>The family of the man who invented the AR-15 assault rifle says he never intended for the weapon to be used by civilians.
>“Our father, Eugene Stoner, designed the AR-15 and subsequent M-16 as a military weapon to give our soldiers an advantage over the AK-47,” the Stoner family told NBC News in a statement late Wednesday.
>Stoner, who designed the AR-15 and the M-16 in the 1950s, died of cancer in April 1997. He was 74.“He died long before any mass shootings occurred,” the family said. “But we do think he would have been horrified and sickened as anyone, if not more by these events.”According to his New York Times obituary, Stoner, a Marine veteran, had the idea “to develop a rifle that would fire repeatedly with a single pull of the trigger” because because military studies showed that soldiers “under the pressure of combat … were not pulling the trigger on the weapons.”
>He designed the original AR-15 — and a .223 caliber bullet capable of piercing a metal helmet at a distance of 500 yards — in his garage.Stoner, an avid hunter, was then contracted by the U.S. Army for his work developing the automatic rifle, which was renamed the M-16 for the battlefield. But family members said he never fathomed they’d be used by citizens to kill.“After many conversations with him, we feel his intent was that he designed it as a military rifle,” Stoner’s family said. “[He] focused on making the most efficient and superior rifle possible for the military.”
https://www.yahoo.com/news/ar-15-inventor-never-intended-000000114.html
If Stoner had such strong feelings about who should and should not use his rifle then he probably shouldn't have licensed it out to Colt
The family that got rich by selling the AR to civilians now says the AR was never meant for civilians.
>>77581761
>implying his opinion matters
the second amendment is written to ensure all civilians' armaments be equal to that of any soldier.
>>77581995
actually that was colt, not armalite.
https://www.americanrifleman.org/articles/2014/2/27/the-first-colt-ar-15-rifle/
>>77581761
>Intended
That's great and all...
>>77581761
Oh wow the left talking for a dead Man. Just like using all those victims to push their agenda. Absolutely disgusting.
>>77582254
>"the people"
meaning the people of the militia, yes, not the general populace
vague wording is vague
I like how they try to work up this perception that a .223 caliber bullet is huge or something
>>77581761
p.s. the rifle he developed for adoption as the M16 was also meant to replace the much more lethal and effective M14 (partly because soldiers were having difficulty controlling automatic fire, negating the effectiveness of the weapon).
he did you a fucking favor.
aimed semiautomatic fire from a .308 rifle is a death sentence out to 100 yards even in the hands of a complete fucking moron. most DMs can hit those 600-700 yard shots cold, with just a little extra training beyond that of the rest of the infantry. why even walk into a club? you can be two blocks away and kill half a dozen people before any of them even know what's happening. these raghead shooters actually walk right up within stabbing distance where you can get them instantly; the only reason these tragedies are so gruesome is that nobody fights back because you're all a bunch of anti-gun pussies who literally gather together and dare them to come at you.
>>77582562
>this fucking chump
>every time
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/10/311
>>77582562'
Militia Act of 1903
"every able-bodied man of at least 17 and under 45 years of age who is not a member of the National Guard or Naval Militia"
It would be pretty shit if a civilian ever needed such a thing.
But we sure have them :-DDDD
>>77582562
>ends bait post with reddit tier meme
every time
Last I checked, the AR was on civilian market before the military picked it up.
>>77581761
AK was meant for civilian use.
>>77582803
he can't explain how the framers of the constitution wrote the militia into it with an amendment, 114 years before the creation of the national guard
don't bother
>>77581761
Well he kind of has a point. Select fire weaponry is actually pretty impractical for civilian uses. The simi automatic version that was purpose built for civilian sale and use on the other hand is an excellent rifle for home defense, hunting medium size game and, sport and competition shooting. Probably one of the best for.
>>77581761
And you know what else the AR family was intended to do?
Manufactured using a cnc machine with just about any common metal alloy, even stainless steel.
This means that no matter what regulations are passed, people will still be able to make them in basements
>>77582974
Kalalnikov really got it righ with the 47. It's like the Toyota Helix of guns.
>>77581761
>1997
>“He died long before any mass shootings occurred."
Jews will literally re-write history to fit their agenda, and not a single goy will call them out on it... because that's anti-semitic. :^)
>21 killed, 19 wounded: San Ysidro, Calif. - JULY 18, 1984
>14 killed, 6 wounded: Edmond, Okla. - AUG. 20, 1986
>10 killed, 4 wounded: Jacksonville, Fla. - JUNE 18, 1990
>22 killed, 20 wounded: Killeen, Texas - OCT. 16, 1991
At least your gun designers aren't treated as badly as ours
>>77581761
THE RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS
SHALL
It doesn't matter what the intentions of the designer are. If you want an excellent essay on this subject, see here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Death_of_the_Author
>>77583125
Not impractical when the intended use is resisting a tyrant.
Keep in mind that there is no discussion of need or practicality in the context of the right to keep and bear arms.
>>77583125
Indeed, it's unlikely you're going to beat the high score with it set to full auto.
>>77581761
>this ID has only made a single post
Fuck you stoner assholes
AK-47 is better anyway
>>77581761
Stoner probably thought it was nice people liked his gun.
>>77582932
nope. it was designed and in preproduction and submitted for military review to see if it would meet the M16 specification a whole four years before colt put its first sporter on the market.
every single one of them was automatic. the AR-15 is an assault rifle whose semiautomatic variant has been wildly more successful.
obviously this is hindsight, but colt had from 1963 to 1986 to make and sell as many select fire rifles as they could and civilians just didn't want them that badly.
>>77581761
>But we do think he would have been horrified and sickened as anyone, if not more by these events
So they're full of shit and putting words in the hands of a dead man.
The AR15 has been sold to civilians both in full auto(this stopped in 86 thanks to that snake Reagan) and semiautomatic since 1963.
(((((((the family))))))))
>>77581761
He designed a shit weapon that would melt and or jam constantly. My uncles were alpha company and have told me the horror stories about when they first got those m-16's. Both of them against regulation used stolen ak-47s.
>>77583659
I have heard similar unkindly stories about the early days of the M16.
>>77582562
>meaning the people of the militia, yes, not the general populace
How?
I get that the schooling system is crap and you probably don't even know what the thing in that image is let alone being able to grasp the very clear and simple grammar of the second amendment but God damn.
Are you illiterate or being deliberately manipulative?
>>77581761
Obviously it was never "intended" for civilian use, but it will do just fine.
>>77583659
Wasn't there a big problem with a change in ammo right before it was deployed to the front lines?
You can't buy full auto rifles though, so its not really the same thing.
>>77581761
>>77582562
Hey faggot, you forgot
>the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed
>>77583750
I forgot the whole story about pre-deployment issues but I know from what my uncles said the gun was shit in vietnamese jungles. They said it was shit and constant issues with dirt in the gas system.
>>77583659
And not that the M1 is the same kind of thing, but I also heard some folks were keen to dump the M16 for an M1 just because at least it could get certain kinds of jobs done reliably.
>1 post by this id
Every time
>>77583576
>fire rifles as they could and civilians just didn't want them that badly.
Because of the NFA.
If that didn't exist the full auto variant would have been much more popular because it is the same price as any other regular AR.
The $200 tax stamp getting fingerprinted registering it and waiting 6-12 months is of course going to deter people from getting the giggle switch modles and opt for the semiautomatic versions.
>>77581761
>first AR15 sold to the civilian market in 1963
>died in 1997
He had 34 years to say that it was never intended for civilians but never did? Also there were mass shootings, see>>77583246
Also, the UT Austin guy killed a good amount of people as well in his shooting. This article reeks of Judaism
Pic related is an ad from around 1964
>>77583891
Yea my one uncle stashed his M1 before he got his hands on an ak.
>>77583125
the army only asked for the M16 in the first place because they determined, via study, that a field of automatic fire would be just as effective as aimed semi-automatic fire on the battlefield. this is incomprehensible to me. i don't think they were right. but i haven't read all the details.
even under the assertion that "civilian uses" includes militia overthrow of tyrannical government which _is_ armed with automatics and uses them "well," aimed semi-automatic fire wins.
no one is going to run-and-gun with the hessians at ranges of 50 feet like omar and the poopdicks. you always let a raid team in and take whatever they want, you don't resist. why would you? 20 of your friends will be waiting for some of them down the street from their homes at night. there's no hiding from an armed populace for which the legal penalty of owning a firearm is all but equal to that of using it in a robbery or a murder.
Reminder that the Orlando shooter did not use an AR-15.
>>77583659
This is due to the military switching powder and not even issuing cleaning kits to soldiers telling them "this huur future raffle don't eben need cleaning"
Once cleaning kits were issued these problems all but vanished.
And they've since been completely eliminated with minor improvements to the design. Well about as far as a mechanical device can get and still be a practical tool to issue to soldiers.
Vids related
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=DX73uXs3xGU
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YAneTFiz5WU
>>77583906
well yes, the law was the operant component in that equation. i'm saying, people chose not to change those laws in order to liberate the funs. the '34 NFA was amended by the '68 GCA to create the title 2 weapons classification, and nobody saw fit to stash a bunch. then in '86 the FOPA wrecked the market even more. people didn't tell their representatives the right thing, enough times.
>>77583750
The gunpowder was switched to a dirtier, cheaper version than what was intended.
>>77583439
>>77583905
Can someone explain this shitty meme?
>>77584023
reminder that the only reason the sig sauer MCX exists is so that sig can lock you into a platform that's similar to the AR-15 and you buy more of their shit, both weapons remain operationally identical
rip sig, don't buy new, buy your p220 on gunbroker, look for the west german stamp
HOLLLLYYYY SHITTTTT
Why the fuck will people not stop talking about the Armalite-15?
It's just a populat semi-auto rifle. I understand complaining about semi-automatic rifles but why this obsession over banning specifically the armalite-15? Is it really that "scary" looking that it pushes the propaganda agenda in a way an AK or SKS or any other semi-auto cant?
>>77583706
Stories about rusting barrels and holding up miserably under jungle use in Vietnam were pretty commonplace growing up in the 90s when it felt like there were more Vietnam vets around to bitch about the early M16s being utter POS's.
I think all the utter horror stories i heard in the 90's cultivated my distaste for the gun, especially during those Brady Bill years when I started shooting, back where nobody could buy new ones anyways.
AR's really seem to have gotten a second wind from Iraq II and all the post-9/11 fellating of "the troops", and the fact that the AWB expired in 2004, in the heat of that culture, is to me the main reason for its explosive popularity over the past 10 years or so.
Me, I learned to shoot on Anschutz diopter-sight match .22s and M1 Garland's.
.223 is a great round for introducing your girlfriend to high power shooting, and a pretty decent round for teaching your 11 year-old to hunt small game.
The idea that the AR-15 can be made out by the gun grabbers to be this no holds barred killing machine is hilarious, and part of me wants to see a mass shooter blowing limbs off with a PTR-1/AR-10/FAL, or blowing people in half with a .30-06 or 7.62x54, just so people can see how harmless the AR-15 is.
>>77584184
Just saying if the internet existed at the time none of those laws would have passed.
They didn't pass due to popular demand they passed under the radar with little knowledge from the population.
Imagine if the only news the entire nation got was from.news papers the radio and television?
And look at what the media is pushing right now but imagine there was zero opposition to it in the form of media.
>>77584238
The OP is spamming this shit and leaving it while you chucklefucks reply to it over and over again.
>>77584287
>both weapons remain operationally identical
No they aren't.
The MCX is much much closer to the AR180 in operation.
The only interchangeable parts is the lower receiver and trigger group.
Everything else works entirely differently even compared to a piston AR
>>77584343
>shooting garlands
Anon, c'mon now, lets not get this website v&
>>77584304
this is exactly what happens when there's a mass shooting. people flipped their shit over the bushmaster company when the DC sniper's rifle was finally in LEO hands. same-same.
ignore it. nothing will change. trump won't enforce obama's new FFL edict.
>>77581761
And Kalashnikov lamented the fact that the AK47 became so popular and widespread.
Tough shit.
>>77582562
<1 post by this ID
>>77582562
0/10
>>77584125
>not posting the best AR15 vid on youtube
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=BSizVpfqFtw
I love rewatching this everytime someone says the AR jams or is a shitty weapon etc
>>77584010
>the army only asked for the M16 in the first place because they determined, via study, that a field of automatic fire would be just as effective as aimed semi-automatic fire on the battlefield. this is incomprehensible to me. i don't think they were right. but i haven't read all the details.
iirc a lot of that was based off of combat studies of ww2 battles
they found that most engagements happened within 100 yards or so, thus accuracy beyond that isnt worth much
rate of fire was more important than accuracy
and having a hard hitting round was important too
The soviets did similar studies and found the same things to be true. Interestingly they went on to make the ak, which takes a different approach to the above lessons.
>>77584451
i didn't say "interchangeable parts" i said "operationally" identical.
that means both weapons, treated as a black box, do the same things for the shooter. there is a rail system. there is a pistol grip and a shoulder stock. there are a similar set of available calibers. and so on.
>>77581761
So? Einstein didn't contribute to physics so nuclear weapons could be developed, and look at what happened.
>>77584498
Both side by side are a must
Shooting an AR like that isn't exactly going to happen but tripping face first into a mud puddle is very likely as a soldier.
>>77584501
good to know.
iirc the AK is the way it is because production chains were more important than soldiers? almost anybody in russia could bang out an AK, its just folded metal. the AR requires milling machines. commies are eternally poor.
>>77581761
We don't care. Anti-gunners BTFO, shall not be infringed, let freedom ring.
>>77584343
>M1 Garland
>>77584125
All but vanished
>>77581761
>AR Makers
>The family of the man
What?
>>77583750
It's a finicky weapon, it builds up carbon around the blowback lines exhaust and star chamber which causes it to jam.
If I were as pathetic as /k/ and some of you the AR would be my weapon of choice for the simple reason that I know it inside and out. I could take it apart and put it back together blindfolded in a matter of seconds.. but that was when it was part of my job
I hope that Obama makes an attempt to issue a ban for it's civilian use, not that it would matter much, Hillary will surely make it happen once she enters office
>implying even if true that it matters
By the way the hearsay of relatives isn't evidence
>>77584400
Wouldn't bait reaction images be more effective?
>>77584560
So what's the difference between any guns?
>>77584721
Ebin
>>77581761
Who cares... this is old news. And as long as an AR-15 helps fight against a tyrannical government... then that's all that matters... because that's what the amendment was written for, to protect the other amendments, especially the first amendment.
>>77584630
Agreed, my video just gives me a bigger stiffy
>>77584560
>i said "operationally" identical.
Which is wrong from a mechanical standpoint considering they use entirely different operating systems to achieve semiautomatic fire.
By what you're saying every detachable box magazine semiautomatic rifle is the same operating system.
Pic1/2 related
>>77584575
Einstein wrote a letter to Roosevelt to get the Manhattan Project going.
>>77581761
>ar makers claim
>the maker is dead for almost 20 years
How can dead men claim something? You sure you haven't been huffing propaganda again?
>>77581761
Wow. The family of a dude who has been dead for 20 years said some shit.
I am now completely for infringing rights.
>>77581761
This was BTFO by /k/ last night.
>>77584885
Honestly, trying to look into why Truman got convinced to nuke Nippon was a pivotal point in me deciding to spend years reading books to try to figure out if this shit was serious or just tin foil.
>>77584864
The Sig MCX as much much more in common with the Ar18(0) than the AR15.
>>77581761
Fucking Cuck Rifle
EVERY GUN BY RIGHT IS FOR CIVILIAN USE. WE LET THE MILITARY USE THEM.
>>77584974
/Thread
>>77584630
There are also tests like that. The AR-15 is a dependable and accurate rifle. The design of the AR-15 has been changed quite a bit since Vietnam and the issues with it in that war were partially because of the fact that soldiers weren't properly trained with them.
>>77583905
Keyword. Can.
>>77581761
>died in 1997
>before any mass shootings
So clearly the gun has been in civilian use and has only recently become an issue. It's a problem with the people then, and not the weapon.
>>77581761
Sounds like they might have been asked leading questions by a hostile interviewer. Sure, it was initially designed for military use but I don't see any catagorical opposition to civilian ownership. And of course they have to say they feel bad about a massacre.
>AR Makers
>Family of the man
>"“But we do think..."
Into the trash it goes
This is nothing more than a man's cuck children attempting to get their 15 mins of fame by throwing their family in the trash.
This is the same kind of trash that melts their grandfathers 1911.
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rtFX3JBYsIg
>>77584023
Outside of catching the odd radio report, I stopped following the story after Sunday. What did he use?
DESU, I think the idea that a single man was able to kill 50 and injure 50 more is ridiculous regardless of what gun was used. Especially considering apparent survivors have multiple gun shot wounds. The time needed to do that doesnt add up to me. Maybe I just underestimate how completely helpless homosexuals and women are.
>>77581761
well guess ill just buy a Sig Sauer MCX instead
>>77584655
>iirc the AK is the way it is because production chains were more important than soldiers? almost anybody in russia could bang out an AK, its just folded metal. the AR requires milling machines. commies are eternally poor.
Sorta
But I would say that had more to do with the us and ussr taking very different lessons from the war with regards to production
The commies never had to deal with strategic bombing. So the AK can be massed produced for cheap with mostly stamped parts. However those metal stamping machines are large, power hungry and very heavy. You can only produce the ak economically on a large factory scale - something that is very much in line with soviet style economic planning. However those factories are a big target that can't be moved or dispersed effectively, meaning they will be knocked out easily in a war.
The US bombed the shit out of the germans and japs, and as such we were very interested in learning everything we could about the effects of our campaign. The germans had a good amount of success at dispersing their factories, and this is a lesson the US took to heart. So while using cnc machines were a really "high tech" means of production back when the stoner was new, it had the advantage of being hugely dispersalable. In theory anywhere with a cnc milling machine could become a gun foundry. And it was known then that these machines would become very common, as they are today. Short of killing just about everyone in the US you'll never be able to stop ar production here.
>>77584797
you mean like a pistol and a rifle?
i didn't say you were wrong. you're not. i'm talking about the end-user's wallet. you could buy an MCX and then have to pay sig more money later for upgrades. or, you could buy the cheapest lower receiver you can find, wait for sales, interchange parts when design revolutions occur, etc.
i got to make pic related in that post and all i needed was a new barrel for a rifle i had had for a decade.
>>77584304
Fuck you "not my AR-15" cucks. All you care is about your own rifle. You would like to see MCX and AK banned just so you could own yours for little longer. What a cuck.
>>77585021
>The design of the AR-15 has been changed quite a bit
You an still take any modern bolt carrier lower reciver or upper receiver and put it into any old Colt SP01
The biggest changes were the forward assist dustcover (which is a big change in terms of reliability) and various furniture changes retained take down pins.
But like we both said the issues seen were ue to soldiers not being trained to clean their rifles.
>>77581761
>Give the license to a privately owned company, Colt
>WOW GUIS LOOK EVEN THE DESIGNER WAS AGAINST IT.
>>77581995
They where with you only for your money.
>>77585187
I love how buttblasted they get about the increasing attempts at 3D printer guns.
God Bless the US of A.
>>77581761
The guy wasn't a civilian, he was a contractor and an ex cop, so...
>>77584864
a person picks up either one and one trigger pull equals one shot.
the AR-15 variant costs him $500 to $900 unless he really wants to splurge.
the MCX costs him $1600.
if he had bought that AR 30 years ago, he'd still be able, right now today, to put a timney drop-in trigger group into it, and national match sights on top, vastly improving his weapon. he didn't need to know that back then to take advantage of this today, and nothing special changes about the delivered capability. one trigger pull one shot. same with bolt carriers that are now made with fancy coatings. and so on.
MCX buyers are chumps and they probably all have iphones. sig will not keep up with innovation that takes place across dozens of manufacturers who are sticking to the AR-15 specs, i guarantee it.
>>77585233
I think he's just pointing out the hypocrisy and ridiculousness of the leftist position on the matter , m8
>>77584864
>every detachable box magazine semiautomatic rifle is the same operating system.
no, because the end-user buys magazines which have to marry the weapon. the AR-15 is STANAG and sig probably wisely stuck to that, too. but not every rifle is.
>>77584498
> when gun melted
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EwSJiAwoMpY
>>77581761
The guy was still designing guns into the 1990s, pretty sure he saw a lot of shootings and didn't give a single fuck.
>>77581761
> “But we do think he would have been"
Blank words that mean nothing.
>>77583160
except the AK is inaccurate as fuck. Its like the Sten of the gun world - cheaply made and its accuracy and bullet drop reflect that
>>77585447
>a person picks up either one and one trigger pull equals one shot.
>the AR-15 variant costs him $500 to $900 unless he really wants to splurge.
>the MCX costs him $1600.
Again you're shifting goalpost.
You made the claim that they used similar operating systems.
They just simply don't.
Make all the claims that ARs are more economical choice for semiautomatic centerfired rifle but any claims they work the same is idiotic and ignorant.
Just as ignorant as the media calling AR15s ina. Gun store full auto assault rifles
>>77585034
Exactly
It really wasn't much of a problem in the 90's
This issue is another byproduct of the times. Unfortunately the problem lies within the people more than the object in question
>>77585485
Why do you even care if they call it AR-15 then? If they ban MCX today, AR-15 will surely follow.
It is only good that they think it is AR-15, then they cannot ban rifles one-by-one.
>>77585447
>this is what poorfags tell themselves
whatever keeps you and your plastic toy sleeping at night :^)
>>77585517
>no, because the end-user buys magazines which have to marry the weapon. the AR-15 is STANAG and sig probably wisely stuck to that, too. but not every rifle is.
By that logic the tar21 x95 fs2000 Aug Scar keltec16 hk g53 etc etc are "the same operating system" moron
>>77585667
A Hilux isn't exactly a race car either. But it is a hell of a truck that just keeps going in spite of abuse.
>>77585830
>>77585517
>>77585447
And there are some important advantages the MCX operating system has over the AR.
One being gas blowback with suppressed fire
>>77581761
Yeah and many muskets the Americans used were probably meant for the queens military too, so what?
>>77581761
This shows exactly why such weapons shouldn't be available to the general public. They're called assault rifles and not defense rifles. They're designed for military purposes to kill large numbers of people very efficiently. /pol/ has no viable argument the inappropriateness of these guns for the general public.
Gun control now!
>>77583246
After carter flooded south florida with cubans and spics on his way out the door like obama is doing to the whole country, miami became the murder capital of the world in the early 80s. There were constant mass shooting with uzis and mac 10s or whatever. Now those have little practical use but i use my ar for target shooting and varmint hunting
>>77585867
There are just better choices out there, especially in the hands of semi-auto only users.
>>77586095
I don't disagree at all. But just like the Hilux was the truck of choice to ship to ISIS, the AK is still the cheap, readily available, and multi-purpose weapon of choice for arming the hordes.
>>77585447
>put a timney drop-in trigger group into it, and national match sights on top,
And btw since Sig decided to use the same trigger group and 1913 rails/keymod are a thing both an be done with the MCX so you're not making a point.
If only the military were allowed to use these weapons, and if there was any serious rule preventing use of the military on American soil except in the event of invasion we could ban assault weapons.
But they are in the hands of police, federal agencies, criminals, and millions of other citizens who are free to sell them, and from whom these weapons can be and have been stolen.
In the end I think we should support expanded background checks, but you don't just give that shit away free. In a compromise we need to receive something in return, and I think it should be a federal law against state and local regulation of and taxation on ammunition.
>>77581761
He was asked loaded questions and the interview was edited to suit journalists' needs.
http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/05/28/breaking-jim-sullivan-responds/
Of course barely anyone hears that, because the press is only interrested in left propaganda and they have no problem with blatantly lying.
>>77585964
"assault rifles" only differ in appearance to other semi auto wood frame mag fed rifles. There is literally no mechanical difference between even the scariest looking black metal frame and polymer stock rifle and an average wood frame rifle like a ruger 10/22.
You are just willfully ignorant or misinformed
>>77586587
>>77584697
>Garland
Fuck autocorrect and those Jews (and pooinloos) at google for not adding in God's own gun, the GarAND.
>>77581761
If you are going to talk about the origins of the ar15, at least have the decency to call it a Arma lite rifle.
OP doesn't know nothing about nothing.
>>77585739
i did not make that claim, i claimed they do the same things for the end-user. they are identical to the operator, operationally identical. the same in use. put buttstock in shoulder pocket, grip, pull trigger once, hold back, release, repeat
>>77585830
>autism
its not one feature, its the whole host of them, that matters. not internal parts nobody sees. end-users are not all as expert as us.
>>77585913
this is obtainble with .300 blackout in the AR platform. i even posted a picture of mine. i have no gas adjustment and do not need it.
>>77586217
yeah in that one case. you're right. but i was in a hurry.
you're still essentially telling me it's perfectly reasonable to buy a 2003 saab 9-3 because it has GM parts in it. only in this analogy, the whole rest of the world is driving hondas and even other brands with other manufacturers that use honda parts, and they've been doing it for 50 years specifically because the GM parts made for a shit car even when GM itself made it, and then GM spun off the new spec, but sold it to... honda.
not to mention the fact that the AR-180 "interchangeability" you're defending is primarily with the ultimate meme weapon, the bullpup. shilled harder on youtube than any other rifle because the jews happen to make one.
>it wasn't meant for mass killing
>what is My Lai Massacre for 100 Alex
People are such pussies nowadays.
>>77581761
The M16 has gotten more soldiers killed than all enemy tactics combined.
>>77581761
>the family of a dead man
>I think he would
>I think
Spotted the problem.
>>77585021
> The AR-15 is a dependable and accurate rifle.
Comparing to what?
It cant even penetrate cardboard: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10hrP6MQ1MY
> fighting in jungle
> fighting in city
> fighting against armored oponents
If you are a sniper, you better use Mosin Nagant. If you are an infantry, you need AK.
If you are self-defence, you need AGS-40 mounted on exoskeleton.
>>77585667
> AK is inaccurate as fuck
Got proofs? AK-74 please, single shots.
A private corporation's opinion on their product has absolutely no bearing on a government's ability to alienate the people from their rights.
The Supreme Court already decided this, weapons with non-military uses are banned under the 2nd.
>>77586980
Ok Ivan you're going a little overboard. But id have to agree the Ak family is far superior to the Ar family of guns
>>77581761
And then they removed burst and auto and now it's no different than almost any other civilian gas-recoil rifle.
What's the big deal? Is it because it's black and liberals are racists?
>>77583032
Sheeit. I like this.
>>77581761
>HIDE SHILL THREADS
>IGNORE SHILL POSTS
>DO NOT REPLY TO SHILL POSTERS
spread the word
>>77586866
>i did not make that claim
Now you're lying
>>77584287
>reminder that the only reason the sig sauer MCX exists is so that sig can lock you into a platform that's similar to the AR-15 and you buy more of their shit, both weapons remain operationally identical
Which is wrong
> the same in use. put buttstock in shoulder pocket, grip, pull trigger once, hold back, release, repeat
And again this logic makes everysingle box mag fed semiautomatic rifle the same to you.
>>77586866
>this is obtainble with .300 blackout in the AR platform.
No retard
Even in 300blk the Sig blows significantly less gas in the users face than any AR design.
You can watch side by side comparisons of this on YouTube.
> its not one feature, its the whole host of them, that matters. not internal parts nobody sees. end-users are not all as expert as us.
More goalpost shifting and projecting your own bullshit onto other people.
> not to mention the fact that the AR-180 "interchangeability" you're defending is primarily with the ultimate meme weapon,
No retard it is basic mechanical engineering.
From.an engineering standpoint the MCX is a close cousin to the AR180.
>After many conversations with him, we feel his intent was that he designed it as a military rifle
So Stoner didn't even say that.
>>77585964
>ID
>GAY
>>77586210
Yeah, I agree
>>77586980
>you better use Mosin Nagant
Know how I know you're shitposting?
You an buy bargain price bolt guns for $50 more than a mosin already drilled and tapped for scope mounts and capable of significantly better accuracy
>>77587118
And it`s for civilian use too.
>>77581761
>Dead guy talking
More like liberal opportunists talking who know the dead guy can't argue back.
>>77587443
> capable
You are doing it again.
>>77587467
The rate of fire is choice as well. No need to blatatatatat all your ammunition out before you can think. Instead,
DUN DUN DUN DUN DUN DUN
DUN DUN DUN
DUN DUN DUN DUN
DUN DUN
DUN DUN DUN DUN DUN
>>77587443
You should state that they do shoot a better MOA versus a surplus rifle with terrible tolerances. Otherwise, as the Russian guy mentioned, you add in "capable" and your whole point goes out the window
BTW - fuck you Russia, keep sending your women over here on school/work permits and I will keep plowing them while they rotate out every 6 months and fresh ones roll back in
>>77587118
Depends on use
AR15 is a superior military rifle today and the AK is a superior survivalist rifle.
There is a reason nearly every single special operations unit in the world that gets to choose their rifles choose the AR.
Even the god damn norks special forces have been caught using it.
It is faster more precise and more ergonomic and most importantly more modular.
More reliable with regular maintenance(AK is easier to maintain which is why it is superior survivalist rifle) as well
>>77581761
You know Mr.Stoner was still alive when they began selling them to civilians right? Straight from his company Armalite as well? His family is full of fucking shit, they should be ashamed for shitting on their father's work. Also fuck you OP you're a giant faggot.
>>77587887
And if you're not poor, then you get both and others.
Then you can make good use of whatever very common rounds you have at hand.
>>77587803
>add in "capable" and your whole point goes out the window
Not at all
Modern production hunting rifles have more mechanical inherent accuracy than comparable mosins.
Which were also one of the worst bolt action designs of the world wars.
The Mauser action is mechanically superior in every way.
And this is from someone who loves mosins and doesn't own any other bolt guns.
>>77585447
Don't really need improved trigger groups and sights to shoot defenseless fish in a barrel.
>>77587887
Should mention that military 5.45 is ballistically a superior round than military 556 loads
>>77581761
>He designed the original AR-15 — and a .223 caliber bullet capable of piercing a metal helmet at a distance of 500 yards
The "original" AR was 7.62x51 you stupid cuck, it was only after years of bureaucracy - and a prototype barrel exploding during military trials - that they asked for a 5.56 prototype.
>>77584458
Kalashnikov "inventing" the AK-47 was almost certainly Soviet propaganda anyway, it's much more likely it was actually designed by captured Nazi engineers after the war.
>>77581761
>.“He died long before any mass shootings occurred,”
Charles Whitman says Hi and go fuck yourself.
Mikhail never intended the AK to be used for anything but the protection of the Soviet Union either.
I also doubt that Einstein liked his discovery to be used as a WMD either. But here we are in a world where sandniggers use AK's to kill each other and we nuked a nation twice.
Besides Eugene has been dead for decades so we can't exactly ask him.
AK is a copy of the STG-44. Look at them side by side. If anything they captured an early STG-44 and copied it using stamping
>Didn't want it to be put in civilian hands
>Sold his design to a company known for providing guns for the civilian market for over a century
>>77589301
The AK-47 borrows more from American guns than German, such as the M1 Garand.
The contemporary AR-15 is literally the civilian version of the M16. More importantly, the political opinions of the original engineer are irrelevant.
More importantly than THAT, he didn't think that civilians shouldn't have it, that's just how his retard children are interpreting his talks about military usage.
But EVEN MORE IMPORTANTLY, even if he was a hypocrite who made an auto loading rifle in his garage but didn't think civilians should have them, the fact that he was able to build a gas impingement rifle in his garage in the fucking 50s shows the futility of trying to ban them
>>77582562
>Framers use the word militia in introductory clause.
>Framers deliberately use different word in operative clause.
>"It also means militia"
Good try, faggot.
>>77589301
The aesthetics may be similar but the mechanism is different
>>77581761
Oh fucking well. They're in our hands now.
Velcro and the GPS were never designed with civilian use in mind.
>>77590157
GPS was. It was intentionally left imprecise via encryption so that the military would have a leg up on whoever else might hijack the signals.
>died of cancer in April 1997. He was 74.“He died long before any mass shootings occurred,”
so the 2nd amendment wasnt a thing until after 1997? why is it a problem now all of a sudden?
>>77589902
Well, you see
They brought 4 German firearm designers in and the result is the AK-47. Schmeisser who made the MP-28 and STG-44, Horn who was working on an easy to make/use rifle, Barnitzke, the designer at Gustloff, VG1-5, and one of Barnitzke’s assistants
So yeah. It was a German creation and they slapped Mihail's name on it.
hurrdurr computers were intended to be only used for war, EVERYONE MUST STOP USING COMPUTERS NOW
#NotAllMuslims
This story is weeks old, and the maker clarified that he was misrepresented by editing done after the interview
>>77587940
Nice AR. Mine is similar except I have an EOTECH red dot and a foregrip on it. It's a basic bitch Magpul setup but I fucking love it.
Can anyone answer me what gives military more of a right to own and use a gun specifically to kill people? Only because people, who we've presumably voted into office, decide that someone, somewhere in another country, needs to die. There's still the six degrees of murder if elected officials go to war. So what makes it so different if I use it to kill someone here, rather than some 18 year old kid, who went through "training" with a drill sergeant yelling at him, so now they have carte blanche and can shoot anyone they deem necessary. We're just cutting out the middle-man.
>>77581761
They make residuals on all AR style weapons. Time to stop buying that piece of shit direct impingement dirty chamber joke of a gun.
>>77581761
>AR 15 Makers (manufacturers)
>Article says inventor
>>77590751
Well, you're supposed to have like a Declaration of War and all that sort of old fashioned stuff in order to provide a different legal structure. Nowadays we just do treason and war crimes and seek authority from foreign bodies like NATO and the UN so we can blame them.
Almost a little bit Jewish, cliche as that might sound.
>>77590773
Just pull the bolt out and grease it once in a while you stupid fuck.
>>77582192
Should you also have the right to tanks and grenades then?
>>77591322
It's not really about having a right or not.
I mean there's nothing stopping a grand jury from fucking your shit up if you piss people off, or getting arrested for reckless endangerment, gross negligence, or even disorderly conduct. There's no need to argue whether or not you have a "right" to military equipment.
>>77591322
HELL YES
Except then we would need police on-par with such. Just in case of a mass shooting... With a tank.
Huh. Really makes you think.
Guess they better return all of that money from civilian purchases.
>>77591322
>Tanks
>grenades
>illegal to own
You fucked up, Aquafresh.
If semi-auto rifles are banned, expect a slippery slope. The left will stop at nothing to completely eviscerate the 2nd amendment.
>>77591322
We do
>>77583954
>less than $200
Those were the days.
>>77581761
>“He died long before any mass shootings occurred,” the family said. “But we do think
aaaand saged
>>77591322
Live grenades are illegal, but you can own a tank (owning ammunition for the tank is probably illegal though).
>>77591322
>mfw still no BTR 80
Two things
A. Does this create a market for me to create an easy to use civilian grade assault rifle?
B. Who paid him?
Liberals are so fucking retarded I'm getting sick of it.
>>77581761
>https://www.yahoo.com/news/ar-15-inventor-never-intended-000000114.html
WOW they are flat out lying now, the original AR was marketing as a sporting rifle.
For civilians.
But this was in a time before we had this liberal mental illness disease.
>>77592223
The tank has to be registered if it's gun works and is over 0.5" in diameter
>>77591631
Why not simply remove the 2nd amendment entirely.
It is just an "amendement"; it was a change of the original Constitution.
>>77592406
>Liberals are so fucking retarded I'm getting sick of it.
This.
>>77581761
>The family of the man [...] says
sage
>>77581761
>the Stoner family told
>the Stoner family
>the Stoner
>Stoner
I see what the real problem is here
>People often ask me how I feel about my invention being used to kill people every day and the AK being a common weapon of ethnic conflicts. I want to make it clear that I created my assault rifle to protect my country. You can blame politicians for its spreading out of control on a global scale.
-- Mikhail Kalashnikov, inventor of the AK-47
>>77592625
Because nobody would agree to the Constitution until after the first 10 amendments ("Bill of Rights") were tacked on to limit the power of the brand new federal government.
Didn't really want to have to make a federal government, but it was too much anarchy without one to fight off the British Empire effectively.
>>77581761
When it comes to fighting a tyrannical government, there is no civilian distinction.
>>77591322
>should
Irrelevant as the Stoner family's opinions. We do.
>>77583817
And that's even missing countries like Venezuela with scarce legal gun ownership and extremely high violence and homicides towards unarmed civilians.
>family says
>not the maker himself
Fuck off
>>77581761
sage shill threads, do not reply to shill posters
>>77581761
You obviously don't recognize blatant propaganda when you see it. You are either intellectually dishonest or dangerously stupid.
>>77592822
Well, the amendment does say only a "well regulated militia"has the right to bare arms. It does not say individuals unaffiliated to any militia have a right.
Didnt a co-designer of the AR-15 say a while back that he was surprised how popular the gun had become on the civlian market? Everyone was acting like he said "HE DIDNT MAKE IT FOR THE CIVILIANS REEEEEEEE" when he never said that at all.
>>77581761
Big Government will have the authority to murder civilians who stand in the way of their international war games long after you can't even carry a pocket knife or pepper spray for protection.
The also get Planet Killer Nukes, Bombers, Tanks, Real Machine Guns for every solider if they want them so equipped, rocket launchers, grenades, microwave weapons, laser weapons, etc.
And you are crying about civilians having on shot per trigger pull rifles.
Your priorities are not very straight, unless you seek a left wing Dictatorship. Which is almost certainly what you seek.
>>77581761
Yes, it isn't meant for citizens because citizens don't have full rights under the ***second constitution*** of the "United States"...whereas it is meant for the people of a republic who's laws are dictated by the ***ORIGINAL CONSTITUTION*** of the "United States of America." You people aren't even truly free and you gloat about it...y'all disgust me.
SHALL
>>77586980
Sounds like the perfect round for home defense.
>>77593403
Try reading it again(((((((((((((((((,))))))))))))))))))) my friend.
>>77593403
Read Militia Act of 1903.
>>77581761
>had the idea “to develop a rifle that would fire repeatedly with a single pull of the trigger” because because military studies showed that soldiers “under the pressure of combat … were not pulling the trigger on the weapons.”
BULLFUCKINGSHIT, this doesn't even make sense.
>>77583577
Why did Reagan ban full-auto? I thought he was the most right-wing President who ever lived?
Can you even kill anyone with a .223 caliber bullet?
>>77581980
>“He died long before any mass shootings occurred”
>1997
>>77581761
Because I'm sure the faggot children know best what he wanted. It's not like he, a civilian, built one in his own garage for personal use or anything.
>>77593403
Too bad the Supreme Court shot this down with DC vs. Heller and McDonald v. Chicago
Gun grabbers go away
>>77581761
First of all, the man who invented the AR 15 is deceased.
The people this article quotes is the FAMILY of Eugene Stoner. They did not invent the gun and probably know nothing about the industry other than it made them a shitzillion dollars, which they live comfortably off of now. The AR 15 first entered the CIVILIAN market, and was not adopted by the military until later.
If they have such a problem with the AR 15, maybe they should refund the money they inherited from Stoner's legacy. No? Then fuck off and quit whining about something they didn't even create.
>>77593577
No, it's designed to wound
:^)
>>77593403
It's a legal structure of what we call "negative rights." The founding documents don't say what rights we have. The founding documents say that the government is only allowed to do this, that and the other (usually things like being responsible to guard our rights).
It's illegal for the government to overstep those boundaries, or at least it's left to state, local, and private agreements.
>>77593714
kek
When you kill your enemies, they win.
>>77581761
>The family of the man says so
Yeah sure.
Also
>Supreme Court has ruled that the government cannot ban any specific class of firearm
>Has ruled that there is an individual right to own, that the Militia Act is valid, and that through the 14th amendment, this right applies to everyone
>Has ruled that that the government cannot restrict what arms are available to the public based solely on their use by the military
Any attempt to keep pushing this will lead to nowhere, any attempt to start a constitutional convention will fail and will just only consist of painful whining.
>>77593568
>I thought he was the most right-wing President who ever lived?
That's just a meme. Reagan was the original cuckservative.
>>77593976
This. Culturally he was a feel good president but policy wise he wasn't good.
>>77593433
TL;DR btw op
>>77591322
You can already buy tanks.
They're legal to own but you aren't allowed to drive them on public roads.
http://www.mortarinvestments.eu/
>>77593568
You're thinking of Nixon.
>>77594131
You're allowed to drive them on public roads here but you have to take the treads off and get wheels for it or street-treads simply because normal tank treads fuck up streets instantly.
>>77594401
Nixon wasn't really right-wing either (department of energy, price controls, etc.). Coolidge was probably the last actual conservative we had as POTUS.
>>77594445
yeah but what's the police going to do about it if you drive on the public road anyway?
>>77594528
He was right-wing in spirit. Nixon was a pretty good president actually I wish liberals would stop their Bill Nye-tier meme shit about him being evil.
>>77594565
Ask you not to. They really can't do shit without calling in the national guard.
>>77593403
>Well, the amendment does say only a "well regulated militia"has the right to bare arms.
No, it doesn't. Have you even read it ever? It says 'a well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state'
>It does not say individuals unaffiliated to any militia have a right.
It says 'the right of the People to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed'.. It literally doesn't get much more explicit than that. I don't even know how you would read a right for militias in this, but not citizens. It basically says: We need militias, so the right of the people to have weapons cannot be infringed.
Because what good is a militia (aka: armed citizens that get together to protect their country/community) if the people that make up the militia do not have acces to weapons?
>>77581761
>"It was never intended for civilian use."
>allows it to be sold to civilians
The only people that are BTFO here are the AR Makers for admitting that they weren't meant for civilians, therefore opening themselves up to lawsuits.
>>77594528
>department of energy
EPA actually whatever.
>>77594657
>He was right-wing in spirit. Nixon was a pretty good president actually I wish liberals would stop their Bill Nye-tier meme shit about him being evil.
I would agree with that. He was a moderate like Eisenhower. Definitely one of the better modern presidents.
>>77582562
>every other amendment intended to protect individual freedom
>except this one, this one is meant to ensure that the govt can arm itself
>because y'know, all govts don't already do that
Yeah that makes a lot of sense, fucking anti-2As have to jump through such mental gymnastics to justify their tyranny.
>>77592811
Was he a midget?
>>77594745
We also got Nixon on tape talking about what a nutjob Kissinger was and how he didn't like the faggotry in SF or Bohemian Grove.
He was less than perfect, and as far as I gauge it didn't really understand what was going on with closing the gold window, but at least his heart was in the right place.
>>77594445
they make rubber padded tank treads for road use
AR-15 is the most casual gun.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ttMuvmspa8o
>>77581980
nobody can resist the Internal Jew
>>77594731
>AR makers
damn that's going to be a lot of lawsuits.
wait if those are kids of his, then are they willing to return all the money Stoner made selling the gun to everybody?
I remember him getting $1 per sold rifle including the ones sold to the public.
>>77581761
>Our father
Shut the fuck up you brats. Isn't it enough that you faggots dance on the graves of murder victims, now you do it on the grave of your own father? I hope every single one of you gets caught up in the next terrorist attack just so we don't have to listen to your exploitative drivel anymore you fucking wastes of breath
>>“Our father, Eugene Stoner, designed the AR-15 and subsequent M-16 as a military weapon to give our soldiers an advantage over the AK-47,” the Stoner family told NBC News in a statement late Wednesday.
> M-16 as a military weapon to give our soldiers an advantage over the AK-47
>advantage over the AK-47
What a badass. Read his obit.
>>77595290
Russiaboo detected.
>>77595684
M16 is fucking shit and almost every single automatic weapon on Earth shits on it, even that piece of shit L85A1.
>>77595684
Actually I am a wehraboo but I am also a realist, name one advantage a vietnam era m-16 had over an ak-47
>>77595984
It looked nicer
>>77587443
>>77588091
To be fair, the most lethal sniper in history did use a nugget with iron sights.
>>77585447
Holy shit fucking kill yourself nofunz
The MCX is infact more similar to the AK than the AR
It even fires a cartridge that is supposed to be the US' answer on the 7.62x39
>>77595984
>vietnam era m-16 had over an ak-47
Accuracy. Otherwise not a lot.
the Modern AR platform is a better weapon compared to an AK. New or Old.
>>77581980
Dat money
>>77595984
it was lighter and more accurate than the AKM.
reliability was mostly solved after they chromelined barrel and started issuing cleaning kits.
>>77596773
And equally or more importantly, stopped issuing improper ammo
http://www.thegunzone.com/556prop.html
>>77581761
AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used AR-15 was not used
>>77592223
Explosives just require a permit to transport in public and a $200 tax stamp.
that said the M16 had nothing on the Australian modified FN-FAL.
>>77597294
FN-FAL may be a memegun but I love it. It's the angry fighting Irishman full of piss and vinegar of rifles.
>>77589301
>completely different action
don't post anymore
>>77581761
Except the maker has been long dead and probably would say "SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED"
>>77585233
Guess what anon, I own all 3 of those guns. I think we should do away with tax stamps as well and reopen the machine gun registration.
