>tfw talking to your group about the parts they liked playing
>say they liked x part and didn't like y part
>"yeah anon, y part was dumb as fuck, i can't believe you made us do that"
>x part was the one you had to bullshit in 5 minutes because they went in a weird direction
>y part was the one you meticulously crafted and made characterizations/concept art for
god i fucking hate myself
it's been a few months since we last played and they're all mad at me for not having made anything more for the campaign, but i have no fucking idea what they want and it's hard to get motivated when apparently your planning doesn't mean shit as to whether or not they're going to like it
they're all such fucking whiny little bitches about everything too, they always charge in like retards regardless of the nature of the encounter and then complain when a character almost dies and they have to spend a month in some town resting up because a couple of party members got disemboweled
IF YOU HAD FUCKING HAD A PLAN AS TO HOW TO FIGHT THE TRIBAL CHAMPION, MAYBE YOU WOULDN'T HAVE HAD TO GET STABBED IN THE GUT FOUR TIMES
>>47454934
Just wing it, roll with the off-kilter punches the players throw. Fudge the dice a little so that interesting stuff happens, not just "you die."
>>47454934
Never meticulously craft anything, classic DM mistake.
Just pay attention to what the player's enjoy and expand that part to fill up the whole game.
>they liked the 5 minute bullshit arsepull
>they didn't like the meticulously crafted portion
>they're all mad at me for not having made anything more for the campaign, but i have no fucking idea what they want
I think you know fine what they want.
>>47454934
At least you have players that give honest feedback. Mine will tell me when something was completely awesome, but barely mention any negatives. And when they do its super wishy washy.
I can't be that good. Cmon guys, I can't improve things if I don't know what's lacking!
>>47455386
Oh fuck I HATE THAT
Such completely passive aggressive Shit. And it's even worse online, where everything is through text and emails n Shit. Fucking just write it out! Goddammit!
>>47455403
My group thankfully isn't passive aggressive. It's just fantastically hard to get feedback from them. You won't hurt my feelings, I've said this multiple times. There is no way I am running an absolutely perfect campaign here.
>>47454934
That sounds pretty terrible
>>47454934
>Be GM
>Players tell me they don't wana just do dungeon crawls and hero-quests this time
>OK fine
>Ask my players to come up with backstories for their characters that would include some personal goal for them to work through or some kind of issue that drives them
>Give them literally 2 weeks (plus a one week delay) to get this done
>Game night comes around
>3 of the 4 players have literally nothing for backstory or motivation, still want to play anyway. Promise they'll have something next week.
>4 weeks later they still have nothing and the one guy with a backstory has been mostly ignoring it and just playing a murderhobo.
>Start coming up with excuses not to play until everyone loses interest, because fuck, if my players can't even give me the tiniest shred of stuff to work with I might as well go try my luck with online groups or something. Hell, sitting around watching TV all night would be more gratifying than being expected to work with nothing for free.
>>47454934
>players always going off on how they want to have freedom to do what they want in an open world game.
>you're always having to force feed them bucketfuls of plot hooks because they never take the initiative to tell you what they want to do.
>>47454934
>stealth based character is always using stealth inappropriately, randomly declaring how he's hiding in markets, taverns, council chambers etc. when the party is gathering information on the spooky dungeon. It is never helpful, and often detrimental to party's goals.
>get to the spooky dungeon and the stealth character never hides or scouts ahead EVER and happily blunders along in the second or third rank of the marching order and can't understand why he never gets to backstab anyone
> players go full chaotic evil
I actually don't mind this because it was in one of the characters back stories from day one, and the other is a chaotic randumb who is actually played well as a psychopath douchebag with eight luck feats to back up his retarded plans, but now they are literally wanted and will probably end up dead.
They also said hey don't want the campaign to end until there is anTPK so clearly they think death is inevitable....
>>47454934
>they like the part that wasn't a railroad
>they didn't like the part that was a railroad
Huh.
>>47455755
A variation that I've grown to hate
>ask players to come up with backstories that will help drive the story of the campaign
>the players that give you nothing get all pissy that the events revolve around the other players that actually provided you with information.
>when told "give me something and I'll include it" they produce outrageous shit like "He's a prince with a closet full of holy swords and red dragon mount"
>>47454934
>Have guest player
>Ask for end of session feedback from group
>"There want really a plot this session. I didn't know why we were doing any of the stuff we did besides railroading."
>The party decided to do this. The setup was all last session, and this was execution.
>You showed up mid-plot and complained about lack of context you little shit. I was being generous when I let you in on such short notice.
Of course I was more polite in person.
>>47454934
>be forever DM
>friends want to play but don't own any of the books
>provide them with .pdfs and online resources
>they don't read them...ever...in the 2 years we played
>always roll characters together while they pass the PHB around
>always show up late or not at all
>games never last more than a few sessions
>blame me for not remembering what skills/spells/abilities their characters have because "lol you're DM you should know", while still refusing to read the material
>finally put an end to it and call them on their bullshit
>"Fuck you anon. You should be thankful we even wanted to play. Without us, you'd never been able to DM!"
>mfw
I'm just kind of numb...
>>47454934
>from now on there's always a hidden pit trap between them and the bad guy
>no exceptions
It's the only way they learn, anon. Also, don't craft big stories but just run with whatever comes to your mind in 5 mins, that's what they want.
First time GM here. My play group is legitimately my best friends, regardless of how shitty they are at roleplaying, finding what they enjoy and building off of it or taking their ideas into consideration for quests and everything has made the whole campaign so much fun. I thought that meticulously crafting things would be super fun, but it was more fun to just flush out NPCs, giving them depth and feeling like real people. Not building the perfect dungeon or puzzle for them to solve.
But have a question, how do you suggest your players to go a certain direction and not just say, "Fuck it, let's go the other way", making certain things you made feel obsolete because they required to be in certain geographical locations?
>>47455898
The obvious follow-up question is "why they don't have these nice things anymore, and what are they going to do to regain them?"
>>47454934
While I'm not familiar too much with that extreme of a feel, I guess I can relate somewhat.
Just NEVER go too in-depth about any of your quests. You'll be tempted the rail-road the more complex and strung-out it is, and it'll feel too artificial and not immergent enough like-wise.
I always go in with a skeletal lay-out of what happens and where, but beyond that, it's pretty much all improv.
I've only heard good things from my players as of yet.
>play GURPS
>new player complains he wants more points because he based his character on Lina Inverse and someone else on the internet built a version that cost 1000 points (a fucking absurd amount, for those unfamiliar)
>try explaining that there are different ways to do things and just because you CAN build a character with ALL THE POINTS, they can be faithfully simulated with fewer points
>No this character is too weak you don't understand, I NEED +5 in all my stats or I just can't be cool
>dude didn't even read the rulebooks and is taking this random online version of a character as gospel truth
I should have just told him to fuck off and play with the creator of that character sheet instead of wasting 2 hours trying to explain that a 300 point character is perfectly capable of being badass and is not, in his words, 'a level one gutter-hobo'
>>47455984
I had a group pull this on me sorta.
>The PLAYERS THEMSELVES tell me they want to play 5th Edition instead of Pathfinder (3.5 basically).
>Aquire PDF of 5E for all of them
>Give them 5E PDF
>Spend a couple of hours reading it myself, pretty easy stuff, not too hard to learn.
>Craft my campaign encounters around 5E stats and combat balance
>Game night happens
>"Lets just play Pathfinder, we already know how to play that game."
>player tells me he really enjoyed a random fight against 2 zombie ogres that was literally a spankfest in a 30×30 open room
>tells me he hated accompanying a knightly order in a manticore hunt while mounted on a giant vulture
I would be mad if it wasn't a pre-made adventure, I'm just kinda annoyed
He also kept complaining that another party member (my girlfriend) "stole" the last hit on the manticore even though she asked nicely and he agreed
Is he being that guy?
>>47455771
FUCKING THIS
FUCK.
WHERES YOUR GOD DAMN MOTIVATION.
>>47455984
>"Fuck you anon. You should be thankful we even wanted to play. Without us, you'd never been able to DM!"
i don't even
did this seriously happen or are you exaggerating for the sake of a better story
>>47456062
Flexibility and improvisation, mostly. Remember that you can (and should) recycle your prepped material, no point in letting that go to waste.
>>47456079
As a D&D guy I feel your pain somewhat. One of my players in one of my early campaigns tried to convince me he should be allowed to point buy two ability scores to 18 and the rest should not be lower than 10 because he is supposed to be an epic hero
At level 1
>>47456085
That fucking blows anon
>>47456111
It was the last thing a "friend" said to me after spending the day tracking them down for a session (yeah yeah I was a dolt) only to have them show up, half ass it and then leave to grab dinner, 1 hour after showing up.
I lost it...that was their retort.
>>47456117
Oh, yeah they've done this before and a town I created was moved and the plot just existed there as though it was always there. But right now they are going to the desert to stop some evil shit from going down pretty much, and they aren't entirely aware of the scope of the amount of evil there or what I have planned, talk about how they want to fight a bunch of evil shit. Don't want to ruin what I have but it feasibly only works in the desert because of it's geographical location on the map to another kingdom. I want to give them what they want, but I don't want to say they can't turn back. But they can sometimes be erratic. For fucks sake one of them almost Poltergeist themselves into a magical well when they threw in the body of their fallen friend, came out as a hallow who turned into ethereal ash.
>>47456072
The problem is that the players that come up with these power fantasy backstories are equally bad at explaining how they got from world-straddling positions of power to 1st level adventurers.
>>47456062
I tend to take the "all roads lead to rome" approach
If players ignore a hook or go a different direction they will definitely find themselves facing the hook anyway, like if they decided to not go into the dungeon to kill the lich, but tqke over the kingdom instead they will still go through the dungeon, refluffed as a castle and kill the king, who was a lich all along!
>>47456212
Have them discover that the evil is bigger than they expected, and flee for their lives to fight it on another day? That's just as legit story as heroes conquering the evil on the first try.
>Be forever GM
>Run fun games
>Players give me input on what they want
>Generally things are engaging
>Players take over as GM when my games finish
I will never know the feels of you cucks, and it's great. All you had to do was you know, communicate with your players.
>>47455755
>Be player
>Come up with a motivation for every one of my characters that ties into a person goal that they can't accomplish alone.
>Other players in the party always end up being murderhobos or actually getting annoyed that my character wants something that would require their help (even if it's something as simple as "Hey, since you're going to this dangerous place anyway, can I come along with you because there might be clues to my origins there. In exchange I'll offer you my services as a healer!")
Welp, you know what they say. "Trying is the first step to failure."
>>47456156
>>47456079
I've had the opposite problem where we're playing a high-powered system where a starting character can just destroy ordinary people but the players pussyfoot around and get all nervous when they're not at 100% health
>>47456076
>>47456238
These GMs know what they're talking about
>>47456062
This>>47456117 and this>>47456238.
It's not about being unique. It's about how unique you can make the same material sound.
I have two dungeon maps. That's it. Most of the time I just turn or invert them and descibe the atmosphere differently. If my players actually mapped out their paths (like I've suggested) I'd be forced to change.
>>47456328
Escalate and keep piling on the challenge, making them realize what badasses their characters are? Make sure to off-handedly mention waves two and three of enemies arriving next when they're already neck-deep in enemies.
>>47456327
>animeposter complains that other people find him obnoxious
well gee
>>47456407
Yes, clearly a reaction-image says everything about me.
2/10 got me to reply.
>>47456222
There is that but you know, baby steps. No one was a good roleplayer the day they were born, it takes practice.
I gave up preparing anything beyond a dozen bullet points before a session, because players will almost always think of something you didn't.
Specifically, I thought my players would either join the rebels or the nobles - instead, they pretended to work for the nobles, got themselves captured on purpose, and managed to convince the rebels that the nobles had built a super weapon, and that the best plan was to let their army into the castle, then blow it up with them inside.
You just need to trust your players.
>have a player obsessed with being a special snowflake. He has his character learn an obscure language in addition to the one everybody in the universe speaks.
>player is constantly announcing that he's going to talk to people in this obscure language, wastes time babbling at NPCs with no chance of them understanding him, including enemies, animals, etc.
>insistent that his friend in the group should also learn this obscure language "so they can talk".
>Friend finally gives in and spends the points to learn the language
>Obsessed player constantly announcing that he's talking in the obscure language to his friend even when what he's saying is important info that the whole party needs to know.
>Friend keeps telling the player that it is stupid and a waste of time (especially in the middle of combat) to have the player speaking his obscure language when the group really needs to know what he's saying.
>>47456427
Actually it was the "services as a healer" bit along with the anime.
>>47455984
I feel you anon. I ran a game of rage trader for some people. During the first session I sent them copies of the books. After six months I still had to tell them how to roll basic attacks. One of the party members never spent any of the experience and spent most of the game whining about not being as strong as everyone else who spent their experience.
Almost every session was spent dragging the party through a sea of plot hooks and listening to them whine about not having anything to do.
If all the above wasn't bad enough two of the players were unable to make a schedule to save their lives. We'd schedule a day, I'd send out multiple reminders only to have them tell me two hours before that they were busy. The justification was almost always "I didn't know we were playing today". Now they keep bugging me to run the game again.
>>47456859
The fact that you see everything as an anime trope really says more about you than the person you're criticizing, anon.
>>47454934
>players encounter NPC
>said NPC is not immediately hostile
>hear from some source that NPC is tough for some reason or another
>players pick fight
>SURPRISE! The NPC is actually tough and either beats them or kills a character going down or something
>players bitch at me for making things too hard
I've had this across 4 groups and 3 systems, and I still don't get it.
>>47456990
Hahaha fuck
Their fault for picking the fight
Your fault for not de-escalating immediately in character
>>47454934
Stop planning so much. Just stop it. It never leads to good things no matter how much work you put in. Moments you think you've constructed well and built up to a good payoff become artificial at best. Great moments come naturally from the players actions as well as the players inactions. Sometimes this means they get their ass kicked by bandits. Sometimes this means they kick an evil necromancer in the teeth and curbstomb his minions.
Spend your time building your world. Build your locations. Make a few NPCs, know them well, know how they'd react. Create a few conflicts. Know what monsters are where, make a few tables. Let your players go where they want and do what they want. At the same time, keep track of who is doing what on your side of the screen. KEEP TRACK OF TIME! Make a calendar for your world and mark deadlines and events. If the players don't come across something or someone, don't just hold off on the encounter, let it advance without them. I handwrite on every single page of notes I make "Let it happen." to remind me that it's not about what I want or plan, it's about what happens. The players have agency and the world breathes. If you just spend your time fleshing out the world instead of forcing encounters or plot points, you won't have to plan anything for your sessions. You'll also have a lot more fun just seeing what your players come up with and what happens to your world as a result.
> you will never run a sandbox vanilla zombie apocalypse campaign with resource tracking and high lethality in GURPS or some other highly lethal system where the characters have to look for food organically and make friends withd if fervent NPCs and slowly try to rebuild society, with the two hundred glow in the dark zombies you purchased for giant tactical combats.
> they want to play pathfinder instead
Why even live....
>>47457112
Not OP, but all that worldbuilding stuff usually falls under the header of planning.
Running a Monsters and Other Childish things game set in a weird town with weird mysteries happening in it as well as high school drama.
I keep on throwing mysteries at them with obvious hooks, and like wise people they just walk away. It makes total sense to not act like horror movie protaganists but god its so hard to make things happen if no one goes down the rabbit hole.
For example :
>Weird ghost bus shows up at exact same place every day
>They know there was some sort of crash that killed some kids but nobody talks about
>After about two months of play, they finally decide to go look at it.
>One player gets on, looks around. A pile of ghost kids are there chatting, and the bus driver tells them to get on because there's a schedule to keep
>They get off, everyone leaves.
It's so fucking annoying, I keep having weird and bad things happen to them but once they deal with the immediate ramifications they don't investigate why things happened or how to stop future things.
>>47457219
At the end of the day you don't know what is going to happen or, rather, what you want to happen though. Of course there's planning when it comes to worldbuilding, but it's not the same type of planning as "The players will go here and meet X, then Y will happen and they'll have to do Z." Maybe I should've written it as "Stop having expectations" or something. Yeah, that probably works better.
>>47455386
I won't lie, asking any group I've ever gm'd for while they're in the same room produces this. That said getting them all separately gives them a chance to say what without worrying about what the others will say.
I mean shit, I'd have never found out they all wanted more combat in the game if I had asked while they were all together.
>gives players an open world or interact with
>small plots here and there as they travel
>they enjoy it, but ask for something substantial with more social aspects
>spend three weeks crafting a serendipitous conspiracy between three factions in an effort to destabilize the region
>each faction has their set of motives and reasons behind starting this conspiracy, the rabbit hole goes pretty deep
>players follow this plot up to the minor “boss” npc
>they defeat the npc, but things get really melancholic in-character
>they decide to fuck off and do something else
>half of the party are heirs in hiding following a coup by their younger brother
>the other half are just random bumpkins in it for the cash
>the royal brothers made a big show of hiring mercenaries to launch an adventure for the throne
>the royal sister, technically the true heir, just wants to do wizard stuff and is helping them out of familial bond
>royal brothers finally get their big army but then fuck off ot a different city IRL
>goodbye plot
>>47454934
>people too lazy to read the fucking book
>people so goddamn lazy they even ask you to roll up a character for them, tailor-made to their expectations
God fucking damn it you fucking fags
If I have the time to do all this shit, so do you.
I ask for an up to date description of their characters a week ago for a commission I'm putting in with a drawfag I like.
No response. Nothing. 2 emails, request for a timely answer, nada. Zilch.
It's disappointing.
>>47457858
So don't pay him, find another drawfag.Don't tell me you paid before it was actually finished...
>>47457784
>find new group
>get hired as mercenaries by royal heirs
>continue and achieve
>intrigue happens, female heir gets shoved into throne, male heirs start trying to assassinate her
>she becomes jaded and starts fighting back
>the people suffer
>time to choose sides and put a new stable king on the throne or just take it for themselves
I'd be into it
>be forever dm
>Gone away for school, but all my players stayed local
>While at school they all say they cant wait for when I come home so we can play again
>feelappreciated.jpeg
>When Im not doing school work or extra curicular stuff Im crafting a whole world, and writing an age of exploration game.
>Have so much time I can plan huge encounters
>Have time to plan so many that the game would actually work sandbox
>Fuckit add kingdom building
>This is my masterpiece
>Its a glorious narrative but I have so much stuff I'll be able to improve around everything
>dynamic as fuck
>Summer rolls around
>play the first session
>players rave about the game
>how they cant wait for the next session
>Literally no one makes time for another session
>games dies after two weeks
I have no image for the feels I have. I really wanted to play test the whole thing and try to self publish it.
>making homebrew system
>asking some players to help me playtest things on a few simple, one to two shot adventures
>find problems in system, most especially spells and abilities that are too strong or too weak in combination
>tweak things in between adventures, ironing it towards what I want
> in particular, there was one three trick combo that would give someone a 95% chance of surviving anything, no matter how hard they got hit.
>expunge the flaw
>player who discovered it throws a tantrum that I take away all the cool things.
Which part of playtesting wasn't clear?
>>47457112
Solid.
>>47457112
What I would consider when building NPCs - which a single most important element to a fun world and a successful campaign imo - is make a note of a likely reaction they can have to a specific action. Something along the line of:
>How would he/she react to a betrayal?
>How would he/she act under a lot of pressure
>How would he/she react to flattery
And extrapolate the rest of reactions from half-a-dozen of those you actually wrote down.
That being said, I am a lazy shit and usually have but a few striking lines for each NPC and imporvise everything else. While it works well, I feel that a little prep > decent prep > no prep > too much prep
>>47457456
>gives players an open world or interact with
This is where you went wrong fampai. Truth it, when players ask for a "sandbox" or free world, unless it's a specific game or they are really experienced and motivated, they mean something else entirely. And in the end, 95% of players don't have the slightest idea about what they want. I've had a few games come to a grinding halt because they asked for a sandbox/political game/whatever, made (despite me warning them) unsuitable characters and ended up asking me to just run a dungeon crawl.
>>47458015
That group actually disbanded pretty quick after that due to other things. This Sunday is the first session of a new campaign set a year after the original party split.
The royal brothers have raised great hosts to take back the throne, the only problem being that Cortez (half-elf bastard, the oldest but illegitimate) has changed his mind and decided that he wants to sit the throne. Lobos, the younger brother doesn't like this, and there is now a three way war between the two of them and King Leopoldo (half brother and original true heir until he was disinherited by the last king). Meanwhile, Catarina (the daughter and technically most legitimate heir after Leopoldo's disinheritance) has fucked off to who knows where to do nectomancy stuff for the Arcane Lodge.
The party is a group of nominally unaligned adventurers on their first dungeon delve who will soon find themselves searching for Catarina in the midst of civil war, religious upheaval, and technological and political renaissance.
Ironically, Leopoldo really is the best candidate to rule:
>Lobos
Is very persuasive and gallant, but is a complete airhead and has more looks than sense. He however has the support of most of the disaffected nobles.
>Cortez
Is a fearless warrior with plenty of ruthless cunning, but is short on people skills, and is viewed by the nobility as a foreigner. More of a warlord than king material.
>Catarina
Prefers the company of her skeletal companions to living contact, and has absolutely no interest in politics or people's feelings. Is also pretty scary and has a sugarskull tattood over her face.
>Leopoldo
Has a lot of public support as he's pulled a Bismark on a collection of warring city states, reviving lots of lost culture and forging a world power. However, a decent chunk of the nobility view him as a usurper.
Since this is a feels thread alongside the venting, I figured I'd brighten the mood a bit:
We've had the same group for about 8 years now. We're generally pretty forthcoming about issues with each others' campaigns, know our boundaries, are cool with expanding our horizons, and don't flake out without notice. We have our differences, but that's smalltime.
...I guess that doesn't really make any of you exasperated DMs out there any happier, but just know that good players are out there. They're out there, and they're looking for a DM like you.
(Though for real don't meticulously plot everything, it'll only end in heartbreak. Allow yourself to be pleasantly surprised)
>>47461782
Where is the bait here? I'm just telling you people that all of your problems are self created and easily fixed by acting like adults.
>>47456062
>flush out NPCs
Heh. Into the toilet it goes!
>But have a question, how do you suggest your players to go a certain direction and not just say, "Fuck it, let's go the other way", making certain things you made feel obsolete because they required to be in certain geographical locations?
Generally, don't. If they're not interesting in doing the thing you planned, it's not going to become fun if you try to push them to do it. Just figure out what they'd rather do and run that.
Fortunately, you didn't spend a whole lot of time prepping that thing that flopped, right? 'Cause if you spent a lot of time prepping the wrong thing, until you got attached to it, then either it'll end up being thrown away and you'll feel bad, or you'll get them to do it anyway (maybe via soft railroading, IE "The road forks in three directions, which do you choose? Wait, it doesn't matter, fuck your decisions, they all lead to this ogre encounter! No matter where you go, it's ogre time.") and they'll be bored and not like it, and you'll feel bad. Either way you're gonna have a bad time.
Make your prep wide and shallow, and offer them a variety of hooks, with just enough prep that you're ready to improvise with whatever they find exciting.
>>47461909
Yeah nah.
I applaud your attempt to rage this thread back to life though.
Although next time just lead with the typical "D&D is cancer and the bane of all things table top" like a normal faggot.
>>47462372
I'm still wondering where the bait is, senpai.
>>47454934
Anon, I'm afraid you've mixed something up.
If your players didn't like the thing that took you a long time, that's one thing, but they apparently really liked it when you made stuff up.
That means, from their perspective, you're good at making stuff up even if you don't prepare it before hand! That's a strength as a DM, not a reason to be sad! That's a reason to smile!
>>47456079
>'a level one gutter-hobo'
stealing this for my next character
>>47455898
> ask players to come up with backstories for aNaruto campaign
> each one comes up with a relatively in-depth backstory that provides motivation for what they do
> they play to their character, more or less
> the guy who rolled up a character that was basically a breeding experiment plays to his canon clan's character traits, being easygoing and a tad smart-mouthed instead of dark and edgy
It's heaven for a novice GM, lemme tell ya
>Half an hour after the game is supposed to start
>Nobody has shown up at the game store
>Text one of my friends, ask where is everyone
>"We're all playing Overwatch"
>Tonight's game night though
>"Dude Overwatch literally just came out"
>All four of you skipped the game to play Overwatch and none of you bothered to tell me?
>"Come on man did you really expect us to miss the first night after Overwatch's launch to play D&D?"
I want to die
>Want to run an OSR game
>Vaguely lighthearted, some gonzo elements
>Not sure if players would be interested
>Not sure if I can even get time for everyone to play
>Not sure if I even like old-school games or just the idea of them
>Only ever DMed a couple solo sessions of Basic Fantasy RPG before
Fuck, self-doubt is my real enemy here, isn't it?
>>47463326
Jesus christ, what a gaggle of assholes. Time to get some new friends who can act like adults, anon.
>>47462669
Baselessly forcing the blame onto the people in the thread is the bait. It's pretty obvious, desu fampai.
>>47463326
>he really expected people to skip Overwatch launch day for D&D
>>47456429
I was.
my players often get an image in their heads of how THEY believe something should play out
so when their retarded plan doesn't work out precisely how they imagined, they bitch
what's even worse is that they often base their shit off of "muh realism". In a game where all three of them have magic and shit
like no, the pack of OWLBEARS aren't afraid of your fucking torch. Why the fuck would the pack of THREE ANGRY OWLBEARS just up and run away because you swung a torch twenty feet away from you?
or shit like the magic character uses illusions then gets butthurt about people seeing through them. Like you're fighting guards and you illusion up a small dragon in front of them, they fucking saw you do that and the thing clearly appeared out of thin air, they know that magic is a thing and the dragon also clearly is fake because one of the guards is fucking standing in it
My games go great for the most part but my players are just kinda dumb.
>>47463326
having players that don't care about the game as much as you do is terrible. Straight up leave them and tell them that if they don't give a shit you're not gonna try to give a shit
>>47454934
Nothing bugs me more than being an online DM doing play by post and not getting a reply from more than one person in the range of 36 hours.
Makes me feel like I've done something horrible but nobody wants to mention it, or they just don't care about the game any more.
It's a little thing, but it makes me paranoid. That and not getting feedback.
I learned not to plan anything out in too much detail as you cannot know what your players would react to a certain situation. I make little notes like a writer and use it for inspiration.
>>47463531
>Like you're fighting guards and you illusion up a small dragon in front of them, they fucking saw you do that and the thing clearly appeared out of thin air, they know that magic is a thing
if you're willing to cite this as an excuse, you might as well not have illusion magic at all.
>and the dragon also clearly is fake because one of the guards is fucking standing in it
this, this makes sense. The rest of it seems a bit much to me
>>47463531
My players generally don't bitch, but if something's skew-whiff, they're not afraid to speak up and ask me about it or state their position.
Case in point, two bad guys were initiative X, one got a player down to low health, and I said 'seeing player is badly hurt, the other bandit closes in', and one of them was like 'If they have the same initiative, they should be moving at the same time, right? The second bandit couldn't know that the player would crit-fail and lose so much health.'
It made sense, so I changed the second bandit's target to be as if he didn't know the player was nearly about to get one-shotted.
>>47463510
Why wouldn't you expect people to skip the launch of a shitty game for a good one, anon?
>>47463510
If he's not even worth a fucking text message saying "oh can't come that day, playing vidjeo games" to these guys, then they're childish assholes who should find themselves a doormat to DM for them instead.
Adults who've made commitments don't break them silently.
>>47463809
As a guy who cancelled all of his plans for the week to playWarhammer Total Warthis desu famalamadingdong
>>47463671
Illusions should be used for clever shit, not "I bet if I conjure something in front of this guy he'll run away!"
unless you're using some weird setting everyone knows that magic is around and likely have seen some sort of magic in their lifetime, and they're probably not stupid enough to believe that a legit dragon just materialized out of thin air in the middle of town after the man in the wizard robes did a bunch of hand gestures and said some magic shit
>>47463709
imo you were well in the right, even if they have the same initiative it's your choice if they both go at the same time or not. You could also easily say "They decide to gang up on you" because you know, that makes complete sense
your players were just trying to wishy wash you into a better situation for themselves
>>47454934
I hate my group.
>that one fat autistic fag who totally lacks any ability to plan ahead and takes pride in it, I still don't get why, and always fucking acts as stupid as possible and just won't stop memeing.
>that one minmaxing fag who is always late for at least an hour and tries to solve everything with violence and always brags about how things are easy even when they're not and he died four sessions in a row
>that another minmaxing rules-lawying fag why is always spiteful as fuck and rages anytime when things don't go his way
>that one fag who always makes the same character who is either a knight or a lone cowboy that lacks any kind of backstory or personality besides "muh honor" or "muh badassery"
>that one fag who always have a dismissive attitude and who doesn't bother to read anything and always asks one of the minmaxers to make a character for him and it's fucking always some kind of chaotic stupid bard regardless of the systemGuess which one is me.
>>47463874
>>that one fag who always makes the same character who is either a knight or a lone cowboy that lacks any kind of backstory or personality besides "muh honor" or "muh badassery"
Behold my psychic powers.
>>47463874
The first one. More adjectives.
>>47463864
>unless you're using some weird setting everyone knows that magic is around and likely have seen some sort of magic in their lifetime, and they're probably not stupid enough to believe that a legit dragon just materialized out of thin air in the middle of town after the man in the wizard robes did a bunch of hand gestures and said some magic shit
I mean, unless he thought the guy in wizard robes literally summoned a pseudodragon.
is there such thing as a good group?
seriously, i've been in four groups in my life and none of them are what I'd call "good". Either the GM was a cunt or didn't try or one of the players was a cunt or didn't try.
my players are alright when they play but they're just kind of cunts personality wise, like I won't hear anything from one guy for a week and then the night we're supposed to play it's "oh can't make it" or I just don't hear anything at all
am I wrong for believe that fucking adults shouldn't act like that? They just have no respect for my time or the time of anyone but themselves.
>>47454934
>decide to run involved shadowrun/13th age combo campaign thing
>play rules light because party isn't interested enough to give a shit about actual rules in either book
>party never follows any given plot hooks
>every player on their phone between rounds, and during travel or literally anything else
why even show up
I'm DMing a DnD 5e game soon, how fucked am I
>>47463864
> imo you were well in the right
Quite possibly
> even if they have the same initiative it's your choice if they both go at the same time or not
I know. But it made sense the way the guy explained it. He didn't sperg out, he calmly and rationally explained his point of view, and I respect that.
> You could also easily say "They decide to gang up on you" because you know, that makes complete sense
Yeah, but - and this is shitty reasoning, admittedly - it was only the second game and I didn't want one of them to die straight-up. I used a Kishimoto-tier asspull to get him to safety on 1HP and 1 Chakra Point, bleeding out and essentially unable to move, but alive. I did impress upon him that unlike the actual Kishimoto, I won't be handing them out like Halloween candy, and if we consider them as Fate points sort of thing, he burned his for like the next eight missions.
I'm still a REALLY new GM, so I like my players putting in their input and teaching me as we go. They don't try to take advantage of me, which is great.
>>47463949
good groups are hard to find in a hobby that appeals to the socially stunted.
Oddly enough, one of the best experiences I've ever had at the table was as a player (rare) in a random group at the FLGS.
It's a shit show for the most part, but every once in a while you find something that works.
>>47463900
>>47463903
I'm the third one. And I'm the GM.
>>47454934
top kek that greentext is hilarious
>>47463949
Yes, there are. It's mostly luck, though.
My first group - which I played with in person - I'd known for ages and they're ALL really laidback, easy-going and love RPGs. They know the rules back to front, helped me ease into the game, encouraged me to speak up. If I made a mistake or took too long with rolling, they never got mad, just explained where I went wrong or explained what the rolls meant. It was some of the most fun I ever had.
My second and current group (I'm >>47463709) is also pretty great. We play on Roll20 but they're all friendly, they love the setting, two players are veterans and help the newbies, and they both help me become a better GM.
>>47463671
Illusions typically work better if they don't see you cast them.
>>47456327
>can I come along with you because there might be clues to my origins there.
This is honestly worse than a murderhobo or brooding personality, imo. All of your character's motivations are entirely passive, or only interesting to you. It's not necessarily obnoxious, it's just dull and shitty, especially if you haven't come up with an actual backstory beforehand with the GM so the GM can involve you in the story and make it interesting.
>>47463935
player asked me "what's the biggest dragon I can conjure with silent image". I being nice let him summon a "large hatchling dragon".
he summoned it directly in front of the group of guards, didn't move it or anything and assumed that a silent unmoving dragon would be enough to get six guards to run away in fear
again, this is why I used it as an example of my players believing that something should work out in a specific way and then getting made and bitchy when it doesn't. The guy complained about his stupid shit not working for a solid five minutes.
game before that another player got unbelievably assmad when he got arrested for admitting to a murder right in front of a guard. I told him "the guard is going to arrest you and take you to prison, what are you going to do?" and he said that he'd do nothing and co-operate.
The party was split up (not my doing) so the other players couldn't do anything, and after I went to them and what they were doing and came back to the player being in prison he freaked out and said "B-but why am I in prison? I know I said I'd go with the guard and co-operate but I wanted to escape before I got there!"
well you didn't fucking tell me bud and I asked so you're in fucking jail. Your fault in the first place for being a retard and admitting to MURDERING THE GUARD CAPTAIN in front of several guards LIKE NOTHING WOULD HAPPEN Twenty minutes later I was about five seconds from having the guards come in and execute his stupid ass right there so I didn't have to put up with his bitching anymore
>>47464146
As I pointed out, it's not exactly a heinous or game-breaking stretch to consider the possibility that the guard could have believed that a wizard would be capable of summoning a pseudodragon.
>>47464191
>he summoned it directly in front of the group of guards, didn't move it or anything and assumed that a silent unmoving dragon would be enough to get six guards to run away in fear
Well, shit, in that case he clearly didn't give enough of a shit to commit to the plan. If he's not even going to bother seeing out his ploy you're perfectly justified in not allowing it to fly.
>>47464194
I think that's covered by the "he knows magic is a thing" deal. There's only two possible options, and if the player fucks up the position of the illusion it's obvious it's not a real dragon. From the way it was framed, the player seemed incredulous that the guards weren't panicking immediately ignoring all logic.
>Have a shit group
>Seriously, I don't like playing with them. I wasted a great story I had been writing on their shitty characters and horrible roleplaying, that I can't ever use again because it's recorded for everyone to see (no, I'm not going to share it).
>Have a rotating 4th seat because we keep losing the 4th player. Finally 3rd players leaves and 2nd player can't make it anymore.
>Trudge on with replacements, but want to get rid of all of them.
>I just want to find a fucking group of people who can put a little bit of effort into roleplaying and not say "Yeah that <dramatic part we've been building up to> was pretty boring. Why did you have us do that? I had more fun fighting <encounter with skeletons>."
So much work I put in. Not just the campaign, but everything that went around it. All just wasted on these idiots.
>In during someone saying "Just get a new group."
It's not that easy when the game you're trying to run is a live show.
>>47457897
You read that wrong.
The fuckers are too lazy to give the DM a fucking up to date description of their characters, so he can give it to the drawfag to, yanno, draw.
>>47464298
>I think that's covered by the "he knows magic is a thing" deal.
Knowing magic is a thing is precisely one reason why the guard could have believed that a dragon had been summoned. After all, summoning a dragon is magic itself. That's all I was saying. Maybe I'm a lenient DM, but I would have maybe had the guards at least roll some kind of morale or Intelligence check had the wizard player actually put any further thought into the scheme. As it is, though, yeah, a completely silent immaterial dragon isn't going to fool anybody for very long.
>want to run a LoZ themed campaign
>2 of my players are into it, really want to play
>1 of them absolutely refuses because he hates Zelda, never played it just watched me play the original once
>have to choose between leaving one guy behind and hearing him bitch, or playing a fun campaign
>>47464338
Oh, illusions have will saves to see through them. If the dragon had actually, you know, acted like a dragon the DM would have had to make them roll to see through it. But since it just plopped into existence and didn't even move, it's obvious the wizard just made a pretty picture.
>>47464362
Can that one guy not attend? Can you find a replacement?
>>47464194
>>47464219
>>47464298
>>47464338
My main point is that nobody is going to believe that a dragon was just conjured out of thin air in the middle of town.
Even less are they going to believe that a silent dragon that didn't move or smell like anything or make any sort of noise or do anything but stand in a spot was just conjured out of thin air.
it was also in the middle of the day so it wasn't like there was darkness obscuring anyone's vision.
I didn't have anyone make a check because 1. the dc would have been 12 and someone would have made it and 2. the dragon had a guard visibly standing through one of it's front legs (the wings were also clipping through a building)
but in the mind of my players the guards wouldn't notice any of that and would just drop all their weapons and run away from the murderers who just killed several of their friends and their captain earlier that day
had it been phantasmal force or major image or something that wasn't basic ass silent image in a situation like that then I would have played it out differently. Had the player conjured it around a corner or something then had it swoop in from the sky I would have played it differently. But he didn't and just assumed that it'd work out his way because he wanted it to. He's an adult btw
>>47464381
I do all my shit online, so he'll know I'm online with all of our other friends playing and he'll start bitching to play WoW or play more 5e.
>>47464314
why are you trying to do a live show? you're not matt mercer or chris perkins friendo
>>47464465
>why are you trying to do a live show?
Because it's a thing I've always wanted to do, long before Critical Role was a thing, and I've since partnered with a better channel that I actually make money from, but I still want to do my own thing.
You might as well ask me why I decided to be a professional illustrator, because I'm not Greg Capullo or Jim Lee. We don't decide what we want to do with our lives based on whether or not people better than us already exist.
>>47464371
Wait, really? Illusion is Will? That's kinda weird. I didn't know that.
>>47464579
It was in 3.5. It's an INT save now in 5th.
>>47457231
I got a player who keeps shutting down the game to complain about how she doesn't understand plot points.
It's called a mystery, go investigate and learn!
>>47457231
I'd love to play in a MaOCT game. But I'm the only one in my group that knows the system :/
I quite literally hate my meme DM, he thinks self inserting his own character into the party is a good thing. Specially when he is a high level "legend" in the world and apparently the big bad is his "evil other self". I mean that's retarted to me.
This is my first time playing this but I doubt it should work like this. I hope other GMs aren't as autistic as my friend.
>>47465142
>I mean that's retarted to me.
It's not just you. Your DM sucks, anon.
>>47455894
Meticulously crafted doesn't necessarily mean railroad. It could just mean he spent a lot of time thinking up and planning the area/encounter/whatever
>>47465142
That's the worst case of DMPC I've ever heard
>have one player that gets passive-aggressive any time we have to cancel a session
>specifically when I call it off, not so much when other players can't make it.
>bitched the whole time when he DM'd two sessions months back when we did rotating games as a break between my campaigns
Shit man, we play every week, and sometimes every other week when life happens. It's either that or no game at all.
>>47465142
that's actually so bad that variations of what he is doing is considered a meme (or something like that) here
by that I mean that so many DMs have done stupid wish-fulfillment bullshit like that that it's become the /tg/ equivalent of starting a story with "it was a dark and stormy night..." except way worse
>>47465268
A DM who cancels sessions should be shot.
If you can't do it, don't fucking agree to do it.
>>47465304
And what if there's a legitimate reason?
> My, uh...guys my brother passed away last week. The funeral is being held on the day we play...
> FUCK YOU RUN THE GAME WHO GIVES A SHIT ABOUT YOUR BROTHER HE WAS PROBABLY A FAGGOT ANYWAY
>>47465335
Yes, I'm sure your life is just full of funerals that conveniently fall on game days. First it was your brother, then your grandma, then your uncle. Shit, you're just running out of relatives.
>>47465354
>funerals
>plural
That guy just said A funeral, you strawmanning double nigger
>>47465354
>I'm only pretending!
>>47465370
I know he did. But he also said "any time we cancel a session" and "specifically when I call it off". That means, by definition, he has cancelled multiple times.
And I don't think it was for family funerals.
Again, if your schedule doesn't allow you to commit, why would you fucking commit? Just let someone else do it.
>>47465304
How about you can go fuck yourself, or run your own game instead of bitching.
If I'm sick as shit that day, it's not going to be a fun session for anyone anyway. If I have family in town, guess what, I'm going to spend time with them instead.
Turns out adults tend to have busy schedules, and the one night a week 5 people can meet sometimes doesn't work out. Either fucking deal with the fact you don't get to play pretend every single week sometimes, or leave.
>>47465421
Why are you throwing a temper tantrum?
>>47455771
>You walk into town
>Around you, you see a bustling tavern, a bounty board, a mercenary guild, and 5 grieving mothers sans daughters
>We go straight to the nearest inn and leave first thing in the morning
>>47465410
>he
>implying those two posts must be the same person
We're all anonymous here and you can't tell the difference so assuming that you're always talking to the same person is not a safe move. Welcome to 4chan.
>>47465410
>Oh no, the DM couldn't make it a couple times over our 6 month game, what a cunt!
Again, fuck off and run one yourself then you self important shit.
>>47465446
Dude, I fucking hate this.
>Party strolls into town, heads straight for an inn.
>Describe a scene of colorful people, different cliques and groups in different uniforms that clearly are not friendly, snippets of conversation and rumor flying around, bards playing music, etc.
>"We order dinner and pay for a room, and then go to sleep."
Every. Fucking. Time.
>>47465455
>Again, fuck off and run one yourself then you self important shit.
I do. And I'm not a piece of shit who can't keep a simple schedule.
Surprise, if I decide to dedicate a night of my week to playing RPGs, that means I actually do what adults do and schedule things to accommodate that, since it's something I've chosen to commit to and since I know it's going to happen every week at the exact same time I have no real excuse for not being able to make upcoming events and responsibilities not conflict.
Are you really telling me you can't use a calendar to plan things in your life?
>>47465446
My party's basically set up a "mercs & investigators for hire" in a major city.
Which is really convenient because I don't have to worry about them picking up hooks, I just send them direct to their doorstep.
>>47455755
I've had the flipside
>be player of a pedantic DM who explains he spends massive amount of time crafting quests and etc.
>requests backstory from every player, and promises 'the more there is, the more reward in game"
>craft elaborate backstory with DM assistance.
>Game starts
>game takes place in the boonies of space. No one is around but monsters.
>2 years pass of gaming like this 1-3 times a month
>Suddenly DM passes note saying "someone tells you 'beware Dravis, he is coming for you" do you tell the party?"
>OMG the rival of my character's backstory! I inform the party. finally! something from my backstory. FINALLY
That ended up being the last session. DM said he got bored.
>>47465436
He's being opinionated on 4chan. I'm not saying /tg/ should be anyone's toilet but one of the benefits of posting on 4chan is that you get to decide for yourself how much respect another poster deserves, if you think they said something really stupid you get to bite their head off.
I know players can be self-entitled little bitches but I also know some GMs are total flakes and it sucks to be let down on something as fun as tabletop RP. So, I don't really have a dog in this fight.
>>47463511
>be me
>be born
>holy shit Marth! Look at how well he's playing the role of a baby?
>>47465506
Congratulations, you're not what I was complaining about then you illiterate bumfuck.
If you're going to bitch that someone can't make it once or twice, and that person is the one actually doing the work to run a game; then you should at least be willing to run one yourself. The person in question in my original post isn't willing to run one, nor is anyone else in the group.
But if you think it's realistic that someone puts D&D above everything else in their life unerringly or else they're garbage, then you're a manchild.
>>47465507
One of my players actually half-complained that all the plot hooks just seek them out, usually via friends they know delivering info or knocking on their door.
My response was "Well, it could have something to do with the fact that you guys never fucking leave your safehouse unless you're on a quest."
>>47457112
Considering I'm planning on running a game for the first time in a month, and am building a region to campaign in, this post really helps.
Thanks!
>>47465576
Luckily my players like it and are enjoying the novelty of it. I could see the flip-side of it though.
>>47465570
>But if you think it's realistic that someone puts D&D above everything else in their life unerringly or else they're garbage, then you're a manchild.
Why do you have to put it above anything else? You either put it NEXT TO everything else, or you don't fucking commit to being part of the group.
You know how often shit comes up that keeps me from playing? Never, because I'm capable of accounting for this one 4 hour chunk of time every week well in advance. You know, like adults do.
>>47457173
I think you and I both know what your next pathfinder campaign is
>>47465613
You're continuing to act like I've said I cancel every week or something. It's been maybe 2-3 times over more than 6 months.
If you think people don't get sick, or have relatives in town, or car problems or fucking life happening occasionally, and that those are inexcusable reasons to miss out on 4 hours of talking in funny voices and rolling dice, then I don't know what to tell you.
>>47463874
>>47464001
Sounds like you should write a webcomic about it
>>47463326
>>47463809
stop running for them man. They don't deserve your commitment.
>>47465613
So basically, if you never leave your house, never interact with family, never get sick, and never have to take a shift at work then you're set?
Fuck off manchild.
>>47465613
Everyone's life is different, some jobs are more demanding than others, some lifestyles are more forgiving than others, some children are more forgiving than others.
That said, I will be very surprised if you claim to be a working class adult with children. You are saying things that a working class adult with children would, in my experience, never say.
A lot of people know perfectly well that they will have to cancel their leisure activities for other reasons but they still plan leisure activities because of how badly they WANT to do them. No one is making you play D&D with these people, you are free to pick up your dice and leave, and if it is a concern for you then I recommend you talk to new groups about it beforehand, but you are judging these people in a stupid and short-sighted way.
Believe me, if I COULD keep every fun-appointment that I ever made, I would do so. D&D is small time, you ever try telling someone not not cum for 3 weeks before you consensually rape them and then have to cancel said rape? Now THAT is disappointment.
>>47465743
Why?
>>47465801
>>47465813
Thank you. The other guy had me starting to think I was taking crazy pills.
>>47465436
Because it's a thread for venting? He's being a selfish cunt so I'm treating him like one.
>join new RPG group
>Excited to finally find a live group after a long down time
>We play 3 different games and in every game one player is usually scheming to fuck the rest of the party over.
Without Fail.
Interparty conflict can be interesting but all the time? Seriously!?!
Can we be straightforward for once?!?
>>47465410
We can't all be fucking NEETs with no life who are able to play 24/7. Sometimes things pop up, and sometimes things get in the way. There's no reason to get all bitter and twisted about it. DnD is fun, but it's not the be-all and end-all of your existence, and if it is, you need to take a serious look at your priorities.
>>47464465
/co/ here, came because my friend was talking about both this board and hypothetically playing dnd, I know a failed lawyer/artist who has 9 cats and is into dnd named Chris Perkins, I hope it's the same guy.
>>47466088
The Chris Perkins that he's talking about is a full time Wizards of the Coast employee, I think he's actually a designer but they field him for publicity events (like the Penny Arcade games) where they need someone to run a game and make D&D look good. .
>>47466019
Gee, citizen, that sounds pretty lame.
Why not play a superior RPG based around cooperation, like Paranoia? Everybody can get together and have a good time playing as Troubleshooters protecting Alpha Complex from threats like the Outside and the Communists that inevitably dwell in your very midst.
>>47466347
Those words reek of treason.
>Powergamer brought his wife into the group
>She's great at the game that's not the issue she's a fantastic role player
>She's also a powergaming bitch
God above, save me from this nightmare.
>>47466388Actually, by reading these words, you yourself are guilty of treason! This text was spoilered because it was above your clearance level!
BLAM
>>47458132
Post it as a pdf. I'm interested.
>>47466437
But friend computer, are you yourself questioning the clearance level you granted me? Isn't that considered treasonous?
>>47466714
Seconding that. Something with a lot of work put in it is worth sharing.
>>47464448
>My main point is that nobody is going to believe that a dragon was just conjured out of thin air in the middle of town.
While you're right on all the other stuff, summoning magic IS a thing.
Not DM/GM currently, but the people there were treating me like I was + there's no thread for just general venting.
>player shows up for our 5e game
>has played like 2 sessions with another GM who apparently knew as little as humanly goddamn possible
>made him roll a d20 for stats
>just a single d20
>refused to change it/roll it again once I suggested he do so, in front of current DM
>homebrewed a "bloodline limit" that allowed him to polymorph into a specific shape, teleport, and hypnotize people
>all without using actually casting
>is from another plane which is -literally- our earth
>is also amnesiac or something
>he wouldn't shut the fuck up about telling me about his character,
>when I'm the only of 7 other people that were supposed to be there,
>when I've clearly told him and showed him I'm trying to finish some touches on my own character
Sure, he gave up levels on his own for this, but he literally didn't discuss this with anyone. He just showed up, started talking about how it worked, and refused to listen when I tried to explain making homebrew shit on your first ever character for any tabletop game -ever- might be a fucking bad idea, he essentially ignored me.
>DM starts the game
>"I'm late, I'm late, for a very important date"
>fuckthis.jpeg
>continue onwards while not even paying much attention
>rabbit shrinks and jumps down a small hole
>There's a bag of red pills and blue pills
I just zoned out and watched the nearby 40k game or was reading from the books, after that
worst of all, IMO.
>character is built around using fire spells and being decended from genies/elementals
>DM /immediately/ tries to make me take a cursed item for a starting item that makes me weak to ice spells
>second combat of the campaign
>every enemy is immune to fire damage
Gonna tell the group I'm already done with his campaign tomorrow.
>dm a D&D5e
>have a high autism guy with no social awareness whatsoever
>constantly fucking ignoring the DM
>constantly asking questions that no one cares about.
>always fucking correcting everyone about their characters
>Legally I can't kick this guy out, or reassign him.
FUCK EVERYTHING.
>>47466950
Let's see, in 5e you cannot conjure a dragon at all.
In 2e, if it's in the DM's encounter tables, you could theoretically summon a newborn baby white dragon (11 hit dice, -6 for hatchling = 5 HD) if you're level 13 and know Monster Summoning V, which can summon level 5 monsters. This is only if you rolled that on the table, however.
In 1e you could get a white dragon at level 13, or a black dragon at level 15, if the dice and DM permit.
In any event, it's really unlikely that some random dude in a wizard hat is s mighty enough spellcaster to even potentially summon a dragon. A wizard that powerful would be known far and wide.
It's pretty
>>47467150
>>Legally I can't kick this guy out
This isn't how the world works.
>>47467150
AL?
or just a FLGS deal.
is there not other games running you can suggest he go into?
>>47467112
>7 other people
Good lord.
>>47467245
it gets worse
4 of them have multiple characters.I do as well, but I only pull them out when inevitably 5 people somehow fail to show up without saying anything
>>47467163
If it's AL like he stated here >>47467175
then yeah, it is.
Adventurers league even sounds awful without having tried it, I can't imagine why anyone would go for it.
>>47467276
>tfw new to d&d
>try a local store, total bros, help me design my character, fun as fuck quest, have a great time
>try another store on a different day, its an AL store, tell me that the adventure I played didn't count.
>starts an hour late because the DM feels he needs to correct my char sheet.
>strict rule abides and reading from the Book.
>guy in group wont shut the fuck about the rules
>same guy is annoying as fuck, with his character, always going off path and thinking he knows everything. wants to make out with every girl he sees in char. stops the flow of the game because he thinks that his ideas are better than the groups.
no AL fucking sucks
>>47467336
Nah, AL is great. It attracts all the worst people and gets them away from you, much like the lint trap in your dryer.
>>47467361
>>47467336
>>47467276
>tfw I was thinking about offering to DM AL for my FLGS because they don't have anybody running D&D games there right now and I really wanna play D&D
I feel like I may have dodged a bullet
>>47467336
If I wanted my roleplay experiences to have uncompromising rules and ridged plots I'd go play a Video RPG or an MMORPG. Half the fun of the tabletop is the creativity and human element provided by the DM and the other players. Eliminate that is like botching the visuals in a movie: Your throwing away the advantages of your medium.
>>47454934
>they always charge in like retards regardless of the nature of the encounter and then complain when a character almost dies
Found your problem OP.
Next time, actually kill a few of them. Teach them the hard way how retards who charge in would actually be dealt with in real life. If they bitch, tell them "git gud or git out".
>>47454934
>Be GM
>Player has a character concept that's 3 pages long
>Player has written a backstory that is impossible at nearly every turn including having a vampire wife and a half vampire child, dual personalities and PTSD
>"Uh~ Seems a bit overdressed don't you think?"
>I've been working on this for more than a year
>MFW
>>47467622
Tell him "I think this one's been in the oven too long, it's way overcooked."
>>47455898
>the players that give you nothing get all pissy that the events revolve around the other players that actually provided you with information.
I've seen this one in action. Not just the ones that "actually provided you with information," but even players wondering why they don't have as much to do, and their characters don't have as much to show for their adventures as the ones who grab onto plot-hooks, pursue personal objectives proactively, and generally show agency.
>>47456087
>complaining about last hits in a tabletop rpg
Is...is this real? Do people do this?
>>47455984
>Fuck you anon. You should be thankful we even wanted to play. Without us, you'd never been able to DM!"
Then don't play with them.
Their loss, not yours.
>>47456079
>Lina Inverse
Ew.
>>47456079
300 points a level 1 gutter hobo? Should have made this person see what GURPS feels like at 100 points. Let alone the 25-50 it advises for an actual average human.
>>47456884
>rage trader
Now THIS is a game I'd play!
>>47468351
Not same anon, but yes.
It's not helped by the fact that the DM occassionally has a fit of autism and gives extra exp for it, in an endless circle of making characters more powerful for hitting shit really hard, which lets them hit shit harder, which gives them exp, ect.
It's made especially retarded that he demands we all do turns in a circle of how we're sitting, becuase inititive is "too complicated' it's "just another thing to keep track of"
>>47466753
Are you doubting the authority and wisdom of friend computer? Friend computer gives or takes your level of clearance based on your loyalty and willingness to obey and it seems to me that you are currently lacking in both regards thus is the unfortunate reason for your slight downgrade to yellow status and as such I regret to inform you on Friend Computer's behalf the conversation you have been participating in is below your clearance level has been deemed Green Clearance. Please proceed to the nearest Suicide Booth as punishment for your clone's insubordinate behavior.
Remember: a loyal friend of friend computer never questions friend computer.
>>47458992
>Catarina
I love that deciding to be a spinster in RPGs can mean getting involved in necromancy as a way to pass the time.
>>47454934
>try to get the group together
>everyone is up for first sessions but there is never a second one
>literally only do one shots
>every now and then they say "man we should continue X campaign"
>I say we should
>nah can't sorry maybe next time
>playerbase is composed of:
powergamer lol-I-am-too-good-eveb-for-myself guy
edge mcedgeman that turns out not to be edgy at all. Always.
person that takes nothing seriously and wants to roleplay far right wing views
weedlmao bro
magician
people that don't know how to roleplay (like 4 of them)
the assbackwards clown
>mfw I am stuck with these guys for the rest of my miserable life
>>47468453
That was the last day.
At the time they were the only people in the area that had even heard of ttrpgs so my judgement was heavily impaired. It has since given me a lot of red flags to be mindful of in the future though.
>>47469927
Did they get a new GM?
>>47455386
I had that problem for quite a while now too, but when my group got smaller it suddenly became much easier for people to provide feedback. Hell, they've even begun sending me a form in a word file evaluating sessions, and it helps enormously. My advice is, keep bringing it up during the sessions, make it as concrete as you can. "Did you think character X was too hard to persuade?" "Was the bittersweet end for that character too dark, would you rather have a lighter tone?" "Have we been spending too much time in the criminal underworld of this city?"
Keep prodding them, most of it won't matter to them but you might get lucky with some feedback at some point.
>>47469982
They just went back to playing FF7 for the 50th time.No seriously
>>47470015
Well then good riddance.
>>47456795
>filename
>>47468490
Isn't that simply a rogue trader campaign where the characters worship Khorne?
Rouge trader would be fitting for once
>>47468481
I'm so glad I'm not the only one who thought this!
Hell, I made a 125 point (before disavantages) spec. Ops, and needless to say he, and the rest of the party, were ridiculous basasses as far as humans were concerned.
>>47455755
I told mine
"If you dont bring a backstory you'll play a level 0 peasant"
Only 1 didnt bring it.
He played a level 0 peasant.
He had a backstory the next time.
>>47454934
>I have no idea what they want
they want to have fun, and they don't want to spend 20 minutes hearing you describe a loincloth.
>be GM
>running for group for 4 years or so now
>feel a little bit beat at times, like people aren't interested in my games
>run anyway, I'm just a pessimist
>go through large hiatuses recently
>really losing will to DM
>find out later that a comission for the party where they spent a ton of dosh together to get has finally finished after a large hiatus
>it looks great
>it's beautiful
>they only spent this much because they like the campaign
>instantly rejuvenated
You fucks are okay sometimes.
>>47456062
I flat-out give them the rules of the engagement. Screw "no railroading", I have a nice rollercoaster ride prepared for you ungrateful bastards and you will enjoy it.
>>47454934
>make a solid campaign plotted out for a season
>players love it
>I'm having fun with it
>I play a certain videogame before the last session
>I really like that game
>I shoehorn parts of that game into the final encounter and ruin everything for everyone
>players hate me for the nosedive in quality and vow never to play with me again
I made a terrible mistake.
>>47472826
Also, this was notable for being one of the few times I winged it a little. Everything I did that was planned out went well.
So don't believe all those horror stories about plans going wrong. You just need to work on your plans and stick to them.
>>47462829
This. My biggest strength as a GM in any system is my ability to just throw plans out the window, grab my pants, lift off the ground, and fly away. Players will ALWAYS think you're good at planning and making complex stories when you're just making everything up as you go along. Just be careful not to contradict yourself. When something happens, record it somewhere, so the details won't get mixed up later. That's literally the only real work I do. And my players are wildly dedicated and will follow me to any system because of it.
>>47473359
>Meticulously plan out a campaign, including subplots based on the backstories of the players
>Constantly one-step ahead of them, always planning contingencies
>Reach a point where they are talking with a character they barely know who's giving them a plot hook that's just a little bit too in your face.
>Wondering if they're going to take it or decide to turn things around and just go off on their own.
>'Hey, what if we just fucked off and did X?'
>Smile excitedly behind the screen, getting my notes ready.
>'Nah, I'm pretty sure he wants us to go here.'
>Respond that they are genuinely free to do whatever they want and whatever their characters would do.
>'Yeah, but we'll see this guy's offer through.'
>Variations of this happen repeatedly.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO STAY ON THE RAILS, JUST DO WHATEVER THE FUCK YOU WANT, I'VE PLANNED FOR ALL SORTS OF CRAZY BULLSHIT10/10 group though.
>Running a campaign
>Difficult to arrange sessions due to commitments
>Have sometimes gone months without a session
>Trying to organise next one, it's like bashing my head against the wall
>Secretly suspect my players just hate me GMing, despite that they say
>>47472850
What game was it anon, and what about it did they hate? I'm really interested in hearing more.
>>47464191
That's fine: I personally like illusion to be useful, so I hope that when (if) the players use it intelligently you give the opposition a small debuff to Will saves to compensate for the fact that Illusion, otherwise, regularly gets fucked by Will saves normally being high enough to render the entire field useless.
>Describe scene/situation to players
>They latch on to some random detail i just threw in for flavor, and overthink it to the point where they convince themselves it's relevant and a real plot hook
>Have to pull the entire next 3 sessions out of my ass because I don't want to run them running in circles wasting their time.
I'm seriously considering making all of my dungeons straight lines because my players cannot choose which way to go without talking about it for 20 minutes or more.
This thread cant be dead!!! I thought I had finally found home
>>47454934
>tfw your group went their separate ways five years ago
>>47454934
>be me
>want to play some RPG
>our last campaign died about a month ago
>whelp guess I'll DM
>set up homebrew world
>everyone is hype
>get a message today
>one of the guys from the group "yeah sorry man. I really don't want to play with anyone out of this group but you and x so I won't be joining".
>realize he's right.
>There's only one person left in the group that isn't in some way unpleasant to play with.
>Y always plays gimmicky characters and does incredibly stupid and nonsensical shit IC.
>Z is weird. He has played RPGs the longest out of all of us and I feel like he has this specific idea about his character and roleplay and always gets pissy when people fool around in any way that detriments his character. Calling him "edgy" jokingly or not following his IC advice.
>Overall he often pushes way too hard into DM territory by saying "X should totally do Y right now" or "that should work like this". But not in the constructive criticism way but the entitled demand kind.
>W is a friend of mine but he -always- want to play a high stealth character that isn't even part of the party and just tags along fucking with them outside of fights but "sneakily" helping them during fights. Or he just completely splits.
>X is the only decent guy left. He RP's well, is super friendly, non-demanding, interactive and always hyped for games.
>that feel when you went through all the trouble to build a super neat world and story and the party kills the hype for you as a DM.
>>47472597
What the fuck did they commission?
>>47472826
Yeah, Corruption of Champions did that to my DMing too, though my players were totally up for it.
>>47479416
There's a sci-fi "sequel" of that by the way.
>>47479608
I've played a bit of it. Still not totally into it, but I'm sure I'll... come... around?
>players interrogate a captured enemy
>they succeed, get some useful info off him
>proceed to interrogate him for the rest of the real life hour with more and more imaginative and escalating methods of torture and intimidation as they absolutely refuse to believe he really doesn't know every detail of the BBEG's plan
Fuck's sake
Next game, the BBEG makes it a point to cut off the tongues of his illiterate minions.
>>47467622
thats some deep mary-sue shit right there
>>47467622
>a vampire wife
This is the point where you ask him why he's not either a thrall or a vampire sired by her himself.
>>47475218
dragon age deep roads campaign go.
>>47480017
>>47467622
To play devil's advocate, all of sword&sorcery is heavily overdressed. It is a loud, garish, self-indulgent genre and people call it "fantasy" for a reason.
I don't quite think that half-vampire catgirl angels belong in sword&sorcery, but I also don't think they're THAT different from half-ogre spiked chain brawlers or half-elfish sacred wizard bowmen, it's just a matter of taste.
>>47480313
just for the sake of conversation my taste is surprisingly bland tho (comparatively to all that). When i attempt to dm a game its usually in a all human world with little influence from other sentient races, as humanity has usually risen so high to pretty much wipe them out. Instead of that, my stories usually focus on vast conflicts between nations in which the players are a very small part of, and they can go anywhere they want but events will happen with or without them. Monsters still threaten outreaching towns and live in the deep places of the planet, but there is heavy Mary-sue in the games i try to run.
>>47480470
edit: there is little Mary-sue in games i try to run
>rotating DM group using one setting
>when it gets to me, I go whole hog and really build up the world which at the time was only a dungeon, a town and a forest
>everyone is excited, and loved my campaign
>get stuck DMing for the next two years
>someone else finally takes the reins
>adds airships
>adds pirates
>adds flintlock pistols, when I had established that gunpowder was only known to one kingdom, which is now dead and the only remaining gun ever found was like a thigh-sized canon on a stick
>takes a cool sword I gave to one the players, which I thought was really unique and cool (it had a fire enchantment, but instead of just being on fire, it turned white hot like it had just come from a forge), and not only turned it into a generic flaming sword, but made it deal d20 damage
>d20
>adds stupid tree-house elves
I decided that they couldn't use my setting anymore when they DM.
>players complain they never get to really roleplay and do hero stuff, just end up as CN-NE murderhobos
>Me(the fool): "I can run a hero game"
>game day
>"Is it cool if I play an evil character"
>"My character just wants wenches, gold, and fights"
>aw shit
>group ends up as CN-NE murderhobos again
>contemplate ending it, but they're having fun
>>47455771
>make players set goals
>instead of accomplishing them in downtime, sit around and twiddle fingers until [monster] attacks
>>47463345
I just started DMing and I had the same problem as you did. Just try it dude, I ended up trying it with my 4 friends and they ended up having a blast that they are always asking me when next session is (Everyone has weird schedules). If no one is interested or if you can't get the time at least you tryed right?
>>47472100
I'd continue with the peasant and write the peasants backstory, first session was clearly the turning point in his mundane life that set him on to becoming an adventurer.
I recently found out that one of my players, Greg, was being cheated on by his girlfriend. I figured the moral thing to do would be to let him know. The exchange went something like this.
>"I tell the guard that we're here to take over his shift on the watch"
>"Okay, roll bluff."
>He rolls a somewhat high number, 15 or something
>fudge some rolls
>"Oh, bad luck, man, the guard got a nat 20 on his insight roll!"
>"The guard looks down to the ground, then up to your eyes and says "I..... I think Greg's girlfriend is cheating on him.""
>Greg just gives him this open-mouthed look (see pic) and then walks out of the room
>Have to call the session there
Why are players always so fucking unappreciative?
>>47480681
They didn't really understand worldbuilding until they saw you do it and then after you did it one of them wanted to try it too. He was just trying to be awesome like you.
>>47480470
>>47480493
That sounds cool! So you have more right to call sue than most GMs. I like wahoo-over-the-top action fantasy where everyone turns into legendary heroes, and I would still cringe at the character you described, but I'm in no place to call it a sue.
I think the moral of the story here is that you should never GM for players that view your game of choice as "something neat to try". I have long since learned to only DM for people that have a genuine interest in playing the game and I suggest you all do the same. If people want an game to casually socialize around tell them to find a board game instead of an RPG.
> "Hey, can I homebrew this part of my character?"
1.
> "Refluff an existing mechanic, but if that's impossible then write something up and I'll check it out"
> "100% homebrew"
> [Hours of research to check balance] "No."
> "Why not?"
> [Hours of typing out reasons, researching alternatives] "You could refluff this thing, take that feat and it's legal and balanced"
> "Can I change this completely different mechanic for my character?"
> GO TO 1
>>47481995
>things_that_never_happened.jpeg
>>47483061
Or just don't try to do epic story-driven campaigns? One shots are better, or emergent narrative games where the story revolves around a place rather than a specific set of characters. Or even a troupe game, where you have set characters, but the "actors" who play them can change from week to week.
>>47483104
I actually did something like that for a short while. Had a party of 9 people where people moved in and out depending on their ever changing work schedules. Their characters were all a part of some guild they formed and they just took a new mission every week then just returned home when the job was done. It made adventures super easy to do since they were mostly self contained stories and everyone still had good fun.
>We find a game we want to play
>I as Forever-DM say I'll run it
>Everyone's hype
>Nobody ever turns in their sheets despite constant reminders
>Everyone lose interest
>"Why do we never play, GM?"
>>47483227
Similar thing happened the last time I volunteered to DM at some game shop in my area. It was my friend and four of his classmates from university and I told them a specific date and time two weeks in advance so we can start. Game day shows up and nobody has anything done. Not a single person. Spent the first night holding everyone's hands so they can get their characters started. All they had left to do was background stuff and picking spells, so I schedule another night a week from then. Game day arrives and only one person did what I asked so I just told them I no longer want to do this for them.
If you don't try for me, I won't try for you. Easy.
>>47483319
Well, they want to play, they just don't want to do homework for it. You can bitch about "casuals" and have no game, or you can adapt to their busy lives and pick a system where they don't need to do all that shit, and can just show up, make characters quickly, and go.
There's a lot of modern RPGs that support this kind of pick-up-and-go play style, too. Older RPGs (90s stuff mainly) used to be aimed at math nerds who love doing math, and GMs who wanted to spend ten hours every week in planning, but those kind of people are rare, and making those guys the primary target audience is one reason the RPG market has nearly imploded several times now.
>>47455849
ASCEND THEM INTO DAEMONHOOD FOR THEIR GREAT SERVICES TO CHAOS GODS!
>>47456306
They can attempt to fight it anyway. Remember the greentext where a lvl1 bard played Home Alone with BBEG giant and won by crushing stairs on him?
If it ends in TPK tho, one might want to pull a "more lawful than evil" reanimation lich from da sleeve.
>>47483460
Nigger, I'd rather not have a game then have those bitchass motherfuckers not lifting a fucking finger to do the very simple shit I ask of them.
>>47458755
Planning the world and NPCs is good. Planning player actions is fortune-telling that almost never guesses right.
>>47483460
Not the one you're replying to but if they wanted to pickup and go there are plenty of video games that would better suit them.
Ttrpgs are supposed to be collaborative. These players wanted to ignore the fact that people besides themselves have a life outside the game and expect the GM (who already does most of the job by default) to handle, not only his responsibility, but theirs as well.
If I can handle taking care of a newborn, shuttling my other two children between school and home and put in 10 hours on the construction site; (while working around the wife with an equally retarded schedule) and still find time to throw a campaign together, my players can manage a bit of "homework" in writing a few lines of backstory.
>>47465613
My group plays Saturday's.
I usually work every other Saturday, but after DnD ends. It usually works perfectly.
However, I sometimes get asked to come into work early. Someone might have gone on holidays, or there's more work than we've accounted for or what have you.
If you think that I'm gonna turn down that cash, and the offer of more shifts, you're wrong.
It's not something I can account around, as I only find out a couple days in advance.
It's not common, so it isn't something worth rescheduling on a regular basis around etc.
Shit happens.
>>47473641
Let's just say we had a really bad time.
>>47483460
If their lives are so busy that they can't spare a couple hours to finish a character sheet and learn the game then they should either let the GM know so he can help or find a new hobby.
>dming for the first time.
>Try to make a linearish fallout campaign
>The party constantly make decisions that lead to content I have not prepared. have a hard time keeping the plot linear.
>constantly making new maps.
>basically force the players to go with my finally
>make terrible gameplay decisions.
>all the players think the ending's shit.
what a learning experience.
