So we can all pretty much agree that Snoke is Darth Plagueis and Rey is Luke's daughter?
>>65043960
Snoke - Round head, like Karl Pilkington with AIDS for 400 years
Plagueis - Long head, like a sweaty wrinkly dog turd
How exactly are they the same?
>>65043960
>Rey is Luke's daughter
Guaranteed because the lightsaber calling to her makes no sense otherwise.
>Snoke is Plagueis
That one's a bit messier. Your pic related is actually concept art of an old Kylo Ren design, and that dude on the ground behind him is Finn, so it really isn't evidence at all. Snoke is definitely old, saw the Empire come to power, and his leitmotif is very similar to the opera house music played in Episode III when Palpatine talks to Anakin about Plagueis. There's also a ton of pottery points there, because it's highly suggested that Plagueis created Anakin through the Force, so his hypothetical confrontation with the Skywalker line is high drama territory.
But bringing prequel content into the new trilogy seems really unlikely because Disney's been doing everything in its power to pretend the prequels never happened. Why would they downplay the prequels so much only to integrate them into the sequels to such a massive extent? You'd think prequel imagery would factor more into their marketing push if that were the case. Now, if in the next few months to a year we start seeing them bring the prequel shit back out, then this becomes more of a possibility.
>>65044195
>How exactly are they the same?
That's legends Plaguies. We have no idea what canon Plaguies looks like.
>>65044343
>Disney's been doing everything in its power to pretend the prequels never happened.
Fuck Disney.
Anyone who doesn't think Plagueis = Snoke is not paying attention and is ignoring evidence.
Rey being Luke's daughter feels too obvious. I mean JewJew Kike isn't very clever but he knows this is the conclusion everyone would come to. I'm leaning towards Rey being a product of the force similar to how Anakin was which would kind of explain her ability to overpower Kylo in the force because she is like 99% force.
But thats just me talking out my ass.
>>65045876
>But thats just me talking out my ass.
thanks for that pearl of wisdom you retard
Snoke being Plagueis would be pretty cool, but I reallyyyy hope Rey isn't Luke's daughter because that's just so goddamn predictable. It would surprise absolutely no one at all
>>65045876
>rey is a force baby
No. If it's not secret training or erased memories it's other retarded theories like this. You don't need a big explanation for her beating Kylo that has to do with her past.
>>65043960
Snoke doesn't looks like a Muun
>I'm Darth Plageius
>>65045876
>>65046025
She was probably being trained by Luke and escaped Kylo Ren's youngling massacre.
There's no way she's a force baby because that's too weird for the mainstream audience. Also no one would accept such religious ties in a movie made during CURRENT YEAR+1
>>65046025
Just me guessing, but I'm about 90% sure that Rey is not Luke's daughter. One of the big crew guys said that Rey's heritage would be very surprising and in Episode 9.
But yeah, you actually do need an explaination for Mary "Rey" Sue. I don't doubt her fighting skills because she had that staff thing. But you are telling me that some cunt who literally found out she was force sensitive the day before is going to be a near master of both Mind Trick and out Force pulling someone who has trained for years? Luke took years of training by himself and probably weeks with Master Yoda just to be able to lift rocks. No. Its bullshit.
>>65045977
Stay buttmad fag.
>>65043960
Haven't we all agreed at this point that is Rey is part of any major family she's a Kenobi? She has a british accent on purpose, and the only core character with one is Obi-Wan.
>>65044925
>Pretending prequels were good is new dank meme
>>65046157
Honestly I don't know about the plagueis thing. Disney knows how much people hate the prequels and it would really obviously tie them to it.
I am absolutely in two minds about Rey being Luke's daughter, too. I really like the Rey Kenobi theory and it feels like a neat subversion to what we were all expecting - a new trilogy about a new skywalker. It would be a fun way to break the mold.
The lightsaber calling to her doesn't necessarily mean she's a skywalker either. It could quite easily be written off as the force calling to her through a near legendary weapon, and you know it. "That lightsaber is strong with the force, and the force is strong in you" or some tardation.
Let's also remember that the main writer so far has been Kasdan, who was almost certainly the guy who came up with the "I am your father" bit (no, fuck you george, you did NOT have it planned out from day 1) He's a smart guy and a genuinely good writer and I feel like doing the exact same twist with the next generation in the same family in the same film in the trilogy would be really not what he wanted. Making her a Kenobi makes it much less problematic for him.
>>65046281
>Luke took years of training by himself and probably weeks with Master Yoda just to be able to lift rocks. No. Its bullshit.
But it was literally days.
Luke's training with Yoda was happening in ESB at the EXACT SAME TIME that Han, Leia and Chewie are evading the Empire in an asteroid belt then going to cloud city to fix the Millenium Falcon.
At most, Luke had a few days of intense training before he had to leave to get back to Cloud City in enough time to fight Vader.
>>65046209
>She was probably being trained by Luke and escaped Kylo Ren's youngling massacre.
I mean she was probably there, but she'd be 5 to 8 years old. At that point whatever training she could have had is irrelevant.
>>65046281
Three main points I want to make to you.
1. Cutting up the force into categories as specific as "mind trick" is fucking stupid. There are categories but they much more general, like "telekinesis" not "push, pull, saber throw, choke, etc." That you think Rey is better at "force pulling" than Kylo makes you seem retarded. Go back to /v/.
2. You don't seem to understand what the OT portrayed jedi training as. You don't have to practice with larger and larger rocks until you can lift that x-wing. You also don't know that mind tricks are this super impossible thing only masters can do. Fuck, Luke did it without even finishing his jedi training.
3. Your power level way of thinking isn't how the force works in the OT. Luke doesn't beat Vader because he became a better force user or duelist than him.
The explanation is she's strong in the force. You use the very specific phrase "near master" to describe her mind trick ability. Near master? She mind tricked a stormtrooper, they aren't exactly the strongest minds out there.
Apparently in Disney Infinity there's a boss battle between Rey and Kylo and Kylo outright calls her "cousin" so unless Disney is deliberately fucking with canon to throw people off in their game it's basically confirmed she is Lukes daughter.
>>65046792
>posting shit that got debunked the same day it was spread around
>>65046836
It was debunked by paid shills after DIsney realised they fucked up fag.
>>65046730
>Cutting up the force into categories as specific as "mind trick" is fucking stupid.
Literally autism. These are feats that Jedi perform simply put in name. You probably throw a Redditfit when someone calls a movie a flick too right?
>You also don't know that mind tricks are this super impossible thing only masters can do.
Name all the times a mind trick was used.
QuiGon TPM, ObiWan ANH, Luke ROTJ
All masters. Rey did it after one day. Hurr durr the force is easy.
>Luke doesn't beat Vader because he became a better force user or duelist than him.
I never said that but please explain your obviously superior way of thinking then. It was by chance? It was because he tapped into his emotions?
>The explanation is she's strong in the force.
Obviously but there is a reason the Jedi Order existed. Being able to use the force isn't something you pick up on a whim from being force sensitive. It has to be trained and taught. AND THIS IS THE PREQUEL LINE OF THOUGHT WITH MIDICHLORIANS AND SHIT.
Lets go back to the OT line of thought where it was "anyone can be a Jedi" way that people got butthurt over after midichlorians were introduced in TPM. In the OT it was basically "anyone can be a Jedi if you focus yourself hard enough and learn the ways from a master".
Rey is a Mary Sue. MARY SUE!!!
>>65046871
What other conspiracy theories you got for us?
Just watch another play through of the same boss fight. Kylo says curses when he gets hit. But no, you're going straight to 'shill' spewing and name calling. You're a real piece of work.
>>65043960
That's concept art of Kylo Ren.
Snoke is not Plagueis. And I wouldn't bet my money on Rey being Luke's, but it's certainly possible, unlike Plagueis.
>>65047409
lol okay DIsney whatever you say bro.
>>65046871
>>65047496
> if you don't agree with me, you're a paid shill
truly the pinnacle of internet arguing.
>>65043960
>Before TFA.
>Guys Snoke is Plagueis, trust me, he will be a Munn
>Movie comes out, Snoke is not a Munn
>No wait guys, they just change his species, and name, almost gender too, but it's totally Plagueis
I can't wait for "they are saving the reveal for Episode 9" after 8 comes out, kek.
>>65044925
Good b8.
>>65046871
He doesn't even say cousin, he just said curses. Not everything is a conspiracy.
>>65046551
In old EU (dunno if it still stands), the Falcon took over a month to get from the asteroids to Cloud City with a shitty, less powerful backup hyperdrive-like device. It wasn't a fast trip for them.
Plenty of time for Luke to train for weeks and then get to Bespin quick with a working hyperdrive.
>>65045977
>cant deal reading others thoughts
Must be hard, being alive n all
>>65044195
Space Botox
>>65047368
>Literally autism.
I'm sorry it's so autistic to let the movies speak for themselves instead of applying the logic they did in the star wars video games.
>Name all the times a mind trick was used. All masters.
I've only seen Jango and Boba use jetpacks. I guess only Fetts are allowed to use them. You lack basic logic and it's fucked up.
>I never said that
Full on autism. I know you didn't, it's called an example. Luke beat Vader for two reasons. The first was Vader was conflicted (just like Kylo). The second is that Luke tapped into the dark side (similar to Rey tapping into the light). I bring this up because you want to have it that no one can win a duel without being the better force user with more training.
>there is a reason the Jedi Order existed. Being able to use the force isn't something you pick up on a whim from being force sensitive. It has to be trained and taught. AND THIS IS THE PREQUEL LINE OF THOUGHT WITH MIDICHLORIANS AND SHIT.
It's prequel thinking to make the force require x years of training in specific areas to use the force. In the OT Luke gets a bunch of lessons on belief, no one tells him the proper finger position or stance for anything. Shit, Luke never even trains in lightsaber fighting.
What the fuck are you yelling about Mary Sues for? I never said Rey wasn't one.
>>65047679
>In old EU (dunno if it still stands)
No.
>>65043960
>implying I even accept Disney/10 pleb shit as being Star Wars
>implying I accept anything other than the OT and a few scenes from the prequels as Star Wars
What's it like being pleb f am?
People who think Snoke is Plagueis are just as deluded as people who think Ashoka will be in Rouge One, or that a KotoR cinematic trilogy is coming.
Nope, it's never happening.
>>65047782
>let the movies speak for themselves
>won't admit that only Masters with the Force have used mind tricks
kek
>>65044898
Approximately that. Him being a Muun is Lucas's idea. Lucas material remains canon.
Anyways, the Plagueis shit is not valid, Plagueis is dead, Sheev killed him. Sheev explains this. Sheev kept his ashes in a vase in his office. All of this is in either screenplays or novelizations, both of which are Lucas level canon. Unless you want to do a MASSIVE asspull HES MASDURED TEH MIDICHLORINES AND REVIED HIMSELF bullshit explanation, he will not come back.
>>65047877
I'm very glad you ignored the part where I talk about that.
>>65047877
Hey, DisneyShills and the proles are doing the best they can the pile of rehashed shit known as TFA. Cut them some slack.
Rey is Luke's "daughter" cloned from the hand when the saber was found. It's pottery. Anakin had no father, Rey had no mother. It rhymes.
>>65047877
Not the other anon but you just revealed you are trolling with that and ignoring everything else
>>65047904
While I agree with your sentiment that Plagueis is never happening, Lucas never gave much about the character. In fact, there are quotes where he states that the Opera scene is meant to be ambiguous and Sheev could just be bullshitting.
Darth Bane is an actual character created by Lucas, fleshed out by EU. Plagueis was just an idea, not even a real character, until EU turned him into one and then fleshed him out.
The whole him existing and getting killed/vase stuff is all EU. Film-wise Plagueis is just a story told to Anakin by Sheev to trick him into thinking he can save his wife.
>>65047639
Investigate 311
Rey is Sheev's daughter. That's why Kylo shat his pants when he realised who she was. She's the heir to the empire, and the inheritor of UNLIMITED... POWER!
>>65048144
>Rey is Sheev's daughter
no no No No NO NO!!!!
>>65046551
No training with Obi Wan's ghost in between Episodes IV and V?
>>65047782
The video games aren't canon anymore.
>>65048144
The doubles confirm.
>>65048275
What difference to do you think that makes to my post?
>>65044343
Luke had it for 2 years Obi Wan had it for 30
>>65047782
>similar to Rey tapping into the light
Ironically, the "canon" novelization states that Rey also tapped into the Darkside and barely stopped herself from actually killing Kylo.
But you know, the books are "canon" canon.
>>65046338
Just because the movies sucked doesn't mean that they didn't have any merits and didn't introduce any great concepts, potential plot points, and greatly expand the lore. To not take advantage of that would be totally idiotic on Disney's part. Especially since the prequel era produced some of the best Star Wars content in the franchise, (Clone Wars cartoons, KOTOR, Republic Commando, Sith Empire, etc.)
>>65046300
It would be too predictable for her to be Luke's daughter. Whoever she is, and I'm hoping for a Kenobi, the people who stashed her on Jakku didn't want her to survive. No caring parent would leave their small child in the care of Unkar Plutt. My theory is she was kidnapped.
Rey is the daughter of Luke and Camie Kenobi
>>65048441
Wtf the do the prequels have to do with KotoR?
KotoR was a major OT rip off, based on a setting created in some comics 90's comics (that it ignored and turned into the OT, but whatever).
>>65047368
Natural affinity was always a part of it though. Luke even says in Jedi that the Force is strong in his family. Vader says in ANH "the force is strong with this one" when chasing Luke through the trench. It always had something to do with natural talent.
>>65048550
Because the old Jedi Order and the Sith weren't even things in the OT? KOTOR is pretty obviously based on the lore established by the prequels.
>>65048452
Considering how poorly fathers are depicted in the media I wouldn't be surprised if they that because they thought it make her safe or some other bullshit. Luke in TFA has already abandoned his friends and the galaxy so why not Rey?
>>65048630
The Sith and Jedi Order both existed in Tales of the Jedi, the "main" inspiration for KotoR.
The prequels have almost nothing to do with KotoR aside from "there are droids with guns and Assassin Droids are Droideka rip offs."
>>65048632
>>65048452
Kylo left her on Jakku.
In the Disney infinity games if you battle kylo against the he has a voice clip that calls her cousin.
>>65048854
Debunked the same day it was originally spread.
>But muh Kenobi wouldn't have any kids
Obi Wan was never a model Jedi. He was always seen as a loose canon. He only got promoted because he was good at killing Sith.
Also he would think the rule is bullshit because he had no problem raising Luke.
And if it wasn't for him finding Anakin, and Anakin banging Padme.. they would never have found out Sheev's plans... and Sheev would have found Anakin himself anyway.
>>65049054
2/10, it's the best I can do. Since the XP-B8 came out, such shitty bait is just not in demand.
>>65048408
Apparently "logic and evidence" is only present when it represents your argument.
You argue that the Force is something that is easy for anyone to control and master. All depictions from the saga we've seen do not support this except what is in Episode 7.
So what are you a Disney shill or what?
>>65049533
Why didn't you explain your video game post?
Why are you putting words into my mouth?
Why do you pretend the prequels and the OT show the same concept of the force?
Why do you shitpost with your shill meme?
>>65047782
Whether you like it or not the prequels are canon and you can't just ignore the rules the establish. "Prequel thinking" is Disney shill talk for "following the lore".
>>65049666
>Whether you like it or not the prequels are canon
Correct.
>and you can't just ignore the rules the establish.
Oh, but you can. Do you think JJ or Kasdan or whoever is doing VIII gives one fuck about the prequels? See when the OT and the PT show different ideas about the force, you can only pick one to go forward with. Guess which one the new trilogy is going with.
>>65049666
>"Prequel thinking" is Disney shill talk for "following the lore".
Nah, that's just prequelfags trying to pretend the prequels are still relevant.
They aren't, Disney has little use for them and knows they have to go for the OT feel to bank on the nostalgia; and they are destined to be forgotten by the next generation too.
The Prequels are irrelevant to the future of star wars.
>>65043960
Yes, but Rey is also Obi-wan's granddaughter.
>>65049626
Why don't you explain straight what the THESIS of this argument is about then. What exactly are you arguing for?
>Why do you pretend the prequels and the OT show the same concept of the force?
They don't though and now you are putting words in my mouth. Prequels have midi-chlorians. OT have "anyone can do it with some training".
>Rey Mixer is Sheev's bastard daughter
>Luke trains her
Its like pottery
>>65050218
Before you ask me to explain myself, how about you explain your video game post?
How many times are you gonna dodge that while begging me to be more clear about what I mean?
>>65049747
>>65049825
Except they don't show different conceptions of the Force. They clearly specify that using the Force is based partly on genetics and natural ability. That's why Luke says that the force is strong in his family. That's why they say Leia is another hope. If anybody could be a Jedi then why would Yoda and Obi bother with Luke in particular? They care about him and Leia because they know that Luke is naturally talented with the force because Anakin was.
>>65050671
>If anybody could be a Jedi then why would Yoda and Obi bother with Luke in particular? They care about him and Leia because they know that Luke is naturally talented with the force because Anakin was.
Tell me this is a joke.
>>65050778
If they could recruit anybody to be a Jedi then why wouldn't they just work with the rebellion to find and train new Jedi? Why bother with one kid in particular?
Snoke's origin is to be explained in Rebels.
Chances are he's just an inquisitor.
>>65043960
Guaranteed we won't know who Rey is until Episode 9. Guaran-fucking-teed.
I could see some hints being dropped about Snoke in episode 8. Who he is, a taste of where he comes from, etc.
Luke will literally play the Yoda role in Ep 8. Rey and Kylo will probably fight again, this time I'm genuinely unsure who will win.
As for Poe and Finn, I have no theories or ideas what they'll be up too. Probably fighting for the resistance.
>>65050855
I could just tell you but I want to see if you can get there on your own.
What makes Luke and Leia special? (Hint: you've already mentioned it)
How does Luke 'win' in the end? How does he get what he wants? (Hint: I'm not talking about how he wins a lightsaber duel)
What does Luke (and therefore Leia too) cause Vader to feel? (Hint: Luke says it more than once)
>>65048632
Abandoning adults is one thing, abandoning a very young, helpless child is quite another and would make Luke look evil. They took care in the movie to show us Plutt was slowly starving Rey. Bad guys are behind why she ended up on alone Jakku.
>>65051091
>Snoke's origin is to be explained in Rebels.
Source.
>>65051116
Look m8, even if they used them because their relation to Vader makes him more vulnerable, it's still pretty obvious that in the OT the Force is related to natural ability. They talk about the force being strong with certain people. That means that it's stronger with some than it is with others. Luke tells Leia "you have that power too", which obviously implies that there are people who don't have that power, and that it is transmitted genetically. If you honestly think that in the OT anybody could use the Force than you just didn't watch the movie.
>>65046551
>But it was literally days
What makes you think that would have been a short trip for them?
Travel between distant systems is supposed to take ages even using hyperdrives
With a broken hyperdrive they would have technically been travelling for hundreds of years according to real phyics, but even with sci-fi space magic you're just pulling "days" out of your ass.
But it doesn't matter if it was a day or a month, because training with two of the greatest masters of recent history for five minutes should put you in a better place than someone who found out it existed yesterday
No. Rey is the Force incarnate just like Anakin was supposed to be. Episode VII's title was referring to her.
>>65051580
>From “Revenge of the Jedi” Story Conference Transcript, July 13 to July 17, 1981 with series creator George Lucas, writer Lawrence Kasdan, director Richard Marquand and producer Howard Kazanjian.
>Kasdan: The Force was available to anyone who could hook into it?
>Lucas: Yes, everybody can do it.
>Kasdan: Not just the Jedi?
>Lucas: It’s just the Jedi who take the time to do it.
>Marquand: They use it as a technique.
>Lucas: Like yoga. If you want to take the time to do it, you can do it; but the ones that really want to do it are the ones who are into that kind of thing. Also like karate. Also another misconception is that Yoda teaches Jedi, but he is like a guru; he doesn’t go out and fight anybody.
Can you please stop bringing up all those retcons with all that prequel talk?
>>65043960
>we can all pretty much agree
memeshitlord
>>65051709
Even if that was Lucas's original intention, he did a shit job of showing in the movies, and nothing about the way the force works in the prequels actually contradicts the way it works in the OT. Even saying "The Force is strong with this one" like Vader does in ANH obviously implies that some people are naturally gifted with it.
Not to mention that just ignoring canon material is what's called bad writing, even if the content that produced it was shitty.
>>65051580
>even if you're right, you're wrong!
Reminder that the only thing I brought up was why Obi-Wan and Yoda would choose Luke or Leia over a random with potential. This whole genetics thing isn't what I was talking about at all. But let's just go a head anyway I guess.
>because the force can run in families that means it only runs in families
You're writing a lot of fan fiction there anon. You know not everyone's talent runs in the family while some undoubtedly do. It's like saying every child of a director can direct, that certainly isn't true. Yet there are some examples yes. I don't think you understand how logic and evidence works.
>>65051916
>Not to mention that just ignoring canon material is what's called bad writing
Nah, it isn't. Canon isn't some sacred holy cow. In fact, it's quite pointless to anyone but wookipedia autists who keep track of that shit.
>>65051953
M8 Luke literally says "the Force is strong in my family".
>>65051996
So you're saying that if you create a world with established rules it's okay to just ignore them whenever the plot calls for it?
>>65044343
They mentioned both clone troopers and balancing the force in TFA.
>>65052070
>M8 Luke literally says "the Force is strong in my family".
Holy shit read my post this time faggot.
>>65046409
Lucas came up with Vader being Luke's father. Lucas wrote the second draft for ESB and all Kasdan did was polish the dialogue.
>Rey is Luke's daughter
>Rey is Sheev's daughter
>Luke is Sheev
Every day until it's fact.
>>65047904
None of that is canon.
>>65047368
If anyone can be a Jedi then why did obi claim that Luke was their last hope? Force ability has always been hereditary.
>>65052070
>So you're saying that if you create a world with established rules it's okay to just ignore them whenever the plot calls for it?
Nah,I find contextual consistency pretty important myself, but it depends on the story.
In case of the prequels, they trampled all over OT's "canon." And since OT is more popular, and more easily milked for nostalgia, Disney made a simple business decision to ignore the prequels.
>>65051636
>you will never pay unkar plutt to have your way with the physical incarnation of the force
>>65052156
The point being that nothing in the OT contradicts the way the Force is supposed to work in the prequels. What little we do see about how the force works actually coincides with what the prequels show. Which means that there aren't two different ways that it's supposed to work, and anybody trying to justify Disney's blatant violation of the canon.
>>65052332
Sure there are a few minor details in which the prequels contradict the OT, but the way the Force works isn't one of them.
>>65051091
>>65051213
He has none because he is talking out his ass.
It would be interesting if Snoke (ahem read Plagueis) is mentioned in Rebels, but it won't because it would ruin the surprise.
>>65051580
Just stop replying to this troll Disney shill. He is constantly inconsistent and gets mega-defensive when asked to explain his arguments.
>>65052425
Well I don't necessarily disagree, but I simply would not pay attention to something just because it's technically "canon." Darth Maul being alive is technically canon too, but you bet your ass Disney will never put him in a movie since it would confuse the 99% of movie goers that think he is dead.
>>65052529
Speaking of which, Snoke is not Plagueis, and Plagueis will never appear on film. Mostly because there is no surprise is such a "twist" (it's not even a twist, it's just a crappy reference really).
>>65052608
Yeah but it's easy to ignore Darth Maul. Ignoring how a central plot element like the Force has worked for the past six movies is less easy. It would be like bringing Obi-Wan back with no explanation, it's just shitty storytelling.
>>65045876
>Anyone who doesn't think Plagueis = Snoke is not paying attention and is ignoring evidence
There's a reason that TFA has countless callbacks to the original trilogy and zero callbacks to the prequels. And it's not just that the prequels are dogshit that most of the SW fanbase (and even some normies) hate. It's that it's not iconic or memorable. There's literally no reason for Snoke to be Plagueis because Plagueis was NOBODY. Except to faggots who read way too much supplementary material, AKA shit that wasn't in the movie.
>>65052262
I wasn't saying I support the idea, but that was indeed Lucas' original intention as shown here: >>65051709
Midichlorians make more sense no matter how buttblasted it makes people.
>>65051600
>>65051916
>>65052070
>>65052387
>hide Mouse shill posts
>ignore Mouse shill posts
>do not reply to Mouse shill posts
>>65052693
Again, I don't disagree with the sentiment, but Disney is mostly building off the OT when it comes to the movies. I simply don't think the events of the PT, and their lore, will have any real relevance in future movies.
>lukes daughter fags still exist
How? Give one good reason why it wouldnt have been revealed at the end of TFA? Plagueis is Snoke and he created Rey like he wanted to create Anakin
>>65052818
I honestly can't tell if this is b8 or not.
>>65052701
Finally a rational human being. Good luck though, you can't get through to EUfags.
They won't let it go until IX comes out. Then they will be confused because "Disney didn't use this awesome character that totally ties all the movies together!"
>>65043960
can we agree that you fanboys are so dumb you don't realize the similarities are due to the "creative" aspects of the movie being completely unoriginal?
>>65052800
Of course, because taking the actual good parts of the prequel and EU lore and incorporating them into the new canon would actually be good, and Disney can't have that now can they.
>>65052966
I agree that it would be, mostly, good, but there is certainly no profit in pandering to already established Star Wars fans. If you are/were an EU fan, Disney already has your money anyway. Another reason why Plagueis is irrelevant and has no use for Disney.
>>65052701
But then again who the fuck is Snoke and why should I care? At least Plagueis is established in ROTS and can provide connective tissue for the entire saga. It would be dumb for him not to be Plagueis
>>65053107
This. It would just be a shitty rehash of the Emperor unless they made him Plageus.
>>65044195
>Karl Pilkington with AIDS for 400 years
>>65053107
That's the thing, Plagueis isn't an established character to most people, only to EUfags.
There is no practical difference between Snoke being a new character, and a character mentioned once in a throwaway line in one movie to the general audience. In fact, Plagueis creates more complications and comes with baggage that a new character does not.
Also, Snoke is Palpatine 2.0 rehash by design, no matter his identity.
>>65052387
So if we're just gonna end up arguing about the nature of the force instead, let's pin down what we're talking about.
If we, or really I, put the prequel bashing away, you want to talk about if The Force Awakens falls in line with canon force use as set up by the previous 6 movies. Plus or minus the room for new stuff of course, I don't think anyone is gonna complain Kylo Ren's marionette-like use of telekinesis is lore breaking.
I think you'd agree we need a list of force uses in TFA. I'm just gonna stick to Rey, unless you wanna bring something up from Kylo. He mostly just moves things and reads minds, both have precedent in the PT and OT.
Rey's force use:
>enhanced piloting ability
>force vision?
>resist mind probe
>reading kylo's mind or at least his feelings
>mind tricked storm trooper
>telekinesis on the lightsaber in the snow
>enhanced melee weapon skill?
>super strength
Did I miss anything?
So I guess I'd ask which you found lore breaking in and of themselves and which were because she was untrained.
>>65052701
Exactly what kind of callbacks are you talking about? They wanted to emulate the OT because lore-wise and chronologically it is much closer to the new trilogy and they were also better movies in general. But the prequels and everything content-wise in them are still canon including Plagueis.
They mention Jedi and the Force in TFA. They did that in the prequels so does that count as a "callback" in your book?
>no reason for Snoke to be Plagueis
It would be more familiar to those who actually pay attention to the universe rather than having some random super-powerful guy come out of fucking nowhere. For normies it wouldn't make any difference either way too because with a brand new character or Plagueis, to them he is a new character.
None of us should pretend to know what the new movie's plots will be about either because we don't. But it is not impossible that we could get a reveal talking about Plagueis creating Anakin with midichlorians (and possibly Ren or Rey but the former is reaching hard) and in that sense Plagueis and Luke are related because technically it would mean Plagueis/Snoke is Anakin's father, Luke's grandfather and Kylo's great-grandfather. Creating family tension there that is very familiar with the OT. "No Luke. I AM your grandfather."-type shit. See its like pottery it spins. Now you can cry about how stupid this would be but thats like... your opinion man. It doesn't have any relevance one whether or not Snoke is or isn't Plagueis just because you think this exact scenario is stupid.
Now that being said, there is other evidence to support Plagueis being Snoke such as:
>the music from ROTS talking about Plagueis being EXACTLY the same as Snokes theme in TFA
>the lack of mention of Plagueis after ROTS that is canon
>unexplained wounds on Snoke
... post limit
>>65052800
If that were true, Disney would've just declared them non-canon then you can join the rest of Reddit in your circlejerk of hate.
>>65053256
If that's the case then there isn't really any reason to not make him Snoke either. Making him Plageus would be a way to tie all the movies together with a character that normies at worst won't really care about and that die hard fans will go apeshit for. There is nothing to lose and everything to gain from putting Plageus in the new movies. I realize it probably won't happen, I just really want it to because I dread the next two movies being shitty OT rehashes.
>>65044898
Thus far, Plagueis is only a legend in canon
>>65053450
2/2
Now that being said, there is other evidence to support Plagueis being Snoke such as:
>the music from ROTS talking about Plagueis being EXACTLY the same as Snokes theme in TFA
>the lack of mention of Plagueis after ROTS that is canon
>unexplained wounds on Snoke's head that correlate with an assassination attempt by Sheev explained in ROTS
>Sheev boasting about killing a man that literally figured out how to prevent death but people taking Sheev's words at face value
>the idea that powerful Dark Siders are just ever present in the galaxy and the idea of one that we've never heard of before sudden controls a large part of the galaxy
You see, as someone mentions here:
>>65053256
>>65053466
just as I have in the first post, Plagueis is a lesser-known but established bad guy that makes sense in his return.
AND PLAGUEIS IS NOT EU, HE IS CANON. CRY ABOUT IT.
>>65053361
Pretty much. He piloting skills could be explained by enhanced reflexes and intuition. The two things that don't make sense are beating Kylo and doing the mind trick. As far as Kylo goes I could accept it given that he was injured etc. but the way it was handled he's clearly winning until Rey just thinks about the Force a little bit and then beats him.
>>65044195
Old canon Plagueis is a Muun, which is arguably one of the silliest looking alien design in Star Wars. Remember the intergalactic banking cland dude from episode 2? It's the same species
>>65047368
Autism would favor your brand of specific categorization.
Source: I'm a special ed teacher
>>65053466
>If that's the case then there isn't really any reason to not make him Snoke either.
Plenty of reasons not to. He comes with a bunch of discarded lore for one thing. But the main reason is that is shits all over the Saga. The whole point of the movies, according to Lucas, is for Anakin to balance the force by destroying that Sith. If Plagueis exists, he basically retcons all movies canonically. Not to mention it would make Palpatine look like an idiot.
>>65053450
>If that were true, Disney would've just
declared them non-canon then you can join the rest of Reddit in your circlejerk of hate.
It's bad for business to alienate fans. Otherwise you and your prequel autists friends would whine all over reddit about how Disney raped your childhood.
>>65053621
>AND PLAGUEIS IS NOT EU, HE IS CANON.
Everything but his name comes from EU. He is not established whatsoever to the average fan, only wookiepdia autists care about him.
>>65053698
Would explain why they decided to wipe all canon too. As to not give away the secret of Plagueis by saying:
>all EU material post-ROTJ is non canon
>oh and that Darth Plageuis book, thats not canon either
>>65053689
Kylo does worse AS she does better because he's losing confidence as she's gaining it.
He's someone who's strutted around playing a badass in front of obedient stormtroopers who is now wetting himself at a real challenge.
>>65053739
>Everything but his name comes from EU. He is not established whatsoever to the average fan, only wookiepdia autists care about him.
And your point is? Literally has nothing to do with my post. Try re-reading it until you can figure it out without hand-holding faggot.
>>65053739
Snoke isn't established to the average fan either.
>>65053813
Stay mad, Snoke isn't Plagueis either way. He's dead in your precious canon, and it's not changing.
>>65053837
He doesn't need to be. Palpatine wasn't exactly established in RotJ either. Snoke is a supporting villain, the trilogy is about Rey and Kylo. He'll be important lore-wise and plot-wise, but the movies aren't about him.
And by now the average Star Wars fan know who Snoke is and still has no idea who the fuck Plagueis was.
The SW question on my mind lately is when in episode 3, sheev fucks up 3 jedi masters in seconds, Mace dindu is the only one left, said to be one of if not the strongest saber duelist among the jedi, and he gains the upper hand on sheev only when Anakin is there to watch. Did sheev throw the fight in order to show anakin the unjust ways of the jedi? Was it coincidence that anakin was there to wreck maces shit right on time?
Why do you fags still claim Snoke is Plagueis when the new canon material states that Anakin destroyed the Sith? It says that Snoke and Ren are just dark side users.
>>65053972
>Stay mad, Snoke isn't Plagueis either way
Says who lol
Saying
>I'm right you're wrong
doesn't count as evidence familia.
You haven't provided a single piece of evidence to support that Snoke isn't Plagueis. In fact, you provide more proof FOR the theory. Because Plagueis wasn't well established in ROTS. Vader was a supporting villain. Plagueis being the great-grandfather of Kylo (and possibly Rey) ties them together. But that doesn't mean the movie is centered around him and no one is suggesting it is.
The average Star Wars fan doesn't know the difference between Palpatine, Sheev, Sidious or the Emperor either. But they are all the same person.
Sorryfam but Plagueis is probably Snoke. Unless said otherwise in Episode 8/9.
>>65054229
The funny thing is, you'll actually be confused and disappointed after IX comes out and Snoke is still Snoke.
>>65054214
Its possible almost being killed by his apprentice made Plagueis turn away from the Sith. It was already established in the EU Plagueis material that he was somewhat against the Sith teachings, specifically the Rule of Two.
"Destroying the Sith" doesn't really mean shit. Because it would imply that there is no more evil Jedi in the galaxy yet here are Snoke and Kylo.
Its kind of just arguing semantics.
>>65054335
So you admit to the possiblity then? Good.
And no, I'll be understanding because right now we have no answers. Only clues to the truth. When we finally have the truth, I'll accept it instead of being a denying little bitch like you.
>>65054388
>So you admit to the possiblity then?
Sure, but I'm 99% sure Snoke is Snoke. And have nothing but sympathy for the EU obsessed fans who think otherwise.
>>65053689
Okay so mind trick and meditating power boost in battle.
So for the mind trick we know it's a jedi knight level technique. Obi-Wan uses it on death sticks guy, and while he is Anakin's "master" he only gets the actual jedi master rank in III.
Luke used in it RotJ, clearly to show how much he's learned but he was no master. I'd even be hesitant to say he's a jedi knight. I'm gonna do a little conversion here between yoda's old and new force training. In the old days the jedi council used whatever "the trials" are to grant the rank of jedi knight. There's a final test. Yoda tells Luke that he's not a jedi (since padawans aren't full jedi I'm gonna say jedi and jedi knight mean the same thing here) until he faces Vader. He does tell Luke he's learned enough even though he didn't finish the training. Is Luke really as well trained in the beginning of RotJ as Obi-Wan was at the end Phantom Menace?
So from what we see it seems like a jedi knight could do it proficiently, but there is a discord between Clones and Jedi. Obi-Wan is a padawan until he's in his early 20s and starts from a young age, like single digits. That's probably at least a decade of training and he's even older when we finally see him do the mind trick in Clones. Luke got a couple weeks tops with yoda and 6 months to a year of reflection. I don't know, either Luke is some kind of savant in the force or just because we see Obi-Wan do it at a certain level of training doesn't mean he couldn't do it earlier with less training or force mastery.
>>65054488
Good, thats all I'm arguing for is that the possibility of Snoke being Plagueis exists. Fags in here are confident that he isn't when they obviously have no idea either way.
We'll only really know when the movies come out.
>>65048144
This is so stupid it could be true
>>65054519
Rey being able to sucessfully do a mind trick only hours/day after learning she can use the force is similar to me passing an exam on physics with only a few hours to study.
Its just incredibly unlikely, hand-wavy, and Mary Sue-like.
>>65053739
>Everything but his name comes from EU
The only thing I know about Plagueis is what I know from the prequels. And that's still plenty. He's an incredibly powerful Sith lord that had even the emperor speak of him with awe and probably fear. He wasn't defeated by superior force but trickery. And his great talent was fortitude.
I'm not joking when I say I've been avoiding all things star wars until the past week and this is the first I've heard of the theory and it makes a lot of sense. Plagueis is probably a survivor given his legendary talents for healing/health extension so if anyone could survive the emperor's assassination it would be him.
It also rhymes nicely with the past movies that he's like the emperor but not. The Emperor's talent was his Machiavellian power. He was a leader and schemer and thus his evil empire was truly an Empire. The first order is a remnant of what the empire once was. Not as grand but meaner and scrappier. Tougher. Like Plagueis, their new Sith Lord. The emperor was a creator, even if a dark one. A Plagueis/Snoke would be a preserver (if we're going max hindu here I guess Vader can be shiva/the destroyer)
A different kind of evil that should still not be underestimated.
>Plagueis and Sheev work together to create life in the Force
>it fails
>The Force creates the chosen one to kill the Sith order for their douchiness
>Plagueis and Sheev killed
>but Plagueis had trick up his sheev - discovered Force ghost technique and came back
>finished his experiment by creating Rey
>Luke kicks his ass and kidnaps Rey
>wipes her memory
>>65054650
Okay your physics exam analogy there, it implies or at least tries to imply a great level of difficulty.
How hard is the mind trick to pull off? That's what I'm trying to talk about.
>>65054665
>The only thing I know about Plagueis is what I know from the prequels.
I don't think you are being quite honest here. Plagueis in RotS is just a story Sheev told Anakin to to trick him. Things like who he was, what did, and how he died, are all elaborated in the EU. The film itself does not even tell if Sheev is his apprentice nor if Plagueis is anything more than a legend. All the other things you mentioned is extraneous to the plot of the film info that comes from the EU, not the prequels.
Which is the way Lucas intended it, Plaguies is supposed to be an ambiguous and open ended idea. EU is the one that took that idea and turned him into another boring Sith Lord.
>>65054823
>How hard is the mind trick to pull off?
Considering its fictional, impossible to say.
But anytime we've seen it used its been by something very experienced with the Force. Implying that it is not easy. Why haven't we seen a 5 year old youngling use it? Because thats the same thing here. Rey is the equivalent of a 20-something yo youngling.
>>65055020
EU that was considered canon before the Disney wipe.
>>65055098
>But anytime we've seen it used its been by something very experienced with the Force. Implying that it is not easy. Why haven't we seen a 5 year old youngling use it? Because thats the same thing here. Rey is the equivalent of a 20-something yo youngling.
Did you read anything I wrote about Obi-Wan and Luke using it?
>>65055098
>EU that was considered canon before the Disney wipe.
Not really, it wasn't. George literally called it a parallel universe that does not apply to his movies.
Disney has done more to legitimize EU than Lucas ever did.
>>65043960
>another Shit Wars fan fic thread
fuck off to >>>/Wookieepedia/ fags
>>65055222
You mean how they had at least 1 year experience each practicing the Force instead of the 1 DAY that Rey had?
Yeah I read it. Your point?
>>65055251
>called it a parallel universe
[Citation needed].
Lucas however did insist on Plagueis being a Muun. Sorry to burst your head canon, but Plagueis is a real person and was considered canon by Lucas before the Disney EU wipe.
He is still considered an actual person in the new canon, but we do not know anything about him.
>>65055020
>Plagueis in RotS is just a story
Right, and I and others heard that story.
>Sheev told Anakin to to trick him.
That's your speculation. It could very well be true. Certainly Anakin thought it was.
>Things like who he was, what did, and how he died, are all elaborated in the EU
They might be elaborated more definitively in the EU but it's an obvious conclusion to jump to that Palpatine was talking about his own old master. I'm pretty sure the prequel movies imply this because I assume so and again I don't know what the EU says about the guy.
Then there's the subtle but definite one off line about Anakin not having a father. Again, fan speculation says a guy that might have immortality powers might be connected to such weirdness. You don't need the EU for this. People were talking about it when the movies first came out. I remember. Whether or not Disney wants to go with such strange Jesus allusion I don't know, but they were clearly meant to be a serious plot point in Lucas's canon vision in the prequel movies.
You seem kind of angry at the EU for some reason and it's clouding your judgement. You don't need comics and auxiliary books to have fan speculation from, yes ambiguous but also definite, elements in the older movies.
>>65055364
My point is that you don't know what the minimum requirement for a mind trick is so fuck off niggerlips. Combine that with the obvious idea that the movie is trying to tell you Rey is very naturally gifted and nothing is lore breaking.
>>65055364
>[Citation needed]
>"There are two worlds here," explained Lucas. "There's my world, which is the movies, and there's this other world that has been created, which I say is the parallel universe—the licensing world of the books, games and comic books.
>"The only relevant official continuities are the current versions of the films alone, and the combined current version of the films along with whatever else we've got in the Holocron.
>"Anything not in the current version of the films is irrelevant to Film only continuity."
Sorry to burst your bubble, but EU was never canon to the films.
>Lucas however did insist on Plagueis being a Muun.
He insisted on a lot of things. The EU has to conform to the movies, the movies do not have to conform to the films. Which is why swaths of EU got wiped away at George's whim all the time.
>He is still considered an actual person in the new canon, but we do not know anything about him.
Sure, he is real in Disney canon, but he's also dead in Disney canon.
>>65055520
>No way Darth Maul is dead he was killed in Episode 1
>Wait what? He was in The Clone Wars? Whatever he died there too at the end with Sheev.
>Wait what? He is going to be in Rebels? What the fuck...
Things change get over it.
Gonna repeat my thesis from earlier:
"Good, thats all I'm arguing for is that the possibility of Snoke being Plagueis exists. Fags in here are confident that he isn't when they obviously have no idea either way.
We'll only really know when the movies come out."
>>65055426
>That's your speculation. It could very well be true. Certainly Anakin thought it was.
Like I said, that's the point.
>"Now there's a hint in the movie that there was a Sith lord who had the power to create life. But it's left unsaid: Is Anakin a product of a super-Sith who influenced the midichlorians to create him, or is he simply created by the midichlorians to bring forth a prophecy, or was he created by the Force through the midichlorians? It's left up to the audience to decide. How he was born ulitmately has no relationship to how he dies, because in the end, the prophecy is true: Balance comes back to the Force." - George Lucas
Like the director of the film says, Plagueis' existence is completely irrelevant to the plot, which is why no canonical film ever bothered to answer the question if it's a lie or not.
>They might be elaborated more definitively in the EU but it's an obvious conclusion to jump to that Palpatine was talking about his own old master.
Cool speculation bro.
> Again, fan speculation says a guy that might have immortality powers might be connected to such weirdness.
Cool speculation bro, but George also made it clear Anakin was a viring birth through the Force and not through Plagueis.
>You seem kind of angry at the EU for some reason and it's clouding your judgement.
I have an issue with EUfags. They keep pushing their headcanon, that goes against all established lore, at every turn.
>>65055614
>he thinks the cartoons have any impact on the films
Let's not move back the goalposts. Disney changed things, and declared everything to be canon, but we are talking about what George did and intended. Also, Disney hasn't changed anything, the movies are still going to be the only thing that matter when it comes to movie continuity.
>>65053527
>Plagueis is only a legend in canon
No, he's been confirmed canon star wars.com as canon.
>>65055865
Wrong. He doesn't have his own entry in the databank. The only mention of him in the databank refers to him as a myth.
He is not canon.
>>65055926
I think he's technically Disney canon because he was mentioned in Tarkin. Of course, it also states he is dead, but Plagueisfags will ignore that minor detail.
>>65055834
>>65055957
>he doesn't understand that both TCW and Rebels are canon
I'm not moving any goalposts, I'm simply saying that Maul was considered dead in early Lucas canon. Then TCW came out and him being alive is now canon.
There is literally nothing stopping Disney from "reviving" Plagueis. And it absolutely would not be as much of a handwave as Maul's was considering Sheev mentions Plagueis' power to stay alive.
>>65055926
Being mentioned in ROTS and Tarkin make him canon buddy.
There's no way Snoke is Plagueis
Disney wants nothing to do with the Prequels, there's no fucking way they'll bring back something the general public only heard in 1 line of dialogue from a shit movie 11 years ago
>>65055996
Read the thread before posting, reddit.
>>65055926
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Plagueis
http://www.starwars.com/databank/darth-sidious-biography-gallery
Snoke is Ezra
Rebels is literally Snokes origin story
>>65055994
>>he doesn't understand that both TCW and Rebels are canon
>he keeps moving the goalposts
Let's make this simple.
>>65055098
>EU that was considered canon before the Disney wipe.
>>65055520
>Nope
>L-let me talk about c-cartoons instead!
BTFO.
>>65056052
>Rebels is literally Snokes origin story
The sad part is I can't tell if your trolling or not because Disney could go down this storyline.
>>65055994
>>65056042
http://www.starwars.com/databank/galaxies-opera-house
>the myth
So there you have it, from the horse's mouth. He isn't canon, he's a legend, a myth.
>>65055996
You're right, but good luck getting through to the kids that grew up on prequels.
Can sith lord's murder their apprentice?
I know the intended succession of power is that the apprentice kills the master.
But if the master kills the apprentice you can just go "he wasn't strong enough to inherit the title of sith lord, if he was he wouldn't be dead would he"
>>65054229
>The average Star Wars fan doesn't know the difference between Palpatine, Sheev, Sidious or the Emperor either. But they are all the same person.
Potentially true, so let's accept this for argument's sake. The difference, though, is that a single movie trilogy didn't rename that same character multiple times or put additional titles on him.
In the OT, he's The Emperor. That's all you ever hear. It's an Empire and he's identified as our Emperor. Simple and straight forward.
The name Palpatine originally came from EU and, of course, was used in the PT because he wasn't an Emperor yet. Then Sheev came out in other EU after that.
But Snoke has already been named Supreme Leader Snoke for his movies. His simple identifying title is already set up. For all I know, Snoke could be Plagueis but I don't think he will be because I don't think they'll spend a movie getting the audience to know his name and then, later, stop to basically correct it with, "but Snoke isn't actually my name. My name is Plagueis! None of you recognise that name but, yeah, he existed. And I'm him. And Snoke. So, I guess, call me whichever of those you wish."
The reveal of Vader actually being Luke's dad (later named as Anakin in ROTJ) worked because the conflict between Luke's absent father and Darth Vader being connected to that absence was set up from the beginning. It's a major sub-plot of ANH and becomes the plot of ESB and ROTJ. It's all about him.
This movie, so far, hasn't been about Snoke. He's just a shadowy figure named Snoke. While the next movies might reveal some back story, I don't foresee it being detailed enough to suddenly handle a wonky "who the fuck is Plagueis" explanation. The Emperor only got backstory because he starred in a whole prequel trilogy about that stuff. Snoke doesn't have that. They don't have time to explain him as Snoke and as Plagueis AND do all the Rey, Finn, Kylo, Luke stuff.
>>65046300
>Accents are genetic
>>65056102
lel BTFO indeed
Have an upboat for your master-debating!
>>65056133
http://www.starwars.com/databank/darth-sidious-biography-gallery
>The details of how Palpatine came to study under Sith Lord Darth Plagueis are known by very few.
So there you have it, from the horse's mouth. He is canon. He is real, and Sidious studied under him.
BTFOOO
>>65056133
>He isn't canon, he's a legend, a myth.
No it isn't. There is a canon article on Star wars wiki about canon Darth Palagueis.
>Darth Plagueis was a male Dark Lord of the Sith and the master of Darth Sidious. He acquired considerable knowledge in the field of midi-chlorian manipulation, but was ultimately betrayed and murdered by his own apprentice, in accordance with the "Rule of Two." Sidious later recounted the tale of his master's demise to lure Anakin Skywalker to the dark side.
CANON
A
N
O
N
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Plagueis
The reason why Snoke looks so fucked up, is that he's a Frankenstein monster of the Dark Side binding the souls of Sheev, Vader and Plagueis together
It's irrelevant if Palgueis is canon or not under Disney.
He'll never appear in any canonical work again. His little story is done, and he's dead. The character is too irrelevant to bring back.
>>65056225
>>65056221
Sorry but the databank on starwars.com is the only canon source we have, and it says Plagueis is only a myth.
>>65056231
>The reason why Snoke looks so fucked up, is that he's a Frankenstein monster of the Dark Side binding the souls of Sheev, Vader and Plagueis together
Nah, Snoke is Plagueis. After Sheev "killed" him, he literally came back from the fucking dead using the force. Midi-chlorians literally helped rebuild his body. That's why he looks like a fucking zombie. That's why he has the scar (lightsaber scar).
>>65056296
>Sorry but the databank on starwars.com is the only canon source we have, and it says Plagueis is only a myth.
I'm going to fucking kill you.
>>65056199
In the PT he is known by 3 of the 4 of those names:
First as Senator/Chancellor Palaptine.
Then as the "Emperor" at the end of ROTS and then also Darth Sidious. Having multiple aliases is not something that is new to Star Wars.
>>65056267
>>65056296
ALALALALALA I CAN'T HEAR YOU IM IN MY SAFE SPACE LALALALALALA
>>65054772
>discovered Force ghost technique
I don't know if Snoke is Plagueis, so I'll set that aside, but this does bring up something I've been thinking about. Lots of people talk about Snoke's appearances as if he's using a hologram message, like the Emperor used with Vader, to communicate from wherever he is and make himself look big.
I've been wondering if it's not a hologram and what if Snoke is a Force ghost. Like an evil old Ob-Wan for Kylo.
Plagueisfags think that:
>JJ is lying
>Kasdan is lying
>Hidalgo is lying
>There is a 2 year long misdirection campaign going on by Disney to hide Plagues
Yep, tottally guys. Disney is putting all this effort to hide a character mentioned once in the prequels for their epic twist. And let's ignore the fact it rectons all prior movies and shows that Luke and Vader failed.
>Kylo, I am your Grandfather's master master!
OMG! Can you imagine the epic reaction by the audience when this awesome twist is revealed? That tottaly is a worth twist that won't go over the head of everyone by neckbeards!
Look, I know Star Wars fans are autistsc, but please stop embarrassing yourselves.
>>65048144
I honestly like the idea till I think of Sheev going balls deep in some unfortunate Gungan.
>>65056390
Darksiders can't be Force Ghosts.
>>65056296
HERE HERE HERE HERE HERE
CANON PLAGUEIS
https://books.google.com/books?id=7S6OAwAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q=Darth%20Plagueis&f=false
https://books.google.com/books?id=7S6OAwAAQBAJ&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q=Darth%20Plagueis&f=false
>>65056415
>No guys Benadict Cumberbatch is totally not Khan I swear
Oh wait he was. They were lying.
Is it possible to be this stupid? Apparently yes, you are proving it.
>>65054637
In the EU Sheev had a biological son who was a mutant, he sent him away to work as a slave, he knocked up a Jedi in hiding and they had a son, who disappears from the EU right after his story is over.
>>65055020
That is not how Lucas intended it. Lucas gave direction to the guy who wrote the Plagueis novel and more details about Plagueis are included in both the ROTS screenplay and novelization that specify that he was Sheev's master and a real figure.
That he was a Muun was suggested by George to the guy writing the novelization, so that's in a canonical grey area since technically EVERYTHING George says about SW up to him selling it to Disney is highest level canon.
Remember the time he went on the Daily Show and told John Stewart that Obi-Wan came from the planet Stewjon? That is canon. That off handed throwaway answer is actually still in the star wars canon.
>>65056443
To make things clear, this is a new canon book.
>>65056455
Is Boba Fett surviving Lucas' idea?
>>65056449
>Khan
Oh yea, the most famous Star Trek villain from the most critically acclaimed Star Trek film, that saved the franchise from dying and is known to every Star Trek fan, was hidden in the Star Trek 2 semi-remake.
That's totally comparable to a throwaway line from Revenge of the Sith that no one gets but neckbeards that edit wookipedia.
Same scenario, yep.
>>65056552
>gets BTFO
>N-no its totally not the same!! ;___;
B T F O
T
F
O
>>65056455
>That is not how Lucas intended it
>>"Now there's a hint in the movie that there was a Sith lord who had the power to create life. But it's left unsaid: Is Anakin a product of a super-Sith who influenced the midichlorians to create him, or is he simply created by the midichlorians to bring forth a prophecy, or was he created by the Force through the midichlorians? It's left up to the audience to decide. How he was born ulitmately has no relationship to how he dies, because in the end, the prophecy is true: Balance comes back to the Force." - George Lucas
>But it's left unsaid
>It's left up to the audience to decide.
STAPH.
>>65043960
Plaguis is using Vader's corpse as a Vessel to be Snoke, like Orochimaru.
>>65056415
>There is a 2 year long misdirection campaign going on by Disney to hide Plagues
>HURRR DURR THEY ARE GOING TO SPOIL IT FOR THE AUDIENCE RIGHT GUIES!
>>65056614
Don't fuck my theory up with your bullshit Naruto crap
>>65056552
>hidden
He was a major character. His plot was basically a remake of the episode "Space Seed."
Come on, son.
>Soundtracks Imply Snoke is Darth Plagueis
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vd_8-NCN5CU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vd_8-NCN5CU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vd_8-NCN5CU
I'm pretty sure Shmi Skywalker is Snoke. The scars match up!!!
>>65056732
His existence in the film was hidden during marketing, not during the actual film.
>>65056811
It ain't Shmi
>>65056378
True. But those aren't entirely new identities for a minor character. The Phantom Menace sets up both Sidious and Palpatine right from the start, with the audience seeing they're the same person if they have eyes. Palpatine then just gains various ranks over time, like Luke or Han becoming Commander/General when they weren't before.
But, imagine if Darth Maul had been in Attack of the Clones. We don't have Darth Maul introduced in TPM as Darth Maul, the shadowy Dark Side enforcer for the movie, finish the movie and then, in AotC reveal, "actually, I'm more than just Maul. I'm also Darth (whatever)! And here is the explanation/backstory..."
Palpatine/Sidious didn't do the same thing part-way through either. He is how he was set up in each trilogy. Snoke just exists as a big baddie; a physical sign of who/what has to be toppled in order to win this new trilogy (or however many movies they take for this plotline). It would make more sense if some sort of connection between Snoke and Luke had been set up. Some sort of "we have history, he and I" kind of seed, like the early connection between Luke's lost father and Vader in ANH.
>>65056875
Source?
>>65056441
That's traditionally been the view, true. Is there stuff in what is currently still canon that confirms that that's surely the case?
>>65053739
How does Plagueis negate Anakin's journey any more than some other random 1000 year old insanely powerful dark side user?
>>65046209
>There's no way she's a force baby because that's too weird for the mainstream audience
Agreed. It's Disney
>>65053698
George Lucas made Plagueis a muun, which is a very Lucas thing to do and I'm okay with that. Besides, that means it would take more effort to make him appear threatening.
>>65056904
Well the only reason we know Palpatine is Sidious is because of the order the movies were released.
If the movies came out 1-6 instead of 4-3, they would've hidden Sidious/Sheev's identity thus making it a surprise. So there is no reason they wouldn't be able to do it here.
>>65056905
Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. I mean I know you are trolling, but have some common sense at least.
>>65056999
Well actually Dark Siders can be force ghosts... but in a different form. For example here is Darth Bane's "force ghost" from the Clone Wars:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nQXLOK3KtY
So they can be Force ghosts, but what we saw in TFA was just a hologram.
>>65057004
Because Snoke has arleady been stated not to be a Sith.
According to Lucas, the whole point of the six films is Anakin fulfilling the prophecy to balance the force, by wiping out the Sith.
If another Sith appears, that basically means he failed and the story of the past six films was for nothing.
This is why they had to make up the Knights of Ren, to avoid using Sith from now on.
>>65048030
ah shit, this sounds like something they'd do
could be the reason why Maz didn't want to talk about the lightsaber to her
>>65056875
>it ain't shmi starts playing
>>65057136
>So they can be Force ghosts, but what we saw in TFA was just a hologram.
They clarified Bane was an illusion by Sheev, not a force ghost.
>>65057149
Knights of Ren are basically Sith.
>>65057149
Plagueis could've turned away from the Sith. Thats not an insane claim to make considering his apprentice tried to kill him.
But what the prophecy said was that the Chosen One would destroy the Sith. It was most likely accomplished in ROTJ by Vader but it could easily mean Luke is the Chosen One instead and is supposed to destroy Plagueis.
But if not, so? The prophecy really didn't mean shit if Snoke and Kylo are able to take the galaxy over just 30 years later and bring the Dark Side back.
>>65057189
This. Same shit different name. They are all dark siders.
Its like saying I want to kill all the Shia Muslims! Then you do, but the Sunnis are still around so what did you accomplish.
>>65057189
Yea, that's the point, it's how they get around George's limitation.
>>65055364
Source that Lucas ever used the word "Muun?"
>>65057317
"That's no Muun" - Obi Wan Kenobi
>>65057136
I need proof for this so called "trolling". Also, Shmope is Shmi.
>>65057317
>"A panel on continuity at the Celebration IV convention revealed that his identity as a Muun had originally come from George Lucas.[30]"
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Forum:CIV_Continuity_Questions
>Closing comments
>Plagueis as a Muun is from George
Despite what people say, Lucas' quotes are not canon unless specifically listed somewhere in new canon literature.
>>65057456
>i_was_only_pretending_to_be_retarded.png
>>65043960
but Rey issheev's clone, senpai
>>65057482
>Plagueis as a Muun is from George
NOT CANON
O
T
C
A
N
O
N
senpai
>>65057615
>>65057482
But Snoke is still Plagueis, right?
top kek
Anymore loopholes you guys have for your headcanon?
>>65056875
It ain't Shhhhhmmmmmi I ain't no Galactic Senator's son
>>65057615
>>65057666
So either Lucas' quotes are canon or they aren't. If they are, Snoke can't be Plagueis because he isn't a Muun (as far as we know) and Revan, the best SW character to ever exist is still canon.
If not, Plagueis can still be a human and still be Snoke and Revan is not canon.
Either way I win. :^)
>>65057779
>revan
>canon
>ever
I have bad news for you.
>>65057829
Oh so Plagueis isn't a Muun then?
>>65057666
>But Snoke is still Plagueis, right?
He will be revealed so in episode 9.
>>65053698
>when that pussy stank
What if Snoke used the midichlorians to create Rey?
>>65058452
Fuck off tripfag
But I think its a plausible theory. Theres no evidence to go off of though.
>>65056551
no, but he liked it. Darth Maul surviving was his idea.
>>65056606
We all know that nothing he says about the prequels means anything.
The biggest problem I have with Snoke not being Plageus (aside from him just being a shitty Emperor rehash) is that it means we are just supposed to assume that badass Sith tier monster men just pop out of holes in the ground or something? I mean I get the feeling from Snoke that he's ancient, where could he have possibly come from in the last 30 years? If he isn't Plageus I can't think of how they could make any not stupid backstory for him.
>>65056614
No,Plagueis is using his fire wind attack, just like Rokikiro from my favorite animu.
>>65058564
This.
Although, any dark side bad guys after the "Chosen One destroy the Sith prophecy" is pretty stupid. But money must be had.
>>65053698
He looked fine.
>>65058564
Neo-Canon is setting him up as some guy from the outer rim, possibly the "creator" of the dark side too.
>>65058680
Agreed. Star Wars has like no alien bad guys.
Good ones at least.
>>65058811
"Creator" of the dark side? Fucking what?
Source?
>>65058836
Not him but a new book says Sheev sent some dudes to seek the origin of the dark side deep in the outer rim
>>65058680
Ayy lmao, XCOM 2 can't come soon enough.
>>65058836
>"No Sith remains. And the lone Jedi that exists--the son of Anakin Skywalker--possesses an untouchable soul. At least for now. We must instead move towards the dark side. Palpatine felt that the universe beyond the edges of our map was where his power came from. Over the many years he, with our aid, sent men and women beyond known space. They built labs and communication stations on distant moons, asteroids, out there in the wilds. We must follow them. Retreat from the Galaxy. Go out beyond the veil of stars. We must seek the source of the dark side like a man looking for a wellspring of water."
>>65047368
if you have to train the jedi, who trained the first jedi?
>>65058836
Here's him later in his career, he got rekt by Maladian assassins who caught him by surprise because he was shit at seeing the future (which is also how Sheev killed him, he literally got him drunk then force lightninged him to death) and cut his throat out. Sheev and his bro Sate had to come in and shoot all of those fuckers, Sheev performed Sith reverse CPR to stop his hearts so he didn't bleed out. He had to wear the mask the rest of his life.
I recommend the Plagueis book, one of the few good works in the later EU. You get introduced to young Sheev, who is basically Elliot Rodgers except less whiny and actually skilled at things. The later Maul books are also good, if I remember correctly there's some Maul stuff in the Plagueis book too that was delightfully evil.
Like the time Sheev had Maul climb a mountain naked in a snowstorm, then when he got to the top, Sheev asked him if he was cold, Maul said yes, then Sheev threw him in a lake and told him to swim or die.
>>65048144
I could get behind this. Heck, it could be a way to have her start to fall to the dark side with feminists going nuts.
