Why does /v/ like steam again?
>>275024071
Underaged children.
>>275024071
valve drones
>>275024071
I can share my Games on 10 PCs on people with different accounts.
I got my friends covered.
>>275024071
I don't.
I don't have friends to give games to. What now retard OP?
>>275024071
There has never been the extensive used-games market on PC like consoles have so it's never been an issue.
Only idiotic console tards criticize this aspect of steam.
who else GOG>Steam?
>>275024071
Remember the good old days when people hated steam
>>275024071
Blame EULA for that not Steam.
>>275024071
none of my friends are so poor they can't buy a cheap game off steam
>>275024071
people have gotten older and the younger generations has just accepted this way of handling DRM as the norm.
I'm 20, I don't really give a fuck about Steam. They give me games at insane discounts, I don't have to deal with paying for online. I'm ok with taking the risk of losing all my games if the sink ships.
>Buying second-hand Windows
People actually do this?
>>275024071
>having friends
normalfag pls go
>>275024230
I don't believe having freedom is retarded.
>>275024071
You can sell Windows 7 CD keys?
Right? Who uses anything but Uplay now anyway?
>>275024321
>normalfag
>>275024271
Not sure if troll. The end user license agreement is written by the company that owns the software your using. So it would actually be valve.
>>275024267
Yeah, back when it was a shit service.
But starting around 2008-2009 they made it a LOT better.
Because it's the only reason why the PC is still a viable platform to sell games on
>>275024434
>saved pic for when people call me a normfalfag for having a gf
fuck you normalfag neckbeards, YOU are the true normies
>>275024469
You have to be underaged to believe this. Steam doesn't even sell games. They sell subscriptions to licenses.
>>275024278
>if the ship sinks
If you know how business works, you'd know this is practically impossible.
If Valve were to start failing, they'd sell Steam to another company.
>>275024278
Except you are not loosing all your games if the ship sink.
>>275024526
:^)
>>275024557
I'm not arguing about the technicalities but you gotta admit, without steam a lot of devs would ignore the PC altogether
You can't do that with Windows, I'm telling Bill.
>>275024071
Hey, remember the good old days when you could trade in PC games at a used games shop for cash or store credit?
Yeah, me neither.
>>275024434
you could have easily posted that yourself normalfag
>>275024071
you cant resell windows keys either you fucking autistic shitstain
>>275024071
EA shill pls go :^)
>>275024646
They already are. You think Ubisoft games running at 20 fps on 2000$ hardware is a coincidence? Steam has been the final nail in the coffin. No publisher is going to look at a platform selling games for pennies and say "this looks like a great idea to invest in." Shitty console ports ARE NOT PC gaming.
>>275024670
Nope, but it's worth bringing up when the sorts of aspies who post on /r9k/ and WizChan are clearly around.
>>275024454
What I mean is that Valve is distributor not a publisher, they don't dictate the EULA for every game on their platform.
>>275024563
>>275024582
that's why I'm taking the "risk"
I don't believe I'll lose all my games. But IF that happens, I might be ok with it. Almost all of my games I've bought from steam were under $15 because of steam sales.
>>275024245
I'd agree if GoG actually had some games on it
>>275024737
who is this supreme gentleman, anon?
>>275024557
>I'm so clever because I read an excerpt from the EULA
Retard, that's not what it says. Steam as a service is the subscription, which sells you game licenses which you can download and install through the steam client.
Otherwise it wouldn't be possible to register games bought on steam on another service like Origin.
>>275024071
Here's the problem. The Windows disc has limited uses. 3 I think.
Here's the fix.
Either let them play it at your house or allow them temporary access to your account and they can stream it from your computer. I doubt they want to own the game forever and the game is so cheap during sales that it's stupid to complain about this. Especially when most of the games I own I bought using tf2 items to gullible retards. It's really not hard to get your money's worth.
>>275024734
>One publisher treats PC like shit
>That means everyone does
Full retard.
>>275024772
I don't know Anon, but whoever he is, he has some moves.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFqn8gTmEQw
>>275024774
>You can use your subscription on other services!
>Steam can remove your CDkey whenever they feel like it completely removing your ability to play the game
>>275024834
They're the only major publisher still publishing all their games on PC.
>>275024754
There's not even a "risk", in the extremely unlikely scenario that Steam falls, you'll still have all your game licenses, which can be moved to a different service.
>>275024880
>Steam can remove your CDkey whenever they feel like it
Why would they?
>>275024734
Daily reminder of what Ubisoft thinks of PCs
>PC only, who cares
>>275024071
The only reason why you can't sell PC Games is because of piracy.
A real life object can't be pirated, which means that if you sell it to somebody else, you need to buy it again back from him, or just a new physical game, if you want to play it again. They don't lose a digital or physical sale.
If people were unable to pirate, then you selling a PC game would be allowed, but in digital sales the rules on what you own aren't the same, because you can easily pirate the game and sell it to somebody else without them knowing you did, and keep the game. Which means they lost a whole sale to somebody who would have got it from them for the full price and also from them instead of you.
That's why Gabe doesn't let you.
Though I don't know if Windows 7 keys can be reused.
>>275024941
Because they don't give a shit about you. Don't like their new TOS? Fuck you, we'll just take all our games back.
>>275024959
The fact that Steam is synonymous with PC gaming just goes to show how dead PC gaming is.
>>275024941
They are a business, do anything they don't agree with (even if it is not illegal or immoral) and they can do it whenever they want. Read the terms of use.
>>275024880
>Steam can remove your CDkey whenever they feel like it
And any MMO company actually own your account and can terminate whenever they fucking wish.
It's a legal safeguard to avoid people suing their ass and every kid with a rich dad dragging their ass in court.
>>275024880
>They're the only major publisher still publishing all their games on PC
Yeah, except for EA, Activision, Square Enix, 2K etc etc
Fucking dumbass.
>>275024737
What a faggot that kid was
>>275025000
>>275025016
Not sure what you mean by
>anything they don't agree with
But if steam ever did decide to arbitrarily take away all your games, why not just pirate them?
>>275024770
does it not have "modern" games? I wouldn't know as I bout some good pre-Windows 7 games off of it like Planescape, Baldur's Gate, The Witcher etc.
>>275025086
Why not just pirate them in the first place and not deal with the DRM?
>>275025139
Because I like supporting developers
>>275024978
Um, real life piracy of objects happens all the time. Your concepts are sound, but the way you are explaining it is fucked up beyond aspie repair.
>>275024880
>Steam can remove your CD key whenever they feel like it
You do realize that literally every single EULA since the early 90's says this, but right?
Even console game EULAs.
Stop trying to be clever, because you aren't.
All you're doing is regurgitating the same shit shitposters say.
>>275024230
>being part of a shithole justifies jumping in the biggest cesspool there is
You'd think smart mustards would vouch for DRM-free disc releases. Imagine all the things they could put in a $60 bundle since bare games rarely cost more than $40 on PC. But nope. They would rather eat shit from the fat asshole and beg for more.
>>275025052
>>275024772
>>275024737
You do realize this was a false flag?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HO9TNctr1UM
>>275025204
You realize before you had to tie a CDKey to some shitty 3rd party service, they couldn't physically steal your games, right?
>>275025191
Why would you support a publisher that thinks you're a pirate? Buying a game doesn't support developers, it supports publishers.
>>275025204
Yeah. Sony will totally crash into my house and take ALL my PS2/PS3 games from me for violating EULA.
Are you literally autistic? Do you not see the difference between formal rules in applicable and non-applicable environments?
>>275025273
>Why would you support a publisher that thinks you're a pirate?
Why would they think I'm a pirate?
And money isn't the only support you can give.
>>275025139
>>275025139
Because the "DRM" also downloads, installs, updates and in some cases allows you to easily mod your games.
Steam has gone beyond DRM.
If the DRM isn't invasive or harmful, it isn't bad.
If you're going to be the type that spouts "all DRM is evil!" Regardless of context, you should become one of those FOSS fags.
>>275025273
Yes, buying games doesn't support the developers at all. They just magic money into existence depending on how successful their last game was and cut staff for the hell of it when a game flops.
>>275025197
What real life objects are pirated?
How am I explaining it badly, this is what is going on.
>>275024879
I agree, he's like the hero gotham deserves, but not the one it needs right now
http://youtu.be/ACRzA_8tBtw?list=UU7MlRJfnKM_QDPE90A4m-TQ
>>275025354
Why would they add DRM if they thought you would buy the game anyways?
>And money isn't the only support you can give.
Elaborate. You mean like word of mouth? Pirating a game doesn't stop you from talking about it.
>>275025240
ive seen so many retardation after my 2 decades of internets I can't even tell if ur retarded or being funny
>>275024071
Yes OP, you can totally sell your old CD key for Windows 7 unless you never activated it, which would no longer make it old.
>>275025497
>Why would they add DRM if they thought you would buy the game anyways?
They didn't add DRM. They put it on steam.
When you buy a game you are showing your support, whether or not 100% of that money goes to the developers.
>>275025273
>>275025340
The point he was trying to make is that those clauses exist in ALL game EULAs, but they're never acted upon because they're just there to cover the publishers ass in case something goes terribly wrong.
Like, "WW3 started"levels of terribly wrong.
>>275025610
Putting a game on Steam requires you to install Steam to download and buy it. How the fuck is that not DRM?
>>275025631
You mean like not agreeing to the new TOS?
>>275025672
I never said it wasn't. I said the developers/publishers didn't add DRM because they think you are a pirate.
Please try to keep up.
>>275025497
Putting a game on steam isn't "adding DRM", it's making use of their digital distribution system.
If they don't want to use Steamworks DRM, they don't have to.
There's a whole list of DRM free games on Steam, you only need the client to download and install the game. After that you never have to launch steam again in order to play that game.
>>275025783
Explain to me how I buy a game that's only on Steam without ever installing that piece of shit.
>>275025672
>Putting a game on Steam requires you to install Steam to download and buy it. How the fuck is that not DRM?
Because Steam isn't inherently DRM.
>>275025672
>TOS changes are the end of the world
You do realize that whenever you update software, you have to agree to the new TOS, right?
Seriously, how dumb are you to not understand how software TOS and EULAs work?
>>275025854
stfu fucking valvedrone, your shilling is giving us cancer.
>>275025854
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steam_%28software%29
>Steam is an internet-based digital distribution, digital rights management,
>>275025884
You do realize you can't play your games without agreeing to their new TOSes, right? Why would a DRMless client have this "feature?"
>>275025672
>Putting a game on Steam requires you to install Steam to download and buy it. How the fuck is that not DRM?
>Distribution services are now DRM
I think you need to read up on what DRM is, because it isn't what you think it is.
>>275024321
>>275024526
>>275024670
>2014
>unironically using the term normalfag
Just play videogames you manchildren
>>275025430
Piracy happens all the time in real life, in varying degrees.
Stealing is piracy, objects can be stolen. Copying is piracy, objects can be copied (look at all the knockoffs and imitations). Hell, real fucking pirates are out in international waters right now, really look it up in the news.
Your explanation is off because you aren't taking into account that the downloads or installation of the purchased games are intangible, therefore they aren't losing anything by giving you one, however they are gaining your money. That implies a lot of differences if you think it through to it's end: they are not giving you anything, any object.
Piracy is wrong and yet kids today all think it's something that is so easy and not a bad thing. Want that shirt in the window? Break the shirt and wear it. That's the same as downloading a pirated game.
On the other hand, control of the games as these companies are doing is not the same as selling you something and not getting a sale if it is copied. They may not have gotten that sale anyway. Think that through a minute.
>>275026012
/v/ isn't for playing videogames, it's for arguing about them.
>>275025997
>requires a 3rd party client
>not DRM
If it's not DRM, why can't I use my own client. Are you going to claim PSN and XBL aren't DRM?
>>275025340
Your example of WHAT THEY CAN'T DO is exactly why things are going in this direction and will continue to do so, in order to try control the pirates.
If you don't follow the rules, you get cut off. That's the perfect world they want and it's coming. In a way, if you are producing and selling anything at all, it'll be good for you, too.
>>275025952
>You do realize you can't play your games without agreeing to their new TOSes, right? Why would a DRMless client have this "feature?"
Except that isn't true at all, you fucking retard.
If the game doesn't use Steamworks, you don't have to use steam to launch it.
We never claimed it was a "DRMless" client either, we said that DRM is an optional component of Steam available to developers.
HI
>>275025997
I've worked in IT for over 20 years and can't believe all of this conversation going on.
I don't think DRM is bad but I'll try help explain DRM once and for all, in a way all you can finally understand:
They are digitally controlling the right way you must access something.
Understand now?
>>275026073
>requires third party client
Using a download and installation client is NOT DRM.
By your definition, installation programs are DRM because you can't manually install the software yourself.
It's okay when Valve does it
It's okay when Nintendo does it
Where do you think you are OP?
>>275026217
What is your point and who is it directed to?
>>275026019
>Want that shirt in the window? Break the shirt and wear it. That's the same as downloading a pirated game.
What? No it isn't.
You agreed to it (and do so again) every time you buy a game on Steam.
Just because you don't read the TOS doesn't mean they don't exist.
Personally, I've never really participated in the used games market before moving to PC, and even if I had, the convenience/cheapness of Steam outweighs the no resale policy. If you don't like it, don't use the service.
>BUT MY GAMES ARE ONLY AVAILABLE ON STEAM
Pirate them, then, or write letters and make petitions at the company for DRM free games. The consumer-friendly EU laws are too easy to exploit as proven time and time again.
>mfw consolefags believe they own their games
They are no better than piratefags if they think they own their games just because it is a physical copy
>>275024978
It's not like you can't pirate console games.
>>275026272
>Using a download and installation client is NOT DRM.
see
>>275026259
>They are digitally controlling the right way you must access something.
>>275024278
>20
>People who were literally babies back in 1995 think they can talk anything about video games.
>>275026259
Making use of a specific distribution method isn't DRM.
By that logic the postal system is DRM if I want a Linux install disk.
>>275026327
What? Yes it is.
You want something that you do not properly have access to and will not pay the amount of monetary funds to acquire it the proper way. You take it. You commit piracy.
You think all those "download a car" ads were just jokes from drunken nights of writing?
>>275024071
>ms paint comic
sure told us
>>275026312
That is from the Windows 7 EULA. Selling the CD Key of a windows 7 installation as OP's image suggests is very much against it. Goddamn near every piece of software has similar terms in its EULA. Complaining about shit that is widespread and pretending it's unique to Steam by making up mspaint scenarios is retarded.
>this one guy trying so hard to act like Steam is bad
>>275026458
see
>They are digitally controlling the right way you must access something.
Your postal service example is also the same idea, but you don't understand why.
I'll help: Ever try to send a letter for free?
>He worships Gaben a billionaire jewish CEO that does nothing sell fake shit like hats and crates, NOT games
>He loves Steam DRM and actively shits on other DRM such as Origin (which has been improving since it's launch) and Uplay (still crap) while claiming Steam isnt DRM, but a special snowflake DRM that makes it not actually DRM
>He raves about Steam sales which are literally the same every year and prays to Rabbi Gaben for selling him a digital copy that cost Valve nothing to produce at a reduced price
>He is okay that CEO Rabbi Gaben is a literal pony fucker
>He defends that fact that Steam stores your DNS cache for retention and NSA style analysis
>He is a valve drone
>>275026486
It is completely different. A shirt is a physical product that is finite in number and requires money and labour to construct. There is only one shirt and if you want another shirt you need to make another one.
Meanwhile a digital file can be copied infinitely for no cost.
If you could legitimately download a car, you are not stealing anything because there is nothing to steal. The whole point of the 'download a car' thing is that it completely misses the point and makes a mockery of anti-piracy campaigns.
>>275026486
No, it's not.
From a MORAL perspective, sure, you have something you didn't get the right to obtain. However, theft involve taking a product you don't have the right to obtain and as a result, that product is no longer available to be obtained legitimately, costing the creator of that product/distributor money. Piracy, as it exists with games, makes a copy of the product while leaving the original intact, meaning the game that you copied is still available to be purchased and thus, the only thing lost is a hypothetical sale.
I know, do like me, buy new, pirate old.
>>275026564
I work in IT and that quote of the CD key usage is only for the OEM version, by the way.
It is non-transferrable in the sense that it is to remain on the computer and has to "move with the computer" to the next person.
The full retail version of Windows has no such limitation, which is why it costs more.
>>275025826
You have to install it, but you can uninstall it right after.
>>275024071
No one's stopping you from selling the cd-key and the disk, it's just that it won't work for other person.
>>275026585
>I'll help: Ever try to send a letter for free?
Ever switch the send to and return to address?
>>275026729
So the DRM is only required once. It's still DRM.
>>275026636
You are incorrect and don't understand the concepts here.
Being digital means it can be copied yes, but there is a cost that you are paying for: the entertainment, the experience. That is what they bring up in court if you are prosecuted for piracy, not the lack of the item or box for the game.
You enjoyed an experience that the company created and it must be paid for. That is the shirt in the window. If you work around the payment and get the experience of the game material without paying, that is what makes it is piracy.
Do you really think these torrent sites are getting fined and shut down because the copes are digital and mean nothing?
>>275026574
Consolefags can get really no-lifey in here. Best just to wait it out and let them steam it off
>>275026632
Quality post
>>275026259
>Work in IT for over 20 years
>Still goes onto the shithole that is /v/
What do you do? Jerk off to your animes in the networking closet all day?
Remember, it is ok if Valve does it.
>>275024880
>>Steam can remove your CDkey whenever they feel like it completely removing your ability to play the game
And Sony and Microsoft can remotely turn your console to a brick, so what?
>>275026654
Sorry, but that is the thieves' cant for piracy, trying to rationalize it.
It does not matter if the original copy remains, you are obtaining something without monetary payment (what is normally required for you to give). You have it backwards, like most people who argue piracy in games:
The main point is not that they aren't losing anything, the main point is that you aren't giving anything.
You are sidestepping the "trade" part of things, which is against the Trade Laws and Commissions. You are committing piracy and can be prosecuted.
You faggots want shitty DRM? I'll show you shitty DRM.
Some of you may haves used Keurig Brewers, which make a quick and alright tasting cup of coffee. Normally, all you need is the coffee packet designed to work with the machine and you'll get your coffee, and over the years unlicensed manufacturers started making their own cups, because they were relatively easy to make (it's just grounds and a filter in a tiny plastic cup).
But with these new Keurig 2.0 Brewers, if you don't have OFFICIALLY LISCENSED KEURIG COFFEE PACKETS, you can't use it. There's a work around by taking the lid off of a liscensed cup and taping it on to whatever other one your ant since all it does is scan the rim, but that's besides the point. If you had an original Keurig Brewer and bought unliscensed packets, you would effectively have a huge pile of useless shit.
>>275026761
You missed the point. What you did is illegal and there's a reason why.
Explaining the store window can be broken does not make taking the shirt legally acceptable.
>>275027000
>brings up consoles
Steam isn't PC gaming. There were alternatives to that piece of shit before it killed PC gaming.
Because
>>275026785
And that's inherently bad because...?
>>275026965
Thank you for the insult, but I am attempting to explain something here to people, to try help, then I'll leave.
>people arguing over steam being DRM
If you argue that the Steam client, in and of itself, is DRM, then you must acknowledge that GOG also has DRM since you need to create an account and login to purchase and download games.
>>275027005
Oh, from a legal perspective, sure. It's called piracy and not sharing for a reason.
But it's not theft. In the eyes of the law it falls under the same category but it is infinitely less harmful than theft.
>>275026987
>>275027027
This is fucking vile.
It's like buying the fucking machine isn't enough.
>>275027027
that's not even close to the drm clusterfuck that steam is.
Keurig can't switch off that thing from a distance at any moment. You can still make normal coffee with normal packets without much hassle, and you can still use it, even if you tamper with it.
All of this is impossible with steams drm.
stop trying to defend steam you fucking valveshill, its cancerous and dsigusting
or you are underage, in that case I pity your brain deficiency
>>275027027
I've owned 5 Keurig coffee makers now, and bought the 2.0 to replace my Vue. None of the stores here sold the Vue cups so I always had to order them online, which was too much of a bother. The 2.0 has been great to me so far, though.
Never used those knockoff K-cups anyhow.
>>275027027
that's just proprietary shit, DRM is different
>>275027087
Because it's completely unnecessary. FTP has been a standard for over 4 decades now. Why the fuck should I install Valve's trash just to use it?
>>275027107
ignore the NEET child, for your own sanity
>>275027221
Sony and M$ can exclude your console from their network as well.
Your point?
>>275026987
its OK when nintendo does it!
>>275027174
Are you touched in the head? Piracy is absolutely the same thing as theft
>non steam game 50$
>can sell it ages later for 1-10$
>40$ loss
>buy steam games and spent 1-30$ to begin with
>>275027328
>spouting fucking baseless bullshit strawman
- argument completely cancelled
> b-b-but sony and microsoft
holy fucking shit just stop posting till you get a bit older, willya?
>>275027320
Unnecessary and harmful are not the same thing
>>275024071
because it's cheaper than buying in a store.
Most games had you bind CD keys to accounts anyway so you couldn't play multiplayer with a second hand one.
>>275027174
I think you should learn what the word Theft means.....
http://dictionary.law.com/Default.aspx?selected=2119
Esp.: you are using what you have taken and they did not consent
You seriously have a problem and should rethink your concepts.
>>275027575
bad != harmful
>>275024071
Technically it's also illegal to resell Windows keys, unless you buy keys specifically for resale. just that you don't currently have a persistent MS account that they can blacklist you from, so that the rule would have teeth.
However, with W8 and beyond, MS are creating app stores built into the OS, like steam, so this will start to be an issue.
>>275024071
>>275024096
>>275024114
Eh, Ill bite. I guess its a little restrictive in that I cant sell games that I have bought. However, I can easily see that becoming a security vulnerability. They obviously lose money from it, but I'm sure they have to pay fees to maintain the server/sell the game/get the license. I think its a small price to pay.
Everyone is on it, and it will likely always be the most common/populated game-network(inb4 facebook)
Best Built in game network-social platform, it has most everything I want
Has most all the games I want.
Having a digital library is convenient.
Hosts servers/makes games extraordinarily accessible
Simplifies online play/network issues
No real alternatives.
Some games give you keys, and in the event that steam ended you would be able to use those keys to download new copies.
Until there is a competitor offering something better, Ill be enjoying steam.
>>275027467
All I'm saying is that you shouldn't be so partial as to hate one company alone, just because you are assblasted about them.
Especially when everyone else is doing the exact same DRM on their users.
When you tried to get personal you automatically gave up on the discussion, so I will take it that you are just shitposting. Hope you will get well soon.
>>275027221
You act like Steam is going around revoking access to games at will. They're not. Policies like that are put in place to protect against major offenders
The worst part is, people accept it and defend it.
>only console children complain about this
Hell, at this point, it's not really about that, but about the freedom to do whatever you want with you things YOU BUY.
It's one of the main reasons I pirate. The other being fuck it, I'm poor. But still, the point remains. It's incredibly strange when people actively defend such poor standards.
It'd be like going to a restaurant. Ordering a plate of food but realizing the plate of food is too large for you alone, so you offer to share it with your friend. This way you can both enjoy the same meal without your friend having to buy something he may or may not enjoy and may or may not finish. And even if he did, there'd always be that bit left over. (see vidya, completed the game, it just sits there). Now normally, you'd be able to give the food (game) to your friend either for free or $5 (original price being $40). Except then the owner of the restaurant comes out, steals your meal you paid for, kicks you and your friend out of the restaurant, and bans you from ever coming back. And keeps your money.
Can you imagine that shit happen in real life? People wouldn't stand for that.
Imagine it with cars? No one would stand for that shit.
I don't know why people respect Gabe that fat fuck. He's a jew.
>>275027702
>major offenders
Wanting to sell your old games shouldn't be an "offense".
>>275027383
As you (or the anon you're agreeing with) said:
>You are sidestepping the "trade" part of things, which is against the Trade Laws and Commissions.
Which is true of piracy and theft, and in this instance I'm using "theft" the refer to physical "breaking a store window and stealing a shirt" theft, not as a catch-all for not properly engaging in trade as per the law. But there is a mechanical difference in how theft and piracy occur, and while the end result for the person committing the piracy/theft is the same, the end result for the original creator/distributor/whoever is moving that product is vastly different.
You can sell your account.
>>275026486
You're confusing actual physical theft with downloading a digital product that is only copied and left intact for anyone who wishes to actually purchase it. Morally you obtained something you had no right to obtain without trading something in return for it. The distributor only loses a sale while millions purchase this digital product that doesn't really exist except on a screen.
So you're basically telling me I've obtained an idea without paying for it. Even though the distributor might not have deserved my trade that I worked hard to obtain in the first place.
Perhaps, their idea is broken or useless and they haven't disclosed to that to me in this trade agreement.
That's basically a scam.
Should I allow myself to be scammed by them without this knowledge?
But I know that if I obtain this product for free from somebody else, I'll be able to see whether or not this product is useless or not.
So do I allow myself to be scammed still or do I obtain this product for free from the man?
I'm only going to make the scammer's pockets slightly empty. And he's still going to scam others naive enough to fall for his scam.
>>275027742
Guess what: Software licenses are not cars or food. Software licensing hasn't materially changes in the last 30 years. It has always been this way, there was just not way to enforce it up to this point.
>>275027742
>I don't know why people respect Gabe that fat fuck. He's a jew.
Because people realized too late that Valve can fuck you over for any reason. Not sucking Gabe's dick can cost you your entirely library.
>>275027742
I don't know when the last time you went outside was, but you can be kicked out and banned from a restaurant for doing things they don't like, shockingly enough even if you've already paid
Why are consoletards so fucking mad today? Jesus christ.
Maybe because their second board /pol/ got purged? I dunno.
>>275027928
It's almost like theses extreme circumstances only occur when huge violations occur and we only get one side of the story from the outraged assholes.
>>275027813
Being scammed implies that you did not know you could not return the item. The Agreement you click past without reading every time you buy a game (read it, it changes at times) tells you that you cannot return the game (on Steam) and you are agreeing to this, as part of the Trade. It is no longer a scam.
>>275027928
That's different you retard, a proper comparison to a restaurant and DRM would be that the food you order can only be eaten by you and if you share it you get given the bill, kicked out and banned forever
no more cd's to get lost or scratched, its nice to have everything in one place
also I don't have friends to give my games too, what now?
>>275027837
This.
People thought at one time "they can't come in a take my games away because they can't break into my house". Well now they are making you go to their house to play the games, and can kick you out anything they want.
Problem solved.
>>275027797
But the owner/creator/distributor of the product is still losing something with piracy, namely time and money invested in creating that product and rights to intellectual property
Test
>>275027881
Name one time when that has ever happened
Any store can "fuck you over" and ban you from entering for any reason they want, but who do they actually use that on?
>>275028285
When you don't agree to their new TOS.
>>275025016
being a business also means that if they treat their customers like shit they lose them
taking away people's games for no reason would be terrible for business
>>275028065
And a proper comparison from the games side is inviting your friend over and sharing the same purchased product temporarily. Your friend isn't getting his own meal, you didn't go into the kitchen and get a second meal for him without paying for it
>>275026632
go back to /pol/
oh wait, you cant lol
>>275028316
So basically, you got nothing and you are just bitching because you are feeling insecure about a TOS?
>>275024071
Uh, if you use an OEM license your OS will be tied to your mobo. And nobody buys the $200 non OEM licenses.
I used to think that game piraters were doing it to be rebels or sticking it to the man somehow.
I seriously cannot believe how many fucking people don't know why piracy is wrong...
It's like they can get something for nothing so they just do it.
>>275028285
You have obviously never been to Japan, where they know that americans are too fat and loud. Have fun trying to go to restaurants.
>>275024734
>Shitty console ports ARE NOT PC gaming.
PC does not equal starcraft, CS and shitty MMOs
>>275028316
Maybe if you violate their TOS you lose your games. There's nothing in the TOS that would make the average person who just wants to play games refuse to accept
>>275028519
Um, I do and so do my coworkers
but I knew about OEM and was explaining it to him
>>275028628
Nothing in their TOS yet, you mean. They can change it whenever they want. What if they force you to view ads randomly when you're not even using Steam? What if they want to install a rootkit to "stop hackers?"
>>275028525
I only ever pirated when there was no demo so I could see how the game ran.
>piracy is wrong
No, piracy is sometimes wrong. Try and fucking tell me I shouldn't pirate my chinese cartoons. I fucking dare you to try and give me a reason I shouldn't.
I don't get the bitching.
What's stopping anyone from simply trading their account?
Just make a new account for every game you buy.
>>275028525
Grey Market sales are 10 times worse than piracy.
>>275028846
We already confirmed it's just some mad shitposter/s.
>>275028628
I think a lot of people might have an issue with the "No refunds under any circumstances. Ever." policy.
Retailers typically aren't allowed to sell broken shit and just say "Go fuck yourself." when you want a refund for it. Getting one out of Valve is a crapshoot.
>FTFY
>>275028779
If you are obtaining cartoon that aren't meant for you (you are not getting consent) or you would normally have to pay for them (to legally watch them), then what you are doing is wrong.
Being wrong should be enough reason, but it isn't for problem people. That's why the punishment is there. Remember that Mega guy who got more years than a murderer? That's one reason, since you asked for one.
>>275024267
This is on the same level of funny as that naked banana picture. It's written by the same kind of person. It's not funny.
>>275028968
>gabes hand
Because I usually buy things with the intention of buying them, not taking them to the pawn shop for crack money.
>>275027980
PCfag here. Steam is cancerous shit.
>>275028968
Wrong. Retail (not OEM) Windows is fully tradeable.
>>275024325
>console
>having freedom
valvedrones will defend thisthe original year long ban was for votekicking a valve employee in csgoevery time something like this is posted valvedrones sperg out and go on about how the person posting it is the leader of myg0t or some bullshitthey also permabanned 4 other accounts stored in my clientregistry.blob which didn't even belong to me
>>275028876
The only people that lose out of grey market sales are the almost completely redundant distributors who like to do shit like artificially inflate prices, pressure for region locking in software/hardware and import restricting laws, price fix and other nefarious crap.
Fuck those guys.
>>275029103
I use steam, love it, and don't know any of what you are talking about but don't seem to agree with it
![dnpJJ[1].png](https://i.imgur.com/hiCvRtE.png "dnpJJ[1].png")
>>275029103
fucking new captcha shit eats my image every time i post
>>275029087
>being able to freely trade and sell games back
>not freedom
>>275029086
>a. Software Other Than Windows Anytime Upgrade. The first user of the software may make a one time transfer of the software and this agreement, by transferring the original media, the certificate of authenticity, the product key and the proof of purchase directly to a third party. The first user must remove the software before transferring it separately from the computer. The first user may not retain any copies of the software.b. Windows Anytime Upgrade Software. You may transfer the software directly to a third party only with the licensed computer. You may not keep any copies of the software or any earlier edition. c. Other Requirements. Before any permitted transfer, the other party must agree that this agreement applies to the transfer and use of the software.
Have fun with that.
>complaining for a game that cost 1/5 of the original price
Yeah, whatever, I've 1000 games on steam and I haven't paid more than 5 dollars for any of them, meanwhile every time I buy a game for my ps4 to play with my friends I've to pay around 40 dollars.
ITT:
>Steam is bad you'll lose all your games and get banned!
>But here's 1000 people for that 1 person who didn't get banned!
>WOW OKAY VALVEDRONE ENJOY YOUR CANCER
Jesus christ you niggers. The jews really have a chokehold on your balls if you think paying more for games is a just reason because of a highly unlikely scenario unless the fucking great depression happened.
>>275028129
>losing time
No, it has already been made.
>losing money
No, it wouldn't have been bought.
>losings rights to intellectual property
They are still maintaining their rights, which are just make-believe anyway. Nobody has an intrinsic right to anything.
>>275029163
OPENING A STEAM SUPPORT TICKET IS A BANNABLE OFFENSE
__________________
END OF RINE
>>275029163
What the hell is that about
Wow
>>275029225
Don't bother Anon.
Valve drones are a lost cause.
>there are people who still buy physical copies of games
>>275029225
> not understanding
Now you realize that the console is the DRM to play the games
so maybeDON'T FUCKING USE STEAM IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT
Ever notice how every anti valve thread has about 80% anti valve posts in the first 5-10 minutes, but then becomes 80% pro valve posts immediately after?
I'd say they're paid shills or something because of how they act, but I know that valvedrones really do have this insane mod mentality of #doingitforfree like the fucking JIDF
>>275029256
You are wrong. You are quoting OEM licenses. Stop it.
Retail box is transferrable, I've called Microsoft when I sold my old PC to ask and they said as long as I gave the disc itself, kept no copies or material at all.
>microsoft/sony/nintendo can ban your console forever and ever
It's the same fucking shit, steam ban your games, and console companies ban your console.
>>275029225
Consoles are physical DRM.
>>275029438
>dont use it if u dont like it ;)
valvedrone mentality summed up in a single sentence
It's not like valve has a chokehold of the PC games market and abuses this fact as much as they can while massively expanding to move in on the territory of non game software and music
it's not like 50% of PC games these days aren't steam exclusive due to their incredibly abusive parity agreements you cant get out of without a decent publisher, or their equally as abusive NDAs which prevent any sane dev from mentioning these facts
What kind of a retard gets banned from Steam? It is completely against Valve's interest to ban you. You'd have to do something very stupid to warrant a ban.
>>275029586
>I don't like product
>"ok don't use it"
>HURR TYPICAL THINGDRONE
>>275029493
Addendum: you can also install a Retail version of windows on a new PC that you purchase or build, you cannot do this with an OEM version if you buy that version
>>275029103
Valvedrones have been constantly defending everything about Steam in this thread.
I don't know how anyone can be so delusional to think there isn't anything wrong with Steam.
>>275029508
My console still works though and I still have access to my digitally downloaded and disc-based games offline.
I just can't ever access an online service that they charge me for if I'm banned from Xbox Live or the PSN.
>>275029256
This is for OEM copies of Windows 7, when it is sold with the computer.
>18. TRANSFER TO A THIRD PARTY. a. Software Other Than Windows Anytime Upgrade. The first user of the software may make a one time transfer of the software and this agreement, by transferring the original media, the certificate of authenticity, the product key and the proof of purchase directly to a third party. The first user must remove the software before transferring it separately from the computer. The first user may not retain any copies of the software.
>>275029508
And does that make it justified? Just because consoles are fucking shit PC games have to be as shit to make it fair?
Valve is a fucking ovarian cyst, everything about video games would be better if it didn't exist
>>275029586
what games were you unable to play because they were Steam exclusive?
>>275029508
They can only prevent you from going online on the consoles, they can't remotely disable your entire game library like Steam can. Well, not the physical ones. More and more now buying a physical copy of a PC game nets you nothing but a Steam key and an an offline installer for Steam. It's not the same fucking shit at all.
>>275029261
ITT:
>rumors, mostly based on idiocy and shitposting, which lack proper sources, other than "I can prove that my account is banned, but you just have to believe me that what I did, was nothing bad."
>Miraculously, no one ever experienced or even heard about that, other than the aforementioned bs.
>People have no idea, that every game, since the 90's, probably even sooner, included a ToS, or EULA that specifically stated that you may own the copy, but not the content.
>People act like it's a new thing, now that companies have ways to enforce said ToS, and EULAs, besides "we hope you do the right thing".
>Manbabbies kick and scream that they can't give their friends copies of their games anymore, like they did with Ultima VII.
>Complain about Steam, when this is practically a footnote of the digital age.
The only opinions on this I actually count, are those from complete retro hippies, who actually use nothing that requires ToS or EULAs. Like those idiots on the Amazon rewiews "Huh what is this Steam thing. On my computer? 1/5 Stars! The bad corporations strike again!". Not that it's a valid point, but at least they have a basis for their bullshit. Here, it's just shitposting.
>>275029603
That's what consoleniggers don't understand, meanwhile microsoft bans you only for using a hitler avatar or something.
>>275024296
Second-hand software is existing market.
>>275029257
>it's okay because it's cheap
This is literally the dumbest (and only) arguments valvedrones use.
>>275029603
Dumbass. Valve can and will ban you for anything at any time. If you so much as talk about sharing games in steam chat, Valve will ban your account
>>275029603
Yeah, something as insane as open a steam support ticket asking valve to fix a bug in their client
>>275029163
>>275029404
>being this retarded
A PC is also the DRM to play the games then?
>>275029493
It's not OEM licenses you idiot. OEM is this:
>A) If you have Windows 7 OEM and have not installed it you can sell it. If you did install it you can only sell it with the computer it was installed on.
>>275029737
I heard Valve works with the NSA to spy on you and will ban you if you talk shit about Steam IRL
>>275024071
>mspaint comic
>steam allows trading
>people band together into groups and start trading each other games for 0.00 US dollars
>after a set number of games is bought, people can just trade them to each other forever, no new games are bought
Wow, so clever and freedom loving.
Why don't you just pirate if you want free games?
>>275029603
>It is completely against Valve's interest to ban you.
If you want to play PC games these days Steam is pretty much no longer optional.
Valve knows this. They know if they ban you it just means you have to create a new account and re-purchase shit you want again. You could argue it's actually in their best interest to ban people for any sort of bullshit reason, the only thing stopping them is the public outcry that would follow. One day they might just not care.
>>275029792
You are quoting OEM license, nigger.
This is not OEM:
>18. TRANSFER TO A THIRD PARTY. a. Software Other Than Windows Anytime Upgrade. The first user of the software may make a one time transfer of the software and this agreement, by transferring the original media, the certificate of authenticity, the product key and the proof of purchase directly to a third party. The first user must remove the software before transferring it separately from the computer. The first user may not retain any copies of the software.
>>275029737
Why would you want to share games? Do you play some kind of shit single player casual games, and once you've beaten them in 10 hours you want to give your friends a chance to play through for free? Fuck off.
You can sell and buy used steam games in Europe
Laws > ToS and EULA
>>275026012
>lets talk about vidya like real GAMERS™
no fuck you
>>275029902
ToS and EULA aren't legally binding anyway, they're just there so that companies can screw you.
>>275024071
reselling a W7 key is violating the ToS though
>>275029737
Do you actually expect Valve to facilitate piracy? You actually feel entitled to play games you didn't pay for for free? LOL
>>275029886
I think you should read things from the Microsoft site:
http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_7-windows_install/whats-the-difference-between-windows-7-retail-and/4737adfe-8a76-e011-8dfc-68b599b31bf5
Once again: YOU CAN SELL THE RETAIL VERSION OF WINDOWS
YOU CANNOT EVEN INSTALL THE OEM VERSION ON THE NEXT COMPUTER YOU BUILD/OWN
>>275029872
>They know if they ban you it just means you have to create a new account and re-purchase shit you want again
Rampantly banning people and taking away everything they bought won't make them give Valve more money. It'll make them leave and find another service
>>275029956
>ToS and EULA aren't legally binding anyway
Yes they are, they are contracts.
I mean they are legally binding in so much as a court agrees to enforce them and courts generally will agree to enforce them, though they might void certain clauses if they violate existing laws or something along those lines.
>>275029802
Steam used Peer2Peer chat for a decade
suddenly up out of the blue they make it HTML based and relay it through their own servers first
somehow when there's a dispute about scamming they can access the chat logs and find out who the scammer is
I wonder how they do that :^)))))))
Also, steam illegally scans your CPU/RAM even when the client isn't running, illegally sends back your dns cache in plaintext (gabes astroturfing on that reddit thread is pure bullshit, the people who made the information about the dns cache being sent back public have debunked his lies), scans every .txt and dll on your machine to find blacklisted code (they honestly banned the organner cheat by scanning for its config.cfg, people upset by this made a point by making their servers upload the tiny cfg to people that connected to them and in turn VAC banned thousands of people, valve refused to lift any of these bans)
and monitors outgoing and incoming traffic, you can see this for yourself using wireshark or tomato
Relevant.
>>275029963
No it's not. Stop spewing bullshit.
>18. TRANSFER TO A THIRD PARTY. a. Software Other Than Windows Anytime Upgrade. The first user of the software may make a one time transfer of the software and this agreement, by transferring the original media, the certificate of authenticity, the product key and the proof of purchase directly to a third party. The first user must remove the software before transferring it separately from the computer. The first user may not retain any copies of the software.
>>275029791
No, you can do pretty much anything you want on a PC. You can even play console games on a PC with an emulator if somebody has cracked the .iso
You are free to manipulate the game as much as you want with a P;, the only restrictions are from the maker of the game.
>>275024267
You mean the last few years on /v/?
People who like Steam are in the minority here now. It's outright haters and battered housewives mostly.
>>275029896
get a load of this tough guy
>>275029956
They're legally binding as long as they don't go against a law
>>275030103
>>275030103
You do realize that aside from being wrong and doing wrong, one day you may end up in Jail because you are pirating Windows?
>>275024071
>Windows
>a software that makes most of its profits from businesses and only a small praction from consumers
>is owned by one of the largest companies in the world
>video games
>makes the entirety of its profits from consumers
>run by companies much smaller than Microsoft that often have to close down (even large publishers like THQ)
>>275024071
I have no idea. I'd guess astroturfing, that is the only reason why Reddit sucks Valve's dick so often.
>>275030084
USA is the only country on earth that actually allows companies to fuck you in the ass this hard, every first world nation treats EULAs like toilet paper
Daily reminder that Valve is campaigning to violate the rights of European citizens by appealing EU consumer protection laws, and valvedrones will defend this
