Can we have a theory thread?
music education and music theory stifles creativity and promotes conformity: fact or fiction?
>>54284836
There's evidence that suggests it.
Even Jimi Hendrix knew zero music theory. Michael Gira...MC Ride. The best musicians don't give a fuck
![Beyond_belief_fact_or_fiction[1].jpg](https://i.imgur.com/H6flsmj.jpg "Beyond_belief_fact_or_fiction[1].jpg")
>>54284836
>>54284806
what's this stupposed to represent? I know that the outer note is what makes each inner chord a minor, but that's not the circle of fifths.
be cautious of following these systems. i write music, and i try to avoid music theory as much as possible. it's nice for analyzing music, but useless for creating it. using such logical thinking isn't all that helpful for the creative process.
>>54284907
>i write music, and i try to avoid music theory as much as possible
well yes thats obvious. the outer cricle represents major keys, inner circle are their parallel minors.
>>54284836
if you make any sort of genre that relies, generally, on harmonic theory: no/maybe a little but as an artist it oughtn't impede you
if you make avant-garde music: maybe, but you ought to know enough about how things are ~usually~ done to be sure you aren't accidentally playing conformist music you didn't know about, and, as an artist it oughtn't impede you
>>54284836
Conformity would be not bothering to learn what the fuck are you trying to to, aka not learning theory
>>54284879
False common myth.
>>54284836
Most people who argue this have no idea how to use theory. Don't rely on it as a means for your playing, but allow it to show you options.You learn the rules and then how to break them
today i downtuned to a# standard and that was probably the most i have thought about music theory in years
>>54284998
how famous are you, how much money do you have from your music, and how many bitches did you fuck
>>54284941
>parallel minors
relative minors*
>>54284941
I understood the concept without knowing those words. What does it matter I didn't know the specific phrase your teacher taught you? I'm not trying to make it in classical music dude.
If I'm playing in a band and I say A minor, I expect everyone to know that C creates a somberness of mood in an A. This should be obvious for anyone who's played an instrument for a long time. Getting autistic over exact wording gets you nowhere.
>>54284879
>The best musicians don't give a fuck
Yeah because Beethoven, Bartok, Prokofiev, Bach and Mozart didn't know theory. I'm sick of this meme where people don't want to learn theory.
>>54284998
>A#
Literally 90% of the time it will be Bb. A# is rarely used.
the whole "most songs just use these four chords!" bit always depressed me, but somehow learning most every song is a journey from tonic to dominant back to tonic excited me.
there are many excellent musicians who have never had any training, but their ideas of what sounds pleasing are usually still influenced by traditional western music theory.
Knowing how chords are built out of scale degrees made my life so much easier, would recommend learning at least 1st year college-level music theory to all musicians
>>54284836
theory allows your creativity to do more.
creativity and knowledge are separate. having more knowledge on a subject only serves to extend what your natural creativity is able to do
Its fiction proliferated by people who don't know theory and may have jealousy issues
>>54284879
>Hendrix
>Michael Gira
>MC Ride
>The best musicians
/mu/'s poor taste strikes again.
seriously though Gira a shit. MC ride has no real skill to his rapping or lyricism. Hendrix is the most talented of the bunch, and even he is just a guitarist who wrote some OK songs.
>>54285053
>Literally 90% of the time it will be Bb. A# is rarely used.
Do you realize how much of a giant faggot you sound like? Bb = A#, no exceptions.
>>54285053
A# is Bb
>>54285133
m-me? why are you browsing /mu/? we have work tomorrow!
>>54284836
Nope. The opposite is true. Understanding theory is key when playing with other people and can greatly facilitate not only your understanding but also your enjoyment of music. Knowing/learning theory is legitimately loads of fun not to mention it is not hard to learn.
Also there is a 99 point ninehundred nine nine nine chance that if you don't know any theory you will *often* use overdone and basic techniques and progressions when writing music (which is fine)
It's way easier to properly do your own thing when you know theory.
>>54285143
>>54285183
Did I ever say that Bb didn't equal A#? If you went to any serious musician and called a Bb chord and A# chord they wouldn't take you seriously at all.
>>54285222
am I being rused?
>>54285143
>not knowing about temperament
>>54285143
not him but Bb is far more common to use than A#.
yes they are the same note, but Bb is present in all flat keys on the circle of fifths, whereas A# doesn't get used until you get all the way down to B Major/G# minor.
Bb is something that is everywhere, A# is very rarely used. If you're just tuning your guitar down and not worrying about scoring it out or playing in a key, then you can call it what you like
Interesting note, back in the days of just intonation, the distance between 2 enharmonic notes (notes that are the same but spelled differently) was quantifiable. The pythagorean comma or ~23 cents
/mu/ officially confirmed for easiest board to troll. all you have to do is mention music theory.
>>54285222
I wouldn't want to play with people like that. Could you imagine how repetitive and guessable those bastards' playing would be? I wouldn't take those people seriously.
>>54285287
you've never played with people who can improvise and also know theory.
they'd be pitch axis-ing all over you m8. you wouldn't even be able to follow
>>54285245
>>54285249
I don't care about any of that. Usually guitars get tuned down to A standard, not B standard. So when the original anon said A#, it made sense since it's a half step higher from A standard.
My knowledge of music theory was taught to me by taking jazz band, but i still think theory can be a hindrance.
>>54285287
>knowing any theory whatsoever makes your playing guessable
I seriously can't believe there are people out there that believe this.
>>54285382
>Usually guitars get tuned down to A standard, not B standard
>What is a baritone guitar
>theory stifles creativity
>>54285382
yeah, but in real life it would make more sense to say Bb since Bb is the more common key signature. enharmonically they're the same but Bb is the better way to say it.
>>54285202
no, we have spring break
>>54285415
What is relativity
>>54285466
Yeah but in real life caring about that shit won't actually make you better at music, just better at pretending you do over the internet
>>54284836
Fiction. Literally arguing in favour of ignorance.
>>54285565
yeah but in real life it actually will if you know what you're talking about. if you dont then thats fine, but game recognize game and nobody's pretending anything.
>>54285440
i studied theory for 6 years
it's useless. you get the same skill level just from experimentation. knowing scales,chords,modes,intervals, none of it pays off unless you plan to do one particular genre really well. i just mess with every particular one i like.
>>54285565
you should spend more time with classical performers or jazz players. then you'd see the reason people tend to use one spelling over another. Bb is common as fuck. A#, people start looking at you weird... "are we playing in g# minor anon? I don't see any F, G, C or D sharps though...."
>>54285592
thank you
>>54285048
Because you're musically illiterate. Also most likely you very very very VERY loosely understand the concept, MAYBE.
>If I'm playing in a band and I say A minor, I expect everyone to know that C creates a somberness of mood in an A.
NVM You obviously have no idea what you're talking about, or are just shitposting...
>>54285565
How much money have you made in music? Do people call you to play music on their albums? Are you signed to a label? Are you skilled enough to play Classical or Jazz repertoire? If you answered no to any of these questions you have no right to insult theory and say it stifles creativity.
>>54285634
Maybe you just aren't a creative person.
>>54285634
I agree with this, however, for those who aren't naturally talented with music, being taught theory can really give you some essential building blocks to take your creativity where it needs to be in order to be self-sufficient.
Also, even if you completely manage to be a successful musician without knowing theory, if you want to communicate with other musicians, knowing theory is vital.
>>54285727
i'm pretty creative. i started printer core and bubblegum bass.
>>54285755
kek
>>54285767
here's a sample of the next wave i'm working on. i think i'll call it sourkraut
https://clyp.it/4oqko25b
>>54285598
I'd be lying if I said that taking jazz and playing bass didn't teach me a thing or two about theory. But when I sit down to play now I drop my basic knowledge of theory and just try to play what sounds or feels good. I'll tap into that area of my brain sometimes though, but sometimes that makes me more frustrated and willing to give up since I'm not enjoying it at that point.
>>54285685
I would usually say usually Bb too, I understand how it works. Bb is a very prominent note, but so is A on the guitar. I've played in a jazz band in the rhythym section, and you know as well as I do that bass guitar and an idea of theory are vital.
>>54285755
actually I started printer core and I studied theory for 4 years at university
https://clyp.it/czsaxq2r
jk we're cool, I didn't start it :^)
>>54284836
Ehhh not really. Music Theory is nothing more than the study of music. The problem is, from what I understand, is that the method of teaching leads students into thinking in black and white.
Because they are being taught a fundamental system they think playing within the system is "Good" and playing outside is "Bad."
The system itself being the introductory concepts of rhythm, harmony, melody, and consonance. Having music that encompasses these things sound "Good" to everyone (as in they like it).
But you can play music with weird rhythms, or lacking harmony and melody, and having more dissonant features and have it sound beautiful if you know how to. That's basically the more advanced theory you would learn. It's all about understanding the dynamics.
So a person who is beginner in music who is just grasping these systematic concepts are probably gonna be boxed in, at first. While someone without said knowledge could discover something that sounds 10x cooler than something that contradicts what the beginner knows.
For instance: This guy with no music theory knowledge plays some notes out of key, but it sounds really good. A person who only knows a little theory would be like "WTF!? He's playing notes that are neither in major nor minor!" While someone who knows more would be like "Cool you discovered a phrase that utilizes the harmonic minor scale." And at the end of the day, that guy who played those notes won't know the fuck what he did.
