Why Marvel Disney doesn't have any good villain?
Red Skull is a great villain they should just use him again.
Most of their other memorable villains are tied up with Sony or Fox.
Galactus, Osbourne, Magneto, Doom
>>69040796
loki is the only great alive one
they killed off the other good ones like red skull and obediah
also this>>69040841
>>69040841
Surely Osbourne comes with the Spider-Man package? maybe they'll do the "Osbourne becomes president" storyline
>>69040841
This. Hugo did a great job with limited material.
Plus Loki is one of the best capeshit villains ever
>>69040796
Red Skull and Abomination were good.
Zemo was threatening too but we can have a consesus yet because supposedly this is his origin story.
>>69040841
Red Skull kinda sucked, though. Should've had a mask instead of their weak "See, he's evil inside so the serum turned him into a monster cuz pottery" shit.
The only cool villain was Zola and they squandered him when he could be ruling Hydra from inside the internet.
>>69040796
I thought Darren Cross and Obadiah Stane were good, but I'm a sucker for villains in power armor in general so I dunno.
>>69040796
Loki and Zemo were good
Yellowjacket death was horrifying.
I thought Zemo was good.
>>69040796
Marvel trade out attributes that make a villain compelling in order to stay family friendly.
Good villains feed on tension and quality motivation. When they are comedic punching bags set up to job you simply can't have these things.
>>69040931
Loki is a good character but a shit villain because his character is non threatening
>>69040796
Because they can't bother dealing with moral grey areas. The only "interesting" character so far is Loki because of this, and that statement is a little far-reaching.
Zemo is a walking cliché.
>>69041147
I guess he's no Lex.
>>69041160
>Zemo is a walking cliché.
We still don't know if he was lying about his motivation and we don't know about his dad.
>>69040796
Iron Monger was great.
Red Skull was good but needs some more screentime.
Abomination was good, and I loved his fight with Hulk.
Ronan was fucking great, and I loved that they channeled classic "I'm the shit and you ain't shit" Ronan.
Loki was actually a good villain in Avengers, but he's overrTed otherwise.
The rest are either wasted potential or just plain weak.
I like Loki. While The Avengers are horrible and the Thor franchise isn't much better, I'll still watch any future film with Loki in it. I wish they would go against the capekino flow and let a villain win for once.
I have no problems, ZERO problems, with evil characters doing evil things. I don't need nuance. The sympathetic villain is overdone; it's interesting that it's the only thing that will satisfy these armchair critics besides murder or rape. There's a lot of evil in the world, and when they come at you, who wants the backstory on ISIS?
>>69041279
Shit I forgot.
Zola/HYDRA/Pierce were probably the best ones.
>>69041286
>I wish they would go against the capekino flow and let a villain win for once.I have good news.
>>69041286
>I wish they would go against the capekino flow and let a villain win for once.
Like Lex killing superman?
>>69041286
Just wait for dr strange, hopefully they deliver with dormarnu
Also this>>69040841
F4 has some of the best villains but the f4 dynamic is so played out they are boring
>>69041089
>>69041101
>>69041279
This honestly. Though I would've loved to see more of Yellowjacket they had a pretty good buildup for him through Darren trying to perfect his formula.
Never got why people hated on the bad guy from Ant-Man so much, I thought that Peter Russo did a great job portraying someone who seemed genuinely unhinged. Way more menacing than I was expecting the villain in fucking Ant-Man to be, and he definitely had more presence than like, Ronan or the shitty elf from Thor 2.
>>69041286
I want to add on to the whole "liking Loki" thing. While I do like him, I hate how weak he is in the films and how easily defeated he is. Love the character but they fucked him up imo.
>>69041642
He was great I felt. He was creepy, emotionally unstable and unbelievably arrogant. He didn't feel like a run of the mill cutout bad guy. Flesh him out a little more and he would have been the best Marvel villain.
Red Skull was fucking great but Hugo isn't coming back. Ever.
>>69041642
They definitely got the unhinged/sadist aspect right with him but I'm guessing the reason he isn't popular is because he 100% has the appearance of some generic evil business man and he wasn't involved in any interesting twists. He unveils the yellow jacket, Ant-Man comes to stop him so he puts it on and they have a big (little?) fight at the end of the movie. Nothing unexpected, the trailers told you the whole story.
Plus he just dies like every other shit Marvel villain, never to be seen again.
>>69043923
They replaced Hulk and War Machine's actors and nobody minded, no one will care if Red Skull comes back sounding a little different. It's been 5 years since Cap 1 came out.
>>69040841
>le red skull is good maymay
>>69041188
>implying the roof scene wasn't GOAT
>>69040841
>Red Skull is a great villain they should just use him again.
Red Skull is literally the most boring and worthless villain that could ever be used.
>>69041293
Making a villain interesting and making them sympathetic are two completely different things.
Frollo from Disney's Hunchback wasn't sympathetic at all, but he's way more interesting than any of the MCU's villains because of how he was fleshed out as a person.
>>69040891
I guess it depends on the specific deal they struck with Sony. But given he's getting his own MCU movie I assume is related characters come too.
Which means Oscorp can enter the picture as a rival to Stark Enterprises in the MCU if they want.
>>69040796
I liked Ronan. Marvel is at a disadvantage because they don't have a villain actor who killed themselves before the movie came out, causing the academy to give them a pohumous oscar.
I reckon Thanos is going to be pretty cool in The Avengers: Infinity War.
>>69041033
>he could be ruling Hydra from inside the internet
How do you know he isn't? Why not let Cap think he died in the missile strike, then upload himself? They won't be looking for him if they think he's dead.
>>69041642
I liked him overall but had a few problems with him. First off, his arc is 100% exactly the same as Stane's; the protege of the company owner, bald, feels like his mentor betrayed him, takes over the company, sells to shady buyers, tries to develop a copy of the good guy's power armor, fights the good guy in his better suit but loses because of a technical problem the hero solved earlier.
Second, the things he does to show how evil he is are bizarre. He kills that one investor in the bathroom because.. he wasn't interested in buying the suit? Not like he threatened to shut down Pymtech.
Also, he's eeeeevil because he tests on goats? It is probably more expensive, but it's weird that the movie thinks that mice are okay but testing on goats is eeeeeeevil.
None of this stuff is the actor's fault though. He was good.
>>69044652
>I liked Ronan.
What was there to like?
He had pretty much no characterization at all.
>>69044723
The last couple of villains written by Markus and McFeely haven't been anything special. The Winter Soldier was great, but that's mostly because of his theme music, the costume department, the way the cinematography was done, and his fight choreography. Red Skull though, was kind of underwhelming, as was Alexander Pierce. Zola was okay though.
>>69040841
>Doom
hopefully that Fox deal pushes through.
a Triumph and Torment movie would be pretty based.
>>69044818
>He kills that one investor in the bathroom because.. he wasn't interested in buying the suit? Not like he threatened to shut down Pymtech.
That was precisely to show how unhinged and childish he was. He killed the guy for disagreeing with him.
>Also, he's eeeeevil because he tests on goats?
They were little baby lambs.
>>69044837
He's a traditionalist, who cares about Kree traditions and values, sees the Xandarians as a sickness, and doesn't forgive them for standing against the Kree Empire. It's not nuanced, but it was cool to watch, and understadable.
DATEH REPORT
16 DECEMBER 1991
>>69044934
I thought the Kree were an allegory for Muslims 2bh
People keep saying Zemo was good, but I think he's only good by comparison to the rest of the shitty Marvel villains. Zemo would be considered mediocre if we had more great Marvel movie villains than Loki and Red Skull. Maybe they'll bring him back later and he'll be more interesting.
Justin Hammer from Iron Man 2 is pretty underrated imo. He's such a cringeworthy wannabe Tony Stark and I love it.
>>69044899
>how unhinged and childish he was
I guess; it just seemed more pointless than anything. Unhinged people usually follow a sort of logic, like thinking he was going to get him shut down, or if he saw a threat to his funding. But that guy just didn't want to buy the suit. The scene didn't sell me how it wanted to.
>They were little baby lambs
Which just kind of reinforces the point. It's a test animal. It's experimented on, then it's disposed of. The movie doesn't say it's animal testing in general that's a problem, because they were going to use rats. It's just "oh no think of the baby lambs!" I guess it makes him look unhinged, but just in a weird, stupid way, not a menacing way. He's so evil he tests on lambs instead of mice!
You can thank Disney for ruining all potentially interesting villains. There's an interview with Mickey Rourke where he claims the studio cut most of his scenes in IM2 to simplify his character. This guy studied Russian for months to sound authentic, and Disney turned him into a forgettable cookie cutter bad guy, lest there was one retard in the audience who'd get confused about a villain having just a little bit of nuance.
>>69044979
Yeah, there's a bit of that there. They also used to be portrayed as sort of fascist and Kree-supremacist, so that's probably in there too. Gunn said on Twitter that Xandar is multicultural, something that was shown but not stated outright in the movie, whereas Kree, at least in the comics, subjugate or destroy any other species and culture they conquer. There's an underclass in their society we'll probably see in Captain Marvel called the "Pink Kree" composed of a mix of various humanoids their empire has subjugated.
So when he says "The Xandarians and your "culture" are a disease." That's probably what he means.
I know most of 4chan disagrees with me, but I think Ultron was good. Charismatic, interesting characterization, and a great performance. Nothing wrong with being a quip machine, especially when you're the robot son of Quip Man.
He also got 3 of the best scenes in the entire MCU.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dK5fJqkINuA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxDQh_-vJss
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhGPvE43aAM
>>69044979
That actually may not be far off, if unintentional. The Kree a technologically advanced culture from very far away who conquered a large empire and menaced Earth, but mostly fought against third parties. However, they also drew soldiers take from native populations to serve as special soldiers for them (the Inhumans). Some Kree are blue and obviously alien, but some look human.
The Muslim empires were very foreign to Dark Ages Western Europe, were technologically advanced, conquered a large empire but were mostly busy with the Byzantines and Persia, and they drew soldiers from Christian families (the Jannisaries). Many of them were obviously Arab and foreign, but some were from Spain or Greece and looked white.
>>69045241
I thought the best part was how the empire didn't officially support Ronan but did nothing to stop him, kek
>>69045335
>I thought the best part was how the empire didn't officially support Ronan but did nothing to stop him, kek
Yeah, that sounds pretty Muslim.
>>69040881
REDSKULL ISN'T DEAD.
>>69044887
Ftfy
>>69045223
You mean Marvel Studios. Paramount was in charge of distribution at the time of Iron Man 2's release
I always thought spiderman had the best villians
>Green Goblin
>Doc Ock
>Mysterio
>Venom
>Carnage
>Lizard
>>69040796
>Iron Monger
>Red Skull
>Loki
>Winter Soldier
All of those did fucking great on film, Abomination was ok. The rest were mediocre
>>69045223
Rourke's complaints are completely valid, but Iron Man 2 is also pretty well known as the MCU film with the most heavy-handed executive meddling and pressure short of Age of Ultron - note that both films drove away their directors from the franchise. They've mostly backed away from that practice, I think; they still need their precious ties to the overall story arc, but they're a little more able to tell their own stories.
That said, as I see it, the "main" MCU story has been told thus far through the Cap and Avengers movies, with the other films mostly introducing characters, not major plot developments. Cap 1 introduces Hydra and the Tesseract, Avengers has the Chitauri invasion, Cap 2 brings down SHIELD and brings Hydra back, Ultron happens, now Civil War happens. There's only been 5 other films after IM2 that weren't one of those (Thor 1&2, IM3, GotG, AntMan) and they don't advance the metaplot much, so they might have a little more free range.
>>69045438
Marvel Studios was owned by Disney as of 2009, and IM2 came out in 2010. Paramount distributed the movie, but Disney produced it.
>>69040796
Zemo was a letdown..
Why can't Marvel make good villains?
>>69040891
I'm waiting for this storyline now that spider-man is in the game, they already introduced the armor
>>69045538
Because Kevin Feige doesn't think villains should be fleshed out. He's gone on record stating this.
>>69045472
>Batman
>Spider-Man
>Flash
>Superman
Have the best villains, in that order. Spider-Man really does have a ton of great villains and it's impressive that they made 5 movies with different villains in each one while only recycling one of them (green goblin) once, and they still haven't used them all. Can't wait to see Mysterio, Vulture and Scorpion in the MCU.
>>69045641
Is that because he's concerned that the movie will become "VILLAIN MOVIE: also with the hero in it"? Because that HAS been a problem with superhero movies before (Batman Returns and Batman & Robin come to mind. Batman Forever was actually pretty good about that.)
>>69045753
That was the biggest reason, yeah. He thinks the movies should focus entirely on the hero.
>>69040796
Because they don't need to.
The heroes are likeable enough, and people don't go to the movies to see villains, they want to see heroes kicking their asses.
>>69045677
Mysterio is criminally underutilized, but he should be in a sinister six film assuming it gets made. He was made for the big screen and gives the production team limitless potential, a good portrayal could really bolster his popularity across all formats.
Pretty sure Michael Keaton will be playing the Vulture for the next Spider-man movie, unless they cast him as OsbornI want to see Maximum Carnage, but they already fucked up Venom so bad the first time I'm not sure how they'll neuter Carnage. Fox would be ok, but Disney would probably never let him see print
>>69045800
He can eat a dick, villains are the only reason I care about the story most of the time
>>69045872
sorry m8, keaton dropped out of homecoming
>>69045800
>>69045914
But that's the reason people watch the movies.
When they see an Avengers movie, they want to see the Avengers.
Iron Man is really popular because people liked Iron Man, not the villains.
>>69041286
Did you watch Thor 2? He pretty much did win.
>>69040796
Blomsky was great, Red Skull was pretty good, and Loki was fantastic in the first movie but has been shit since. I'm still upset they got Christopher Eccleston to play a throwaway villain who spent most of the film in a mask.
>>69040796
The only good villain in a superhero movie has been the Joker, and because of Ledger's performance, because the Joker in the end is just the Mary Sue of villains.
>>69045951
Iron Man has complete garbage villains m8, even in the comics. Iron Man also wasn't very popular before the film anyway
You can't say that about Batman or Spider-man and that's why their films usually revolve around the villain equally. Their own character arcs are fairly easy to follow and their interactions with those villains are easily the best parts of the film. It's also the reason why Superman films suffer so much, because Superman is not an interesting character
Avengers is an outlier since it's a team-up movie, it's a bad example since there isn't enough screen time to spare
>>69046039
>The only good villain in a superhero movie has been the Joker
The fuck did you just say
>>69040796
Spiderman has 75% of the memorable villains in marvel, same deal on how Batman has 75% of the memorable villains in DC
Reddit Skull
hahuehuahehuauhueh
Because they're too busy fighting over the rights for the cool villains, which are mostly X-Men and Fantastic Four villains. Avengers villains suck.
>>69045677
>Flash
I know no Flash villains, who are they?
>>69045945
Fucking why? He's not getting a better deal.
>>69045753
>Because that HAS been a problem with superhero movies before
>that HAS been a problem
>problem
>"""""""""problem"""""""""
Get fucked desu
Older cape movies where the villains consistently steal the show are infinitely more fun than anything the MQU has produced.
The first Iron Man is their best movie, in part because Stane is actually a decently written character and Jeff Bridges was allowed to actually act.
>>69045255
The first Ultron fight was dogshit. His speech was neat but that fight was total asshair
>>69047758
>Sees the script
>Realizes he'd be in the movie for about 10 minutes and would do nothing but spout quips and job for Spider-Man
>Tosses it in the bin where it belongs and waits for his next academy award nomination
>>69048062
>Keaton confirmed more based each day he ages
He will die in my lifetime, and that'sokay
Ronan wasn't really a "good villain", but he was a memorable performance and his introductory scene is fantastic. Lee Pace was great as a mean mugging blue guy.
Loki kinda wins by default for being best Marvel villain simply because he's lasted more than one movie. You'll notice that most all Marvel villains only get one movie before they're retired, which is why Fox > Marvel in that regard.
Magneto might not be the greatest cinematic villain of all time, but at least he's consistent.
>>69045889
Irony, coming from a likely drone.
>>69040796
Last 4 were good. Stane was good, though moreso out of Monger. I might be in the minority, but Loki kinda sucked in all his movies he's appeared in.
>>69040796
ICING PROBLEM?
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>>69047740
Evil guys who go fast
>>69040841
>Disney needs to use others creative work to make something good
nice
what do you guys think of lex luthor in bvs?
>>69040796
imagine the disney marvel version of carnage LOL
>>69050618
Because Spiderman 3's Venom was that great?
>>69048062
Based Michael "if the character quips the script I shall rip" Keaton
>>69050618
Carnage is a shit character that I hope never makes it to film.
>>69040796
The fuck is Trevor doing in that pic? Did the person who make this not even saw the movie?
>>69051525
Spoilers trigger MCUcks.
>>69050571
Not Lex Luthor at all, is he?
>>69040796
There are no good marvel villains. What marvel needs are real antagonists - and they just can't do it, look to the source (Stan Lee). Which is why they will never have a Joker
>>69040796
This is actually a good question. They tend to write 'stress reliever' villains.
What's up with that?
>>69052126
I really like this image
>>69047521
No fuck off they do so well with their shitty heroes like Ant-Man they can easily elevate someone like Ultron if they tried.
>>69046130
>Iron Man has complete garbage villains m8, even in the comics.
I wouldn't mind having the proper Mandarin in the films instead of the bullshit switch and bait they pulled with Iron Man 3 and the 10 rings terrorists in previous films.
>>69051373
Now I'm not so sure but isn't the reason why Spiderman 3 turned out like shit was due to studio meddling. I heard Raimi had entirely different plans for the 3rd Movie but the Studio wanted Venom or something. SPiderman 1 and 2 are still the best capeshit movies especially the second.
>>69045641
That's funny because it's both undramatic and uncreative. You can't demonstrate an idea without giving your villain a brain.
Films aren't a fashion magazine, was Dog Day Afternoon so bad for starring Pacino?
Really disappointed in these recent flicks,
>>69040796
Disney's focus groups and tests probably showed a favorable response to villains that are despicable but not intimidating.
Plebs like to see bad things happening to someone they hate but don't care about dramatic tension.
>>69052893
Me too! Save it, it's all yours my friend :)
>>69045641
You mean when he told Sony "Not every Spider-Man villain has to be a nice guy that we see become a villain in the movie in some way that's tied to Spider-Man"?
>>69053896
why are you talking like this?
>>69053935
>>69053935
>being this new
>>69053084
I don't get what's so great about those movies. They fucked up doctor octopus to the point where he's just a crazy man, Peter is always miserable and kristen dunst is just a terrible mary jane. Green goblin was great though.
>>69053935
note how bill offers up a thanks to lori, even though bill posted the image originally
>>69048062
>>69048334
>>69051469
Are you guys dreaming? Keaton got canned because RDJ was hired. He is expensive as fuck and probably ate half the budget of the movie alone. Rightfully so I think 'cause he's the only one in MCU who can actuallyact.
>>69040881
Red Skull was transported somewhere by the Space Gem. he didn't die.
>>69046229
>tfw we will NEVER see mysterio/hobgoblin on the screen
>>69040796
I don't understand why Ultron can't still be alive. He is an AI, im sure he could have hidden away on some computer chip or something.
I also don't understand why people don't like him?
Why the fuck haven't they brought the Abomination back yet, he was pretty good desu.
>>69057851
I was expecting Hydra to use him at least as SHIELD was burning into the ground. But yeah you're right. Nigga needs to come back and wreck everyone's shit now that Banner is MIA.
>>69046229
Probably why they are the most iconic heroes in either
what happened to Red skull?
He just disappeared into another dimension by the tessaract at the end of Cap america if I remember well.
they should bring him back
>>69040796
they are intentionally written to be terrible because their target audience are kids, they don't want kids to look up to these villains and think of them as cool people but as bumbling idiots who fail because they're evil
>>69057958
It would have been pretty hype to see him team up with Crossbones.
>>69040796
Maybe if you learn proper English we'll talk. Otherwise fuck off back to your Eastern Europe/Russian shithole.
>>69040796
not every villain can be as good as Lex and Doomsday OP
is venom a villain or more like an anti-hero?
he's spider-mans villain but even they team up sometimes and he teams up with punisher too
>>69050571
Hackman was better
