People here think that well be able to make ships move faster than the speed of light because they played mass effect. They think that gravity on other planets will be just like that on Earth. They think that we can change the climate of mars by nuking the poles because Elon Musk said so. They think we can change the atmosphere to make it breathable. There is literally nothing worthwhile in space except mining asteroids for resources. Why would anyone want to live in a space station their whole life or a planet where they cant ever take on their mask.
>>73421607
People already live in cities their whole lives.
Living in space habitats or domed cities on other planets isn't too much of a stretch.
Also, nice strawman arguments. There are plenty of viable, low energy colonization solutions that you failed to discuss.
Because one day the earth will be destroyed by the sun you disgusting worm
Colonization is a meme Well never colonize Mars well never colonize the moon we cant terreform planets.
If you've lived even 30 years ago you would have a grasp of how technologically advanced weve come in such a small amount of time. People thought getting to the moon was impossible too you know
>>73421863
SO what. You want humans to just live in space stations there whole life. Such a stupid argument. Why does it matter if humans continue on or not if there home is destroyed. Muh human race must live on give me a break.
>>73422037
>People
Bad argument. we cannot move faster tan the speed of light. This ideology is basically a cult. Muh we need to have our eggs in more baskets.
>>73421607
"We" won't
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Self-replicating_spacecraft
>>73422236
Anything is possible. You just have to be yourself.
>>73422388
Just be yourself a non gender binary queer pansexuall trannie
>>73421952
>>73421607
You people are spics aren't you?
People with your mindset should be shot.
Just because it might not be possible doesn't mean we shouldn't try.
>>73422120
>muh human race must live on give me a break
You're right. Let's just all do nothing. Let's go out an blow our brains out in the street.
Where do you people even come from? You're as bad as fucking Muslims.
>>73422120
you could realistically make giant space stations capable of actual life if you built up space infrastructure
you don't need FTL to colonize anything anyway.
>>73421607
well being a little bitch won't help you colonize shit that's for sure.
>>73421607
You're completely right. The only reason people think that space colonization is going to be a thing is because they grew up on a diet of sci-fi videogames and movies.
>>73422587
This is literally a cult. You guys have no argument and dont understand that money could be spent on much more useful things than things autistics read in a sci fi book or a video game
>>73421855
>low energy colonization solutions
Get a load of this faggot.
The whole reason people think space colonization is cool is to find other planets. Well we already have one. And we know that other planets would not be able to sustain us like the one we have now. So why would anyone want to live on such an inhospitable place. We should make earth awesome and stop this nonsense of leaving we know we wont find anything like Earth.
>>73422806
Why though? If it doesn't matter what happens to humans and humanity, who cares what we do with money.
>>73422236
>speed of light
How is this a barrier to colonization?
>>73421607
>Let's keep humanity all on Earth until inevitable overpopulation occurs, or a giant asteroid hits us.
If you think there aren't ways to get to a habitable planet one day or even create our own planet then you are a fucking degenerate retard.
The survival of our species is the only thing that matters and if you think otherwise you are just a Nu-male that doesn't understand the importance of genetics and lacks the basic survival genes to survive.
>>73423103
>humanity, who cares what we do with money.
We could use it effectively instead of wasting by sending people to mars for you know no reason at all
>>73423043
>we know we wont find anything like Earth.
you would be the people who told explorers not to find the new world. "Let's stay in Europe, there's nothing else out there". That's what you sound like.
"People on this board actually think well colonize other continents
People here think that well be able to make ships move faster than the speed of walking because they played in the sea. They think that weather on other continents will be just like that on Africa. They think that we can adjust to the climate of Europe by putting on clothes because Ooga Booga said so. They think we can change to agriculture to eat. There is literally nothing worthwhile on the rest of Earth except mining mountains for salts. Why would anyone want to live in a cold hut their whole life or a continent where they cant ever take off their clothes."
- 50.000 BC, Africa
>>73423410
Do you know how long it takes to get to another solar system. Unless you think the moon or mars are perfectly habitable.
>>73423469
except we now have modern science that shows just how complex our world is and how it would literally have to be a complete replica of earth for us to live in it.
>>73422236
It's a pretty basic concept but retard like you refuse to understand. One day we will find out how to and if not we can simply terraform other planets or create our own.
>>73423447
But like you said earlier:
>muh human race must live on give me a break
So again I'll ask. Why does it matter how we spend money?
>>73423470
hahahaha
>>73422653
>implying it shouldn't be a thing
I bet you won't breed in your lifetime with Nu-Male thoughts like that. Humans are pioneers and nomads. One day we will spread our seed to the stars.
>>73423707
>So again I'll ask. Why does it matter how
because were alive now and have a habitable planet we acclimated on. My point was why is it important for humans to live on if theyre stuck on a space station.
>>73423535
Yeah, a really long fucking time.
But it's still physically possible to move mass to another system.
Saturn is probably the best candidate of all of the natural bodies for colonization in our system.
Other than that, various cylindrical habitats in solar/planetary orbits are probably the next most feasible.
>>73423873
I bet you played mass effect
>>73422120
>>73422236
Why do you want humanity to die out?
Just because you're a loser with nothing to give to society doesn't mean society isn't worth having.
>>73423947
So you believe we could make a planet where we could have a comfortable gravitational strength and one where we could breathe without a mask
>>73422120
>Muh human race must live on give me a break
Yes, it must. We have an obligation to our species to survive, prosper, and grow for as long as we can. It's a shame the people like you exist in every generation.
>>73423645
You misunderstand.
We don't know how we would colonize other planets, or even get there for sure. People are well aware of the difference in gravity, climate, why it is, at least with modern day technology, impossible to travel faster than light or go around it any other way.
That doesn't mean we should just lay down everything and say "nope not possible" and never even try to find a way to do it. We know so little about it there is no way for us to exclude the possibility of colonizing any other world.
While we are working out other, more practical stuff as maybe you'd put it we can use our collective knowledge and our furthered advancements to maybe find a way. That's how we have been doing it the last, i don't know how many thousands of years. Ever since some guy found out how to make a spear.
>>73421607
>why would someone cross the ocean with a bunch of dirty criminals on xvi century ships to go to a deadly jungle where you would be unable to remove your armour because you are constantly being attacked by a horde of barbaric madmen
>>73424024
Im saying living isnt that great unless we have a planet. Living o a space station forever would be depressing
I used to think that space travel and colonization was inevitable, but as technology has progressed I think it's going to be fundamentally different than we expect.
We are making pretty much zero progress towards ftl travel, and slower than light ships seem pointless. If we send a cryogenic colony ship out expecting it to take a few thousand years to reach a habitable system, humanity left on Earth will advance and change so much in that time period, maybe even working out ftl travel and having a different ship get there first. And if we dont, at best communication times will be so great and the journey so long that we basically won't ever know own if it was successful.
Coputers and networking technologies are progressing by leaps and bounds however. If we are talking about a time line a few hundred years long, I see no reason why tech such as quantum computing wouldn't allow us to digitize our species. If we can mimic a human brain with a high tech prosthesis, we should be able to copy or transfer a human mind directly over, creating an ai indistinguishable from an actual person. A stl ship loaded up with a colony of this ai would be an order of magnitude easier to create and maintain vs a space meat locker. Plus time would be relativly.meaningless to the crew allowing "society" to progress along the way. If the mission is successful, great. If not, then you end up with a functioning city in space.
>>73423884
>Stuck on a space station
The only point of staying on a space station would be to inevitably find a planet suitable for human life so we could populate it. Besides it wouldn't just be a "space station" anyway retard. It would be more like a space blimp or space ship.
>>73424144
In space stations with no hope of ever getting earth back?
>>73423645
Really? Are there no people living in the space station right now? Is there a miniature earth inside that space station?
And using modern science as an excuse, is like saying "well we have a perfectly fine boat but let's not use it". We don't know the exstent of what we can do.
And finally, none of what you said changes the fact you would be the same people who said "don't leave Europe and explore on the ocean". That's what you're saying. They didn't know what was out there. They didn't know what they'd find.
And yet they did it anyway because they were human beings. Not some disgusting pitiful trash like you.
>>73423971
I did but ME3 ending was a disappoint
I bet your ancestors also thought we would never fly Nu-Male
>>73424266
Anywhere and everywhere we can.
>>73424266
Sounds rather like your opinion.
>>73424297
What are the odds of finding a planet that has the exact gravitational strength and atmosphere and climate as earth. ya its zero
>>73423043
I don't give 2 shits about finding Earth V2.0, I want to explore. I want to see plasma based life forms, find out if you can fly through a wormhole, and take selfies in front of active supernovae.
>>73423884
>because were alive now
HAHAHAHA
"me me me me me"
That's what you sound like you disgusting sub human filth
>>73424483
>has the exact gravitational strength and atmosphere and climate as earth. ya its zero
So you think well find a golden egg of a planet that will be just like earth. Cmon
>>73424140
Eventually, yes, probably take tens of thousands of years to accomplish a perfect match.
But we'll likely compromise and colonize locations that meet some of the many criteria.
Saturn's surface, for example is about 1 Gravity and it has a protective magnetosphere. You'd have to live in sealed floating habitats, but it's physically possible and far less of an energy investment than terraforming.
>>73421607
>People on this board actually think well colonize other worlds
They are stupid monkeys. Monkeys don't belong to space. Even if space colonisation is possible (Fermi paradox says no) it will be robots who will do it. Fragile monkeys literally would not be able to compete with robots (or cyborgs). Evolution and natural selection have no mercy.
>>73421607
>There is literally nothing worthwhile in space except mining asteroids for resources.
That's pretty much the LEAST worthwhile thing to do in space. The amount of fuel to get any resources back from space, and the lag time it takes, may completely outstrip the economic benefit of it. With that kind of tech, we could more easily drill into the earth's mantle and pump whatever's down there up, or just outright transmute them from other elements.
The real reason to go into space is cultural and social. Expand to create new habitats, to explore, or to spread a philosophy.
>>73424695
>b
you left out my ponit of that we have a planet. Way to strawman me you obviously have no argument.
>>73424781
Those robots will be us.
>>73424888
why would anyone want to be a robot.
>>73424810
Who says resources have to be transported to Earth?
Far less energy to utilize them in place or transfer them to another location that isn't a big gravity well.
>>73424888
Yeah like fishes are humans.
>>73421607
FTL travel is still impossible right now obviously but we work towards more discoveries in quantum physics each day. It could happen.
Gravity on other planets can be measured by probes. Mars is a long shot but habitation inside enclosures is possible, but terraforming would take god knows how many centuries if not millenia. What's worthwhile in space is having an escape plan. If there is a doomsday event we cannot avoid, we need a backup home.
>>73425098
I could just as easily ask why would anyone want to be a fragile meat bag?
>>73424555
>it needs to be exactly like earth lmao
It really just needs to have high amounts of oxygen and be in the "goldilocks zone" True it wont be super easy to find planets in the "goldilocks zone" But it still can be larger or smaller than Earth lol. We would simply adapt. If they gravity is stronger perhaps we would augment ourselves to help counter it or if it wasn't much larger we could physically adapt to the extra restraint. If it was smaller like mars for example than we would be a lot lighter and our bone mass would lighten as well and we would become slightly taller.
Did you go to school by chance?
>>73421952
>meme
Argument immediately discarded, abandon thread. Sage goes in all fields.
>>73421607
>They think that gravity on other planets will be just like that on Earth.
Scientifically illiterate man detected.
Planets with less mass have less gravity. Planets with more have more.
No one is implying what you implied.
>>73424845
Oh I saw it.
I left it out because that's not the important part of what you said. You don't give a damn about anything but yourself and what you said proved it.
Don't try to act as though this isn't what you meant.
>>73425098
Why would anybody not?
>not limited to how you were born, you could have different limbs for different purposes
>no need for space suits, etc
>no genetic defects
>backup consciousness, die horribly and wake up at home maybe missing a few hours of memory
>much stronger
I could go on
>>73425170
robots would have zero emotions. Humans can experience happiness and love even if they also experience sadness.
>>73421607
>move faster than the speed of light
>implying that's the only way something can move
>what is quantum entanglement
>implying we know jack shit about nature to be this defeatist
>>73424781
>What is an EMP blast?
Ya i dont think so. Seeing as humans program computers only another human could start the programming for such an event.
Through the amount of fail safes and things such as EMPs it would be pretty easy to end any sort of "robot" uprising.
>>73425122
>implying we're making huge strides growing fins and gills
Haven't been keeping up with prosthetics/cybernetics research have you?
>>73421607
Yes, there will be a /pol/ony, and yes, it will be all male. AIDS will have been eliminated by then, so it's largely going to be a massive circle jerk and buttsex bonanza. This is the bold future humanity is making for itself.
>>73425400
And as we work to understand the brain more and more and create more complex AI, we could very possibly create an artificial, non-biological brain that could house a human-like consciousness that could feel emotions for all you know. It's not like it'd be how current robots are.
>>73425185
Weve already seen that low gravity has an effect on our eyes we could eventually become blind on a different gravity world. Youre getting all these so called facts from shit like halo and mass effect.
>>73425385
This.
I literally cannot wait to discard my meatsuit and live inside a 10,000 year colony ship.
>ctrl-f "quantum"
every time. "quantum mechanics" is always a nice filler argument. You never know what those quantum scientists might discover! Maybe warp drives for spaceships
>>73425400
>robots would have zero emotions
Why?
What physical barrier prevents robots from being designed with complex neuroelectrical/chemical responses to external stimuli?
>>73425306
Actual people think this Im not saying science say this
>>73425583
>Live on 0.96 G world
WOW SO DIFFERENT
>>73422806
>money could be spent
Money is paper. Resources is what we spend to do anything. Resources on this planet are limited. Sooner or later, we'll run out of them and then we die. We have no choice but to try and get resources from outside our planet, whether it's possible or not. Because if we don't try and succeed, then it's game over.
>>73421607
>Why would anyone want to live in a space station their whole life or a planet where they cant ever take on their mask.
because earth and humanity on it severely sucks cock?
>>73425583
So on a higher gravity world will we SEE LIKE HAWKS?
Neat.
>>73425703
And actual people can be retarded like you, what's your point?
>>73425544
So basically Ghost in the Shell?
>>73424702
You seem to believe that living on Earth, or an Earth like environment is a requirement for living well, or having a desire to live. And therefore due to the difficulty (assuming it always remains difficult) of creating an Earth-like environment, or finding one, that all efforts towards space exploration are pointless.
Your issues are faulty assumptions that only life in an Earth-like environment is worth living, and that technology will not develop to such an extant that it solves the former problem, should it even prove to be one.
>>73424845
>>73425322
Besides, as this anon said, you're coming across like a whiny nihilist only concerned with the here and now with not a single thought spared for the future and existence of human race.
>hard life isn't worth living
>why does the human race have to exist if its hard?
>but we're alive now, so why bother spending money on the future instead of current comforts
You're pathetic and short-sighted.
>>73424781
Whatever you say, Lord Frieza.
>>73425322
>.
>I left it out because that's not the important part of what you said. You don't give a damn about anything but yourself and what you said proved it.
>Don't try to act as though this isn't what you meant.
no I actually do care which is why I wouldnt want to damn generations to being stuck on a space station with no hope of ever returning to earth. Like I said you have no argument ere except muh feels we need humans to live on in space stations. Why why should humanities future lie in living in space station without a home planet to return to.
>>73422995
Nice 2015 meme
>>73425583
>what is evolution
If enough humans were born on a foreign planet over a long enough peroid they would adapt u mongoloid as long as the environment was similar enough. If you don't think we could just have sophisticated computerized eyes by then anyway then you need to pay attention to modern science and robotics.
>>73425782
Have you rolled on Putinka in honour of the grandpas who was at the war?
There's a fairly solid chance of overcoming the limitations you mentioned given enough time, but there's a far greater chance of being sent back a couple of hundred years before we can actually manage that step. We've used most of the "easy" resources to reach this technological stage. If we get sent back again through a nuclear war or a natural catastrophe, there may not be enough left to reach the stage that would make wide-spread space colonization true.
>>73425699
>Why?
>What physical barrier prevents robots from being designed with complex neuroelectrical/chemical responses to external stimuli
emotions come from chemicals. Why would an ai want those if it would make it less effective at progress.
>>73423470
BINGO
/thread
>>73421607
yes you are right goy. we will NEVER get to even have moon bases because rockets are too expensive. you listen well to our scientists on tv who say it is IMPOSSIBLRU to travel faster than light like. we are the only life in all the universe because some math nerd figured it out for us. its purely coincidence that more and more people are seeing weather balloons in our skies and filming them with their smartphones. there is also no need to investigate all technologies that could potential compete with oil, coal, or natural gas. our future in energy is in SOLAR or WIND energy, not magic "zero point energy" like those lucrative science fiction films you love so much. btw be sure to see the NEW independence day movie where humans kick alien butts!
>>73425800
nononono The majority of those who think about colonizing other worlds do not think about the difference of gravity.
>>73423470
OP = BTFO
>>73421607
>/pol/ Science division 2016
>People here think that well be able to make ships move faster than the speed of light because they played mass effect. They think that gravity on other planets will be just like that on Earth. They think that we can change the climate of mars by nuking the poles because Elon Musk said so. They think we can change the atmosphere to make it breathable. There is literally nothing worthwhile in space except mining asteroids for resources. Why would anyone want to live in a space station their whole life or a planet where they cant ever take on their mask.
>/pol Science division 1860
People here think that well be able to make ships that can fly because they read Joules Verne. They think that gravity on this planet can be overcome just like that. They think that we can change the climate by praying to god because the Pope said so. They think we can change the atmosphere to make it un-breathable. There is literally nothing worthwhile in travel except mining for resources. Why would anyone want to live in Hawaii their whole life or a country where they cant ever take off their top hat?
>>73423645
You can't possible be this stupid.
>>73425800
nononono The majority of those who think about colonizing other worlds do not think about the difference of gravity..
>>73424810
>The amount of fuel to get any resources back from space, and the lag time it takes, may completely outstrip the economic benefit of it.
This is another thing. If you really serious about space colonisation you would be forced to produce stuff in space from space resources. It is much more energy efficient than dragging stuff up and down in gravity well of Earth-like planets. that mean that you will be having full production cycle in space. Ehhh why do yo want to deal with planets again? After you become space race you simply don't need to deal with stinking planets anymore this is no efficient. Space would be populated by space optimised robotic race who live in space and kick back any monkeys who want to awkwardly crawl from their planets. These monkeys will have no chance like fish has no chance to come out from oceans again on Earth.
>>73426286
The ideal colonized world would be a very earth-like planet. And of course studies would be done on early colonists to see just how much a 0.2G or whatever difference affected them.
>>73426124
Do you have a problem with what I said or something? I'm pretty sure I was just telling the objective truth about humanity's future. So, I don't understand why you're acting like a cunt.
>>73425400
>robots would have zero emotions. Humans can experience happiness and love
So that's it is it? Emotions? The same exact emotions billions of humans had before us and the same exact emotions billions will have after us. That's all you want to live for? That's all you care about?
People like you need to be exterminated. Your mindset is a detriment to human progress and advancement.
>>73426172
It's unlikely that we'll have the destructive energy necessary to throw mankind back that far.
Given our current nuclear arsenals, a temporary setback to the 19th century for most modern nations would be more likely, followed by rapid redevelopment because of the current widespread dissemination of technological knowledge and tools.
Hollywood really has fucked up our preconceptions about nuclear war.
>>73426374
This. Once you get to space you're halfway to anywhere, building stuff in space is essential for getting space resources.
>>73425959
If you think that humanities future of living in space station for the rest of eternity is worthwhile than that completely fine.
>>73421607
>People here think that well be able to make ships move faster than the speed of light because they played mass effect
>its the same person from the other thread about this that doesnt understand tensor calculus, scalar physics and quantum chemistry
Had to start a new thread about how math is hard even though this was mastered in the 30s?
>>73425854
Very possibly in the future, but it's most definitely a long, long way off.
>>73424271
Most people fundamentally misunderstand the relationship between time and distance. When you leave from a place at relativistic speed, that place, as far as you're concerned, stops existing as it was when you left. Time dilation caused it to hurtle towards its own future without you. You can never really go back.
All news you get from anywhere else in the universe is necessarily the number of light-years between you and the place where it happened out of date.
There won't really be trade. Wherever you are, you only have the resources of that place available to you. If you land in an iron-poor system, iron is just more expensive, and the economy has to adjust to it.
Groups will be loosely associated, far separated, there will be no such thing as a multi-system government, managing more than one planet will probably be nigh impractical. You'll have thousands of "nations" that you're aware of, some maybe thousands of light-years away, whose histories you know and understand, but which might not exist anymore.
Imagine a travel agency advertised they were building a paradise on a faraway world. You decide to take off there, try your luck. As you're traveling, news reports arrive more quickly. You hear about them building vast beaches, lush with fantastical animals and birds, starred by flowers in every color imaginable. Everyone gets a harem of artificial women, and spends all day in an intoxicated trance under the influence of a drug with all the good points of THC, alcohol and LSD. Five minutes before arrival, (30 years in outside time) you get reports that the place broke out in war, all those paradise lands have been glassed, and whoever is left is living in a road-warrior hellhole.
History will cease to be studied. People will invent study doctrines, search for patterns, etc... Sciences like economics or even group psychology might get enough data to be vaild.
>>73424271
I mostly agree with this. I see us digitizing humanity far before we end up colonizing earth-like planets. The thing I disagree with is that humanity will be fundamentally different when we're digitized. With neural mapping that advanced, pain and pleasure would be easily replicated. Memories could be easily fabricated. It'd also be possible to have multiple copies of one "person".
I don't think we'd be a proper life-form at that point and I don't see any imperative to exist, much less colonize other planets.
>>73426098
thats if we didnt all die out first
>>73426533
Our current space stations aren't exactly designed like space colonies would be. They would be ring or cylinder shaped to give us artificial gravity unless we discover and master the graviton or some shit.
>nothing can ever go faster than the speed of light they said
>>73426533
I think that existing is better than not-existing.
>>73426445
So you dont care about about anything but progress
>>73426612
Basically we need FTL travel to have a multi-planet society.
>>73421607
>Terraforming Mars.
The magnetosphere on that rock is a little bitch, no matter what you do to the atmospheric composition any life you try to seed there will die to solar radiation.
Terraforming Mars cannot happen. Well, not without hollowing it out and filling it back up with radioactive materials and iron. Might as well just make your own planet from scratch if you can pull that shit off.
>>73426538
>Had to start a new thread about how math is hard
I didnt start that thread.
>>73421607
OP's just a faggot with an existential crisis trying to stick it to the man, why are people still commenting?
>>73426554
Have some decade old technology.
We're already hooking people's brains up to machines. As we understand more and more about how human-machine interfacing works, we'll design more human-like synthetic equivalent brains. We already have chips that can accurately simulate portions of the human brain to bypass damaged areas.
Colonization is the only way to cleanse the human genome from niggers
>>73426792
There is no reason we have to leave anything behind other than shitskins to progress. I don't get why you can't understand that technology isn't locked in place, a Ghost In The Shell future where consciousness can exist in computers and everybody is an android who still thinks exactly like a human is impossible.
>>73424271
Good ideas. Only problem is our only real goal is simply to start having real humans on planets though not just getting robots there.
It's just a matter of getting our population on several planets to ensure our species survival.From there keeping the planets connected and establishing trade would allow us to colonize further.
>>73426612
>history will cease to be studied
What I mean by this is that, there will be so much disconnected shit happening, and news from far away will be coming in so slowly that it won't make sense to compile one single log of everything like we do now, to try and understand it like a narrative--this happened, then this etc because there's so much going on at once.
Instead, we'll see the same shit playing out over hundreds of different societies. Same stories, over and over again.
This is why studies that are currently alchemical, like social psychology and economics might become valid. We might find a story about a hundred different societies started with nearly exactly the same conditions, trying different economic systems, and find correlations to how things play out.
FTL is like a given in most science fiction nowadays, and I think that's tragic. There are so many possibilities for a civilization limited by the speed of light.
>>73422120
You are free to die if you want to. Everyone else will continue on-ward and upward.
>>73427006
Hooking things up to brains is different than directly transferring consciousness, though. That's the biggest problem in my opinion.
>>73426981
>:
no argument good
>>73422120
What a pathetic, loathsome creature without an ounce of the human spirit you are. Thank God nobody like you is in charge of anything important.
>>73426620
What is your definition of life-form?
Would we not continue to consume resources and self-replicate?
Does life have to consist of complex chains of proteins?
>>73424266
Says who? I would love to be adventuring in a space station.
>>73425501
What is radiation? Face it space is the outrageously hostile place for life. But even with our primitive technologies, we were able to create robots able to work in these condition for decades. No monkey can compete with this. Robots can adapt. Monkeys can't. Well you probably can create heavily altered cyborg monkey for space conditions but surely as hell it as much different from humans as fish is different from homo sapiens and will have nothing in common interests and understanding.
>>73427127
What even is consciousness? Your ego and self-preservation instinct make it hard to imagine that you aren't some indivisible thing, but really, all you are is the state of a machine.
The person you were even 1ms ago *doesn't exist anymore*.
>>73424271
Agreed.
>>73426675
>muh quantum entanglement
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No-communication_theorem
>>73427093
you guys are a cult seriously, I dont feel like uploading my brain into the cloud anytime soon.
>>73427198
You'are pathetic and loathsome pathetic subhuman freak. You have no human spirit.
asteroid colony seeds when?
>>73427127
The point is we're understanding more and more about how our brains work and we're now treating major areas like circuitry and not just a blob of activity.
We're much closer to accurate human-brain simulations that I think people realize, and like I said, we're already accurately simulating some portions.
>>73427291
I know consciousness is weird and shit, but what I'm saying is the actual 100% transfer of a human consciousness to a machine is going to be very difficult, considering the entirety of the internet is only an incredibly small fraction of the size of the brain's neural network. That's the biggest issue, just having enough artificial "neurons" to allow for a mind to exist as it does inside our brains.
>>73427198
tell me why living in a space station forever is progress for humanity seems like a failure
>>73427337
It would happen in centuries you idiot. And it wouldn't be a giant connection, individuality is important. Everybody has their own HDD.
>>73427198
Obama defunded NASA
>>73424266
What if it's a big ass spinning ring-planet with nothing but beaches, drink-stands and luaus populated by you, your friends, and about 100 million horny artificial women all customized appeal to every fetish imaginable?
>>73426844
>hollowing it out and filling it back up with radioactive materials and iron
Literal retard.
If you run a thick enough wire around the circumferance of Mars, as with the circumferance of any object, and channel an electric current through it, you create a magnetic field. If the current is strong enough, which we would be capable of providing if we could colonize that planet on the first place, you have a magnetosphere.
>>73422120
By that logic why not kill yourself rn faggot?
>>73426468
I don't believe in the Hollywood shite and I know that reaching the pre-war stage would be easier, but it would take a tremendous amount of resources (greatest problem) to rebuild the infrastructure back to it's former glory, not to mention you can't just start building the fancy stuff just like that without going through certain stages that came before our current technological level: technological progress is somewhat layered and you'll need to fill pre-requisite shit for gradual progress. It would still take a generation or two to get back to the point where we left off.
>>73425306
>Planets with less mass have less gravity. Planets with more have more.
Looking at our solar system, we see that all planets have drastically different radii and density.
A planet with less mass can have the "same" gravitation at surface-level if it's small enough in radius.
A planet with a shitton of mass can have the same gravitation at surface-level if it's large enough in radius.
Mass isn't the thing you have to worry about.
It's gravity at surface level. We'd also have to worry about things like delta-V required to get back and forth from planet surface to orbit but I don't want to look that autistic.
>>73427458
Oh yeah, now I get you. I'm not disagreeing with that as much as I am disagreeing with how close we are to it technologically.
Also everybody ITT who's interested in this shit should watch Transcendence, which explores this concept pretty well.
>>73426830
Yes, to create a society you're spot-on. But human beings can still spread without needing to keep any ties to their point of origin.
>>73427537
No he didn't.
They're doing some wonderful Muslim outreach work now.
>>73427540
So thats it horny ai women
>>73421607
>We'll never cross the Atlantic Ocean, it's way too turbulent.
>Ships made out of fucking METAL!? Are you nuts? How do they float? With MAGIC?
>Motorized horse-carriages? Surely you jest.
>An airplane? Hah!
>A METAL airplane? You're retarded!
>We'll never go to the moon, there's no cheese there.
In other words, OP is a faggot and life finds a way.
>>73424888
conciousness has not been explained
>>73427729
Never aging. Never getting seriously injured. I think a strong religion would have to be implemented to avoid mass degeneracy where everybody turns on their pleasure receptors 100% of the time and just does nothing, but currently human bodies kinda suck.
>>73427587
>Literal retard.
>If you run a thick enough wire around the circumferance of Mars, as with the circumferance of any object, and channel an electric current through it, you create a magnetic field. If the current is strong enough, which we would be capable of providing if we could colonize that planet on the first place, you have a magnetosphere.
you guys think youre so smart but you dont even understand my post. We have a planet we acclimated on if its gone where are we gonna go in a space station
>>73427466
Probably not quite true, there are more connections in the brain, but they are probably much simpler and full of redundancy. A router, representing one node on a network has a CPU capable of doing millions of calculations per second, yet to even add two three-digit numbers takes our full concentration for a few seconds.
They're different, and not really comparable, but to say that the human brain is more complex than all human technology to this point is a bit of a hyperbole.
>>73427736
>ese there.
>In other words, OP is a faggot and life finds a way.
You guys are a cult we know we cant go faster than light and you want to become robots.
>>73421607
>why would anybody want to go to the new world where there are indians and dangerous diseases and unbroken wilderness
>>73427863
>injured. I think a strong religion would have to be implemented to avoid mass degeneracy where everybody turns on their pleasure receptors 100% of the time and just does nothing, but
You couldnt control robots like that.
>>73427600
I think you're overestimating the destructive power of nukes. Not everything will be destroyed, hell most cities would be completely untouched by blast and thermal pulse. Most nuclear targets, according to analysis of US/Soviet military doctrine would be other nukes, fleets, large armor/infantry formations, command/control, runways, etc..
The biggest killer would be disease and starvation from all of the logistical disruption right after the war. Why waste a nuke on New York when the chaos of stopping the food supply for 72 hours would cause the whole city to destroy itself anyway?
So most machinery and even fossil fuel resources would be intact or at the very least recoverable.
>>73427729
>>73422806
>>73422236
>>73422120
>>73421952
>>73423645
>>73423535
>>73424266
>>73425098
>>73427840
I'm convinced it's not that complex. Take this guy for instance. He might as well be a machine. Which is funny for someone who so loves his "humanity"
>>73428045
maybe not become robot , but how about uploading our consciousness into a new body when we die ? with that we would achieve immortality
>>73427953
It has more complex connections/networks. Yeah it is kind of a dumb analogy but it's the best one I have now.
>>73427879
>how are people going to adapt to living in cold climates?
>I don't know Ugg. Warm places seem best because we're already acclimated. Nobody can survive in the north.
Your side of history never wins because you have no imagination or ambition.
>>73427736
>In other words, OP is a faggot and life finds a way.
But it will be not the way you dream. >>73427540
Entities able to solve problem of space colonization will have very little common with human race.
>>73425501
Invent something vs emp blast . Thanks human
>>73424271
I see you played soma.
>>73428045
>You guys are a cult we know we cant go faster than light
How does it feel to have been tricked by approved physics? I fly to work on Janet and I can tell you this, you are wrong.
>>73427863
> avoid mass degeneracy where everybody turns on their pleasure receptors 100% of the time
Wouldn't be a problem. All those people would go ahead and jack in then spend all eternity jacking it in a corner. They'd never propagate themselves.
The people who will be numerous in say, 100 million years will be the ones who have some kind of goal they want to achieve. That's what nature will select for.
This is, unless there's a festival-like religion where the propagation of total pleasure is considered a means unto itself.
>>73428145
Why not? There is no reason a human mind would stop being capable of faith once outside of a biological vessel.
>>73427222
I don't have a problem with robots being "life" or not. It's just a word.
My issue is that everything would be artificial because with a digitized minds, we'd essentially be replaced by machines.
Our real brains could be tossed into the trash after the procedure is done.
"Our" memories could be completely faked.
I dunno about you, but that sounds like death of humanity to me.
>>73428227
No reason not to go full robot at that point.
>>73427840
And it might not have to be to still get a good mind emulation up and running.
>>73421607
People said the same about leaving their shit hole mud huts.
>>73428324
I think tests could be done to prove it's the same person after the procedure. Also memories would be hard as shit to fake, especially a lifetime of them.
>>73421607
Fuck you subhuman dog. If you stand in the way of human salvation and progress, we will kill you and anyone with you.
Humanity will rise, and we will spread to the stars.
>>73428191
>>73428227
even>>73428298
If everyone were robots why would reproduction matter. We could just create new ai people if we that kinds of technology.
>>73422120
Why not just kill yourself now faggot?
>>73427555
>All life on the planet is in the hands of PG&E.
Good luck with your colony.
>>73428592
I never said anything about reproduction
>>73428367
its not life tho
>>73428145
Faith is basically the programming language of the human mind. It plays into their own development, giving them goals and instilling behaviors.
AIs would likely have something comparable, maybe you could only say analogous. The three/four laws immediately come to mind.
You need this to keep them goal-directed. A robot with the ability to reprogram itself will eventually program itself into a trap-- as soon as it comes to a problem it can't solve, if it has the ability to direct its own programming, it will just program itself to no longer care about that difficult goal, and it will become useless.
That kind of behavior will be considered "taboo" and "immoral" for AIs.
>>73428415
yeah but its earth its the same atmosphere. There isnt any science saying this is possible t actually terreform besides ludicrous points.
>>73428592
Reproduction is important to help create new ideas through new people. It would presumably be handled differently though. Also I'm actually gonna rescind my statements about immortality because I remembered a good scifi book I read where they had cured death, society had stagnated because all of the old fucks were still in power and never died.
>>73428324
Humanity as we know it maybe, but the thing is the robots would become would be a part of us, just as our children are.
Some would end up being more or less 'human'. Some would probably choose to live at least a portion of their lives as 100% biological just to see how it feels.
I don't think it's going to be one big, irrevocable 'change' moment. It's going to be gradual and there will be movement back and forth and all around the spectrum of sapient thought and biological vs synthetic substrates.
I hate to say more 'diversity' given the current context of that term... but that's pretty much what it would be.
>>73428592
let me elaborate on what i said :
>about to die
>your cells are used to make a perfect clone and younger body of you
>your consciousness is saved regularly like a cloud service
>when you die the clone body is uploaded with your consciousness
>you are alive again , Young and with the knowledge you had in your previous "life"
>>73428527
If it were actually possible for a species to achieve this we would have met one by now according to fermis paradox
>>73421607
An advantage to space station life is we could toss morons like you out an airlock.
>>73428227
If robot body is more efficient robotic race will prevail. Natural selection. No mercy. And robotic bodies already win space race. Nope your dream of losing virginity to space princess will never become the reality.
>>73428616
way to grasp my point
>>73421607
People here think that well be able to make ships that can traverse entire oceans because they heard stories about it in Pagan Tales. They think that food and people on other continents will be the same and that they won't fall off the world. They think they can change the state of the continent by bringing there culture with them and making it more like home. There is literally nothing worthwhile on other continents other than mining for gold in the mountains. Why would anyone want to live in a ship there whole life and not ever be able to make permanent settlements.
>>73428324
Ah forgot to mention a good example:
The Amish. They choose to live within an earlier context of human existence. We will likely have many humans/cyborgs/robots in the future that will choose to follow their example and co-exist with the rest on some level.
>>73428867
you dont understand fermis paradox nor the drake equation
>>73428853
no, that other copy is alive. You die. Your consciousness doesn't just skip over. You are you and the copy is someone else. You can't escape it.
>>73428767
Okay, give me the definition of life.
>>73428771
theres no way to say this is ceratain, if ais happened they would probably be very different from a human.
>>73422120
t.scared AYY LMAO
>>73429033
what if we find a way to save my consciousness , personallity and knowledge to upload it ? surely if everything about my brain is safe when i am uploaded in my new body i would still be me
>>73428867
>If it were actually possible for a species to achieve this we would have met one by now according to fermis paradox
I dont try to talk to ants, but that doesnt mean ants dont exist.
>>73428592
Reproduction is a fascinating topic. Most beings capable of reproduction will want beings that share their goals to be the end result.
We will probably see this kind of thing happening long before AIs are even a thing. Test-tube babies. Design your offspring to be smart, driven, strong, competitive, kind, sociopathic, conquerors or liberators. We'll see genetic dynasties pop up, with people who are incredibly inbred but through tech are able to avoid the negative consequences. They'll be similar to tribes in the middle-east-- distrustful and hostile to outsiders, while doing everything in their power to make sure their own tribe dominates.
New people will eventually lose their individuality become nothing more than an extension of somebody else's will.
Luckily, such monocultural people will be vulnerable to singular disruptive strategies-- they may decide en masse to join a suicidal religion for example, or they may be easy marks to confidence schemes.
>>73429204
an uploading is just creating a copy. It will not be you unless your brain or whatever is holding your conciousness was transplanted into the new body.
>>73422995
Make Mars Great Again.
what a fucking pessimist OP kill yourself
>>73429013
>Okay, give me the definition of life.
did I trigger you
>>73429160
kek
>>73428938
We won't see the kind of competition which makes people have to give up their bodies to compete with AIs until an area becomes extremely resource-starved. People and things will likely just take off for uninhabited places once that starts up.
>>73421607
There are people who're much smarter than you working on it. Absolutely anything is possible with good enough science.
>>73429332
Oh no I dont think its 100 percent certain that its possible to become a mormon space god Im such a traitor to humanity.
>>73429295
Unless the upload/transference were very gradual.
A neuron or portion of a neuron at a time, like what already happens in our brains as neurons are repaired and replaced.
>>73428834
>but the thing is the robots would become would be a part of us, just as our children are.
More like humans are part of fish, you know they are animals too and have spine and brain. Only first are much more sophisticated and live on the ground and others live in the water. What do humans think about fish? The things fish can not comprehend. Our robotic children will be thinking the same about us. Be proud fish.
>>73429295
Every instant, your brain is changing. Parts of you, your memories, tendencies, learned behaviors are being pruned away to make room for new stuff. This is happening all the time.
Compare yourself now to three years ago, and think about how much you've changed. The thing you are now is not the same as the thing you were then. That think no longer exists.
Your ego tells you that you are special, and separate, a distinct entity. It has to-- otherwise you'd see no problem just jumping off a cliff and dying. But this conceit leaves no way for you to understand what the "real" you is.
>>73429733
yeah, that's possible as well.
>>73429763
annnd I don't disagree with a single thing in this post.
>>73429763
that is not the reason why people dont commit suicide easily
I don't see what the point would be to settle on other planets, even if they were somehow identical to Earth in terms of gravity, atmospheric composition, warmth, etc.
If you have the technology to sustain large amounts of people in space for the journey there, which most likely includes self-sustenance through whatever means, why wouldn't you just live exclusively on space stations? Asteroid farming for water, etc.?
>>73429474
>We won't see the kind of competition which makes people have to give up their bodies to compete with AIs until an area becomes extremely resource-starved.
This competition is called life. As soon as it becomes more effective it will happen. in evolution it is called mutation. Some will do it over curiosity or stupidity or because of evil intent and then it is over. Evolution advantage. New better race out breeds less effective race.
>>73426612
>implying
I would bet on it becoming like ancient greece with antion states
>People here think that well be able to make ships move faster than the speed of light
Stop projecting your "education" onto civilized people. Speed isn't the problem anyway, distances and unless we can manipulate distance with something like worm holes true space exploration will never happen.
>>73429752
Very true, most robotic intelligences wouldn't think much of us at all and those that did would be more inclined to think of us as a pet or at best an old slow grandpa.
Which is why speeding up our own neural processes, on more efficient substrates, is important for at least some of humanity.
Cybernetic ambassadors able to think at machine intelligence speeds to bridge the gap between super and mundane intelligences.
Without them, we really do risk being so far removed from synthetic intelligences that being wiped out is more likely.
>>73428514
>>73429204
The reality of a digitization procedure is that they create a completely perfect replica of the mind, but on a machine.
What happens to the person's current, biological mind? It would be a separate consciousness.
A person undergoing this procedure wouldn't have their mind "transferred" over like a magical soul. From their POV, they'd go into the hospital to get copied, get copied, and go on living their life until they die.
At the moment they're copied, the patient and their copy are identical in mind. In the time elapsed after the procedure they diverge and become entirely different consciousness. Even if you use technology to synchronize the biological mind's experiences to the robo-mind, they'd still be two separate minds which don't magically melt into one.
I really don't see a point
>>73430096
>I don't see what the point
Point is monkey does not dream of giving a birth to robotic space race living in space. (because what is the point of such dreams?) Monkey dreams of the paradise jungle with 72 virgin females. Because it is monkey.
>>73430203
There are still coelacanths even though lobe finned fishes aren't as effective at finding food etc. There are still newts and axolotls even though most of their niche is better exploited by lizards.
Something better coming along isn't a death sentence. To completely wipe out some other race, there needs to be some incentive to do so-- virgin habitat is more easily exploited than what's already inhabited.
My bet is that more often than not, they'll leave each other alone.
>>73430537
I'll be honest, this monkey would spend a lot of time running 'fuck like rabbits' simulations on his mind-emulation upload/transfer.
Don't like doing spreadsheets now as it is, don't see why that would change just because I move into a new brain-house.
>>73421607
>People here think that well be able to make ships move faster than the speed of light
its actually about moving shorter distances, not moving faster
>They think that gravity on other planets will be just like that on Earth.
no they don't stop making shit up, its not relevant anyway
>They think that we can change the climate of mars by nuking the poles
Well it would change it, not sure if it would benefit anything
>They think we can change the atmosphere to make it breathable
why not, people used to think we cant land on the moon
>>73430839
>its actually about moving shorter distances, not moving faster
Care to expand?
>>73430096
Because that would be retarded when you have a hospitable planet with untapped resources.
>>73430426
It'll probably be possible to move a lot of your faculties into a machine over time, taking over for parts of your brain, meaning you get "perfectly" digitized without feeling any separation from the time you were human to the time you became digital, and importantly, without anything biological left behind. Some people will probably pay extra money for that treatment.
I think that's a meaningless distinction, but that doesn't mean I won't pay extra for the treatment.
>>73424781
I just read your source and in no way does it say that is not possible. Don't be a faggot.
>>73427066
>It's just a matter of getting our population on several planets to ensure our species survival.
See, that's kind of my point. By the time we are ready to mount colonization missions, I feel like the definition of our species and what it means to be human will have changed.
We won't look at it as sending robots in to space, but any for of digitized humanity will be considered "legally and socially" human. That point of blurring the line between ai and human minds, redefining what it means to be human, is inevitable at this point.
Look at the change in things like gay acceptance, sjw nonsense, women's rights, etc. In 100 years we have redefined our entire family structure, given voting rights to women and minorities, and are potentially redefining the concept of gender. Personal opinions aside, I see no reason why we won't see similar movements for digital life forms. Giving ai the right to vote, self replicating machines creating "families", organic/synthetic check boxes right next to race/sex on all forms, and so on. In 200 years societal norms are going to be unrecognizable to us today.
>>73430991
The distances in space are so vast that even moving at 99% of the speed of light would be pointless. Manipulating distance (wormholes) is the only possible way as far as science is aware that would make large-scale space exploration possible.
>>73431095
I didn't think of that.
I keep forgetting it's hard to say clearly define life and death at the hypothetical spacemagic level.
>>73431067
>untapped resources
To do exactly what with? Build huts?
There are only so many elements in the universe, you aren't going to find some supersteel material growing from the trees in another planet. You just need farm P-type asteroids, etc. and fabricate whatever you need from those elements. The amount of time and energy wasted visiting planets is massive compared to just using the vessels you used to arrive there, which are already more than capable of self-sustenance.
The only reason to visit planets is for scientific research, similar to the Antarctic, or interfering with the locals, for whatever reason. There's no actual mechanical benefit to colonising a surface.
>>73430991
They want to figure out a way to fold space, because it is believed to be more like a fabric, and simply cut a whole and travel though. Pic related.
You think of things too conventionally, obviously we don't have the understanding or technology yet but in the future I am sure we will
>>73421607
I know right? There's these idiots I know that think the planet isn't flat lol Fuckers will probably fall into the abyss sooner or later.
ayy lmao internet defense force detected
>>73431504
I think you're talking about the Ship of Theseus thought experiment. It's quite interesting when you think about it in terms of replacing body parts with machinery.
Every single cell in your body is replaced annually. Are you the same person that you were ten years ago? I find things like this fascinating, it's a shame philosophy courses and shit devolve into DUDE IS GRASS REAL ARE WE ALL COMPUTERS DUUUUDE or other shite.
>>73431395
How 'vast' a distance is also depends on your frame of reference is regarding your perception of time.
Traveling thousands of lightyears at sub-light speeds with our current timeframe would suck.
But stopping or at least clocking down our rate of perception would probably make it more palatable, for those willing to 'give up' that much usable time.
>>73431395
Eh you're close, you can accelerate things to incredible speeds if you can simultaneously reduce their mass. Currently the method used to transverse large distances is to generate gravity waves of a large enough strength to locally bend space time closer to the target destination thereby allowing much faster and nearly instantaneous travel.
>>73428269
Soma?
>>73431632
if wormholes are proven to be somethign else than just a theory , then we will be able to travel like your pic
>>73421607
>people dream about the future
Everyone laugh at them!
>>73430839
>its not relevant anyway
Yeh we evilved on this planet with this gravity. So unless every martian colonist perpetually does does weight bearing exercises their bones will become brittle - intracellular calcium levels will be whack and youll have a cascade of health problems
>>73431536
>To do exactly what with? Build huts?
The things we do on Earth at the moment
>There are only so many elements in the universe, you aren't going to find some supersteel material growing from the trees in another planet
Completely irrelevant point
>You just need farm P-type asteroids, etc. and fabricate whatever you need from those elements.
Or you could not be a retard and do that on the planet with easier access to resources and easier setting for industries.
>The amount of time and energy wasted visiting planets is massive compared to just using the vessels you used to arrive there
The amount of time, energy, possibilities and efficiency used doing everything in space instead of doing it on a planet is just stupid.
>The only reason to visit planets is for scientific research
We were talking about settling planets, not visiting them. Stop moving the goalposts.
>itt thread scared martian afraid of the great cuckening to come when we colonize space with our superior terran cocks
your bitches are already ours they just don't know it yet
>>73431632
>obviously we don't have the understanding or technology yet
You would be surprised what is possible today.
>>73421607
>can't open a grammar book
>speculates about space
Way to go McBurger
>>73431395
>>73431806
Yep, if we somehow discover the ability to reverse or halt aging through the genome, replacing organs with stem-cell grown ones, robotic hearts, etc., lifespans will increase exponentially, perhaps limitlessly.
A 3000 year trip to a nearby colony might seem undoable right now, without 'generation ships' or whatever the sci-fi term is, but if medicine and science advance to a point where people are able to live infinitely, it won't be undoable.
>>73431536
Well I mean they found unobtanium on pandora growing from trees
>>73432007
You're an absolute retard. You think landing a ship on a planet and trying to build a civilisation there by digging up materials is going to be more efficient than fabricating it in space by farming the limitless supply of asteroids?
Think about shit before you type it out.
>>73432149
Also,
Couldn't there be possible ways of making it feel as if time is going faster than it really is?
>not realizing that humanity will become a race of cyborgs capable of living in any environment
>>73432504
I'm not sure, I've got no education in this regard, but I imagine the sense of time is tied to your mortality.
Imagine being an insect who's lifespan is only a few minutes or hours.
If our lifespan was suddenly increased to hundreds of thousands of years, or something insane like that, I don't think our sense of time would stay the same.
>>73432020
the problem is that its all theory until we try it
>>73432149
>perhaps limitless
If its made of matter it has something called a half life, it can't last forever in that form. Our brains will become mush and erode.
Colonizing worlds is on the same level as flight or something.
It's hard for us to imagine how it would work and we probably think it's impossible right now. However some years down the line we don't know what kind of discoveries will be made to make it actually possible.
This always happens, do you think people in the middle aged thought we could ever fly in the sky like birds? Probably not, they would have no idea how something like that would be possible. But it happened, we have lots of things that fly these days. Some guys even made a functional hovercraft this year.
Everything is possible, we just don't know it yet.
I swear we literally had this thread like a week ago and OP is just copy pasting his posts
>>73432504
If we can approach the speed of light closely enough, you won't even have to. I don't know what the actual timing is, but it significantly slows down for people traveling extremely fast-- A one hundred light-year journey may only take one subjective year. At the speed of light proper, time completely stops, meaning that you can be anywhere in the universe instantly from your own frame of reference. Which is great if you don't care about all of human history passing you by during your trip.
>>73425998
chuckled
>>73432504
Also suspended animation.
