't do anything once they've tried to use it.
I didn't realize that poise didn't do anything until I had defeated Yhorm and transposed his greatshield.
And I am glad that I didn't put any points in Vit because I almost did.
>>336925325
But the Lightning Blade is a lot better than Gold Pine Resins.
>>336920019
You don't because that was the last Souls game.
>>336935872
>post-release updates and balance fixes don't exist
>>336927261
Hyper Armor is also pretty ugly.
Not only does teeny tiny daggers stagger people in full havel, but nude people swinging great swords can still hyper through the swings of gigantic dragon tooths or maces.
>>336933243
But it would stop those weapons. Try to spam R1 against someone who's wearing full Havel with poise enabled, eventually you'll be hit by an Ultra Greatsword and realize that spamming R1 isn't the way to win
>>336936587
You can already do that with the way hyperarmor works. All you're doing is giving these spammers some poise to work with when they're button mashing.
