You have 10 seconds to name a better medieval-esque battle scene in a TV series or film. You can't
>>71387152
Agincourt in Branagh's Henry V
Camlann in Excalibur
Stirling in Braveheart
there's three, none of which have shitty plot contrivances or last-minute cliched rescues
>>71387199
>Agincourt in Branagh's Henry V
Fuck off that scene sucked and was shit. Go watch it again.
>>71387199
Okay but name two more. You can't.
Also,
>Henry V
>using Shakespeare as a fair comparison
His films are always a notch above
The Amon Hen sequence in Fellowship of the Ring
The siege in The War Lord (1965).
Battle of Helms Deep
It doesn't beat the best of movies, but it's certainly the best of any TV show.
Zulu,end battle
Waterloo,the charge of the french cuirassiers
With Fire and Sword,assault of the polish hussars
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-9x5ADYWXeo
It was good up until the pile of dead bodies magically appeared
>>71387152
>that guy flying back 10 fet from being stabbed
How is all the choreography on this show so fucking awful?
>>71387438
Confirmed for no knowledge of history
>>71387406
>Zulu
>Waterloo
>Medievel
no
>>71387460
Please show me how I am wrong armchair historian.
>>71387199
Go to sleep grandpa. None of those are as dynamic and true to first person perspective like the GoTs' Battle of th3 Bastards.
They did something no one has ever done before. It was fookin legendary.
>>71387454
>this one minor detail that was on screen for one second caused him to dislike an entire series
>>71387515
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cannae
>>71387591
I don't see 10ft high pile of dead bodies mentioned in that, and the romans didn't stand still and allow the carthaginians to surround them. The romans also didn't have a giant that could have broken the enemy ranks easily, not to mention that the romans could have flee'd which is what encouraged them to rout.
>>71387152
Henry V
Hattin, Kingdom of Heaven
any LotR set piece
The War Lord
El Cid
The Messenger
Barbarossa
Fetih 1453
hardhome
>>71387152
Brave heart
>>71387152
Kingdom of Heaven, Battle of Jerusalem.
>>71387152
ok nobody said that, so I'm gonna say it
Helm's keep, The Two Towers
>>71387152
Army of Darkness
http://www.strawpoll.me/10609725
>>71387152
Even Braveheart's battles were better.
Hardhome was also better.
>>71387152
Pelennor Fields
>>71387152
> medieval-esque battle
>>71387199
The Battle of Agincourt was not what makes Henry V good
The battle itself is actually pretty bland, just 5 minutes of onscreen chaos until apparently all the French are dead
Also nothing like how the actual battle played out
Any LOTR battle. Take your pick
>>71388512
>Hardhome was also better.
Nope
>>71387591
>https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Cannae
...somehow, I don't think this is applicable when it involves 10x the humanity as the GoT battle.
>>71388558
Thanks for posting this.
Scene looked cool but uniforms and phalanx foundations for that (made-up) era are just retarded.
>>71388558
>spear walls were never used in the medieval era
okie dokie, just going to put your opinions in the trash where they belong
>>71388712
why? genuinely curious?
Army of Darkness.
Kingdom of Heaven.
Excalibur.
>>71387591
>look at me I watched the Inside the episode stuff where they mention a battle
>DnD mention a battle I read up on wiki so what they showed us in the show is totally accurate
>>71387591
>reads dabid saying the battle is based on cannae
>that battle must have had a 10m high wall of corpses then
>goes to 4chan to show off history knowledge by linking to wikipedia page
>>71388730
>>spear walls were never used in the medieval era
Burger detected
Not spears, pikes and yes, medieval militia never used pikes and giant shields (even pavise was smaller).
>>71388730
It's not just spears. It's the way they use them and the uniforms. It require training and manufacturing not available in Westeros or the European Middle Ages. Phalanx formations disappeared for that reason (only to reoccur in early modern times Switzerland).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swiss_mercenaries#Organization_and_tactics
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_uniform#Medieval_feudal
>>71388823
This IS faux-historical. Would you have minded it if it was a Tercio with the musketeers replaced by bowmen?
Jaime & Bronn vs Sand Snakes was better.
>>71388873
Westeros is only just coming out of their golden age
Targ dynasty fell only 20 years ago
Many powerful houses and well trained armies still exist
>>71388873
Phalanx was dropped because the majority of armies were levies and their lords didn't particularly give a shit if they died. Phalanx required the entire formation understanding that lots of them are going to die simply for the others to hold.
If the army (I've not seen GoT) was a trained, professional army, there is nothing wrong with it. But if they're just bumfucks told to pick up or a spear/pike or hang, then the chances are they would have broken ANYWAY. Most of them would have gone "Fuck this, they can't catch us all if we all run".
>>71388904
>This IS faux-historical.
It's american show.
>Would you have minded it if it was a Tercio with the musketeers replaced by bowmen?
Yep, because you cannot build Tercio using feudal militia as infantry.
>>71388919
>Westeros is only just coming out of their golden age
Nope
>Targ dynasty fell only 20 years ago
So?
>>71388981
Oh they're a militia, I thought they were a professional army. Still, it is faux historical and has fantasy creatures in it.
Warhammer Fantasy, for example, did the same shit and nobody particularly cared. It was for fun and I guess not played so serious... Plus they had guns...
You know what, ignore this.
>>71389020
>Warhammer Fantasy, for example, did the same shit and nobody particularly cared.
yeah even GW not cared about Warhammer Fantasy.
Kingdom of heaven
>>71388919
Yeah? Tell me the part in the books where they tell us that soldiers get the required year-long phalanx training and where they tell us about the high taxes required to pay for all that fun. Pro tip: You can't cause Gurm portrays Westeros as an archetypical feudal society.
>>71388979
There is more than one reason why Phalanx disappeared, it was not merely tactical. One reason, and you are right about that, is that feudal lords didn't afford that sort of training for their peasent fuck.
>>71388558
Why not just hack away at spearheads? There are not that many spears protruding out and Boltons can't see shit anyway due to giant fucking shield blocking their view.
Blackwater :^)
>>71388979
Agreed. Though in Westeros there are no professional armies.
>>71388791
>>71388820
autism
>>71389047
They cared for 34 years, despite 15 of those costing them hand over fist.
Still, it was neat. Not that it's gone per se, but I never particularly cared for the game cause nobody played it.
40k does the same shit, the idea that laser weapons would replace kinetic weapons is silly, since fucking rain would reduce the potency of a laser shot. Obviously GW explain the reasoning behind this well enough, but that's the point.
GoT and shit loads of settings have shitty shit that makes no logical sense, but runs on 'rule of cool'.
>>71389136
Those were 2 people in less than one minute simply because you suck a trying to appear smart.
Meh. Everyone is just going to say it sucks because it's edgy to dislike it.
>>71387547
>no one has ever done a tracking shot in an action sequence
>>71389100
Of course there is more reasons. From heavy cavalry being more prominent, to armour evolution and manufacturing, expensive training and maintenance and drilling shit into people.
I think rule of cool is the reason it happened, rather than any military logic. What is, exactly, the alternative to that kind of scene? A simple shield wall could work, but it doesn't look as cool as Phalanx.
>Came here to praise LotR battle scenes
>Others already did
Cheers!
>>71389186
It looked cool but was ruined by shitty writing before and after the battle. Almost nothing made sense (Sansa not telling Jon about the Vale army) so the stakes felt artificial as fuck. If you look at the battle as such I am fine with it (as long as no one tries to tell me it's historically accurate) I just couldn't ignore my disbelief especially because it was quite clear what was going to happen.
I also didn't like that they didn't include and objectives like a hill or something on the terrain. Also they stole so much from Braveheart there anyway that the Umbers should have switched sides during the battle.
>>71388981
>It's american show.
This is some sort of criticism? Did someone dent your brain with a hammer?
>>71388823
>>71388873
I'm from an area famous for pikemen, where a French force of knights, that also included about 2000 pikemen, was defeated by a local army of mostly pikemen in 1302. Please tell me how pike formations were not a thing in medieval times.
No giant shields though, that's retarded
>>71389221
Are you the dude that hasn't watched GoT? I don't think we disagree much if you are
>>A simple shield wall could work, but it doesn't look as cool as Phalanx.
Well they all have that bearded fucks in dark clothes. It can work especially if you use tons of fake blood. The lightening and everything was well done really. It looked cool because of that imho not because of the phalanx-thingy.
>>71389285
>This is some sort of criticism? \
yeah since you usually sucks when trying to make something related with non-American history.
>Giant would literally be unstoppable if they gave him a weapon, literally any weapon, just give him a fucking tree
>He goes in unarmed just so they can make the battle more "dramatic"
>>71389305
The flemish cities were rich as fuck and used well trained town militia. The Belgian Quattrocento is not really representative of the European middle ages.
https://youtu.be/adxlG_IAYlQ Jerusalem has come
>>71389362
I, personally, suck? I have nothing to do with the creation of Game of Thrones. Are you okay?
>>71389502
>I, personally, suck?
Yep
>>71389464
Hey look, it's Doran Martell!
>>71387571
hey i didnt say that one scene made me dislike the series. I said all the choreography is bad, and it is.
>>71389601
it's bad now. Season 1 was good.
>>71387152
I really can't. There are some comparable scenes(maybe a handful) but nothing outright better.
>>71387152
>no Ran
tob plen
>>71389435
But it was a thing that was used.
Didn't the Scots use pikes at the battle of Stirling bridge or is that just Braveheart?
>>71387152
Genuinely can't.
Really top tier, I honestly think the steady cam part following john as chaos flows around him is the best battle scene I've ever seen.
Miguel Sapochnik saved GoT with those last two episodes.
>>71389435
Flemish are notoriously retarded too, don't argue with them
>>71388791
You are retarded. They mention a real, historical battle because it inspired the very thing you're scoffing at for being "unrealistic"
And wikipedia is the easiest/most convenient way to link to it. I doubt you read books anyway.
>>71389988
Please Dutchbro, it takes a lot more to get a rise out of us
>>71389832
found pleb
>>71387152
The battle was a mix of 300 and LOTR. Of course the plebs loved it.
>>71390081
Nobody just stands around waiting for a shield wall to completely encircle them. If you're going to dumb it down so either the audience can understand what's going on or because you don't have the resources or artistry to portray it in a way that makes basic common sense, you're going to get criticized and quoting something they read about some battle isn't going to change the end result.
I just watched Braveheart on Netflix, the battle scenes are sloppy and a real slog. Just shot after shot of gore to make it seem epic. Really shitty cinematography.
>>71389832
[u]
>>71387152
Gladiator https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ygsa6iO8X9o
Braveheart
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qy-O09do1sY
Kingdom of heaven
Troy https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OFWOzENwX3M
Lotr ay
300 any
Robin hood 2010
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n75PgMSxAOw
Vikings https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0kSj3T8XJMA
Its not that hard to find sword and bow fights, unless you're a edgy 14 year old whos only seen game of thrones.
>>71387152
Literally every CommBlock historical movie ever shits on GoT in this aspect.
>>71387152
It's not even the best battle in the show.
Shit, is not even the best battle in that episode.
>>71389800
I don't know about that but Braveheart is full of shit. Also the weapon itself is not the problem. It's the weapon+uniform+training. Armed peasants or Lords with horses don't fight like that. Professional armies do but those armies need payment, for this payment you gotta have high taxes etc. All this stuff is modern (just like the Flemish cities were modern in 1302) and doesn't have a place in a rural feudal society.
>t.some dude working oh his history PhD
>>71390081
I cough at is because the Battle of Cannae did not happen in the Middle Ages. 10.000s of professional soldiers is not the same as 3000 fighting peasants and some highborns on horses. In the same episode they talk about Gettysburg when mentioning the body pile. It's the same level of retardation. Also the initial point was the pile of bodies, something that is not mentioned by Polybios as far as I can remember.
>>71391010
The thing is Westeros does have modern (in that sense) cities, quite a bit of them it seems. It's weird to assume there's no militias there or that there was no way Ramsay could get a hand on trained soldiers, though they'd probably be mercenaries.
The Bolton uniforms make it a lot more stupid though.
>>71391010
>>71389800
Bannockburn.
>>71387152
The way that it captured the chaos and claustrophobia of battle was astounding. The way that it wasn't just a battle scene, but it worked on the emotions of it as well, that's what made it stand out for me. All the near misses at the beginning, the tension of the every tightening shield wall, the panic of Jon trying to claw his way up from getting trampled...
I loved every second of it, I've never been so invested in a battle sequence.
>>71391350
>>71391010
Ok so yeah, I doubt Scotland was heavily urbanized at the time; or was it?
>>71387384
>He hasn't seen spartacus last season
>>71387152
I've seen russians rush b better than this guy rushing into battle.
>>71387591
End this meme. The battles were nothing alike except one side got surrounded in both. Some shitty bits from GOT battlescene
>Giant is unarmed
>Ramsey charges his cavalry at the enemy cavalry instead of just using his spears and obliterating them
>No path to flee left to the Starks; enemies that were completely surrounded fought much harder. Most medieval tacticians left an escape route for their enemy, so they could cut them down in the rout
>riders of Rohan knocking down the guys like dominos
>>71389832
That part was terrible. You could see the cuts and tell it was filmed in front of a green screen
Any scene from Kingdom of Heaven
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqeePbcXX-o
>>71390490
Those are all worse than the battle in Game of Thrones though.
>>71387272
fucking this!
The most underrated battle in cinema
>ignoring the main commander letting the enemy troops have the morale to fight to the very end
>>71393309
No they're not. The battle in Game of Thrones is literally just D&D trying to make Jon Snow look cool, and it feels extremely fake. Extreme shakey cam and constant cuts don't help either. Ridley Scott is damn near unbeatable when it comes to historical battles.
>>71393475
>extreme shaky cam and constant cuts
Did we watch the same episode? There was minimal shaky cam and the cuts were fine. They even had that badass steadycam scene, and the CGI was fantastic.
>>71389219
no, not in medieval context
>>71393565
As soon as the long take ended it was a choppy mess
>>71393679
Not really. Constantly looking for the cons in everything you watch makes it seem much worse than it is
>>71393640
But it's a faux tracking shot. You can pretty obviously see where cuts are made
>>71393742
It's hard not to notice the cons when the camerawork and editing makes it impossible to tell what the fuck is happening
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rs3I2UDfzQA
Watch the scene again. The amount of cuts in even just the first minute is fucking outrageous. It's a pretty obvious attempt to cover lazy choreography and stunt work
>>71387152
>>71393861
I suppose you're right. Then again, it's practically impossible to do a convincing battle scene unless there are quite a few cuts.
>>71393763
But having no cuts serves no other purpose than masturbatory. Cuts or not, the final effect was still gorgeous and fresh.
>>71394332
Trying to cover up your cuts and pass it off as a single shot is even worse
>>71391262
No, it is not weird. I am fine with "modern" militias in the setting, let's say in Oldtown or, y'knowy in King's Landing where they have the Goldcloaks and the King's Guard. That's fine. But not in the fucking north the most savage place of the realm lead by the Bolton's. If DnD do something like that they gotta set it up properly but they didn't.
>>71391675
It wasn't.
>>71394449
Fuck me I misread what you wrote: >>71391262
>>71387152
I literally enjoyed the alexander film's battle at the beginning more.
