So what did you guys and Nutnfancy say about modern budget bolt action rifles being superior to milsurp rifles like the K31?
>http://youtu.be/eqwG2caxNo8
Judt admit it, a modern budget bolt action is nowhere near the quality, accuracy, and sturdiness of a quality milsurp such as the K98, K31 etc.
>>28264331
Well no shit.
They're still good guns though.
>Listening to nutnfancy
The guy is a total moron. Always rambling about his "project" and taking 45 minutes to tell you what could be said in 10.
>>28264331
Nutnfancy is a mouth breathing casual. The guy quite literally loves to listen to himself talk- which is why in average his videos are 45 minutes long.
Side note: My next build is going to be a Remington 700LR in 300 win mag.
Your average ruger american is gonna be more accurate than your average milsurp, but they are feather light and won't have nowhere near the ruggedness.
Its like they were designed to fulfill different roles or something.
Apples to apples gun comparisons are fucking retarded.
>>28264331
I thought it went without saying that modern bolts were superior for hunting. The ease of mounting glass alone makes them superior. Only day/k/are mosin memers think otherwise. Which means people here will hate him for stating the obvious. But the more he pisses off the fanbases I hate, the more I like him.
>>28265930
>won't have nowhere
>>28265930
I'm not even sure of the accuracy part, maybe your average mosin but not a decent mauser or schmidt rubin. The Ruger will be lighter (delicate), the ability to mount glass without compromise (lacks irons), warranty and parts availability is another big advantage.
>>28264331
Congrats, one guy found one top quality example of a rifle which was never used in any conflict. Go grab a random Mosin off the shelf and try it.
>>28266808
After like 80 tries...
>>28264508
I'm still floored about that ridiculously long video he had where he compared 2 types of plastic spoon. It was completely serious, too.
>>28267044
Watch his revolver video, his son is worse. He spent 10 mins trying to reason why less ammo capacity is superior to carrying an auto.
>>28266735
> delicate
A composite stock can take more punishment than a generic 70+ year old wood stock.
>>28267085
>A composite stock can take more punishment than a generic 70+ year old wood stock.
No. Especially not the walnut stocks they used.
>>28267085
I doubt it, and furthermore isn't a gun more than just the stock? So you're telling the Ruger American's locking/bolt is STRONGER than a K31 or Mauser? No fucking way, they were made and stringently tested as military weapons and they endured super competitive trials to become so.
>>28264331
I don't like Nutnfancy. His videos are far too long to enjoy.
Are new budget rifles good? Yes. They have a few options and are generally lighter and have easier ability in optics mounts and types.
Are milsurps good? Yes. But to me,nothing beats picking up an old warhorse and thinking of her history. Plus ammo is usually pretty common for most of them.
>>28267147
>Ruger American's locking/bolt is STRONGER than a K31
To be fair the Schmidt-Rubin&friends action is not strong whatsoever but a Mauser is.
>>28266984
Are you implying you'd do any better with a modern bolt rifle stock? Because most of them don't even come with irons.
>>28267157
The k31 is plenty strong, the mauser is more so but the S&R myths are pretty stale these days.
>>28267176
>The k31 is plenty strong
It is but compared to every other action of the time it's one of the weakest. Doesn't matter anyway if you shoot surplus but don't go ham on them reloads.
>>28267138
Why do you say no. Because physics would say otherwise.
>>28267157
>your wrong because I day so
>>28267157
It's strong enough to handle a REAL FUCKING NATO conversion.
>>28267192
That's what I'm saying, I'm not about to consider it for a .308win conversion but saying it's not strong whatsoever is a bit hyperbolic.
Haven't watched the video, but OP, manufacturing sure has come a long way in 50 years. I own a prime example of a rifle I paid $289.99 for, and on a rock steady bench, with cheap PMC rounds, is capable of SUB MOA. My Savage Axis kicks ass. I've spent a lot of time with a Remington 700 long action, a short action, and Mosin Nagants and TONS of AR's to say this.
>>28267243
I will try to find some targets I will take photos of, just for this thread. @300 yards, and 100 yards. And not silly 3 shot groups, but 5's and 10 round groupings, that mean a WHOLE lot more than luckily getting a clover leaf with a mere three like so many "target shooters" think is a great feat.
>>28267211
Well treated wood is much less brittle than plastics.
>>28267232
Not really. .308 is pushing the limit of the functionality of the action.
>>28267214
It's inherent to the design. Straight pull actions are inherently weaker than turn bolt actions.
>>28267277
>Not really. .308 is pushing the limit of the functionality of the action.
No.
>Straight pull actions are inherently weaker than turn bolt actions.
(citation needed)
Even with handloads, many WWII era rifles struggle to get groupings a run of the mill .22LR bolt action can achieve nowadays. Even the $99.99 special Savage Rascal.
>>28267284
>No.
yes.
>>28267284
>(citation needed)
nigga is you fucking serious
>>28267147
Yes composites are absolutely stronger.
Yes a Ruger American or Savage Axis is stronger than a K31, Mosin, Carcano, hell literally everything non mauser. Yes an m77/model 70 is stronger than a k98.
>>28267306
>nigga is you fucking serious
Yes, explain your thought process because what you're claiming is retarded.
>>28267332
>Yes, explain your thought process because what you're claiming is retarded.
Use your fucking brain that's all the citation you need. it's inherent to the design of the action.
Sorry if i hurt your feelings.
>>28264331
>Since we have this thread anyway
How are Ruger Bolt action rifles? Good deal for the price? Been thinking about picking up a .223 and/or .308 after my wallet recovers from christmas shopping
>>28267355
So your argument is "I'm right you're wrong". Fascinating.
>>28267355
>welp, I really can't explain it. what now?
The lock that the cammed bolts of schmidt-rubin and K31 actions create is really fucking strong, and it's not going anywhere.
It served as the goddamn service rifle for the Swiss for decades. What more do you want?
>>28267367
The American is one of the best budget rifles.
The M77 is the strongest Western made action (mauser clone) and tied with the cz550 (also mauser clone). Its well made and can be extremely accurate and available in everything from .22-250 to .375 ruger.
>>28267377
I'm right because i'm right.
Certain dated k31s are known to have bolt failures because the whole thing rides on a tiny tab of metal. It's natural to the design. Swissaboos are almost as bad as fucking ivans.
http://theswissriflesdotcommessageboard.yuku.com/topic/11890/K31-1944-operating-rod-failures#.VndE9xUrLcc
>>28267403
>The lock that the cammed bolts of schmidt-rubin and K31 actions create is really fucking strong,
Actually it's not, there have been documented failures.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0XO5hqYTCc
>It served as the goddamn service rifle for the Swiss for decades
My actual fucking face when.
Never saw combat. Come back when you learn about the Steyr M95s sucking dick or the Ross rifles blowing their load
>>28267456
>Certain dated k31s are known to have bolt failures because the whole thing rides on a tiny tab of metal. It's natural to the design. Swissaboos are almost as bad as fucking ivans.
No, it's because they changed the alloy during those years to something weaker due to cost/experimentation. Did you even read the thread you fucking retard?
>>28267475
>no it's okay it sucks because x happened!
Still not as strong as a Mauser or Mosin.
>>28267355
Except the action strength is completely dependent on the locking lugs, which are fucking durable. GP11 is a pretty hot cartridge, and the K31 is a well built rifle. You're probably thinking of the Steyr M95 which had a rear locking lug bolt. or the Ross Rifle, which had a dumb threaded lug design in the Mk III and a poor bolt design which made a small user error turn into a huge catastrophic failure.
The K31 was designed to be fucking strong, and just because it's a bit more complicated to manufacture than a mauser or enfield action doesn't mean it's inherently weaker.
>>28267456
>Certain dated k31s are known to have bolt failures because the whole thing rides on a tiny tab of metal
A single model year is known to have these issues due to a metallurgical change that was then changed back. Try again.
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-0XO5hqYTCc
Says right in the description he was using handloaded ammo and somehow fucked the headspace.
My dad has an old .243 Ruger M77 with some Nikon (I think) scope on it. We brought it out for the first time in probably 10-15 years and it shot great. I'd like to shoot that thing a bit more.
>>28267490
Good god you're retarded.
>>28267490
If you used shitty metallurgy on them, you would have the same fucking problem. The mosin and K31 bolt both have lugs that aren't apart of the whole bolt, and function the exact same. The difference is that the K31 has a cam to do the work of turning the bolt.
>>28267456
>bolt-actions are infallible
>a firearm must never fail under any circumstances for it to be reliable
>the Swiss don't have a well-regulated standing army that trains with their weapons
>Swiss craftsmanship, especially in terms of firearms, doesn't literally have the best reputation ever.
You wish I was shilling, or a Swissaboo, or whatever.
Not even close. I'm here for the mechanical aspects of firearms, and I don't give a flying shit where they come from. Jumped into this thread because I saw you acting a fool. The fun part about anonymous forums is that you can gracefully bow out without damage to your reputation; you should learn to listen for your cue.
>>28267147
Well, if the Ruger American can take a max pressure .308 Winchester, then yes it is stronger. K31s were built to stand the GP11's pressure, which was high, but not as high as a hot .308.
>>28267498
>GP11 is a pretty hot cartridge
Not as hot as Real Fuckin Nato.
People who...actually own .308 conversions have trouble extracting .308 rounds because more pressure numbnuts.
>K31 is a well built rifle
Never said it wasn't. It simply won't survive as much punishment as a turn bolt rifle.
>You're probably thinking of the Steyr M95 which had a rear locking lug bolt.
No it doesn't. See pic related
>doesn't mean it's inherently weaker.
It is. Sorry if this rocks your world. Fire it out of battery a few times until the operating rod is worn down to nothing.
>>28267511
>A single model year is known to have these issues due to a metallurgical change that was then changed back. Try again.
Still happened. It's part of the history of the K31.
>Says right in the description he was using handloaded ammo and somehow fucked the headspace.
Then the fucking rifle exploded. Somehow IV8888888^ can't get a Mosin to pop.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Bzls73WH7w
BECAUSE IT'S STRONGER?!
>>28267528
Takes one to know one friend.
>>28267531
>If you used shitty metallurgy on them, you would have the same fucking problem.
Maybe but that never happened so who knows.
>The difference is that the K31 has a cam to do the work of turning the bolt.
Which is another point of failure.
>>28267555
>doesn't literally have the best reputation ever.
Once again i should say i never called it weak. It's not as strong as a mauser or mosin point blank.
>>28264331
Nutnfancy just dedicated an hour long video on why he loves the mosin Nagant, and another hour on how to refinish the stock. You literally are talking out of your ass on things you don't know about
>>28267560
K31's have had numerous successful conversions to .308.
>>28267574
>People who...actually own .308 conversions have trouble extracting .308 rounds because more pressure numbnuts.
Again, citation needed.
>>28267574
>It's not as strong as a mauser or mosin point blank
No one is saying it is, you're just a retard for thinking straight pull is inherently weaker. The K31 isn't as strong by design because it doesn't need to be. The Nagant was stupidly over engineered for durability.
>>28267574
GP11 was just as hot as any other cartridge used by any other rifle of the era.
The locking lugs and chamber are the only thing that pressure matters with. Citations will be needed before I take the word of some cock monger on a Canadian maple tapping website.
>>28267616
Didn't know about those. Are they rare?
>>28267616
>Again, citation needed.
Can you not use Google?
http://theswissriflesdotcommessageboard.yuku.com/topic/8411/K31-in-308-Questions?page=1#.VndKIRUrLcc
Shit there was a thread last week about a .308 K31 owner who had to bash the bolt to get it to move.
>>28267616
>No one is saying it is
mfw you're arguing with me for no reason then. That's all I've ever said in this entire fucking thread. Swissaboos bust a tit for no fucking reason. Before you even start bitching and moaning i own a 1911.
>>28267574
>>The difference is that the K31 has a cam to do the work of turning the bolt.
>Which is another point of failure.
Good God. No it isn't. It's the same fucking thing. The bolt turns because of the cam. The bolt handle does not. It boils down to a rod sticking into a cylinder with a special cutout. Both parts are incredibly stout; the cammed bolt is one of the last things you'll ever see fail on that rifle.
Who let you out of high school?
>>28267660
Why are conversions even a part of this discussion? Once converted, they're unique custom rifles. Lord knows what bubba did to those rifles.
>>28267666
>Good God. No it isn't.
Yes it is.
>It's the same fucking thing
No it's not. Turn bolts are turned by hand.
>It boils down to a rod sticking into a cylinder with a special cutout
A nub* that can wear and actually has worn down for some people.
> Both parts are incredibly stout; the cammed bolt is one of the last things you'll ever see fail on that rifle.
Never ever said anyones rifle is going to fail but it can and if it does that cam lug is what's keeping the bolt from hitting your face. It's been reported that the lugs can be worn down when people don't properly push the bolt into battery.
>>28267696
>Why are conversions even a part of this discussion?
Because some chode said k31s can handle .308 no problem but they have some minor problems like not extracting hotter rounds.
Swissaboos go home
>muh match grade surplus
All dried up now and on the same level of commonality as 8mm mauser.
>Muh accuracy
A mosin can achieve your level of accuracy
>muh swiss heritage
A rifle that has been kicked around more times than you circlejerk over your rifle
>>28267660
>http://theswissriflesdotcommessageboard.yuku.com/topic/8411/K31-in-308-Questions?page=1#.VndKIRUrLcc
There are 4 people in that thread saying theirs work great and one guy saying he has two, one that works fine and one that had a minor hiccup that could have just been a dirty chamber. That's hardly conclusive.
>>28267313
>Yes a Ruger American or Savage Axis is stronger than a K31, Mosin...
Finnish M39's say naw.
>>28267313
Prove what you're saying, oh wait you can't. probably because you don't own any of the shit you're acting as an authority on.
>>28267741
you're absolutely right but I'd be more worried about how the rifle is failing to extract from a dirty chamber m8. Wouldn't happen to a Mauser or Mosin.
>>28267798
Happens to Mosins quite a bit really. Especially with new shooters.
I've never had the problem because I did the whole drill+bore brite.
>>28267798
>worried about how the rifle is failing to extract from a dirty chamber m8. Wouldn't happen to a Mauser or Mosin.
Alright /k/, this is the make or break point. It's now positive he's either pants on head retarded or trolling.
>>28267660
>Multiple people with different experiences
>Most of which are positive
>Certain ammo doesn't work well with a rifle not originally designed for it
Okay.
>>28267723
>Never ever said anyones rifle is going to fail but it can and if it does that cam lug is what's keeping the bolt from hitting your face.
No. This is wrong. The locking lugs would have to fail for the bolt to hit your face.
>>28267798
Semi autos would never have taken off if this were a major problem. A K31 will not jam that easily, and if you're firing thousands of rounds between cleaning anyways, you are beyond help.
>>28267724
>not reloading
Git.
>>28267723
They're both turned by hand.
>worn down for some people
They're made from the same material, they won't wear on each other. Basic materials science.
>that cam lug is what's keeping the bolt from hitting your face
Bull fucking shit. The part you are talking about "wearing" is what turns the bolt's locking lugs into alignment with the receiver; it's not a locking lug on its own. It has to function in order to bring the bolt into battery, and if it's not locked in battery it won't fire.
>inb4 k31 fires out of battery all the time, lol!
No, it doesn't. You can't make it fire out of battery without significant modification. I dare you to prove me wrong.
Who is paying you to come up with this bullshit?
I would accuse you of not owning a K31, but I wouldn't be surprised if you did and were still too dim to try figuring out how it works.
>>28267723
>that cam lug is what's keeping the bolt from hitting your face.
What on gods earth do you think those fat ass locking lugs are for if that nib is the only thing holding the bolt closed?
>>28267560
Hey no one is going to take your fucking Ruger kiddo. It's not the best gun in the world, and it's not more rugged than a good milsurp. Sure it's better for hunting, and mounting glass but that's it. If the K31 or let's say Swedish Mauser were made today they would cost ~$1000 or more, it's a retarded comparison.
>>28267147
> I doubt it
Based on what? Composites are stronger than wood. That's not news to anyone who isn't retarded.
>>28267777
Fuck you nigger. You haven't proven that wood is stronger. Go ahead and hit a wood stock with a hammer. It dents instantly. The same cannot be said for a composite stock in the same configuration.
>>28267860
Nigger, I don't even own a Ruger American. I'm just stating that the K31 and Ruger are built for different things. I wouldn't want to try and test the limit.
>>28267860
> it's not more rugged than a good milsurp
In terms of materials strength, it's stronger. If you claim otherwise you are ignoring every basic materials engineering practice in existence.
>>28267813
Nigga even with a cosmoline chamber i could still rip the rounds out of my Mosin.
>>28267821
>The locking lugs would have to fail for the bolt to hit your face.
my bad.
>>28267821
>Semi autos would never have taken off if this were a major problem.
It was a major problem in early semi autos though.
>>28267855
>I dare you to prove me wrong.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aL2ryX5e2G0
btw i have a 1896/11
>>28267880
Polymer stocks are trash in cold environments, many compositions are prone to shattering. If you're going on an expedition somewhere real cold you'd better hope you got the right mix.
Wood doesn't care about temperature nearly as much, and if it's treated it won't care about humidity either.
>>28267138
Really? Because literally every test proves you wrong.
>>28267880
Walnut has a higher compressive strength by ~3MPa. And a plastic stock won't dent, it'll fucking crack.
>>28267277
> Well treated wood is much less brittle than plastics.
Wood will deteriorate faster than composite no matter what. That's a fact.
>>28267921
Wood expands and contracts a lot with temperature. Are you so motherfucking stupid that you think you're fooling anyone here?
>>28267926
Interesting how every materials engineer in the world disagree as does the US (and every other) military.
>>28267925
My bad, go test it then and prove me wrong. I want to see you fuck up your rifles.
>>28267934
Definitely. I have a Nepalese Martini Henry with the wood having the same consistency of mud but if it was a plastic stock the same age it would shatter.
>>28267498
The Steyer M.95 has two front locking lugs and no rear locking lugs.
>>28267948
I find it interesting that you demand proof when you have'n tprovided any... at all.
>>28267880
So you don't own them then. And fyi when YOU make a claim the burden of proof is on YOU. You said poly is stronger, prove it. My proof is that it's not uncommon to buy surp rifles that are 100+ years old with stocks that are in perfect working order.
>>28267948
Is there a reason why you're pretending like composites on rifles are made of the same plastic as happy meal toys?
>>28267947
>nylon compression strength
86.2 MPa
>walnut compression strength
89 MPa
Also, are you seriously trying to say that plastic doesn't get brittle as fuck when it's below freezing out?
>>28267906
The 1896 and K31 are not the same at all. They are both straight pull, but the K31 is not a Schmidt Rubin.
That video does give me a bit to worry about. I'll try it on my K31 right now.
>>28267957
My bad. I thought there was a Steyr that had rear locking lugs. Thanks for the clarification.
>>28267976
No, no , no faggot. This ENTIRE thread is based on the claim that modern rifles with composite parts are materially inferior. The direct implication is made in the first fucking post.
>>28267961
Why provide proof? I'll sit here and make statements that piss you off while you scream about citations. I've had plastics that sit out in the sun and turn brittle and nasty but so has some of my wood. I'm saying if you take care of your shit they'll age just fine.
>>28267978
Is there a reason why you're pretending companies don't cheap out on as much as they can?
>>28267978
Well,pardon if this is a stupid question.
But weren't early plastics very prone to cracking?
I still wouldn't take composite stocks if I'm going somewhere cold/rocky.
I'd rather have dented wood than a cracked stock.
>>28267986
>'ll try it on my K31 right now.
The firing pin forces the cam into the correct position before it hits the primer.
>>28267980
Are you seriously trying to say that composite furniture is made from generic plastic?
Are you seriously trying to say that wood doesn't warp, contract, and expand with temperature and humidity fluctuations?
>>28268005
Yeah, I just tested it. I wouldn't want to try it with a live round, but it seems to go into the proper position.
>>28267906
>he thinks I haven't seen that video
Try again. That's not out of battery. The bolt is closed before the primer is struck. If you think the multi-decade development of this rifle wouldn't account for something so petty as that you should see yourself out.
>owns a Schmidt-Rubin and doesn't know shit about how they work; prefers to spew bullshit online about how they allegedly fail
Did you get ripped off, or what? Buyer's remorse?
I at least hope you're learning from this discussion.
>>28267997
plastics =/= composites
Stop using them as synonyms.
>>28267997
Right, so they also use cheap wood. Thanks for admitting that.
>>28267999
So you're saying you are basing your opinion of composites based on early generic plastics. Neat.
>>28268021
>Try again. That's not out of battery. The bolt is closed before the primer is struck. If you think the multi-decade development of this rifle wouldn't account for something so petty as that you should see yourself out.
Okay my bad. Do it to your rifle a couple thousand times then and video it.
>>28268044
>Right, so they also use cheap wood
Not only was it cheap but it was stored in the armpit of Asia in a nasty castle basement.
wood>"composites"
>>28268044
I've only broken one composite stock. But I think it was because it's old as dirt and I dropped it.
But I like wood. It's pretty. Pretty much the reason why I still prefer the old milsurps. Those M39s have gorgeous stocks.
>>28268013
Thing is, you probably have without noticing.
I know I have. It was accounted for in the design. The thing isn't a bomb like some would have you believe.
>>28268047
It is literally impossible. The firing pin is not in the forward position when the bolt is forced closed.
>>28268077
I slam the bolt forward every time. I don't think I've personally ever done it, but from what I've seen while slowing letting the firing pin forward with the bolt out of battery, I wouldn't doubt that it is designed to prevent it from ending in catastrophy.
>>28267992
Wrong, I didn't make the thread you confounded little tard.
>>28267085 (you)
You brought up the stock, I simply said the ruger is more delicate .You can't and you won't show evidence counter to either points.
>>28267138
This, that's why walnut frame pistols were a thing before Glock started making polymer frame pistols.
>>28268152
Don't be ridiculous Walnut is too heavy for handguns.
>>28268159
Well, I'm not exactly willing to test it with my rifle since I'm not being given them like candy to destroy. However, the primer strike could have occurred after the bolt locked in place, which would mean there is no problem. The video's test only concludes that the primer pierced the paper.
>>28268185
>However, the primer strike could have occurred after the bolt locked in place, which would mean there is no problem. The video's test only concludes that the primer pierced the paper.
I had a brain fart my bad.
>>28268194
Hey, it happens. If only Iraqveteran8888 would do this test for us. It would be the one time he did something useful that wasn't done retardedly.
>>28268152
Going this far to as to compare the poly glock uses to what Ruger is making their budget stocks out of. All in effort to avoid actually proving your point, especially when you've been proven factually wrong on the compression strength.
>>28268124
I don't think the actual metal would be delicate. The finish yes.
However,if it does have glass on it I would be damned sure not to drop it in either case.
It does have tighter tolerances than a milsurp.
I dunno where you would look to find the hardness of the metal used in those rifles and the milsurps.
>>28268217
>confuses clearances with tolerances
I'm not even talking about the materials, I'm talking about the action, how it's put together, it's design. The Ruger is not built to be a military weapon, PERIOD. They simply are not expected to take the abuse of general issue material. Also if an 1903 or the k98, Swede Mauser, K31 were made today it would x4 the price of the Ruger, so it's a stupid fucking comparison.
>>28267147
>So you're telling the Ruger American's locking/bolt is STRONGER than a K31 or Mauser?
Don't know about the Ruger American series, but Ruger sells a short action Hawkeye rifle chambered in .300 RCM that was designed to replicate the ballistics of .300 Win Mag and be usable in a short action rifle, can your Mauser do that?
>>28268256
No fucking shit it would be x4 the price. The machining quality would be much,much higher and it would probably have the option for a wooden or composite stock.
I would have thought that most Ruger centerfires are modernized Mauser actions.
I dunno,I haven't taken one apart to actually look.
And no,I don't think it would survive in a military environment.
Hell,after seeing some of the shit armorers have to deal with,sometimes I wonder if the M4 platform can even handle it.
>>28268301
>an your Mauser do that?
Not him but k98s can chamber and fire 9.3x64 rounds which fuq shit up needless to say. Not sure how they compare to .300 win mag but these are only suitible in long action large ring mausers.
>>28268301
I'll tell you what's really fucking odd about you. I only own one mauser, it's a M48 and I bought it for collecting. I don't have my ego wrapped up in, but if I did you could chock it up to pride of ownership. But you seem to have your little ego all wrapped up in a rifle you don't even fucking have. How am I supposed to know how many rounds the action, barrel, stock of that hawkeye will survive might be 1,000 might be 10,000 don't know don't care. But I do know that there are crates upon crates of 100+ year old surps that are doing great to this day.
>>28268348
Larger rounds can have less pressure to them. Check what the pressure specifications are. .45-70 will properly fuck things up, but the pressure is hardly comparable to 5.56.
>>28268411
>Larger rounds can have less pressure to them
According to wiki 9.3x64 max is 64k PSI and we're talking almost 6k Jewels of muzzle energy. It's a Safari round to be sure.
>>28268348
Looking it up, .300 RCM is a little over 1,000 PSI hotter and is a bit larger at the base so it will have more bolt thrust from that also.
>>28268368
>But you seem to have your little ego all wrapped up in a rifle you don't even fucking have.
Wut? I really don't care much either way, but that doesn't change how modern metallurgy has allowed manufacturers to cram more powerful ammunition into smaller guns. Technology advances, deal with it. Let me guess, you also believe that the m1911 is just as good as if not better than modern pistols.
>>28268428
>jewels
>>28268428
I hate different standards. Looks like CIP is 64k, which is close to the max of 5.56 at 62k
>>28268438
b..but foot-pounds is gay
How the hell did this thread spiral out of control
>>28268475
it was started on /k/.
>>28268436
>dehhhh yous a fuddd
There's the first strawman, surely won't be the last. Why did you bring up a gun you have no experience with as if to imply it actually means shit to my argument if "you didn't care much either way"?
>>28268306
He's talking about modern production of a K31 or the like, identical. Not even improved materials.
It would be closer to $2k to $3k street price for a modern K31. The craftsmanship is insane on those, and the only reason the Swiss could turn them out is because it was a 40 year development they backed from the ground up.
>>28268456
pssst
it's joules, anon
>>28268456
It's joules bud.
>>28268490
>>28268491
Oh i know that. I prefer typing jewels because of this nonsense.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UjBpaNRMT1Y
>>28268518
I wish to forget that reality TV is still a thing pls
>>28268525
TV period.
>>28268542
I-I like watching Tim Allen on Last Man Standing.
pls no bully
>>28267147
>muh military weaponry
The main selling points for the military are cheap to mass produce and easy to use (bonus points if it shares parts/periferals/manual of arms with whatever they're already using) beyond that the rifle just has to be adequate. The .mil doesn't use the best or the toughest equipment, it uses the cheapest.
>>28268545
I couldn't even if I wanted to, I have no idea what that is. I will confess I can't stop watching moe shit anime (a crack addiction is better for your mental health), other than that I do watch movies after they've been out for a while.
>>28268482
>Why did you bring up a gun you have no experience
First of all, Ruger rifles were already brought up before I entered the conversation. Second of all, experience using a piece of equipment has absolutely nothing to do with comparing what equipment is designed to be able to handle, my point stands.
>>28268525
Oh meight, it's a thing..
Frooty Rudy lost tho.
>>28268551
So what I said about the 100+ old guns isn't true then? If it is then what you've done is attempted to poison the well and straw man at the same time. Basically you're at the end of your rope here and you're getting lazy with the bullshit. Fuck it, I don't even know why I'm wasting my breath, more milsurp for me and when I sell some of my "shit mausers" in 20 years you be wishing you weren't a obtuse retard in 2015.
>>28268551
Military weapons balance several factors and cost is only one of them. Weight and reliability are favored over cost savings, in fact.
Most militaries, and the US military especially, has no problem going with a system with a higher per unit cost that meets requirements better.
No, they don't needlessly go for the absolute top of the line, but they are willing to pay for quality. (There are weapons much cheaper then the M24 out there.)
>>28268612
Don't buy milsurp then, by all means stick to dildos. I'll be happy to pick up your slack. That trash garand my grandfather bought in the 80's is already worth double what he paid and it's only going up, my other guns included.
>>28268551
Prove the Germans picked the mauser k98 because of it was "cheap and easy to produce" when they often did things that were 100% the opposite of that (Maus, Tiger, V1, V2...) same for the mountain jews.
But it wouldn't take much to prove most factory rifles especially the Ruger American were built down to a price, and employ numerous cost cutting methods in material and construction.
>>28268671
Wait, are you telling me that you purchase milsurps because you think that they're the best option and not just because you enjoy shooting them? About half of my gun collection is milsurps or other older guns because I enjoy shooting them, I don't go and insist that they outperform modern designs though. If you constantly concern yourself with what guns perform the best your gun collection will be rather boring.
>>28268734
Where did I say anything to that effect in that comment you abysmal congenital defect? I clearly implied that I collect them. it's you and the people in this thread that are making an issue about performance, there are ways milsurps are superior to factory budget rifles and also inferior in some.
>>28268602
No escape
ITT: shifting goal posts until milsurp wins
>>28268727
>Prove the Germans picked the mauser k98 because of it was "cheap and easy to produce"
Lets be honest here, everything else was much more needlessly complicated.
>>28267044
>>28267079
I'm going to need sauce
>>28264331
Fucktard.
His videos are 3 minutes of information crammed into an hours.
>>28271726
The revolver one is called revolver porn, it's just a day or so old. He literally jokes about his son banging 12 year olds, it's the creepiest "joke" I've ever heard.
I'm not a NF hater, I can tolerate his videos if I'm considering buying whatever he's talking about. And I creamily relished how he ass blasted Larue mongoloids but beyond that I just avoid his man childish rambles because I have better shit to do. But this revolver video actually made my head hurt, he and his sun were partially competing for who could be more of a cringe machine, talking over each other, his son spouting 20 year old fuddlore and finally talking about sexing 6 graders (just watch it).
