Would Artorias be one of the strongest bosses in Souls series (including BB) if he were in his prime during our encounter with him?
He lost against Manus during his prime time WITH Sif and all his gear so no.
Probably not. From a logic standpoint, Guns > Swords and shields. And from a Lore standpoint Great Ones > Pretty much anything else
Bloodborne should take the top tier in pretty much every category just because of its setting. That said, Artorias is still a fucking boss.
>>319887402
He fought Manus without his shield
>>319887618
>>319887402
He likely didn't even encounter Manus. The Dark overwhelmed him.
>>319887226
Debatable. And I hate to say this as an artoriasfag myself. But seeing as how it is established that ornstien was the captain of the elite knights it stands to reason that in their prime he was the strongest
>>319887226
From an in game not your headcannon standpoint swords > guns and pretty much everything else
And from an in game difficulty standpoint DaS elite knights as a hole > pretty much everything else (especially the underwhelming "great ones")
>>319888503
Forgot pic
>>319887226
The Dark wouldn't really weaken him, would it? If anything it would strengthen him. It may have caused him to go mad, but as a result, he was even more aggressive.
He probably surpassed his "prime" after the Dark got to him.
>>319888503
Being the strongest doesn't necessarily mean you're the best at leading.
>>319888503
Captains!=strongest
Just their capability to lead.
>>319887226
I'm glad his voice acting was cut out, he sounded like a faggot.
Smough would squash him ez
We fought artorias without his shield and he wasn't using his left arm with his sword.
And he was a feral fuck who probably wasn't thinking straight.
He's strong but I think ornstein was stronger if he was the captain.
>>319887226
No, he would be weaker than Manus because Manus defeated him.
>>319887465
Guns are weak as fuck in bloodborne what are you talking about?
>>319889184
>having shit gems
>not leveling bloodtinge
>>319889049
It also would have taken away some of the impact from the whole event. What we were fighting was not the noble warrior, Artorias, but rather a husk that just resembled him. There was no more warrior left in him, only animalistic instincts and madness. He could no longer think straight, nor could he speak, he could only let out what was either predatorial screams or cries of pain.
Having him talk would have just taken from all of that.
Would Vendrick in his prime have been the strongest souls character
So was old dragonslayer the real Ornstein and the one in Anal Rondo just an illusion or not?
Good Hunter >= Slayer of Demons > Chosen Undead > Bearer of the Curse
There is no debate.
doubt it, i cant see artorias beating most of the old hunters bosses.
>he would be weaker than Manus
>being weaker than the Dark Lord, the strongest enemy in Dark Souls world means you're not strong
>>319889557
Most likely an illusion. The giant blacksmith believes everyone is gone.
>>319889670
Even with BB weapons?
>>319889557
DS 2 has rehashed bosses, take a guess.
>>319889452
tl;dr
In terms of arsenal and fighting ability the hunter is too far ahead of the others. In terms of being cool as fuck the SoD wins that hands down
>>319889489
Yes, most likely he'd be the strongest human to have ever lived. Gods like Gwyn would probably still be stronger.
>>319889802
>Even with BB weapons?
I think it's implied that hunters have specialized training in understanding and using Hunter Tools and Trick Weaponry. Unless you think shit like the Beast Cutter, Threaded Cane, Bloodletter and Amygalan Arm don't have weird mechanics to make them work.
>>319889806
Nigga, that was like a paragraph.
>>319890212
shut the fuck up bitch and learn to write words smaller
>>319889939
When it comes down to it I'm fairly sure that the Slayer of Demons and Good Hunter would be some kind of stalemate. You would have to argue game mechanics at that point.
The Slayer of Demons either becomes a top tier demon right below god level, or becomes a fixture for the universe suppressing a god and keeping the universe together as a transcended monumental watching a demon waifu.
The Good Hunter either fucks off and leaves Yharnam forever being done with all that shit, becomes the aide to a god, or becomes a super god with a doll waifu.
>>319890378
Oh, you're FUNposting.
>>319887226
If his shield actually worked? Maybe.
>>319889557
>>319889735
The Ornstein we fight in Anor Londo is real, it drops his unique soul, and there's literally no evidence to suggest that Gwyndolin can make souls from scratch like he can make illusions
>>319887226
Pffft hahahahahaha. No. Ornstein was the captain for a reason. Artorias was only "hard" because fromsoft decided to inflate his defenses and health. Every one of his attacks can be blocked as long you don't let him charge up.
>>319890805
>the best fighter is the captain meme
the captain is the best strategist, not the best fighter, because his job is to tell the fighter where and when to fight. the leader of the Band of the Hawk was Griffith, not Guts
>>319890573
You also get the old dragonslayer's soul.
How can a soul been gotten twice? Unless one wasn't real? There's zero evidence to support that the soul in Dark Souls 2 was fabricated.
However, the illusions in Anor Londo, such as the silver knights, and sentries, all have souls. So I'd say it's a step closer to probability that Gwyndolyn fashioned a soul for Ornstein, from a mass of lesser souls.
>>319890805
Ornstein was also pretty weak. You fight him without Smough and he's easy operation. Artorias, in the state he's in, in the DLC, is mych stronger than Ornstein. Of course, that could just be due to him being taken over by the Dark.
>>319891005
there's no evidence to suggest that the Old Dragonslayer was actually Ornstein, and not just some fanboy wearing a mockup of his armor and weapon.
>implying that the silver knights were illusions
"The Silver Knights stayed behind in Anor Londo
to defend the illusory goddess" -- Silver Knight Shield
>>319890805
>implying strength is the only criteria for a leader.
Artorias was stronger, but Ornstein was just better at commanding, simple as that
>>319891005
The old dragonslayer you met in DS2 is not Ornstein.
>>319891251
You frogot your whole explanation of why what you say is valid.
>>319887226
Gameplay wise, I don't think anything can keep pace with some of the higher tier Bloodborne bosses, they just absolutely shit damage and are always on the attack.
>>319891005
the only actual illusion that Gwyndolin was confirmed to have conjured has 2 HP. Supposing that the Silver Knights are illusions (which is wrong, see >>319891224), then Gwyndolin is capable of making illusions many, many times stronger than that. Thus, it makes no sense for him to have Gwynevere's illusion be as weak as it is, considering it's importance. It makes much more logical sense that the Silver Knights, etc. are actual beings, and that the only illusion in the city is Gwynevere. Everything else, except the insanely disciplined silver knights, fucks off when the illusion disappears because they no longer have a job
>>319891005
If a soul is strong enough it'll eventually reincarnate or some bullshit like that.
>>319890934
Griffith won against Guts at the beginning and only lost to him at the end.
>>319891005
Your problem here is that you are looking at Dark Souls 2 as anything but fan fiction.
It wasn't directed nor was the story written by Miyazaki, and the sequel was never meant to happen in the first place. To put it simply, and that's all it really is in the first place, it's no more than a mindless and meaningless cameo.
>>319891701
are you implying that Griffith would have been capable of the superhuman fighting feats that Guts pulled, like soloing 100 guys, or fighting demons to a standstill? Griffith was good, but Guts was always better
>>319890805
Ornstein isn't the captain, idiot. He's BELIEVED to be the captain.
>>319891953
there really isn't any reason to suppose that he isn't, aside from being a contrarian
He wouldn't stand a chance against BB bosses, but he's stronger than every DeS, DaS and DaS2 boss except Manus.
>>319892035
>stronger than all bosses except manus
no
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRdVoqppR6M
>>319889153
>ornstein was stronger if he was the captain.
Ornstein was the captain of the dragon hunters. Artorias wasn't part of them.
>>319891745
>>319891667
>>319891519
>>319891251
Christ guys. The first anon already made a well enough point. I don't need a bunch of Vaati followers ganking my ass.
>>319892115
I'm talking about him in his prime. With a greatshield used to block Kalameet's fire and greatsword in his main hand.
>>319892218
>Vaati followers
>Implying he didn't just steal the lore discussions from other people and claim they were his own
>>319892258
Shield > Buff
His only weakpoint is the lack of defense.
>>319887226
Gerhrman in his prime would destroy the shit out of anything
>>319887226
I loved the fight against Artorias, but to be honest Raime, The Fume Knight is the fucking toughest boss in the series.
>>319892395
I don't think you understood what my implication was. But you read the name Vaati, and responded by whipping out your hate boner.
>>319892218
>Vaati followers
good one, you sure showed me!
>implying that claiming that the silver knights are illusions isn't Vaati as fuck
>>319888891
I would argue though that Artorias' strength was primarily derived from his unbreakable will and purity, because of this the corruption of the Dark would severely handicapped the 'source' of his strength as the Dark itself corrupts the soul.
>>319891781
Not only did he fight the demon apostles, but he also did it with a fucking broken straight sword.
Guts >>>>>>>> Griffith
>>319888891
he doesn't fight intelligently, he just berserker rushes everything, and on top of it, his broken arm makes it impossible for him to use his shield, which is kind of a big deal
>>319892569
Nothing in DaS2 should count. The fact that you have to level up your fucking i-frames automatically makes any fight harder in a very- and pardon the meme term here- artificial way. Literally artificial difficulty.
He's cool but the fact that he's in a shit game is what makes him tougher.
>>319891667
what determines the strenght of a soul though?
>>319892702
The objectively correct answer
also this image is fitting for this thread
>>319887402
He wctually went mad if you read the armor description. The dark overwhelms him and he goes batshit abd breaks his arm.
If he had sif, was sane, and had his sheild, hed be a much harder boss.
>>319892659
This is fair enough. His weapon scales with faith, right? If the dark took that away, he would be weaker.
>>319888891
The Dark made him go full nuclear - he doesn't care about his defenses. His armor is destroyed, he doesn't wield a greatshield, he doesn't care if he's vulnerable to attacks when he buffs. In this state he couldn't even beat Kalameet.
>>319892829
Fume Knight is so late in the game, that by the time you fight him, if you don't have AT LEAST softcapped ADP you need to respec, because you've fucked up hard
>>319892617
>implying that claiming that the silver knights are illusions isn't Vaati as fuck
No, it was a simple misunderstanding, due to lack of information.
Being Vaati, is wanting to shove your interpretation of the lore down people's throats, even though they already heard it from other, more knowledgeable sources. Which is exactly what 4 other anons did, after the first anon already explained things.
BTW, where were the 4 of you when the anon asked the question initially? Why did you wait for me to respond, if you already had the answers?
>>319892847
Probably how unique/strong you are.
>>319892847
Probably just the more souls you collect over time. The reason why some of the "Gods" are physically larger than you, is because they hold innumerable amounts of souls inside them.
>>319893095
Here's how I always saw Souls working in Dark Souls.
Consider pic related. Notice how it clearly consists of a core, and a shell. My theory is that all souls work similarly.
The "core" of a person's soul is their "unique" soul, it's what you're getting when you defeat a boss. For a human, the "core" is their humanity.
The "shell" is built from all the consumable/soft souls that you gather. You can carry them around like money/spare batteries, but at bonfires you can fuse them to your own soul, increasing the strength of the "shell," and leveling up your power. Other creatures seem to be able to do the same, so this ability isn't strictly limited to undead, but only undead can do it at bonfires.
When you hollow, the core of your soul -- your humanity -- fades, leaving just the shell behind. Thus, you hollow out, literally, by having a hollow soul, and you zombify. This also explains why hollows can move and do other stuff, because they still have something that's keeping them powered.
But then again, this is probably all retarded
>>319893601
I like that idea and it's as valid as any other idea since there's no in-game answer for fucking anything.
>>319887226
no the 4 knights are a joke like gwyn himself they were only lucky to find power
>>319893601
This seems reasonable.
>>319893554
They're also from a completely different race, spawned from Gwyn's soul, as opposed to humanity.
I AM THE OLD KING!
SHOW ME THINE STRENGTH AND THE STRENGTH OF THINE SOULS
PREPARE THYSELF BRAVE KNIGHT
>Ornstein+Artorias will never dp ur boipucci
>>319893982
>Four knights are a joke
>Like Gwyn
Nice, overused meme. The only two knights that can be called jokes are Ciaran and Ornstein on his own. And, Ciaran was an assassin, she never was one to fight head to head, and Ornstein was probably more of a tactician. The only way Ornstein really presented himself as a threat to the player on his own, was after using Smough to power up.
Now, Gough and Artorias, they're badasses. Gough is tough as fuck, and hits hard, he also has a ton of moves no one else has, and Artorias, even after being taken over by the Dark is a badass, even though his defense is absolute shit.
And just like Artorias, Gwyn is still pretty badass. That is, if you don't fucking parry him like a goddamn babby. Motherfucker, even after hollowing is fast as fuck and hits pretty hard. I'd be willing to say the Chosen Undead would stand no chance against him if he wasn't hollowing.
In matters of style, Artorias will always be the strongest.
>>319888503
>>319887226
wouldnt gwyn be the strongest if we're talking "at their prime"
>>319895387
His attacks are easier to roll through than Gwyn's and he's not nearly as aggressive as Gwyn.
>>319894518
How comes Burger King let his descendant fuck over the world with demons?
Where are all the regular ass people in the Dark Souls universe?
>>319896621
Well, you only really visit Lordran, Oolacile, and Anor Londo in DS1, and those places are Undead-ville, Dark-mutated, and empty.
And Drangleic is pretty much is like the first one. So we don't actually get to see the "normal" kingdoms like Carim, Vinheim, or Catarina.
>>319895259
ornstein the dragonslayer a tactian only stopped reading live in you little dream world
>>319896841
He probably was more of a tactician after the war with the dragons ended.
So why did the Dark fuck over Artorias so bad? It didn't seem to affect him when he dealt with New Londo.
>>319892947
>If you don'r put points in a stat because you try a different playstyle, you've fucked up hard
FROMdrones here.
>>319887226
Gwyn in his prime would be more powerful.
>>319887226
No. The whole point of the DLC is to show you that Artorias is a legend blown out of proportion about the wrong guy.
>>319897857
What the hell are you talking about?
>>319898110
Chosen Undead does the shit the Artorias is credited with, famiglia
>>319898110
You are the Artorias that everyone talks about in the main game. Everyone who talks about his legends was just fed false info, because the real Artorias never did any of that shit.
>>319898216
I don't remember him being credited with anything I did.
>>319898292
You mean besides killing Manus and preventing the spread of the Dark?
>>319898474
Is that something that happens at the very end of the game? Because I've killed everyone apart from the last boss, and I don't remember anyone crediting Artorias for anything I did.
>>319892014
The word "believed" is every reason to suppose he isn't. What if there was no captain? Fucking moron.
>le contrarian meme
>>319887226
>in his prime
I'd like to think that Gehrman and Gwyn in their prime would slap the shit out of him.
>>319897041
It's the difference between dipping your ankles in a pool vs diving head first into an ocean. New Londo was only touched by the dark, it wasn't the actual dark like where Manus was.
>>319898874
4 Kings weren't wielding the primordial soul. They and the dickwraiths had just amassed a shitload of humanity. Manus was the real deal and he fucked Artorias's shit up.
>>319887793
he broke his arm fighting manus
>>319897041
What did he do in New Londo? I don't remember. Didn't they just flood the place, and wasn't that long after Artorias died? I thought "Abysswalker" came from the fact that you defeated Manus in Oolacile and history eventually attributed it to Artorias.
Anyway, in Dark Souls 1 lore, the natural enemy of all of the gods is Dark.
>>319899376
I wish our limbs could get broken too in DS.
>>319887226
>including BB
Haha
None, and I mean NONE, of the Souls bosses have a a chance against the hunter. They will be completely annihilated in a matter of seconds when they fight against the agility and the stamina of the hunter.
John Alfred Forester could fucking destroy any of these limpwristed bumblefucks.
>>319899503
kek
naked chosen undead is faster and much better at dodging
>>319899914
this
>>319893601
I like this Idea anon.
>>319899914
because he was broken as fuck
>running around naked with havels shield and zwei at radical larry speed
good times
>>319893743
>>319894223
>>319900659
To continue, leveling up at bonfires is probably a miracle that Gwyn granted, to give the bonfires this property. Pray to the bonfires, sacrifice consumable souls, and increase the power of your consumable soul shell. After all, what better way to hide the dark of humanity, than by masking it in a shell of light, soft souls?
Since soft souls seem to be passively drawn to the thing that kills you, logically, any creature would have the capability to "pick them up," just like the player does. After all, since the Giant Blacksmith treats them like money, there exists the precedent that non-humans can absorb them.
The miracle of fusing consumable souls to your own would probably extend to non-humans like Gwyn's Knights, etc., or it could be performed by a priest in a similar ritual to the levelup girls in the other games. The consumable soul shell is what you're getting when souls get added to your counter when you kill stuff.
With respect to getting soft souls from animals and the like, you would just be grabbing whatever spare consumable soul pocket change they had picked up passively along their journey of killing various undead, these souls weren't fused.
>>319899391
Artorias was keeping the Darkwraiths of New Londo locked down. Nobody could face the Abyss, and then Artorias comes, jumps feet-first into it with his covenant, and went ham on them. Then he left for Oolacile, and the defenders couldn't handle it, and were forced to flood the city.
I personally think that he made it all the way to manus before getting rekt
>>319899210
There is nothing to suggest that Manus was the pygmy
>>319900701
that's nothing compared to the binoculars glitch that the Cursed Undead could perform in DaS2
>>319901837
Other than everything to do with the Dark Soul and Humanity.
>>319901991
he was either the pygmy, or one of the pygmy's immediate descendents. the whole point of the pygmy was that there actually wasn't anything special about him, besides being the first human. him and all his first children should have equivalent powerlevels
>>319901837
I ain't saying that, but he was still in possession of some hardcore humanity. Even if it wasn't the original soul.
>>319899418
you could break limbs in BB
>>319902107
I think the strongest evidence that he's the Pygmy is that you encounter every other being in the intro throughout the game. You go through mythology and bring down everyone.
But I guess it doesn't matter. As long as we know the Pygmy was the first human, his descendents inherited fragments of the Dark Soul as Humanity, that the tiny humans are a fundamentally different existence opposed to gods and lords, and that Dark Souls 2 really fucked up the setting.
>>319902415
who would win in a fight between the Chosen Undead and the Good Hunter?
>>319902415
>that the tiny humans are a fundamentally different existence opposed to gods and lords
Nope.
>>319902540
Yes they are. That's why humans can go hollow, they run out of humanity.
>there are STILL people on /v/ who think that the Age of Dark is a good thing
>there are STILL people on /v/ who actually, unironically, believe Kaathe's lies
>there are STILL people on /v/ who seriously think that Aldia had any idea what he was talking about
>>319902540
Yep. That's the whole point of Dark Souls.
>>319902685
Well the age of Dark Might be good in sense that humanity becomes more powerful than souls, probably not good in the sense it fucks up everything with the abyss.
>>319902891
humanity would get fucked up right alongside everything else, the nature of humanity is self-destructive in Souls
>>319902674
...yeah, everyone knows that Gods are completely incapable of going hollow. There's certainly not a hollow-ed out god as the final boss.
>>319902685
>there are STILL people on /v/ who don't understand that they got duped by Gwyndolin to enslave their people to dying gods
>>319902989
that's not the same thing and you know it. Gwyn had to burn in the first flame to hollow, gods don't hollow spontaneously like undead do
>>319902989
I think that's different because he burned his soul out, which doesn't seem to be quite the same thing as hollowing.
>>319903001
>he thinks that mankind would prosper in the Abyss
gee I sure am having fun in this void of infinite blackness that kills me instantly when I touch it!
>>319891005
>DS2 is canon
every time
>>319903171
we'll see how much of DaS2 is canon when DaS3 launches
This thread reminds me why Dark Souls is such a great game. Thanks.
>>319903075
No, they would've started going hollow eventually anyway. All the Lord Souls were fading, not just the Dark Soul.
>>319902989
Yeah he burned up his soul though, not his humanity. He created the bonfires and the curse of the undead to trick humans in to burning humanity as kindling, extending the life of the flame. Ironically the only thing sustaining the preponderance of souls is burning humanity.
>>319903154
It's exactly the same thing. Hollow + Lord Soul = Gods/Humans/Witches/Nito. Gwyn is also the only time were you can see the Dark Sign in-game.
>>319903391
except that clearly isn't true since hollowing, as a concept, wasn't an issue until the undead curse became a thing, at which point the power of the first flame was already severely weakened. The lord souls fade, but this doesn't mean that the gods hollow, it just means that they grow proportionally weaker
>>319902674
So can anything, hollows are the base form of beings and how they are is determined by their soul. I really don't understand why no one knows this, the fucking opening video shows hollows walking towards the flame to find the souls of the lords and becoming them.
>>319902974
People would get fucked up, but we would get to see humanity in its raw form, and who knows what that would look like (see Manus). Humans look like mini-gods because their shard of the dark soul is co-opted by the light of souls based in the first flame.
>>319903246
Doesn't the ivory kings crown and analice whatever her name is appear in a das3 trailer?
>>319903556
>The lord souls fade, but this doesn't mean that the gods hollow
Why wouldn't it. Gods are literally just Lord Souls + hollows, just like humans. It'd take longer to Hollow, because there aren't millions of them, but the Lord Souls failing would absolutely cause them to hollow out.
>>319903562
Hollows are a result of the darksign and the curse of the undead.
>>319892869
I had always heard and assumed that artorias broke his arm, his shield arm, protecting puppy sif from some non-discripit foe/attck. After his arm broke, he then used his magic-tagic shield to put a barrier around sif to protect sif from the humanity ghosts.
>>319903365
that looked like it hurt
>>319903570
the Age of Dark is characterized by a degeneration into base instincts of self-destructive greed and obsession, all the item descriptions related to Humanity, New Londo, the Dark Sorceries, and Oolacile mention this. Whatever new, "glorious" physical form you may take, you wouldn't be "you" when the transformation finishes, you'd be an animal like Manus. This would even hold in an Abyss/Age of Dark that was uncorrupted by the whatever evil sorcery that the Oolacilians did to revive Manus, as much of the same is also implied in DaS2.
tldr, you may get a sweet new physical body like Manus, but your mind would go poof
>>319903776
Rewatch the intro. You can clearly see that Hollows are the things which find the Lord Souls.
Would OP be one of the strongest cocksuckers on /v/ board (excluding 8ch) if he were in his prime during our encounter with him?
>>319903723
Humans came from the Dark Soul. Gods came from Gwyn's lord soul. Completely different.
>>319887226
What about Dragon God
>>319903723
But the curse is the result of the rising prominence of the dark, not its waning. Gods can lose their power, but at their core they're fundamentally different beings that rely on the lord soul and not humanity.
The major point of the game is the fading of the light and the ascendancy of the dark. The Gods, beings based in light were scared shitless by this and so they tied a bunch of things to keep the light of the first flame from fading. Ultimately their solution was to dupe humans into burning their humanity to sustain the fire.
>>319904075
In what way are they different that would actually rebut my point?
>>319904250
Humanity IS a lord soul, you gigantic goofball.
The entire point of the Age of Dark is that everything hollows, everything degenerates, the power of souls fade (souls being artifacts of Fire), and all that's left in a world of shambling hollows in the Abyss is 1 or 2 dudes with shitloads of humanity, but even they hollow eventually.
>mfw everyone always forgets the furtive pygmy
>>319889638
Pretty sure the Good Hunter would completely destroy the other three. Remember that the beasts in Bloodborne are a lot more vicious and stronger than the monsters in the Souls games. Remember the people in bloodborne don't even bother wearing armour since the beasts are so strong and can tear through it.
>>319904439
Humanity is a lord soul, but it operates on the separate end of the dichotomy between light and dark. As the light fades the dark increases in power.
>>319904494
so easily forgottenhe's manus right?
>>319904686
You really can't say for sure one way or the other, but I really think that's the conclusion you're meant to arrive at.
>>319904250
>Gods can lose their power, but at their core they're fundamentally different beings that rely on the lord soul and not humanity.
Humanity IS a Lord Soul.
>The major point of the game is the fading of the light and the ascendancy of the dark. The Gods, beings based in light were scared shitless
Oh, so you're a moron who takes everything by Kaathe word for word.
Dark soul is not in ascendancy. People are hollowing out everywhere. The abyss has gone from a place where humanity is literally pouring out of the walls to one where it's filled with people desperately craving it and selling their souls so they can suck it out of other people.
Unless they try to make some sense of the story in the third game there is no point to a story in these games.
>>319904672
the dark increases in power, but the dark is self-desctructive. That's why people hollow, even in the presence of the increasing power of the dark soul (and therefore their humanity) -- the increasing power of the Dark just means that hollowing would logically take longer to happen. Nobody is immune to hollowing, not even the Dark Lord. Even in the Age of Dark, everything would hollow eventually, and all that would be left would be Serpents.
>>319903964
Depends, does he possess the kek soul at this point in time?
Is this before or after the age of dank?
>>319904894
nice meme
>>319904686
>>319904828
He's either Manus or Manus is just a person that acquired a shit load of humanity and got fucked over. Hell, the reason he basically started the abyss is because he was dead and a snake made a bunch of people fuck up his grave so he fucked them up.
So let me get this straight
>dks1
Age of fire
>dks2
>age of man
>dks3
Age if darkness?
>>319905301
age of man and age of dark are one and the same
>>319905409
Then what about the age of dragons
>>319905571
distinct from all the others
>>319905301
Not really.
DKS2 is still the age of fire albeit severely weak due to the fact that you cant keep this shit burning forever.
I think in DKS3 we're gonna see a point in history where the fire is about to go out permanently and no amount of sacrifices will suffice. The natural order went tits up when Gwyn fucked around with the first flame and now everything is messed up beyond repair unless the fire is snuffed out.
>>319905571
Age of dragons would be before Dark Souls 1. Dark Souls 2 is probably just Age of Fire again.
>>319905643
The new trailer literally says 3 is already darkness.
>>319887226
If anyone in the souls series can be compared in their prime, then Gwyn is extremely powerful. The Chosen Undead probably can't take Gwyn fully intact.
>>319906146
Except that you do
>>319898689
>The everything is a meme meme
>>319906010
I don't believe that. I think we're reaching the utter end of the age of fire. We're just about to enter the age of dark proper.
>>319904829
Humanity decreases only because it is used to sustain the fire, and hollowing exists because of this. There's no reason to think that it fades by itself as fire does.
>>319906379
>he actually believed Aldia's bullshit
hollows were a thing before Gwyn linked the fire to begin with, New Londo was an undead city
>>319905643
>Third game is where the flame goes out and you recreate it.
>>319906010
Dark Souls 3's trailer says "now only embers remain"
Dark Souls' intro cinematic says "even now there are only embers"
I wouldn't take it too literally just yet.
>>319906556
I didn't even know who Aldia was because DaS2 is irrelevant.
>>319906270
No you don't.
By the time you get to him he is a shell of what he was after burning for the flame so long. Just compare his model with the opening cut scene.
>>319892569
For me Fume Knight was super easy compared to Sir Alonne.
>>319906798
He is literally powered by the flames.
>>319906737
then you should recognize that undead and hollowing are an inherent feature of the Dark becoming stronger, and that they aren't due to meddling from Gwyn
>>319903806
This is correct.
>>319906891
and his soul literally says that almost all of his essence was burned away, and that you're fighting the embers of the man that he originally was
No, he's actually probably stronger with the abyss shit. He's lower tanked than ornstein
>>319906891
but the flame exists during the first game because it is powered(fueled) by him.
How is dark souls 2 linked with 1? I played throughout dks2 and aside from some weapons, I never really got it.
>>319906891
No anon, he is using his soul to keep the flame alive.
Plus he gave a piece of it to Seath and the 4 kings.
Prime Gwyn was pretty much a god
>>319907260
>how is DaS2 linked to DaS1
very sloppily
>mfw the lord souls are related to the old ones and it ties all the Souls games with Bloodborne
>>319907260
Muh cycles
>>319897391
>I want to build my character to be swift on his feet so he can dodge all attacks
>WTF I have to put points into a stat that makes me dodge better HURR ARTUFFUCIAL DIFFIHULTY
>>319907321
>4 kings
Why would he work with the 4 kings, weren't they dark?
>>319892035
Aldia and Vendrick are fucking invincible (the later isn't if you get the Giant Souls). How would they be less strong?
>>319907260
Its implied that Drangleich or whatever was built in the ruins on Lordran.
Plus all the bosses are "reincarnations" of some sort of the 4 lords from DaS, that why you get their souls in NG+
>>319907260
Honestly it's better to just think of Dark Souls 2 as being a different universe entirely. That way it doesn't hurt as much.
>>319907582
the 4kings turned to dark after he gave them the soul shard, before then they were examples of humanity's potential and Gwyn was proud of them
>>319904114
>Can be held down by two ballista tethers
>>319907597
The lore in bloodborne literally states that the old knight armor and shield stuff you use in dark souls doesn't work anymore on the beasts. They had to completely change the weapons and armor for this stuff.
Tldr dark souls characters wouldn't last a day in yharnam
>>319907582
The were good people, and such great kings that Gwyn decided to share some power with them.
But then the Kaathe came in with his covenant and corrupted them
>>319907260
its so badly and obscurely linked and referenced that DS2 feels like a fanfiction of DS1
>>319892569
Really?
I felt that Ivory King was way harder than Fume Knight.
>>319907976
>>319907723
>>319907429
>>319907332
I hate this meme. Dks2 was a great game.
>>319907260
>Ornstein
>the game references Solaire
>Nashandra and her stupid sisters are the daughters of Manus, which shouldn't even exist in the first place
>all four Lord bosses drop the Lord Souls from Dark Souls 1 in NG+
>Havel again for some reason
It's linked pretty heavily. Piss poor linking, of course, but linked nonetheless.
>>319907852
That doesn't answer my question at all. How would they be less strong than a fully powered Artorias?
>>319908087
>people who were disappointed in DaS2 are spouting memes
are all DaS2 fans so ridiculously overly defensive? get over yourself
>>319908087
It was a good game. It wasn't Dark Souls however. Dark Souls 3 is what Dark Souls 2 was meant to be.
>>319908162
I wasn't that anon, I just skimmed through and replied to what you said about Gwyn in bb
>>319908171
>get over yourself
Exceptionally Ironic.
Anything in every Souls games except the Good Hunter would get obliterated by the Moon Presence's red eye attack because they don't have the regain mechanic, and that's if the Good Hunter has the 3 umbilical cords. So it doesn't really matter if Artorias is fully powered or not.
>>319908112
>>Nashandra and her stupid sisters are the daughters of Manus, which shouldn't even exist in the first place
They're shards of Manus, not her daughters. And each daughter looks like a fucked up version of Dusk.
>>319908112
Don't forget Anon, the most important element.4 Kings
>>319908431
I'm not sure if you know what irony is
>>319906556
>New Londo was an undead city
Doesn't the Crestfallen Warrior say they were undead before the flooding? Not trying to prove you wrong or anything, just curious. I always assumed the 4 kings went batshit after Gwyn linked the fire, or that at least the two events were pretty close in time.
so how about that dark souls 3 guys?
>no more hallowing
>instant flasks
>instant backstabs
>mana
>equip load no longer exists
>bloodbourne dodges in plate armor
>>319908625
New Londo used to be an undead city. Gwyn gave the 4kings a shard of his soul on the way to link the flame, as a reward for their job in managing the city as well as they did, and to set an example of what human/undead civilizations could be capable of. After Gwyn linked the flame, Kaathe came along and corrupted them.
>>319908605
Sure I do, it's like bronzy and goldy only more iron.
>>319908759
Wut?
Youre kidding right?
>>319908759
>>no more hallowing
>>instant flasks
>>instant backstabs
>>equip load no longer exists
>>bloodbourne dodges in plate armor
Nice memes.
what happens in the age of dark?
>>319908759
>instant backstabs
>no equip load
>bloodborne dodges in plate armor
I see that you actually have no idea what you're talking about, or are just baiting
>>319908921
he's memeing
>>319908928
Can't see shit captain.
>>319908928
No one really knows.
>>319908928
the abyss consumes the world.
it probably wouldn't be corrosive/dangerous to the touch like the ones in Oolacile and New Londo, which were affected by the sorceries of Oolacile that were used to revive Manus. DaS2 implies that a "native" abyss would be comforting/addicting to the touch.
However, your mind would degenerate as you would be consumed by animal instincts in the process, like a hollow
>>319909028
>>319909049
would be pretty cool to see it in Dark souls 3. Maybe like sky gets swallowed by the abyss and shit happens and its tomb of giants 24/7 everywhere
>>319908928
No one really knows for sure, all we can tell is that the Lords lose their power, except the Dark lord, wich gets super powerful.
Also the snakes are up to something
>>319904686
>>319904828
No, you are the reincarnation of the Furtive Pygmy. Because he was the only one who born with the Dark Soul. And that is you.. the chosen undead.
>>319909914
do you even lore bro?
>>319909914
you are NOT the reincarnation of anyone, the title "chosen undead" is meaningless, it is applied to anyone who happens to be strong enough to ring the bells. you are no-one, you have no fate that isn't decided by your own 2 hands
>>319910043
>>319910063
The Furtive Pygmy, a deity often forgotten in the ancient tales, was the owner of the Dark Soul, and is a supposed ancestor of the player. The Furtive Pygmy planned to use his newly gained power to bring about the Age of Dark. This is the task that is passed on to the player by Darkstalker Kaathe if the player wishes to.
http://darksouls.wikia.com/wiki/Furtive_Pygmy
pls faggots.
>>319887226
In his prime Gwyn would be stronger. He is literally a shell of himself, lost ability to use miracles, but is still fast as fuck and a monster fighter. The devs decided to make him perriable which hurts the perception of his power but he would be absolutely godly in his prime.
>>319910063
this. All players and phantoms are just transient wanderers of this world. Canonically YOU are the chosen one because you get to the end of the game
>>319910310
>http://darksouls.wikia.com/wiki/Furtive_Pygmy
>supposed
Yes pls, continue being one.
>>319910420
>YOU are the chosen one because you get to the end of the game
And Skull Lantern.
>>319910310
he is your ancestor in the same sense that Adam and Eve are the ancestors of all of humanity, dummy. That in literally no way implies that you're his reincarnation, it just means that the pygmy was the first human, and that you can (if you're a complete dumbass) posthumously satisfy his wishes and kickstart an age of dark
>>319910478
Manus is a primeval human and may or may not be the Furtive Pygmy himself, whose Humanity went wild.
http://darksouls.wikidot.com/manus-father-of-the-abyss
>Manus
>may or may not be a furtive pygmy
>means that player might be furtive pygmy too
>pls, you cant win.
---------------/The Chosen Undead kindles the flame > Dark Souls II
---Dark Souls
---------------\The Chosen Undead becomes the Old One > Demon's Souls > Bloodborne
>>319909428
Well technically in both the trailers and leaked screenshots the sun almost appears to be bleeding. It looks like the abyss is taking over.
>>319908460
I think the descriptions for the Manus soul shard things call them the daughters of the abyss or some bullshit like it.
>>319911549
>>319911549
Yeah basically the darkness can take form from even shards. Since Manus and by proxy the dark soul is related to humans explains why the "daughters" of Manus appear human or mostly humanoid.
>>319910310
>The Furtive Pygmy planned to use his newly gained power to bring about the Age of Dark.
Furtive Pygmy confirmed for NEET
>>319912167
the only person who says that the Pygmy wanted to bring about an Age of Dark is Kaathe, and Kaathe speaks nothing but L I E S
>>319904901
>everything would hollow eventually, and all that would be left would be Serpents.
Meh, it started out with Dragons and grey everythings. Then, for no reason whatsoever other than intrigue, there was Fire. And with Fire came Disparity.
Meaning you'll eventually have another Thing come out of nowhere and destroy the status quo. And then a chosen darkman will become the Lord of Thing.
>>319912242
There really should be a way to kill the serpents.
>>319912242
Kaathe and Frampt are nothing but manipulators. Kaathe whispers into the Furtive Pygmy of starting the Age of Dark while Frampt whispers in Gwyns ear to keep the fire lit at all costs.
>>319911843
Humanity *IS* the dark soul. That's why Kaathe calls the furtive pigmy your progenitor. The pigmy split his lord soul many, many times, and created humans.
There's a reason why the humanity item looks like a dark version of a boss soul. and the daughters of the abyss souls in DaS2 look like the humanity sprite.
>>319912250
however, why would you want to destroy all existing civilization and doom the current inhabitants of the world, just because "it is meant to be this way?" that sounds like the plan of a cheap, 3rd rate shonen villain
>>319911843
I know how it works, but it's still bullshit. The Chosen Undead receives Manus' soul and possibly popped it, the shards shouldn't even exist.
>>319912474
It's called "putting them out of their misery"
>>319912431
the manipulations of Frampt are him choosing not to tell you that linking the flame involves burning yourself alive, so that you'll happily do so without realizing the implications of what you're doing to yourself. it really is in everyone's interests to keep the flames lit
That's a lot of health you got there, it would be a shame if something happened to it all
>>319912570
>everyone in the world is suicidal, just like me!
>they all secretly want to die, they just haven't admitted it to themselves yet!
go away, Allant
>>319912614
Please don't meme on this Christian board.
>>319912614
yeah, that WOULD be a shame if I didn't have this nifty regain mechanic
