Why do lesbian MTFs admit to being autogynephiles but gay FTMs yaoi fangirls insist that they're absolutely not autoandrophiles? There's nothing wrong with being tran for fetish reasons.
>theres nothing wrong with being trans for fetish reasons
KILL YOURSELF
LITERALLY
KILL YOURSELF
post more animal pictures
>>6420487
Not OP
but there isnt...
Why do I get the feeling you're an AGP apologist who keeps invading FtMg?
Making a thread because you didn't get enough (You)s?
AGPs are like sad trans lesbians who can't come to terms with who they are and are trying to force their insecurity on gay t-dudes and it's hilarious and sad.
Transbians please control your trash.
>>6420566
Just admit that you're a fujoshi. You can transition into your homestuck husbando without T anyway.
>>6420582
What about MTF fujoshi? I'm MTF, have always liked yaoi (since middle school) and like yuri as well, albeit to a much lower degree.
>>6420603
You're just a super a gay dude desu, Blanchard approves
>>6420475
>tfw transitioning to become my own 2d waifu
>tfw mtf and solely attracted to women
>tfw people defend my transness even though I only want to transition because forced feminization is my biggest turn on
Feels good, I don't even have to explain my reasoning, because AGP doesn't exist
>>6420608
>>6420611
I'm into girls too, though. Actually have a preference for women.
>>6420475
>There's nothing wrong with being tran for fetish reasons.
Agreed. If someone would rather be one gender than another, arousal tangential to that is understandable and irrelevant. I think people should still only transition if they are sure that it's right for them, but we should try to minimize this TruTranny^tm mentality. It's harmful to everyone.
>>6420475
2/10 i'm pretty sure you're trolling for (You)s but i'm a glutton for punishment so i'll ask anyway, do people like you legitimately not believe trans people can be gay/lesbian? what would one have to do in order to be a "real" gay trans man or lesbian trans woman? or do you not believe people are really trans at all?
>>6420651
I dont have a very high sex drive, either. I mostly read yaoi for the emotions and stuff. Girls are easier to date because they tend to not be nearly as sex oriented as men.
>>6420661
I'm sure some are gay or lesbian, but most are fetishists. It's just how it is.
>>6420681
so how do you tell the "real" gays from the fake ones/fetishists?
>>6420684
Anyone on /lgbt/ can tell a deranged AGP from a true MTF. Apply the same logic towards FTMs.
It ain't that hard.
>>6420726
you didn't answer my question. i'm legitimately curious what you think separates a "real" gay trans man from a AAP trans man. what are some things that one group does that the other doesn't do? or what are some red flags that would clue you in to whether or not a trans man's gayness is real or fake?
>>6420777
Being a cis fujoshit for decades with absolutely no discomfort with your vagruba or being feminine, never wanting to be a boy as a kid, then suddenly realizing you're tran when you've consumed enough bishounen chinese cartoons or socialized enough in le fandoms (XD). Of course that always means wanting to look like Link or some other uke 2D fantasy shota and absolutely never an average masculine male with body hair, muscles and impending baldness. Being an insufferable fag hag is also a reliable marker.
Like I said, it ain't that hard.
>>6420475
>lesbian MTFs admit to being autogynephiles
[Citation needed]
>>6420521
You got it senpai
>>6420928
>AGP general
>>6420835
>implying this happens
>>6414279
>>6420957
>implying it doesn't
>one anonymous fujo making a post on 4chins is proof
At this point you sound like a pressed gayFTM who fits that exact description.
>>6420970
That post is mine and its already more proof than your wad of horseshit. Keep coming up with more retarded narratives you have no idea whether is true or not though
>>6421007
Interesting desu. If you're just a fujo with no intent of transitioning, why get assblasted on behalf of FujoToMales?
>>6421037
>why get assblasted on behalf of FujoToMales
Lol, where did I do that? The part where I pointed out how your """argument""" is pulled right out of your ass and has exactly zero basis is reality? Notice I never talked about MTFs, only fujos.
>can't argue
>gets bullshit called out
>u-u mad
>>6420475
Most ftms don't like anime, cuz most ftms are not losers pre transition, since its really hard to be female and a loser
Most mtfs like anime cuz they were losers in high school
but i did see this video and it reminded me of ftmg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eARV2PdvNck
Because i'm an ftm with agp but i'm not allowed to say that because that makes me faketrans
>>6420953
More like autogynephiles admitting they're not trans and won't transition.
I'm a genius, a master. This was just a very small move.
>>6421104
You mean the part where you asserted it doesn't happen and cited yourself as some sort of a source? Typical delusional fujoshi. Are you sure you're not looking to become a totally nonexistant tumblr Ayyden anytime soon desu wa?
That pic sounds a lot like you. You seem to be getting really emotional over this.
>tfw after I get SRS I can safely indulge my AGP fantasies anytime and anywhere without detection
>>6421141
>wants to be a man
>gets off to dressing like a woman
>gets off to the idea of becoming a woman
FtMtF incoming
>>6420928
like open your eyes and look at the screen nigga. anons do it all the time. it's only when they have to have an identity attached to them when they go on to hate da ebul fetizhists!!
>>6421171
No, I just get off to the idea of getting my bussy reckted. I also like the female form a lot. I've had some good chuckles thinking about becoming a hon though.
>>6420475
meh. the gay/bi ftm meme is because T tends to make ftms gay. even the most hetero-snapback-wearing ones typically become bi a few months after they start hrt.
i'm not sure if this is right but i remember reading that the sudden increase in testosterone also bumps estrogen levels a good bit in response (which means they noticeably high estrogen and testosterone levels)
>>6421185
>I'm a breeder broad who hates 3dpd gay men and t-totally isn't looking to go trans
>I'm on /lgbt/ for some reason, strategically replying to posts pertaining to fujos, gay men and FTMs
Drayvyn pls, those makoharu doujins won't read themselves.
>implying I can't cite myself and have the same amount of proof
>>6421176
I know they're AGP, only they don't explicitly admit to being one. The agpgen is nothing but falseflagging while the mtfs that are actually in transition call it a myth while avatarfagging with anime girls.
>>6421182
>no genital dysphoria
Oh, so you're not AGP. You're a transtrender. Got it.
>>6421199
>The agpgen is nothing but falseflagging
uwot
>>6421182
>No, I just get off to the idea of getting my bussy reckted
so a straight girl with no dysphoria
A+
>>6421203
>not liking your sexual organs
Was getting your willy chopped off pleasurable, Brittany? Hows that numb orgasm working out for you?
>>6421198
>implying I can't cite myself and have the same amount of proof
Are you saying you're an mtf with agp? I'm confused.
I'm perfectly happy with my identity as a straight girl and have no guilt in reaping the benefits that come with it. And also I've already made it obvious 3D is PD, and that transitioning isn't going to get me closer to 2D. Why would I want to become something I'm disgusted with?
>>6421220
Good b8. I'm sure you hate to touch your dick also.
>fight for yourself
>it helps a bunch of people you realise you can't stand
>and you're one of them
Ok I still like the queer/ non-binary kind
>>6421223
>implying I'm trans to somehow make your bs trans identity more valid
Pretty defensive there, Anon. Don't get mad at me because you wrecked your own life with a stupid phase. Tell me how detransition goes, eh?
>>6420639
Did you find yourself attracted to men at all during your transition? I've heard that estrogen does that sometimes
>>6421253
You need to step up your bait game, Maki. Truly pathetic. How do you expect to catch any fish?
>>6421228
i'm ftm
if you like your genitalia you're just a chick. sorry to tell you maybe /y/ or /cgl/ would be a better board for you
>>6421269
Thank you for informing me. Ill detransition now.
>>6421261
Who's baiting? The anon is clearly a transtrender. I'm just calling them as I see them.
>>6421284
Whatever you say, Maki.
>>6421288
The fuck is a Maki?
>>6421276
good girl
>>6420475
Not all non-straight MtFs are AGP Anon. That view's outdated. There IS a subset of fetishists though. From my interaction with people on this board there is ALSO a subset of people who BOTH have the fetish AND suffer from dysphoria, complicating things further.
I ran into like two self-proclaimed AAPs on this board. I think they're rarer because the number of people who would admit to something like this is small in the first place and there are less women than men on 4chan.
>>6421323
>girl
>GIRL
HOLY FUCKING SHIT IM SO TRIGGERED RIGHT NOW. HOW DARE U MISGENDER ME U PIECE OF HETEROBIRMATIVE SCUM> I WILL RAPE UR FAMILY AND REPORT U TO THE FBI UNLESS U TAKE THAT BACK, IMMEDIATELY!!! ILL MAKE U WISH U WERE NEVER EVEN BORN SHITLORD!!!!! PREPARE TO BE DOXXED!
It's sad that people think that would actually trigger anyone.
>>6421227
bitch who said all fujos go trans? henny why is you here?
>>6420835
I know you're here to meme but let me educate you. I'm actually a genuine AGP nutcase and I've had AGP fantasies since I was 5. They only turned sexual when I became 13 but I still obsessively engaged these thoughts without understanding why I liked them so much. Fetishes are not as simple as you think them to be.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erotic_target_location_error
I think a far better way of detecting these tricks is looking at the kind of man they want. For some reason even before transitioning they only want confirmed gay men, not just men in general. A normal gay dude dgaf if a man is gay or straight, if he looks good he can be fapped to. These bitches only want gay ones, hence why it's a gay fetish and not genuine sexuality. One can expect them to try transitioning in hopes of scoring a real gay man for validation.
Tumblr is full of these.
>>6421458
You're talking out of your ass you fucking moron. Tumblr is full to the brim with girls and AAPs fetishizing straight men fucking each other. Whether the male in question is gay or not isn't something they actually care about. They just like it when the guy is actually gay because they feel like it gives them an excuse to be fetishist perverts because
>muh lgbtqxyz+* rights
>>6421418
I was one of those AAP trannies. I took my fetish too far and now I am a femboy tbqh pham.
>>6421439
You did? That was your entire fucking premise for fucks sake. Tell me this is just a poor gas lighting attempt. You can't actually be this retarded.
newfag itt, what's aap/agp ?
>>6421796
a meme
>>6421806
pls explain it
>>6421796
Oh boy.
Autogynephilia is the erotic attraction to the idea of yourself as a woman. Autoandrophilia is the gender-reversed parallel.
The term was coined by Ray Blanchard around the 90s to describe his two categorizations of male-to-female transsexuals. The first, termed "homosexual transsexuals" since Blanchard did not think of transsexuals as belonging to anything but their birth sex, were those attracted exclusively to men. The second, Non-homosexual transsexuals, are those not exclusively attracted to men.
According to Blanchard's theory homosexuality is caused by being overly feminized/masculinized i.e. tending toward the other gender in some brain areas. Homosexuals attraction is explained by embracing even that aspect of the other gender. Homosexual transsexuals are extreme homosexuals who have so many traits in common with the other sex that they cannot bear to remain their birth sex, feeling dysphoria.
Reading this you must be thinking "well, cool, but how does that account for non-homosexual transsexuals?" and the answer is that it doesn't. Thus Blanchard theorized that non-homosexual MtFs just have an extreme Paraphilia, the medical term for an unusual sexual attraction which affect's the patient's well being to the point of being pathologic. According to him the sexuality of non-homosexual transsexuals is so tightly wound around the fantasy of being a woman that they're close to incapable of having sexual relationships as their birth gender. What starts as a base sexual drive transforms into an orientation. So you have AGP-sufferers who are both turned by the idea of turning into women AND feel dysphoric because they can never feel comfortable with themselves sexually as men. Note that these extreme dysphoric cases exist alongside far milder cases where those with AGP can still function as men.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Erotic_target_location_error
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blanchard%27s_transsexualism_typology
I want to know when this whole agp thing started. I remember several months ago I came to this board and dropped a single post about agp in the trans lesbians gen and left. Now I see shit like the agp general and gender critical threads revolving around agp always somewhere in the catalog. Was it already a meme the first time I was here? Is it a relatively recent thing?
>>6421796
A tl;dr meme
>>6421830
Thanks cutie, wish you all the best.
>>6421832
It has been here since before you were born. And on this board since practically its inception.
>>6421796
>>6421830
Part 2.
His research is extremely controversial for a variety of reasons. Regressive elements cling to it as a proof that transsexuals are just perverts when even Blanchard stated both groups are transsexuals, AGP is an orientation and not "just" a fetish, and that AGP-sufferers have non-sexual motivations along with their sexual ones. On the other hand Blanchard is like 70 and so a bit behind the times. He does not like transsexuals much because he considers their problem a mental illness, just like homosexuality. For this reason many LGBT activists try to paint him as a wholly demonic hack who is just trying to cast all MtFs as perverts.
I feel that the truth is more complicated. Recent research has indeed shown that homosexual transsexuals have heavily feminized/masculinized brain regions, putting them in their own distinct category as far as brains go, while the same has not been shown true for non-homosexual transsexuals as of yet. This somewhat vindicates Blanchard's early work. On the other hand a lot of his research is somewhat lacking in evidence and cannot actually deal with Autoandrophilia. Blanchard himself believes AAP is impossible because AGP is a Paraphilia and only men report having paraphilias in any significant number yet there is a significant, as far as I know similar per capita, contingent of AAPs. This hints that perhaps the cause is something other than paraphilias. Modern research seems to suggest a biological basis while paraphilias are developed during one's life.
All in all his actual explanation for non-homosexual transsexuals is somewhat of a conjecture BUT the phenomena called AGP exists and in some cases functions exactly as he described it.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraphilia
t. AGPer, currently not transitioning because I feel like my sexuality is a joke but still feeling shitty about being a man.
>>6421845
You're welcome. I should've pointed out that this was a two-parter. Sorry. I hope you're still around to see the conclusion.
>>6421761
I'm assuming you're ftm? I'm mtf and I think I gave myself AAP.
Used to identify as transbian but found sex with vaginas immensely boring/gross. Always preferred futas or traps tbqh. Then I discovered men through yaoi, eventually coming to the realization to irl men are quite hot too.
Whats weird is I started off with some AGP tendencies too. Like autoerotic crossdressing shit. But recently I've become intensely attracted to the thought of myself as a male in a gay relationship.
I even bought a binder to flatten my chest and got a shorter haircut. The hormones have kept me small and cute too which only fuels it. I look a lot like the kind of twinks and femboys I would want to fuck.
I feel like I'm going crazy.
>>6421880
>I feel like I'm going crazy.
Yes anon
>>6421830
>Autogynephilia is the erotic attraction to the idea of yourself as a woman.
You could've stopped right there instead of writing this entire wall of text. Are you feeling defensive?
>>6421977
This is a really lousy attempt at trolling. AGP is a medical, academic term and carries a lot of implications. Summing it up in one line like that is akin to summing up Psychopathy as the lack of empathy or Depression as being really fuckin' sad.
>>6421984
He doesn't need your """explanation""". He can do the research himself. It was a pretty fucking transparent attempt to share your personal bias with him. You can stop pretending now.
>>6421994
He literally asked someone to explain it. You just suggested that it would be better to give an inaccurate explanation because going into details is unhelpful. Probably because the facts go against your precious feelings. I get it, you're just pretending to be retarded, but at least don't promote anti-intellectualism while doing so. There is nothing I hate more than ignorance and denial of science.
>>6420475
I am undeniably autoandro
However I don't like yaoi?
>>6422002
>He literally asked someone to explain it.
>newfag itt, what's aap/agp ?
0/10 apply yourself.
You fucking injected your personal bias into your shitty explanation without being asked. Fuck off.
>>6422012
I covered the various different viewpoints then gave my own. Try again dimwit.
I just call myself a cross dresser right now cause thinking about Trans stuff and getting into it made me depressed. I'm pretty closeted. But I'm also a narcissist. I do it because I love the way I look. I've been getting upset again about having a dick lately though. I just want to fit in my clothes like I should. I like feminine things, but I still have my mental masculine traits. I've pretty much just become a clothing fetishist, shopping, judging people on what they wear, going for designer. And I put so much work into dressing up that I don't want to take it off. So it's not really sexual. I have Trans friends saying things like I'll come out as true female in a few years. But I feel like I'd want to kill myself with either path, just for different reasons.
>>6422020
>various different viewpoints
LMAO sure you did. All you wanted to do was discredit the guy who coined the term. You can fuck off now.
>>6422047
I repeatedly defended some of his assertions while pointing out that others do not stand up to scrutiny. Before doing anything else I presented his theory exactly as he does. Were I trying to demonize him I'd present him the way the LGBT community presents him.
>LMAO
Well, I shouldn't be surprised your reading comprehension isn't topnotch. Still, an admirable effort for a mentally handicapped individual.
Blanchard himself has admitted AAP is bullshit he made up to appease feminists.
>>6422090
He did say that he put it in the DSM to preemptively protect his ass from angry feminists. A lot of women self-report AAP though, at least on the fetish level.
>>6422047
i'm definitely on the side of blanchard, but i'd say that description was even-handed
maybe i didn't read close enough though
>>6421855
>yet there is a significant, as far as I know similar per capita, contingent of AAPs.
I have known a lot of FTMs over the years and I have never met or read about a single one that got turned on at the thought of being a man or wearing men's clothes. You see MTFs all the time asking if they're still trans if they get turned on when they crossdress, but I would challenge you to try to find even one single similar "am I trans" post on /r/ftm or any other FTM board.
>>6422178
I actually ran into a few in the AGP general. They tried to start their own general but it kept dying due to there being like 3 of them. My personal experience is that there are far less of them, which would go along nicely with less women having paraphilias than men, but they've claimed that they personally knew quite a few people like them but that there is zero overlap between the places where they hang out and where we do. This leaves me conflicted. I believe this deserves some serious research but I couldn't find any.
If I had to go just by my own personal experience and the research done on MtFs so far I'd agree that the paraphilia line of thought makes the most sense. It is just strange to hear these self reports.
>>6422178
Turned on can mean a lot of things though. Guys get boners at the most random of times. And getting dressed it can happen easily. That doesn't necessarily mean your horny and need to fuck now.
Chicks don't have that same kind of easily triggered physical tell. Nipples are similar, but still different.
As a male cd, I do occasionally get that, but I'm not horny, it's an irritating inconvenience. If I'm dressing slutty for a partner then of course.
Oh I totally, totally get off on the idea of having a male body. Just the idea of having a proper wank can be enough to get me off. Wearing men's clothes does turn me on.
But at the same time it goes a lot deeper. It's not the only reason why I'm considering transitioning by a long long shot. Part of me thinks the autoeroticism is like a form of relief - not having this gross body I'm stuck in any more, having freedom.
I also can't speak on behalf of other FtMs.
>>6420928
Sources:
http://www.philpercs.com/2016/02/autogynephilia-a-critique-and-personal-narrative.html
http://deploy.loveisover.me/lgbt/thread/5788347/#5793031
>>6422178
To be fair half of them are like
>omgg I just imagined having sex with a guy and he was Fucking me and I had a vagina oh no does this mean I'm a agp fetishist and not trans??
>I just put on a dress and it made me happy does this mean I'm just agp?
>>6422266
It pisses me off that people still deny this because they can't deal with the fact Blanchard doesn't like them. Look, some peeps can be AGP without it invalidating the movement.
I have a good friend that is mtf and has trouble with getting off. They're usually at their limit on their binder by the time they have sex. And the jiggling of their boobs takes em out of it and they lose focus.
One time we fucked in a position where it looked like my dick was actually theirs. And we had a good conversation the next day of "... So did you come on me last night? You got that too?"
They have a packer now and love it. I'll need to see what they feel about the agp aap stuff.
>>6422513
preeeeetty sure you messed up your ms and fs there. But hey, it's cool, that's why we're here, right?
I can't get off unless I'm in a properly male headspace. Trying to fuck in a room with a mirror is a total no-go.
>>6422280
Well most people are retarded and don't actually understand Blanchard's theory. Blanchard never said that AGP people weren't trans, nor did he say that being AGP means you can't transition. Blanchard merely pointed out that an overwhelming number of MTF patients who were attracted to women and who sought transition happened to have a history of erotic cross dressing and arousal at the idea of being women. Blanchard still helped his AGP patients transition anyway because he noticed that many of them actually benefited from transition. Instead, however, nobody reads Blanchard's work and so anti-AGP retards use his work to argue that AGP people should be excluded as being trans when that is not at all what he believed, while people who oppose his theory think that Blanchard was personally insulting them with his AGP theory or trying to invalidate their transness or whatever. If people with AGP actually understood Blanchard's ideas, I think it might help them accept that their is nothing wrong with being AGP, and that they aren't actually excluded from the possibility of transitioning.
>>6421830
>>6421855
As a non-transitioning AGP myself all I gotta say is goddamn thats quite an effortpost.
I agree 100% but, I have my own pet theory on AGP. AGPs are feminized like the HSTS, but to a lesser degree so they can pass as cishet. They're never told their allowed to be anything else but a normal boy and terrified of the consequences of failing to do so. This amplifies during puberty. So they develop cognitive dissonance and repression. Then one day they snap and become a hon.
There is no concrete proof of this yet , but there is a hint. The exsistence of gyandromorphila, which is attraction to transwoman and transvestites. This is very common amongst AGPs, as any bitter HSTS will attest to. This could be an intermediate state between androphilia and gynephilia.
>>6422616
yea but still, trutrans is only trans.
agp fetishists are just autists playing dressup.
>>6422554
Yup, totes did. For the longest time when I heard Transmale or transwoman. I wasn't sure what exactly it meant like if it referred to before or after.
>>6422616
Yes Blanchard thinks AGPs are trans, BUT, he doesn't consider transwomen women. The anti-AGP tru trans crowd either doesn't get this, or doesn't care.
>>6422616
Right on. One thing I'd like to note (not that you said otherwise, mind) is that AGP is a very confusing condition because it can come with or without dysphoria. For some it can remain as contained as a foot fetish while for others it develops into an actual orientation. It is amazingly simple for one kind to mistake themselves for the other due to shame, doubt and stigma.
I think things are the way they are because it is a lot easier to sell non-AGP transsexuals to normal people than the AGP variety so the latter gets erased by the LGBT community. Try explaining something like AGP to your average American and all they hear is "pervert goes through extreme surgery to get off". Ultimately, though, this status quo is harmful to everyone. Spreading the truth is important.
Anti-T groups spreading the simplified view aren't helping.
>>6422624
One problem with this line of thought is that, if HSTS are MAX_HOMO and homosexuals are MID_HOMO then NHTS would fit between them but that would mean they are attracted to men, which they are sometimes not. NHTS somehow don't fit the spectrum which is why the paraphilia approach was attempted.
The whole spectrum argument could be false, mind, but it seems to hold so far and has more backing than the alternatives.
>>6422652
Don't worry. I was literally at a government policy discussion about this last week, and someone nervously approached me in the coffee break and asked me what I meant when I said 'transwoman'.
Doesn't help that I have a very female-looking face and figure that is pretty hard to hide in formal wear, so they might have thought I was talking about my own experiences as a transman when I was using the word.
So even people being asked for their input on the law don't get it totally.
>>6422682
>Transwoman
A female Transformers fan, living the Transformers lifestyle.
>>6421258
No, not attracted to men at all even after I started hrt. I think mtfs that "start" becoming attracted to men were always a little bi but in denial about it until they transitioned.
>>6422624
Wow, yeah I kinda feel that. I be cishet with family and most people I've known for a decade. Some of those decade long friends learned I cd and they can't look at me the same, or hate it, and don't want me mentioning it. But I'm open about it to most new friends I make, so it's just a part of me to them.
I like looking good both ways, and I love the styles in women's clothing in general. It was sort of erotic at first. But for the past 4 or 5 years, it's been about comfort, exploring styles, and even getting closer to my girl friends. Oddly, I kept telling myself I wouldn't be a tranny, but here I am. I got super dysphoric at first, but when I decided to stop trying to label and define myself and just started focusing on doing what I enjoy, I felt better. But Even as a part timer, I still have my moments of anxiety when I'm out.
I tend to place myself in the mentally ill category of it all.
>>6422670
Autistic agp fetishist detected. Get lost straight man
>>6422735
All transsexuals are their birth gender according Blanchard m8. Thanks for playing though.
>>6420475
Women have problem with being direct to the point and always end up lying or making up some random bullshit excuse.
They also go full tumblr if you mention something that "triggers" them, like the one you just did.
Don't even try to ask FtM shit like that because being born a female + testosterone in their brain giving roid rage is a recipe of a disaster if you really want to discuss anything with them.
>>6422642
What makes an AGP person less trans exactly? According to Blanchard, both AGP and non-AGP transpeople have dysphoria, the difference is in how the two groups came to be transsexuals in the first place. Besides, sexual arousal goes away in most AGP people who take hormones, because their libido decreases and the desire to remain female stays, but in a non-sexual way. There is no such thing as "trutrans," because the existence of AGP Transwomen shows that their are different paths by which people can become trans. Why does fitting the stereotypical meme of an effeminate boy who feels like a "woman trapped in a man's body" make someone's transness anymore valid ?
>6422663
You're right, I don't completely agree with Blanchard either, but to be honest, I think that many of his observations are correct though, but I disagree with some of his conclusions. For example, their is no way to know whether or not being AGP causes someone to eventually identify as trans or whether AGP fantasies are merely a symptom of a repressed, innate trans identity. Either way however, AGP people can still benefit from transitioning, and the point is that people should agree with or disagree with Blanchard's findings on the basis of what he actually said, instead of basing their opinion on a misinterpretation of his theory.
>>6422735
Looks like someone didn't even bother to try to understand Blanchard in the first place.
I've been meaning to make a Blanchard-themed "It says you're a faggot" reaction pic with Blanchard pointing to a book titled DSM 4 with the caption "It says you're an autogynephile" but I can't muster the fucks to do so. Use your imagination.
>>6422666
I agree, essentially many people who are AGP (myself included) are left in the dark when it comes to discovering whether or not they really are trans, because the only cases they are presented with are from people who fit the stereotypical narrative of "women trapped in men's bodies" who realized they were trans from a young age. The fact of the matter is that AGP people have trouble finding transwomen who don't fit this narrative because it's too stigmatizing for any MTF to openly admit she used to have erotic fantasies about being a woman. I can understand the need to stay silent about AGP post transition, but at the same time, I think it would be very helpful for AGP people who are confused if they could hear from someone with AGP who transitioned and turned out fine. Then they could find a narrative they could identify with and understand that AGP transexualism is more normal and common in the trans community than they think it is.
>>6421880
>I'm assuming you're ftm
Nope. Just mtf(tm on HRT), familia.
>>6423012
>AAP
>MtF
WHAAAAAAAT?
>>6421713
>literally agrees with me but pulls a combative tl;dr anyway
Are you on your period or something?
>>6421795
Damn, fujos really are mentally disabled. If that's not your reading comprehension and womyn emotions totally betraying you, go ahead and give me a citation.
>>6422827
AGP is conditioned, which means it can be treated via other means.
>>6422273
That's mostly because most ftms, until about 5 years ago, we're just former butch lesbos aka so lesbian they're men. A transcending tumblrina is much more recent of a phenomenon.
Men have started indulging fetishes a lot earlier, but as time passes, both AGP and AAP are given more means to get diagnosed. HSTS types are being outnumbered, especially with gay acceptance and less need to pose as the opposite sex to live normally.
>>6421437
it wasn't even meant to 'trigger' you but i guess it did so lol
>>6420475
I don't consider 4chan to be a representative sample of any group of people, nor should you.
>>6420566
On ftmg there are ""dudes"" that have lesbian sex with women and ""dudes"" that have """""gay""""" sex with hetero men penetrating them. Definitely MtF transbians that did it.
>>6423451
>implying the sample is 4chan
Ever heard of tumlr? I'm sure you have.
>>6423360
Wellllllll, by and large we don't know how to cure paraphilias and most of them develop during early childhood.
>>6423360
Yeah but funny thing is, I've basically stopped masturbating to AGP fantasies entirely in order to get rid of them and after about two weeks of not masturbating at all, my AGP fantasies disappeared, but I wanted to be female more intensely than ever, but it was no longer in a sexual way. That is basically the situation I'm in now, and I'm only 18, so it's not too late for me to transition yet.
>>6423502
Doesn't mean we shouldn't be trying. We don't treat personality disorders with surgery after all.
>>6423538
You're actually onto something, since the more you masturbate to a fetish the more it escalates. For you it might be too late, but abstaining can be a foundation for future non-surgical treatment.
>>6423543
I honestly think some people would like to be cured and that once we get to the whole genetically engineering our progeny thing we'll edit out transness but I can also see why someone who is already suffering from the condition and for whom AGP has developed into an orientation would be resistant to being "cured" because by this point it has become part of what makes them who they are.
Either way, for now, I think transitioning is a reasonable thing to do for some adults following careful screening.
>>6423560
I might eventually be able to control the desire to transition in time, but the thing is, it wasn't just my AGP that went away, but several other fetishes as well. I was basically a completely perverted sadomasochistic fetishist, but after I stopped masturbating to AGP fantasies all of those other fetishes went away as well.
>>6422747
Kek get lost delusional straight man
>>6423583
At that stage we'll also stop having live pregnancies and births. Babies will be grown in vats and the numbers will correspond with the exact ratio necessary for optimal productivity.
>>6423612
Facts are facts m80. Hence the term HOMOSEXUAL transsexuals to describe androphiles.
>>6423608
That's interesting. My experience with AGP started when I was 4. Non-sexual, obsessive fantasies about boys becoming girls. Turned sexual at puberty. Not just auto in my case though. Makes me doubt the "porn made me this way" hypothesis, you know?
>>6423647
For me it started at 9 when I had an obsessive fantasy about myself turning into a girl, and then at 15 I started engaging in extremely arousing cross dressing as well as masturbating to erotic fantasies about being a woman. Things started to change though when I was 17 when i basically stopped masturbating because I felt pretty ashamed. Thing is though, after I stopped masturbating I started to feel some actual dysphoria. At 18, I feel like I badly want to be a woman, but it's no longer sexual like it used to be, infact I barely even masturbate anymore.
>>6423608
Sounds a lot like me, though what stopped both AGP and SM fantasies was HRT.
>>6423716
If you don't mind me asking, at what age did you start HRT, do you pass pretty well? I feel like I want to start HRT now at 18, but I'm worried alot about passing and other problems.
>>6423729
Can't tell you much since I've only been taking it for a month, but I definitely feel better.
18 is not too bad age, and I think it's better to regret doing something you really want than not do it; If your dysphoria is strong enough of course.
>>6423704
I'm oddly glad to hear that. I really can't tell whether I'm actually trans since while I dislike my body and wouldn't want any other male body I don't experience the outright revulsion many people do. It is more "A cat is fine too" for me. I feel The Feels but also get turned on by the very thought of transitioning which kind of makes you doubt your integrity. Still couldn't see myself have a relationship as a man.
Not sure why I'm so obsessed with figuring myself out since I have no chance of passing and will probably end up repressing forever either way. Best of luck to you.
>>6423811
To be honest I was strongly confused about whether or not I was trans for the same reason. It wasn't until I actually found MTF people who were like me that I learned to accept that I was trans, because then I saw that my case was more normal and common that I thought. I feel as though even if I were never to transition, at least knowing that their other people out their like me who turned out fine makes me feel better.
>>6422624
Personally I'm mainly into men and other transwomen and I think of my attraction to as homosexual, as I think any reasonable person besides Blanchard would. If you're attracted to another male with a penis and y chromosomes, that attraction is gay as hell imo.
>>6422710
Same pham. This was me. Growing up I was a painfully timid guy and very introverted. My family mostly let me be, but school was hell. I got tall early and then stopped, so I was smaller than most of my male classmates.
Guys would try to fight me so I just let them wail on me because it felt pointless and I wanted it to be over with. Then I was raped by another classmate. I was afraid of men for a long time.
I think at least part of the reason I transitioned in the first place was because I was scared of them and didn't want to be like other men.
>>6422663
I don't either, trans myself
I am inherently different from women who don't need intervention to be that way. It doesn't mean I'm a wrong person, just a defective man
I'm not sure if I'm autoandro.
I'm attracted to pussy and cock, but I just dream of having a cock.
It's hard to cum when I'm not thinking about it honestly, the first time my gf got me off was when she gave my strap on a bj and was talking about my 'cock' and shit.
I dunno man.
>>6426493
No u, cunt.
Nobody even knows what you're derping about anymore, just let it go. Tumblr is waiting.
>>6426085
How the fuck did you orgasm without stimulation
>>6426876
That should be my line AGP tranny. You're really a retarded piece of shit. I BTFO'd you a long time ago and you've been responding with nothing except insults ever since. It's beyond me why you keep replying.
>>6428081
>m-muh line
>I-I BTFO'd you
Cute coping mechanism, fujo. Maybe someday you'll find a way to apply your delusions towards overcoming your daddy issues and penis envy.
>It's beyond me why you keep replying.
Because I enjoy facefucking hardcore masochists like you, desu.
>>6427826
It vibrates? And presses against my clit?
>>6429125
why are you asking a question?
>>6426493
>I am asking for an actual mtf admitting they transitioned because of agp. Neither of those links has anything to do with this description.
Then you clearly didn't read the links properly, allow me to quote from each source:
"I started my transition at 21. At the time I was morbidly depressed, suicidal, and a kissless virgin who was obsessed with 4chan, anime, traps and shemale porn. After a failed suicide attempt I felt that I might as well try to live out my sexual fantasy of being a girl. I came out of the closet, and tried my hardest to come off as a legit trans person and not some fetishist. Counter to that however, dressing in women's clothing sexually excited me. The thought of me being able to have sex with women and other "shemales" (as I called them back then. Now the word makes me wince), was enough to make be begin my transition."
"I did have a history of cross-dressing fetishism, with a particular predilection for nylon. In a nutshell, I would wear women’s clothing and become aroused... It seems possible that someone could think they’d be happier as a trans woman than being a cis male not because they think they “are a woman” deep down in their brain but because social and medical transition would satisfy their unique set of desires formed by a unique combination of nature and nurture. That’s me. I chose to be trans."
If those narratives from two transwomen don't describe an AGP transition, then I honestly don't what does.
>>6426493
Also keep in mind that Blanchard didn't believe that AGP in and of itself causes certain transwomen to transition. He said that Dysphoria causes them to do so, and that many AGP people won't ever develop gender dysphoria. Blanchard clearly saw that some AGP arousal eventually turned into GID, while many other cases of AGP don't. You probably will never find a trans woman who transitioned solely because of arousal, but rather one who transitioned because she was dysphoric but also had a history of cross gender arousal prior to experiencing dysphoria.
>>6429576
Agreed. What I find interesting is this: are we sure we know which one leads to which? On the surface you almost always hear of cross-gender arousal occurring before the person suffering from AGP starts feeling dysphoric but as shown by some people in this very thread sometimes the obsession with becoming the other gender started at a very young age. I counted 4, 5 and 8. Now it is not unheard of for children to engage in sexual behavior without adult supervision but many of the people I talked to claim that the obsession only turned sexual come puberty. This makes me wonder whether AGP fantasies are a coping mechanism. You separate the undesirable part of yourself and reduce it to something sexual so you can be "normal".
Mind, that's pure conjecture at this point. Blanchard's approach also makes sense and has a lot more evidence and research behind it.
>>6429606
At this point there's two possibilities: either years of AGP fantasies cause a person to develop dysphoria and become trans, or AGP fantasies are a symptom of repressed trans identity. Honestly, nobody can really answer this question at this point in time, but regardless of the cause of dysphoria, Blanchard, Lawrence and Bailey observed from their AGP patients that many of them benefited from transitioning.
So being AAP means you get off imagining your body is male, right?
I certainly have that. But I also hate being seen as female outside of fetish reasons. Always wanted to be a guy before I even really knew there was a difference.
I just assumed that if I was cis I'd be one of those cocky guys with sky-high confidence, one that sends dick pics and hits on straight men without a care in the world, because I'd be okay with my body and not find it the world's biggest turn off.
>>6429714
>But I also hate being seen as female outside of fetish reasons.
Didn't we establish that it's pretty common among AGP as well?
>>6429763
And by this I mean being seen as male obviously.
>>6429763
>>6429768
I don't know, I haven't read every post of the thread, just thought I'd add my 2c.
But, do (non-psychologist) people really care WHY other folks are trans? So long as it is of their own free will and something they understand the gravity of, why does it matter if it is so they can enjoy sex fully or not?
I don't really know, seems kind of a dumb thing to be mad about.
>>6429784
They really, really do. There's a battle between those trying to paint the whole thing as a simple perversion taken too far, those trying to erase it because it is too complicated to explain to normies and those taking the scientifically supported middle road.
Polards to the right, SJWs to the left and practically no one in the center.
>>6429791
But, okay, devil's advocate, even it it was a 'perversion'... why would that matter? Like, say I only wanted to be male so I could whack one out in front of the mirror every single night. There's people out there that are so angry about that to try to deny people treatment?
Christ humans are messed up.
>>6429800
Because, generally speaking, humans are a lot less accepting of people in full fetish gear going around them and getting off to it. Those who hold that view hold AGP/AAP transsexuals to be akin to latex-clad freaks living out their sexual fantasies in public, in plain view of children.
>>6420475
MTF lesbian. Not AGP.
Also get fucking educated, most of the tests that would render you AGP a cis women would also be considered AGP.
AGP is bullshit.
People need to fuck off and stop being jelous that some MTF people can find other women to love.
Stop trying to drag transbians into deeper shit than we already are. Our orientation is just as legit as anyone else's.
>>6430027
OP was clearly meaning to be a dick but AGP is very much a thing. There's a difference between being turned at the thought of yourself having some sexual experience as a woman, which most cis women do, and being turned on at the thought of how girly it would make you feel to dress like a maid and clean the house.
>>6430027
#AGPAndTriggered
>>6420475
because "lesbian MTFs" are insane men trying to barge into womens' spaces, and they get off to the idea that they can jerk off their penises wherever they want and the world bends over backwards to accommodate them
>>6440573
i already know that "transbians" are fetishist freaks?
>>6440587
Nice reading comprehension m80
>>6440602
>Autogynephilia is the erotic attraction to the idea of yourself as a woman
>AGPs still function as men
>AGP is a Paraphilia and only men report having paraphilias
>AGP exists
you said it yourself, transbians are fucking freaks that only deligtimize the rest of LGBTQIA
>>6421124
>cuz most ftms are not losers pre transition
>since its really hard to be female and a loser
maybe my experiences are skewed as a seth rogen trapped inside a plebtier autism "lesbian" body
>>6445338
Bet you had a bf or gf
>>6445338
Alot of FTMs are female nerds, tomboys or dykes, so they're not going to fit into conventional girl culture anyways.
>>6449971
no one likes cuntboy lizardpeople, not even other lizardpeople
>tfw no amount of my jewgold will ever buy me a functional dick
>>6420938
What exactly is he doing to this cat
>>6450272
Succ
>>6450288
I think that's just what he wants it to look like.
>>6421124
Hahaha. Oh man. Nearly every ftm I know is a fucking weeaboo fujo. Cept for like two. They do the Anime, but they're not loser fujoshi about it.
>>6451636
>tfw the evidence for AAP existing slowly mounts
Time to gather enough to disprove that paraphilia thing.
>>6440565
It's a bit more complicated than that, but okay. Whatever floats your boat.
>>6452803
um, no. it's pretty much exactly on point
>>6453005
RTFT
I'm a really faggoty bisexual FTM (/lit/-tier faggotry). I also browse /a/. Tear me to shreds.
Because we're not catty bitches trying to destroy each other at every turn. MTFs are definitely real women. Women are fucking social terrorists.
>>6453020
what
>>6421124
Disliking anime makes me a non-loser? Oh man. I was a fool for thinking that being a shut in for 10 years made me anything but a winner.
Now I have terminal cancer too, thanks for the vid.
>>6453165
no, it doesn't work that way. it's only likes anime => loser
>>6453047
Many people enjoy books and anime.
Your interests are popular, common and have nothing to do with gender roles/stereotypes.
Was that brutal enough for you?
>>6459096
Dang. And here I deluded myself again.
>>6420475
>There's absolutely nothing wrong with being tran for fetish reasons
Degenerate fucks like you make everyone else look bad
Before I transitioned I thought I was a lesbian, and thought I was straight for a while after that. I then thought I was bi, and now a few years later I've come to realize I'm gay. It would be stupid to say I'm an autoandrophile when I spent so much of my time not being attracted to men and only reading yaoi after I had be presenting as male for several years and had dated many men and women in that time frame
>>6462104
There isn't though
