why is it so hard to find a vegan boyfriend? :/
>>5342105
because all the vegan boys have girlfriends
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X-xoXbhnFHY
post vegan qts...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KumDaLweYp0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-lhBFByj5TY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KVRGd7q21cQ
>>5342105
Please don't post about being vegan on 4chan, you know you'll just be eaten alive.
just date an organic free-range plant, maybe a nice pine tree
I went vegan 2 years ago, wondered why most vegans were girls, then realized I'm a tranny.
>>5342114
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTHStdmh6t0
>>5342105
because gays love having big pieces of meat in their mouths.
>>5342151
This.
And vegans don't swallow since semen is an animal based product.
And we all know that spitters are quitters.
>>5342105
Because they all die from malnutrition after several years of starving themselves?
>>5342192
You can't starve yourself unless you don't eat enough calories, anon...
>>5342105
Now that we know that plants do express pain, what is the justification for veganism? Is it ok to eat lower life forms because we can't sense their pain? I didn't hear the cow moo out in pain and I didn't hear the cucumber release it's gaseous cry for help. What's the difference between killing a living thing for food and killing a living thing for food?
http://science.howstuffworks.com/life/botany/plants-feel-pain.htm
>>5342270
Some bullshit about plants not really dying when you take their fruits from them (so you're kinda chopping off their limbs slowly) and them not being treated as bad as animal (when they get showered with chemicals as well).
>>5342270
>>5342315
if you read past the click-bait title (which you probably don't) there is no evidence in this article that plants possess the subjective experience of pain, beyond the equivalent of your skin tanning when it's exposed to sunlight.
Even if that were the case, a plant-based diet requires less plants to die. This is a win on the ethical issue, but more importantly on the environmental issue.
>>5342105
I don't eat anything that casts a shadow.
>>5342270
Because more plants die if you're not vegan, because the animals you eat, happen to eat plants.
>>5342336
It's true, I didn't read the article because I knew it was bullshit. But I've seen that point raised to vegans in the past, and those were their arguments.
I mean, it's understandable. If I dedicated my life to something and then someone discovered it was all worthless, I'd hang on to whatever that made me feel like I didn't waste my time.
Really, I have nothing against vegans. Just against people who try to tell me what I should eat, who sometimes are people who eat meat as well.
Just live and let live.
>>5342344
Well that's not true. If we didn't eat those animals those animals would still eat plants. Most animals we are are herbivores and they need to eat plants to survive. In order to save plants couldn't we just farm and eat carnivores instead?
>>5342391
Most animals we eat are herbivores*
>>5342391
Well the only reason those animals exist is because they're bred to meet the demand for meat. If people stopped buying those products, no more livestock would be bred. And you couldn't save plants by raising carnivores, as you would have to raise herbivores for them to eat, who eat plants.
vegans don't deserve boyfriends
>>5342105
There must not be any vegans in your area, because the first thing a vegan usually does is make it known to the entire world that they are a vegan.
>>5342346
>Just live and let live.
the irony.
Because real men eat meat.
>>5342549
Well what if you don't want your bf to be a real man™?
>>5342105
Oh no not one of you....
Matthew Lush is that you?
>>5342105
Stop trying to link your animal rights bullshit to being gay. You're making a stereotype I don't want to be associated with I love eating meat from veal to foie gras.
You are what you eat and I'm made of meat.
>>5342840
How big is your meat?
>>5342881
Not that anon
Your meat sure looks *ahem* meaty
>>5342890
It's not a "one size fits all", though. I've had more than a few people NOPE the fuck out when they saw it. I've only gotten good reviews from those who decided to give it a go, though. :)
>>5342829
I don't see how asking for a vegan boyfriend is linking veganism to being gay?
I feel like LGB and body mod are the two communities that have a really high concentration of vegans. There are a lot of vegan cuties out there, you'll find yours OP!
>>5342129
lol ahaha
>>5342270
>implying that all vegans/veggies are moral
>prostate cancer
>degradation of the Earth
>but they feel pain!!!! guys just eat meat!!
k
>>5342142
kek
I still drink milk, op
>>5342270
The whole pain argument is completely null as we can kill animals painlessly. I don't see how you can ever live in a consumerist society and be a vegan though, it's like the biggest doublethink imaginable. If you want to go off the grid and grow your own planties then sure, you're making a personal stand on not taking part on the society that shits on nature, good for you, anything less is just plain hypocrisy.
I guess the most valid reason would be health concerns, though a lot of the claims are bullshit there are benefits to cutting down excessive animal product consumption especially if you have genetics that increase the risk of cardiovascular diseases. That's not veganism though. You're just taking care of your own body, not trying to perpetuate and ideology.
I'm a vegetarian but I can't go full vegan, I love cheese and milk too much.
>>5344255
Doublethink requires you be aware of your own hypocrisy, but still fully accept all of it with no internal conflict. In fact, even thinking of your own hypocrisy as hypocrisy sort of nulls it, but... fuck it explaining doublethink is hard.
>>5342270
Nothing in that article even remotely proves that plants can feel pain.
>plants react to shit because of stress hormones!!!1
Cool. In order to feel pain you need to be sentient. Plants aren't fucking sentient so they can't feel pain.
You don't even understand what pain is, jesus christ.
If you want to prove plants can feel pain prove that they are sentient.
Also veganism has a thousand other purposes beyond just ethics.
>>5344255
Most of the suffering animals experience is not during the act of killing, but during their lives, as most are raised on factory farms. And I don't think it's very practical to go live off in the wilderness for most people, much more reasonable to merely try to reduce the harm you do by living in society by being careful of what you consume, whether that be sweat-shop clothing, unethically sourced minerals, or indeed meat.
>>5344302
I have a problem with this too, I've wanted to be vegan for a while now, but have found dairy too hard to give up. I'm going to try soon though.
Not all LGBT are vegans, but all vegans are LGBT.
>>5345494
Peter Singer, world's best known living ethicist, isn't LGBT.
>>5345496
Forgot something.
Since insects can't feel pain does that make it ok for vegetarians and vegans eat them?
http://relaximanentomologist.tumblr.com/post/51301520453/do-insects-feel-pain
>>5345499
Literally who?
>>5345504
Google him, if you're interested.
>>5345501
I would say yes, but, of course, most people think insects are gross, so probably wouldn't want to eat them.
>>5345482
But none of that requires vegetarianism nor veganism, that's just being an informed and ethical consumer. You can be a smart consumer and not be a vegan, the reasoning for not eating animals or animal products has to come from somewhere else and I'm questioning whether that reasoning is valid in any way.
Buying turbofarmed corn product that's been pesticided and fertilized to high heavens is arguably more harmful to the environment than buying ethically produced meat.
>>5345501
Did you read that? It merely confirms that insects do feel something like human pain, but different because they're not human. No shit. In order to self-preserve you better have mechanisms like fear and pain or you and your germ line will die. Sentience is not required for any of this. Vegans are free to enjoy their ideology, but let's not shit the science bed just to make them feel better.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lq6eJO9q4Ck
>>5345574
So they feel pain differently? Like plants?
>>5345554
Well unfortunately most meat is derived from factory farms, because it's cheaper, animals in factory farms are fed grain, which means you actually have to grow more plants if you eat meat, because the process of conversion of plant calories into animal calories is inefficient. This also means you could in principle feed a lot more people if we fed our crops directly to humans:
http://www.news.cornell.edu/stories/1997/08/us-could-feed-800-million-people-grain-livestock-eat
>>5345633
I live in EU and we got pretty great ecologic standards for food that also give guidelines to how the animals should be treated, what they're fed, how they give birth and how they're accommodated in general (you have to let them outside and such). How well that standard is being upheld is another story but that's hardly up to me. I got no idea if a comparable standard exists in the US but I'd definitely be more wary about what I put in my mouth, be it meat or vegetable.
>This also means you could in principle feed a lot more people if we fed our crops directly to humans
In an ideal world there would be no famine or wars either. Even if everyone swapped to vegans all that would happen was that the meat and farmers would go out of business and land values would plummet. Not a single more person would get fed. It's a business after all and the only reason they're making that much plant products to feed the animals is because the meat farmers are paying for it.
>>5345670
That's true, but I hope the economy of meat is eventually replaced with an equally strong economy of plant based meat substitutes, which are becoming increasingly more sophisticated, I'm sure you have also heard of efforts to create in vitro meat.
>>5345686
>meat substitutes
Sure why not. Less strain on the environment is always nice but we're quite a way away from a product that's indistinguishable from a real steak for example, let alone one that's actually profitable to make. Until that I'd just recommend people to be smart about what they buy if they want to make a difference and not get too caught up in hypocritical trendy ideologies.
>>5345629
I imagine the plant system is more primitive and lacks a similar sensation of urgency. Nikkas can't move real quick. Scientifically speaking. But no sentience is not required for survival mechanisms. We're the only sentient lifeform that we know of.
>>5345771
Well really we only know that ourselves are sentient, we assume other people are because they act like us, and have a similar brain, but we have no direct access to their conscious experience, everyone other than me could just be a complex automaton.
>>5345789
>Can't tell if first year philosophy student or sociopath.
Right. Well anyway the plants told me the same thing about you. It's a Mexican standoff now. Pick unrelated.
>>5342336
>Even if that were the case, a plant-based diet requires less plants to die. This is a win on the ethical issue, but more importantly on the environmental issue.
This, honestly. I eat meat, but the environmental impact of land based animal agriculture is horrific for the environment. If I were to ever go vegan it would be for that issue alone.
>>5345977
Agriculture is unnatural. It requires the clearing of land, diversion of water, fucking up the diversity, and depleting the soil to the point where we're now totally dependent on fertilizers and pesticides for yield.
Meanwhile, animals eat plants. Animals poop on plants. Nature is used to this. Circle of life. We can certainly say common industrial scale animal harvesting isn't as benign, but let's not herpaderp about cow farts, fagfam.
The answer is clearly to live nomadic pastoralist lyfe.
>>5342105
Because only women care about that stupid un-natural shit anon
>>5346072
This is a common fallacy, it's called the appeal to nature:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_nature
Also I'm a bi male vegetarian, who would like to become vegan, so obviously not only women are involved.
>>5346125
>bi male vegetarian
so, female
>>5346146
Eh, I don't care.
>>5346149
Sure you don't. Like every other vegetarian/vegan you definitely made sure to let everyone know about your retarded proclivities though.
>>5346158
Why are they retarded?
>>5346158
>>5346189
>pic related
>>5346387
Glad I can entertain.
>>5346158
Not that guy but I don't bring it up unless I have to. Not everyone is holier-than-thou about their personal philosophies. I've run into some pretty obnoxious anti-vegetarians (dude canines lmao). Anyone can be an asshole.
>>5342105
Just want to let you know O, I had the tastiest delicious, most juicy beef hamburger just a moment ago, my mouth is still watering from chewing that tasty cow flesh.
>>5342203
You can still get very ill from not consuming all the required nutrients. Depriving yourself of proteins and vitamins leads to sickness and eventually death
>>5346735
But veganism doesn't deprive you of proteins, and almost all vitamins. B12 is the exception, which can be easily supplemented.
>>5345741
Just because veganism is "trendy" in no way validates or invalidates its relevance. And I fail to see how it is hypocritical because there is nothing inherently hypocritical in its concept.
If everyone was merely "smart about what they buy" there would still be factory farms because there are billions of us who want to eat meat and there needs to be productivity to sustain that demand. Disregarding an animal's well-being is directly tied to productivity. As long as people have access to meat, they will want a larger access, unless the whole western economic system changes.
Sure you can just eat meat once a month or so and end up with a sustainable meat production, but what would be the fucking point? It's still unnecessary and therefore doesn't justify the death of an animal, from a moral consequentialist perspective.
The best way to stop the huge impact of animal agriculture is to bring a gradual change in our moral system that's not that big, because most people who aren't psychopath recognize that animals shouldn't be harmed for their personal pleasure.
>but we're quite a way away from a product that's indistinguishable from a real steak for example, let alone one that's actually profitable to make.
You'd be surprised. We're not there yet, but we're getting there very soon, and way faster than in-vitro meat.
http://www.psfk.com/2015/10/bloody-veggie-burgers-impossible-foods-greenhouse-gases.html
http://www.entrepreneur.com/article/253380
http://www.wired.com/2015/09/want-make-enemies-fast-try-inventing-vegan-egg/ (how innovative startups are already threatening the egg industry)
>>5346996
>there is nothing inherently hypocritical in its concept.
there's no inherent justification for holding such an ideology either. Like i've done in the previous posts i'm questioning the reasoning that people often use to talk themselves into it and for many cases it doesn't really make sense, in some cases goes full on hypocrisy.
>there would still be factory farms because there are billions of us who want to eat meat and there needs to be productivity to sustain that demand
Incorrect. If people actually cared about the choices they make they'd choose not to eat meat unless its ethically produced. Not to mention that if everyone did it there'd be much higher demand for it which would obviously boost the profitability of such businesses.
>It's still unnecessary and therefore doesn't justify the death of an animal, from a moral consequentialist perspective.
>assertions based purely on personal beliefs
If you think it's morally wrong to kill an animal that's great, good for you, someone else might say that growing and harvesting plants is just as wrong and they wouldn't be any more right or wrong in saying so.
>we're getting there very soon
Not really. The first example is ground beef patty, the second is processed chicken nugget type of dish and the last is basically an egg, which is probably the easiest to replicate. We're still a long way away from pic related but I do agree that for most cooking the alternatives are way better. They generally preserve way better too which I personally find to be the best quality.
>>5347131
>Incorrect. If people actually cared about the choices they make they'd choose not to eat meat unless its ethically produced. Not to mention that if everyone did it there'd be much higher demand for it which would obviously boost the profitability of such businesses.
Unless there is a significant change of values that is engraved in society's moral contract, this is pure fantasy. Most people agree that slavery is wrong and still use many products of modern slavery. There will be no significant difference in the treatment of animals if a population of billions continues to hold it as moral to exploit and kill animals for their flesh and secretions. I'm not saying there will be no animals killed for food in my scenario, just as murder is still a thing, but there will be a vastly significant improvement compared to yours.
>If you think it's morally wrong to kill an animal that's great, good for you, someone else might say that growing and harvesting plants is just as wrong and they wouldn't be any more right or wrong in saying so.
But most people think it's morally wrong to kill animals. They just don't practice veganism because of irrational justifications like health concerns, peer pressure or appeal to nature fallacies. Disregarding notions of objective morality, most of society already agrees with the values of veganism.
>>5347360
Also most people tend to empathize with animals when exposed to their suffering. Nobody cringes when they see a neighbor mowing the lawn.
>>5346749
>which can be easily supplemented.
This is the stupidest shit ever.
There's always that one vegan that demonises meat eaters yet when someone points out the insufficience of a vegan diet he goes "muh supplements". Supplements extracted from either animals or made in a laboratory, meaning it's the product of a GMO, like insuline.
But then it somehow doesn't count.
A diet that needs supplements is not healthy.
tl;dr don't belittle someone's diet when your own is also insufficient as fuck.
>>5347554
>A diet that needs supplements is not healthy.
If said supplement complements the diet, then yes, it is healthy. I don't see why it wouldn't be.
I guess your own diet must be unhealthy too, since you probably get an iodine fix from table salt, like most people who do and who don't give a shit about supplements, except when they have to find a justification against being vegan.
Now let's put things in perspective: The most common source of b12 vitamin from animal products is meat. Meat contains saturated fat, cholesterol and heme iron which are known to be unhealthy. It's also a significant source of calories that contain no fiber and thus promotes gut diseases.
On the other hand, b12 supplements are just that, b12 supplements. You can eat all the good fruit, veggies and grains besides that to have an optimally healthy diet.
Say again how "a diet that needs supplements is not healthy"?
>>5342105
Both go against the grain.
>>5347554
Has is a diet lacking in one nutrient that can be easily supplemented insufficient? And B12 supplements aren't produced using animals, but via the fermentation of microbes, which can't suffer. Also what's wrong with GMOs? If a GMO, say a plant, can't suffer then why is it an ethical issue?
>>5342105
Because they're too busy terrorizing Scott pilgrim with their vegan powers?
>>5347762
>>5347762
people don't understand them so they are afraid of their application i.e. terms like "frankenfruit". GMOs are not inherently dangerous but we as people should be keeping a close eye on them b/c we should be interested in keeping the food we ingest safe. desu I think pesticide/herbicides are a bigger issue but w/e
If someone said to me he was vegan, I'd dump him right away. I don't date retards.
Is anyone here /pescetarian/
I've been thinking about trying it.
>>5347802
kek at how half the products listed are already avoided by vegans because they're either animal-tested or explicitely contain animal products
The rest of them can be made with plants, but since the carcasses can't just go to waste, they use animal byproducts. Regardless veganism is about doing your practical best, and is certainly a less retarded lifestyle than "I can't be perfect so I might as well go full sperg and not do any effort"
>>5347813
I was for like a handful of months before going full veggie, why?
>>5347901
Just curious
>>5347802
Why is being a vegan retarded?
>>5347813
Lots of people can't afford it
>>5347802
Careful with those edges, young man
>>5347813
I was before going vegetarian. It was fine.
If I had a vegan bf to cook for me I'd totally go vegan, but otherwise it seems like too much of a hassle to do it.
>>5348533
I'll cook for you anon!
>>5348538
sorry I already have a bf who's damn near carnivorous, I try to get him to eat healthier but his parents raised him on a less than stellar diet so it's behavioral for him now. He's still great though.
>>5347416
I find it funny thought that vegans tell me I wouldnt eat meat if I saw the slaughtering process. I watched the videos and it didn't really bother me watching an animal be slaughtered, actually it made kind of hungry thinking about the tender steaks or meat patties it would be made into.
I'm a vegan guy.
>>5350556
But I'm heterosexual so...good luck op.
>>5346043
>Agriculture is unnatural.
Not nearly as bad as animal agriculture - especially considering a huge portion of total agriculture goes directly to feeding the fucking animals. Getting rid of animal agriculture would reap enormous environmental benefits, even though we would still have plant agriculture for human consumption.
Nice try shit for brains.
>>5351163
>not reading past first sentence
>not understanding agriculture =/= nomadic pastoralism
>not appreciating cute pic
You're making vegans look silly.
Matthew lush
>>5342105
3 Reasons ....
1) LGBT is a minority, smaller dating pool
2) Vegan is a minority, smaller dating pool
3) A lot of vegans (not all) are quite militant about it, that makes for a less appealing personality
>>5342346
I don't tell people what they should eat. I just want them to acknowledge that killing or torturing intelligent life without a really good reason is bad. Eating the byproduct of that process doesn't bother me much, if they weren't involved in the production.
Vegan fag here, just getting finished with a 6000km bike tour across Canada.
>>5342524
Humans havent evolved past consuming organic matter just yet.
>>5347813
Just be wary of Mercury rich species like Marlin and Tuna, Anon.
>>5347554
>thinks they aren't eating supplements
https://onemodernlove.wordpress.com/2015/07/01/b12/
>tfw no vegan bf with great music taste
Relevant to some discussions on this thread:
https://www.overdrive.com/media/1316942/animal-oppression-and-human-violence
>>5342975
>I need a gay vegan boyfriend
>Im not linking anything
>gay
>vegan
pick one you faggot
