I always see complaints about how a game series simplifies and streamlines mechanics to appeal to casuals.
But are there any examples where a game actually streamlined things for the better? Where making things leaner actually improved the game?
street fighter v. since the execution barrier is gone it means that scrubs no longer have any excuse for when they get crushed.
Smash 4
Pokemon breeding is one of the biggest examples I can think of
No More Heroes 2 getting rid of that goddamn hub world
>>315602773
Isn't it still stupid?
Wind Waker changing the iron boots from a menu option to a c-button item.
In the same vein, Twilight Princess letting you swing your sword underwater instead of only being able to attack with the hookshot.
>>315602623
Paper Mario is a pretty good example
If you treat it as a sequel to SMRPG, they basically took a standard rpg system and simplified it to 3 stats (hp, mp and bp) while reducing all the attacks to single integers of 1
It almost felt like an abstraction of rpg gameplay
Monster Hunter is the only one I can think of but its kinda weird
The games have gotten easier because of the streamlining, but the main reason the games were difficult in 1st/2nd gen was because they were exceptionally clunky, and monsters had fucked hitboxes. Some of this is still around but its not really as prevalent, it really shows in 4U though since it seems like a lot of the old monsters were more or less untouched.
>>315603007
Some enemies still had an armor stat, lol
TF2 streamlined TFC's gameplay something fierce
then it un-streamlined itself even harder
Call me a casual, but I'm rather glad ZUN added a visible hitbox and got rid of input delay after Embodiment of Scarlet Devil
F**K YOU!
>>315602623
Dota 2 in a nutshell
Oblivion from Morrowind changed the combat for the better.
>>315603559
Well, input delay in EoSD was just bullshit. The PC-98 games didn't have any as far as I could tell. And the visible hitbox doesn't make a difference after playing once or twice anyway.
>>315602623
>you know what they say, all toasters toast toast
what did he mean by this?
>>315603034
I'm not sure you can say 4U is casualized when GQs are probably one of the grindiest and overly complex mechanics put into the series.
Metroid Prime 2 lightening up on the endgame keys hunt and Metroid Prime 3 going even further.
Divinity 2 is a better game than Divine Divinity despite streamlining a lot of features and moving from an isometric point and click RPG to a third person action-RPG.
>>315602808
I actually liked exploring that hub for secret balls and dumpster shirts on my own time. It was driving back and forth between the job office and the job site over and over for money that was excruciating
I'm probably going to get some shit for this, but Metro: Last Light. Sure, the stealth in LL was a little too forgiving, but I'd rather have that than it outright not working like in 2033. And the less any part of any single video game resembles the amoeba escort, the fucking better.
>>315602989
>that comically slow swing
Why even bother
Terraria streamlining several things in later editions. Being able to freely run past cacti is one of my favorites.
>>315602623
LALALALATSA SPA'GEDDI
>>315602943
It is, but in comparison to how it was before, it was a huge step forward. The odds of getting the Pokemon you want are better in the long run, but starting out and spreading the stuff to other Pokemon species is a pain if you don't trade for Dittos.
Banjo Tooie hugely cutting down on the notes you had to find on a level, as well as making eggs easier and faster to replenish. The idea of only needing one glowbo each for Mumbo and Wumba was good but they probably could have hid them better.
Also cheating was streamlined, but who cares about that?
>>315602710
Isn't most of that because the stock controllers all suck ass for fighters and nobody wants to shell out 100 dollars to be competitive at one game?
>>315602623
>dmc4 style swap for Dante vs dmc3 pre mission select
>everything about hitman blood money
>oddworld abes exodus vs oddworld abes odyssey
>general FPS shooters adopting mouse support
>old shitty rpgs dropping shitty useless stats like "swimming"
>any game that uses minimalistic interfaces
>homeworld 2 menus vs homeworld 1
I have others but meh
>>315604139
GQs are completely optional though. People who run GQs have likely done literally everything else the game has to offer, and I'm betting a good 80% of players don't even reach that point.
They're not really that complex even, it's just health/damage inflation + RNG.
x-com
come at me, assholes
>>315602623
no, dumbing down is always bad
>>315602623
I was one of the few that grew up with Mario that doesn't think 3D Land and 3D World are Tezuka, Koizumi and Miyamoto "raping" my childhood.
Call me a shill if you will, but this was essentially how I wanted 64 to be like as a kid because I remember feeling so alienated by it after enjoying World so goddamn much.
>>315603007
I find Paper Mario stands on its own. Mario and Luigi felt more in tune with Mario RPG standards
>>315603974
It was a nonsequitor.
Mario is suffering a stroke.
>>315605234
Oh, this so much. Terraria is god when it comes to streamlining. The final update was the most convenient thing that happened to videogames. Quickstacking to nearby chests, mount and other stuff-slots, Staff of Regrowth+Flower pot-ledges, it all became so much more fun because of a shitload of features that made the game less tedious. This is what streamlining should be.
>>315608767
>Call me a shill if you will, but this was essentially how I wanted 64 to be like as a kid because I remember feeling so alienated by it after enjoying World so goddamn much.
I agree. I always thought it was weird that the 3D games removed the non-timed powerups.
That being said, I'd still rather play a 2D Mario over 3D Land/3D World.
>>315602623
Bioshock 2's hacking
>>315605856
>Banjo Tooie hugely cutting down on the notes you had to find on a level, as well as making eggs easier and faster to replenish
Yeah but this was actually shit. Tooie might have been a 10/10 game if the levels hadn't been empty as fuck. Nobody minds a collectathon if it actually fills out what are otherwise barren worlds.
Ico's design philosophy was about cutting out all unnecessary objects and it's considered a great game.
>>315603839
Agreed, but The Elder Scrolls needs a new combat system, hacking and slashing in Skyrim is boring as hell
>>315612551
More devs need to take notice of this. Its called design by subtraction
>>315602623
Shitty example but Banjo tooie pretty much notes worthless (New areas of the hub are now accessed by just using a move you learned from a previous one). Considering how much people were bitching about Rare doing collectathons making them trivial made the game feel more streamlined.
LOG was just talking out his ass in Nuts and Bolts when he said they had too many items.
>>315613060
*makes Notes
Megaten dumping spending half an hour shuffling for the skills you want during fusion in favor of just choosing what you want.
granted it might be a bit too lax now and could have some restrictions like your demon having to keep whatever their innate skills are, but still at least i can spend that half an hour doing something else now.
I guess Dragon quest ditching the whole 'you have to open a menu to look underfoot or open a door or talk to someone or fucking go on stairs' might count
>>315613685
>People complain about this shit in Earthbound when there's a shortcut button to talk/check things
