FAMAS replacement
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You are currently reading a thread in /k/ - Weapons
So the French army will replace the FAMAS rifle.
5 choices are here :
- HK416
- FN SCAR
- ARX 160
- SIG 516 or MCX
- VHS2
What's the best? Who'll win?
>>30534402
MCX or SCAR
Lelkek RDB.
Just do M4 Carbine.
IMO SCAR or the SIG would be the best buys for them. I'd really like to see them go for the sci-fi as fuck VHS. They'll get the HK, though
>>30534402
They're all pretty good options.
I remember reading somewhere that the ARX might be the favored choice among the French.
Personally I think the SCAR or ARX would be the most capable picks.
>>30534402
Marlin Camp 45.
The best choice would be the Sig MCX, it is truly the ultimate piston AR and the most advanced assault rifle at the moment.
>tfw not available on the French civil market
However we know that weapon procurement isn't about choosing the best, especially in France. Politics, lobbying and corruption will play the biggest part.
It's either going to be the ARX160 (because it's cheaper and Beretta is balls deep inside the army's asshole at the moment thanks to their insinder Humbert working on the FAMAS FELIN) or the HK416 (because Hollande is nothing but Merkel's dog)
>>30534531
>45
VHS-2 with large drum mags is the right choice
The VHS makes me hard, also our troops are already bullpup trained.
But I don't think it has much chances, and maybe it's for the better as I don't know how QC and reliability are.
Also
>>30534575
>we hellghast now
There were rumors pointing toward the Beretta, I hope they were wrong that thing is ugly.
But honestly anything will be a big improvement over the worn out Famases, those things only stick together because of the paint, of which there isn't much left.
>>30534639
Also we're supposed to know their final choice in december at the soonest.
>>30534402
>>30534575
>>30534639
Also
The HK is used by French special forces, HK has always used French special steels.
The army already buys the FNH MINIMI and MAG 7.62.
ARX160 is used by the Italian Armed Forces and has a French subsidiary, Humbert CTTS in Veauche in the Loire that could be responsible for the operational maintenance.
>>30534564
it did really well at a testing ground in Florida recently too.
>>30534402
Why bother with foreign rifles if now is the perfect opportunity to replace the F1 with the G2 model
>>30534440
I bought an ARX to go in the cruiser to replace the beaten up, old as fuck issued AR. It's nice. Like, really nice. I'm always one to be weary of sleazy Italians, but holy shit this gun kicks ass.
>>30534808
Link?
>>30534808
Kek, indeed, indeed.
Now that I think about it, the Orland shooting might actually become an excuse to eliminate the MCX. If it were to be selected, I'm sure some socialist politicians and journalists would shit their pants and start an uproar against it.
After all, France is the country whose police rejected the Glock 19, solely the "far right" were gaining seats in Austria.
>>30534827
Because French politicians somehow thought it was a good idea to completely shut down our light weapon industry back in 2001.
>>30534402
the less expensive will win
they announced they won't pay to develop a new tank until 2040.
I hope the Leclerc is as a good as they say after upgrades ayy
>>30534882
He's talking about Omar "Fags in body bags" Mateen
Why not use a Tavor? If France has used bullpups for such a long time, why would they go back?
>>30534402
France needs to go back to their classic 8mm.
My money is on th HK416 given that it's pretty much the standard issue rifle for French SOF. Pic related 1st RPIMA in Africa
>>30534921
Because bullpups have a lot of small part and are a fucking pain to maintain.
We operate mainly in areas with lot of dust and sand : cleaning these shits daily is a pain.
Plus it's not that practical to reload and high capacity magazine isn't an available option.
>>30534862
Like, really nice?
I've been eyeballing one for awhile... They seem really cool to me, and I've always trusted beretta.
>>30534898
KEK
Thanks senpai.
>>30534955
Naval commandos, prior to the 416 the used the Sig 550 series
SCAR
>>30534982
CPA 10, air force sof
>>30534894
>the less expensive will win
Exactly
>they announced they won't pay to develop a new tank until 2040.
Why to develop a new tank ?
No Leclerc deployed anywhere
>>30534921
Because bullpups are bullshit and everyone is going back. France will shift to a conventionnal design and so will the UK.
No one cares about the Tavor, its 5 MOA accuracy, non adjustable gas system, poor ergonomics and gas blowblack in the face, unless you're MAC.
A requirement of the tender was to have an adjustable stock, which conveniently eliminated all bullpups save for that abortion that is the VSH2.
Interestingly, IWI did try to enter the tender with the Galil ACE N by using Verney Carron as their shill, and they got BTFO, as they should be.
>>30535003
GIGN
>>30535015
>Because bullpups are bullshit and everyone is going back
While New Zealand is basically irrelevant, they dropped the AUG and adopted an AR,pic related. The Brit's won't adopt a new rifle anytime soon but will probably get rid of the L85s eventually, the strayans ducked up and decided to keep developing the AUG, doesn't matter how much you polish a turd
>>30535005
Well... true.
We prefer light vehicules with the highest caliber possible on top.
>>30535015
Okay, I'm glad to know the reasons behind not using bullpups.
>>30534926
But their classic 8mm was shit
>>30534402
There are pros for several rifles.
HK416 because HK makes ALL of their barrels with french steel from Aubert&Duval.
>H&K's reputation is due to some frogs, HKboos in suicide watch
Best gun on an economical standpoint.
Also, widely used within the french SF along the 417, battle proven
The SCAR seems to be really appreciated because of the reciprocating charging handle for some reason, instructors say it's way simpler to use for someone doing a Famas > Scar transition instead of a Famas > HK416
It's also lighter then the 416, compatible with more AR mags (fuck HK mags) they like the stock, the sights, and the grenade launcher.
The ARX160 is lightweight, got this fine reversible ejection port, and is the cheapest of both rifles, except for the VHS2. Other than that it's an ugly piece of sturdy plastic.
Lastly, the Sig MCX is a very serious contender because it's light as fuck and built like a tank, very reliable, taking the best from the AR and of the Sig55x basically.
The army don't want any bullpup even if the VHS2 is considered a good rifle and appreciated, basically a Famas 2.0. There may even be some VHS in some french SF units wanting an as close as possible replacement for the Famas.
It's all about who those in charge of the decision are going to hear the most :
If they hear the operators : SCAR
If they hear the industrials : HK416
If they hear the merchants mafia : ARX160
If they hear the logistics : SIG MCX
If they hear the "muh famas" autists : VHS2
Needless to say they won't take their decision before 2017 and the next elections. And if they do it they will make sure to chose the SHITTIEST gun just for the sake of putting the next president in a bad situation. Something like :
>"huehuehue le rifle of le army is shit you dun goofed u suck lol"
And before you tell me it's impossible, be advised we have a first minister who has no problem giving away his smartphone to israelis so they can spy on it freely.
>>30534402
I would imagine they would pick the HK 416 because they already have the HK 417 and a few HK 416. It also has the distinct advantage of being similar to other AR designs commonly used across NATO. The lifespan of the part on this rifle is supposed to be pretty good.
I don't think it would be a Swiss weapon because getting a national license to make them might be weird, what with Switzerland's neutrality policies.
The SCAR is too expensive especially considering all current rifles are to be replaced.
They might choose to modernize the Famas in a similar way to the vhs2.
>>30535119
>If they hear the "muh famas" autists : VHS2
arent all weapons used by nations want something that was made in their own country?
I mean most first world/NATO/EU nations use many weapons from a few countries, notably US, Germany, Swiss, Italy etc. as well as many 2nd and 3rd wrold nations buy weapons from them as well. The only nations that ican think of using anything else are the russian/chinese/former soviet states/african militias and other poor countries that only use an AK variant. If they had the money or were a growing economic and developing nation that influnces neighboring nations they would obviously build their own weapons consortium if they had the chance.
>>30535067
Pretty sure we still have the AUG, looks stupid as shit.
>it will start slowly
>as militaries are given their new weapons, the famas will disappear
>i will never see a soldier with a famas in the streets again.
hold me
>>30534422
You'd think it's the obvious choice, but it's going to be the as close as I can get to an m4/m16 while saying it's better clone with a different gas system.
>>30535423
famas will be the North African army weapon of choice for the next 20 years
I heard from a half-reliable source that the ARX has the favors of the Armée for the moment.
>>30535460
yeah but i wont SEE them live anymore...
>>30535503
Africans will take back their rightful clay soon
So you will :)
>>30535528
>rightfull clay
hon hon europe is our rightfull clay, we just have to watch out for those damn russians
>>30534402
they're all famases, what difference does it make?
>>30534926
But that's 30-06
>>30535109
No, the 30-06 pictured was trouble
8mm was fine.
https://www.forgottenweapons.com/the-chauchat-shooting-history-and-tactics-video/
>>30535640
No, the design of 8mm Lebel overall is pretty antiquated and terrible overall
a good first try at smokeless powder round though
>>30535003
That helmet looks leet as fuck.
>>30534890
>Because French politicians somehow thought it was a good idea to completely shut down our light weapon industry back in 2001.
Baguette-anon, compared to other European militaries, how neutered is yours?
>>30534402
>>30535119
>VHS
>Same as a FAMAS
That's inherently incorrect. VHS utilizes a similar gas impingement that the ARs use. French guns are lever delayed blowback. Either way, had the French kept their arms industry, the F1 would have been shifted out for the improved G2
>>30535264
>They might choose to modernize the Famas in a similar way to the vhs2.
The modernized FAMAS would be the FAMAS G2. I doubt that however, since the politicians shut down their own arms industry
>>30534402
>HK416
IntoTheTrashItGoes.jpg
>>30534402
The smart thing to do would be to go for the SIG or the SCAR, but I have a sneaking suspicion that either Italy will con them into the ARX somehow or their autism will take over and they'll go for the VHS2
>>30535068
>turn turret to the right or left
>fire
>barrel rolls
>>30534422
>replacing it with an even older design
>>30535826
the funny thing is it works
no barrel rolls involved tho
they even thought about replacing the 90 by a 105 on it.
Finaly they are trying to put on pic related
>>30535119
>compatible with more AR mags (fuck HK mags)
This only a problem for the first gen 416 and only with gen 1&2 pmags, the A5 doesn't have that problem also
>if they hear the operators: SCAR
It's practically been abandoned in favor of the 416 & 417 see
>>30535019
>>30535003
>>30534982
>>30534955
So really HK has an extra edge, given its a favorite among operators and industrialist have a stake in it (one of these carries more weight. Pro tip, it's not the 1st one)
>>30534402
Whichever one is the cheapest
>>30534402
You should make a straw poll on the choices
>>30535724
The G2 is still getting pretty old by Western military standards. Keep in mind the US military tried to replace the most current generation M4/M16 in the early-mid 2000s.
Why are you all so quick to rule out the SCAR?
With all the politics involved my quick estimate says that Fabrique Nationale would be a pretty strong contender, being situated in Belgium and being one of the big manufacturers.
Guys you don't get it.
Every year France launch a program to replace the Famas
And then they realize they forgot they don't have the money for that.
Repeat
>>30536520
Cost, which was enough to get the arguably over funded US military to say no.
>>30535084
More awkward to reload where you can see it, and when wearing gear on top of armor. Also you need either mechanical linkages from the controls to the receiver (for increased weight and lower reliability), or to put the controls in suboptimal places.
>>30536858
It's things like the Air Force and Navy that are funded. Infantry weapons are maintained with gallon buckets of CLP and hope- there's no budget for replacements.
>>30535955
>Implying that old design hasn't been iterated and upgraded over the decades
>>30535423
Fuck. I'll miss those worn, scratched, French made motherfuckers.
>mfw vigipirate is pretty much useless but I like it because it puts live gunporn on the streets.
The other day at the train station they had camouflaged Felins with red dots. Neat as fuck.
>>30537021
I feel you, the Famas, for all its defaults, had a good visual identity for him. I mean, that was THE french rifle per excellence.
>>30534402
All are shit as they are special snowflake guns that don't do anything better than an AR15 or AK47. I am sure if the French asked the Chinese for either designs they would of sold the means to manufacture them for the price of their jerk-off weapon tests.
France needs to adopt a rifle that is easy to manufacture, easy to maintain, has a large market of readily available parts/accessories, and is simple in design.
>>30535067
>The Brit's won't adopt a new rifle anytime soon but will probably get rid of the L85s eventually,
The Brits keep slowly switching to Canadian C7s/C8s as all the important people seem to have them (Special Forces and people who defend Nuclear Weapons).
>>30534575
Death to the Vektan dogs
>>30534402
VHS2, they're used to the layout already.
>>30534402
I'm surprised the G36 isn't a contender. I figured France would be all over showing some European "solidarity" with Germany, especially after brexit. What better way than to slowly integrate the two armies into one European Army, starting with the same equipment?
>>30537392
Even the Germans want to get rid of the G36 now.
>>30537392
lol no, De Gaulle left NATO for a reason.
>>30534531
muh dick
>>30534402
HK416 or MCX
>no ones mentioned the f90
youre all a bunch of stupid gay poofta cunts
>>30535955
>old designs are inherently worse than new designs
>>30537658
augfags would loose their minds if the french adopted that
>australia, ireland, and FRANCE!
>>30534402
>Going from bullpup back to grandpa gun
Dumb. Leave it to the French to surrender good ideas.
>>30535005
How good is the leclerc
>>30535019
GIGN even do their good they are a fucking meme .
BRI or even GIPN see more action then them
>>30538453
Good but cost too much , never fired a shot on anny OPFOR , is a bitch to repair and it cant handle dust ( for real , they have to put one of those plastic blankets on top of it when they are in a desert ).
But hey , they need a mbt to ride with on the Saint Elysee during 14 july so that the Jewish war lords that run France have something to jack off too
>>30534422
Why? The reason the US still uses them is because the newer stuff isn't improved enough to merit a whole logistics swap. Thats a non issue for a country looking for something completely new. So France has the opportunity to switch to something better, even if it's only a 5% improvement
>>30537505
Yeah, him being paranoid and butthurt about the US/UK special relationship.
RIP in peace FAMAS
>>30534402
SCAR because Frenchies should stick with their kind
>>30538640
Gign does a shit ton of drug control near the alps and protect VIPS
>>30534749
>>30537234
>>30534639
Is it just me or are the helghast like /k/s videogame rhodesia?
>>30534402
I think it'll be the HK416.
I read somewhere that the French military was already leaning towards it, what with it being used by their spec-ops and all and that French soldiers seemed to prefer it over the other candidates. It was an article I read a while back, I'll post it if I find it. If not the 416, then I hope either the SCAR or the ARX.
See ya FAMAS ;_;
>>30537658
It wasn't selected for testing. Even though if it was it would be the only French owned design. (Though Australian designed)
>>30538950
The M4 beat every rifle in rounds fired before failure that required a specialist to fix. Only one rifle jammed less (everyone assumes the M4), but jams can be fixed by most soldiers in the field. There is a very good argument that the M4 was the best rifle in the tests. If not the M4, then the HK, but it is also more expensive. The current M4 is an excellent rifle. The French should have looked at it.
>>30542310
That is, everyone assumes the HK jammed less, but that hasn't been directly confirmed.
Here is a hit piece on the M4A1 that actually argues that it is based (dumb journalist):
>"A second graphic shows test results for “mean rounds between failures.” This is perhaps the most important test because it shows how many shots the rifle can fire before stoppage.
Again gun “C” was by far the best, achieving more than 2,500 rounds. The M4A1 failed after 500 — a gap that can make a significant difference in battle.
This test was a measurement of Class 1 and Class 2 magazine stoppages, in which one soldier can clear the gun himself within 10 seconds or more than 10 seconds, respectively. The U.S. official said classes 1 and 2 are the most common stoppages in battle.
A third graphic shows the M4A1 performed best for Class 3 stoppages, which are more significant failures that require a specialist, or armorer, to clear.
It achieved 6,000 mean rounds between failure. Gun “C” achieved about 4,500 rounds."
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2014/aug/19/armys-quits-tests-after-competing-rifle-outperform/
So, again, the M4A1 out performed every rifle but one in stoppages that a soldier can clear (prob HK), and outperformed every rifle in stoppages that required a armorer to fix. It is also probably the cheapest rifle on that list. It is a good gun.
>>30534402
SCAR-L /556 is an underrated design.
And it is definitely right on par with HK416 for quality, if not more reliable.
>>30537392
Finally someone mentions the Krauts. Frogs and Krauts LOVE each other in the recent years (like, since mid50s).
Now the Krauts want a new standard rifle for their troops, see >>30537438 (well, rifle is fine dot jaypeg, but vonder Leyen wants to "solve """problems"""" so they'll get a new one anyway).
I don't see the Krauts buying anything but HK really (I mean, Haenel? come on) so if they and the frogs get together and get the same, that would create some nice synergy effects. 416 for both? Fine by me
VHS2 looks fucking cool. anyone has more info on dis ?.
>>30540911
hmm.. pretty much. Helghast are legit.
>>30536130
Our doctrine is so retarded, the fact that it works, and well with that, makes me all gigly in the side.
What's the caliber on that thing? And can we paint racing flames on the sides?
>>30538640
>GIGN even do their good they are a fucking meme .
>BRI or even GIPN see more action then them
I didn't know that BRI and GIPN deployed to Afghanistan, pic related.
>>30542391
Yeah, the old GI mags we used were kind of shit.
The new tan followers are just as good, at least for reliability, as PMags.
>>30534402
SCAR or 416
>>30545162
Bullpup.
Nuff said.
>>30536130
It's a 25mm gun, either a bushmater or shorter-barreled cockerill (if i remember correctly) depending on mock-up model (here the bushmaster). Surprisingly there is no mock-up with the 25mm gun of the VBCI. It doesn't fit very well in french doctrine any way, combat recon if performed by Jaguar with its 40mm gun and javelin-like MMP missiles, scouting is performed by VBL which will be replaced by something probably way lighter than the CRAB.
I don't believe the VHS-2 has any chance, so we can say goodbye to bullpup rifles imho. My bet goes to the HK416 though i'd prefer the SCAR for purely aesthetic reasons. Anything but the Beretta is fine with me anyway. Uzbeen never forget.
>>30538714
>overtired memes: the post
