Freud
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You are currently reading a thread in /lit/ - Literature
You are currently reading a thread in /lit/ - Literature
going to read his works
how do you view his works?
i view them in my trashcan as i walk past it some times
>>8069288
Please take out the trash anon
Love,
Mom
>>8069283
I've read a few of his works (I just recently finished Civilization and its Discontents) and I find it all very enlightening. Psychoanalytics isn't without it's drawbacks, and I certainly can't agree with everything he's written, but I still feel I've changed by just being exposed to his ideas.
Definitely worth a read.
>>8069283
My HS english teacher told me he was a genius but inferior to Jung. But a reading of Freud is probably necessary to totally understand Jung anyway.
>>8069326
Your high school english teacher was a high school english teacher for a reason. Jung and freud were both hacks, and the majority of modern psychologists agree. The only difference is that jung's nonsense was beautiful and freud's nonsense was an attempt to pass off his sexual frustration as everone's.
You fucking /lit/iots and your psychoanalysis.
Not OP here.
I'm currently reading over the Western canon of philosophy from the Greeks until Hegel so I can reach Psychoanalysis.
What are the essential authors and works?
>>8070509
oh it's you again, thinking anybody here cares about your psych 101 competence. try /sci/, tho i expect you'll get laughed out of there too.
more like fraud xDDDDDDDD
>>8070531
It's really fucking pathetic that you and the rest of /lit/ think freud had shit to say that was worth listening to. He was wrong about everything. The only reason he's still even brought up is from a historical perspective, and the only reason anyone in real psychology (not counseling) ever references him is just because he coined most of the terminology of describing the psyche and because despite that he was wrong about everything, sometimes he seems right about some things when you're dealing with a person who is as neurotic and sexually frustrated as him.
Freud thought that dreams had a mind of their own and "Concealed" their "Meaning" from you. Because the idea that he just didn't understand them was just an impossibility. He claimed often that he had rid himself of all neuroses. And his entire body of "Research" had zero controls, zero reproducability, zero terminology that wasn't undefined and interchangeable, and zero actual measurement which would be necessary in any science. He was a dumb delusional hack. Even his definition of "Progress" or "Results" was completely defined by himself. Every freudian does more damage to his patients than good.
/sci/ agrees with me almost unanimously, and you're a fucking idiot.
>>8070572
>being this mad
>>8070572
>When you're dealing with someone neurotic and sexually frustrated as him
This is why /lit/ is so pro-freud.
My friend confided to me that he had had dreams about having sex with his mother and I told him about Freud and he instantly rejected it and said that Freud was a retard.
>>8070598
That's because it's a gross oversimplification of the phenomena of incestuous thoughts or dreams. Of course when you're a child you think about it. And of course the mother is the first woman you get close to and is the only woman around that you can base your first developing sexual thoughts on. That does not mean, however, that every adult man secretly wants to fuck his mother. Or "unconsciously" wants to fuck his mother. Or hurt his father. And it does not mean that all neuroses can be traced to sexual origin.
Freud WAS a retard.
>>8070572
>Freud thought that dreams had a mind of their own and "Concealed" their "Meaning" from you. Because the idea that he just didn't understand them was just an impossibility. He claimed often that he had rid himself of all neuroses.
[citations needed]
>>8070618
I honestly doubt he ever said dreams have a "mind" of ther own or that he had rid himself of all neuroses.
>>8070613
>[citation needed]
If only someone said that to freud.
>>8070620
Well read the "history of psychology" which I believe is by morton hunt or some similar name. Or either freud on dreams or jung on dreams or on freud. It's all all over the place but it should give you a picture what freuds body of work actually looks like and how little sense any of it actually made once all of the ideas were fully fleshed out and their implications established.
>>8070625
It's almost as if when you are creating a whole new field you don't have many people to cite, wow who would have thought.
>>8070611
>Freud WAS a retard.
you're going too far.
freud was a remarkable person. probably sociopathic in his skill in navigating social situations.
obviously he didn't hold to current statistical standards for science: that's how science works, it advances. Freud kicked that shit off, the man was a force of nature.
>>8070630
Why would a I read about the history of psychology when Freud isn't writing about psychology? holy fuck how hard can it be to realize that psychoanalysis isn't psychology.
Freud is most interesting in context as a psychologist who tried to understand psychodynamics and psychological deep structure. Try to read something that historicizes him properly and talks about other interesting figures in psychology (like Wundt), as well as precursors to the concept of the unconscious or demi-conscious.
His immediate followers are also interesting if you're extremely good at excising them from lots of other nonsense, and excising a lot of nonsense from their work. You should at least glance at Jung, Adler, Reich, etc.
Later famous psychoanalytics are a matter of taste I guess. They're mostly read through secondary works, unless you're mining for the occasional quote that accidentally sounds like they were onto something (mostly because they were parroting other smart dudes), floating in a sea of chaff.
>>8069326
Jung is a Rand tier joke in modern academia, Freud is still a titanic figure throughout the humanities
>>8070633
>creating
There were plenty of psychologists before freud. And before that there were plenty of neuroscientists and before that there were plenty of philosophers of mind.
I don't know if you're the same guy or not but you people all just keep demonstrating how hopelessly unprepared you are to defend a pro-freudian opinion
>>8070644
>Cites fields which are not psychoanalysis.
Are you really this dumb?
>>8070638
Don't ask me for a citation and then piss on the answer. There's a reason trolls are regarded as less than human beings. Go back to your hole.
>>8070652
You say that he said something, the only citation that matters is a quote that proves this.
>>8070646
>>8070638
You think psychoanalysis is it's own field? It's a method of psychotherapy and is therefore part of psychology. And since he often called what he did "research" and had claimed empirical evidence from his interactions with patients, it seems the man himself thought himself a bit more psychologist than therapist.
They're only neat if you're examining the historical context and development of psychology. His works by themselves are archaic and effectively useless.
>>8070656
>It's a method of psychotherapy
Wrong, you've lost all credibility
>>8070654
Then turn to the chapter about freud you fucking idiot.
I'm out. You can all kill yourselves. It's a better contribution to humanity than trolling or psychoanalysis.
>>8070656
Does not have the same goals, does not have the same object of study, is not science or intends to be, radically different on the approach of treatment but somehow is the same as psychology, yea sure buddy.
>>8070646
>>8070654
>>8070662
>>8070675
Since you have nothing better to do with your time than feign ignorance to try to upset strangers, I assume you're a relatively worthless shitstain with no talents or insights or experiences worth sharing and no friends worth having who would steer you away from such behavior. So sincerely, why don't you kill yourself?
>>8070751
Hoh boi, thats salty
>>8070751
>>8070643
What the fuck are you talking about?
>>8070611
>Of course when you're a child you think about it. And of course the mother is the first woman you get close to and is the only woman around that you can base your first developing sexual thoughts on.
So you believe in Freud?
>>8071038
No. I do not believe that every man unconsciously or secretly wants to fuck his mother and kill his father. I just think that it's very unlikely that anyone has "never had a sexual thought at some point about a parent, and that territory battles happen all the time on many layers of male relationships.
I do not believe that all neuroses are founded by sexual trauma or unmet sexual gratification. I think that since we became self-aware we've set ourselves up for crowdedness anxiousness and stimuli addiction of all kinds.
I do not believe that the dream has a veiling effect hiding it's meaning from the dreamer. I think that that's a cheap copout from a man who didn't want to admit he just didn't understand the dreaming process.
And I do not believe that any man "Rid himself of all neuroses.
So no, I do not believe in freud's psychoanalysis as a theory or a method. What I believe is that there are only two reasons that freud is so popular on /lit/
1. because like freud, most of you are very sexually frustrated and hung up on it constantly.
and 2. Because your retarded literature professors think themselves experts in psychology because they read a little bit from their favorite therapists or counselors and you're all super eager to regurgitate what that asshole said.
>>8071106
Man, you keep talking this bullshit over and over again without providing any sort of citation or anything, but anyway first Freud does not intend you, the reader, to take the concept of the Oedipus Complex and just apply it to everyone you meet like a fucking monkey, it is a tool inside the clinical praxis, you apply it to the one who sits in front of you and talks, because as Freud saw in his patients it is a theme which repeats itself through a lot of his patients, so he wrote about it.
Neurosis isn't founded by sexual trauma it is founded by the process of repression, the child when met with the oedipus complex and castration has to deal with it some form of way and one possible way is through repression which then results in neurosis.
Your third point is the only one you got somewhat right.
Still waiting for you to provide the quote where he says he "rid himself of all neurosis".
which is a better intro to Jung, man and his symbols or the portable Jung? also is the portable Nietzsche a good intro to Nietzsche?
>>8071201
I gave you my sources. I listed several books and authors. You're the retard who has nothing to contribute other than "Wrong! You're wrong so there"
Freud did (However, neo-freudians don't) apply the oedipal complex universally as the foundation of the libido. And thoroughly detailed what he thought about the stages of development and how all neuroses are traceable back to sexual origins. Psychoanalysis, as freud used it, is literally a system of pretenses and accusations used by freud to make his sexual frustration yours. Nothing else. And the quote about him ridding himself of all neuroses is in "The history of psychology" by morton hunt.
That aside, a therapist who prescribes cocaine as a miracle drug is a hack. I shouldn't have to explain that to you.
>>8071228
man and his symbols for the overall view of his thought, modern man in search of a soul for a more psychotherapy-centered view.
>>8071201
Clearly never read freud.
>>8071261
>That aside, a therapist who prescribes cocaine as a miracle drug is a hack. I shouldn't have to explain that to you.
What a weak argument. In the time Freud was a therapist, positive effects of cocaine were well documented in the medical community. It's not like he was the only one doing it, it was an accepted treatment.
>>8071261
Nice sourse man, congratualtions.
Daddy Tier:
Freud
Pleasure Principle Tier:
Rank
Reik
Fromm
The Real Tier:
Lacan
Anna Freud
Winnicott
Just forclusif/Verwerfung them tier:
Jung
Klein & the Flying Faeces
Laforgue
Miller
>>8071329
Just forclusif/Verwerfung them tier:
>Miller
I may love you anon. Except for Anna Freud should be with the rest on forclusif tier.
>>8070643
i'm not sure this is true
I like how all the freud threads get a lot of hate from people with surface level knowledge of psychology, their reactions are always extreme, filled with insults, I wonder where all this resistance comes from and why is it aimed at him.
>>8071261
Freud talking about your behaviour in 1933, you're a little late anon.
>>8069283
As art or philosophy but not science.
The only reason why psychoanalysis is popular in the humanities is because a bunch pseuds realized that they wasted their lives so they tricked people into thinking that they were still relevant.
Real psychology is better at analyzing literature than this pseudoscience garbage.
>>8069283
Absolutely essential for understanding the 20th century.
You can always tell who is from plebbit by the "muh empiricism" comments.
>>8071378
Only plebshit pseuds would defend pseudoscience.
Psychoanalysis should be done away with completely. Psychiatrists should be able to diagnose your illness and prescribe the proper medicine. This is current year. There's no reason to believe dreams are anything more than your brain's way of organizing the day's events.
>>8071448
Fedora plebbit pseuds are the ones who cling onto outdated pseudoscience that's been proven wrong.
>>8071448
Muh anything that requires a brain is stupid positivism
>>8071458
>Y-yeah well I know what you are but what am I?
>>8071329
Isn't Jacques-Alain Miller just Lacan 2.0 though, assuming that you're referring to him?
>>8070640
Tbh I can't help but agree with you. Lacan is fascinating, but I'd sooner visit a shaman than a psychoanalyst of any sort.
>>8070611
> That does not mean, however, that every adult man secretly wants to fuck his mother. Or "unconsciously" wants to fuck his mother. Or hurt his father.
This is blown out of proportion, Freud's point was that desire was influenced fundamentally by those initial stages so that it determines sexual orientation. Sure, mental disease is determined on some level in this way as well and I'm not against calling Freud and Lacan out on their hyperintellectualism (the term that psychologists use in order to denote the fact that Freud and Lacan leave no room for the brain to determine anything, as if matter is inert, waiting to be shaped by desire during childhood, so to speak), but the entire Oedipus Complex must be taken as unconscious development, like a fundamental part of every drive (which distinguishes, for instance, sex and love) not actual desires of having sex with your mother or hurting your father.
>>8071480
Miller is a really sketchy figure that tries to sell the image he understood Lacan and all that jazz, but is considered by many someone who used the imagem of Lacan to promote himself. Also he admitted that in the process of transcription of the seminars he took the liberty to change some phrases, reword some things, because Lacan was too hard and if he, Miller, never changed the text to make it easier nobody would "understand", so he did.
>>8071480
>Isn't Jacques-Alain Miller just Lacan 2.0
He wishes. He is only relevant because he managed to marry Lacan's daughter and get publishing rights of the Seminars.
Hate the fucking money grabbing jew.
>>8071467
t. Pseud
Read the wolfman and other cases
extremely interesting case studies, especially the wolfman and ratman
>>8071546
Holly fuck, really Americucks went with 'Wolfman' and 'Ratman' for the translations?
No wonder Freud is a joke up there, you can't do anything right.
Schreber > Ratman > Dora > Wolfman
>>8070528
Socrates + Aristotle, it's arguable Aristotle was the single most important historical figure in the West, he is considered to have an IQ leagues past current record high iqs.
He is also freakishly close to knowing things we needed high sci for
>>8071556
In my native language they're translated as "the man with rats" and "the man with wolves". It doesn't sound as badass as ratman and wolfman though.
>>8071424
>thinks of everything in terms of matching/non-matching
Stay spooked lol
>>8071628
Stirner doesn't affect metaphysics, pseud.
Psychiatry is pseudoscience
>all these idiots not knowing how much Freud contributed to psychology
>>8071723
I have no idea who that is and searching for Fight the Dragon is giving me videogames.
>>8071568
Yeah, like what?
>>8071864
Like nothing. Anon is retarded.
>>8070577
