Is there anyone here who actually draws, paints etc. as a job?
I am starting to feel like this is a bad choice for a career and I want to know if any of you guys have good advice.
it's a fucking terrible career choice
I knew that going in
I still wanna git gud though
>>2333917
How terrible is it?
Is it something like "only 10% of people trying will manage to get a job" or some shit like that?
>>2333937
No. Much lower
>>2333945
[citation needed]
>>2333945
I never know when you guys are serious or not... fuck
>>2333937
It's probably lower than that. Maybe 10% of grads from art school will get a job. For self-taught it's lower. On average it takes a full 5 years AFTER graduation from art school before you can fully support yourself with art. Compared to other disciplines the amount of money you earn and the respect you hold in society is much lower considering the amount of training required.
You go into it for a career because it is something you love, not because it will be a safe route. It takes years or hard work and failures. It's not uncommon to struggle for a decade, some people struggle longer than that. But in my opinion if it's what you truly want then it's better to try for it and fail than living with regret of "what could have been".
>>2333950
>Maybe 10% of grads from art school will get a job. For self-taught it's lower. On average it takes a full 5 years AFTER graduation from art school before you can fully support yourself with art.
[citation needed]
>>2333950
Welp, guess I will look for a job I will probably hate while I work aeons trying to do art for a living, then.
>tfw after one year of work your stuff is 'decent'
>>2333946
You don't need citation, it's just common sense. I bet you know someone that used to draw and had a dream about being a pro but gave up. I know many.
You will succeed for sure if you get good, but the ridiculously hard and long path to get good is exactly what makes 90% or more give up.
>>2333953
>10% of grads working as an artist
http://hyperallergic.com/156068/indicting-higher-education-in-the-arts-and-beyond/
http://www.theatlantic.com/education/archive/2014/11/what-can-you-really-do-with-a-degree-in-the-arts/382300/
The second article also mentions a bit why the number may be slightly inflated actually.
>five years after graduation
Looking it up it's actually not a full study, just what the experience of a well known illustrator said, and it's backed up by other well known illustrators in the comments. So it's anechdotal, but still probably fairly accurate for most people: http://muddycolors.blogspot.ca/2011/05/life-after-art-school-five-years-to.html
For self taught people having a lower success rate, I don't know of any studies, but simple common sense and looking around makes it pretty obvious. Just look at forums or even /ic/ and look at how many self taught amateurs there are that never make it a successful career. And those are the more serious ones who take part online in things and seek out resources and communities and feedback. For every guy posting there's many times more who are lurking or not even aware of the existence of things and will not go as far.
>>2333902
Don't think of it as "getting a job" like some kind of 9-5 office prick that browses reddit for 6 hours a day. think of it as making money for yourself. Do you want to be a concept artist for video games? Then get together with a programmer (or learn it your self) and make a video game. Do you want to be a freelance painter? Then find someone who wants to commission a painting.
It is fine to want to be an artist and actively work towards it, but at the same time it would be foolish not to be actively working towards a Plan B career path and attend school for a degree that has some value.
>>2333957
>You don't need evidence that the Earth is flat, it's just common sense. I bet that you don't see any curves when you look at the horizon, I've been looking there many times.
Do you see now how stupid it is to say "don't ask for evidence, it's common sense"?
>>2333960
Thanks! I really appreciate that - it's great to see that some anons actually know what they're talking about.
>>2334019
Stupid is ignoring real empirical experience to blindly believe in some numbers and completely ignore the world around you.
It's like saying crime rate lowered in a certain region, yet see every one get robbed or murdered.
>>2334042
>believing that anecdotal evidence is better than researches, studies and statistics
>anecdotes from strangers you met online
Read article on wikipedia about "anecdotal evidence" to learn why you're wrong.
>>2334080
Art is a really tough carreer, but at least you got your numbers, so it's not a problem.
Sane people, on the other hand, should think well about it and check if they are willing to risk so wasting much time and effort. Like I said before, not everyone has the time and discipline to get good enough to succeed. That's called realistic expectations.
>>2334100
There's also the issue of actually succeeding but still feeling empty inside. Nothing worse than "making it" and realizing you aren't enjoying what you thought was your dream job.
>>2333902
I'm lucky enough to live in a place with a good animation industry - 90% of my friends from school got a job in some aspect of production, but for some it took them at least 2 years to break in. It took me about 5 months to get in, and work has been steady since then.
>>2334124
Where you living at?
>>2334126
Vancouver, BC, Canada
It's cheap as heck for producers to spend their money here, and even cheaper for them to hire Canadians because of tax credits
>>2334042
>It's like saying crime rate lowered in a certain region, yet see every one get robbed or murdered.
That's actually an awful example. If the statistics are from a reputable source, it would be wise to trust them. Judging the level of crime only by your direct experience is retarded, as you're only observing a tiny sample of reality.
That said..
>>2333937
>>2333945
>>2333950
Based purely on my own anecdotal evidence, 4 years after graduating from design school, this is what my graduating class is up to:
50-70% of designers are working in their field
5-10% of illustrators are working their field
0-5% of character design students working in their field
Interestingly, it's not necessarily the most talented students who became 'successful' (by this I mean they're able to support themselves). Many of the really promising ones ended up doing other things, or just haven't been able to get their self-promotion together.
>>2334213
Interesting to hear. What school is it? And what type of "designer" are you talking about (industrial, graphic, entertainment, transportation etc)? I bet that has a lot to do with things. Probably almost 100% of Art Center entertainment design grads will be working in the field after a few years.
>>2334216
design students were taught graphic design and advertising design
'character design' refers to something closer to entertainment design: storyboards, concept art, and animation, etc.. honestly, it was a pretty weak part of the program from what i saw.
school: https://www.acad.ca/degrees-programs/visual-communications
>>2333902
It can help support you, but it's very difficult to do it full time.
I'm a veteran going back to college to get my bachelors (political science). The GI Bill helps, but I wouldn't call it fancy living. I sell my paintings on Etsy for additional income. I usually come away with a few hundred dollars from my hobby every month. It's not much, but it's nice to have some play money.
And the satisfaction from getting money from something you've created is huge. Chicks dig it too.
>>2333995
not OP. But I just wanted to come to /ic/ just give to give an update
>been practicing drawing for 2 years, started in the /ic/ beginner threads.
>picked up programming a month ago
>still want to know drawing
>draw some art to go along with the program I made
And its just. I can do 10 hours of programming, and then need an hour or two vidya break. But as for drawing- Ive been at this for 4 days, and I dont mean straight. Every time I sit down to draw for an hour, I need like a 4 hour break in between, and now Im just rushing to get everything done. Drawing is fucking miserable for me, . Am I gonna quit? No. I like having this hobby. But this is probably the most mind numbing hobby Ive ever dived into, and I cant believe I actually considered doing this for a living a year ago. Hours of grinding different images just make me not give a fuck anymore and I just want to get this shit done. So, I think for people who actually want to do this for a job. You have to enjoy just going at it for 10 hours straight a day.
Speaking of programming, look at Mark. https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCYXLyantCxfr6uF6zUTxQLg He was practicing drawing for 10 years, had some type of fanbase, and even ended getting some commissions at the end. But then, in one of his blogs, he said he gave up taking omissions to pursue programming. And at the time, I was confused, thinking how could anyone prefer something like programming for a living over drawing. But now, I think Im completely on Mark's side, and my whole view for what I want to do for living has completely changed.
tldr, some people can git decent at drawing, but only prefer it as a hobby.
>>2334222
Ah, I've heard some bad things about ACAD's program, though admittedly from only a single person who went there. He claimed only one guy out the program got a job, and that was because the guy trained himself outside of the classes by waking up super early and doing daily speedpainting and various exercises to build his skills. The ones who did the program as it was were left with inadequate skillsets.
>>2334226
I think that is what I am going to do, try to get some money on the side while working with something else
>>2334266
programming is ten million times more fun, more rewarding, and more lucrative than drawing.
most of the people I know that went to art schools in the US and Canada ended up working in very small game companies, doing 3d modelling, lighting or rigging or just straight up a code monkey. I know only one that ended up working as a character designer/concept artist (strangely in an animation studio and not a game or film studio). he is in canada.
>>2334292
It is definitely more lucrative, but far from as rewarding as drawing. Because drawing is so fucking hard... I can only imagine how good it feels to finish an illustration at the level of the masters.
>>2334277
Yeah, I found the illustration side of things, which was targeted towards editorial and book illustration, was a bit more focussed. They had instructors with experience in the field to teach traditional illustration, but the instructors for 'entertainment design' type classes did not have experience in that field specifically.
Actually, they taught fundamentals pretty well. The problem was that most of the students' portfolios were either A. not polished enough, and B. not targeted towards a specific market. The skills were often there, but it still just looked like 'student work'.
Two people I know who went through the more 'chracter design' type program are actually really really good. The problem is that they simply don't know how to market themselves, or are too shy.
Also, I mean, it was pretty cheap. $4500 per year.
>>2334292
>programming is ten million times more fun
i mean.. that's pretty subjective, man
