What does /pol/ think of Terence McKenna?
Is he redpilled?
>>72462177
Wasn't he CIA?
For the most part it is interesting to at least be willing to listen to him. Red pilled? Well, maybe but not in the classical sense.
>>72462365
No. If anything, he preached against them and openly spoke about what he perceived to be "disinfo".
He's a great guy. He's like an amateur philosopher. You can listen to lectures he gave, and they are mind-opening. You may relate to a lot of what he says, or you may be hearing those ideas for the first time. That's why a lot of people like him, he puts abstract ideas into words that they understand but never could explain. I've heard many people say that.
>>72462365
Everyone is CIA.
But his lectures are good, everyone should take an interest in them.
>>72462365
He's had contact with the three letters. Not sure if he was a shill or not; His lectures are very interesting however.
Technically Uncle Ted (Kaczynski) was CIA
but he was redpilled as fuck too
He was all about gaia and supported the free love movement. He was a progressive
>>72463155
I'm assuming contact began with the CIA contacting him. He also did preach a lot about psychedelics.
Or do you think it was some kind of back and forth communication sharing some kind of intel? I've never heard of him being connected to the CIA so I'm curious about this.
>>72463205
Or maybe it could be the same in this case. There's a lot of things McKenna says that I really think people should take to heart.
>>72463412
He first acquired DMT through the CIA. I think they gave it to him to see what he thought about it.
Sadly I've not gotten a chance to speak with "entities" myself.
>>72462177
His band, the Flight of the Conchords, are pretty great.
>>72462177
Most people don't realize he was the source of the 2012 end of the world meme. He used the Tai Ching, and someone else replaced it with the Mayan calendar.
>>72462177
https://youtu.be/VWj0xgG6heo
Even if he speaks crazy talk, I find his voice soothing. Could listen to him talk for hours
He thinks fungi came from space.
They probably did, desu
>What does /pol/ think of [Insert King of Junkies here]?
>Is he redpilled?
He was pilled alright. And the answer is always no.
>>72463863
>Even if he speaks crazy talk
I wouldn't exactly call it "crazy talk". Telling people to listen to themselves and stay focused in the present moment isn't exactly hocus pocus. What's the point if you're only listening to someone for their soothing voice?
Other based mushroom guy
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lbGRMj9tP5M
>>72464041
>King of Junkies
Funny thing to call someone who preaches nonjudgement. Even funny if you think that 'junkie' refers to psychedelic users.
>>72464280
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQq_XmhBTgg
Watch this. He's speaking sense but the video fucking hurts to watch.
>>72464286
I consider junkies to be the type of people who add a negative association to perfectly acceptable ideas. Although it's stupid to dismiss an idea based off of it's users (and bluepilled as fuck).
>>72464516
hehe yeah ive seen that one before as well
>>72464516
He is true that people should learn to control their focus. It's all a matter of learning how to fully control yourself, and be aware of what goes on in your head.
>>72462177
A couple years ago his date of death changed
I found this out when I read on his wikipedia page that he died in the year 2000, when I remember reading about speeches he was giving to colleges in the year 2008 to 2009, around about the time I started smoking weed and using stumbleupon to find weird webpages
could just be me, right?
well a couple of people had a thread about the exact same thing on abovetopsecret going at around about the time I figured all of this out, so it wasn't
what I'm trying to say is I think the dude got berenstained
anybody else have similar memories?
>>72467352
People seem to remember him dying in the late 90s.
The whole Berenstein thing has to do with people not being good with kike additions to words. Stein, stain, stine, no one remembers this shit.
A smart guy that ultimately fell for the "PSYCHEDELICS OPEN UR THIRD EYE BRO TRIPPING EQUALS ENLIGHTENMENT" meme. His voice makes for good samples, though:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNdZxoGKEPw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rMz21QZ_lCQ
>>72467533
you see I remember him being alive way past 2000, at least
I sometimes wonder if he want "too far" and tripped back in time
He literally thought we should reduce the male population to a ratio of 1:3 to 1:4. Part of the reason for this was so that men could get more pussy and have 3-4 bitches at a time. But the reason for that was so that men would have less control in a relationship. He blamed masculinity and male dominance for the majority of the world's problems.
>>72467533
no there was a whole thing about an alternate universe, like "luke, i am your father" is "no, i am your father", and "mirror mirror on the wall" being wrong
it's still probably just retards mis-quoting popular culture- if there were truly an alternate universe doing shit like that it would have an effect on day-to-day shit and history not just pop culture quotes
>>72462177
Poor confused materialist lost in his own head. Sad!
Not interested in drugs myself, but he seemed like a good man. Interesting things to say at the least.
>>72463682
And that was based on very, very bad math he came to while high on DMT. A function that mapped "novelty" over time.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terence_McKenna#Novelty_theory_and_Timewave_Zero
Batshit, confirmation bias.
>>72467926
well in my universe Terence was a popular speaker and there was more footage of him speaking to larger crowds
most I can find on youtube these days is the odd taped interview with him or a small appearance somewhere that was recorded, it seems like he died before his ideas really took off
which is weird for me
I swear down he was alive and then suddenly he hadn't been alive for a long fucking time
it freaks me out man
I'm prepared to accept the berenstain bears are just a word confusion but this freaks me out
>>72467926
It's cute how pop-sci comes around though.
>O-oh that's right the changes would be subtle.. okay..
>So the Berenstain Books had different names!
In an alternative universe the planet wouldn't even be here. People don't realize what an alternative universe truly means. And changes won't be subtle changes in society, it's subtle changes in the entire universe.
When you're so cuck you think world = society = life
>>72468068
>Poor confused materialist lost in his own head. Sad!
He was quite the opposite.
>>72468080
>Not interested in drugs myself
He dips into the philosophical aspects, which I don't think is something that requires any admiration of drugs. I also like how he talks about the scientific aspects in addition.
>>72468328
Can you remember anything else? Any little detail helps.
Google "universe leaking into ours" and you will find recent reports. Oh no scary
>>72463022
>>72463412
Not clear who he was working with:
>And certainly when I reached La Chorerra in 1971 I had a price on my head by the FBI, I was running out of money, I was at the end of my rope. And then, uh "they" recruited me and said, "you know, with a mouth like yours there's a place for you in our organization". And I've worked in deep background positions about which the less said the better. And then about 15 years ago they shifted me into public relations and I've been there to the present
http://www.gnosticmedia.com/McKenna-Agent
The audio is down a bit just before the coments.
>>72463641
That's really neat that you mention that. While tripping on dimitri I've telepathically communicated with some guy claiming to represent the 3-letters, they use some type of new high-end psych that hasn't even reached public users yet, it allows them to project into the ether for extended periods with zero stability issues.... they even offered me some work, which I declined.
They're actually pretty cool dudes, albeit a little scary.
very
World leaders should trip on mushrooms together
>>72468328
he talked about that too....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ne3K23sG_2E
I remember something about him talking too big trance/goa partys, but no idea if its pre or post 2k
wiki says death was april 3rd 2k
>>72469182
>He was quite the opposite.
He certainly was not.
>>72468882
It is nothing new, most of these concepts exist within of course vedic and gnostic tradition, but more recently in Jungian writings.
>>72469490
>while I was on mind altering drugs, I hallucinated
>The hallucinations were totally real, guys, and not just my brain short circuiting
Is that m-m-misandry?
https://terencemckenna.wikispaces.com/+Mushrooms,+Sex+and+Society
Can you briefly explain the theory you put forth in Food of the Gods?
>The primate tendency to form dominance heirarchies was temporarily interrupted for about 100,000 years by the psilocybin in the paleolithic diet. This behavioral style of male dominance was chemically interrupted by psilocybin in the diet, so it allowed the style of social organization called partnership to emerge, and that that occured during the period when language, altruism, planning, moral values, esthetics, music and so forth -- everything associated with humanness -- emerged during that period. About 12,000 years ago, the mushrooms left the human diet because they were no longer available, due to climatological change and the previous tendency to form dominance heirarchies re-emerged. So, this is what the historic dilemma is: we have all these qualities that were evolved during the suppression of male dominance that are now somewhat at loggerheads with the tendency of society in a situation of re-established male dominance. The paleolithic situation was orgiastic and this made it impossible for men to trace lines of male paternity, consequently there was no concept of 'my children' for men. It was 'our children' meaning 'we, the group.' This orgiastic style worked into the effects of higher doses of psilocybin to create a situation of frequent boundary dissolution. That's what sexuality is, on one level, about and it's what psychedelics, on another level, are about. With the termination of this orgiastic, mushroom using style of existence, a very neurotic and repressive social style emerged which is now worldwide and typical of western civilization.
>https://youtu.be/_IO7pHD3X9M?t=4265
1:11:05 - 1:18:00
>y-yes...a 3 to 1 ratio of women to men in a world population of 1 billion (starting with developed countries) is a great idea
>>72462177
Who here has met the machine elves?
>>72469911
http://www.lycaeum.org/~sputnik/McKenna/Evolution/
>The way I analyze the modern predicament -- pollution, male dominance, there are a million ways to say it -- the overriding problems are brought on by the existence of the ego, a maladaptive behavioral complex in the psyche that gets going like a tumor. If it's not treated -- if there's not pharmacological intervention -- it becomes the dominant constellation of the personality.
http://dominatorculture.com/post/71465588944/a-psychedelic-point-of-view-terence-mckenna
>But eventually it going be understood who’s to blame, and it isn’t the tribesman of New Guinea or the Indians of Siberia. It is Western, Male, Scientific, Technological Hubris that has claimed center stage like a noisy drunk, and then just preceded to hold us all prisoner, while it acted out a process that is rooted in its own traumatic birth, in the sundering of the symbiotic relationship to the vegetable matrix that characterized prehistory.
>And most of us are accustomed to thinking of intuition as something feminine, mysterious, unexplainable and sort of magical. And also I think, because we live in a male-‐dominant society, we undervalue it. If someone claims intuition, our position is probably one of prove it. Doubt in the face of the face of the assertion, you see.
>How much of an experience of understanding do you have when you examine what you examine what modern physics is saying about the origin of the universe. I submit – not much, because it is so clearly the product of abstraction. The product of the phonetic alphabet, the male ego, they set all the interesting stuff back in the first three minutes – who can go and look?
>>72469730
>He certainly was not.
T-that's it? Nothing to at least tell me why you think that he is? I'm legitiately curious.
>>72469911
Feminism, science, and philosophy is like mixing orange juice and toothpaste.
>>72469756
take a breakthrough dose of DMT
then come back and we can talk
also what good old terrence has to say about it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6Pg1RU1Kxc
>>72469756
>I have zero experience or knowledge on the matter
>Therefore I am an unquestionable expert and you suck
>>72467606
Hi Simon!
>>72470047
Him and those of his ilk, like Leary or Shulgin were firm, complete materialists, damn near atomists that deluded themselves into believing they were not, because they found a method to project their own closed, little human minds to themselves, and mistook it for pneuma, while they were in fact regressing to pure soma. Smaller than children, a narcissistic junkie.
Very uninteresting and superficial.
>>72470297
How dare you believe in the metaphysics.
*Goes back to praying to a visage of his savior's execution*
>>72470107
>>72470297
I've done more psychedelics than you, kid, but I don't try to act like it isn't just synapses firing irregularly.
>>72470809
>kid
This is the surefire way to convince someone you have more experience with them on a subject matter. Nice one, mate.
Also why do you dismiss the "why" with the "how"? "
>>72463022
especially you aidan you're a big guy
>>72462177
DUDE WEEDMT
>>72470809
that's in no way a satisfying explanation of the psychedelic experience
that's similar to say a computer is just electrical signals, ignoring the software and the virtual worlds created on the physics of a computer
the difference is, that we understand we less about the brain, consciousness and the nature of the worlds you can visit in trance states through psychedelics, meditation, drumming, dancing and other methods
ever been contacted an entity? ever lost contact to your body and experienced ego death?
>>72471176
>Also why do you dismiss the "why" with the "how"? "
Because it's far-fetched to go from "my brain is overclocked" to "I'm speaking to CIA agents that are also astrally projecting." There is no plausible mechanism for that other than mystical unfalsifiable bullshit. Taking psychedelics seems to go hand in hand with a false feeling of enlightenment and knowledge, so it's hard to convince people otherwise. Experience is powerful to the human mind, and when it's in a state where it can't actually process these experiences, it loves to fill in the gaps.
Psychedelics are wonderful, don't get me wrong, I've never not enjoyed them, and even when I wasn't enjoying them at the time, they provided me with introspection, but the I SPOKE TO THE MACHINE ELVES types are preventing anyone from taking the medical potential of them seriously.
>>72471591
>that's similar to say a computer is just electrical signals, ignoring the software and the virtual worlds created on the physics of a computer
And no one is going to call Crysis real, no matter how convincing of a simulation it is. It's still just a sum of 1s and 0s. Your brain is capable of simulating "reality", we do it every night when we dream, but I would argue that thinking the source of this reality is anything other than the sum of electrochemical signals is magical thinking.
>ever been contacted an entity? ever lost contact to your body and experienced ego death?
Yes and yes. Schizophrenics are "contacted by entities" all the time, but you don't see anyone taking them seriously.
Looked quick at thumbnail and thought that was Tyrion.
>>72470718
Basically this. Staring at your own eyelids doesn't make a religion. It's also not so different than all that Marxist metaphysical social analysis and psychoanalysis stuff. Pretends to be materialist but actually functions as metaphysics while pretending to have some scientific credibility.
>>72472115
Men used to look at rocks and the sun and make a religion out of it. Now we just upped the ante and made it a more complicated form. A crucified man is not that much deeper a symbol than a rock.
>>72467858
Not entirely true. He blamed "dominator culture"
>>72471894
>There is no plausible mechanism for that other than mystical unfalsifiable bullshit
There we come to the communication problem we have here. Die hard materialistic world views tend to discredit everything that sounds "mystical". I'm all for scientific method, but unfortunately, there is little serious investigation of these topics, which leaves us with more unorthodox sources like traditional shamanic cultures, mystics and phylosophers like McKenna
They give interesting food for thought. I am not saying that any of this is reality, but I deny to push it aside as "mystical quackery"
>I would argue that thinking the source of this reality is anything other than the sum of electrochemical signals is magical thinking.
On this basis, you cannot even be sure that the reality you experience now is objectively material. It could all be "just" a simulation.
In quantum physics everything dissolves into energy, there is no matter and many things that modern theoretical physics postulates is more or less "mystical unfalsifiable BS"
We simply do not have the methods yet, but it would be amazing, if we would develope them to go further down the rabbit hole and sort out the BS
>Schizophrenics
again, McKenna has intersting things to say about this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8fTVvqTk9lU
>>72473634
found one without annoying music in the background
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HJ8W8Gj7p64
>>72469490
literally wat???
>>72472464
>>72472115
“The light of a lamp will never shine in you again. The voice of bridegroom and bride will never be heard in you again. Your merchants were the world’s important people. By your magic spell (pharmakia) all the nations were led astray."
-Apocalypse 18:23
>>72473634
>They give interesting food for thought. I am not saying that any of this is reality, but I deny to push it aside as "mystical quackery"
I agree, but there are a lot of types that immediately jump to the mystical argument. We are slowly learning more and more about the brain, and the gaps are clearing up. Disassociation and "ego death" are failures of part of the brain that can be replicated in a laboratory, and visual/audio hallucinations are strongly suggested to be over activity of the dopamine system causing the brain to interpret noise as meaningful. I'm just more skeptical I guess. Sure, we can argue all day that reality is subjective and interpreted through out senses, but there are some semi-objective things we can agree to agree on, like the scientific method. Even if we're all living in a shared hallucination, we at least seem to agree on how to find out how the hallucination operates. If there is no mechanism we can investigate and replicate, then how can we say anything about it? Taking a bunch of DMT and then saying that since you talked to machine elves, this is the proof of an astral plane is like taking someone's word that they spoke to the Virgin Mary as proof that God exists. I guess my rambling frustration is that we could have these answers, and there could be a lot of medical potential from psys, but everyone thinks they have all of the answers after a hit of acid, even when their facilities to interpret and process things are also under the effects of the drug.
McKenna's talk was interesting, but it seemed like it boiled down to "well society is sick, so anything that disagrees with it must be right." There is a lot of stigma and false information attached to mental illness and drugs, but that doesn't mean that states like schizophrenia and psychosis should be desired. I watched a friend succumb to psychosis from amphetamine addiction, and I will say there was nothing profound or enlightened about his state.
>>72471894
What we do notice is how amazing our minds are, and the more aware you are of the inside of your own head and the more in control you are, the better you can probe your mind on psychedelics. This is why a lot of people are astounded at how creative their brains are, and the kind of things it can make up. That's you, folks. Now that you've witnessed this great power, you shall learn how to use it.
In all seriousness the ability to see your own potentials and how your mind works, while you're in such a state of creativity, gives one a greater understanding of themselves and is a very great way to motivate them. Certainly motivates most people.
>>72475029
Yeah, there are quite a few people who are just plain delusional.
That's one of the big problems we encounter, to differentiate between the things that come from "material reality", those that are product of our own mind and things that MAY be from other sources.
I am in awe about the astral planes and I cannot accept any explanation a la "just the dopaminergic system missfunctioning" to explain all this.
There are just things I have seen, that I cannot accept as products of wild imagination.
Therefore I'm listening to cultures and people who have ideas about it and try to make sense of what the fuck is up with all this shit.
But the scientific community is stepping up their game: clinical tests for psychotherapy with DMT, MDMA, LSD and Mushrooms, MRI studies, a new generation of scientists coming in that are open to new hypothesis.
I think we can hope to see some interesting results and new theories take shape in the next decade or two.
>I watched a friend succumb to psychosis from amphetamine addiction, and I will say there was nothing profound or enlightened about his state.
Modern medicine has really no good idea what to do with psychosis schizophrenia and similar states of consciousness. Therefore it really is hell. Especially if you lose track of what is everyday reality and what is not.
That is the hole argument: We can't really help those people and we have to chance the way we think about these states of mind, to find a way to deal with it. Some tribal shamanistic cultures can give a frame, that helps schizophrenic lead a live without too much suffering.
>>72475029
btw, nice to have a reasonable and polite conversation at this place, that does not end in name calling, stupidity and general faggotry
>>72476912
Smoke Muhammad's dick hans
Meet Allah
>>72476912
>I am in awe about the astral planes and I cannot accept any explanation a la "just the dopaminergic system missfunctioning" to explain all this.
But why? The sense of awe and wonder comes from the drug itself; I've been on psys many times and felt that same sense of child-like wonder. The things the brain are capable of are quite miraculous, but it seems like you can't take this miracle at face value and instead must seek an even greater explanation for it, which again I posit is fueled by the effects of the drug. A computer is made no less wonderful by the fact that it's just a bunch of elections whizzing around in a structured order, so why can't it be same for the brain?
>>72478075
Because I have experiences and heard stories of things that are simply not possible to explain with these concepts.
I have a good understanding of the psychological basics, but at some point it just doesn't do it any more.
And then there are all these cultures that have long practical experience with these substances.
Sure, a lot of it is similar to Christians seeing the virgin Mary, but if you boil it down, there are many concepts of these realms, that are really really similar in nature.
That's btw. also something that scientists who studied these substances have to come to terms with. Examples would be Rick strassman with his DMT studies (DMT: the spirit molecule) and Stanislav Grof doing studies with LSD in the 50s
They try to keep inside the frame of scientific understanding, but at some point they write: Fuck it, this is what happened, it sounds totally insane: we have no idea what's going on here we really can not explain this shit.
If you trust science too much, you won't know what they don't want you to know.
>>72479803
current scientist =/= scientific method
Scientific method is the best bet we have to get closer to the things that are really going on. If we neglect it, we fall for the BS.
Current science has a lot of BS in certain fields, because of politics, methods of funding research, materialistic dogma and taboo.
>>72463863
>I find his voice soothing. Could listen to him talk for hours
God, yes. There's just something about the way he speaks.
I think it's his (perhaps deliberate?) choice of using unorthodox speech cadences, and simply the timbre of his voice. He doesn't sound like he could ever raise his voice in anger about anything, with that timbre.
I would liken his usage of cadences to syncopation in contemporary music - something he predicted, actually - or dissonant chords, in that they all "draw you in" for more. The mind is hardwired to want to hear a resolution to a dissonance, and syncopation stimulates the brain in a certain way; and I think McKenna must have drawn from at least these basic concepts when he decided to start lecturing.
You can listen to him lecture about a topic for 3 hours without losing focus because his cadences are unorthodox. He draws attention to the words in his speech that you would otherwise miss, or not find as significant a focal point. A fascinating man overall, really.
>>72467858
Wouldnt men have more control because they are more scarce? Sexwise, at least.
>>72480262
Truth
>>72480711
At least there'd be no Trigglypuffs around
>>72463408
technically a regressive
his ideal society was pre-agricultural and void of ego
>>72467606
AKSHUYUALLY
