Does anyone have that comparison image between Luke and Rey that shows why Rey is so much more of a Mary Sue than Luke is a Gary Stu?
I need it.
>>64037354
Who the fuck cares.
You're certainly on your way into adulthood.
Stop being a fucking faggot.
Do some push ups and find a decent job instead you waste of space.
>>64037424
thx 4 the bump
>>64037452
>what is sage
Am I gonna have to post rey pit to get what I want?
You're welcome anon
>>64038645
Thank you man, I tried hard to find it through the archive but had no luck
May sweet Rey pussy come to you
>>64038657
No problem bro
I agree, that bitch is hot as fuck
>>64038645
But half of these are literally made up.
>>64038759
Check out this gay nerd
>>64038759
I'm more bothered by all the spelling mistakes
>>64037354
>lower defense position
>>64038819
>accusing finger
>>64038774
>She fought two unarmed dudes who didn't even put a fight, they just wanted to steal the droid.
>Literally spend her whole life disassembling old starships. Of course she knows a lot about them.
>She barely flies it, Finn is a trained soldier that saves their lives with the turret, after the turret breaks they're fucked for a moment.
>She's trained with melee fighting and Kylo has a FUCKING HOLE IN HIS LUNG (that's the novel, yes, he will need to wear a mask in the next one).
>She read Kylos mind, his trick backfired, thats where she learned it.
>She didn't even met up with the resistance until the very end. Also Leia must've recognized her, which implies there's something more interesting coming up when it comes to Rey's ancestry.
>>64038645
What a horribly fucking biased comparison.
If you truly believed that Rey was more of a Mary Sue than Luke, then you would be able to say it objectively.
Luke literally has his name because Luke S = Lucas. He is an author insert there so George could write a story about a boring guy with a boring life who gets plucked from mediocrity and saves the galaxy. He is the quintessential Marty Stu. He gets floored by the Tusken Raiders, gets his shit packed in on the Death Star, and then learns to tap into the force and blows up that Death Star in his X-Wing, saving the galaxy.
Rey is a badly-written character who smacks the Falcon into the sand over and over again before getting the hang of flying it, gets her ass kicked by Kylo Ren in the forest and kidnapped, and works out while being probed by Ren that she can use the Force. She then goes into instantly-overpowered-mode (which is, again, bad writing, not a Mary Sue) and stupidly beats Ren in a duel.
A Mary Sue isn't just someone who is an author insert, but it also isn't just someone who is glorified wish-fulfilment. It has to be both. It's about the character being a vessel for the writer's fantasies. The chick from Twilight is a Mary Sue. Luke Skywalker is a Marty Stu.
The only way one could argue that Rey is a Mary Sue is to simply state that because she is a carbon copy of Luke Skywalker (and she fucking was), and he was a Marty Stu, then by extension she must also be a Mary Sue - and I'm fine with that logic. But as far as her being an author insert and wish-fulfilment for Abrams - fuck that. Just because bloody Landis said it (and that's where all this nonsense let's-throw-a-new-keyword-around bullshit started) doesn't make it so.
>>64038840
>his deadly lightsaber skills
>goes down like a bitch to someone who picked up a saber 5 minutes ago
>>64038900
>Literally spend her whole life disassembling old starships. Of course she knows a lot about them.
i wouldn't trust the local gypsie to fix my car even through he sells scraps from them
>>64038900
Literally retarded.
>>64038933
I thought the name for guys is "Gary Stu".
Either way, of course we can agree that if there's a self insert then it's gotta be Luke. However, the thing people are complaining about right now is that Rey can do too much too well.
I'd say her living on Jakku and being a scavenger who rips apart all sorts of old ships, droids and shit while traveling with a staff leaves me at ease with her being good at
>fighting
>understanding droids
>knowing about the interior of a bunch of ships
But why does she speak Shyriiwook? Why does everyone instantly trust her? Why does she know about mind manipulation tricks the way Obi-Wan used them back in Mos Eisley in the OT? Kylo's attack on her was different, he was just trying to connect himself to her mind and find out about the map/Luke's location.
I don't find it believable that she comes out of this "torture" scene with the new knowledge of how to use the force to mind control people.
And while I'm okay with her being a fit person and good fighter, why would she be so good with the lightsaber? Not only is it a completely different weapon, the blade itself also has no weight, making it even more unlike her staff.
>>64039048
She wasn't instantly good with it. She spent the first half of her fight running away and then she Force'd into beating him. Why? I dunno. Maybe it'll make sense later
>the blade itself also has no weight
Not in this post-OT world.
>>64039207
What, suddenly lasers weigh a lot?
>>64039048
Marty Stu and Gary Stu are both acceptable. I like Marty Stu because it was around first, in reference to Wesley Crusher on TNG (Roddenberry's). Gary Stu came about because people decided they preferred the visual rhyme (Mary - Gary) instead of the Martin/Mary counterparts. To each their own, Gary Stu doesn't bother me.
Rey is a badly-written character. She is too good at a lot of things, obviously, but that's not because Abrams or Kasdan was all "Man, I wish I was a girl who was good at a lot of stuff. I'll channel those desires into this Rey character." It's because Rey is based off Luke, really fucking heavily. And of course Poe is Leia, and Finn is Han. It's just lazy crap, they're not channelling any deep fantasies or anything like that.
>>64039226
How is Finn Han?
I don't see that many similarities
Star Wars casual here.
Although I think her instant abilities are worthy of discussion, I don't think it would be such an issue had Rey as a character been the slightest bit interesting.
Whether it was Daisy Ridley's acting or the script, probably both, I found there to be nothing to root for. She was dull, zero personality, couldn't care less what happened to her.
I saw the film on Tuesday and it's already started to fade from memory.
>>64039265
The sense of humour for one, but also the fact that he's a lying scoundrel. There's an especially obvious allusion at Maz's planet where he says the fighting isn't his problem and leaves everyone but then returns to save Rey - exactly how Han refused to help the rebels but then returns to save Luke.
>>64039273
Unfortunately if you check normie places they all adore and love Rey and highly praise everyone's performance in the movie
>>64039226
I'd say Poe and Rey are both based on Skywalker, with Finn being more of the hot-head kind of guy (Han Solo).
>>64039216
We're not getting into this conversation. Also it's plasma
>>64038645
Kylo wanted to turn Rey to the dark side, he was holding back in the fight
>>64039331
Poe is just Wedge 2.0
>>64039331
Nah, the trio is based on the trio individusally. Poe is obviously Leia, and nothing makes it more obvious than the first scene. The high-ranking Resistance member tasked with retrieving vital information, who gets captured by Stormtroopers and the masked guy in the black suit, but manages to stow that vital information in a droid before being taken, then gets tortured and escapes with the help of Finn... It's Leia. They just made her the lead pilot instead of a princess.
Also bear in mind that when I say each of the new trio is based upon someone in the original trio, I don't just mean personality but also plot lines and thematic beats.
>>64039390
Oh, you actually persuaded me with the capture. I was thinking more about his later role in the movie (memes aside, we're talking Black-Leader), which actually is a copy-paste from Luke. What about Poe being basically based on the Skywalker siblings?
I wish we had gotten an alien main character in the new trilogy.
Imagine if Rey, Finn or Poe had been an alien. Maybe an Ithorian, a Twi'lek or Togruta, a Mon Calamari, a Bothan, a Rodian or Trandoshan etc.
I would have liked that. Always with them fucking humans.
The upcoming 2016 Rogue movie is also 100% humans
mai waifu
>>64039437
Trandoshans are the best.
>>64039427
I honestly don't know anything about the EU so I can't comment on any of that - I know that Starkiller is an homage to Luke's original name, which is also what inspired the name of the dude in the Force Unleashed games, but that's all I really understood in terms of references to the EU.
Poe's skills as a pilot at the end were obviously just to give him something to do while Rey and Finn fought Ren. They needed an epic backdrop to the intimate lightsaber duel, so he got that one aspect of Luke lightly chucked on him. I would say that while there is a little spillover between all three, their individual OT counterparts are fairly obvious.
>>64039514
Fair enough. I agree with you.
>>64039048
The force is obviously guiding her and she has had previous training with certain things.
Notice how she had no idea how she actually pulled off some of the stuff and actually said so.
>>64037354
>Luke's sabre recovered from the depths of Bespin city
>implying it didn't fall to the gas-giant planet like Luke almost did from THE SAME FUCKING SHAFT
>Rey
Beats up four guys by herself
Skilled marksman
Skilled mechanic
Knows more about the Millennium Falcon than Han and Chewie, who piloted and repaired it for years
Can pilot the Millennium Falcon by herself competently enough to outmaneuver two TIE fighters, even though it requires two pilots
Gets kidnapped once, saves herself
Is better at using the Force than Kylo, who trained under Luke for years
Is instantly knowledgeable about probing minds, telekinesis, and using Jedi mindtricks
Instantly skilled at using a lightsaber
Has super saiyan jedi mode, which no other jedi has ever used in the movies
May have possibly learned all of this at the ripe young age of 4, depending on her backstory
Instantly liked by everyone
Instantly trusted by the Resistance to go on a mission to find Luke, even though they barely knew her
>Luke
Got rekt by the tusken raiders, needed Obi Wan to save him
Nearly got killed by the men in the cantina, needed Obi Wan to save him
Needed Leia and Han to cover his ass constantly during the rescue mission, which ended up being a blunder anyways
Screwed up deflecting blaster bolts while Obi Wan was training him, never actually does that until 2 movies later
Rarely uses his lightsaber at all
Initially annoyed Han and Leia with his naivete and innocence
Needed R2 to save him from being crushed by the trash compactor
Needs Obi Wan to protect him from Vader
Needs Han to save him during the trench run from Vader
Pilots competently, doesn't do anything the other rebel pilots can't do (except aim the torpedo)
Uses the force once
>she's at a cliff
>kylo almost knocking her over
>she goes intro trance
>kylo somehow just waits for her to stop her 1 minute long dream while all he does is press against her lightsaber
he could have just chopped off her legs or some shit right there when she napped
>>64038900
she doesn't dissemble starships, sh scavenges them
she takes the shiny parts and sell them
and she doesn't even do a good job of it given how little she is paid for them
and suddenly she is fucking aeronautical engineer with a masters in computer engineering as well?
>>64038645
See this picture right here? This is the type of faggoty fuck that has to be told what the ending of Inception meant.
Beats up four guys by herself? She's got a weapon. And it was two guys. She bashes them with her staff.
Knows more about the Falcon? No, she knows more about what sort of modifications have been done to the Falcon while Han was looking for it.
Force-users are well-known for being superior pilots. We know that Ray has had experience piloting before, but she was too scared to leave Jakku in case her family ever showed up so she never just bounced out of there in some junker. I do agree that she should have given a line saying that she's flown the Falcon itself before, at least.
Skilled with a lightsaber - she's wielding it like her staff. That's why she has such awkward thrusts. She has been with that staff since she was a child, and Ren was severely injured. Her defeat of Ren was entirely plausible and you're just looking for reasons not to like Ray.
I agree with the Jedi power stuff. I can understand how she probed back after resisting, maybe a force push or grab, but there is no way she should have known about the mind tricks.
They knew she was a Jedi you dunderfuck. Han vouched for her before they took off to go save her.
There are characters in the Star Wars universe that speak over four hundred languages. She lived in a trading outpost on a junker planet. It's not that odd for her to know a few dozen in this setting.
Ah, no. The only person who likes her right off the bat is Fin. Han doesn't want her on the ship at first and is skeptical. Moz only cares that she could be a Jedi. Ren wants to take her to corrupt her with the Dark Side. You are seriously grasping at straws.
Not to mention - she gets her ass beat by Ren, who then just straight force-power knocks her ass to sleep. She gets yelled at by Han up until Han needs her to replace Chewie, who is injured. She needs to get rescued by the others twice during the movie.
>>64039637
When Darth Emo realized she had midichlorians he wanted to train her and bring her over to the sith, not kill her.
It was only when she wouldn't relent did he decide to fuck her up.
![cloud_city__bespin_by_tk769-d5t696r[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/4r5DIXt.jpg "cloud_city__bespin_by_tk769-d5t696r[1].jpg")
>>64039618
Rewatch it. Luke falls into one of the openings in the side and even then the only reason he almost falls into the planet is because a door opens when he loses momentum.
Whos to say there isnt a workforce at the bottom of the spire and one of the workers found the lightsaber.
>>64039790
How convenient for Maz to end up having it
>>64039668
>she doesn't even do a good job
she's getting ripped off but has no choice. she's doing a great job but he's taking advantage of his position
>>64039828
>How convinient for an unexplained character in a film to end up having it
How?! How is it any better to have another random character having the lightsaber?
Also it might have slipped your notice but its a film. 99% of things that happen are pure luck
>>64039895
Because if any other person in the galaxy had it it wouldn't end up in Rey's possession?
It's very convenient.
>>64039874
>Real sets
Say what you want about the story but it was fucking surreal to see a modern Star Wars film with competent visuals.
>>64039675
here's your reply
Does anybody have the MGS 'Punished C3PO' image?
>>64038645
Reminds me of how much more involving A New Hope was
Force Awakens I just disengaged after Rey rescues black guy.... completely predictable that she was going to ace every situation
>>64039626
epic pasta :o)
>>64038645
Are there even other lightsaber users out there any more apart from Luke? I doubt Ren practiced fighting against other saber users, so him losing isn't that much of a surprise.
>people act surprised about Star Wars being retarded
>>64040163
They also go to great lengths to establish that he has been critically injured and is taking a large penalty to his skill points.
>>64040169
Star Wars is pretty much the peak of cinéma so people have some standards
>>64039911
I really wonder what the fuck you people want from a movie. No shit it's convenient. You're watching a series of events connected to one main plot. I guess it's also convenient that the Millenium Falcon just happened to be there, since they never would've met Han either if that didnt happen.
>>64040235
Some events are just too convenient.
For example, look at Finn meeting Rey. This is totally believable, all the things that lead to it don't seem like a huge "oh REALLY? how convenient" moment.
Maz having Luke's lightsaber in an unlocked chest in an open room anyone could have walked into for years, though.. that does.
>>64039675
>I agree with the Jedi power stuff. I can understand how she probed back after resisting, maybe a force push or grab, but there is no way she should have known about the mind tricks.
I don't think it's so much that she knew about the "jedi mind trick". I think it's just that her experience fighting back against Kylo Ren's mind probing made her realize that the Force can be used to reach into the minds of others, so she figured she would try to use it to reach into the mind of a nearby stormtrooper and make him let her go.
She even had to try at it a few times, almost like she wasn't even sure it would work and was just trying to replicate the feeling she had when she reached into Kylo Ren's mind before.
>>64040268
The room wasn't open. The door was closed and it opened when Rey came near.
Whether the door would have opened for anyone or the Force made it open for Rey is up for debate.
>>64040320
Uh no, it's a normal door in the SW universe. They open when you go near them.
>>64040336
>They open when you go near them.
Unless they're locked.
>>64040381
Exactly. The door wasn't locked.
Neither was the chest the lightsaber was in.
>>64038618
daaaaamn
>>64040336
>>64040381
>>64040397
Huh? Since when? I can't think of any that open with proximity. Star Trek, sure.
But every one I can think of in Star Wars has a little panel next to it.
>>64038645
Gee this isn't biased at all. It literally omits the parts where Kylo wrecks Rey.
>>64040464
Yeah I guess it omits the part where Buu wrecks Goku until Goku goes super ultra mega saiyajin
>>64040397
Are you sure it wasn't locked? Are you sure the Force didn't open it?
Maz did seem to already realize that the lightsaber was calling out to Rey and Maz says she's not a jedi, which suggests that she's probably not force sensitive.
Don't you think that this locked door being open could have been Maz's indication that it was the will of the Force for Rey to go into that room and find the lightsaber?
>she knows how to pilot because she used used to mess with parts of spacecrafts
This is about the dumbest thing I ever heard, there are mechanics that works for years for F1 and wouldn't pilot a F1 car any better than your average joe.
>>64038900
>She barely flies it
>literally maneuvers it through a star destroyer
>Manages to make it do a frontflip and not crash
Sure.
>Rey explains to Han and Chewie who have been on the MF for decades that you have to remove this limiter installed by some guy
Based Rey, is there anything she can't do?
>>64038933
>A Mary Sue isn't just someone who is an author insert, but it also isn't just someone who is glorified wish-fulfilment. It has to be both
No it doesn't, people have being using that term to describe either one or the other since forever.
>>64037424
Kek
>>64038933
>and that's where all this nonsense let's-throw-a-new-keyword-around bullshit started)
People were saying it on here before he did, I know because I was one of them
If Mary Sue doesn't apply because she's not a self-insert, then what term would apply to a character that is flawless and can do anything and brave any challenge without a problem?
>>64040533
To be fair, that happens rather late in their flight and both Finn and Rey are surprised it even worked out.
>>64039637
Vader did this shit to luke at least three times in the original trilogy.
>>64040672
Why didn't Finn just go to the top turret when the bottom one broke?
>>64040571
>>A Mary Sue isn't just someone who is an author insert, but it also isn't just someone who is glorified wish-fulfilment. It has to be both
>No it doesn't, people have being using that term to describe either one or the other since forever.
Sure, idiots.
>>64040645
>>and that's where all this nonsense let's-throw-a-new-keyword-around bullshit started)
>People were saying it on here before he did, I know because I was one of them
Yeah, that's fair. I don't mean to say that he was definitely the first person to say it, I just mean to say that a shitload of people, especially on this board, are jumping on his bandwagon. "Mary Sue" has been said on this board more times in the last week than in the rest of its existence combined.
>>64040695
Maybe he didn't even know there was an another turret?
>>64040704
>"Mary Sue" has been said on this board more times in the last week than in the rest of its existence combined.
Probably because no big budget movie featuring a mary sue has been released lately.
>>64040806
Why didn't Rey tell him?
She clearly knew the layout of the Falcon very well.
>>64040665
If it was a new franchise people would just write off the whole movie as a Sci-Fi action flick with some god-tier visuals and a legendary score.
Would easily get a 8/10, but no one would be praising the lead female nor would people be criticizing her so much. She would simply be an after thought, her personality is so bland I almost feel like she's supposed to be a surrogate for the audience. Anyone can imagine themselves as Rey placed into the center of the action.
It definitely feels more like a Star Wars movie than episode 1 or 2 ever did.
>>64040856
>and a legendary score
Did we see the same movie?
I mean maybe the OST is good if you listen to it exclusively, as in listen to the album directly. But it was incorporated very badly into the movie then.
EP 7 has the most forgettable music of all SW movies imo.
What are Rey's flaws?
>>64040907
She cares about other people too much
:^)
>>64040816
fucking lold
>>64039466
why are her teeth attractive to me
fuck you jj
>>64040856
>a legendary score
I liked TFA but this is too much, the score was bland as fuck, mediocre at best.
>>64040887
I'm proposing a hypothetical where the first six movies don't exist and you're listening to John Williams take on star wars for the first time.
And I agree that they didn't work music into this film as good as the previous six. Say what you will about Lucas, he at least understands the importance of music and sound mixing.
The flicking popping noise of the snow hitting the sabers really bothered me for some reason.
>>64040816
>>"Mary Sue" has been said on this board more times in the last week than in the rest of its existence combined.
>Probably because no big budget movie featuring a mary sue has been released lately.
No, it's because Landis said it, which is why for two whole days after release every fucking thread on this board was pictures of Landis and his tweet.
Also, bloody what? No Mary Sues at all lately? Are you kidding? In this age of capeshit being shoved down our throats to an incredible extent, fucking Avatar being a thing, and the number of James Bond and Batman movies coming out every couple of years, you're going to say there aren't any big budget movies featuring Mary Sues?
Or are you going to say that since they're technically Marty/Gary Stus, they don't count?
>>64039226
>Poe is Leia
>Finn is Han
So are those two eventually gonna have hot homointerracial sex?
>>64041110
Oh, I'm sure the next ones will deviate massively. I'm just talking Abrams' TFA - ANH parallels.
>>64041110
Well, it's 2017 after all. Get with the times.
>>64041110
I'm cool with this.
As long as Kylo and Rey have hetero sex in the missionary position for the soul purpose of procreation.
And then they figure out Rey is luke's daughter and the movie just becomes Cousin Fuckers in Space!
>>64039273
She's a "kick ass woman" in a sci-fi movie.
Women movie goers love what a stronk female character she is. Male movie goers jack off to Whedon style superpowered girl characters.
She has a personality to them: "badass."
>>64041104
>No, it's because Landis said it, which is why for two whole days after release every fucking thread on this board was pictures of Landis and his tweet.
People in had said it before Landis did, also several reports about how she was good at everything right in first day of screening in Europe.
>
Also, bloody what? No Mary Sues at all lately? Are you kidding? In this age of capeshit being shoved down our throats to an incredible extent, fucking Avatar being a thing, and the number of James Bond and Batman movies coming out every couple of years, you're going to say there aren't any big budget movies featuring Mary Sues?
At very least they fail more than Rey did.
>>64041188
I wish Kylo had raped Rey when she was bound to that chair where he tried to read her mind.
Why didn't he just rip open her shitty cloth outfit and FUCK her?
>>64038933
>>64039675
Arseblasted SJW sperg fedoratippers detected.
>>64041231
Yeah, bro. Me saying Rey is a horribly written, shitty character is totally SJW.
GENDER SWAPPED LUKE
BECAUSE MALE HEROES HAVE NO PLACE IN 2015 YOU SHITLORDS
GURLPOWER!
>>64039466
>3dpd
>waifu
>>>/reddit/
>>64040505
Rey mentions she's flown ships before. For fucks sake.
Why do the bad guys even bother with tie fighters anymore?
They are apparently inferior to any other ship
>>64040212
ahahahahaha
ahahaha
murican cinema you mean
and thats only because you people have no culture and latch on to NEET masturbation fantasies like SW
story wise SW is as mature as fucking Narnia
No one is talking about the Bigger Rey?
It's sort of the proof that Rey is Luke2.0, isn't it? No other character in the SW franchise, besides Luke (and now Rey), ever had a Bigger version of their Prime self.
>>64041372
I like masturbation fantasies and i disliked this movie.
>>64037354
>agile footwork
I just saw TFA yesterday, and ya'll motherfuckers told me that Rey was perfect at everything. She constantly fucks up throughout the movie!
-Good mechanic because she literally scavenges for a living on broken star ships
-She can barely use a blaster and misses constantly
-She can barely use a damn lightsaber. Seriously the first half of her fight with Kylo Ren was fucking embarrassing. Even Finn knew how to use a saber better than she did.
-She can barely pilot the Falcon. The only reason they escaped was because she knew the terrain and Finn's shooting
I'll agree that her knowing a Jedi mind trick was dumb, and just led to a Mey-mey joke (which reddit is eating up). How the fuck is she a Mary Sue though? She barely even survived anything.
>>64041391
http://biggerluke.wikidot.com/
>>64041220
>Several reports about how she was good at everything right in first day of screening in Europe.
Just to clarify, "she's good at stuff" is not the same as "she's a Mary Sue". I'm talking about him referring to Rey as one being the reason that it has become a buzzword, especially on this board.
>People in had said it before Landis did.
What other people had said it first? I'd love to see a citation somewhere. Here's the source for Landis.
W I L D F I R E
https://youtu.be/jcXJXNSy4fk?t=13m28s
>>64041447
That makes you patrician.
>>64041530
Also, again just to clarify, I'm not saying that I'm certain he's the first person to ever say it about her, I'm just blaming him for the flood of it. I said this earlier, up here >>64040704
>I don't mean to say that he was definitely the first person to say it, I just mean to say that a shitload of people, especially on this board, are jumping on his bandwagon.
>>64041531
Based Fischer.
Her and Ford (in interviews) made the whole SW7 thing actually fun for me. They don't give a fuck.
>>64038645
Milluniom Falcon
>>64041584
>tfw she tells Daisy she'll now also get to enjoy fans wanking it to her on a daily basis
>Daisy's face at that point>wasn't even a face of true disgust, she is kind of intrigued
>>64041488
R U RETARTED
AFTER GETTING IT OFF THE GROUND SHE WAS THREADING THE NEEDLE WITH THE FALCON, BEYOND PRO-TIER PILOTING
YOU GOTTA HAVE PERFECT SPATIAL AWARENESS OF YOUR VEHICLE TO DO THAT SHIT, KNOW EXACTLY WHERE ITS EDGES ARE, IT ONLY COMES FROM EXPERIENCE WITH THE SIZE AND SHAPE OF IT
BIGGEST MARY SUE SHIT WAS HER SKILL PILOTING THE FALCON AND NOT TEARING ITS WINGS OFF GOING THRU THAT TURBINE TUNNEL
>>64041488
>Rey was perfect at everything.
She is.
>-Good mechanic because she literally scavenges
That makes no sense.
>-She can barely use a blaster and misses constantly
No, she shot the very first trooper she saw on shot 3. Getting a kill shot on fire 3 isn't missing "constantly."
>-She can barely use a damn lightsaber.
She's used a lightsaber exactly once, against someone trained by Luke, and won without getting a scratch on her.
>-She can barely pilot the Falcon.
Were your eyes closed when she was doing rolls and flying through the wrecked destroyer?
>How the fuck is she a Mary Sue though? She barely even survived anything.
She's better than every single other character at everything and has no character flaws. She the chosen one, daughter of Luke, and has the most force power of anyone ever. Whether she's "barely" better than everyone ever doesn't matter. Anakin was arrogant, Luke was a dopey kid, Rey has no flaws whatsoever.
>>64038645
Ignoring how very wrong some of this is, I'm more bothered by these spelling errors than anything
I always thought it was the Force that opened the door for her
It's stupid to say that Rey is a Mary Sue when she's just a copy of Luke.
It's a very special kind of stupid, though, to try and argue that she's more of a Mary Sue THAN Luke.
>>64041683
She's not the actual daughter of Luke, she's a clone of a Jedi from before the PT. Luke found some genetic material in an old Jedi temple and made himself a daughter/heir (Luke is one of the few characters in SW who wouldn't view a clone as less human. He even see droids as being alive).
When Luke found out she was a fallen Jedi, he left Rey on a planet where he knew she wouldn't be able to learn the Force, or get recruted by Snoke.
That's why (in the novel) when she's fighting Kylo, she hears a dark voice in her head telling her to kill him. That's her older, original personality coming through.
>>64040907
Her biggest one was being too attached to Jakku and trying to get home which is why she got kidnapped in the first place, but she gets over that by the end of the movie, so we'll have to see if they come up with some different ones for VIII
>>64041871
>she's more of a Mary Sue THAN Luke
EXACTLY WHAT SHE IS
BECAUSE ITS 2015 AND GURLS CAN DO ANYTHEEEEENG!
unff
>>64041262
No SJW identifies as such. Just saying she's a shitty character is not enough.
>>64041871
You're an idiot. Luke wasn't a Gary Stu. At all. Anakin was in TPM (not so much in the other 2 movies/clone war cartoons). Not Luke.
In fact, Luke wasn't even The Chosen One. He was A chosen one, but hardly on the scale of Anakin and Rey.
>>64041928
>that lower face
bleh
>>64041955
See >>64038933
>Luke literally has his name because Luke S = Lucas. He is an author insert there so George could write a story about a boring guy with a boring life who gets plucked from mediocrity and saves the galaxy. He is the quintessential Marty Stu. He gets floored by the Tusken Raiders, gets his shit packed in on the Death Star, and then learns to tap into the force and blows up that Death Star in his X-Wing, saving the galaxy.
That's a Gary Sue, buddy boy.
>>64041890
>When Luke found out she was a fallen Jedi, he left Rey on a planet
I haven't read any of the books, but even the prequels weren't that stupid.
>genetically engineer a super jedi
>dump it off on a random planet because it might turn out as a dark side master
>leave forever and don't look back
>>64039790
you literally see his lightsaber fall down
>>64041955
wow. maybe actually wikipedia mary sue before posting here.
>>64038900
There is no way she could learn a complex tactic like the mind trick by reading Kylo's mind. Like, she might learn that it's a thing but she would never get it on the first try. The whole point of having Luke do it in Jedi was to show how much his skills had improved, so it's clearly an advanced ability. If she can just read people's minds and learn high level shit then why do they even need Luke? She could just read Luke's mind and apparently do everything on he first try. Instant Jedi master.
>>64042001
>reddit cuck doesn't understand the difference between necessary and sufficient conditions
cry more cucky
Luke is a well-written character. Rey is a dumb Mary Sue.
>>64042001
There's more than one definition of that word, buddy.
You're using the pleb definition of self-insert. We're using the original definition.
How do I cope with the fact that I will never be with Daisy?
>you will never visit her on set and have her run up to you and wrap her arms around you, breathing deeply into your neck and then pulling back, brushing her curls away from her forehead and flashing a huge smile at you before she leans in and kisses you, her right hand resting against your chest
>she will never ask you how your day was and tell you how happy she is to see you
>she will never look over her shoulder at you and smile before shooting her next scene
>you will never go back to your shared hotel room together
>you will never see her come out of the bathroom with a hair tie in her mouth and only wearing your baggy white band tee as she pulls her hair back into a ponytail
>she will never jump into bed with you and kiss you on the shoulder while you listen to her favourite record and the rain gently makes patterns on the window
>>64041955
Wait, now we're saying ANAKIN was a Gary Stu? What the fuck does Gary Stu mean to you? Someone overpowered? Is that your only parameter?
Jesus, man.
>>64042035
Maybe YOU should do that and read more than 2 lines.
>>64042043
She is the kwisatz haderach.
>>64039273
Eh she seemed almost like a tsundere chick to me, at least with the way she bantered with Finn. I thought her and Finn had a few good scenes together but on her own or with anybody else she was pretty uninteresting.
>>64042067
No, I actually stated quite clearly in that same post >>64038933 that
>A Mary Sue isn't just someone who is an author insert, but it also isn't just someone who is glorified wish-fulfilment. It has to be both. It's about the character being a vessel for the writer's fantasies. The chick from Twilight is a Mary Sue. Luke Skywalker is a Marty Stu.
It needs to be both. And, considering the original Mary Sue from A Trekkie's Tale was both, you saying that one of the two is the "original" definition is fucking retarded.
>>64040887
I think that the directing style didn't allow for williams to really do his thing. Scenes changed so rapidly that it would have been hard to really work complete motifs into many of them. It was just a generic modern action movie really. Felt like the call of duty of star wars movies.
>>64042054
Badly written =/= Mary Sue
>>64042072
I don't know m8. I really don't know.
>>64042074
No. Soeone who is better than the rest of the other characters in their respective field, who is liked by everyone, who does incredible things without any effort or mistake. Kid Anakin was basically Wesley Crusher 2.0.
>>64042138
AUTHOR'S INSERT IS IRRELEVANT
AUTHOR'S AGENDA INSERT WORKS JUST AS WELL
JJ ABRAMS MADE A GURLPOWER EMPOWERMENT MOVIE BECAUSE THAT WAS HIS GOAL
>>64040569
A limiter installed during the period they didn't have the ship.
Are you retarded?
>>64042138
It doesn't NEED to be both. Words and their definitions evolve over time.
>>64042196
Then she's the embodiment of a shitty social agenda - not a Mary Sue.
>>64042183
Does that make Qui Gong, The Traveller; and Obi Wan, Picard?
>>64041871
>It's stupid to say that Rey is a Mary Sue when she's just a copy of Luke.
She's a copy of Luke where they erased all the flaws and limitations.
She makes exactly one error in the entire movie (resets the wrong fuses) and it still turns out in her favor.
If a teen girl wrote this movie as a fan fiction, everyone bar none would agree she's a Mary Sue. The only thing keeping her from being the perfect example of a Mary Sue is the "author wish fulfillment" component of the term. But is it too much of a stretch to feel that Abrams and the writers putting in a Whedon-esque asskicking little girl is just as wish-fulfillment as some teengirl author self-insert would be?
>>64042183
Wesley Crusher was a Gary Stu because he was a young, intelligent guy who got to grow up exploring the galaxy. He was Gene Roddenberry's childhood fantasy. THAT's why he was a Gary Stu.
And what? Anakin in II wasn't the best Jedi in II, at all. He failed his rescue of Obi-Wan and then got his ass kicked by Dooku. How was he the best in his field? He also wasn't liked by everyone and made many mistakes. Even your own fucking parameters are incorrect.
>>64042210
They literally evolve because idiots get them wrong and it spreads.
>>64042162
>sperg continues to not understand logic
just go back to r/cuckold kiddo
>>64042287
I said KID Anakin. I even pointed out that it was only in TPM that he was a GS.
Idiots rule the world. All our words have the meaning they have NOW, because of idiots getting things wrong.
>>64039916
Be nice if they went to a new kind of location shoot instead of showing us desert planet, forest, and ice/snow environment.
>>64042072
>mouth, feet and pit pussy
truly the GOAT pic
>>64042278
You're the only intelligent person responding to me, so I can appreciate your opinions on the matter.
My answer is yes. It's too far of a stretch. That's like me telling you that Rey learning to use the force so quickly is a deus ex machina. Of course it's fucking not. But it can be at a stretch!
Dumb. These phrases apply to a very limited set of circumstances and Rey simply does not fall into them for many reasons - not the least of which being that she's just a carbon copy of Luke.
And yes, she doesn't have as much of a learning curve as Luke, because the whole movie is on less of an epic scale and is much faster-paced. But the steps are all there.
She is mildly talented at fighting thugs, while Luke is mildly talented at bulls-eyeing Womprats.
She fails with the Falcon dismally at first then immediately gets the hang of it, while Luke fails with the training droid at first then immediately gets the hang of it.
She gets into Kylo's head while Luke takes out Imperial Stormtroopers.
She defeats Kylo in a duel while Luke blows up the Death Star without his targeting computer.
As I said in my original post, I am fine with calling Rey a Mary Sue on the proviso that it's only because she's a copy of another Marty/Gary Stu, and it follows on logically from there. That's fine. But to say that she is while he is not is so fucking dumb it's not even funny.
>>64042339
I apologise. My mistake. I can probably get on board with calling him one in TPM because of Lucas writing and directing him in that pottery way that mirrors Luke as well as Rey.
>>64038933
Good to see the io9 tumblrites are out today
>>64042536
>Luke blows up the Death Star without his targeting computer.
One thing I'm a bit vague on - do we ever get a feeling for how long Luke is trained by Yoda? It's been a long time since I've seen the movies.
>>64042211
MARY SUE IS COLLOQUIALLY USED AS A TERM FOR A PLOT ARMORED BULLSHIT CHARACTER WHO IS PREDESTINED TO SUCCEED AT EVERYTHING BECAUSE THE WRITER HAS AN INTEREST IN THAT OUTCOME WHICH CAN BE FOR ANY NUMBER OF REASONS
JJ ABRAMS IS SO SJW HE PROBABLY THINKS HE WAS BORN INTO THE WRONG GENDER AND GENDER IS A SOCIAL CONSTRUCT ANYWAY SHITLORDS, SO HIS TFA DAISY SUE WOULD EVEN SATISFY THE SELF-INSERT COMPONENT OF THE TERM, OR ARE YOU SAYING JJ ABRAMS CAN'T BE A GIRL YOU BIGOT!
>>64038759
Which ones?
>>64041530
He really thinks some loser calling her a Mary Sue lead to others doing so. Don't be a fucking idiot anon. You're free to disagree on whether the use of Mary Sue is right in Rey's context but saying that Landis is the main reason why posters on this board are calling her so is just retarded.
>>64042608
Well, at the time he blew up the Death Star, he hadn't actually met Yoda at all.
He deflects blaster bolts from a training droid, destroys the Death Star, and manages, with difficulty, to pull a lightsaber towards himself using the force before he meets Yoda.
After this he manages to levitate objects with his mind and see visions of the future, and then leaves Yoda and Dagobah.
Then, a year later, he seems to have self-trained himself to become more proficient in most aspects of the Force.
>>64042745
K, bro.
>>64042372
book name?
>>64042773
Interesting! I still hope the next movie comes up with some coherent reason for some of her miraculous aptitude for everything, like her suffering some sort of Bourne-esque amnesia or something. It's aggravating seeing someone become so immediately perfect at everything with no real explanation.
>>64042536
>She is mildly talented at fighting thugs, while Luke is mildly talented at bulls-eyeing Womprats.
>She fails with the Falcon dismally at first then immediately gets the hang of it, while Luke fails with the training droid at first then immediately gets the hang of it.
>She gets into Kylo's head while Luke takes out Imperial Stormtroopers.
>She defeats Kylo in a duel while Luke blows up the Death Star without his targeting computer.
Seems to me that the magnitude and complexity of the things that Rey was doing are far above what you mentioned in comparison for luke.
>sensing and nudging the trajectory of a proton torpedo vs. dueling with lightsabers
Just to address the last point. I can't be bothered with the others but you can think for yourself.
>>64042627
This book bothers me.
How is it a fucking TFA background info book written for KIDS gives so much more good info on everything than the movie itself?
There is another page that explains where the helmet she has came from
>>64042632
An interesting point - how long until JJ comes out as a disabled black woman?
>>64042860
Yeah, like I said, her learning curve is nowhere near as high as Luke's, but that's because it's a 2015 Abrams movie instead of a 1977 Lucas movie. Less grandiose and epic, more fast and action-packed. Less fantasy serial and more drive-by shooting. I still feel the plot and character beats are there, even if the movies feel very different from each other.
I think it's fucking retarded that Rey beat Kylo, I just wouldn't use the term here, that's all.
>Luke
Got rekt by the tusken raiders, needed Obi Wan to save him
Nearly got killed by the men in the cantina, needed Obi Wan to save him
Needed Leia and Han to cover his ass constantly during the rescue mission, which ended up being a clusterfuck
Screwed up deflecting blaster bolts while Obi Wan was training him, never actually does that until 2 movies later
Rarely used his lightsaber at all
Needs C3PO to interpret droids for him
Initially annoyed Han and Leia with his naivete and innocence
Needed R2 to save him from being crushed by the trash compactor
Needed Obi Wan to protect him from Vader
Needed Wedge to protect him from a TIE fighter during the trench run
Needed Han to save him from Vader during the trench run
Piloted competently, didn't do anything the other rebel pilots couldn't do (except aim the torpedo)
Used the force once
>Rey
Beat up four guys by herself
Skilled marksman
Skilled mechanic
Knew more about the Millennium Falcon than Han and Chewie, who piloted and repaired it for years
Piloted the Millennium Falcon by herself competently enough to outmaneuver two TIE fighters, even though it required two pilots
Gets kidnapped once, ends up saving herself anyways
Better at using the Force than Kylo, who trained under Luke for years
Instantly knowledgeable about probing minds, telekinesis, and using Jedi mindtricks
Instantly skilled at using a lightsaber
Has super saiyan jedi mode, which no other jedi has ever used in the movies
May have possibly learned all of this at the ripe young age of 4, depending on her backstory
Instantly liked by everyone
Instantly trusted by the Resistance to go on a mission to find Luke, even though they barely knew her
Can speak Droid and Wookie fluently
>>64043043
You already posted that earlier in this thread
>>64043123
>Calling people out for posting truths
Her pistol kind of looks like a PPG from B5.
![7cb2a6d6da95186cddeb2701838eb769[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/c02Z0hz.jpg "7cb2a6d6da95186cddeb2701838eb769[1].jpg")
>>64042536
>she's just a carbon copy of Luke.
See, I 100% agree. They took Luke and said, let's do that again.
Except here's where they changed their minds. They decided "wouldn't it be cool if Luke was a girl?" And what if "she was a total badass," and of course "everyone likes her and she's good at everything."
>she's a copy of another Marty/Gary Stu, and it follows on logically from there
Luke was a Joseph Campbell hero to a T. But even in his "chosen one that saves the galaxy" role he still started out as a dopey farm boy.
He grew as a hero in the traditional way, he has some shallow personality changes, but overall he was just a generic "hidden prince" that saves everyone.
If they just left it at copying Luke, Rey wouldn't need to be completely flawless. She could have any number of flaws, even minor ones. She could be dumb (no schools on Jakku), cowardly (lives like a carrion-feeding scavenger), weak (tiny girl), ugly (just kidding, it's a movie), anything.
Instead, she's the perfect kickass female character that all modern writers and directors want in all their action movies. Luke wasn't perfect, but Rey is to an unbelievable degree. The only reason Snoke is still alive is because he wasn't on the Star Killer when Rey got there.
It's hard not to see Movie 7 as fan fiction and it's also hard not to see Rey's character as the modern template for director/writer wish fulfillment. I would call Luke a "generic fantasy hero" but I wouldn't call Rey one. Generic heroes feel hesitant, stumble, have to be convinced. Not Rey, she's perfect.
And she's perfect in a very specific way. The way that best fulfills Abrams agenda and beliefs.
>"I tend to gravitate towards stories of women, of young women in situations – as I did with Felicity and Alias. And we were talking about 'Who could this be?' and I saw this young woman."
―J.J. Abrams[src]
"Mary Sue" doesn't fit perfectly, but I'm not aware of a term that better describes this kind of writer overreach.
>yfw Rey trains Luke in the force by the end of episode VIII
>>64043274
We can close this thread, ladies and gentlemen. Finally a good analysis
>>64043274
>"Mary Sue" doesn't fit perfectly, but I'm not aware of a term that better describes this kind of writer overreach.
That's entirely fair. And I agree with nearly all of the rest of your post, too.
>>64043274
Nice summary - I'm a bit unsure of how it made it on to /tv/.
>tfw got to 36 minutes into the cam and cant watch anymore
I thought I couldn't be any more disappointed after the prequels but somehow seeing this heartless, derivative trash has done it.
>>64043511
>He watches cams
Why
>>64043043
Why are you making things up, lying doesn't make your argument more valid.
She beat only two guys, and that's stretching, considering they didn't even carry any weapon or tried to hurt her, they were there only to steal BB8.
She wouldn't save herself from the SB if it wasn't for Finn and Han.
Had a rough life on a desert planet and fought with staff all the time, it's logical she had some melee skills.
Leia obviously knew her or recognized her, she didn't even met her once before in this movie, but still went for a hug. Assume the characters know more than you do, not everything needs to be spelled out for spergs.
Luke's understanding of droid speech was even more bizzare. In the beginning of ANH he needed C3PO to understand R2, but literally later the same day, during the trench run, he was able sustain a fluent conversation with R2 without any problems.
>>64043598
The X-wing's computer translates, goddamn are you inattentive.
Luke was infinitely better than Rey, but he wasn't all that interesting himself. I don't know anyone who prefers him to Vader or Han Solo.
>>64043598
You literally see the x-wing computer translating, did you even watch the movies
>>64043598
>Leia obviously knew her or recognized her, she didn't even met her once before in this movie, but still went for a hug.
A lot of people seem to have read this scene that way, I wasn't one of them. I got the impression that Leia could simply tell that this young woman disembarking the Millenium Falcon, who she knew Finn and Han were going to save, had been through a lot and was shaken and devastated and just comforted her.
I can appreciate the interpretation that she recognised her but I just can't get onboard with it.
I agree with everything else you said, by the way, I'm just replying to this post because of the hug comment.
>>64043612
You definitely have a point. Rey understanding both wookie language and binary is pretty stupid then.
>>64042178
dat ass
>>64043784
A LOT OF WHAT REY WAS ABLE TO DO WAS PRETTY STUPID
BUT NOT IF ITS 2015 AND U'VE GOT GURLPOWER!
>>64042043
This. She'd instantly become Luke-grade after reading Luke's mind and then spend a year become even more powerful than Sheev
>>64043598
>considering they didn't even carry any weapon or tried to hurt her,
You're making that up. They clearly grabbed her and you have no idea what weapons they had.
>and fought with staff all the time,
She could have had that staff for ten seconds before the movies started. You're making it up that she's had it for a while that that she's good with it at all beyond her trained skills that are never explained.
>it's logical she had some melee skills.
In a universe replete with blasters and giant aliens, a tiny girl developing melee skills is illogical. Why doesn't she just learn greco-roman wrestling to use on her fellow scavengers while she's at it.
>Leia obviously knew her or recognized her
Not so obvious, because it looked like she was just comforting another emotional woman in an awkward scene. If Leia could detect she was a powerful latent jedi or she was related to her in some way, she'd logically react in a way other than just to give her a hug.
>>64041909
Maybe she'll grow a drinking problem. That would be a new one for Star Wars
>>64043898
>You're making it up that she's had it for a while that that she's good with it at all beyond her trained skills that are never explained.
...dude. Really?
Do you really need that throwaway expositional line between Rey and Finn where he's all "where'd you learn to fight like that?" and she's all "I learnt the hard way. Growing up on this planet, I had to teach myself to fight."
Really? You required that?
Her experience with the staff is implied by her skill with said staff. Show, don't tell. It's a basic rule of screenwriting.
>>64042032
thats not his lightsaber
>>64043806
Imagine getting into that gym bag and just stuffing your face into those sweaty smelly panties wrapped in those leggings she hastily rolled off and tossed away.
>>64043954
You can say "really?" all you want but the point remains.
You're accusing people of making shit up, then as proof, you offer things you don't know are true as facts.
You can't say you're against "making things up" and "lying" only to IMMEDIATELY start making assumptions, assertions, and flat out lying.
That was the point.
>>64042773
Glad you're taking advice and learning "bro"
![Star Wars Episode V - The Empire Strikes Back.avi_snapshot_01.51.42_[2015.12.25_00.15.26].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/DOK7YBQ.jpg "Star Wars Episode V - The Empire Strikes Back.avi_snapshot_01.51.42_[2015.12.25_00.15.26].jpg")
>>64044025
looks like you're right
my mistake
>>64042627
Why did they not include a 30 second clip of her doing this shit in the movie?
>>64043898
>You're making that up. They clearly grabbed her and you have no idea what weapons they had.
One dude hold her and the second dude tried to take the droid. Thats it. Even if they werent unarmed they werent going for a fight, after she fought back they simply fled.
>>64037354
>flash suppressor
>shoots lasers
>>64044365
>Even if they werent unarmed they werent going for a fight
An assumption.
Probably a correct one, but you can't harass other people for making assumptions, then immediately start making some of your own.
>>64037354
Anyone got the pic on the left page without all the text? She looks qt as fuck.
>>64044442
Point taken, you're right.
>>64041530
Here you go
http://archive.4plebs.org/tv/search/text/"Mary%20sue"%20rey/start/2015-12-10/order/asc/
>>64040846
she wanted to show off i guess, kinda like how anakin would do unnecessary bold maneuvers just because he could
>>64037354
The movie was fucking retarded mainstream SJW faggot shit by a Jew. Worse than the prequels in every way with nostalgia pandering.
What else do you need to know?
>>64038645
None of that makes her a Mary Sue
Can you guys actually look up the terms you use before using them?
>>64039437
well jj gave us a negro
>>64044970
Mary Sue (plural Mary Sues) (fandom slang) A fictional character, usually female, whose implausible talents and likeableness weaken the story.
ITT: /tv/fags getting sperged about someone being the best.
While -with everything- there literally HAS to be somebody that is the best, and such a person is just likely to have to have a more interesting story.
is Rey a virgin, haha
>>64037354
How about a comparison chart between Rey and Steven Seagal in any Steven Seagal film besides Executive Decision?
>>64045858
No I'm pretty sure some CGI monstrosity popped her cherry a long time ago.
>>64037424
>I'm from tumblr and I'm so triggered right now.
perfection
>>64047098
fake tan?
>>64037424
>Mary Sue Internet Defense Force
>>64043598
>it's logical she had some melee skills.
No, it really isn't. Who the fuck taught her to fight with a staff? Just because a character grows up in a rough, rustic environment doesn't mean they know shit about martial arts, this is fucking "Brotherhood of the Wolf" movie logic. What, do you think people in Darfur are fucking kendo masters?
>>64039595
>better pilot with a wonky side mounted sitting for decades with every single rubber part rotting out then a trained center seated tie fighter pilot in a smaller craft despite never having flown in 3 dimensions before
>hurr durr, I do not even know how I did that *cute*
And then you fucking autists just melt and forgive any bullshit. Pathetic
Lucas, look what you let them do
you sell-out
Since this seems a discussion thread, why did they only mention this in the novelization? It seems pretty fucking important as a plot point and it's not even in the film really
>>64040235
That bothered me even more than the lightsaber. The Falcon was Han's baby, it's bullshit that it just randomly got stolen and just happened to be there.
>>64047343
because she was fucking wailing on him at the end, it wasnt spelled out for retards
>luke.. "mary sue" didn't even fucking exist yet
>child anakin, moderate-to-high mary sue
>rey, most mary-sue-of-all-time
>>64045715
>a story where a protagonist never struggles is more interesting then a protagonist who does struggle
You are retarded. You gave the dumbest fucking post in a sea of morons in this thread. You should seriously consider killing yourself.
>>64047343
>anger=dark side
and how did she know that...
>>64045435
That's a terrible vague description
Mary Sues are like Poochy from the Simpsons. Everybody talks about them and they usually have more powers than established. Does she have rainbow lightning? Does everybody talk about how cute she is? No? Then she's not a Mary Sue
>>64037354
You know, I've been criticizing the use of "Mary Sue" on this board since TFA, as I believe Mary Sue is an author self-insert into a story. However, I've begun to suspect the attachment to the term by /tv/ may be influenced by Twilight and Hunger Games, (which I haven't seen).
So...opinions? Is Rey striking a chord in the younger viewer as a Bella Swan or Katniss Everdeen? Are we taking in a new generation of sci-fi that seems less genuine? Is TFA just fanfic?
>>64047600
>does everyone talk about how cute she is
Yes... Yes they do... Han solo, Leia, Finn all comment on her attractiveness.
>has more powers then established
Yes, absolutely. She can fly better then a seasoned pilot her first time behind the controls of something with 3D movement.
>rainbow lightning
No, I guess you got us anon, you proved she was not a mary sue.
>>64047651
she may not be a self-insert of JJ himself, but he is a self insert of his marxist theory
>>64047265
of course
also, people in Darfur know how to operate Space Shuttles, honed from their experiences with the occasional rusty, empty can
>>64047659
Can understand chewie her first time meeting him. LOL silly nigger stormtrooper, you mean you cannot speak an obscure furry beast language.
*cue audience laughter*
Does anyone have that image detailed how anon is a bootyblasted twitter faggot on Christmas eve?
I NEEEEEEEED IT WHAAAAAAA
>>64047651
"Mary Sue" did originally mean an author insert (especially in fan fiction) but now is commonly used to describe characters with traits common to those self-inserts even if they aren't an author stand in.
>>64047758
>so what
You are ruining our cherished franchise with your political feminist nonsense you casual faggot
>>64047708
>implying they grew up with the space shuttles scrapped in their back yard..
racist
>>64047659
It's not her first time piloting something with 3D movement. She says she's a pilot, meaning she's piloted ships before. Luke, on the other hand, only ever piloted T-16 skyhoppers
>>64047782
If the term just means characters who are good at things and ultimately don't fail, you could use the term to describe practically any protagonist in fiction
>>64039834
Yeah, doesn't she say something like "Last week those were worth one portion each."?
>>64047952
>hurr durr I neva left the planet, waiting for the person to come back
You are wrong
>>64040210
Also, I'm still pretty sure he was holding back, since he was hoping to bring her over to the Dark Side.
>>64048215
"We need a pilot."
"We've got one."
"You?"
You are wrong. She is a fucking pilot
>>64038840
>>64047984
Characters that are inserted into a standing franchise, have no significant flaws, and are capable at everything
You are being lazy by dismissing a valid concern in terms of character development. Where exactly, do we go with Ms. "Amazing Pilot, Amazing Technician, Amazing Melee Artist, Force Wonder Kid" Sue?
>>64048215
She fucking says
>I've flown before, but not in space!
Either pay attention or get your hearing checked. It is right after they go into space and both her and Finn are excitedly talking.
Do movies always have to spell out everything for you tards?
She knew where the gunner seat was, and they layout of the ship. It was owned for years by QUARTER PORTION, so obviously since she likes to tinker and thus messed around with the Falcon in her spare time. She probably flew that other ship they were running to first around the planet some.
I am glad they didn't explain everything and showed rather than told.
Also you get uneducated faggots that think flight engineers can't fly, when legally they have been required to know how to fly since 1965. Knowing intimate workings of a ship helps with flying.
Chewie knew more about repairing the Falcon than Han.
If you're going to nitpick, how does Leia know how to tinker with the ship in Episode V when Han tries to make a move on her?
>>64047468
>exactly 0% of what I said that implied the protagonist didnt need to suffer
Being the best at something doesn't mean you don't suffer, usually the opposite.
Also not going to kill myself because some illiterate retard on /tv/ can't comprehend my post ;) Having too much fun seeing autists sperg out because some character is good at something.
>>64042278
>>64042536
The origin of Rey's character, according to JJ in his QA with Kasdan, was Kathleen Kennedy. She introduced, and insisted upon, "a female Jedi."
They wrote her with Kennedy often literally looking over their shoulders. So regardless of is she or aint she, blame goes to the producer.
Is Rey comparable to Katniss in this way?
My main concern is the authenticity of characters in science fiction -- how fiction is presented to an audience. If characters have flaws and make discoveries and overcome hardships, and those hardships are related to the human condition, then it's possible we're viewing art. If it isn't, then we're watching "entertainment" carefully engineered and focus-grouped to appeal to as broad an audience as possible. This discussion of "Mary Sue" has me concerned.
I think it started when I saw that Twilight was being produced as a movie series. Before that, the Harry Potter franchise.
>>64048771
she also shoehorned in Captain Phasma and says she'll be back as a "baddie" in the next
women are cancer
