The USP is the best handgun ever designed.
Prove me wrong
>Protip, you can't
>>30523151
Airshit, please go.
>>30523175
>.45 Auto stamped on the gun
>Airshit
Pick one
I fully agree with you, OP.
>>30523192
>watermark
http://www.ksc-guns.co.jp/
>>30523151
Can't mount modern lights without an adapter.
Low capacity magazines
>>30523151
unreliable
>>30523315
UN FUCKING RELIABLE
>>30523259
can confirm KSC is an airshit company
not even a good one at that. 6/10. Definitely will break on you in like 2 years OP you done goofed
>>30523315
Clearly you have never owned a USP before
I love my USP but the obvious best handgun ever designed is the 1911.
>>30523192
>OP is gullible
>would buy airshit because caliber is stamped on slide
nice thread.
>>30523192
>thinking replicas wouldn't have replica markings
really makes you think
>>30523303
Wrong, pic related
>>30523315
Over almost 300,000 all original parts with no failure at Federal
>>30523346
Clearly you don't know what they're referencing
1911 a best
>>30523364
Clearly not, why don't you fill me in?
>>30523151
it's a gun for small guys, make of that what you will.
>>30523151
Get a glock you homosexual, UPS is garbage.
>>30523151
I like mine, but they're not my only handguns
>>30523360
So it's bigger than a G30, but has the same mag capacity? Sounds like it could have been higher capacity.
And still, no modern lights without an adapter.
>>30523400
>UPS is garbage.
tell me about it, they always deliver my packages late.
>>30523400
I agree. Glocks, Sigs, and 1911s are the only semi-auto handguns that should be made.
>>30523383
it's not a soldier's gun
>>30523192
So if I write ."45 Auto" on a banana, does that make it a firearm?
>>30523151
Here Op save this pic but change the filename.
>>30523400
UPS is superior to any of the other shipping companies.
>>30523383
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRRwbhN4-sU
>>30523151
>that rail
>that mag release
>mag capacity
>>30523348
>>30523376
The USP is the modern successor to the 1911. It's like a German 1911. America and Germany. In a gun. Together. What's not to love about that?
>>30523151
His big brother would disagree
>>30523419
That picture is a TLR3 with no adapter, and it is far thinner than a G30. Thinner than a P01 too.
>>30523151
I want to get one
Maybe in .40 because thats what it was designed for
>inb4 the highest 9mm is comparable to the lowest .40
>>30523601
>TLR
How about a quality light?
>>30523151
>polymer
quod erat demonstrandum
>>30523419
The TLR-3 can be bought adapted to the USP. Also 8 rounds in something that is comfortable to grip and easier to conceal is perfectly fine.
>>30523648
Frankly, because a quality light belongs more on a carbine than a pistol. The TLR3 is on my USP 45 Tactical now for HD, I shoot with it and it's never given me any problems I've over the years so no need to replace.
>>30523648
Streamlights are good.
>>30523676
Streamlights, at least historically, have had issues with cold temperatures
>>30523151
USP is the tits, they make all the glockfags and czboos have cold sweats when even mentioned.
>>30523151
In the market for a 9mm USP Elite because reasons.
>>30523432
If you put a serial number on the banana as well, it just might.
>>30523716
Well, I'm on the Texas coast so that will never be an issue lol. It's made it through the one week of maybe sub 50's "cold" we get a year for few couple years now.
>>30523740
Didn't someone on here recently break it down and found out that it was cheaper/better to just buy a new USP9 and then buy the threaded barrel and match trigger afterwards?
The slide won't say "elite" on it though, so that might be an issue for some.
I might be thinking of the tactical too tho.
>>30523750
AAAAHAHAHAHA
I didn't even see that post or I would have made sure I commented on it. Only thing is mine isn't Airsoft.
>>30523415
Am I the only one who thinks stainless slides on USPs look terrible?
No offense bro, but I can't help it.
>>30523781
You're not alone, I despise anything two tone
>>30523781
I agree. They look so gaudy to me. Too much like something you'd find in a rapper's teeth.
Better than pic related, but still.
>>30523764
You're thinking of the USP Tactical. The Elite has a totally different slide, which gives a longer sight distance.
>>30523781
>>30523789
I love my stainless USP45 and USP45 compact.
No they're not tacticool nor will they ever see a duty holster. But I just like stainless shit for some reason. Different tastes I suppose.
'Merica
>>30523800
Ahhh that's right. I see these with those barrel weights on them sometimes. Looks like a gun from the future.
>>30523175
>OP uses random google image search pic of replica USP not obviously a toy
>Hurr airshit go
Shut the fuck up, autist
That being said, OP probably doesn't own one.
>>30523804
I don't mind stainless in general, it's just the USP specifically.
Don't know why. I just think it looks bad.
>>30523419
They could have put more rounds but didn't because it made the gun perform worse in reliability tests.
>>30523151
High bore axis.
Proprietary rail.
Tiny and hard to reach mag release.
Backwards cartridges in magazines.
Poor magazine capacity.
Five-seveN is far superior.
Steyr M series is far superior.
>>30523456
I'm sorry, did your handgun invent pistol rails? There were no such thing as rails on a handgun before the USP.
>>30523781
I don't own any pistols with a stainless slide, but I can see the appeal. Black "superfinishes," like HK's HE finish, tend to be matte and have no inherent attractiveness. When they wear, they tend to get ugly streaks and sometimes the entire finish flakes off of the metal. Polished bluing looks the best and wears the most attractively, but not too many manufacturers do it anymore, and anyway, bluing is very susceptible to rusting. Stainless has the potential to be a nice middle ground. You have the attractiveness of the raw metal, there's nothing to flake off, and it's not (as) susceptible to rust as blued carbon steel.
>>30523637
USP Compact was originally designed for .40. only HK gun designed around the caliber
>>30523852
Well fuck
>>30523819
>not obviously a toy
This is how I know that you need to lurk more.
There are at least three things about that picture that the casual observer should have noticed immediately, even if you thought KSC was the name of the photographer.
>The grip text says "US.Lot.5.309.815," which HK has never put on their pistols. A USP will say either "HK USP" or "USP."
>The magazine feed lips are obviously not for feeding cartridges - just look at them.
>The hammer has some sort of weird stippling on the sides of it which HK has never done.
>>30523852
Both the fullsize and compact were, and then they were redesigned for .45. That's why the .45 has metal mags and a different frame, they didn't just drop in a different barrel and call it a day.
>>30523834
>Five-seveN is far superior.
>Steyr M series is far superior.
And this is how you defeat your own argument by destroying all your credibility.
>>30523883
The full size USP has a long history of being a variant of the Mark 23, which was designed around .45 ACP, and even .45 ACP +P.
>>30523804
You a Miami Vice type nigga, I can dig it. I like bi tone also, anon.
>>30523896
They can shoot .45 super out of the box, too.
>>30523151
Best at what?
>>30523637
>Maybe in .40 because thats what it was designed for
Not really.
>I want to get one
.40S&W is shit and 9mm is better. Alright, I got that out of my system.
But if you like .40S&W and want a USP chambered in it, you're in luck, because a lot of places have been discounting the USP40s for the last year or two since they don't sell as much anymore like the 9 and 45s do and they're trying to unload stock.
Top Gun Supply just sent out an email about ~2-3 weeks ago for USP40s at, I believe, $679 or thereabouts. They've done that at least 2 or 3 times in the last year. They also did it with the .40 P30s a few times.
>>30523781
I think two tone looks good on some pistols. The USP is not one of them.
>>30523889
The Five-seveN is superior to the USP in many ways.
1 : It is lighter. The FsN is 23oz, where as the lightest USP (9x19mm) is over 27oz.
2 : It is chambered in a superior cartridge. 5.7x28 is superior to .45, .40, and 9mm. 5.7 has lower recoil, similar energy, is very flat shooting, has a longer effective range, is lighter, and is more versatile.
3 : The FsN has a standard rail, allowing easy attachment of any pistol light/laser.
4 : The FsN has a higher magazine capacity (20 rounds) vs the USP (15 rounds for 9x19mm, 13 for .40, and 12 for .45)
5 : The FsN has a better designed and placed magazine release.
6 : Returning to point #2, the FsN can penetrate Level IIIa armor, making it more practical for police and military use, and depending on your forseen use, more practical for civilians as well.
7 : Again returning to point #2, lower recoil. Lower recoil enables faster, more accurate follow up shots. No one can argue that two shots on target of 9mm or .45 is better than three shots of 5.7 on target.
8 : The Five-seveN can be used for varmint hunting, if you do your part. The versatility of 5.7x28 enables you to load up varmint rounds like the 40gr V-Max, or Barnes Varmint Grenades.
9 : The cartridges actually go into the magazine the right way instead of backwards.
>>30524069
>5.7x28 is superior to .45, .40, and 9mm
I'm torn between a new 1911 and a USP compact or HK45 compact.
I want the 1911 for reasons and feels. But I also want to pick up an HK.
I want both butI can only get one because I'm picking up a new upper too
>>30523804
>the size of that 500 magnum revolver
Holy fuck. I mean, HOLY FUCK. That thing is huge. I had to remind myself how big Desert Eagles are several times while looking at that picture.
>>30524083
Its like comparing 7.62x39 to 5.56x45.
It is generally known that 5.56 is superior. Ever wonder why?
>>30524069
kys
>>30524069
>The Five-seveN is superior to the USP in many ways.
>>30524111
No it's like comparing 5.56 to a .22 magnum
>>30524111
because you're a shitposting tripshit NEET with too much time on his hands?
>>30524069
Yeah but the Five seven jams all the time.
>>30524111
Those are both rifle calibers of comparable power.
>>30524110
LOL Glad you enjoyed it. Shooting them is a hoot. Honestly the 500 smith is easier to shoot than the Deagle. The DE ejects straight up so unless you get rock-solid into a weaver or iso firing stance the muzzle flip WILL put brass in your face.
Here's a fun size comparison I did around the same time, when I was more frequent here on /k/
>>30524141
>implying most common service cartridges don't have similar energy to 5.7
>>30524160
Here's another one I did years ago, when the 'merica stuff was just getting started
Okay be honest, how many of you have a USP because you saw it in a movie/tv show? The USP has a great reputation, but I probably wouldn't hae got one if it were not for Evangelion.
>>30524141
x39 is substantially more powerful and has better termal ballistics when comparing similar loads.
5.56 has a much flatter trajectory within its effective range and has a somewhat longer range than x39 because x39 starts dropping like a rock at 400m or so.
5-7 is a pathetic unicorn mouse fart.
>>30524141
5.7, .45, .40, and 9mm are all pistol cartridges with comparable power.
>>30524135
I've got thousands of rounds through mine (SS197, SS198, SS195, SS192, American Eagle, Elite Ammunition) and I've never had a single jam. Not a one. Ever. Of any kind.
>>30524117
.22 mag is actually no slouch out of a rifle length barrel, but no. 5.7 has similar energy to 9mm, 40, and .45.
>>30524112
Nice kot.
>>30524190
>Okay be honest, how many of you have a USP because you saw it in a movie/tv show?
This could be said about nearly every gun ever. That's a bad argument.
>>30524069
>1 : It is lighter.
For what practical application would those 4 ounces matter? Neither is a pocket pistol. On a sturdy belt, it's irrelevant.
>2 : It is chambered in a superior cartridge. 5.7x28 is superior to .45, .40, and 9mm.
No, it's not.
>5.7 has lower recoil, similar energy, is very flat shooting, has a longer effective range, is lighter, and is more versatile.
You probably don't even know what half those buzzwords mean. Flat shooting does not mean less muzzle flip. It means that it shoots closer to point of aim at distances around 100 yards and farther. Which is totally irrelevant with handguns, since they aren't intended for those distances.
>3 : The FsN has a standard rail, allowing easy attachment of any pistol light/laser.
What are adapters.
>4 : The FsN has a higher magazine capacity (20 rounds) vs the USP (15 rounds for 9x19mm, 13 for .40, and 12 for .45)
More rounds, less power per round.
>5 : The FsN has a better designed and placed magazine release.
I disagree.
>6 : Returning to point #2, the FsN can penetrate Level IIIa armor, making it more practical for police and military use, and depending on your forseen use, more practical for civilians as well.
FMJ 5.7x28 ammo, which is all civilians can buy, shot out of a pistol, can NOT penetrate IIIa body armor. Try again.
>7 : Again returning to point #2, lower recoil. Lower recoil enables faster, more accurate follow up shots. No one can argue that two shots on target of 9mm or .45 is better than three shots of 5.7 on target.
I can make that argument in one word: penetration.
>8 : The Five-seveN can be used for varmint hunting, if you do your part. The versatility of 5.7x28 enables you to load up varmint rounds like the 40gr V-Max, or Barnes Varmint Grenades.
Not sure why you are hunting with a pistol, but you know what else is considered a "varmint" caliber? .22 magnum.
>9 : The cartridges actually go into the magazine the right way instead of backwards.
Lel, HK marketing memes :D
>>30523151
Am I a bad person for liking a bone stock Gen 3 Glock more?
It looks really sexy and the ergos are nice but somehow shooting the fucking things feels "off" and that trigger pull is too long and shitty.
>>30524190
I already had my stainless USP45 but I wanted a USP Match something fierce after the Angelina Jolie version of Tomb Raider.
Naturally, the prices went absolutely full-retard after that movie was released and it was discontinued. Arg.
>>30524190
It was Collateral for me
>one of the best shooting scenes in a movie
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bI1_-a0coag
>>30524235
Get the light LEM
It's basically a single action trigger just with a lot of take up so that a thumb safety is not needed for it to be viable to carry
>>30524164
Muzzle energy doesn't mean what you think it means. A light, high energy projectile will dump all its energy into the first few inches of the target and fail to penetrate because it lacks any real momentum. Considering that the heart and lungs are protected by bones, which can defeat these light, medium velocity bullets, this kind of thing does matter.
>>30524235
The factory USP trigger is full euro retard. The match trigger is money well spent - sadly it's HK tier expensive at $130ish whenever HK parts dot net has them in stock.
>>30524219
Loving it because it was in a movie doesn't mean it's still not a great fucking gun.
>>30523834
>High bore axis.
Isn't actually a problem, go shoot some guns before you speak on this matter.
>Proprietary rail.
There is adapters and many adapted lights for it.
>Tiny and hard to reach mag release.
You aren't supposed to use your thumbs retard. Also if you shot any other guns you would know that they all require you to adjust your grip to release the magazine.
>Poor magazine capacity.
Its a pistol, if you need more ammo change mags, or bring a rifle. Its not like we are talking about a big difference between other guns here. Also the first 3 shots matter than the extra 2 you would get with a glock.
>Marisa Kirisame !!1zao16xwdwl
Don't reply to him. Don't talk about him. Don't give him any (You)'s.
>>30523852
>>30523876
This guy is wrong, the fullsize was designed around .40 as well.
>>30524203
Except 7.62x39 does not have better terminal ballistics.
>>30524267
I never said anything to refute that.
Did you even read my post?
>>30524212
>5.7, .45, .40, and 9mm are all pistol cartridges with comparable power.
>>30524190
MGS2, but now I have a newfound love for Misato (sorry Asuka)
>>30523896
Yeah, no. The USP40 and USP 9 came out one whole year before the USP45. The fullsizes were designed around .40.
>>30524225
What this guy said also the fn 5.7 has a shit trigger, shitty safety that is not conducive to disengaging while keeping a firing grip on the gun.
The magazine release on h&k and Walther guns imo is better. It is less likely to be inadvertently pushed, is ambi yet unobtrusive, allows for it to be pushed without shifting your hand. The only downside is that it is different. The problem is that people who don't know how to use it try to push it down with their thumb instead of with their index or middle finger as it was intended to be used. I have found I am much faster with this style of mag release and I think if people would spend some time with it they would be too.
>>30524267
You said it was a bad argument but what he said wasn't an argument at all.
I also enjoy the USP mag release and have no issues going from my 'standard' mag release guns to my USP.
It's definitely faster and definitely more secure.
>>30524048
>Not really.
Yes it was.
>.40S&W is shit and 9mm is better. Alright, I got that out of my system.
.40 is fine, it penetrates better, and you should always have at least one .40. Unless you are some Autist from /k/ who hates when people buy things he can't shoot..err I mean he doesn't like.
>>30523400
FEDEX shills please go.
>>30524264
>is full euro retard
Can you elaborate on this a little? Because I've noticed something similar in all the HKs and Walthers I've shot. Not so much the Glocks, but I know they have a lot of room for trigger upgrades too. Is there some kind of weird standard over there for a heavy trigger pull?
>>30524103
Get the HK45c.
>>30524293
>high bore axis
I found it does make a difference FOR ME. That being said most da/sa capable guns have higher bore axises than sa or striker fired gun, that being said the usp has one of the lower bore axises than the rest - only being bested by the cz75 (from what I can tell)
>>30524362
In a nutshell, yes. Most duty-esque pistols of Euro design are more 'cops that aren't really gun people' oriented vs 'you can actually hit what you're shooting at' oriented.
Which is why the USP tactical also got the match trigger. Etc.
>>30524238
>>30524225
>For what practical application would those 4 ounces matter? Neither is a pocket pistol. On a sturdy belt, it's irrelevant.
Every ounce counts. Always.
>You probably don't even know what half those buzzwords mean. Flat shooting does not mean less muzzle flip. It means that it shoots closer to point of aim at distances around 100 yards and farther. Which is totally irrelevant with handguns, since they aren't intended for those distances.
You're trying to explain my own explanation back to me using your own words. Flat shooting means exactly what it means. Less drop at range. This can be useful in a pistol. Not often, but it can be. Lower recoil often also means reduced muzzle flip, of which the FsN has very very little of.
>What are adapters.
Just means more weight, another component in the chain to break, and your light/laser hangs lower.
>More rounds, less power per round.
Very similar energy per round.
>FMJ 5.7x28 ammo, which is all civilians can buy, shot out of a pistol, can NOT penetrate IIIa body armor. Try again.
Incorrect. SS197 is a 40gr V-Max, not an FMJ. In addition, self defense 5.7 is easily available, and does penetrate IIIa armor. See these videos : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RrSypp272UU
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxBFtilO_C4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gThH2tpBGqs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-C8exaj3Ys
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xbMlxdp1cSw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TVAw7r9Fo_g
Additional info : http://www.fivesevenforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=13233
>I can make that argument in one word: penetration.
5.7 penetrates just fine. Thankfully for self defense shooters, vital organs are not hidden behind 12 inches of gel. Most 5.7x28 penetrates well over 12 inches, with the exception being the 28gr JHP bullet. This one tumbles at about 5-6 inches in gel, creating a huge wound cavity. Think like how 5.56 doesn't penetrate as much as 7.62x39, but yet is still more deadly.
>>30524368
>agreed it's basically the same exact gun as the ups compact but with a more ergonomic grip. The hk45 fullsize is shit though imo
>2 rounds less capacity than the usp45
> buffer instead of god tier dual recoil spring
> longer grip than the usp45
> not as aesthetically pleasing
>>30523804
That is a nice collection.
I respect you and your manly wrists.
>>30524238
>>30524388
Seeing the guy on the right exaggerating his struggle on his draw completely ruins the entire scene for me sadly.
>>30524383
If you shoot your guns a lot you know this. Your body gets used to the orientation of the gun and will adjust accordingly to the recoil. People get used to a Glock or M&P and when they shoot a SIG or HK like shit they blame the gun instead of their own unfamiliarity.
I have this problem with Glocks now that I shoot HKs. I know its not that glocks suck, just that I suck with shooting glocks.
>>30524225
>Not sure why you are hunting with a pistol, but you know what else is considered a "varmint" caliber? .22 magnum.
.223 is also a varmint caliber. It all depends on what projectile you load into the cartridge.
>>30524293
>Isn't actually a problem, go shoot some guns before you speak on this matter.
It makes a big difference for me. The difference in shooting a Glock 19, xD, and Steyr M9-A1 is very noticable. The M9 has noticeably less muzzle flip, enabling me to fire faster follow up shots.
>Its a pistol, if you need more ammo change mags, or bring a rifle.
Every round counts, and you can't always carry a rifle or even extra mags.
>Also the first 3 shots matter than the extra 2 you would get with a glock.
All the more reason to have a pistol with reduced recoil for a faster, more accurate first three shots.
>>30524336
My Five-seveN has a fantastic trigger. Similar to a nice 1911. A light, smooth take up with a short, consistent break. Way better than most service pistols.
>>30524421
I like the USP45 more than the HK45 and actually made the decision for the USP45 over the HK45 when I was looking at them.
That being said I don't agree with all of this.
>Ergonomic are important I like the USP better than the HK45 due to the switch style and the LOP for my trigger finger. If you think the USP45 is too big for you then go HK45.
>I own a fullsize USP40 and I shot a P2000SK and I thought the buffer shim was softer shooting than the spring buffer. The Spring buffer slows the reciprocation down a little bit though making the fullsizes feel more controllable.
>Grip length shouldn't matter on a fullsize, and aestthitics are all in the eye of the beholder. I hate the spiderman grips in appearance but the slide is cooler looking.
>>30524388
>>30523151
After watching "Collateral" in 2004, I bought this gun not even a week afterwards.
>>30523346
I want a P8 so fucking bad. They look so clean and so professional.
>>30523151
The SIG P210 is the best handgun ever designed. This is UN-fucking-debatable if you actually know anything about pistols and their design pros and cons.
USP a shit:
>Bad ergos
>Fragile triggers
>atypical HK QA issues
>dealing with HK's other shit in general
>>30524562
>he can't list a single reason why the USP sucks
>le trigger issues
>on a gun with a notably shitty trigger
spot the nogunz memester
>>30524474
>The difference in shooting a Glock 19, xD, and Steyr M9-A1 is very noticable.
Its all in your head. I ownd a glock22 and a USP45 and USP 40 all at the same time, and the Glock was always slower to get back on target.
Just because you are used to other guns doesn't mean those guns are better.
>Every round counts, and you can't always carry a rifle or even extra mags.
If you can conceal a double stack you can carry an extra mag. If you are in a place where you need more than 15 rounds than you should have kept a shotgun in your car or carry the extra ammo.
The best thing about this argument is that people like you will trash the P30 and the VP9 for having shit capacity and in the same breath talk about the G19 being the best carry gun because it has the perfect capacity, 15 rounds. Its like arguing with women sometimes
>All the more reason to have a pistol with reduced recoil for a faster, more accurate first three shots.
Which is why I use HK because they have recoil buffers and recoil less than Glocks and M&Ps. If you have a problem reacquiring sights on follow ups that is on you not the gun.
>>30524548
Thats not a real gun in that pic, and the P8s are just USP9mm with stupid safeties.
>>30524532
>>30524388
>>30524238
My niggers!
>>30524562
>>Fragile triggers
Wut? The USPs have such strong trigger that nogunz and poor fags bitch about how tough it is to shoot.
>>30524596
Ah, still want a P8 for the novelty.
>>30523151
>Buy a USP
>Go to /k/ and swing your dick
>Meanwhile everyone else has a Glock or an M&P that does the same thing with better aftermarket for cheaper.
Yep. You win pal. Good on you.
>>30524625
Just get a USP9 then.
>>30524586
>Its all in your head.
>the Glock was always slower to get back on target.
So... Was it slower to get back on target, or was it in your head?
>Which is why I use HK because they have recoil buffers and recoil less than Glocks and M&Ps.
>If you have a problem reacquiring sights on follow ups that is on you not the gun.
So.... Do you use the HK because it actually recoils less, or is the difference between them on you, and not the gun?
You seem to be making one statement that there are real differences, followed directly by one that contradicts this by saying that it is either user error or in your head.
>>30524688
>So... Was it slower to get back on target, or was it in your head?
Well I owned both and I always took longer with the Glock. You probably never shot a USP or HK gun at all if you think they have more recoil than glocks.
>So.... Do you use the HK because it actually recoils less, or is the difference between them on you, and not the gun?
Like I said, I owned both, and I owned glocks first and put more ammo through them. Yet I still shot the Hks better. The trigger is better, the grip was better, and the recoil was better.
So I sold my glocks and never looked back. Yeah I have less capacity, but my first and second shots are much better which is more important.
>You seem to be making one statement that there are real differences, followed directly by one that contradicts this by saying that it is either user error or in your head.
In your case its user error. You are not used to something so you suck with it. If I shot a glock now I would not be as good as I used to be. I wouldn't blame that on the gun though I do hate their triggers and grip profile.
>>30524759
You're still not making sense.
You are assuming that the differences in my experiences shooting Glocks, xDs, Steyrs, and Five-seveNs is due to user error, and not that the guns are designed differently.
So tell me, does the Five-seveN have less recoil than an xD because of my own user error, or because of the guns designs?
Does a Steyr M9 have less perceived recoil than a Glock or xD because of my own user error, or because of the Steyr's low bore axis?
The usp 45 is the best handgun ever made. hands down. Let me justify my previous statement. The pistol is incredibly reliable and is used by numerous special operations outfits ranging from the GIGN to our DEVGRU department. It has hostile environment finish, uses a .45 caliber which is optimal for running a suppressor considering the rounds low velocity to begin with. It holds 12 rounds of .45 and just frankly looks sick.
>>30523151
HK, we put our bullets in the magazine backwards, because we know you'll buy it anyway. Because you suck, and we hate you.
>>30524805
>So tell me, does the Five-seveN have less recoil than an xD because of my own user error, or because of the guns designs?
Thats a false equivalency since they shoot different cartridges.
>Does a Steyr M9 have less perceived recoil than a Glock or xD because of my own user error, or because of the Steyr's low bore axis?
Depends on what you shoot more. If you shoot the Steyr the most then thats what you are used to. It has nothing to do with design, especially since it is the same as those other guns anyway.
Bore axis has nothing to do with control ability since all gun divert their recoil energy into the same place.
>>30524868
>Bore axis has nothing to do with control ability since all gun divert their recoil energy into the same place.
I've got you now...
Bore axis does affect felt recoil and muzzle flip. Think of the slide as a wrench. The higher the slide is above the center of your grip, the more leverage it has. With a very long wrench, you can tighten or loosen a bolt very easily. With a short wrench, it takes much more energy to apply the same force to the bolt. A high bore axis is a long wrench. A low bore axis is a short wrench. Your hand is the bolt, and the slide is the wrench.
>>30523330
its unreliable ladies and gents
>>30524909
Good analogy. Will use that for myself. And I couldn't agree more, but I like the USP. Not my FAVORITE, but it is one of my preferred handguns, as I can still hit anything anywhere with it.
>>30524909
>The higher the slide is above the center of your grip, the more leverage it has.
That would only be true if the energy was dissipated through the top of the tang, its not, it all goes into the same place, the take down pin. Also leverage effects torque which isn't how a slide works. It is not torquing on the pistol, it is slamming back into the takedown pin.
>>30525179
Its not a good analogy because it ignores how the force of recoil is actually imparted into the gun.
>>30524598
I wonder how many guns Michael Mann has helped sell in his career.
>Miami Vice
>Thief
>Heat
>Collateral
>Miami Vice 2006
>>30525223
If I were the owner of HK I'd be cutting him a fat check for sure.
>>30525179
Using what you are proficient with is more important than using what is 'the best design' anyway.
>>30525199
Regardless of semantics, the energy is going into your hand. The closer to the center of your hand the energy goes, the less the muzzle is going to rise. If you designed a pistol that was held in the middle of your hand, and the barrel poked out between your fingers, the bore axis would be 'perfect' and there would be no muzzle flip.
>>30524438
you're right.
Why are people jerking over this shit.
>>30525239
>Regardless of semantics, the energy is going into your hand.
Yes, through the same place on every pistol.
>The closer to the center of your hand the energy goes, the less the muzzle is going to rise.
Its the same one everygun since the take down pins are all in the same place.
> If you designed a pistol that was held in the middle of your hand, and the barrel poked out between your fingers, the bore axis would be 'perfect' and there would be no muzzle flip.
No, because thats not how the energy gets dissipated.
>>30525269
Well its not like Cruise couldn't move faster. Mann had him slow down so he could actually film what was going on and you can see it.
>>30525235
I wonder if they did for his movies, realize the HK wasn't named/showed off much but still. I mean other companies do it for their product placements, maybe not Mann himself but the production.
>>30525273
learn physics you fucking americlap
>>30524069
>>30525290
I do know physics, the energy is dissipated into the take down pin which is in the same place on every pistol. Until you put that in a different position you aren't changing how guns work.
Get hazguns Europoor.
>>30525273
>Yes, through the same place on every pistol.
The position of the take down pin relative to your hand changes depending on bore axis.
>No, because thats not how the energy gets dissipated.
>face
>>30525336
>The position of the take down pin relative to your hand changes depending on bore axis.
Except it doesn't. The takedown pin is above your trigger finger on every gun.
>>30525336
>>30525273
Ok let me try to explain this for you.
Lets build a single shot break action pistol. One is traditionally designed with the barrel above the hand grip. The second is designed with the barrel directly in front of the middle of the grip, and looks like a T when laid flat. On the second gun, you grip it with the barrel poking out between your middle and ring finger.
Which one will have more muzzle flip when fired? The one with the bore well above the center of the hand, or the one with the bore directly in the middle of the hand?
If you picked the one with the bore in the center of the hand, you are correct. The energy would be dissipated straight back into your hand, and depending on your grip, there would be either no muzzle rise, or only a slight muzzle depression or rise.
On a Steyr M series, the tang is very high up relative to the bore, which means it is also high relative to the take down pin that you are so fixated on. On a Sig P226 for example, the bore and take down pin are high relative to the grip.
The higher above your grip the point of energy dissipation is, the more muzzle flip.
This is not hard to grasp. I've tried to explain it as simply as possible.
>>30525368
Not exactly. Their height varies by design.
>>30525424
Except it doesn't, they are in the same place on glocks, USPs and Sigs.
>>30525404
>Lets build a single shot break action pistol.
Thats not equivalent though because then the recoil would be imparted onto the bolt face. Where as on a self-loading pistol, that bolt face moves back and the energy is imparted into the takedown pin.
>>30525445
>>30525434
The position of your hand relative to the take down pin varies, depending on the bore axis and how high you can get your hand into the tang.
Here you go : http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2012/03/chris-dumm/the-truth-about-muzzle-flip-and-bore-height/
I shot a suppressed usp45 with an aftermarket grip, that thing felt fucking nice.
Too bad they cost their weight in gold or I'd buy one in a heartbeat.
>>30525459
>The position of your hand relative to the take down pin varies,
No it doesn't. Do you know where the takedown pin even is?
>>30523843
Stainless steel isn't as durable as carbon steel. Modern nitrided finishes don't wear off easily either.
>>30525469
900 is what I got mine for, and it was worth it. made me switch to HK guns.
>>30524190
Counterstrike from the old days turned me on to it, always loved that pistol in the game.
>>30525473
Your inability to comprehend grip position relative to pin position baffles me.
Did you know that different guns have different designs?
>>30524438
You underestimate the element of surprise
>>30523796
>>30523800
>Laser engraved "HK"
shit looks terabad.
>>30523826
you gunna have to sauce that..... Glock has a steep feed, and it performs just fine. HK just couldnt figure out how to put the ejector as the round stop without it breaking out the frame. (my guess)
>>30523843
HK's maritime finish is like no other, shit looks almost better than colt royal blue. Their HE, however, is dogeshit, its just black paint over park, just like slavshit AK's. Stainless looks dead sexy, and you can see the gleam of that real-fuckin-tennifer which gives it that silky-satin-gloss finish.
>>30524048
>.40S&W is shit and 9mm is better.
lol no. and FUCK no when it comes to HK's.
>HK USP45 12rds USPC45 8rds
>HK USP40 13rds USPC40 12rds
>HK USP9 15rds USPC9 13rds
Why gimp yourself on your total power output for some faggy "b-but da military uses it" round that cant even pass thru both sides of a computer case?
>>30523441
The little allahu ackbar at the end made the video
>>30525504
>grip position relative to pin position baffles me.
I can grasp the concept, its just irrelevant since its the same on all guns.
>Did you know that different guns have different designs?
Yes and the takedown pin is in the same place on all of them.
>>30525565
>Why gimp yourself on your total power output for some faggy "b-but da military uses it" round that cant even pass thru both sides of a computer case?
Dur because people are made out of Gel blocks you idiot, thats all I will ever need to penetrate.
>>30524256
>Get the light LEM
Its shit. Literally slack for 3/4 of the pull, and a poor break that is nothing like a SA. Hammer wobbles around left to right and if you want to double strike, good fuckin luck hittin shit cause you aint used to the pull. Reset is also further out than a DA/SA
>>30524264
>The Match trigger is money well spent
The match trigger is nothing different besides they polish the contact points. You are better off getting the regular DA/SA and polishing it yourself with simichrome. I bet you think ALG for the AK is the best thing ever too, dont you?
>"hurr I cant shoot worth shit.... I know, instead of more ammo and practice, Imma spend that money on a "Match" grade target trigger so I still cant shoot worth a shit, but at least I can say the trigger pull feels better!"
>>30523728
I'm not really qualified enough to make any serious claims about either platform, but I have a USP, a CZ, and a G19, and by fat I shoot the CZ and G19 the most often. The CZ is the most fun at the range, and the G19 is my CCW so I practice a lot.
I'm not saying its because of any particular fault of the gun, I just really don't enjoy shooting it as much.
CZboo all day
>>30525622
>Its shit. Literally slack for 3/4 of the pull,
Why is that bad? In fact just about every striker gun behaves like this.
> and a poor break that is nothing like a SA
Except it is a fine break.
>Hammer wobbles around left to right and if you want to double strike, good fuckin luck hittin shit cause you aint used to the pull.
its a good thing that pretty much never happens.
>Reset is also further out than a DA/SA
This doesn't matter in combat.
>>30523881
Someone not intimately familiar with HK products wouldn't know any of that. I'm way beyond being a 'casual observer', but I'm just not big on HK's bullshit, so I wouldn't bother to learn these things.
Given that it says .45ACP on the barrel, a 'casual observer' could certainly assume it to be an actual firearm. You're right about the magazine's feed lips though, that would be a dead giveaway to anyone [who happens to look closely at the top of the mag].
>>30524368
>Get the HK45c.
HK45 was made just to compete with Gen4 glocks. It is shit. The reset is longer, the trigger feels worse, no dual-recoil spring, and no proven track record.
>>30524532
but he uses a USP40......
>>30524562
>SIG still puts everything besides the slide release in the slide release spot.
>>30524759
what is your trigger setup and V#?
>>30524909
Show us your Arsenal StrikeOne next, and compare it vs M9A1 and 92FS
>>30525239
>the energy is going into your hand. The closer to the center of your hand the energy goes, the less the muzzle is going to rise.
this is partially correct, but not completely correct. You can design a gun that has just the right pivot and fulcrums with the correct springs that will have a gun snap itself shut with almost the same sight picture, besides newtons inescapable inverse reciprocating force.
See the Walther P99 9mm. I'll post the video here soon.
>>30523432
It does in California
>>30525723
>but he uses a USP40
He used a .45, Mann has said so.
>>30525723
>HK45 was made just to compete with Gen4 glocks.
Ok, thats why it came out before them right? Way to make your opinion know to be absolute shit with your first sentence fuck face.
>but he uses a USP40......
No he doesn't.
>what is your trigger setup and V#?
LEM
>>30524383
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjL6GijpDW8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwTUhqbxuJw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3zfIIEdZ8Q
check out these ultrahigh bore axis videos. If you get the springs right with a light slide and big breechlock, you can actually get it to work in your favor. This doesn't apply to sigs, because they add weight to the slide over making the breechlock contact surface bigger.
>>30523840
minor nit-pick: i have dovetailed and weaver railed scoped pistols from the 70's and earlier.
accessory rails didn't exist prior to the USP/Mk 23 though. scope rails have for a long time.
>>30523151
It's a fucking piece of shit, weighs 5 pounds, shoots anemic .45 ACP rounds (at least the real USPS does), etc, etc.
And yes, I have shot one numerous times, friend owns one. Still, it's a fucking piece of shit.
>>30525886
Wow, you must suck with it and get picked on by your friends for sucking at shooting.
>>30525605
The first 4" of gel penetration is comparable to the amount of force it takes to break skin. Didnt you ever wonder why they used the BB @~450fps to calibrate? Guess what, go shoot yourself with a BB and tell me if it penetrates 3.5-3.8" of flesh. Bone, depending on compactness and density, is comparable to 4-8" of gel penetration. Why do you think military testing uses 20% gel and requires 12" MINIMUM for it to pass their lethality test?
Its called LOLonly9mm for a reason, and it aint just cause some anons thought it'd be a funny meme.
>>30525664
>>Its shit. Literally slack for 3/4 of the pull,
>Why is that bad? In fact just about every striker gun behaves like this.
No, strikers do not have 3/4 pull of absolute slack. your comparison is shit. A more worthy comparison is to the Walther AS trigger system, except it doesn't lock at the SA point like Anti-Stress does.
>> and a poor break that is nothing like a SA
>Except it is a fine break.
And Glock factory triggers are fine too. Except you didn't pay an extra $130 for it, and it turns out to be even worse than a Glock trigger.
>>Hammer wobbles around left to right and if you want to double strike, good fuckin luck hittin shit cause you aint used to the pull.
>its a good thing that pretty much never happens.
Which part are you referring to? The hammer wobbling? yes, it does it every fuckin time you pull the trigger, it is no longer rock solid with no lateral movement like with the standard DA/SA trigger. And if referring to the latter: Then get a striker-fired pistol instead, since you are basically promoting the whole tap-rack-bang mentality. Thats like buying a Benz with cruisecontrol just so you can drive with the gas pedal all the time.
>>Reset is also further out than a DA/SA
>This doesn't matter in combat.
So getting doubletaps off faster doesn't matter? Double standard much?
So you literally have no rebuttals besides you like LEM and can't admit to yourself you made a bad purchase?
>>30525748
He may have, but they used a USP40 in the movie. Go watch each gunscene closely. I specifically remember seeing an instance where you either see it has characteristics specific to the 40, or he reloads from empty and pops off 13 shots.
>>30525945
The first 4" of gel penetration is comparable to the amount of force it takes to break skin. Didnt you ever wonder why they used the BB @~450fps to calibrate? Guess what, go shoot yourself with a BB and tell me if it penetrates 3.5-3.8" of flesh. Bone, depending on compactness and density, is comparable to 4-8" of gel penetration. Why do you think military testing uses 20% gel and requires 12" MINIMUM for it to pass their lethality test?
Its called LOLonly9mm for a reason, and it aint just cause some anons thought it'd be a funny meme.
You took me seriously when you shouldn't have. Way to get trolled you dumb fuck.
>>30525984
It was confirmed that he used a USP 45. Here is a picture of the weapon used. The only USPs rented for the movie were .45s.
>>30525945
>No, strikers do not have 3/4 pull of absolute slack.
Well the LEM doesn't have that either. Either way .5lbs of slack isn't shit and should throw you off.
>And Glock factory triggers are fine too. Except you didn't pay an extra $130 for it, and it turns out to be even worse than a Glock trigger.
Except its not worse than a glock trigger. I have owned both, and shot the LEM HKs better than my old glocks.
>Which part are you referring to? The hammer wobbling?
Thats not the hammer wobbling, thats your bitch hands shaking because you can't pull a 20lb trigger that isn't meant to be pulled often anyway.
>Then get a striker-fired pistol instead, since you are basically promoting the whole tap-rack-bang mentality.
The trigger mechanics and break are way better on LEM than a striker though.
>So getting doubletaps off faster doesn't matter? Double standard much?
Reset doesn't make that much of a difference in this. The only people who think this are the same people who take 1-2 seconds to reacquire their sights anyway.
So in all actuality you aren't going to make that reset matter because you don't shoot well enough.
>So you literally have no rebuttals besides you like LEM and can't admit to yourself you made a bad purchase?
I sold my Glocks because I liked my LEM HKs so much better. It sounds like you are just bitter about your own purchase, and you inability to shoot guns.
>>30526019
>you dumb fuck.
>"Sarcasm is completely detectable from text!"
there is only one dumbfuck here, and that is you with your shitposts. Fuck off, grown men are trying to have a discussion here.
>>30525984
It was a .45 and it always a .45
>>30525984
>>30526020
Additionally the script describes the weapon as "A HK in .45"
>>30526115
>"Sarcasm is completely detectable from text!"
Lets look at what was said, and you tell me if it should be taken seriously.
>>30525605
>Dur because people are made out of Gel blocks you idiot, thats all I will ever need to penetrate.
I was actually agreeing with you, you just suck at reading you fucking autist.
>>30526115
>there is only one dumbfuck here, and that is you with your shitposts. Fuck off, grown men are trying to have a discussion here.
Yeah, says the guy who sucks at shooting his friends guns so he blames the gun instead of himself.
I thought Marisa killed herself back in 2012.
>>30526020
>That slide release
holy fuck, where do I get one?
>>30526111
>Well the LEM doesn't have that either. Either way .5lbs of slack isn't shit and should throw you off.
Have you even handled one? This is completely false.
>Except its not worse than a glock trigger. I have owned both, and shot the LEM HKs better than my old glocks.
The first 3/4 of the pull is just slack with the only force coming specifically from the trigger reset spring and that hair wire that rides the faux-hammer.
>Thats not the hammer wobbling,
Go pull the slack out of your LEM USP, and then grip the hammer with your other hand and shake it left to right. It moves, and it shouldn't.
>The trigger mechanics and break are way better on LEM than a striker though.
You just compared it to a striker and was all for that, now you floppin like a fish.
The rest of your post is too retarded to warrant a response.
If you like the LEM, then say it. Dont try to discredit me with your delusional pro-LEM ideas, while everything I said was factual.
>>30523303
>low capacity
>12 rounds of .45
>glocks and xds have 13
>literally 1 less round
>m&ps have 10
Eeyyyyyy
>>30526148
>Lets look at what was said, and you tell me if it should be taken seriously.
you responded to my derogatory response to LOLonly9mm. Go read it yourself retard, and try to think out how another anon cannot comprehend how exactly your remark was supposed to be sarcastic.
>>30526158
thats not me cunt, I'm the one telling you how the LEM is shit, and the Match trigger is a very expensive joke.
>>30526211
>I'm the one telling you how the LEM is shit
Why?
>>30526231
>Why?
Lrn2read
>>30526290
So you can't explain why?
>>30526380
Well, I already explained it
>>30526185
>Have you even handled one? This is completely false.
I was exaggerating, but yes I own 2. The take up is 3.5-5.5 lbs depending on springs.
>The first 3/4 of the pull is just slack with the only force coming specifically from the trigger reset spring and that hair wire that rides the faux-hammer.
Its not a Faux hammer, its functional actually. Even still why does it matter if you have that take up when it is light as hell, and the reset isn't that long.
>Go pull the slack out of your LEM USP, and then grip the hammer with your other hand and shake it left to right. It moves, and it shouldn't.
Mine doesn't do this, so were you shooting airshit? Also why would i do that when shooting the thing anyway?
>You just compared it to a striker and was all for that, now you floppin like a fish.
Yes, in practical operation it works like a Striker gun with double strike functionality. The break and pull however is still a hammer pull. You get the best of both worlds with the LEM.
>If you like the LEM, then say it. Dont try to discredit me with your delusional pro-LEM ideas, while everything I said was factual.
Nothing you said was factual, and is the typical LEM hate from people who don't know shit about it. My problem is your ignorance and insistence on thinking that you are right when you are not.
>>30526428
Well, I didn't read it.
>>30526469
Like I said, Lrn2read
>>30526211
>.40S&W is shit and 9mm is better.
lol no. and FUCK no when it comes to HK's.
>HK USP45 12rds USPC45 8rds
>HK USP40 13rds USPC40 12rds
>HK USP9 15rds USPC9 13rds
Why gimp yourself on your total power output for some faggy "b-but da military uses it" round that cant even pass thru both sides of a computer case?
That is what I responded to. I agree with you on this, 9mm isn't automatically better. You sperged at soemthing you thought was meant to offend because you are fucking retarded.
What about my response here.
>Dur because people are made out of Gel blocks you idiot, thats all I will ever need to penetrate.
Is something that should be taken as being serious. Stop trying to defend your stupidity.
>thats not me cunt, I'm the one telling you how the LEM is shit, and the Match trigger is a very expensive joke.
Yeah, because you suck at shooting and can't handle your friends guns.
>>30526231
>>30526290
>>30526380
>>30526428
Because he sucks at shooting and got schooled by his friends who can shoot their guns better than him. Instead of realizing that the LEM is just something he isn't used to he blames the equipment for his lack of familiarity.
>>30526506
>implying there's noticeable difference in performance between 9mm, .40S&W, .357 SIG, and .45 ACP
lol
>>30526596
There is though. Unless you think people are made of gel blocks, and even in that case, 9mm performs the worse.
>>30523400
Agreed I fucking at UPS.
>>30525723
>but he uses a USP40......
lol no, a trained killer wouldn't use some meme caliber over .45
>>30524657
It's not our fault you're poor.
>>30525886
Lol wut. USP 45 and the mk 23 take 45 super.
Unless you are really wealthy, you won't be able to afford to feed them enough to see a difference in accelerated wear.
>>30523852
Apparently they were supposed to be 10mm according to "the HK years"
>>30523804
Ya, some people have to have bad taste. Otherwise fat girls would go unfucked, smart cars would never be driven, and guns in .40 would rust on shelves everywhere.
>>30523151
>bad ergos
>bad trigger
>stupid proprietary rail
eat a koch
>>30527630
>Bitch hands
>Bitch hands
>Doesn't matter these days
Suck that Koch you dirty poorfag.
>>30527770
>bitch hands
similarly, you want to deliberately put a 10 pound trigger on a match rifle just to prove you're "strong"
>HK
>not even a custom shop
>poorfag
lol ok
>>30523151
>>30527802
>similarly, you want to deliberately put a 10 pound trigger on a match rifle just to prove you're "strong"
I have never done that, and have no idea what that has to do with this.
>>30527590
I'll admit that before I shot one, I thought the .50 DE was the stupidest thing ever made.
But honestly it's a shitload of fun as a range toy. Better still, people will buy you ammo just for the chance to shoot it.
Same thing with the .500 S&W.
In my state, your CHL allows you to carry whatever 'caliber' is on your CHL and below. Regardless of how a .44 Mag is more powerful than a .45ACP, it's strictly by bore diameter.
So a few people have asked me to go to the range when the do range qual for their CHL so they can borrow my .50AE and .500 S&W so they can have '.50' for their semiauto and revolver qualification.
Beyond that, the .500 S&W is useful for Alaska trips, but otherwise they're just range toys to blow up watermelons, etc.
The 10mm Delta Elite I've carried a few times in a suit and/or as a BBQ gun.
Normally I carry the worn-out G19 seen in this picture>>30524160
But yeah, fuck .40 S&W
>>30527835
It means that a demonstrable flaw, even if it can be overcome, is still a flaw.
>>30523441
OMFG yes.
>>30527972
Except it isn't really a flaw, since it isn't really a problem. The only people who bitch about HK triggers are the same people who shoot 10 inch groups with their glock.
>>30523151
Serious qeustion:
Is an USP superior to a Glock? Realistically speaking, no fan boy BS.
>>30528163
Please, there are enough trolls here.
>>30523441
I'm setting this as my phones ring tone.
>>30528175
I am not a troll. I own a Glock 17, I chose it because I heard it was the most reliable gun and spare parts/mags are not pricy. And I also like the angle of the gun compared to most of other pistols.
You are the troll by not answering.
>>30528163
I sold my glocks so I could switch to HK after I shot my USP45.
>>30528134
>since it isn't really a problem
>if i refuse to compare the USP with better SA/DA triggers, then it's the best trigger available!
>>30528207
I get that HK are some kind of prime class, but are they worth it? I only shoot 2 times a year with pistols, so would it be worth it?
>>30523415
what flashlight is that on the compact?
>>30528203
Okay, I'll bite, you win.
Comparing the G17 to USP:
SDA vs striker
Safety vs no safety
Glock vs HK (two totally different engineering principles)
You are comparing two weapons designed for different applications, and weapons that oblige the tastes of totally different people. The Glock was designed in fact to be as simple as a revolver (no different trigger pulls, no safety) to make it more marketable to the US market when the Euros were trying to sell semi autos to the revolver armed police of Murica.
>>30528266
I am German myself, therefore an Euro, I am just asking fot the expertise here, I am pretty happy with my Glock but it kinf of bores me that it has no flaws, so much that I am already thinking about trading it for a full metal gun like a 1911 or Browning Hi-Power.
Maybe these are stupid thoughts.
>>30528214
Its fine for a DA/SA,It isn't heavier than other DA/SA guns anyway. I have owned SIGs before and it wasn't all that different. Either way the SIG costs just as much and is heavier so your complaints are moot.
>>30528239
Lol, why even bother owning and carrying guns then? It shoots better than a Glock and feels better in my hand so its worth it to me since I actually shoot my guns.
>>30528313
Never trade or sell you'll only regret it and loose money. Just save and buy more. People find that they rebuy old guns they sold or traded or have buyers remorse on guns they got rid of.
>>30528376
>I say your complaints are moot, therefore it is
Straight up comparison between my P30 (which already has a better trigger than the USP) and my sig 226, the DA is far worse, the single action weight is comparable but the HK is mushier.
>>30528437
You fortgot that I live in Germany which is a gun control hellhole, I can only own 4 handguns currently, so..
>>30528448
>Straight up comparison between my P30 (which already has a better trigger than the USP) and my sig 226, the DA is far worse, the single action weight is comparable but the HK is mushier.
Mushy has nothing to do with weight though. Also you spent the same amount, and your P30 is lighter in total weight and easier to carry. Get LEM or an S model if it bothers you so much.
>>30528469
Well get a sig a glock a HK and one other that covers the nice shit. Perhaps a beretta.
>>30528504
>Mushy has nothing to do with weight though
but it is still part of a trigger assessment
and i actually sent the p30 to grayguns and had it worked on, so it is better now. that commentary was for the pre-work trigger.
>>30528561
>but it is still part of a trigger assessment
Yeah, but you didn't say that earlier, you bitched about weight. Either way, the only DA/SA trigger that is better is on a gun that is just as expensive and weighs more.
>
>>30528507
Problem is I already own 4 Guns
A Colt Trooper MK III, 6", nickel finish built in 1975
Glock 17, gen 4 built in 2013
Walther PPK built in the 80*s
Ruger Single Six New Model
so what should I do man, I guess I am stuck.
>>30528616
adding more complaints, the p30 trigger had overtravel. bruce gray fixed that too.
also my beretta 92fs had a better trigger. as did the fnx-9 i tried at the store. they are both cheaper than the HK too.
>>30528624
Thats actually a nice collection. Good tastes impo. I am buying all 9mm so I can stockpile easier. Makes being/getting proficient easier too.
92FS
P229 elite
P230 (this is my one .380, its my cc)
Want:USP, CZ75, G19
>>30528667
When the Girlfriend turns 21 if she starts carrying my p230 I'll get a p225 or some similar Sig single stack 9mm
>>30528666
>also my beretta 92fs had a better trigger. as did the fnx-9 i tried at the store. they are both cheaper than the HK too.
Yeah, I never really had a problem with it, and just think people like you suck at shooting guns.
>>30528667
Sig is awesome, if the Sig Legion was sold in Germany I would trade in my Glock for it.
That gun is just a wet dream.
I thought my setup like that:
Glock is the work horse
Single six shares ammo with my 10/22
Trooper allows use of 357 mag/38 special and their shotshell variants
The Walther is easily concealable
Fortunately I am not limited on longguns so I allowed myself to own sixteen of em
>>30528743
Yeah hold onto that walther ppk thats nice. Yeah its all just an excuse to horde. I am focussing on mags now. And stocking some ammo for when the democrats come to install the telescreens.
92fs, 8 mags, serpa holster with belt and drop leg clips
p229, 2 mags, light/laser with matching serpa holster
p230, just one mag, leather iwb holster.
>>30528743
Kek I havn't started on longguns. I thought about sticking to one long gun and getting a bolt action in .338 lapua. Just focus on being a long range shooter. Pistols for everything else. Having an AR puts you in range of typical police force engagement range so you're fucked unless its indoors (which pistols work) or you're hidden and far away (.338)
>>30528715
lol ok. now i know why competition shooters tune their triggers. because they actually suck at shooting guns.
>>30528801
I love the looks of the P229 elite, it looks truly oearns its name.
The only mags I really stockpile, concerning handguns, are Glock mags since PPK mags are not really on the cheap side and I am a student so..
Another classy gun is this
> pic related
It would fit well into the hands of a James Bond villain.
Well I think AR's or generally speaking any semi auto that uses commonly found ammo is indispensable if the horrible times of a SHTF scenario should ever occur, so I would start with that, unless you live in a depopulated area with a lot of free area that does not provide cover to any possible attackers.
Then I would go with your .338 idea, but these are just my 2 cents.
My AR is German made, check this out:
http://www.hera-arms.com/
>>30528905
*it looks truly like it earns
>>30528905
idk anon a lot of prepers are starting to stock SAPI plates and carriers rated to 762. And if you are in a firefight and mag dumping you're doing something wrong. One .338 and everyone's gunna wanna freak the fuck out. Shit kills large game past 1,000 meters, it was tested by militaries and punched through multiple sapi plates past 1000 meters. The other thing is in a firefight no one wins, there are no more ERs, even if you can stabilize yourself you'll internally bleed out. Hide and snipe.
>>30528905
Large bore rifles are a game changer anon. Hell people stabilize and fight after receiving .223 in war all the time. Theyll die but theyll keep shooting. .338 clips you and the shock will put you down.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPw7e0Lrd8A
>>30528957
I get your point but I think it depends on where you live, If I lived in a city or suburb I would definately prefer a semi auto medium caliber rifle to a 338 bolt action or even semi auto because its long range nad high powered caliber does not pay off in an enviroment where your furthest range of engagement is 150 meters/yards due to house blocks or woods, you know?
Also 338 Ammo is not commonly found on soldiers/police.
But I get it if I lived on a ranch where I have a clear field of fire for kilometers or at least 400 meters I would pick the 338 as well.
>>30529052
Thats true. I'm in a rural area. Yeah 338 is NOT common accept to big game hunters.
