Musashi.
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You are currently reading a thread in /lit/ - Literature
You are currently reading a thread in /lit/ - Literature
Musashi.
Yojimbo.
Bigukoku Sukito.
>>8090306
What did you think of Musashi?
>>8090273
Reading it now, I'm surprised how funny it is.
Ass Goblins of Auschwitz
>>8090342
how do i get you banned?
>>8090342
>a must read
lets use this thread for something useful
what are some good novels on medieval japan? bonus points if its has a military history angle on it
>>8090381
>medieval japan
pick an era, buddy
>>8090381
goodreads com/list/show/28701.Top_Samurai_Novels
i thought we would talk about musashi
>>8090399
any will do
edo, for example?
I dont know shit about japanse history, I have no idea if people like Nobunaga are from this period
>>8090412
What about him? He was a brilliant fighter that paved the way for more advanced one-on-one combat and military strategy.
Every aspect of his life has been studied to hell and back.
>>8090432
i meant the book
>>8090433
That's hardly any different. The book is an account of his life which, unless you want to discuss it like "lol hozoin only had a power level of 50", is surmised by what I said in that post. Unless you want to talk about his philosophy and values, in which case you would be much better off making a thread about the Book of Five Rings.
>>8090474
is said it's a fictional account, how much of it is truth and how much isnt?
>>8090474
how good is the former?
>>8090287
Posting the superior movie
>>8090481
I'd say ninety percent of it is romanticism or speculation, ten percent is reality. There's not even any record of Musashi ever meeting either Hozoin. There's also a lot of reality that the novel *leaves out* because of pacing or romanticism or whatever.
>>8090497
It's pretty good, but if I had to choose between it and the manga by Inoue, I would choose the manga. Even incomplete, it's still far more entertaining.
>>8090553
did he ever make more issues or is it just dead without the fight between the deaf guy and musashi (real fight not playing with sticks)
>>8090595
Still mostly dead. The artist is depressed and is waiting for that to end before writing/drawing again.
>>8090553
is the manga really that much better?
>>8090724
Aye.
>>8090760
what makes it better?
>mfw i identify more with sasaki kojiro than miyamoto musashi in the book
>>8090796
how would you rate the book
>>8090381
>>8090381
medieval is c. 500-1500 CE
Sengoku and Edo periods are early modern
>>8090947
fuck you
>>8090775
It has pictures and stuff.
>>8090973
mfw
>>8090775
Art can say so much more than just words.
>>8091331
what does this say to you?
>>8091422
Victory in defeat. Spirituality as a convention driving swordsmen. Philosophy of death. The hollowness of victory when devoid or robbed of goal. Juxtaposition of human spirit and animal spirit.
>>8090428
>Edo period
>Medieval
That's like saying the Russian revolution took place during the Renaissance.
>>8090724
Read the manga before the book.
The book has much more depth and the manga isn't 100% accurate as an adaptation so you're bound to miss out on things, they might as well be considered separate works.
Oh and the book is actually finished.
>>8092090
I read the manga before the book*
What is the best translation of the Book of Five Rings?
Can anyone recommend some good historical books on the sengoku jidai period?
>>8092099
Really isn't one. Musashi uses incredibly vague language and makes frequent use of puns. Almost Joycean, really.
"Niten Ichiryuu" just means "Two Heavens, One School", but the actual practice is "Nitou Ichiryuu": School of Two Swords.
As I recall, virtually every translation has Musashi refer to swordsmen as "practitioners" or some equally stupid term that makes no sense but is in fact what he wrote - this sort of thing happens often, so really any translation will do.
>>8092133
How is "practitioner" a stupid term that makes no sense? The book was written for swordsmen.
>>8092137
It's not practitioner, I remembered what it was. Was fucking "strategists/strategy". There are lines where Musashi could very easily have chosen another word - one that made more sense - but instead he uses "strategist".
>I went from province to province dueling with strategists of various schools
>Students of the Ichi school Way of strategy should train from the start with the sword and long sword in eitherhand.
Why use that word, when you use 'warrior', 'enemy', 'soldier', 'man', 'swordsman', etc in other contexts?
>>8092162
It sounds like with that term he's just acknowledging other students of swordsmanship, since there all sorts of schools with different techniques. A person who studies these different techniques can by all rights be called a strategist.
>>8092045
wtf does any of that mean
>>8092178
That is what he's doing - he fought against many other weapons than swords - but there's no reason to use that word when he's referring to his own fucking school. His school is literally called the school of two swords. There were no other weapons involved. There is strategy involved in the discipline of swordsmanship, but that doesn't make them more of a strategist than it does make them a swordsman.
>>8092181
maybe if you read the novel or manga, you'd know
>>8092206
i'd rather read the novel then the manga
>>8092259
>then
By all means, do so. I'm not here to stop you. But I should like to suggest reading the manga as a post-completion supplementary; the art is always beautiful and it gives you a different visual perspective.
>>8092274
mb if i wasn't clear i meant i would read the novel first then afterwards the manga
>>8092291
o lol
enjoy!
>>8092206
>There is strategy involved in the discipline of swordsmanship, but that doesn't make them more of a strategist than it does make them a swordsman.
You should really explain this, because its very simple enough to say that they are strategists within the context of swordsmanship. Not to mention that the book of Five Rings details different methods or strategies to employ in combat, so again by all rights you can be called a strategist by the study and use of these techniques.
I also think its a huge mistake to get so hung up on words that weren't even meant for an English audience, written literally hundreds of years ago. Musashi knew exactly what he was talking about and a little thought will tell you what he was getting at.
>>8092303
>You should really explain this
>In the Way of strategy, when you have fought many times you will easily be able to appraise the speed and position of the enemy's sword...
This one in particular can't be justified. He's talking about all schools of swordsmanship, but refers to them as "the way of strategy". Not "the way of combat" or somesuch, but deliberately the way of strategy.
>...huge mistake to get so hung up on words that weren't even meant for an English audience...
Yeah, but he also constantly plays with words and logic in the text. If you try to view it as a 'textbook' per se, you miss a good deal of the material.
Examples from just opening to a random page:
>There are various methods of using the feet: floating foot, jumping foot, springing foot, treading foot, crow's
foot, and such nimble walking methods. From the point of view of my strategy, these are all unsatisfactory. I dislike floating foot because the feet always tend to float during the fight.
>Neither do I like jumping foot, because it encourages the habit of jumping, and a jumpy spirit.
???
>>8092328
Sounds like he's saying he dosent like those techniques because they take away a persons grounding and also just more wanky than anything. More for show than anything practical.
>>8092341
Of course, but you understand what I'm saying, yes?
Musashi isn't exactly straightforward, even when it comes to things should be very important to a swordsman. The "floating foot" joke is the most obvious example out of what I posted. Could have given a physical explanation as to why his dislike is the case, as he did for jumping; but he chose to make a joke instead.
>>8092355
Well, that's just how it is. The book wasnt meant for English audiences, and even further was particular to students of swordsmanship. Only someone who natively speaks Japanese can really plum the book for all it has, that kinda goes for all translated literature.
>>8092362
I can read Japanese very well, which is *why* I'm pointing it out. My original point in the thread was that it doesn't matter what translation you get because Musashi will goof around in some form in all of them.
