Why are most modern firearms opting for a bullpup design?
>>29343967
They're not
>>29343967
>full-length barrel in a carbine-sized gun
>carbine-length barrel in an SBR-sized gun
>SBR-sized barrel in a machine pistol sized gun
all in all, it's pretty damn neat thing.
That being said, the design's not really that common, even today.
>>29343967
modern?
The 70s isnt really modern
>modern
>using a design that doesn't allow for DI
you can't make this shit up
>>29343967
That's a very phallic barrel.
>>29344333
>Modern design
>DI
you can' make this shit up
>>29344399
>using a gas piston
>adding friction and lowering reliability
you can't forge this tale
>>29343967
Becuase they're compact you nincompoop
>>29344447
don't ever say that to me or my son again.
>>29343967
Because you can add 50% to the price for no reason other than "bullpups are cool" and people still go for it.
>>29344442
>DI
>more reliable track record than piston
Oh, I didnt think April Fools came this early this year.
>2016
>Not using an internal piston design ala the AR15 or DI as on the MAS 49
because in the modern world, outside of the U.S. the fact that a bullpup design doesn't translate over from common civilian firearms into military arms is irrelevant.
Many manufacturers put their primary focus on the military market, as selling to civilians in their countries is very difficult or only happens in a limited scope.
Bullpups are becoming more practical after every iteration as people are figuring out ways to keep all the pros of a standard setup with the shorter profile of a bullpup. Its like the 19th century and non-muzzle loading guns
>>29345146
Other than a stiffer trigger, what are the primary design problems holding back bullpup designs?
>>29344248
/thread
>>29345198
Being terrible at being shot with NODs. It's a lot more complicated than hurr durr just add rails. They're not ergonomic in any way while using a monocular due to how they fit in your should and require a short lop for the offhand.
This is even more noticeable when you can't run IR lasers 24/7 due to their proliferation.
>>29345248
Fuck, shoulder and proliferation of NVGs obviously.
>>29345105
>>29344333
>DI
>good
>>29345261
The funny thing is the gun isn't even destroyed. Try harder Vasily.
>>29345307
>isn't even destroyed
>>29345314
>No guns Vatnik detected
>100000000 Rubles (.001USD) deposited
Protip. It isn't.
>>29345307
I think you missed his point anon.
>>29345198
>stiff trigger
addressed by M17S, RFB, RDB, MDR
>ambidextrous ejection
addressed by RFB, RDB, MDR
>ambidextrous controls
as above
>ease of bolt manipulation
addressed by almost all of them but not by the Tavor for some reason
>ease of chamber access
addressed by FS2000, MDR, non-issue on most other than RFB, RDB
>insufficient top rail for additional optics/LAMs/COTI, etc
addressed by RDB, MDR, options available for RFB, AUG
>insufficient forward handguard and rails for other accessories
as above, notably lacking on FS2000, stock AUG, Tavor
>excessive sight height over bore
more of a design philosophy issue, HOB vs straight line recoil, Tavor is probably the worst offender, but bullpups do not allow for dropped stocks. AR15 height equivalent is as low as it's going.
>excessive length of pull
not a huge issue with the rear-heavy balance of bullpups in terms of comfort and handling, optical eye relief is of greater concern and most bullpups have the top rail extending far back enough that it is not an issue at all. This will only really be a problem for exceptionally short people using the rifle with plates/winter gear on.
>additional fluff, grip angle, trigger reach, butt angle, front handguard length for TOB grip or barricade stops
These are more or less issues of 'not being an AR15' and not having the huge aftermarket support therein.
>>29345348
> Don't shoot overcharged wolf ammo
>Shoot an AR15 so the gun doesn't kill you or maim your face like a third world stamped AK would
Got it anon
>>29345314
Not him but
>Implying the upper and probably chamber are no ruined
>Implying there isn't possible damage to trigger components
>Implying there isn't possible damage to magwell
>>29345358
>a few specific guns have fixed a few of the many issues with bullpups
AR fags on suicide watch.
>>29345307
>>29345336
the fuck is wrong with you?
>>29345443
I'm capable of using the provided image search and reading the OC. The gun is fine.
>>29345386
The AR-15 took several decades to fix it's shit as well.
Lower HOB, adjustable LOP, ambi controls, non-shit triggers, accessory rails, and everything else is relatively new to the AR-15.
>>29345456
I'm talking about you calling every person who disagrees with you a russian.
>>29345386
Yep. As it stands, bullpups are a workable option with some advantages and some disadvantages (as with anything). The gap continues to close though, and the vast majority of "bullpups suck" talking points are going to be remedied in newer designs.
I think in general, the advantages are somewhat overstated. In practical use, there really isn't a massive difference between a bullpup and a conventional rifle with a folding stock, the exception being to legally step around SBR classification.
On the other hand, the disadvantages tend to be WAY overstated, with recurring misinformation stated as fact by people who have clearly never used a bullpup rifle, such as the insistence that bullpups are somehow a milion times harder to shoot/reload/manipulate prone. I imagine the majority of it is just neo-fuddery.
>>29345358
So, while bullpups as a whole fix the biggest issues, individual bullpups only have some of the issues fixed. That's fine imho, every platform has it's pros and cons. My big issue is weight, being a lefty. I feel like the tob issue doesnt exist or isn't as bad, because your support hand might be on a shorter handguard, but the barrel is further back, so in effect, you do get the strong foward grip.
I will eventually get an AUG set up for lefties, and I will enjoy it. But I still think the ar15 is a superior combat weapon to every bullpup I've seen thus far. That being said, people who think every gun in their collection has to be the best combat/competition rifle are fucking autistic
>>29345467
>implying a1 isn't best one
Lrn to AR
Just kidding. I just love the way they look
>>29345473
>RUSSIA STRONK!
I'd call him a faggot but I'm trying to be PC.
>>29345535
Definitely a nostalgic look to them.
>>29345542
alright, that's just mental
Tavor, desert tech, keltec, Fns2000, aug, some ak bullpup stuff, famas, and let's throw in the p90. Because pdw round are just really small rifle rounds
Versus the SCAR, ACR, XCR, 556xi, MCX, 416, sg550 family, ar15 family, rk95, ak12, galil ace, benilli mr1, berreta arx160, keltec su16, cz bren, ak5, and let's throw in the mp7.
Not saying of these are all good designs, because ALOT of them flat out suck. (556xi, XCR, acr, ar160 are the worst offenders) but still, most modern semiautomatic or selectfire rifles are still in tradition configuration
>>29345550
>Babbys first day on 4chan
>>29345571
FUCK, forgot the l85 and the qzb type 95 Chinese one, and the South Africa cr1 I think it's called which is basically a famas internally? I think? Also forgot the g36. I'll leave out the hk33 because that platform isn't modern at all.
Anyhow, traditional config still has most of the marketplace.
>>29345608
>>29345571
Your forgot the Croatian rifle.
>>29345499
The weight thing is kind of ridiculous, with the AUG, FS2000, and Tavor coming in at 8+lbs with skinny ass 16" barrels. Thankfully the RDB and MDR are 7.1~7.5lbs (MDR with a relatively beefy barrel too), which while not exactly light, is at least reasonable. The X95 should be lighter too, but I'm not sure how much.
On the whole tob thing, yeah, that's actually a pretty nice ergonomic advantages bullpups have. I ran a T97 for 3 gun for a bit, and if it had had a longer handguard with less free barrel sticking off the end, the shorter distance from shoulder to barricade would definitely speed things up going port to port on a VTAC 9 hole or similar setup. I use an AR now mainly because the T97 is a piece of shit.
>>29345493
>difference between a bullpup and a conventional rifle with a folding stock, the exception being
Also for exceptionally large firearms such as anti-material rifles (DT HTI, Barrett M95, GM6 Lynx) or grenade or other payload launchers (XM25, every single OICW prototype, every single shoulder fired recoiless rifle)
Working in and around vehicles too.
>>29345548
>230 dollars for a goddamn freedom generator
>80 scope
where did it all go wrong?
>>29345608
>South Africa cr1 I think it's called which is basically a famas internally?
Where the fuck did you get that from? CR21 is a bullpup'd Galil in a fishgun polymer shell
>>29345649
Also:
>20 round clips
>>29345314
How?
>>29344333
Is this a joke? You can have DI with a bullpup.
>>29344333
>>29344442
>Number of DI Weapons <10
>Number of piston Weapons too numerous to count
Americlaps should just need to realise that their favourite rifle is not objectively mechanically perfect. It's totally ok, it works pretty well, it's probably not worth replacing for the army and the modularity and aftermarket are spectacular, but there's a reason the action has not been copied on independent designs.
>>29345649
Inflation.
Most of those guns back in the 70s/60s/50s are actually higher priced than they are now.
>>29345649
inflation
>>29343967
They are not actually.
I mean the Europeans during the 80's went with bullpups, but they are slowly realizing the error of their ways. While the aug is decent and the best example of a bullpup, the French and British bullpups are downright terrible and any serious units if they can, request to use AR style rifles.
North America uses AR style rifles and the other half of the world from Africa to Asia either use AK style rifles, or FN FALs.
>>29345753
>the French and British bullpups are downright terrible
Bullshit
>>29344399
Piston AR's or Op rod AR's are a passing fad. if anything the AR just need a beefier gas tube and CHF barrels needs to be a standard requirement.
>>29345725
even the Iranians got it to work.
>>29344359
Looks more like a hand blender to me...This guy is going to operate on some mangoes, pineapple, yogurt and ice and serve us some smoothies.
I'd otherwise rate you 1/10, I'm the fool for replying to liberal dick bait, but I honestly saw the end of that and thought of a blender.
>>29345774
I think he meant "purpose built piston rifles" and not AR conversion abominations with carrier tilt.
>>29345758
How about enlist and fight in Afghanistan in 2002 attracted to a liaison unit to some French scouts, or fight alongside British units from 2003 to 2012 in Iraq?
How about you actually have to carry said rifle for months in the sand box and actually have war experiences?
Look man, ask any marine or soldier that operated in the same sector as brits and the commando's all had Canadian or American M4 style carbines and M16's with M203 launchers.
and the rank and file Brits hated their Enfields and when I got to pick up and use a famas, it felt like I was holding a sten gun is how cheap it felt. It wasn't those new ones with all the extra plastic on it like you see in you tube videos.
I'm working vaguely on a bullpup design, idk if I'll ever produce it but basically my idea is to keep the internals robust but as sealed off from the outside world as possible (dustcover on ejection port, because downward ejection, gonna have a non reciprocating side charging handle that is reversible, short stroke piston, not gonna do that weird shell bullshit a lot of bullpup makers have been doing, adjustable stock possibly, and a side door for action access). Do these sound liek desirable features in a bullpup? BTW not sure if I'm ever gonna make it, just designing it for fun. If I ever have free time and money after I get my college shit done then I'll maybe try and produce one.
>>29345864
>carrier tilt
This meme needs to die.
>>29344287
pictures aren't to scale
top kill yourself
>>29345314
It's not destroyed, it's disabled. Like the Abrams.
>>29346160
>carrier tilt
>meme
>>29345806
That blender looks like a mortar round
>>29346332
It is though. It's been solved on a number of moder piston ARs.
>>29343967
Because going with the traditional design just for the sake of it isn't a good reason.
If you can make a rifle shorter with a better balance/possible 1 hand manipulation, then why wouldn't you?
>>29346724
By a nearly complete redesign of the system to actually be meant for a short stroke piston instead of the barrel-linear internal piston.
>>29343967
>most
[needing citation intensifies]
