/lgbt/, what age is the minimum you should be to decide you're trans?
You don't really decide but some know when they're really young and some don't. I'd say wait around to like 18 or 20 and then you'd probably be sure what you are and want to be.
>>6448538
If you're still passable there's still hope.
>>6448538
Are you a pediatrician or involved in child/developmental psychology?
12, anything later and youll start to get rekt by puberty whether you choose or not
ftms even earlier but they dont real
>>6448606
For your purposes: around 5
>>6448538
None younger than 14 should be allowed to transition, since young children cannot make these decisions and parents don't know shit
>>6448644
but by then puberty will have hit you and it'll be too late
I think I started feeling the dysphoria around 11, then developed the compulsion to dress like a girl at 13. The only words I had at the time were "shemale" and the like, which I didn't want to be.
>>6448676
There are still many years of puberty at 14 and protecting children from irreversible procedures takes priotity over making transgendered people more passable.
I honestly never liked girl clothes my whole life and never felt right being called pretty/things like that. I fully realized it at 12
It is ridiculous to pressure highschool age kids into deciding what their gender is and putting them on hormone blockers until they do. We need to reevaluate how we approach gender identity as a whole so that people fall under a 'third sex' like in Taiwan where they are just comfortable being CWDs and having a completely different thought process than cis women.
All girls should wait until they're 50. That way they will have had the experience of having kids and a family, and will be mature enough to make such a difficult transition!
My bell went off when I was 55, and after 6 months of hormones I couldn't keep the boys off me!
>>6448696
The effects of hormone blockers are easily reversed, and why do you care so much about protecting delusional cis children?
>>6448715
>>6448724
>The effects of hormone blockers are easily reversed
Puberty is a limited time and these procedures are still new, especially with kids we don't know everything about hormones treatments yet.
>why do you care so much about protecting delusional cis children?
Because they're children you sick fucker.
>>6448733
Oh, my bad. It didn't sound like you cared about children at all, what with your not giving them any credit with regard to their intelligence or confidence about who the fuck they are.
>>6448733
Yes, we do. Lupron has been prescribed for use delaying puberty since the early 70s.
Know something or shut the fuck up.
>>6448748
>if you don't think young children get to make huge life-changing decisions themselves, then you don't care about children
Nice damage control, it's obvious you have some kind of grudge against cis people, or maybe you just want more trans kids so you feel normal?
>>6448749
>"Yes, we do know everything"
No, we don't. Even without medical interference the puberty stage is not fully understood, and once again, the time is limited. Protecting children must take priority.
>>6448769
Your sense of ownership over others' bodies, and obliviousness to the hypocrisy of the paternalistic practices you advocate in total ignorance of the medicines used, the processes affected, the practices of their caregivers, and the lives of the children involved all mark you as unworthy.
I'm sorry you have to be you.
>>6448769
Nope, I'm back to thinking you're a troll. Step it up.
>>6448707
True, as an AGP I would of been cool with being a 3rd gender CWD when I was younger. In fact i'd still be cool with it today. Society is not cool with it, so I larp as a cismale.
Even feminine gayboys may prefer to become twinks instead of trannies, they won't know until they spend a few years on testosterone at least.
So I'd say no puberty blockers, HRT at 16, no questions asked, no parental approval required.
>>6448779
Making kids wait til they turn 14 to decide to get medical treatments for gender transition... is somehow taking ownership of their bodies? You're retarded, or maybe trolling. Children simply can't be allowed to make these kinds of decisions. 14 is young as it is.
>>6448789
Whatever, anon. Your hateful comment about cis kids made it pretty clear that if anyone here is trolling, it's you.
>>6448696
Normal puberty is an irreversible procedure.
Putting them on completely reversible hormone blockers gives them more time to mature and be able to decide for themselves before anything permanent happens to them.
>>6448812
You have chosen to, in complete ignorance, declare yourself and your arbitrary whims more fit to choose what they decide with the consultation and consent of their parents and doctors. Yes, you are claiming ownership.
And your complete ignorance is unfit to decide what is in their best interest. Get the fuck out of their lives.
>>6448769
What's mostly unknown about hormone blockers is how suppressing puberty affects brain development. The physical development stuff is pretty well understood and studied, especially bone density.
Parents and teens should be made aware of the risks and unknown things, but they ultimately get to decide if they outweigh the consequences for their ultimate situation.
Not much point worrying about possibly nonexistent problems if your kid is miserable and likely to kill themselves anyway.
>>6448858
You're the ignorant one, thinking those doctors understand puberty and medical tinkering with puberty as well as you seem to believe. Believe it or not, human beings don't need doctors to go through puberty anyway. I pray you never have children.
>>6448538
6 months
>>6448901
>if your kid is miserable and likely to kill themselves
Kids killing themselves was FAR less common before doctors became so involved with their emotional well being.
>>6448942
Not treating your kid's medical conditions is highly unethical and that's what you are doing if your kid has gender dysphoria and you ignore it.
You'd be no better than those Christian Science fucks that don't get medical treatment for their kids and insist that praying it away works.
>>6448973
>Not treating your kid's medical conditions is highly unethical
You're right, but right now in the Western world we have the opposite ethical issue. People are medicating their children at the drop of a hat and big pharmaceutical companies are behind it (they incentivize hospitals who incentivize doctors to pressure parents with prescriptions). There is a lot of mental illness (and also gender dysphoria) in my family and I have seen how destructive it can be for children when there is a combination of naive well-meaning parents and grasping malicious doctors.
>>6449043
DESU, I don't even want to get into that debate at the moment, partially because you'd be mostly right there.
So, let's get back to the actual topic. If it's confirmed gender dysphoria that's been going on at least 6 months, what is your beef with treating it?
>>6448538
The age you're financially indepentend from your parents and make sure you don't waste their money on your sick antics.
>>6448696
>and protecting children from irreversible procedures takes priotity
So you're saying we should force every child to take puberty blockers? Mkay.
>>6448929
Human beings don't need doctors to go through puberty! But your intention to force its unwanted consequences on those it will do substantial known harm in defense against a harm you have assumed exists despite its failure to manifest in trials and over forty years of active use suggests you are less concerned with the welfare of the children, and more trying to use that as a mask for your opposition to trans people's control of their bodies.
They need the people who ARE helping them, not transparent concern trolls. Fuck off.
The idea that transitioning early leads to passing is a meme.
Look at Jazz Jennings - her transition could not have been more optimal but she still looks like a gangly feminized boy.
The whole 'transition young' thing was dreamed up by crazy insecure transwomen and crazier parents.
Children with GD should be treated with therapy and more cultural acceptance of gender defiance. Half of them end up gay not trans. It's insane to transition before puberty.
>>6449063
>confirmed gender dysphoria
In a child younger than 14, I'd say that is difficult or even impossible to confirm. The brain isn't fully developed until much much later, altering its development on a theory is just not good medicine.
>>6449073
>puberty is a medical procedure!
>protect kids from their own natural growth!
No, anon. No.
>>6449085
>a harm you have assumed exists despite its failure to manifest in trials and over forty years of active use
Nice try. There are many cases where the transitioning turns out to have been a mistake and those people have very few options for 'de-transitioning'
>>6449099
That's why would put them on hormone blockers, you dumb fuck. Then you wait until 16 usually until you do anything permanent to them.
If they turn out to not be trans, just take them off the blockers and it's like any other kid that had a late puberty, plus they've been in therapy to clear up their gender issues. Nothing bad has happened.
If they turn out to be trans, you just saved them a ton of pain and improved their chances of passing, and more importantly, not killing themselves immensely.
>>6449119
>it's like any other kid that had a late puberty
Doctors don't know that for sure. Stop acting like this is so simple and harmless, tinkering with puberty is changing a child's development no matter what and you can't guarantee that nothing bad is happening or that if they 'turn out' to be trans, it's not because of the tinkering in the first place.
Like I said before, helping trans to 'pass' is not as important as protecting children, that is purely a concern of vanity. And suicide was much less common when doctors were less involved in kids' emotional health.
>>6449135
No one is suggesting we do this to every child. Only ones struggling with gender, therefore already likely to be trans.
How can you justify not treating a kid because there's unknowns involved? Hardly any medical treatment is risk free, most involve determining if the risks outweigh the benefits. If the parents are made aware of the risks and consent anyway, what is the issue? Why do you know better for their children?
>>6449135
> Natural is always best!
No.
Also, no amount of evidence is sufficient for creatures like you. I'm glad that your whims and ignorance are completely irrelevant to the treatment of other human beings. Go away and live your life instead of squandering your hours trying to advocate harming others.
>>6449166
>How can you justify not treating a kid because there's unknowns involved?
If it were about something life-threatening it would be different. Again, this is a concern of vanity, the risk cannot possibly be justified.
>>6449176
You're the one advocating harming children, and for what? Better chance at 'passing'? Fuck you.
>>6449181
So we shouldn't treat any mental conditions in children? After all, none of them are directly life-threatening and most of them involve treatments that aren't fully studied or understood.
>>6449098
Jazz just looks like a less attractive girl not like a boy. Otherwise I agree, she complains about boys not wanting to date her. If she was a gay boy she might have experienced sex already. Her prostate and penis would be more developed too.
>>6449119
They experience several years of puberty without sex hormones, they're not truly going to know if they hate their birth sex hormones if they don't experience them for several years.
>>6449214
But what if they do? You just put them through something harmful and permanent, when you could have stopped it.
What happened to not harming kids?
Also, you don't need that to see if a kid has gender dysphoria.
>>6449230
A potential problem is well meaning people pushing gender noncomforming kids to transition. Gender noncomforming kids do not need puberty blockers. If reasonable efforts are made to seperate GNC from trans then I see no problem.
One future problem that may occur is GNC kids being groomed by their parents into being trans, then detranstioning later and screaming bloody murder. Although I wonder if a GNC kid may become a happy tranny, despite not really being trans...
When they're old enough to understand the ramifications. Around eighteen, though even that's pushing it.
If you think kids are mature and smart enough to make decisions like that at a younger age, you are a child yourself.
>>6450216
This is why I'd like to see 15 more years of research on early adult transitioners say 18-25, to see how many regret their transitions in their 30s. If results are highly positive then we can move the age of transition lower.
>>6450197
Oh yeah, I think the getting the child's consent as well without the parents pressuring them is paramount.
Like 35.
Have to be old enough to understand the long-term ramifications and have given non-trans life a legitimate shot.
If you're pushing 40 and old enough to truly understand that you're permanently fucking up the rest of your life, and haven't built a life that you're attached enough to by that point then you can go ahead.
>>6450444
Definitly, I'm just concerned about liberal parents instilling in a young GNC child the idea that they're trans and then the child just rolls with it.
Here's what people tell trans gals of different ages:
Under 12: "You're just a child. You're too young to know about this kind of stuff. I wanted to be a dragon when I was a kid. It was a phase and I grew out of it. Worry about this when you're more mature"
12-18: "You're a teenager. Your hormones are raging and you're all confused. Your body is changing with puberty, and somehow this is making you feel you're trans. Puberty is perfectly natural. Just focus on graduating high school and worry about this later."
18-22: "You're under a lot of stress right now. College is hard. You don't have a lot of real world experience. You had no idea how it is to work how to support yourself. Worry about this later. Finish college, get into the real world, then you can worry about this gender crap."
22-30: "You don't have time to worry about this gender transition stuff. You're just starting out. You need to establish your career, build up some savings, and become stable. Get a girlfriend. You don't even know what it's like to really be a man. Give living as an independent man a try for a few years, then transition if that doesn't work out."
30-55: "How can you be so selfish? You have a wife and kids to worry about! How can you be considering gender transition? Your wife married a man. Your kids need a father. Doing this will destroy your family. If you simply must do this, at least wait until the kids are old enough to understand or preferably are out of the house."
55+: "What's the point? You're already through most of your life. You've made it this far, you might as well just finish it out as a guy. Plus, you're so old there's no hope you'll ever pass. Transition is something for kids, not old folks."
In summary, no matter what your age, people will tell you that your age should preclude you from transition.
>>6449176
You alright Akaka? I agree that this dude is an idiot but you seem uncharacteristically irate relative to your usual calm self.
>>6448715
pfff haha
>>6450893
Akasa is always insane
>>6448538
>mandated assessment at 12 (this should be law everywhere, or at least education)
>allowed to transition at 15
But I didn't
figure it out until
I was
19
>>6448715
It never stops being funny. Good one, hon!
