Why is it that the majority of combos in Smash 4 come from grabs? This only encourages campy out of shield, grab only type play. Very few characters have reliable non grab setups other then 5x u-tilt.
Give me non throw combos in Smash 4 other then u-tilt u-tilt u-tilt u-tilt crap.
I'll start with what I know.
Lucina and Marth have Jab 1 into F-air F-air
Kirby has alot of shit from D-air and D-tilt
Little mac can true combo smashes, tilts and specials from his d-tilt and he can also combo his jab into d-tilt as well. He also can chain dash attacks.
Link can combo with his combos into dash attack and has d-tilt to f-air, d-tilt u-air and jab jab Up B.
Poor jiggly puff has combos but they can be n-aired most of the time. I'm not a jiggly puff main but you guys really don't deserve this bullshit from a braindead Luigi player :(
Falcon can do some of his D-throw setups with his dash attack instead and it does true combo. He also n-air reverse f-tilt dash u-air
Sheik has alot of f-air chains and can combo then into bouncing fish and can chain f-tilts.
Mewtwo obvious has combos from D-tilt and Disable and a prediction from his Side B
ZSS can actually combo shit from Down smash and her laser gun.
Rosalina can just spam down smash and combo shit with Luma.
>>320047723
Play Melee or Project M at the least.
Problem solved.
>>320047723
Play a real fighting game if you care that much.
>he doesn't know about tilt combos
bet you don't even have c-stick set to attack
Roy has a lot of them, his grab combos aren't even that reliable. Too bad they're hard to land.
>>320048404
It looks like his jab has a slight amount of hitstun for a guaranteed Jab F-tilt Jab D-tilt or Jab Side B. He could do jab into F-smash but I don't think it's guaranteed.
Lucas can get away with a lot of stuff from ff nair, which is really good because his grad is actually pretty ass
dtilt and zair are also really good linking tools
PK Freeze into PKT2 is the GOAT Lucas Combo though
>>320048404
Roy's grab combos are pretty reliable. Ike and Link are the only ones that they pretty much don't work on, I guess they just have a weird weight and fall speed.
Fthrow is better for floaties and dthrow is better for fast fallers. Against fast fallers, at like 0% it's probably better to go for dthrow jab ftilt or dtilt. After that, dthrow buffered uair is probably your best option.
Even if people try to DI down and tech his fthrow, if the Roy is expecting it then they're just put in a tech chase situation.
>>320049110
>PK Freeze into PKT2 is the GOAT Lucas Combo though
It's also a really bad combo that only gets people if they don't mash out. Can't tell you how many Lucas players I've gotten kills on because they tried that.
>Needing throws to start a combo
>Resorting to shield-grabbing when they get past 100%
>Those scrubs that get salty as fuck after losing and do nothing but running grabs the next match
The easiest way to deal with it is projectiles.
If the network connection isn't shit, and you're good at spot dodging, that's always an option too.
If you know the hitbox of your character's tilts, that always helps out too. Tilts into spikes usually work out.
Ike's D-tilt can combo into fair, bair, or Aether depending on how they DI. Landing the bair one is pretty hard though.
His nair can combo into a lot of attacks, mainly jab if you land and fair/Aether if you're in the air
Fuck this thread, someone start a tourney
>>320047723
Jr can side B into up-Air.
>Waaaaaaaaa I don't want to learn and adapt!!!
Meleebabby spotted.
IkeA - A - AAll you need
Use ryu and profit
I fucking hate characters that rely on grabs for braindead combos.
Whats bs is you can get grabbed while in the air. Jumping doesnt prevent getting grabbed.
Git gud.
>>320047723
Not a serious fighting game
Please re-evaluate your life and priorities
See, you, like most people, forget that shields can be broken.
And that they shrink.
And that they can easily be chipped.
Grabs are lazy and easy which is why they're popular, but chipping a shield down to nothing or using a shield break if your character has one basically fucks people who rely on that stupid ass shit.
Essentially grabs are to smash what beams are to mvc.
Mac's combos are generally pretty hit or miss depending on the match up but I have a few that use.
d.tilt>d.tilt>grab
d.tilt>s.hop>n.Air(sometimes twice)>up.b
d.tilt(1-3 times)>side.b>d.tilt>into previous d.tilt combos
(This can only be done at certain percentages with certain characters)
down.tilted f.smash>run>up.smash
If you time your attacks, any smash will likely hit off a d.tilt. A read or reaction on the air dodge. A pivot smash after the down throw is a good mix up and can easily break shields. If you pressure there shield before hand, but this thread called for non grab combos.
I probably have a couple others that I can't think of right now. Mac is a lot of freestyle combos off of reads though. He tends to be very read/punish heavy.
Dr. Mario:
>If they are on the edge without invincibility, d-tilt d-tilt f-air; may apply to Mario as well
>dash attack -> u-air -> u-air or b-air or up special depending on where they DI
Ryu:
>d-air into d-air near the ledge for kill
>d-tilt x amount of times -> shoryuken
Meta Knight:
>d-tilt into d-throw or dash attack [optional -> jump -> u-air -> jump -> u-air -> jump -> u-air -> jump -> u-air -> jump -> u-air -> jump -> u-air] -> up special
bowser jr has zero landing lag if his dair connects, go crazy
>>320047723
>Why is it that the majority of combos in Smash 4 come from grabs?
The worst thing is that most of them come from down throw, which is a weak throw in certain percentages, where back throws deal pretty high percentages.
For example, Palutena can get a fair or a dair out of a dthrow, 4% + 8%, but her back throw does 14% so you get more from that.
I think this applies to a lot of characters.
Basically the reason the combo game in Smash 4 is awful is because of that air dodge.
I quit playing this shit and went back to Melee. They gave characters a "way" they should be played. Falcon, for example, is basically Dash grab: The Character. It's not Falcon's fault, the game is inherently shit.
Compare that to Falcon's options after a grab in Melee, and you see what I mean. Sakurai is a cunt.
>>320056962
This bothers me to no end. Everyone seems to play the same exact way no matter what the character is. I've been told my Mac plays differently than any other they have played, but it doesn't mean much since he's such a rare character to see in tournament. There's no variety to playstyles and it makes watching competitive play extremely boring to watch.
>Turning a casual party game into a competitive one
My friend plays these and started getting into it competitively, now it's all he does and brags so much about how he beat some hot shitter on FG even though it was probably some kid.
It's now super boring to even go over to his house b/c this game is all he plays, and all he ever wants to play.Even better when he loses a FG match, and ends up getting super mad lmfao
>>320055445
Don't forget these.
>Down tilt >Up smash
>Down tilt >Up B
>Down tilt >KO punch
>Jab > Up B
>Jab > KO punch
I can't count the number of times I faked someone out with the first two hits of Mac's jab combo and smacked them with a KO punch.
>>320047723
When you realise sm4sh isn't good you just start playing melee
type in how to play melee online and download dolphin and buy a gc adapter for pc (15$)
research a character (shiek is really easy to play) practice for a few days then play some friendlies on anthers ladder
>>320056962
>Compare that to Falcon's options after a grab in Melee, and you see what I mean. Sakurai is a cunt.
What, tech chase into read?
Wizzrobe can cover all options from a throw, but that's some 20GX shit that's really hard to pull off. Other than that, 90% of Captain Falcon's game is reading.
>>320057484
If you get into competitive properly, travel to small and major tournaments, Smash can be awesome.
The problem is when people play competitive rules with people who couldn't give a shit.
>>320057909
Jigglypuff is probably the best character for a Smash 4 player. Basically every character became Jigglypuff after Brawl.
Captain Falcon has:
First hit of nair > footstool > dair > ftilt reset > knee. Only works at low percents otherwise dair doesn't lead into an ftilt reset.
>>320058131
I think Peach, Sheik and Jigs are the easiest for new players
in some cases too easy....
>>320058293
Do you really think footstool combos are viable in competitive play? Not when you're just in training mode?
Show me one competitive match VOD where someone uses a footstool combo. I'll wait.
Ryu has short hop sourspot nair into jab combo into light dtilt into heavy dtilt cancelled tatsu.
You could always just learn to play the game rather than bitching about it on /v/.
>>320058385
Peach has some pretty tough tech. Float cancelling and instant float cancelled nairs to name a few.
She also has some awful matchups, such as Marth and Jigglypuff, that could put people off.
Sheik can be played with practically no tech skill whatsoever and you'd probably do well enough to get far locally. Same with Jigglypuff.
If someone wants to start learning tech properly, Falco is the best. His fast fall speed makes L Cancelling really easy and his combos from shine are super free.
>>320057859
Word. I assumed every Mac knew how to confirm into KO by now, so I was giving some less well known ones that I knew. It's still good information regardless.
>>320058560
>Ryu has short hop sourspot nair into jab combo into light dtilt into heavy dtilt cancelled tatsu.
This right here is why the combo system in Smash 4 is awful.
>>320047723
the first smashbros was only good for me because of kirby's grab attack also the reason i didin't like melee much
>>320058804
To be fair, that combo is from a really low percentage otherwise the nair and jab combo knock them too far away.
It's a good starter but combos aren't something all that useful aside from grab follow ups in Sm4sh.
>>320058707
It's good to know that there's some competent Mac players out there. The gene pool has been irreparably tainted by the shitters that picked him up at launch. I strongly encourage anyone who knows how to play him to just fuck all the shitters in the ass as hard as possible.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oRweLnE0YSs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0b_-rS3JNZE
New sm4sh leak?
http://m.imgur.com/a/0qPA4
>>320059119
So how long did it take to put that "leak" together?
>>320059119
If real, that's excessively disappointing. Worst case you set my expectations extremely low for Tuesday.
>>320059350
Actually I saw in on /r/ smashbros new feed about 15 minutes ago but then it got instantly deleted.
>>320058674
Yeah I'm a new falco main
I never tried peach but I found her turnips can destroy falco's recovery
as well as her crouch cancel downsmash being really annoying when playing with a lagster
>>320059036
He gets a bad reputations as brain dead, but to use him properly he takes some of the most skill in the game, imo. Once you realize that life percentage doesn't matter and you play him that way you'll do better. All that matters is stage positioning and limiting the amount of time you're spending in the air. Since you can just as easily die at 0% as at 150% it doesn't matter. Your spacing, timing, reads, and reactions can never have a misstep if you want to succeed. He's one of the few characters in the game that has to establish a proper neutral game to win Using your Smash attacks as a shield with good timing is a great way to keep defensive while pushing the offensive and have been working on using them that way as well.
He's disgustingly fun to play, but brought down by the people that just f.smash to victory on For Glory. Unless something amazing happens during the direct on Tuesday, Mac is the only thing keeping me playing.
>>320047723
OP, if you think combos are the key to victory in Smash 4, you're sadly mistaken.
You need full stage control. Smash 4 is the most dangerous game in all of Smash to actually land on the ground. This is because airdodging has high landing lag, which it doesn't in the other games. A certain distance to the ground, they're either gonna have to attack you, or air dodge, or do nothing. So just shield where they're landing and punish OoS, or do something that can beat their attack if your character can do that (Little Mac, Palutena, projectiles)
So what you need to do is control the stage, keep the opponent in the air and don't go for actually comboing them in the air, unless it's to bait an air dodge.
It's an advantage maintaining game. If you watch competitive games, they keep the advantage against opponents for as long as possible to win.
If you must learn tech, learn extended dash dancing and maybe perfect pivot, but don't worry too much about the last one.
Literally every character has non-throw combos
Fox
Bowser Jr
Ike
Mewtwo
Anyway combos arent even the point of smash.
>>320058438
Greninja players
>>320060109
Perfect pivoting seems to be useless outside of a handful of select characters. I use it as a Mac main, but when I'm in tournament I never see anyone but myself or some sheiks.
>>320060091
I actually hate Little Mac.
He's basically good against characters that can't take advantage of his weaknesses. He sucks against characters that can, such as Sheik, Diddy, Pikachu, Rosalina, ZSS, Villager and Pac-Man (most of the top tier, what a coincidence).
Against characters who can't abuse Mac's bad air game, what you end up with is a character with amazing frame data and movement, with super armour on almost every move.
If you play LM, only play him as a counter pick against anyone who isn't play a top tier. Don't play him as your main, because you won't get far.
In other words, you're turning the game into rock paper scissors, which is the main problem with the Melee top tiers. For this reason, I hate Little Mac and you should go to hell for playing him.
>>320060091
It may sound weird but I've never used anyone in a fighter that handles as well as he does. He was the one character I wanted above all else, and I stood up and cheered when he was announced. There's no one else on the roster like him. I like Ryu as well, always have in the SF series, but Mac. Holy fuck, Mac.
I'd like to see Wolf come Tuesday. I played him in Brawl so it'd be nice to have my boy back. I wasn't expecting Cloud at all, so I'll likely pick him up too.
The Shittle Mac players I wind up against usually do exactly what I want, that being counter in the air while they're close to the ledge so I can hit them from the side in such a way that it doesn't matter whether or not I get hit; they'll shoot off toward the edge of the screen so far that it's impossible to recover. They typically already wasted their second jump anyway.
>>320060424
I don't use it. It's so easy to fuck up, since it's a frame perfect analog input. If you fuck it up, you're probably going to die.
Extended dash dancing is much better, but it fucks up my thumb quite a lot.
Basically all Sakurai did was just make the tech from previous games much more difficult to do, not impossible, further distancing the higher level players from the rest.
>>320047723
Because throws normally have enough hitstun and leaves the opponent close enough to easily follow through.
Robin can Arcthunder into X shenanigans, the only one I am good enough to execute on a regular basis is Arcthunder into Arcfire into Uair, but people can do better and more.
>>320060521
The only people I've had problems with as Mac are ZSS and on occasion Rosalina. Sheik can juggle him to death, but with enough match up knowledge she's honestly not that hard to deal with. Sure, there are players out there that will destroy me, but I've been playing long enough to see the gaps in most characters.
>>320060742
Even in competitive play you'll sometimes see this and it hurts to watch every time. I don't know why people haven't trained themselves to use counter only off of reaction. It's a super hard read that can actually hurt you due to positioning after the counter and no follow ups.
>>320060759
I just straight grinded it for a while and it's second nature. That plus Mac's excellent pivot smash give you the ability to play some excellent spacing games.
>>320047723
playing a wii game
itt pedophiles
>>320060521
I feel close to the same. Competent macs I just fold against because his moves far outpace mine. His tilts are absurd as is his smash attack range and cool down time.
>>320060521
He's got hyper armor on his four smash attacks, and super armor on his neutral.b. That's far from every move. They even removed the i frames on his up.b for some reason so you can't use it as a reversal anymore. He's been nerfed so many times now that he's near useless competitively. I don't know how people still think he's good. His good match ups are slow characters such as Ganon and DK, and even then he has trouble with some of those. If people keep complaining about him they'll eventually make him unusable. They nerfed his recovery and it did close to nothing because he couldn't recover easily before. People cry nerf every time a character does semi-well in a match up that doesn't favor them. It's fucking annoying.
>>320061257
> Sheik can juggle him to death, but with enough match up knowledge she's honestly not that hard to deal with.
I meant it more as she has the tools to force LM in the air. Needles are strong. LM's weaknesses come into play in that matchup. Against a lot of other characters, they don't at all, so he's just super good.
>Campy
>grabs
Choose one
>>320061797
Just counter pick ZSS, that match up is nigh-unwinnable for Mac. Or just block his attacks. His grab is shit and he's way negative on block for every attack but his 1f jab and d.tilt.
>>320062512
His Smash attacks aren't exactly easy to punish. They have very low end lag on them. So he can use one and then 1f jab out of it if you try to punish from the front. They're easily the safest smashes in the game even without armour.
Also neutral b having super armour means he isn't as helpless in the air as everyone thinks he is. He can use it to get out of combos.
>>320062657
I still think Mac is severely underrated among the people that make the tier lists I see. His recovery is spotty but he's not C Tier like he's always rated. I'd say B- at worst. I say that as a Mac main.
What I said earlier about him not needing to worry about life is doubly true for the Sheik match up. A down smash will eat an entire charge of needles, and if you take it slowly when trying to get in she can't force the air game without getting a hit first. You'll live and die by your ability to keep proper spacing in that MU.
>>320063059
Block the smashes. Perfect blocks especially kill Mac. He's dangerously negative on block.
You're also the only other person I've ever heard of besides myself that uses neutral.b to escape combos.
>>320063104
My point isn't that LM is shit.
It's that he's very matchup dependant and I don't like him for that.
Some matchups he gets rekt and you may as well forfeit straight away. Other matchups, his weaknesses don't come into it at all and he dominates them.
I think that he's the main thing that makes the tier list real in Smash 4, since his bad matchups are all top tiers. All he does is give the lower tiers less chance of getting anywhere.
pika at like ~40% to ~73% can get dtilt, hope for tripping and then get reset regrab or reset upsmash OR if they land on a platform reset reset fair drop off platform reset reset regrab or upsmash
also villager can combo off of fair and lloid so easily. you can even use lloid setups for sheild pressure like
lloid -> jab -> dtilt grab OR fair to cover the roll
>>320063304
Unless you perfect shield, his smashes push you back far enough to not be able to grab
>>320063476
I get what you are saying 100%. I was just making a statement that he's a lot better than people think. Being fluid with him and having multiple game plans helps a lot. Locking yourself into a single play style hurts a lot as Mac.
I also make a point of playing friendlies with people who main my bad match ups. Since Mac is currently the only person I enjoy on the roster, I can't really switch.
What combos are there for wario
>>320063689
Use your other tools then. This is literally a thread about not using grab. If you want to practice the match up I'll practice with you. Who do you use?
>>320063881
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoEuQY_m-RE
>>320064038
Marth, so unless I get Mac offstage I don't have projectiles or anything else to really cover his superior on stage play.
>>320063865
>>320064038
>I also make a point of playing friendlies with people who main my bad match ups.
That's respectable. The best player in my region plays Pac-Man, so I'm used to telling LM mains to just stop playing him. I main Palutena just because waifu, so I know about being stubborn, but she actually has a good matchup against Pac so I've ended up sticking with her.
>>320064038
His lag frames after are too short, especially after the changes to hitstun.
>>320047903
Samus' up air up air to up B usually coonnects and will often kill at low ceilings
>>320064224
Ahh, I can see why you have trouble in this match up. Marth is terrible in this game. They seemed to suck all the fun out of him for some reason, making him a clunky feeling mess. You're going to have to beat them in the neutral which will be hard if they are extremely aggressive. Your d.tilt for footsies is a decent tool and s.hop n.air. Besides that it will be tough.
>>320064237
Another character that I can see having trouble with Mac. I have zero advice for you in the MU since I've never played one in tournament, so I can't give you anything to work with. You're a true rarity.
Sorry to both of you guys for being so combative when I didn't know which perspective you guys were coming from. I will say that there's more time to attack than you think, but you both use characters with a lot of start up on attacks.
>>320065045
I don't really have too much experience with macs outside of For Glory anyway. Unless I'm facing a shit mac or able to consistently space short hop aerials without being perfect shielded I don't have much in the way of offense against mac which is why I have to try and rely on grabs to stop his momentum. Even then his smashes and ftilt push me far back enough that I can't get the shield grab often enough. My id isLink_DS, so send me a friend request if you want to play. Won't be able to play until later tonight or tomorrow though since I gotta go for now.
>>320065492
Will do, I don't play online much, but we can throw down. It'll be good practice for that match up for me. Where are you located? I'm in the US.
We'll play tomorrow. I know it's a lame name, but it's an old one.xRainbowTempest
>>320065731
Sadly online is where I get most of my time to play. I'm in the US too, EST time. You can send me a Wii U message with what times work for you if I don't see it here. Thanks for the help and see you then
>>320047723
Robin has combos off of Arcfire and Arcthunder
Fox has combos off of uptilts, his Nair and Dair
Even Luigi, the king of grabs, has some combos off of his uptilt.
Melee is better but why do people act as if characters don't get high mileage out of their grabs in that game as well? For the top tiers the bulk of their percentage when the opponent is at low percent come off of chaingrabs(Fox, Marth and Sheik come to mind). Peach too can chaingrab off of Upthrow.
>>320047723
Ike, Peach and Mac use Dtilt as combo starters.
Mewto's combos often come off his tilts and jab, his throws suck.
Sheik also has confirms from her tilts(ftilt and Dtilt) and Neutral Air.
>>320066086
Mac can use d.tilt, up.tilt, jab, n.air, and f.air as a combo starter.
>>320065995
because melee had a bunch of stuff that didn't need a throw to start it and a ton of combo options in general.
>>320066536
with your enemy doing nothing but moving the stick anyone can combo
>>320066536
While Melee of course has more potential for comboing due to the increased amount of hitstun and the fact that you can only airdodge a single time my point was that Smash 4 has a ton of characters whose main source of combos come off moves that aren't their throws. To me it's weird to complain about throw combos in Smash 4 as if it's something new and that throws aren't a big part of other Smash games. Sheik and Marth in Melee are good in large part due to their grab game.
Dedede can combo pretty much all of his attacks from gordos.
Dtilt combos into itself and ftilt and jab.
Utilt combos into itself and nair and uair.
Nair combos into utilt and uar.
Jab is supposed to combo into dsmash and grab.
Uair can combo into grabs and itself.
I'm sure there are others that I am forgetting, but Dedede has a lot of different dthrow combos as well. I can sometimes do dthrow>fair>nair>dtilt>jab for 50%+
>>320057909
Why are meleefags so insecure about their own game they need to shit up every thread that isnt about them?
>>320067079
The complaint is most characters can't actually combo unless it's a throw or an extremely specific setup. In melee just about any stray hit that's not a smash attack or multihit will often combo into something else. That's just not the case in smash 4.
>>320067607
Don't worry about them. They do it in our Street Fighter and pretty much every other game's threads as well. Just ignore them.
fox can combo falling f-air into up-smash if it meteors
samus can combo down air meteor into back air on most characters around 100%
as well as up tilt to nair or fair.
>>320066710
Ironic considering how many sm4sh webm's posted are just random fags "styling" on CPUs.
>>320067607
If you don't like the way that the newer games play, suggesting you go back to the games that lacked these issues is perfectly viable.
It's not Sakurai is going to wake up and suddenly make the series good again, he can't even make decent SP content anymore.
>>320067923
From personal experience, SFags latch onto bait and then the thread gets derailed from there.
Not even hard, just post melee and they'll go
>Fighting game
And devolve into trolls trolling trolls.
Wario
Wario Bike into f-air or d-air works pretty well for me
>>320068326
People can't even play KI:U right, so I don't think making the series hardcore again will ever happen.
OP, you have no clue what you are talking about. There are an even amount of grab/non grab combos and even true combos, its just that grabbing is much more reliable and shielding in this game is more important than shielding in any other smash game, therefore going for grabs is key. Some non grab combos:
-falcons SH u-air
-falcons SH nair
-roys SH nair
-diddys d-tilt
-ganons side-b
-falcons dair
-ganons dair
-ryus down-b
-yoshis neutral b
-ZSS SH nair
-ZSS neutral b
-ZSS down smash
-Bowser juniors down b
-Diddys banana
-sheiks up tilt
-shieks fair
-nesses fair
-foxes utilt
-marios utilt
-sonics got a fucking ton and im not going o go through them all
-All of ryus fucking tilts combo into ariels or other ground inputs other than his utilt(except elbow input)
-luigis fair
-warios bike, chomp, and nair
-d3's gordo
-d3's nair
-game and watches neutral b
-game and watches utilt
-robs top
-mewtwos side b shit is pretty reliable and annoying
-little macs fsmashes at low percents
-jigglypuffs jab into side b at low percents
-link and toon links bomb shit / tornado shit
-dr mario and marios neutral b
-samus u-air
-pukachus up air
-pikachus neutral b
-Pacmans list is so god damn long im not going to say it but his combo game is solely on fruit bites
-greninjas neutral b
-duck hunts neutral b
-duck hunts side b
-ikes SH nair
-megamans down b and side b
-lucarios non rage nair
-robins side b
-robins neutral b when times correctly
-shulks nair
-olimars dtilt
-wii fit trainers tilts
-dk's uair at low percents
-Im SURE pit, other sword swingers than roy, paliutena and charizard have some but Im not familiar with the characters enough to point them out specifically, but Im positive they have them. For example, charizars nair or sword swingers SH nair, but im not sure.
-Same goes for charatcers like peach, bowser, RL, and falco, I know they have non throw combos, but I cant tell you the exact inputs as I do not know the characters enough.
OP, you are a just a shield whore
>>320066536
Fox and Falco are anomalies in Melee.
>>320067880
So what you're saying is Melee is easier than Smash 4?
>>320068175
>MUH SM4SH BOOGEYMAN
you meleefags are truly obsessed with deflecting (pun intended)
>>320049110
Zair -> Fast fall -> grab is a true combo, though.
>>320069145
it's not just fox and falco
>>320069245
I'm saying that there are more combos and combo potential in melee and it makes the game more fun in my opinion. The difficulty of said combos ranges in difficulty, but the difficulty ceiling is much higher than smash 4's.
>>320068781
I'm not asking for it to be hardcore, I'm just asking for it to be good.
I can't play Classic because of the shoehorned 8 player smash and the fact that you need coins just to play on the highest difficulty.
I can't play All-stars because Sakurai thought that it was a good idea to cut the groups down to six while giving you four items that practically heal you to full whenever they're used.
I can't play adventure mode because Sakurai is a bitch who got butthurt over SSE's cutscenes being uploaded to youtube.
There isn't even a coin launcher mini-game or boss battles, or even break the targets anymore.
I mean, I can understand dumbing down MP because you want to entice casuals but why did he feel the need to ruin SP too?
Especially after how much work he put into it in Brawl.
>>320058438
I'm at work so I'm not going video searching for you, but I've seen ryo do footstool combos with Ike on several occasins.
I've never seen the falcon combo I mentioned done in a competitive match but it's not because footstools are inherently infeasible. It's just because landing the first hit of Falcon's nair is fairly unsafe.
>>320069503
Whose deflecting?
Go on /ssbg/ and any webm is mostly shit that the posters came up with just to show off.
Ironic, accusing meleefags of deflecting when that's what you're doing as well.
>>320069701
>break the targets and board the platforms created for each character in N64
>they help you learn some basic character control
>removed forever because 50 characters
>>320069930
>deflecting yet again
ctrl-f webm and see nothing but meleefags hitting static targets without even leaving this thread, accusing someone else won't make your shit stop being shit
>>320069686
So he's, you are saying Melee is easier. That's fine bro, it's really easy to get combos off in Super Smash Flash 2 as well, and that makes it fun for a while.
>>320070382
You're trying to hard kid.
Too obvious.
>>320069997
The "but 50 characters" thing is a weak excuse. They already have everything they need for btt/btp in the game. It shouldn't even take a week to make a stage for every character. At the very least they add make your own btt/btp
I don't wanna start a thread about it so I'll just ask in a pre-existing Smash thread
How the fuck do you deal with Shulk? I'm new to the Wii U game and I got my ass beat by the fucking level 8 computer Shulk four times in a row. I've played over 200 matches already, albeit against the computer, but I've won probably around 185 of them. Shulk just trashes me though. All my other losses are one at a time normally, but Shulk just seems to have it all. Long reach and a counter off the bat, buffs to Smash, Speed, Jump, Defense (this one really pissed me off, my kill options didn't work worth a shit. Knocked him maybe 5 character lengths away at 130% with a fully charged forward smash), and whatever Buster gives him. I want to main Pikachu but I play Dr.Mario/Mario/Ryu/Roy sometimes. Was playing Pika when I got my ass beat. Any tips?
>>320071197
stop rolling and get good.
shulks not even top tier so that means if you have trouble your bad
>>320071350
I barely roll though, if anything I spot dodge more than roll
>if you have trouble*you'rebad
>I'm new to the Wii U game
hmm
>>320071197
Play as Shulk to find out where he's lacking
>>320047903
>hey guys I want to know combos
>"no you should play games that have no combos"
ebin
>>320072191
Sm4sh has less combos than Brawl though.
>>320047723
"Ganondorf combo"
I use this frequently
side b down-a jump f-air
Then run to ledge after sending the opponent flying and postition a spike or a down b
Does the priority system not promote ground play? All the air meta is just hit trading and biggest hitboxes.
>>320074342
*
>>320059119
>In the Final
>when that theme is already in the game under a different name
0/10
>>320070490
Its okay to be retarded.
>>320047723
Falco's dash and d-tilt lead some pretty gud combos but nothing guaranteed. I'm still mad they got rid of his lasers.
>>320051735
i've always wondered why ike mains only use jab and nothing else
