Capitalism works in theory, but not in practice. The developed world became developed by ignoring its rules but enforcing the rules on weaker nations, an aggression principle whereby the powerful ram free markets down poor peoples throats with state guns while getting public money from the taxpayer trough. You'll accept the rules we don't apply to ourselves or else. Capitalism in theory is a mirage.
>>77052584
It works fine in practice.
Maybe you should consider trying it.
>>77052963
Please tell me where is theoretical capitalism put into practice?
>>77054092
You tell me.
You're the one who claimed it doesn't work.
>>77054670
Literally no where. It's a mirage as I said in the OP.
>>77052584
By this rationale, America is forcing China to purchase its Treasury bonds. Since America has no way to force China to do such a thing, there is no explanation for their behavior under your paradigm.
>>77054896
It's hard to force China to do anything, it's a strong nation. Trump might be able to force China to accept US patent laws, but we shall see.
Could you retards read a fucking book before criticizing capitalism?
Every prominent economic philosopher since the 1880s has agreed that capitalism is not ideal, but a necessary evil until we can eliminate human labor as a necessity. Every single one of them agrees that the logical result of capitalism is virtually all the wealth in the hands of a tiny group of titans of industry. This must continue until the workers do not depend on the titans anymore for the resources they need to stay alive. Once we reach that point, we move into actual socialism (not the retarded, corrupt negligence that plagues modern socialist governments).
>wahh people are better off than others
>>77052584
>lel my le cheap bathroom copy paste of social stratification
>le capitalism is state trying to hurt dem poor folks
Reddit, read a book.
>>77055560
A state enforced, protected, maintained system that is meant to direct wealth and power towards a select few is bad but a necessary evil because robots and then they'll make sure the majority superfluous population is maintained and cared for because robots.
The state will wither away once capitalists are defeated.
Yep you sound even more fucking retarded than communists.
>>77056178
To quote a crackpot, not an argument
>>77052584
You're right, capitalism itself doesn't work. Personally, I believe capitalism with some government oversight and regulations works best.
Also, the only economic system that works as good or better than capitalism is socialism, National Socialism.
>>77052584
DIRECT DEMOCRACY 2.0 NOW !
>>77054796
So is there a problem or not?
>>77056212
The only retard here is you.
>>77056982
A couple problems. The myth of capitalism, unlike the myth of communism hasn't been expunged. Real capitalism needs to be taught in schools, not the nice fantasy land version, the one enforced by the barrel of a gun. The issue would be IMO it would devastating to the system if the majority of people had the veil lifted.
>>77052584
No shit. Capitalism has always been built on force, from the first enclosure of land in the 16th century.
>>77056982
NO U!
It's never really been tried, just corrupted by despotic corporatists. It'll work if we just take to the streets!
>>77057318
Capitalism isn't enforced through means of government, capitalism is completely free market meaning no government involvement, communism however involves forcing individuals to pay for others or be punished for it, whether through jail or death.
>>77057524
>capitalism is completely free market meaning no government involvement
kek, I guess that's why capitalists go squealing like pigs to the state for protection whenever a socialist movement arises. From the English Diggers to the Bay of Pigs.
>>77057524
>Capitalism isn't enforced through means of government
Of course it is, from the very beginnings (the first enclosures in England in the 16th century), the eradication of the native population here, to the violent interventions in the third world, the symbol of capitalism should be a gun. It's about forcing people to pay for others or be punished for it.
>>77057735
You forget that actual capitalism has never existed as a result of socialism and communism which are based off of marxist ideology. If you fear government bailouts why do you make the governments bigger? Why not smaller? And allow for a free market? In a truly free market each reaps what they sow, if they fail as a business then they must reform or face consequences within that market which include loss of customers, employees and money.
>>77052584
>Central Bankers are directly above the Individual
>State Violence is a person
>Corporatists are above Central Bankers
>the State is on top
All evidence points toward the Central Bankers being at the top of the food chain. If you don't understand this, you don't understand Capitalism.
Furthermore,
>Capitalism works in theory, but not in practice
This argument would be a bit more solid if non-Capitalist countries had successful economies and outcomes better than Capitalism. That is simply not the case.
>The developed world became developed by ignoring its rules but enforcing the rules on weaker nations, an aggression principle whereby the powerful ram free markets down poor peoples throats with state guns while getting public money from the taxpayer trough
You are conflating Capitalism with Imperialism. Even without Imperialism, the developed world would have become developed. The evidence for this is that those nations which never embarked on Imperial campaigns are more devolved and richer than those that did.
Explain yourself.
>>77052584
everything "can" "work" by fait
i.e. no matter the misery resultant, capitalism "works" because it is declared to have worked, if you can ad-hoc "functioning" to arbitrary degrees of variability
There's not a single pure ideology that works in reality.
Take a moment to wrap your head around that.
>>77058244
In many ways Marxists and Socialists reinforced capitalism, a system that was well on it's way to collapse by the 1940's. But this lead to a wide range of positive changes, but these changes have been reversed because of no countervailing force. I do support, not an increase of government, but rather a shifting of government and a change in its entire structure.
>>77058614
You mean the countries (most notably in East Asia) that completely ignored the rules and bitterly opposed markets being rammed down their throat and protected their economies so that they could develop?
>>77054796
Capitalism is the leading force in every prosperous country, period. Doesn't matter what kind of economy these countries have. In socialist countries like Sweden and Denmark, the capitalist segment of society pays for the socialist extravagances. Compare Hong Kong to mainland China. Compare Chile to Venezuela. There's no contest. Not only does capitalism work, it's practically incapable of being suppressed. Your account of history is flat out delusional.
>>77058732
>Technology that was developed using public funds and resources that was handed over to a greedy cock sucking company led by an egomaniacal asshole piece of shit who sells it back to you at a high price.jpg
>>77059247
No. I am primarily referring to countires like Sweden as well as other small European nations that did not embark on costly empire building exercises overseas.
>>77059255
That's a reversal of the truth. In most capitalist countries the public pays the cost for private extravagance.
>>77058941
Modern technology entrenched the system you call "capitalism" (but really I see it as the inherent effects of technology itself - t. Unabomber). The way I see it there's basically no way to fix this broken system without destroying/abandoning most of the technologies which keep it in place, including the Internet (and even sites like this) and possibly even earlier back to the electrical power grid and Industrial revolution in general
Really going back to a landed agrarian system is the only thing that I see would actually fix anything.
>>77059848
THEY PAY IT VOLUNTARILY YOU KEK
APPLE CANNOT GET A DIME OUT OF YOUR WALLET UNLESS YOU GIVE IT TO THEM
GOVERNMENT DOES NOT ASK FOR YOUR MONEY. IT TAKES.
>>77052584
this pyramid is inverted.
>>77059848
Question #2: How did you get that computer that you happen to be using right now?
>>77052584
But that's not at all what "corporatist" means
>>77060076
It's selling the things that the public already paid for again to us in a shiny shitty package.
>JUST DON'T BUY IT HURR DURR
We literally don't have a choice, buy it from Apple or another shitty mini dictatorship in a different shiny shitty package.
>>77060782
I bartered for parts at a computer scrap yard
>>77054796
>Literally no where
Prove it
>>77061161
In your ideal society, how do you imagine the Internet working?
Entirely government controlled and locked down?
Or do you think it would be better if the Intneret were just banned or not permitted as a service period.
>>77061390
>prove a negative
Nigger what
I would argue that many of the terms we are using aren't well defined.
I would argue that fundamentally Capitalism is a system based on free exchange and property rights. Free exchange is a pretty simple idea. Although in theory it is voluntary, in the real world when someone needs to eat, they have to make an exchange to do so. But, that's life. As long as no one is compelled at the point of a gun or addicted to item being exchanged, this idea is pretty much enforces itself.
Property rights however probably require a government to enforce the rights of a hereditary establishment. The concept of property far predates Capitalism. Although Capitalism allows an accumulation of property far in excess of what can be used in a lifetime, in practice the people living in systems without a solid concept of property rights have regularly been despoiled.
>>77059911
I would say that the system you are referring to is the current world order as defined by globalized corporations and central banking.
This system has a huge number of internal weaknesses. One is the relatively new idea of paper money not tied to precious metals. Without the easy flow of electronic "money", globalized business becomes impossible.
>>77061340
I found a picture of OP
>>77061568
In a society where democracy is so distant and maligned I can understand how you can find this proposition repugnant, but it doesn't have to be. Paying taxes should be a wonderful thing, it's societies way of funding the things it has agreed upon after sustained discussion and input from all affected. It's a repugnant idea in a scale according to the level where you have an impact or say on the implementation of policies.
>>77052584
>Communism works in theory, but not in practice. And only if the theorist is retarded.
FTFY
Human beings are omnivores.
This makes us fundamentally incompatible with communism.
>>77062066
Would you allow privacy of information and conversation on the Internet you propose? Would a site like this one be legal? Would speech be controlled by the collective?
>>77063268
>didn't bother reading the thread.
Oh you aren't a commie.
You're fascist.
Good.
Militant platonistic fascism is the only way forwards.
>>77063462
In an society where we respect freedom and privacy it would.
You do understand speech is controlled by a collective in capitalism. You are part of a company, and you say your opinion and it's not accepted by the collectivist dictatorship, you could lose your job, there is no debate either, the mandate is handed down from above.
>>77063801
I don't think he's a fascist, he has a fetish for democracy and thinks it actually works
Here's a more accurate version
>>77056212
>A state enforced, protected, maintained system
Never go full Retard kid
>>77064870
The people lying on the ground at the bottom are the ones who should have the potbellies desu
