Is League of Legends P2W?
>>334980752
Nope fresh acc 16 champs 2 rune pages. I'll make it to diamond in two-three weeks
>>334980752
nope
>>334981931
have a you, gamer
>>334980752
Yes, sure you can grind your ass off and get the current champion of the meta but in that same amount of time you could be doing some better
>>334980752
not really because there arent as stark counter picks and hero lineups as in dota
there is no equivalent of say phantom lancer in LoL. In dota, you see a PL and you have a multitude of options to make him useless. you can earthshaker him, you can pick medusa and kill all of his illusions with one button, you can just push his lane in fast and gank him early
but LoL just doesn't work that way
did they patch out runes? runes are advantages that you have to grind out (easier to grind with real world cash though lol)
>>334984991
Nope, there is still runes, mastery, champions, and whatever else I forgot grind. Come on son, it's an asian MMO that tries to be a MOBA even down to shitty lockboxes and half naked characters
>>334980752
People think pay to win LITERALLY means pay to win. No, it is a pejorative term for 'pay for advantage'. In a genre as competitive as Mobas, any sort of advantage is amplified.
League is undeniably pay to win. Not all players are on equal starting ground. It might be LESS pay to win than a Korean MMO or something, but it is still MORE pay to win than Dota, which has objectively zero advantages when paying.
>>334984856
> earthshaker.
> medusa.
Not killing his illusions in 2 hits with Kunkka? Ok.
>>334985504
no, lol is not pay for advantage
lol is pay for skins, only cosmetic
>>334986053
Pay for riot points to unlock stronger heroes the developers have admitted are stronger.
>>334986053
And heroea
>>334986053
I think you got DOTA 2 and LoL mixed up friend
>>334986296
no, there is decent balance, no overpowered heroes
>>334980752
Although lots of people will argue whether it is or isn't because you can unlock (almost) everything by grinding, what almost no one tells you is that in competitive LoL many skins are banned because they simply provide advantages when used.
Mostly it's that they have different animations or graphics and these changes make it much harder to see and therefore dodge an incoming attack.
When you can buy a skin (which can only be bought with real money) that makes one or more of your attacks practically invisible, that is an advantage.
Last I read, over 40 such skins are banned from competitive play in LoL.
>>334985504
This.
Most people don't want to admit the things they like are shitty. When talking about P2W people like to use semantics or play down the power imbalance that's caused by money affecting gameplay. LoL suffers from power creep much in the same way other F2P games do.
>>334985504
Pay for advantage is really vague in League though. If you're talking fresh accounts and shit, the guy who pays is going to be able to unlock a wider pool of champions to use - but he can't buy runes with real money (requires in-game currency and levels) he can't level faster than the other guy, he can't open up more mastery paths without the levels, and so forth. But if the first player decides to buy XP boosts to get these unlocks that are gated by levels, he forfeits a larger champion pool, and also WILL get matched with higher level people, meaning the low-level second player won't have to face him. IP gains ARE pitiful though, especially with how high priced everything is and how much fucking STUFF there is to collect.
>>334986296
You can buy those with in-game cash too, and having EVERY hero doesn't confer a greater advantage than being really really good with ONE hero when League doesn't have stark counter-picks like >>334984856 said. You might own every hero in the game, but it doesn't do you much good when you can only bring one at a time to the fight, and the guy who spent a week grinding can just as easily pick the flavor of the month hero and wreck your face with it too.
>>334986579
You're just out of your fucking mind
>>334980752
The heroes in League are all the same so it doesn't matter if you don't have them all unlocked.
In DOTA2 that would be completely fucked because they're all wildly different.
>>334985682
>Kunkka
Not killing his illusions with Leshrac in 1 second? Ok.
>>334987013
>If you're talking fresh accounts and shit, the guy who pays is going to be able to unlock a wider pool of champions to use - but he can't buy runes with real money (requires in-game currency and levels) he can't level faster than the other guy, he can't open up more mastery paths without the levels, and so forth.
I totally understand your rational position, but in my mind this does not make it seem much better.
In genres such as casual FPSs, people have accepted guns/perks/whatever being locked behind XP goals. In game with a competitive origin (such as RTS, Moba or arena shooters), this notion is entirely foreign.
So they can't pay for an advantage, but there IS a tangible xp advantage gained from putting in more hours. And don't worry, the advantages are offset by literally not having to face the players with an advantage.
Nobody is arguing LoL is literally unplayable. That's not the point. But in Dota 2, if you make a fresh account, you are on 1000% equal footing with a player who has logged 5000 hours. All that matters is skill and game knowledge.
>>334980752
Definitely. It's not a terrible case of it ultimately, I think, skill does make a difference and in theory a free player can with enough investment of time have access to everything a paid player can in regards to gameplay relevance, but there's still a significant advantage in spending at all but the absolute highest level of gameplay.
It's impossible for any game of asymmetrical design to be perfectly balanced, DotA embraces this fact by designing characters around niches so that characters who're objectively shit see play at high end games due to slotting in well to key situations. League of Legends in comparison balances around keeping all the characters within a very close power-level. This may be better depending on who you're asking, but in practice less of the League cast sees competitive play since you're going to be picking the character with the 51% win-rate in every game over the character with a 49% win-rate unlike DotA where a 5% win rate character can be an instant lock-in.
This is an important detail because it means having regular access to the best in cast is an advantage. Being able to obtain all characters available in a timely manner means you will never have to worry about losing out on a pick. By paying for every character, you also have a tactical advantage in being able to allocate game currency into runes and having rune pages to support a wide variety of situations.
So while you can't buy a level advantage in any given game, I would say that spending money is a distinct advantage in League.
>>334980752
LoL's grind is absolutely unreasonable and the free rotation needs to be both bigger and feature more of the expensive characters, but someone who has so little play time that they only have a single character unlocked is probably not going to do well even if they had access to all characters.
>>334986946
Dota also had some power creep in the last few released heroes that had to be seriously toned down.
>>334987404
That's absolutely something I agree with though - especially since there's no "try before you buy" system, a limited number of refunds, no dedicated practice mode, and so on and so forth. The game is riddled with problems that make the entry barrier for new players way higher than it should be, but Riot apparently really fucking loves money so they've made progression slow as shit to either keep people playing for a sort of drip-feed of gratification when unlocking shit or just force them to straight up buy that junk with real money. Either way, they're winning. But pay to win isn't a term I'd ascribe to League based on how the game works and the design philosophy behind their characters, where everything slots into a similar role and counterpicks mean very little.
Now to call the game loaded with fucking Jews, that's a different story.
Having the full roster is nice, but it's not required.
Most people, especially challenger level players have very small champion pools to begin with.
Being countered isn't a death sentence in the game. There's counterpicks but it's not something that overall better play couldn't overcome. All matchups effectively become a contest between player skills and their familiarity with the champions.
That being said though, the IP system is garbage. IP gains are pitiful, buying runes sucks, and leveling accounts in general is a pain in the ass.
>>334985682
>2 hits is somehow better than 1
alright guy
>>334980752
No because the only real advantages you can get in the game are in the form of runes, masteries and summoner spells in which the former can only be bought with the ingame currency only attainable by playing the game while the latter two unlock by leveling up via playing the game.
More hero options does not equal to having an advantage since this is a team based 5 versus 5 where when the games starts, both teams have the same amount of heroes. Hero stats and abilities that you didn't/can't choose are never relevant.
