Why is existentialism so gloomy? I'm taking a course on the subject and all the notable existentialists seemed not to live a "happy" life, including the father of existentialism. He even made his Christian life seem depressing even though it was his "passion". Camus seemed to be the most "human" and even he despised being labeled an existentialist.
happiness is for normies
>>7515603
Only modes of thinking that can give you real happiness are strict practice of a real religion, esoteric practice of a real religion, and pure egoism. Christianity is a bastardized, diluted religion so Kierkegaard never had a chance.
>>7515625
>Christianity is a bastardized, diluted religion
Aloha snackbar, my Muslim friend.
>>7515603
It's called being socially rejected.
Welcome to the NHK.
>>7515603
If you think existentialism is gloomy then you need to work on your reading comprehension
Seven years ago Nietzsche turned my aspie little fifteen year old self into a confident, disciplined athlete and student, Heidegger is some of the most beautiful stuff I've ever read and Kierkegaard legitimately saved my life byconverting me to Christianity
>>7515712
when will this meme end
>>7515718
Which meme?
>>7515721
christianity
>>7515723
Considering it's lasted about 2000 years not any time soonI'm even willing to agree that, strictly speaking, it is a meme. It's still a meme that saved my life.
>>7515603
Nietzsche is happy as fuck
>>7515730
Are you a Christian in the way Kierkegaard would define a Christian? Is it your passion? Do you dedicate most of your life to it and do you see most of organized Christianity as a bad thing; merely a herd of non-reflective followers?
>>7515629
>I haven't read Kierkegaard
>>7515794
Yep, even Kierkegaard himself criticized Christianity.
>>7515603
There's a tendency for male geniuses to be isolated for long periods in order for them to self-actualize, ie. look at how Nietzsche was isolated by far the longest and is perhaps the most stupefying, insightful thinker of the 19th century.
Also what you're saying just isn't true, you're confusing a modern view of what a gloomy life is for the philosopher's themselves being unhappy. Sartre openly said he never felt a day of despair in his life.
>>7515787
>non-reflective
Like any Christian truly reflects ....
>>7515603
Camus was only in it for the audience pussy. The other existentialists just struggled with balance needed to live with the doubt it takes to attack the collective knowledge of the world and the certainty it takes to reign in a woman and make her pleasant.
>>7515787
imho Christianity is a personal relationship with God and, while a religious community full of sincere followers would be ideal, I can't imagine a church that doesn't succumb to the same socio-political gripes as any other establishment with the potential to generate economic and social capital.
The Church as an international public establishment is not for me and t b h I think it's directly opposed by scripture (But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.).
Christianity is an all consuming fire that comforts me on my darkest days but, like anything else of any worth in this world, it's been co-opted and commercialized to the point where I'd have to contend that Nietzsche was absolutely correct in pronouncing that society had killed God.
I believe that the only sincere relationship with God that one may have in a world that is dichotomously divided between generalized society (nationalism, identity with group politics and the like) and the materialist individual ego born of several generations raised on objectifying each other and themselves (thanks in large part to television and social media) is one in private. Private even to the language which expresses our thoughts and must, in large part, be felt as much as it is to be reflected on.
It's not any harder to be truly religious these days, it's just that those that are sincere are mostly private and let their beliefs speak through their actions while those that are public are mainly doing it for aesthetic purposes.
Am I the only one who can't take French existentialists seriously? It seems that there is something about the French mind that makes them misunderstand existentialism.
>>7515828
>all this ressentiment in one post
s m h
t b h
f a m
>>7515986
Camus is a good novelist, Sarte had a very sophisticated psychological take on phenomenology, Merleau-Ponty is based but he was always more indebted to the phenomenological tradition.
They always sound and feel better upon initial reading than they do under analytic scrutinywhich is kind of the point imo.
>>7515603
>existentialism
ohhh the big SEXY word oooooo
BIG
>>7515999
BLACK
>>7515615
This
>>7517262
good reaction
OK? You are gloomy? Don't be gloomy.
Done. Solved your philosophical issue.
>>7515712
What book by Kierkegaard should I start with ?
>>7517917
Assuming you have a general understanding of Aristotle, St Augustine and Kant (Hegel would be nice as well since Kierks was largely critical of him) you can dive right into Fear and Trembling with no problems
Rick Anthony Furtak's "Wisdom in Love" is a great companion piece too
Most existentialists were happy. They may seem gloomy because they were deep thinkers, but even Nietzsche always sounds rather lively in his writings. And his life were objectively shit, he was just too strong to break down.
>>7515787
Kierkegaard was a really bad theologian. He says that faith is a task for the knight of faith alone where is the Apostle's Creed affirms, "the Holy Catholic Church, the Communion of Saints", and St. Paul talks of the Church as "the mystical body of Christ".
Faith isn't passion. Faith is an infused theological virtue that comes from the action of the Holy Spirit in the soul; essentially it's an unmerited gift from God, a light that shines in your intellect allowing it to assent to divine truths revealed by God. It has an OBJECTIVE content - revealed truth. It is not purely subjective as Kierkegaard says. It is not a passion. It does not even reside in the will - it resides principally in the intellect. His idea that Christians are unreflective followers is him being scandalized by his Lutheran congregation, and really it's pride to imagine that you are the one True Christian and split yourself off from the Church because nobody is as True as you. St. Augustine says that schism (cutting yourself off from communion with the Church) is a sin against charity and is never justified, even if your fellow churchmen are evil and sacrilegious men.
>>7515976
The Church is Christ's mystical body. You can't have Christ without the Church. If you deny the Church you deny Christ. The Church is not a socio-political body but is above all a mystical body, consisting of the Church Triumphant (the saints in heaven) and the Church Militant (the faithful struggling on earth), all united in the bond of charity, forming the Communion of Saints. The Church is essential to charity among Christians. Charity is not primarily a feeling or passion, it is a supernatural act of the will which wishes for the eternal good of the beloved, and to cut yourself off from communion with all Christians because you are too intellectual, too passionate, too refined to pray, confess your sins, and share Holy Communion with them is a sin against charity.
>>7518133
>He says that faith is a task for the knight of faith alone
It's telling that Kierkegaard chooses Abraham as his exemplar in Fear & Trembling. Abraham can be presented as struggling alone before the face of God, which suits Kierkegaard's radical individualist theology which starkly contradicts the theology and ecclesiology of the Church Fathers who all affirm that faith is passed on and shared in a community of believers held together by charity.
>>7518133
>>The Church is Christ's mystical body. You can't have Christ without the Church
That is not for you to say. Only God can judge me.
>>7518141
>>7518133
Lastly, I have way more respect for figures like St. Francis of Assisi and St. Charles Borromeo and many other saints who instead of being scandalized by the lukewarmness of the congregation and running away from the Church and writing romantic tracts about the Knight of Faith struggling alone before God, instead remained in the Church and reformed her from within.
>>7518152
>That is not for you to say. Only God can judge me.
I know it's not for me to say. It's not me that has said it though, it is God that has said it, through His Scriptures and through the authority of the Catholic Church. I'm just relaying to you what God has spoken. Go look up the history of the Church and look with what horror they treated heretics and schismatics from the earliest days; even St. Paul warns against them in the Epistles.
>>7518173
I'll trust it when I hear it from him at the end.
>>7518173
Uh huh.
>>7518173
>>7518152
cont. the idea that you can be a home-alone Christian without a Church is a radical novelty that was basically unheard of before Kierkegaard.
You can't pick-and-choose. You have to have the faith that God has revealed. You can't say that you like the teaching on heaven but reject the teaching on hell because it offends you, because God has revealed both and it is His authority that certifies every article of faith, one just as much as another. If you reject any article of faith you reject the Authority that has revealed it. One article of faith is:
"The Holy Catholic Church, the Communion of Saints".
If you reject this article you reject:
"The Holy Spirit"
"The Forgiveness of Sins"
"Life everlasting"
and every other article.
>>7518178
Where does your faith come from mate? Do you have divine faith or merely human faith?
read this article
https://www.olrl.org/apologetics/churchbible.shtml
>>7515603
Because it's easy to accept that the world is meaningless but hard to find a meaning that makes you happy.
