Thoughts?
>>70158675
Radio Raheem got what was coming to him.
>>70158722
Can you imagine someone in real life walking around with a radio on full blast blaring the same song 24/7? He would be killed in a week if he didnt stop.
>>70158675
good movie. Great soundtrack
neo-/tv/ won't like it, because of muh Spike lee and muh niggers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsM4vMOQHO0
>>70158776
Exactly.
Also Sal literally did nothing wrong and yet the movie paints him out as a bad guy, he was protecting his property.
Why did Spike Lee make a movie about how blacks are reprehensible animals? I thought he was pro-black and anti-white.
Loved it, terrific atmosphere.
>>70158875
According to Spike Lee, white people are scum and niggers are allowed to start riots when they can't get their way
>>70158675
Redpilled as fuck
Can't see how anyone can watch this and feel anything but sympathy for Sal and disgust for the fuckwit young blacks starting trouble with everyone
Joint kino
>>70158722
Raheem is similar to my name. But it's more like Reham just spelled differently.
Spike does a great job showing a realistic scenario. It's interesting in that white people will watch and think the blacks chimped out and are the villains, whereas black people will watch and think destroying the shop was justified and cheer that it's gone. I was actually surprised when I first watched in how fairly he showed both sides.
Why did Spike Lee decide to put those quotes by Martin and Malcolm at the end which summarize the main theme of the fucking movie?
Why do filmmakers do this? Beat us over the head with messages instead of allowing us to make conclusions based on subtext?
Nonetheless it was an alright film.
>>70158875
If you understood the movie you would know that he's not anti-white.
>>70159484
can you explain how the pro-black side views this movie? as a white person I naturally see the blacks as troublemakers that cause all the conflict and I have trouble understanding how someone like Spike sees the movie.
>>70159392
General moviegoers don't catch themes. Spike was trying to get a message out there and in order to achieve that he had to hand-feed the public.
Love the way summer is portrayed in this movie, it's pretty real
>>70159558
>pro-black side
>as a white person I naturally see the blacks as troublemakers
The movie's not pandering to specific sides of the race relation battle. The entire purpose of the movie is to give a balanced perspective in which the viewer sees that white people are right/wrong about some things and that black people are right/wrong about some things. To fully appreciate the movie you should sympathize with all the characters and realize that they're all just victims to their mistakes and of circumstance, same as in real life.
>>70158675
niggers gonna nig
>>70159733
but italians aren't white and yet they are fucking better than those black apes
>>70159733
but Sal does literally nothing wrong, Radio is a fucktard moron as is that dude trying to start the boycott. How can you not just think they caused all the problems? Why is it ok to burn down a store? Why was Radio fighting cops like an idiot instead of cooperating?
>>70159893
I haven't seen this in several years so I only remember the gist of it. However, I seem to remember Sal being a dick. He certainly doesn't deserve to have his parlor burned down, but he does more than "literally nothing."
>>70160004
He tells them not to play rap music, and that he only hangs pictures of Italians on his wall. Such oppression, fight the power!
>>70160110
He was a racist prick and dealt with all the black people with contempt. He was like a highschool jock treating the nerds like shit. Burning his place down was like the beta uprising.
>>70160379
Why would he give them respect? You need to earn respect. He respected Mookie's sister because she deserved it.
>>70158776
Boomboxes are called Ghetto-blasters for a reason. People used to do that shit.
>>70160379
Sal respects them as long as they respected him.
He only ever loses his temper with Radio Nigger playing his music loudly inside his restaurant and the other nigger trying to tell him how to decorate his restaurant
Sal is not presented as a bad guy, it's not the point that big bad rayciss whide man gotta get his shit destroyed
>>70160110
He broke his stereo. He has a right to tell people not to play music in his shop and he has a right to tell them to fuck off but he can't just break people's shit.
masterpiece, 10/10
Too bad all his movies besides this one are terrible
>>70160545
Which is still pretty bizarre if you think about it. I think I read once those things used to eat batteries and you have to drag that thing with you all fucking day.
>>70158675
>that parody scene of the trashcan scene in the critic episode
goodtimes
>>70160492
>>70160585
>He only ever loses his temper with Radio Nigger playing his music loudly inside his restaurant
See: >>70160628
>the other nigger trying to tell him how to decorate his restaurant
The "other nigger" has a point. Sal's in their neighborhood putting up pictures exclusively of. white people. This is really uninviting and Sal's doing it out of contempt for black people. If Sal was a nice guy looking to live in harmony with the blacks he would put some "brothas" on the wall.
Instead, like you, he doesn't accommodate for the situation and things get out of hand. You see, he made us versus instead of doing the right thing in order to ease the situation.
>inb4 if the blacks didn't like it they should go somewhere else or "open up their own pizzeria"
This is precisely the problem the movie is addressing. If we'd stop telling each other to fuck off and instead were a little more lenient, race relations would be golden.
>>70159244
Nail on the head. When Lee was still young, energetic, and angry he could make something this balanced, not giving either side an inch. Then America stayed the same for 25 years, he got rich and hated himself for changing, and we get last year's "Ain't none of us sassy ass sistas giving y'all that poosay till you quit it with the gang violence: A Rich Sander's Supporter Joint"
>>70160852
>This is precisely the problem the movie is addressing. If we'd stop telling each other to fuck off and instead were a little more lenient, race relations would be golden
As long as Family Feud is still on television race relations will never improve.
>>70161002
Trash media is the bane of humanity. That's what /tv/'s here for, fighting pleb entertainment one post at a time.
>>70160654
I've heard Malcolm X is pretty good, after all my nigga is the lead. He Got Game is pretty cool too.
>>70160852
So you are saying Sal can't be proud of his heritage and have an italian restaurant but blacks should be proud of being black.
OK.
>>70160852
>This is really uninviting and Sal's doing it out of contempt for black people
No he isn't. The shop might be in their neighborhood but it's his space. If he wants Italians on the wall to celebrate his Italianness that's his choice not theirs.
> he doesn't accommodate for the situation
You mean the handful of people in the entire neighborhood who actually cared about it? The same ones who had no jobs and were going around harassing other people (black and white) in the neighbourhood for stupid shit?
>>70159874
Never ceases to amuse me when the most mongrelized breed of people on earth feel they can talk about the whiteness of countries they couldn't point to on a map
>>70160852
>Sal's in their neighborhood putting up pictures exclusively of. white people. This is really uninviting and Sal's doing it out of contempt for black people.
Uh, that's just creating atmosphere in the restaurant, any ethnic restaurant does this. Chinese place in my majority white town/neighborhood has Chinese characters and dragons etc. emblazoned on the wall and traditional Chinese music playing in the background. Italian places do the same, pictures of Rocky Marciano, Italian flags, and Dean Martin music in the background.
>>70161130
No. He should have pictures of Italians, but having exclusively pictures of white people gives off an air of racism. Actually, he was doing it out of racism. He hated blacks and wanted to express his contempt for them. This contributed to the building tensions throughout the film culminating in his place being burned.
Whatever you think, Sal objectively made the situation worse. Had he just accommodated for the black people, in whose neighborhood he's operating, none of that bad shit would have happened.
>inb4 the black people should just not have chimped out
From Sal's perspective chimping out is an inevitability. It's his job to be the bigger man.
>>70161171
>No he isn't
Yes he is. He's clearly a racist and you're blind if you don't recognize that.
>The shop might be in their neighborhood but it's his space
This is the exact attitude the movie's criticizing.
>If he wants Italians on the wall to celebrate his Italianness that's his choice not theirs.
Fine, then his pizzeria will continue to be burned. You see how that's a lose-lose. Just fucking do the right thing and put up a Jordan picture and we all live happily ever after.
But no, muh libertarian principles and unrealistic ideals must be adhered to so I'll continue being a prick. Then my pizzaria will get burned down and I'll blame the other guy. And the world will just keep spinning, being a revolving door for these types of people, unable to compromise, weeping when everything goes to shit.
>You mean the handful of people in the entire neighborhood who actually cared about it?
No, I mean the rising tensions throughout the movie. As the film progresses it becomes obvious that there's going to be a happening if no one changes their attitude. No one does and the neighborhood ends up fucked and a guy gets killed. Sal's complicit in that and had he done otherwise his place wouldn't have been burned. But point the finger elsewhere, Sal dindu nuffin.
>>70161648
>Sal should know that the blacks won't respect the law so he should just cave and do whatever they want
t. cuck
>>70161550
Uh, it's pretty clear that those aren't Sal's intentions. Him and his son hate the blacks and he's expressing that through the pictures.
Regardless, Sal's actions are part of the reason the neighborhood goes to shit. If Sal takes different actions, he would have a business at the end of the movie and Raheem wouldn't be dead. Instead, he chooses to be a prick and he ends up crying.
>>70158675
This is going to get abstract, but the thing that gets me about this film is just the aesthetics of it. I've only seen a handful of Lee's films but I can't understand how the person who was behind this could have churned out something as garbage as Chi-Raq.
I just mean things like the colour and the costumes and the sort of hyper-real nature of it all feels so god damn masterful, whereas Chi-Raq is just generic trash. It makes me feel like the real genius behind the film could be the Production designer or the DP or whoever, since I've yet to see Lee replicate how good this films style is.
>>70161774
>it's pretty clear that those aren't Sal's intentions
Hanging pictures up of notable Italian Americans in his pizzeria like every other pizzeria is a clear cut racist conspiracy? Don't agree
And I don't think some token black pictures would get Buggin Out to stop harassing the resaurant, give them an inch and they take a mile
>>70161724
Okay, my man. Don't cooperate with your neighbors and see how far that will get you. I won't feel bad when you get gunned down by some nigger you inevitably offend because of your white pride bumper sticker or whatever.
>>70161904
The niggers should cooperate too
Which most of them in the movie did asides from a few troublemakers who ended up ruining everything for everyone
>>70159874
Edgy.
>>70161940
>implying we haven't
I don't know what it's like in America but if you're honestly going to blame ethnic groups for your problems you're as bad as the BLM people you hate.
>>70161901
>Don't agree
In the context of the movie, it's very obvious that those are his intentions.
>give them an inch and they take a mile
Slippery slope fallacy
Also, it's refuting this point is practically the thesis of the movie. As long as we maintain this us versus them mentality in which we can't give an inch our neighborhoods will continue to be destroyed. If we just compromised a little, all our lives would go smoother.
Imagine how that would actually play out. Instead of Sal telling Buggin' Out to fuck off he could say, "Okay, I will hang up some black guys."
Next time Buggin' Out walks in he sees Michael, Jackie and Michael Jackson. That would really ease the growing racial tension. Maybe he wouldn't be appeased and say hang up more, but at that point Sal could make some joke like "Don't push your luck" or some shit. A boycott would not have followed that, thus the pizzeria doesn't get burned down.
>>70161940
>The niggers should cooperate too
That's precisely the message of the movie. Lee makes tons of points addressed to black people. The problem is as long as we keep up this us versus them game in which we "can't give an inch" we're fucked.
>>70161648
I haven't seen the movie in a while so I can't be sure, but did Sal really hate the blacks? I thought that was only his older son. I actually thought that at one point Sal even said he considered his regular customers family and tells his son to shut up when he talks about how much he hates living in the ghetto with all the blacks.
Also if you aren't shitposting you're doing a very bad job of making your relatively reasonable point actually sound reasonable.
>>70161901
This, as a person who's worked in small businesses often dealing with niggas if you bend over backwards to serve them they will fuck with you as they'll consider you a pussy.
Could Sal have been friendlier with his black clientele, perhaps. And maybe he could have added a picture of an honorary Italian like Sammy Davis Jr., but going "Ok guys I'll put tons of black people who have nothing to do with Pizza or Italians" would make him look like a bitch.
>>70162171
Dude do you really think if a white kid had come in with a boombox blaring, Sal wouldn't have reacted the same way? He would have told the kid to get the fuck out just the same.
People like you are the problem. You don't hold blacks accountable for their actions. The whole neighborhood takes Radio's side just because he's black, even though he was the one creating the issue. If they don't like Sal's Pizzeria, they're free to go elsewhere. They have no right to go in and tell him he has to do certain things with his business.
>>70162175
>tells his son to shut up when he talks about how much he hates living in the ghetto with all the blacks
He only says that because they have no other options. The Italian neighborhood is filled with business so they really have nowhere else to go.
Also, the way he destroys Raheem's radio, I thought, makes it clear how he feels about blacks.
>Also if you aren't shitposting you're doing a very bad job of making your relatively reasonable point actually sound reasonable.
It's 4 am here and I don't often argue/think about race relations. If you could lay out a clear argument that'd be helpful.
>>70159392
Well Spike Lee loves/hates blacks. He makes these movies for black people to educate them because their nigger culture is fucking everything up. So the messages are literally to them to stop being a fucking nigger.
Obviously they cant catch a hint and think Spike is just going "oh heres bad shit u guys are doing, but im sorry for that heres a powerful quote my kangz n qweens"
>>70162416
I don't see Sal destroying the radio as a sign that he hates black people. The way that scene was presented made me feel pretty agitated and pissed off towards everyone in Sal's store too. I think that anybody having to deal with that shit could have gone over the edge there. He's decided to keep his store open later than usual to serve a few extra customers when he didn't have to and now when he's gone out of his way to keep his door open two loud as fuck assholes who aren't customers burst in and start screaming in his face about how his Italian pizzeria needs more black representation, then everybody present gets into a shouting match but you can't even tell what the fuck's going on because all that you can make out over the chaos is 'FIGHT DA POWA' coming out over that fucking boombox that's right in your face.
I think that the violence in the pizzeria was just a general clusterfuck of frustration and tension and that the only ones with clear racial motivations were Sal's son and the guy who wouldn't shut up about the pictures.
And as for a clear argument, I think what you're saying is right, don't be a hard-headed asshole and tell people to fuck off the moment that you hear something you don't like, but the way you're putting it all you really seem to be proposing is folding over whenever somebody applies pressure and won't let up. I'm a law student, and what I've been taught is to always look for a third option when dealing with a dispute.
The two traditional approaches are of course, 'I'm going to push until I get what I want' and 'I'll just give them what they want,' but there's more to it than that. The trouble is that what people really want and what they actually want are often two different things. Take Sal's son for example, he has no problem saying that he hates black people, but what's his real problem? He wants out of the ghetto, but what does leaving the ghetto mean to him? What's so bad about the ghetto? I think that the problem is -
>>70162345
>He would have told the kid to get the fuck out just the same
He didn't tell him to get the fuck out, he destroyed it with a bat.
>You don't hold blacks accountable for their actions
What are you talking about? I'm backing up the parts addressed to white people. If /tv/ were full of black people saying Sal got what was coming to him I'd be pointing out how wrong they are.
>The whole neighborhood takes Radio's side just because he's black
If /tv/ were black this is what I'd say to them.
>If they don't like Sal's Pizzeria, they're free to go elsewhere.
No they aren't, they live in Bed Stuy, they're poor as shit.
>They have no right to go in and tell him he has to do certain things with his business
He's part of community and if he wants to be dick he'll get his place burned down. You're trite "they have no right" is so meaningless in the context of this movie, or for that matter, the real world. We have to accommodate for one another if we're to get along.
best scene without a doubt
https://youtu.be/IA3oxE4X5w8
>>70162623
- that he's lonely. Sal's older, more business-minded, he has his sons and feels close to his customers, or at least much closer to them than his son. And there's Sal's other son, who has his family, but also seems to get along fine with Lee's character, and from this I think we can take it that he gets along fine with their neighbors. But what does big son have? From how I remember it he doesn't really have any friends, is on bad terms with a lot of the neighborhood and thinks he would be better off if they all lived with the other Italians. To him living with Italians isn't just being surrounded by people who look like them, it'll mean he'll have people to get along with. His problem wasn't racial, the racism was just a symptom he developed, I think he's just a lonely and unhappy guy who blames his neighborhood/community for his situation.
Now, pictureman, what's his problem. I think that the short answer is just that he's got a bizarro-/pol/ complex, by which I mean he's unemployed and generally doesn't seem to have a lot going on and has a victim complex going on that drives him to blaming all kinds of shit that's far bigger than him on what are pretty simple and self-contained problems. I think that if he just got a job and a girlfriend he'd finally have his hands full meaning he'd have to drop that chip off his shoulder.
So tl;dr
>Sal's son just needs some friends, find a DnD group or something
>Picture-man just has to get a life
That's done and the neighborhood suddenly has a whole lot less to worry about without anybody having to bitch out on their pride or feel like a loser.
>>70162773
Good post. I guess I was mixing up Sal and his son - it's been like 5 years seen I've seen this.
Black owned establishments do the same shit as Sal did. If you've ever eaten at a soul food restaurant you know what I'm talking about.
>>70163552
>not enjoying art for its own sake but for status
Hello middlebrow
>>70163552
Me on the far right.
>>70158675
nobody did the right thing, Spike's best
>>70159893
in Spike's mind Sal is taking money from the black community but cant give anything back not even such a small thing as having a picture on his wall
How come they didn't attack the chinks??
Honestly. Straight from the heart, if I could find my journal (yeah haha he had a journal. It was required for my school), I wrote clearly "the right thing was that black people need to go." I wrote this with awful spelling, but these were the words that came from the mind of a 2nd grader. We had a project where we needed to watch a diverse movie and write how we felt. Uncle thought this movie might be good. I need to find the damn thing. I recieved a frowny face with "this was not the message anon." Teacher was black so now years later I understand how pissed he must have been with a little hispanic boy writing this shit. But its what I thought "do the right thing meant", like okay the right thing was to make them go away.
>>70164037
Gooks>crackers?
>>70164721
gooks=crackers
>>70158675
Everyone's an asshole and not in a good way, nothing was learned from it, especially the ending. Watch a Mike Leigh film if you want to see assholes and get something out of it.
>>70160852
The movie makes a point to mention that Sal and the other Italians had been in the neighborhood for a long time, before it became a black owned area. Hell, remember the fucking scene where Martin Lawrence and Gus Fring are yelling at that one Italian guy for riding his bike through their neighborhood even though the guy and his family had lived their for over 50 years?
>>70162751
Kek.
>yo them shits is fucked up
>you may as well just throw them out now
Just finished rewatching it. Sal did literally nothing wrong. He had a bunch of niggers in his store chimping out, and he shouldn't have kept his cool for as long as he did. Nothing in the movie suggested he was racist, he wanted to stay in bed stuy, he told his son to quit being hateful towards them, he even apologized and gave the retarded dude some money. He didn't kill radio Raheem, the cops did. The niggers were not even remotely justified for burning his business down.
