Conan is a self insert mary sue yet everybody here loves the film and never criticizes the fact.
How come everybody hates Rey but nobody hates Conan?
>>68010795
because Arnie is based
my guess is because the Star Wars and Conan universes are different and so the criteria for what makes a good character is different, Conan is more mythical even though both are fantasy and so your characters can be more symbolic in Conan
also here's a qt Daisy Ridley pic
>>68010795
Because he has a cock.
>200+ posts of triggered sexists from both sides
>>68010795
We got to see Conan become a badass through pushing a wheel and slave fighting
We saw that Rey was supposed to be badass from her hitting some derkas with a stick and yelling at a midget
don't bite it
>>68010831
That isn't cute
>>68010795
But people have said he's a mary sue. Especially in the books.
Conan is Cute
What's her name sue isn't cute
>>68010795
He passed like 20 years pulling that fucking wheel to build muscles.
Then he became a gladiator and got trained by an asian midget.
And he also studied poetry and philosophy while he bred with the best stock.
>>68010915
And people still love the character
desu I can't think of a single Arnold character that can be called a Mary Sue closest would maybe be his character from Twins or Junior
Conan worked his way to the top, senpai.
Rey was literally handed magical space powers and a super-special "destiny".
Also Rey is Drizzt levels of Mary Sue, if not worse.
>>68010938
So? Doesn't change the fact most mary sues are disliked whether they're male or female.
>Conan was a MaREY Sue
Yeah having your family killed and being put into slavery for most of your life is very privileged
All those fantastic moments when he's beaten half to death and almost dies
>>68010909
absolutely false
>>68010948
>Twins
He's stated to be the pinnacle of genetics.
>>68010948
you mean "cant be called" right?
Because it's Arnold and Arnold is a fucking legend. Your character can be a mary sue if it's played by Arnold since Arnold is a real-life mary sue
That silly british cunt has nothing on him
>>68010795
>mary sue
he dies he cant be mary sue
>>68010795
Conan is a revenge story about a guy who had a hard as fuck life whose entire family got slaughtered and he became a slave and slowly crawled and fought to the top tooth and nail to ultimately win the day. Or as we call it, a likable, relateable character. That's the problem with real mary sues, we never see their slow journey, they always just start from the very beginning as "awesome" because the author self-inserts as them and wants to be cool and worshipped despite not having done anything yet to deserve it.
God what a shitty thread, just hang yourself with a belt already.
"Underdog revenge power fantasy" is not the same as a Mary Sue
>>68010976
Robert E Howard himself pretty much stated "Conan is my Power Fantasy" on a number of occasions.
>>68010938
And people still love Rey, even though she's an infinitely worse character than Conan, played by a worse actor than Arnold.
And that's fucking saying a lot.
>>68010987
>Arnold is a real-life mary sue
Great post anon
>>68010795
>self insert mary sue
Gary Stu you mean?
>How come everybody hates Rey but nobody hates Conan?
because 'everybody' is retarded manchildren who can't relate to women because they were stood up in middle school.
>>68011029
So?
Conan still loses plenty of times, which literally makes him NOT a Mary Sue.
>>68010795
Conan isn't as serious as Star Wars. Also Arnie looks like he could do all that shit he does in his films in real live too.
While Conan 100% is a power fantasy character, he does fail at things and he requires help from his companions. Both Sabutei and Valeria save his life. The only thing that came naturally to him was fighting.
By Crom's beard, you are an insufferable faggot.
>>68011057
When you don't know how a term is used, don't use it.
I love them both, but I'm not a sniveling cuck. I love Conan more though because he's so fucking comfy god damn why isn't Arnie using his infinite starpower to get an Old Man Conan movie made?
>>68010960
Somebody liking a mary sue doesn't change the fact that mary sues are disliked?
>>68011077
>The only thing that came naturally to him was fighting.
This.
Rey can fly the millennium falcon, fix space engines, fight, use a lightsaber, use the force and jedi mind tricks with no prior knowledge whatsoever
>>68011096
The point is Conan has flaws, and can't do everything by himself.
But I guess you have a completely different definition of Mary Sue that suits your argument :^)
Why are you people replying to this?
>>68011107
What, you don't like Carl Drogo as Conan?
Racist.
>>68011065
>Star Wars
>serious
>THE EPICLY GOOD REBELS FIGHT AGAINST THE NOT-NAZIS IN SPACE WITH NO REDEEMING QUALITIES
>>68011182
Yes, Star Wars is infinitely more serious than Conan the Barbarian.
>>68011129
>In a world where space bacteria makes people conduits of God, it makes you a Mary Sue when your space bacteria acts as a conduit of God.
I hate this "'''''''''Logic"''''''''''
>>68011107
>Old Man Conan
Fuck you man, Hollywood can't make an action movie that's not a castrated politically correct travesty.
That movie would suck as much as the Conan remake.
>>68010795
Conan is very self aware fun not trying to push an agenda.
>>68011151
>Correct
>That's just your opinion man
>>68011203
>he thinks the midichlorians are the Force
Top kek
IF Rey hasn't had any prior training in the Force, then she's learned to control the Force faster than literally anybody else in the canon.
>>68010795
because conan is the best movie ever made
>>68011197
Star Wars is tongue in cheek, Conan is a serious work of art.
>>68011208
If Arnie gave a damn he could make sure it isn't cucked. But I guess Conan isn't special to his heart is it? I get the feeling he's not sentimental about any of his roles.
>>68011221
>>68011242
>Can't follow an analogy
The Force is God, you cretin.
Rey isn't bending the force to her will, The Force (Awakened) is using her as it's pawn. The force has a will, it is exerting that will.
>>68011342
Destroyer was so fucking bad.
>>68011203
>>In a world where space bacteria makes people conduits of God
Except that's completely untrue
It takes years of training and sensitivity for anyone to control the force...except maRey
>>68010983
Well, casting Arnie and stating otherwise would be a lie
>yet everybody here loves the film
wut
>>68011352
No, I got it.
And what you described is even worse than Rey just being a Mary Sue.
>>68010795
Cause he's male.
>>68010957
This, guy was kidnapped, enslaved etc
>>68010795
Because TFA made no effort to explain how Rey is good at what she does and every character in the movie instantly becomes good friends with her the second they meet.
Conan is a self aware tounge-in-cheek power fantasy. The intentional selling point of comics and the movie was that you could watch this superhuman warrior kick ass.
This is like asking "why you call Rey a Mary Sue, but not Superman or Jesus? Double standards much?"
>>68010795
Conan came out 20 something years ago and is still relevant. Everyone still knows who Conan the Barbarian is. He may be a Mary Sue but he was charming all the same and his story was well written and well remembered. Rey was a badly written character in a fanfic tier movie, and has few charming or redeeming features.
>>68011397
See >>68011352
>>68011418
ANH, Obi Wan states the force has a will, it's repeated again by Yoda, stated again in the midichlorians speech and IS IN THE FUCKING TITLE OF THE FORCE AWAKENS.
Rey is being guided, even pupeteered by the force, because her finding luke and restoring balance is it's will.
The force is, was and always will be a big dumb plot device. I'm sorry this is news to you.
>>68011527
>The Force is all living things
>all living things have a will
WEW LAD
E
W
L
A
D
>>68011527
This. Rey got blessed by space magic in a movie about space wizards.
>>68011369
Definition of a cash grab. It was fun as a kid. Glad I saw this one first as a kid then saw barbarian as a teenager.
>>68011208
>That movie would suck as much as the Conan remake.
Not necessarily, make John Milius to write and direct it.
Besides King Conan movie has been rumored from like late 90's before Arnie became governator. There are good Conan stories where he is old.
>>68011491
>This is like asking "why you call Rey a Mary Sue, but not Superman or Jesus? Double standards much?"
Superman and Jesus have plausible explanations why they are so powerful in their original fiction.
>>68011556
He and his Mentor Qui Gon both use the term "Will of the force" mate, google it.
>>68011580
Pretty much, yes.
Though I'd say Space God and Space Saints.
>>68010795
People forget that Conan is based on a character devised for the sake of short stories/serials.
There isn't time to establish a backstory and some kind of brilliant character development arc in writing like this -- it's basically the adventure that gets all of the attention and there's absolutely nothing wrong with it.
Having said that, if you read novels about Conan, you'll see his character treated in different ways. The movie, for example, has him enslaved, shows the progression of his strength through forced labor and combat, etc.
>>68011594
I wasn't arguing against that. Just pointing out that the movie is intentionally about a character that possesses an unrealistic amount of skill and strenght, the same way the Superman comic books and movies are.
Theres nothing wrong with that because that's the very premise of the story
>>68010795
>conan trained all his life to become what he is
>rey knew everything at once and bested jedi trained kylo
wat
>>68011754
See >>68011203 >>68011580
>>68011527
Read threads mate.
>>68011797
Why didn't the Force help Luke as many times as it helped Rey then?
>>68011797
That fagetron is ignoring that even an immaculate conception had to train for years to do anything with the force.
The force doesn't give sudden powers.
>>68012013
It did. Though in more subtle ways. Part of it is admittedly a shift in what audiences want.
>>68010938
>people like Conan and don't care that he's a Mary Sue
>so why do I get so pissed off and triggered when someone calls Rey a Mary Sue!?
>>68012094
People who accept that Conan is a mary sue are those who skipped the first 20 minutesof his movie.
>>68010795
>family gets killed by thulsa doom
>tracks thulsa down to kill him
>gets the shit kicked out of him
>crucified and died, failing his revenge and dead family
>friends have to resurrect him
>final stand, Conan again loses fight, ghost of dead girlfriend has to intervene to save him
Yeah, what a Mary Sue.
>>68012013
See the title?
Force Awakens?
That doesn't imply a change, or shift...?
>>68012024
That's pretty much exactly what it does whenever the plot needs it to. I'm not debating if that's a lazy cop out, because it is, what I won't deny is that it was ever any different.
>>68010795
>Spends 22 years as a slave
>Gets beaten to within an inch of his life
>literally crucified
>Is literally half dead and requires sorcery to keep him alive
>Has his true love killed
such a sue XD
Because he's fucking CONAN
>>68012214
Tragic Backstory ISN'T Sueish now...?
>>68012214
You don't know what a mary sue is.
>>68012252
Tragic back story is one thing, spending 4/5ths of your life as a slave is another
>>68012024
>Pod Racer at Ten
>Ace Pilot, blows up Naboo Blockade, 10
>Builds and programs C3PO, 10
>Builds own pod racer, 10
Dem years o training
No force here...
>>68012252
All of this happened in the movie.
>>68012309
But it's still his backstory, not his plot.
>>68012345
In short scene and a montage.
Because Arnie is an established Mary Sue in his universe, Rey is a Mary Sue in a movie universe that originally did not have one.
It ruined what Star Wars is about, that's why she's hated.
>>68012400
i seriously hope that thing has a penis
>>68012309
He wasn't a slave because of any flaws in his character, he was forced to be a slave. Rey was also a repressed character that got bossed around by people, but shes still somehow a supergenius straight out of the literal deserts.
>>68010795
The dude was enslaved, had to run from wild dogs, got caught when infiltrating the cult, got the shit beat out of him, got CRUCIFIED and virtually died before being resurrected, then almost died during final battle if not for ghost of girl who resurrected him.
Movie Conan is not Mary Sue.
>>68012252
he has a shit life, and his victory is getting to a baseline of satisfaction most people have, getting revenge,
even in his moment of victory his enemy says "I was living rent free in your mind for 20+ years, I'm the impetus for most of your decisions, I'm more of an influence than your father" which is true and incredibly depressing.
>>68010795
Well you know, the first Conan is an amazing film and a billion times better than TFA. Also Conan doesn't save himself when he gets captured, he's fucking left to die and has to be rescued and resurrected by his tabletop party.
>>68012334
Anakin was a child laborer though tasked with assembling and disassembling machines like you'd find in:
CHINA! That's right you insufferable Disney Shill Cuck! Up until a few years ago children were used in even Apple factories! And even beyond apple factories, children were used in several factories. ANAKIN, as a slave working in a parts shop undoubtedly disassembled condemned machines, droids among them. HE WRECKED EVERY POD HE WAS IN including Watto's pod. And up until the events of phantom menace, he had never finished a race. HE AS A CHILD OF THE FORCE still had to RACE CONTINUALLY AND IN SO DOING, WRECKED MANY PODS, to become a proficient racer. His power of precog only enabled HIM to be AS COMPETENT AS HIS ALIEN OPPONENTS: Not better than them, ONLY AS PROFFICIENT! During the final battle, Anakin and R2 is taken to the battle via remote and there ANAKIN USES HIS OBSERVABLY PRACTICED TRIED AND TRUE ABILITY OF AVOIDING DANGER, happens onto ship whilst running from enemy and blows up a fuel refueling tank INADVERTANTLY while shooting at a squad of droids. Like how Han INADVERTANTLY knocks Bobba Fett into the Sarlacc pit.
Anakin loses his hand to dooku and all else to Obi, least we forget.
maRey Sue however...Xander Cage of Triple X was a Gary Stu, but not like maRey Sue was though. Conan had to get good AND WAS SAVES REPEATEDLY BY HIS FRIENDS even from beyond the grave, not maRey Sue though. ASSHOLES WHO SAYS THAT THE FORCE GAVE HER A PASS TO DO SHIT ARE JUST MAKING EXCUSES! Never, ever in the lore has the force ever Gave anyone a get out of training and practicing jail card. Even Obi wan who was a part of the force could do no more than Advise and Talk if ever needed. AND THAT'S BECAUSE OBI WAN WAS BASED ON GANDALF and Gandalf never fought anyones battles. He simply inspired and coerces greatness in others
