play guitar for 8 years
never been in a band
what do?
you write music and then show your musical buds and go from their
>>60481146
make a Craigslist post and find a band. You'll be so glad you did.
I'm in a band rn and I love it but everyone else is pretty pleb. Like not that I'm super patrish or whatever, but our drummer listens to Dream Theatre and other shit modern prog and our lead guitar listens to really shit stuff like Jet (he doesn't even listen to albums, just single songs.) I've managed to get feedback into some songs, but nobody wants to experiment or anything, they're literally in it for the money which is fucking stupid.
>>60483323
Oh man, I have a friend like that. He's a guitarist but he only listens to single songs - not even whole albums of poppy stuff like Foo Fighters or Steel Panther.
I considered asking him to make a band with me, since he can play bass too and he's easy to deal with but trying to get him to listen to new music is such a pain, I loaned him Songs for the Deaf and Pinkerton once and he found them like too weird or something. I don't understand, why do people take up an instrument if they aren't that interested in music?
>>60481704
>>60482640
This. Make music and find a band or go solo.
kill yourself
it never gets better
>>60484258
The worst part is he's actually fucking good. Like he has no idea what he's doing but he just plays really well bc he's been learning for like 9 years. My band has introduced him to some good stuff like New Order/Joy Division, but he never listens to albums still.
>>60484258
fucking this
it seems like the only good players these days are also huge plebs who have never written anything for themselves and the only innovative and creative people suck at playing
>>60484620
>The only innovative and creative people suck at playing
Then how do we know that they're creative and innovative?
>>60484620
that's because people tend to be the most creative when they're constricted. be it limited knowledge of musical theory, no good recording equipment, etc.
>>60483323
>they're literally in it for the money
Lol, that's when I realized they were complete idiots
>>60484751
>that's because people tend to be the most creative when they're constricted
This makes sense, my friend writes better songs than I, even though he doesn't know a bit of theory.
I'm kind of jelly
>>60484953
>>60483323
My band had a falling out because of this. We were all really good, but one of our guitarists was in to really complicated guitar technique involving slapping and a shit load of left hand work, similar to Jon Gom or John Butler.
When you play really obscure stuff, you simply won't get the same attention that you would if you played fun rock. It might bother you man, but a lot of people want to play music that they know the audience will like. Calling Dream Theater shit is ridiculous and Jet is some of the most fun blues rock that there is. Maybe you just need to accept that a lot of people don't want to go out and listen to pretentious bullshit.
>>60483323
>>60484953
I know you guys are going to fight this vehemently, but it can be perceived that playing really obscure shit that very few people will vibe to at a bar, restaurant or club can be viewed as selfish or elitist. When music is made really unique and complicated, it loses its fun vibe. Being a beginning band, you should play more mass appeal stuff because the owners won't ask for you to come back when people aren't feeling the vibe that your band puts out, and music is a group experience. Playing what you want to play and not what a lot of people want to hear can definitely be seen as selfish in a way.
>>60483323
>>60484953
There's nothing wrong with playing a few complex songs with cool time signatures and complicated melodies, but most of your stuff should be shit that your average person would enjoy passively and that appeals generally to people.
>>60485356
Depends what kind of music you want to make. If you (the artist) aren't satisfied with it, then you shouldn't bother. Being poppy for the sake of being poppy is just selling out, imo. Every artist has a different sound, everyone perceived and interprets music in their own unique way, so if you want to be a good musician, you should hone in on 'your' sound and refine it.
The fans will come after that.
>>60485582
I admire your aversion to "selling out" but I think it's a little more complicated here. You literally will not get a consistent gig at a bar, restaurant or club if you play inaccessible music. I'm also not talking about being poppy for the sake of being poppy, I'm saying play more general appeal music not just because it makes sense pracitcally, but because it's way more fun to get positive feedback from your audience. That's why people talk about playing to your audience. You can maintain your mindset, but don't ever bitch when you can't get consistent gigs. You're shooting yourself in the foot because of some perceived need for integrity, but then you just end up playing in your buddy's apartment with 2 fans.
>>60485582
What ended up happening to my band was that the guitarist left to do his own shit alone, and we went on to play for money and get bitches all around town, and people recognized us at parties, smoked us up and bought us shots all the time.
He never got gigs, now he's made his music more appealing and is starting to work the bar circuit alone. Reality sucks.
>>60485216
>>60485299
>>60485356
Thanks for the advice n shit senpai. I don't have any pretense that people at bars and restaurants want to hear fucking noise rock, so we don't play it. I'm more annoyed that some of the guys look at music too narrowly. Like the guy who likes Dream Theater (I know they're talented, sounds wanky to my ears tho) thinks we need a complex structure and shit for ever song, and everyone needs to know exactly what we're doing like the back of our hands and basically he doesn't want improvisation. The guy who likes Jet (straight up no on them being any good) just wants us to play rock songs when I suggest that we play, ironically enough, more mass appeal songs that will not only make people like us more, but will also make us stand out more than a rock band that looks at music too narrowly.
One of the best moments of my life was playing "I Want You Back" at a house party and having everyone sing along, but I see playing that kind of music as a sort of experimentation for a rock band (we weren't sure if it was going to be good at all). I don't know, I'm hoping that the clash of different influences and interests can make some fucking great music that's mass appeal yet experimental, like Bowie or Talking Heads.
>>60485786
No problem man. The hardest thing is finding the perfect balance in your music.
>>60481704
>>60482640
>>60484258
im a kissless virgin, have no friends etc, how am i supposed to just waltz onto craigslist and join a band, people hate me and think im weird why would strangers on craigslist be any less critical
>>60486131
Jesus christ man idk but I hope your life gets less fucking depressing.
>>60486178
No, I'm fucked. Oh well.
>>60486226
Fuckin see a therapist or something bro
>>60486226
You need CBT or something.
>play guitar for five years
>play piano for two
>end up getting involved in a hiphop group because I had limited knowledge about DAWs
what the fuck
>>60486337
Lol hey man at least you got a group. My college bandmates are all 60 miles away and my best friend isn't that good at guitar.
>>60485786
You sound like my kinda guy, for what it's worth. To be a good 'rock' band, imo, you have to do more than just rock, like, take sounds from different genres, different styles and draw them back into your own sound.
Sure there are bands (like the Beatles, at least in my opinion) that went so far with that mentality that they felt like a jack of all trades, without being a master of any particular sound (like Brian Wilson with Pet Sounds) but if you aren't listening and making 'new' sound horizons, how can you expect to be more than a flash in the pan?
Now that I think about it, being a good and exciting band is a fine balancing act between multiple differing mentalities isn't it? That's probably the reason you end up with so many pleb musicians.
>>60484620
I want to argue against this but everyone I've ever known at uni who was a music (instrumental or vocal) major usually had very bland and somewhat constricted tastes. Even people who listened to top-tier jazz listened exclusively to that, and nothing else.
>>60486506
except they're all twats and literally the only track that I've produced that I actually like, they refuse to write to because they say it's trash
>>60486627
Yeah, a balancing act between different mentalities is what my fav bands (Anco, Velvet Underground, Sonic Youth) all do really well.
>>60486879
Fucking music courses are a joke, not only because of the qualification themselves but the people too. The women always gravitate towards the role of singer because they want to be big like Adele/Beyonce but have no real interest in music and can't play a single instrument.
Then you get the people who are too dim to study a more valuable qualification/the junkies that smoke pot all day and also the guys who are studying music even though, according to them, music is dead and the last good artist was Michael Jackson.
Can you further define what you mean by "play the guitar"? Can you improv in any key? Can you recognize 2-5 patterns? Can you do jazz improv?
If you can regurgitate the dorian scale in Dm7 and Ebm7 for Impressions than bam you got 5 minutes of stuff right there. Throw in Autumn Leaves and now you are getting somewhere. If you can improv, or atleast comp, and know your circle of fifths so you know your keys, then you can probably find alot of jam bands that play jazz or swing or whatever at your local frame gallery or back alley bar. Depending on your city.
If you are looking to write music more than just simply perform it, then you don't need anyone else and you don't necessarily need the theory that I'm talking about. Just need to know song-writing techniques: how to write a cadence, how to resolve a 2nd position to a 5th position, how to change keys in a song without sounding awful, how to write a bridge, a hook, a verse, etc etc.
You can be Micachu and the Shapes and not worry about any of that shit and just let it flow like water or you can be like King Crimson and obsess over the details and learn a ton of theory. Whatever you do just start making, recording, and performing music. Show it to people, if it's worth a shit, they will want to play with you. Play open mic nights, after you get off stage go grab a pint at the bar and just hang out for a bit, people will walk up to you and comment on your playing. Ask them if they play anything. "Oh you play keys? That's great, wana jam sometime?"
I'm more of a Jazz guy and I don't write much just perform but I know alot of people that started jam bands that way - just playing open mic nights and people come up to them when they are done.
>>60481146
play guitar for 5 years
im an idiot that can only do blues improv
>>60484620
As someone who for about 5 year played 7-9 hours everyday I think I can shed a little light on this.
Basically when ever I play I feel like I have to add some theory or difficult technique in everything I do and it was kind of because I wanted to justify the time I spent practicing and learning theory.
With song writing no matter what note or chord I play any and every note that can follow can be justified by a scale or whatever. There is no mystery to anything and any mood I want to create I know exactly how to do it with out trying out a bunch of different things.
Every melody I create just feels like parts of a scale because the more scales you learn the more you realize it is impossible to not play a scale.
It really takes the mystery out of music in a way, although now I listen to a lot of early Industrial music where there often is no melodies or chord progressions at all. In any music I have ever tried to create, I try to keep the guitar or piano out of it as much as possible.
It is really hard trying to find like minded people to play music with though, especially since all the musicians I know expect me to want to play guitar music.
>>60487597
You need to further your understanding of theory if you are finding it more a vice than a tool. I haven't played 7-9 hours a day for 5 years straight, but I have been studying and teaching for about 10 years, specifically jazz, but also classical and blues, and the whole point is once you know the rules you are playing by you better understand how to break them. That's what jazz is all about, really.
As an example, once you memorize the full 3-octave scale shapes which I'm sure you have down 100% if you've been playing that much then you now know not every note than you can play but also every note than isn't supposed to be played, and that's where it gets fun.
Knowing the rules of the game your playing will never hurt your ability to play. Ignorance is bliss, sure, but knowledge is also beautiful.
You can take it either way. Either you learn about the Universe and become bored with it, or you live in a constant state of awe in it's existence. Same thing with music, no matter how much theory you've learned, and I've learned alot, it doesn't change the fact that there are only 12 tones. 12 fuckin tones. and within those 12 tones people come up with new shit every single day, for years and years and years, and they will continue to do so.
I believe you should re-evaluate your relationship with theory, but I'm an old hoot.
>>60487423
>Can you further define what you mean by "play the guitar"? Can you improv in any key?
yes
>Can you recognize 2-5 patterns?
no
>Can you do jazz improv?
how is jazz any different from regular improv
>
>If you can regurgitate the dorian scale in Dm7 and Ebm7 for Impressions than bam you got 5 minutes of stuff right there.
playing one scale over 2 chords for 5 minutes sounds fucking awful
>Throw in Autumn Leaves and now you are getting somewhere. If you can improv
yes
> or atleast comp,
i can barely comp
>and know your circle of fifths so you know your keys,
never bothered with any of that
> then you can probably find alot of jam bands that play jazz or swing or whatever at your local frame gallery or back alley bar. Depending on your city.
I live in a shithole bumfuck town
>>60481146
go to lots of really good music festivals and concerts and talk to a lot of the people there
>>60487908
quit telling yourself you're a kissless virgin and try acting like a man
you'll never get anywhere being a faggot and you know it so suck it up quit complaining and do your best
idk drop acid at a festival or something jesus christ get out of the house
>>60487827
The distinction made between "can you improv" and "can you jazz improv" is because if you go to any school of music and take improv classes Jazz is generally seperate because it is considered a more advanced area of improvisation. In a jazz standard you will be drawing a "road map" through the chord changes, switching keys very often, being able to think in numbers (I.E. scale degrees) and be needing to switch between modes very effortlessly. The distinction is only made due to it's difficulty compared to improving in (most) other genres of music.
Impressions can be great, it's a tad boring if you know it well, but it can be a great piece to fill 5 minutes, and ofcourse like any standard you can change it up as much as you like really.
You don't know your circle of fifths but you can improv in any given key?
Live in a shithole town? That is unfortunate. Only advice for that is uh, move towns I guess haha!
>>60487800
I completely get what you are saying but even when I do play in and out of key to get that kind of outside sound it still feels like I'm following the rules because that sound is well established.
I feel like the rules can't be broken in the way that you can't just break the laws of physics.
Also I'm clinically depressed and scared to take my meds because they increase risk of seizures,
that might have something to do with my attitude about this stuff
>>60488006
thanks, dad.
>>60488044
>You don't know your circle of fifths but you can improv in any given key?
why do i need some magic circle to shift the root of a scale to a different fret.
>>60488144
lol i bet your dad thinks you're a faggot
you'll never know what it feels like to bring pride to your father's eyes
you will never be a success with that attitude
>>60488210
I'll never do a lot of things you dumb nigger, what is this a Gatorade commercial?
>>60488210
>>60488044
>You don't know your circle of fifths but you can improv in any given key?
>>60488144
1. The pattern of the scale changes given the position of the root. What scales are you even playing when you improv? Do you know which scales to use during which types of chords?
2. Circle of fifths is a very basic theory tool, it is not nessecary, but if someone told me they can improv in any key and I told them to "walk the fifths" and they had no idea what I meant, I would consider not letting them fill in for my regular guy. It's one of those tools that is generally learned before moving onto more advanced things like Improv.
3. When I say Improv, I'm not talking about just making shit up. I'm talking about being able to discern what key a given song is in on your own, figure the chord pattern of the key so you know which scales to be switching between during which chord changes, and then when to add things like accents. When to slow down, when to speed up, when to cadence a position, when to play staccato, when to play legato, when to play fortissimo, etc etc. There is structure to a good improv, and that structure is also improved during the improv, but it sounds to me like you think I mean "can you play some notes of the major scale in any key"? in which yes. All you would need to do is move the root and regurgitate the one or two octave major scale you have memorized. Or possibly you've memorized the minor pentatonic because blues is always popular.
Truth of the matter is alot of folks myself included have given you advice and you have chosen to not accept any of it because your self-deprivation leads to a self-fulfilling prophecy of never changing anything.
I'm done here, if you wana join a band then join one. If you wana be alone then be alone. Don't be a candyass about it.
>>60488360
>>1. The pattern of the scale changes given the position of the root. What scales are you even playing when you improv? Do you know which scales to use during which types of chords?
It absolutely does fucking not. What are you smoking? Cause whatever it is I want 2 of them.
>2. Circle of fifths is a very basic theory tool, it is not nessecary, but if someone told me they can improv in any key and I told them to "walk the fifths" and they had no idea what I meant, I would consider not letting them fill in for my regular guy. It's one of those tools that is generally learned before moving onto more advanced things like Improv.
Yawn
>3. When I say Improv, I'm not talking about just making shit up. I'm talking about being able to discern what key a given song is in on your own, figure the chord pattern of the key so you know which scales to be switching between during which chord changes, and then when to add things like accents. When to slow down, when to speed up, when to cadence a position, when to play staccato, when to play legato, when to play fortissimo, etc etc. There is structure to a good improv, and that structure is also improved during the improv, but it sounds to me like you think I mean "can you play some notes of the major scale in any key"? in which yes. All you would need to do is move the root and regurgitate the one or two octave major scale you have memorized. Or possibly you've memorized the minor pentatonic because blues is always popular.
Try just telling me the key of the song or give me the chords or something...? I know 40ish~ scales.
>>60488113
Wellbutrin huh. I was on that for a while. The seizure risk is scary, and I imagine if you are taking wellbutrin (bupropion) then you also got some anxiety eh? not supposed to combine alcohol with it. They have you on the 150mg XR or the 300? I stayed at 150 and never had a problem with seizures, even drank on it from time to time no problem.
Life gets better. Gotta make decisions that will in the future make it easier to enjoy things, but overall it's not too bad. Even if it's clinical, mine is too, it can be calmed. It might never go away, but it can be managed. Life can be enjoyable. I promise.
>>60488443
You are an idiot.
>>60488544
is that the best you got, femboy?
>>60488513
I have the 150mg XR, good to know that it was fine for you.
