> Hurrr she's a mary sue
> Durrrr Kylo Ren is weak as fuck
No you fucking faggots. Pay attention when you watch a movie.
During her fight against Kylo Ren, she's weak. She defends herself quite well, but that's about it. She loses ground and falls back all the time against him. Until the precipice, that is.
Now, did you notice? When they're lookning at each other, saber against saber, pay attention to Rey's expression. It's changing. She's scared. Now her eyes. Look at them. Those eyes are eyes of someone angry. Her mouth. That's the mouth of someone about to spill hate.
Now, notice how the combat turns on her favour? Did you notice her strokes? Those strokes are not of someone calm and composed. From that point onward, she's litteraly dominating the combat. Kylo can't do shit against her, because she received a huge powerup from her anger. Yes, she's letting the Dark Side overflow her
This is not the first time we've seen this in Star Wars, be it in the series or in the movies. Think about Obiwan vs Maul. It's the same, actually.
this is the face of someone calm and serene in the face of conflict, senpai
>>64127879
That still doesn't explain why Kylo lost his ability to paralyze people.
Did Chewbacca's bowcaster also cause amnesia :^)
>>64127951
That's the face of someone that knows she's about to win because she just learned what she should do to make it happen.
>>64127879
Decent bait, but saying she isn't a Mary Sue is just too much of a leap to ever be believable.
I love how every redditor retard thinks they've got the perfect rebuttal for Rey's being a Mary Sue.
>>64127879
Honestly OP i don't give a fuck about the rationalizations that you and people who liked this shit can come up with.
The thing is the protagonist shouldn't have been able to defeat the bad guy in the first fucking movie of a trilogy.
If she was a well written character like Luke, she would have gotten her ass kicked the entire movie and then in the end maybe she pulls some crazy powers out of her ass.
But as it is she was perfect in everything and had no flaws, and in the last 20 minutes of the movie she starts to do things that only a trained jedi should be able to do.
Fuck this character and fuck you.
She isn't a Mary Sue because she's an ugly trog. :^)
And why the fuck does she use that shitty accent?
Everyone knows anything but the west coast neutral accent is offputting.
>>64127879
Why is she so smug?
>>64127879
>She loses ground and falls back all the time against him
It's over, Rey! I have the high ground.
>>64127951
Oh look, she's closing her eyes and meditating. I should just stand here and watch like a faggot instead of chopping her face off.
>>64128196
Basically. Anakin gets his hand cut off trying to fight a much more dangerous opponent, Luke gets his hand cut off fighting a more dangerous opponent, but Rey just wins first time with no training
>>64127879
Yeah? Was it "the dark side taking over" when she does a jedi mind trick like 20 minutes after finding out what the force even was? With no training? Lmao. please kid.
>>64127982
I always assumed there was some bullshit reason why the force couldnt really be used in fights to a large extent
>there are 1000s of people on this board right now in eternal threads like theses that think and actually believe that this movie is real life
>>64128570
Is it not? I thought this was some histroy documentary
/vr/ here
Rey is as if someone had read the definition of Mary Sue and decided to make a movie about it.
>>64127879
Are you genuinely retarded?
>>64127879
goku is a mary sue, rey is goku so rey is a fucking mary sue.
>>64128298
he literally says he wants to train her right in this very shot, are you retarded my friend?
>>64128570
Asking for well written characters is not the same as believing that movies are "real life", you nigger.
>>64127879
she's the mary sue because ren didn't burn her with the cross guard like he did with the nigger.
>>64128196
>If she was a well written character like Luke, she would have gotten her ass kicked the entire movie and then in the end maybe she pulls some crazy powers out of her ass.
Idiots actually think this is what is a good character.
What a plob.
The very scene you're talking about... the exact moment, when you can see the red saber reflecting in both their eyes... She closes hers, and when she reopens them there is a second (green, I believe) blade of light along with the red. LUKE WAS THERE WITH HER. SHE ACHIEVED BALANCE
Why the fuck didn't she take the high ground? Was the knowledge of Sokan lost once Vader, Obi Wan and Sheev died?
>>64128710
>well written means being shit at first but ending up brilliant
/tv/ ladies and gentlemen.
>>64128738
I KNOW HOW TO REPAIR EVERYTHING AND I DEFEAT BIG BAD GUY WITH THE FORCE WITHOUT EVER BEING TRAINED, THAT IS A GOOD CHARACTER
>>64127982
Kylo was prone to fits of rage. He probably lost focus and just wanted to hammer her into the ground with his sword.
Take a look at this image and tell me she isn't a Mary Sue.
This looks like some fat tumblrina power fanatsy.
The only thing missing is the fact that she isn't a muslim or brown skinned.
>>64128196
Course they do. Otherwise they ex machina out of the scene like in the first hobbit, or she dies and theres no point to a protag having the force
>>64128796
>any of that matters
Face it, kid.
You are a gargantuan pleb that wouldn't understand characterization if it came along and raped your face.
>>>/r/eddit/
>>64128710
>well written characters
They were perfectly depthful for a space adventure story that is meant for children. What is the issue here?
>>64128806
So you are telling me that the guy who was wounded by a bowcaster thought it was a better idea to "hammer" someone into the ground instead of using force powers? :^)
Also nowhere in the Star Wars universe sith are required to concentrate to use powers. If anything it is the other way around.
>>64127879
I have the novelization. In it they basically say she became so enraged she easily toppled the injured Ren and almost considered killing him, but then was revolted by the feeling of the dark side. Kind of like how Luke almost killed Vader in RotJ, but decided not to. That's why she runs.
Basically this movie has shown not only is Rey tempted by the dark side, but Kylo is tempted by the light as well. They're not all that different.
>>64127982
He probably figured she could resist since he'd been unable to invade her mind.
The length you people go to to hate this movie is really fucking weird. There's plenty of valid criticism to be made without inventing weird shit.
>>64127951
>this is the face of someone calm and serene in the face of conflict, senpai
>>64128916
take your shit to /lit/
>>64128830
>lives in the desert
>completely covers herself
>not muslim
>>64127879
>>64127879
>Star Wars
>Well Written
K I L L YOURSELVES MILLENIALS
>>64128856
>Otherwise they ex machina out of the scene like in the first hobbit, or she dies and theres no point to a protag having the force
Then maybe the writters shouldn't have had her have a battle with the bad guy in the first movie?
Luke escaped the Death Star after Obi Wan was killed, instead of pursuing him and fighting him. That also would've have worked for Rey.
>knowing how to fight
Plausible and her big stick means even a slight figure can get a little more power with a weapon
>knowing how to fix junk
Plausible, if a scavenger doesn't know what a worthwhile part is, they won't last long
>piloting the Millenium Falcon like Han Solo who actually owned it and was experienced at flying it
Bullshit
>using force powers after a few tries after merely seeing them be used
Bullshit
>fighting against a guy who has several chunks missing from him, and winning
Plausible
>>64128963
it actually explains pretty much all the deleted scenes that will be in the eventual extended edition. the original cut of this movie was over 4 hours long. that's the version the cancer guy got to see.
>>64128160
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect
I love how every redditor and sjw are proving she is one
>>64127879
God the damage control force is everywhere today. Accept it guys it was a bad film. Move on with your lives.
>>64128916
very poetic
JJ is a genius
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sQEm2RmdIi0
/tv/ BTFO
>>64128924
>he paralyzed her before
>>64128924
Nigger the villain was introduced and shown to be a menacing bad guy, by paralyzing people.
That's like the first think that he does after he's introduced.
Asking why he forgot about that shit in the final battle is perfectly valid.
>>64129014
I hope he died satisfied. If this was the last movie I got to see, I would be pissed.
>>64128678
Then he should have chopped her hands off. They can be easily replaced in the SW universe.
>>64128924
It's just shitposting
>>64128983
But how else are they gonna redo Empire with the light-sabre force pull out-of-the-snow move?
>>64128742
>SHE ACHIEVED BALANCE
In one day, no less! Being a Jedi Master is so easy, it makes you wonder why they bother training them from such a young age.
she's a mix of Darth Revan and Bastila Shan from KOTOR vidya.
it's kinda obvious
>she uses battle meditation
>her memory was probably wiped
>>64129065
B-but he just killed his father! And then got shot with Chewie's bowcaster! He wasn't thinking clearly, and suddenly forgot how to use his abilities!
>>64129014
>Star Wars Extended editions
Well at least they will explain all this shit in the special edition of the blu ray and not in the video games, books, comic books and cereal boxes.
Young Anakin takes out a droid control ship as a toddler and you're saying this is better because REY is a Mary Sue?
Lucas has played you '90s born millennials like a fiddle.
>>64129092
Calling out a movie on its plot holes,convienences and other valid criticisms isn't shitposting anon
>>64127879
From where did you copy this hilarious text?
>>64129142
She's not Revan though, Revan was already a seasoned Jedi/Sith with a bunch of experience and training under his belt when he was mindwiped
If Rey was mindwiped she would've learned and had all of her force training as a toddler
Revan also still had to gradually relearn all of his skills, he didn't have a super saiyan mode where he suddenly remembered everything
Daly reminder it was litteraly the first time she hold a lightsaber
It was even the first 2 min of her life holding a lightsaber
She couldn't even use a blaster 10 min before because she forgot to take off the security
your point is invalid
>>64129152
>toddler
this is why you fail
>>64129221
although with your story it was implied from the start that you're strong with the force
>>64129089
This is my major bone to pick
Every Jedi character in Star Wars either ends up dead or wounded irreplaceably, even Finn gets BTFO hard and will walk about with a permanent back scar but I can guarauntee you now that Rey will come out of this trilogy without a single scratch on her.
And yet people will still try and claim she isn't a Mary Sue.
Let's see her lose a hand then, oh wait we won't cause Disney hasn't got the balls and Rey is a tumblr tier fantasy projection character for spoilt white hoes and little white princesses who'll never face a day of hardship in their lives.
>>64127879
No retard obi Wan used patience and jedi virtue to figure a way out of his situation. The truest of jedi
>>64129152
Here's a novel idea for you TFA fans:
The prequels were shit and poorly written movies
TRIGGER WARNINGThe Force Awankens was also a shit movie and poorly written
>>64128907
Did you miss the part about "fits of rage"? Rage doesn't lead to rational thought, moron.
>>64129161
I understand that but there's some people that haven't even seen the movie and are just parroting the hate that came from those that did see it.
>>64128865
>NUH UH YOURE WRONG AND DON'T UNDERSTAND CHARACTERIZATION
Great points you're making there. You really convinced me.
>>64129299
>Let's see her lose a hand then, oh wait we won't cause Disney hasn't got the balls and Rey is a tumblr tier fantasy projection character for spoilt white hoes and little white princesses who'll never face a day of hardship in their lives.
>Wanting to see wimmin get mutilated or maimed in 2015+
You should fuck off back to 4+4chan you misogynist Gaymergater.
>>64129299
>Rey is a tumblr tier fantasy projection character
and that's why she will be crippled, naive
tumblr likes their pricesses strong and independent
see Furiosa
>implying rey wasn't trained by luke before he wiped her memories and sent her to jakku
>>64127879
>she doesn't have experience with a saber
>she wields a staff on Jakku for years
>she knows basic fighting skills with a staff like weapon
People are stupid
>>64128916
>Basically this movie has shown not only is Rey tempted by the dark side
The movie doesn't show us that, the book does
>>64129412
Getting fits of rage won't make you forget about your most useful ability.
Unless you also wanna argue that Crawling Ren was mentally challenged.
>>64129467
>and that's why she will be crippled
No she won't.
Also Furiosa was already crippled.
>>64129531
He couldn't even lift the lightsaber you dumb fuck
What makes you think he still has command over his full abilities
>>64129598
>No she won't
good point, thanks
>>64129634
>He couldn't even lift the lightsaber you dumb fuck
>Making stuff up
I give up.
How did she know how to use the Jedi mind trick?
How did a lowly scrapper that can barely feed herself learn to speak multiple languages including one that is used by expensive droids?
Where did she learn how to use a lightsaber on the same level as a Sith apprentice? Did she take fencing classes?
How is she able to resist Kylo Ren's mind crush with no knowledge on how to use the Force?
Why did they make it a point that she didn't need Finn to hold her hand?
How does she know more about the Millennium Falcon than Han Solo does?
Why do they send Rey and Chewbacca to get Luke Skywalker? Do they really think a total stranger to him would do the job better?
>>64129521
This. There is no "struggle" in the movie, Rey just instantly connects with the Force. All of you retards who think she's going to fall are just grasping at straws.
>>64127879
>defending the piece of shit A Newer Hope
fucking idiot kids, I want winter break to end so they're back in middle school already
OP I'm honestly breathtaken at how many people can't see that she's using anger and her desire to kill, to make herself stronger
there's a lot of these dumb people, and not just in this thread
but its so obvious that she's tapping into the dark side, so poorly concealed, that I think it's likely this is a red herring
>>64128830
thats what threw me, really
they went over the top to appeal to new age diversity, yet the MC is still white
i wanted a brown skin muslim/indian waifu
>>64129521
The movie does. Read OP's post and stop sleeping in the theater. Or are you that snorring faggot I sometimes have to deal with?
>>64129714
I will be euphoric and eat my fedora if she ends up turning to the dark side in the sequelShe won't
>>64128916
>novelization
A novelization of the prequels also says that Sheev and the Jedi were moving and fighting so quickly Anakin couldn't keep track of what was happening when this scene happened
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3oSAVwcD4U
>>64129680
>How is she able to resist Kylo Ren's mind crush with no knowledge on how to use the Force?
This is the big one for me. Not only can she resist it, she overpowers him. If she was just resistant that would be fine, some people have stronger resistance to suggestions, but Rey is able to read a dark-side trainee's mind without any training herself.
>>64129679
He tries to force pull the lightsaber and fails, because rey gets it
Blind, stupid
>>64128160
She's less of a mary sue and more of a less tactfully designed main character. Personally I can't wait for a dvdscr or equivalent so I can cut out a few scenes, particularly her force persuasion one and let her escape be a mystery
![papua-woman_2072013i[2].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/xtt7rZr.jpg "papua-woman_2072013i[2].jpg")
upcoming attractions
>rey trains with luke, gets very powerful very fast
>kylo trains with snoke, but his wavering between light and dark sides holds him back from achieving true power
>kylo is severely punished for his constant disappointments, defects
>encounters rey and co by chance
>kylo tries to join their side, but a fight ensues since nobody trusts him
>they eventually accept him ala prince zuko
>kylo and rey train in techniques of the dark side to help her prepare
>finn misinterprets all this close personal time as a budding romance. feels he is only holding everyone back and leaves the group
>the two encounter the other knights of ren, a badass fight ensues
>rey ends up betraying kylo and embracing the dark side, the power has gone to her head
>she leaves with the knights of ren as bb8 drags kylo's body back to the resistance
>>64129785
That's because she was more powerful with the force than he was, and because Luke's lightsaber "connected with her".
Blind and retarded.
>>64129714
I'm honestly breath taken at how far people have to reach to justify Rey's bullshit. "Using the dark side"? Prove it. There was no "scary dark side" music playing, Rey's face turned serene and then she kicked Kylo's ass. What a load of bullshit, how are we supposed to see Kylo as a threat now? She kicked his ass WITH ZERO TRAINING. That means that she's already better than him. If both of them get trained, SHE'LL STILL BE BETTER THAN HIM.
>i wanted a brown skin muslim/indian waifuPOO IN LOO
>>64129367
Almost like its a poorly written franchise as a whole or something
>>64127879
You couldn't be more autistic
why dont the bad guys use loyal computer-controlled clones as their elite soldiers anymore?
why are humans diverted to janitorial and maintenance duties instead of droids?
>>64129843
I really hope this flip happens
Only thing that'll redeem her character
is it possible that part of the "myth" of Luke Skywalker that Rey knows about involves controlling people's actions? I mean she's clearly heard incredible things about Luke and the force, even if they're just considered fantastical stories on Jakku. Couldn't part of the myth of Luke Skywalker involve specific force powers?
>>64129152
People complain about the prequels all the time though.
Anakin being a Gary Stu just rarely gets mentioned because it's overshadowed by all the other things about the prequels that were even worse, namely the boring political dialogue and Jar-Jar.
People sure are assblasted at her being called a Mary Sue.
It's pretty fun.
>>64129221
Rey did "edit swkotor.ini [Game Options] add EnableCheats=1 then when playing press ~ to bring down console"
Honestly, she couldn't be like Luke from ANH. Not in 2015. If she was as whiny and useless as Luke was there would be a shitstorm of articles and tweets about how much JJ and Disney hate women.
>>64129985
>Couldn't part of the myth of Luke Skywalker involve specific force powers?
Nobody knows, because instead of exposition and character development the movie decided that poorly done action scenes that rip off A New Hope was the way to go.
But i'm sure they will explain in the video games.
>>64129768
>AAAUUOOOOGHHHGHGHAAAHHAHHHH
What did he mean by this?
>>64129152
People shit all over Anakin since his very inception, though
At least with Anakin it was implied that he fucked up a lot of pods while podracing and basically dedicated his entire childhood to that shit
>>64128672
Lol. Goku is less Mary Sue than Rey.
I compared Kylo to Gohan.
>>64129845
Nice aspull
>>64130045
Luke was also saved by a man a couple of times (Obi Wan after the sandniggers and Han Solo at the trench)
Having Rey being saved by a man would be too much in 2015.
The fact she lasted more than 10 seconds in a lightsaber battle against a TRAINED force and lightsaber user is ridiculous enough.
Never mind actually fucking winning.
>>64130151
That was the entire point of the cantina scene nigger and the people saying that she went super saiyan with the force at the end are the people defending this shit, not me.
>>64130152
correct. can't have a woman be weak, can't have a woman rely on the help of anyone.
rey is a mary sue because of third wave internet outrage feminism.
>>64128196
>The thing is the protagonist shouldn't have been able to defeat the bad guy in the first fucking movie of a trilogy.
If we were talking about Darth Vader then yeah, but Kylo Ren is literally a half-caste, temper tantrum bitch who is riding the coat tails of the Sith and honestly shouldn't even be wielding a light saber since he's only proficient with range force powers.
Kylo Ren is just shit and needs to killed off by a proper raised Sith Lord.
>>64129462
>Can't refute the point so starts calling people names
Yeah u sure won that arguement....
>>64130333
I can't tell if you are being sarcastic or not, but either way it is not so much internet feminism as it is the desire to be as progressive and liberal as fuck in Hollywood.
>>64130481
they are very closely related.
>>64129054
This guy is making a lot of assumptions to justify this shit even though he's wrong half the time
>>64128830
>The only thing missing is the fact that she isn't a muslim or brown skinned.
Count your blessings. I for one love Rey because I know what's coming next. By the time Ep. X rolls around and Disney doesn't need to bother to try to tie into the Original Trilogy anymore it's going to be a minority free-for-all.
Soon after that, some horrendous Marvel x Star Wars crossover because idiots on Reddit will be clamoring for it, and people will be asking if the franchise is well and truly dead. Answer: no, not yet. Not until C3PO and R2D2 are replaced with sassy transgender droids that don't need no man.
>>64127879
>BB-8 points out Finn
>Rey chases him and attacks him
How is that okay? So somebody runs away and it's okay to fuck them up?
>>64130629
>Marvel x Star Wars crossover
>Guardians of the Galaxy x Star Wars crossover.
Kill me now.
>>64130121
Kylo is definitely Vegeta. He should be the strongest by means of his families ties and training but he will always play second fiddle to Rey/Goku who were separated from their family and self-trained. He will play the villain for some time before eventually being redeemed by the light and joining with Rey.
>>64129054
>BTFO by Mundane Matt
Yeah no
>>64130681
The robot said he stole that jacket, robots cant be wrong
>>64130681
I take it you aren't from America? Its literally how all cops operate
>>64128979
>a seasoned Sith apprentice...
that has just killed his father (a task that's he was obviously conflicted into doing) and then tanked a blasted shot from an OP gun fired by a sasquatch.
He was a good friend thou.
>>64129845
Where was this ever implied? Oh wait it's not. Its just based soley off of convienence.
>>64130756
who is this guy?
Is he always this retarded?
>>64130718
irc there was a marvel/star trek crossover comic that got made once.
>>64130794
It's implied that he completely turns to the Dark side when he kills Han. Listen to their convorsation and the Watch the lighting changes. There was no confliction once he made the decision.
The shot in the gut thing is complete horseshit reasoning as well
>>64129054
>requires you to see it a couple of times
Shill detected
>>64130955
Gut shot would have made more sense if he hadn't easily dispatched a guy conditioned from birth to be a fighter a minute beforehand
>>64130955
I would like to see you fighting like a seasoned faggot after getting shot by a furry... the movie was shit none the less
>>64131065
I can't I'm not a sith or a trained fighter.
>>64129412
No, rage leads to having a high level of dark side power.
>>64130404
What was the argument? Innuendo and hearsay?
>>64129054
>pronounces AT-AT as "atat"
AHAHAHA OPINION FUCKING DISCARDED
>pulling out fuses opens electronic doors
Also why is she the greatest fucking pilot ever again? The shit she was doing was insane.
>Ren killed all of Lukes students
But Luke The Knights of Ren are your students
Luke killed the one with the staff and gave it to Rey and dropped her off on Jaku
>>64129034
Heheh. Most of the time the anti-Mary Sue argument has come down to 'well so is Luke, then', and that argument has to come down to 'blew up the Death Star on his own'. Trying to argue it away is never going to work.
>>64127879
>Movie is literally called the force awakens
>'Why is everyones force powers so much stronger than before???'
>>64128806
I would mind hammering her into the ground with my sword, if you know what I mean. ;^)
Let me expedite this process for you guys. Merry Christmas /tv/!
Full Star Wars: The Force Awakens download, .mp4 format, decent quality, even has the credits at the end
http://downloadconfirm.net/file/056Ba2
>>64129714
The way to show this would have been:
>Narrowly escapes being killed/beaten/captured by Kylo
>Next movie, does much better, by getting very angry, possibly after already having been warned about leaning to the dark side
Not just
>ReyWinsLol
>>64130955
The bowcaster instakilled every mook that got hit by it, and even killed one guy who didn't even take a direct hit just from the explosion.
The fact that the guy is walking around at all after that is a bigger plot hole than getting beat by unskilled opponents.
>>64129714
She literally stopped mid fight and mediated and became calm
We fucking know all of this you god damn faggot
she literally closes her eyes and then opens them again and knows everything she needs to know to win the lightsaber match
this is literally the problem that people have, definitively
you haven't addressed jack shit
>>64129985
But Luke knows telekinesis is possible during his training with Yoda. He still struggles with it, and can't lift his X-Wing.
>>64131776
You mean, she knows she has to get angry to win? Well, yeah. it actually adresses everything.
Jedi can't do shit when they aren't angry. When was the last time they won anything by not being angry? Yeah, right. Never.
![Taco-Bell-Crunchwrap-Slider-Take-the-Money-and-Run[2].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/9kVzVVQ.jpg "Taco-Bell-Crunchwrap-Slider-Take-the-Money-and-Run[2].jpg")
>>64131629
>37kb
>>64131846
>she knows she has to get angry to win
How does she know that? How could she possibly know that? She's not a Jedi history scholar. She thought they were fucking mythical.
>>64131424
force mang
>>64128672
Except Goku woudn't win without continual loss of life/limbs/friends....hence making him stronger should he survive. Rey was just OP as fuk and could Jedi Mind Trick with no training.
>inb4 lukes daughter
Idgaf f@m Luke was Vader's son and still got rekt
>>64128865
Ah yes, the reddit counter using logical fallacies. We're on to you faggots. Btw
>kill yourself familia
>seriously though, back to imgur you fat fuck
>>64131898
>>64131898
Because it's basic fucking human instinct? You don't win a fistfight against burglars/rapists/whatever by being the fucking Gandhi. Sure she can't possibly knows that.
Jesus, people this days.
>>64127879
calm down OP, it's a movie
>>64128217
I guess you hate Obi Wan too huh faggot
>>64127879
I think I'm finally starting to understand. Everyone posting about the soggy knees and denying that Rey is a Mary Sue is a waifufag.
That goddamn lightsaber better be possessed by all those goddamn kids Anakin killed with it.
>>64132017
So you're saying basic human instinct supersedes the Force? Why didn't Ben experience that same instinctual motivation?
>>64130008
>anakin a Gary stu
>gets btfo or is said to have been btfo in every movie several times
>>64130008
Anakin in Episode 1 and Rey are about equally in terms of OP-ness. Do you think Episode 1 is a good movie? Do you think Anakin in Episode 1 is a good and enjoyable character?
In 2 and 3 he exhibits major character flaws.
>>64127879
Loli Rey?
>WANT
>>64127879
Remember when Kenobi went to help Luke, but then he beat up all the tusken raiders single-handedly with a stick? Remember when Luke was in a bar and those guys started giving him shit, so he did super judo moves? Remember when he pushed Han Solo out of the way and started piloting the Millennium Falcon and did some really cool maneuvers despite being a dirt farmer all his life? Remember when they got captured in the Death Star, and Luke used advanced Force tricks without any proper training? Remember when Kenobi died and Luke was like "no" and Force pulled Kenobi's lightsaber from Vader, and then attacked Vader with both his and Kenobi's lightsaber? Remember when Luke seriously wounded Vader in a lightsaber fight, and would have killed him had the ground not split between them?
Yeah, me neither, because as Mary Sue as Luke was, he never reached the levels of MaRey Sue. He was never Rey bad.
>>64132116
You're right, he does because he's a dark side user of the force. That's the easy way to powerup. But you have to keep in mind :
- He's weakened
- He's full of himself
- Even though he went full dark side, he was still hesitant to the light a few minutes before
- He's supposed to bring her alive before Snoke
- He's actually facing someone expressing basic instinct of survival, even more so than his, letting the right amount of dark side flow in
>>64132414
Adding to this, even Anakin wasn't this much of a Mary Sue. You didn't have Anakin go toe-to-toe with Darth Maul and win in a lightsaber fight in Episode I. You didn't have him do complicated shit with the Force in Episode I.
Yeah, he's pretty good in Episode II, but 1) that's after Jedi training and 2) he still gets beaten by Dooku (and that was in a fight where it was Dooku vs Kenobi and Anakin).
If it had been Rey, she'd have killed Maul as a child, then beat Dooku as a padawan. She'd also probably have used the Jedi mind trick successfully on Watoo because Mary Sue.
>defeat the empire
>change name from rebel alliance to the RESISTANCE and operate out of mud huts even though, in theory, you are now the dominance player
What reason was there for this, besides to be similar to episode IV?
The only people who complain about or even use terms like "Mary Sue" are internet autists like yourselves.
>>64129467
Furiosa wasn't a mary sue she got fucked up by the end
>>64132700
It's called a cold war, played through proxy war and proxy belligerents. Surely you should know about this.
>>64127879
Yeah it was very blatantly close to Luke's final fight with Vader, where he's clearly using the aggression but then still hold back from killing.
People really didn't pay much attention to stuff in this movie.
It's hard to say if they'l be a role reversal between Kylo and Rey but they clearly don't want them to be strait light vrs dark.
Has anyone else though that maybe Kylo Ren just sucks at using a lightsaber and Rey isn't really that special? Obviously throughout the movie it shows how strong he is with the force, but all he ever does with his lightsaber is execute people and throw bitch fits. The first time we see him use it in combat he barley beats a random dindu stormtrooper, and then looses to Rey.
I feel like forgiving it because it's star wars, but shes just too boring.
Theres no change growth left for her, shes already able to do most of the jedi stuff, and she already won in a fight. Now it's just training montages to get better. Hell she already got over her need to go back to planet not-tatooine.
The only character I care about is kylo because there is something actually going on with him.
>>64127879
I was with you right up until the end. The correct example would have been Luke in his fight against Vader when Vader mentioned turning Leia over to the dark side and Luke snapped.
>>64130014
This.
this is worse than anime power level threads. Suddenly becoming more skilled because you turn angry is just hilarious
>>64127951
And then she lashes out in rage immediately afterwards and almost commits murder.
Why did she win when she closed her eyes?
If shes focussing she should be calmer and less angry. Was snoke talking to her when she closed her eyes?
>>64129467
>see Furiosa
The amputee who was so fucking close to death that she needed an utter miracle to live?
Boy, did you even watch the movie?
>>64127879
She seemed pretty calm desu
>>64133263
Isn't "quick and easy" the path to the dark side of the force?
>>64133364
This is Star Wars you dumbfuck, where going to the dark side is the easy way to get stronger. Do you know what leads to the dark side? Fear, hate and anger.
>>64129234
you just swing a thing.
She's been swinging a thing and blocking another thing for a long time.
>>64133486
Shut the fuck up holy shit you have no idea what you are talking about.
>>64129680
>How did a lowly scrapper that can barely feed herself learn to speak multiple languages including one that is used by expensive droids?
Well, considering all the different species and such at the jakku station, it's no big surprise. Didn't Luke also know a ton of different languages while still being just a farm boy?
>Where did she learn how to use a lightsaber on the same level as a Sith apprentice? Did she take fencing classes?
two explanations: Kylo has been shot and wounded, he just murdered his father aka he is physically and mentally out of balance. Rey also knows how to fight with a staff, so it's no suprise she can fight with what is basically a shorter stick. Finn managed to put up a fight with Kylo Ren too, and he didn't have the advantages of the force.
The other possible explanation is that Rey has been trained a bit, but has has her memory wiped by Luke. Not sure about this, but still, it would explain a bit about how she's able to do much so quickly.
>How is she able to resist Kylo Ren's mind crush with no knowledge on how to use the Force?
Because she's strong in the force. No technique required. Some characters resist jedi mind tricks with no training too, no biggie.
>Why did they make it a point that she didn't need Finn to hold her hand?
Because it's fun + empowering for little girls. Remember, this is mostly a movie for kids.
>How does she know more about the Millennium Falcon than Han Solo does?
She doesn't, but it's been in the possession of the guy she's been working for the last 10-15 years, so she knows its current state better than Han.
>Why do they send Rey and Chewbacca to get Luke Skywalker? Do they really think a total stranger to him would do the job better?
Because she fought the big bad space wizard and won, and is basically the closest thing they have to a jedi, and because it's a fucking adventure movie. shit doesn't always make sense. It's a fucking fantasy movie with lasers.
>>64133419
She won because Kylo Ren was physically and emotionally beaten down.
>>64133094
>Luke's final fight with Vader
>final
There's your problem.
>>64133364
She probably worked on the falcon (they should have explained this ).
Her piloting skills make no sense though. Luke was an aspiring pilot who trained constantly, she was a scavenger trying to survive. At most she should know how to fix anything, not control it.
I'm betting JJ was planning on having Poe show up much earlier and solve all the piloting problems.
>>64129063
She wasn't as powerful. It's after she escapes that she starts to discover her control of the force, and the more time passes, the more powerful she becomes. Kylo says so himself.. She's somehow connected to it more strongly than him.
Good lord it's like you didn't even pay attention to the movie.
>>64129882
More like loo in her poo.
Maybe Rey is just Luke's daughter and had some really light force training but the fact she's from the Skywalker bloodline, one that's been described as being really close to the force had something to do with her sudden, novice power burst?
>>64133612
>The other possible explanation is that Rey has been trained a bit, but has has her memory wiped by Luke. Not sure about this, but still, it would explain a bit about how she's able to do much so quickly.
this is actually the shittiest explanation they could go with
it'd be like if frodo went toe to toe with a ringwraith immediately after leaving the shire, then that being explained in two towers as "oh, yeah, frodo was trained by master swordsmen. dont worry about it"
>>64133717
>maybe rey is just luke's daughter
There is no maybe, it's so obvious that it feels like they're going twist it and shes actually Hans daughter.
>>64133644
>the more time passes
Between freeing herself and fighting Ren? Like, practically none?
>>64133787
Then I'm not getting people being incredulous to what happened. Wasn't Luke the most powerful Jedi ever by the end of ROTJ? Wouldn't being his family and not being a mess of light/dark-sided mean something? Did weebs even spaz out over obvious shit like this when Gohan took out Raditz or something?
>>64133756
Luke wasn't trained that much. It's completely possible that she just knows how to use it.
But the first explanation is better.
>>64133787
My question about this is, why didn't Leia or Han Solo even suspect of her or mention her? They spend the entire film talking about how they have a son so the twist isn't very strong, why wouldn't they mention they also have a daughter that they lost/left alone?
>>64133808
those are not my words, they're Ren's. She becomes dangerous after exploring her powers.
Did they ever lock down the shuttle bay like kylo ordered?
He tells them that shes going to try and leave off of a shuttle. the next shot is her trying to go to an un guarded shuttle with an open door. Was it a trap or something?
>>64133899
>why wouldn't they mention they also have a daughter that they lost/left alone?
Because they knew who she was.
>>64133882
Woah all her positive points all imply like she received training by the strongest Jedi in history or since she was a tiny child or something. But hey, totally valid comparison, and the same situations happened to them clearly :^)
>>64133944
I doubt it, this movie has too much foreshadowing to leave that out. It would be an asspull if they do, considering all that happened.
>>64133867
Luke was also the son of the chosen one, or if we ignore the prequels, the son of vader. He still didn't have immediate force powers and if anything the jedi blood should be thinner for her.
I saw the movie today and I thought it was good!
She was a bit OP in being able to miraculously fly the Millenium Falcoln but they did at least show her fighting with her staff earlier in the film so her being able to lightsaber fight didn't come out of completely nowhere.
>>64133787
Plus, Han sure wants her to be with him, even making her part of his crew. Like, he wants to over his best friend's daughter. Plus, Maz asks Solo "who's this girl?" then the scene cuts out to an other one. He knows who she is.
>>64134014
She obviously did know how to fly other ships.
>>64127879
we we know she was inspired by the dark side
how does that make it ok, she's still a mary sue
>>64134006
Right and he never received training as a kid. Didn't he in Episode 4 use the force to deflect a laser blast without being seen? Reminder that this is like literally his first training with the force. Wasn't Yoda adamant on not training him since he was way too old to do the training, implying that this was severerly limiting, and that he was really therefore far behind where he should be at due to this? You're comparing Apples and Oranges here dude.
>>64134134
Without it being seen?*
>>64133612
>Rey also knows how to fight with a staff, so it's no suprise she can fight with what is basically a shorter stick
Get out you don't know shit about lightsaber and the lore behind it.
>The other possible explanation is that Rey has been trained a bit, but has has her memory wiped by Luke.
That was done to fucking Revan and it took him a long time and he had to go trought the academy again to just become a normal Jedi again.
The only explenation is that TFA writing is shit
>>64134028
Don't forget after Kylo throws his first lightsaber fit, the messenger tells him they were accompanied by a girl and kylo force chokes him an asks "what girl. " I think Kylo knows who she is also.
>>64134134
>Didn't he in Episode 4 use the force to deflect a laser blast without being seen
Are you talking about when Obi wan trained him to do this and failed it the first try? I forgot did kylo train her to do all of these things? Leia has zero training and shes not able to use the force outside of people talking to her through it.
> Wasn't Yoda adamant on not training him since he was way too old to do the training
Yoda likely doesn't train adults because they want results and are impure.
>>64127879
In the books it is explicitly said that Rey attacks viciously and is lured by the Dark side and Kylo comments twice that she's trying to kill him.
>>64134198
>>64134198
> Get out you don't know shit about lightsaber and the lore behind it.
There is no lore anymore, get your facts checked, retard. We don't care bout your fanfiction.
>>64132080
the image he started the thread with supports this theory too
>>64129875
>he didn't read the novel
Holy shit kill yourself.
>>64134433
Yes there is otherwise there is no fucking point in calling these movies Star Wars if you think a lighsaber is just a "shorter sitck" you're retarded.
>>64134541
>and he had to go trought the academy again to just become a normal Jedi again
>implying it wasn't just blatant pandering to make people buy the games.
>>64127879
That's what I think too. No one ever even told her what the dark side was or that it was bad, so I really do believe she was getting all that power from dark side emotions.
>>64134358
Lmao "likely", how convenient for you dude. It sounded like to me that he's "too old to begin the training" was that he was too far behind where he should be, otherwise why not take adults consistently? I'm sure susception to the dark side has an element to it, but isn't that an issue seemingly with all the Skywalkers? Ren as a character period throughout the film and Rey using her anger during their fight all seem to drive these points home further and make susception to the dark side for Skywalkers seem like a moot issue.
Leia had no training but Rey clearly has. Rey being a Skywalker and having private training as a child from one of the most powerful Jedi of all-time doesn't make her power boost seem nonsensical. A bit too much? Sure, but the logic for what occurred is there.
> There was a vast rumbling, as of a continent sighing, and a gigantic chunk of forest behind Rey simply collapsed downward, leaving her fighting on the edge of a cliff so high that the newly formed surface below could not be seen through the rising cloud of dust.
> Ren held his lightsaber, poised to strike. “I could kill you right now. But there is another way.” Breathing hard, Rey looked up in disgust at the man looming above her. “You’re a monster.” “No. You need a teacher.” He was beseeching and insistent all at once. “I can show you the ways of the
Force!”
> Slowly she shook her head. “The Force?” That was what this was about? Instead of moving to defend herself, Rey closed her eyes. Ren hesitated, confused by her actions. A long moment passed, in which Ren sensed a change in the air, a change in her. Then she opened her eyes and attacked, viciously, in a way she didn’t know she was capable of, striking again and again as Ren was slowly driven back. The flaring energy from the interacting lightsabers was more pronounced than ever in the flurry of her attack. And—Ren went down.
>>64127879
>argues that she is not a mary sue
>can literally dial on the dark side with no consequences and beat the dark side-versed darth klebold
uuuuuuu
> He was up again in an instant, but not in time to fully deflect a following blow from Rey’s weapon. He succeeded in blocking it, but he still took the full force of the strike against the haft of his own lightsaber. The weapon went flying into the snow. Unarmed, he raised a hand and utilized the Force to fend off one slashing blow after another, until finally her fury penetrated his remaining defenses. Taking a glancing blow to the head and chest, he went down, a prominent burn slashed across his face.
> Weakened, he reached out toward his lightsaber, trying to draw it to him. One downward cut, she saw. One quick, final strike, and she could kill him. The landing lights of a shuttle appeared in the distance, coming over the trees in her direction. She had to make a decision, now.
> Kill him, a voice inside her head said. It was amorphous, unidentifiable, raw. Pure vengeful emotion. So easy, she told herself. So quick. She recoiled from it. From the dark side. The world shook beneath her as the ground began to split. Turning away from the injured figure, she ran back to where Finn lay badly wounded.
So, yeah.
>>64134761
This is terrible.
Has there ever been a single good novelization?
Rey isn't a mary sue. As the protagonist she should be a cypher for the audience. The issue isn't one of "jew jew abrams" being a SJW, or feminism the movie its that the plot of this movie was lame.
If rey has some nebulous past that affects her character the audience should know what that is. It shouldn'tbe lorded over us like a treat. It's lazy and presumptuous. Even if it pays off later her sudden rise in power level complicates things later in down the line. Kylo ren has already been defeated and Rey has gone max level so the only place to go is super saiyan 2.
>>64134699
>but rey clearly has
Remember when Han was talking to them and telling them about the jedi, about the myths and legends? Why would she be surprised if she was trained herself? Why wouldn't she take the lightsabre if shes trained with it? shes happy to take the blaster from han.
"hurr I was trained all along I just forgot"
Yoda obviously didn't train luke because of the darkness he saw in him. The adult thing was an excuse.
>>64134937
>dude memory wipe lmao
>>64134937
>put hurr in front of the explanation
Great argument, totally proved me wrong dude lmao
>>64134893
Yeah man, tv/movie series never later reveal elements of the plot that is not apparent to the audience, nor hinted at! This is totally new and never been done tons of times, how pompous! Tell me everything right now Mr. Abrams! Lucas should have had a scene where the Emperor told Vader that Luke was explicitly his son in Episode 4 instead.
>>64127879
She's very easily the most boring of the three main characters. Finn/Poe arguably had more chemistry together as weird as that sounds. Rey/Finn just felt very fake to me.
>>64133989
One or two points imply that, and how long did that training last? a year maybe before Ben snapped and went edgelord?
>>64134528
>Needing a novel to explain what should be in the movie
Kill yourself pleb.
>>64133638
>I'm betting JJ was planning on having Poe show up much earlier and solve all the piloting problems.
same thoughts here brother.
Dameron just "disappearing" just to show up later again doesn't seem very likely from a JJ abrams point of view. It's just such a lazy way to get him out of the screen long enough so we can have finn and rey adventures.
I mean she's flying that thing through that star destroyer like a pro (great sequence) which is a bit fat fetched if you set her skills to that of a mechanic / scavenger that lived her whole life on that desert planet doing nothing else.
Dameron flying the falcon through there would've made sense but then again what do you do with the 3rd person that is not piloting nor shooting the cannon.
Guess that's where they just let Poe disappear and make Rey fly the thing like a pro because of force.
>>64135719
>calls other people a pleb
>only watches the movies and none of the side material
>>64135621
>Finn
kind of a disappointment , from the trailers I was thinking maybe the story would have some of it from a storm troopers point of view,
I see the problem with people thinking Rey is a MS
Her main flaws are that she's unsocialized, immature and bossy, but the sperglords don't see this or understand this as a flaw.
You were supposed to sympathize with her "oh she makes fucked up eye contact and talks over everyone too" but they didn't realize spergers don't have empathy.
>>64127879
Rey really does feel like an unnecessary character when you think about it. I mean, if Finn and Poe had just stayed together after the crash, then they could have found BB at the junkyard together and then run from the TIE fighters together and then escaped in the Millennium Falcon together. Poe's piloting skills would be a better fit for the escape scene too.
I'm just saying, the main character of the movie shouldn't be so easily to remove from the movie's plot and have it still make sense, or even more sense really.
>>64135944
Here's the problem with her negative traits: they're never addressed or criticized. When she makes a mistake it usually ends up working out in the end.
>girl spends her entire life taking ships apart for salvage
>"hurr how does she know so much about ships"
>>64136041
ok explain the ace combat level of piloting then
>>64136041
>spends her whole life scavenging junkyards
>knows more about Han Solos pride and joy than he does
>>64135621
Finn was annoying, Poe would have got annoying too if he was in it more. They were fine characters and nothing was wrong with their performances, but I'm glad we didn't have them as the only main characters.
>>64136041
This man has spent his entire life working on F-15 Eagle jet fighters. Does that make him the world's greatest fighter pilot?
>>64136168
Finn and Poe were the only likable new characters
>>64135702
Everyone keeps assuming that Kylo is the one who turned on Luke, but after re-watching it they seriously never ever say that it was Kylo.
>>64136126
Yeah, Skywalker! They have an X-wing flight simulator in that shithole bar on Tatooine or what? Fuck you mean?
What? "I used the"--the, what? The Force? What the fuck is that?
>>64136224
They never say it, but contextually it is obvious. Han Solo wasn't particularly eager to mention that his son was a mass murdering rogue Jedi.
>>64135970
Finn just doesn't fit in with the lines he was sometimes given
>maybe you got a cute boyfriend?
or that phasma tantrum he throws.
just didn't get why he had to be that way and make up for the lack of droids for comic relief in some sequences
what the fuck is going on?
Her being a mary sue didn't bother me honestly. like whatever, it's a movie, you need to have the protagonist doing shit to move the plot forward.
My problem was that I wasn't even sure what her motivation was. She gets swept up in this whirlwind of characters who barely know what they're doing and for the first half of the movie she wants to just get it over with and go home. Then they have the obligatory "you can never go home again" scene and she's like welp, time to get captured and let the plot think for me from now on
I mean was there actually any line where she said she wanted to join the resistance or learn the ways of the force or something? seemed like it all just kind of happened because the movie needed it to.
>>64127879
Is that incase?
>>64136224
Oh btw Leia states that she wanted "luke to train him" .
implying luke didn't train Kylo but someone else did.
So the possibility of Rey being in some sort connected to a former trianing is there.
If they paid attention to their script in that way.
>>64136267
I think he means for you to explain how she's such a great pilot, like an extremely fucking good pilot.
>>64136299
I think that line was orginally meant for finn asking Poe "Why do you need to go back to Jakku, do you have a cute GIRLFRIEND?" And then the line was awkwardly repurposed during a latter rewrite. I just can't shake the feeling that Poe was supposed have a much greater presence at some point. The biggest piece of evidence is that he is specifically mentioned in the scrolling text at the beginning of the movie. Why would the text give such focus to a minor character UNLESS he originally had a much bigger part to play?
>>64127879
Kylo was also shot dead on by a fucking bow caster, the most powerful rifle in the Star Wars saga. Not only is he not blown the fuck out, he actually stands his ground.
When he's beating his side before the fight he's losing a LOT of blood. A lesser man would have been killed by that blast.
ITT: Retards think Kylo Ren is a boss-ass sith because Luke loved him too much to not snap his punk neck when he went rogue
Ben a shit and so are all of you.
>>64136348
I don't think it implies that at all. It only implies those are her wish, not that they were or were not fulfilled
>>64135834
>Needing the side material to fill in plot holes
That's a sign of bad writing
>R-real fans buy every piece of merch Disney shits out!
Hope Disney is paying you well.
>>64128672
Goku is in no way a Mary Sue
>He gets his ass kicked all the time
>He makes terrible mistakes when he enters his "Saiyan battle hungry mode"
>He's a fucking retard
>Never gets to raise Gohan for more than a few months or years at a time
>bangs chi chi and leaves her to raise goten
>He literally hit his head as a kid and suffered major brain trauma
